Food Addiction & Dopamine: The Real Science Behind Craving

In Part Two of this illuminating conversation, Dr. Supatra Tovar continues her deep dive with addiction and trauma specialist Dr. Kenneth Skale to explore the psychology of food addiction, emotional regulation, and behavioral recovery. Together, they unpack how modern food systems, emotional dysregulation, and unresolved attachment wounds drive addictive patterns with food, substances, and even habits like gaming or social media.

Dr. Skale explains how food addiction mirrors substance addiction—not because of hunger, but because the brain’s reward and seeking systems are hijacked by stress, loneliness, and highly processed foods engineered for “craveability.” He and Dr. Tovar discuss how hyper-palatable combinations of sugar, fat, and salt overstimulate dopamine pathways, rewiring the brain toward compulsive consumption. Unlike natural foods, these lab-designed products create an emotional dependency—similar to the way substances like alcohol or nicotine alter mood and regulation.

Listeners learn the difference between binge eating disorder and food addiction—how bingeing involves episodic overeating, while food addiction reflects a chronic emotional reliance on food to regulate distress. Dr. Tovar shares real-world clinical examples of how clients use food to soothe attachment anxiety or to fill emotional voids, noting that the addiction is rarely about hunger, but about unmet psychological needs.

The discussion moves into harm reduction strategies, such as replacing processed “trigger” foods with mindful alternatives and creating replacement rituals that maintain comfort without self-destruction. Dr. Tovar’s “kettle chip” approach—choosing a higher-quality version of a triggering food in a mindful setting—illustrates how recovery can happen through compassion, not deprivation. Dr. Skale reinforces that shame only deepens addiction, emphasizing that “the best disinfectant for shame is sunlight.”

From there, they explore the role of loved ones in supporting recovery. Partners and family members often fall into control dynamics that backfire. Dr. Skale explains how expressing genuine concern through feelings—“It scares me when you drink” instead of “You drink too much”—builds connection instead of defensiveness. Dr. Tovar adds that body-shaming or weight-based comments worsen food addiction, while empathy and emotional curiosity foster healing.

This episode concludes with practical guidance for anyone questioning their relationship with food or substances. Dr. Skale outlines early steps toward change—sharing openly, seeking therapy, and exploring support groups such as SMART Recovery, Refuge Recovery, or Overeaters Anonymous. Together, Dr. Tovar and Dr. Skale remind listeners that recovery begins when we illuminate shame, build internal safety, and reconnect with our bodies as allies rather than enemies.

Would you like to know more about Dr. Kenneth Skale? Here are his social media channels :  https://pasadenahealing.com/kennethskale,   

Thank you for joining us on this journey to wellness. Remember, the insights and advice shared on the ANEW Body Insight Podcast are for educational and informational purposes only and do not constitute medical advice. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making any changes to your health routine. To learn more about the podcast and stay updated on new episodes, visit ANEW Body Insight Podcast at anew-insight.com. To watch this episode on YouTube, visit @my.anew.insight. Follow us on social media at @my.anew.insight on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and Threads for more updates and insights. Thank you for tuning in! Stay connected with us for more empowering stories and expert guidance. Until next time, stay well and keep evolving with ANEW Body Insight!

Transcript

0:00 Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:01

Me too. So food addiction is I think, a little controversial topic because people are like, oh, it's not, it's not a necessarily substance that is addictive. Oh, it is. I would love to kind of have you helped me differentiate between food addiction and say some of the other difficulties that you might get with eating disorders, such as like binge eating, even if you're not necessarily a, a, a specialist in that area.

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:02

I think food addiction is an addiction insofar as other behavioral addictions and substance addictions all implicate that seeking system like we talked about in the first half of our interview. So when someone is relying on food in a way that is, I would say less predicted by actual hunger and more by their emotional state of dysregulation, when that has negative consequences and they're unable to stop it, despite trying. But maybe you can help me clarify if, if this checks out. But I think Binge Eating Disorder really focuses on the episodes of very discreet, shoving as much food as you can in despite being uncomfortably full, feeling very guilty after. Whereas I would say a food addiction is much more broad. Maybe it speaks to a more underlying pattern of an emotional function for the behavior. Eating not just indiscreet episodes, but throughout the day, despite when one is not full. I mean, despite when one is not hungry,

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:04

absolutely. I think you are completely on point, and I'd like to add that when you see difficulties with food addiction, right? Or even if it's food addiction and binge eating disorder, or just binge eating disorder or bulimia, whatever it might be, not so much with anorexia, but what you tend to see is that kind of reward seeking food. kind of termed craveability experts and so they know the combination of chemicals and additives that they can add to a food that is going to actually make people, you know, Lays doesn't have this motto. You can't just eat just one for no reason. Like that's, it's designed. Yeah, they're, they're like straight up like, hi, we're your food addiction, go-to and, and when we look at highly processed foods, that's when I see more food addiction than anything else.

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:06

whether it's alcohol, cocaine cake, potato, chips, whatever it is soda that the first several times you use it, that does come with a huge surge of dopamine and other neurochemicals, and you make an association, oh this, this thing makes me feel amazing. And then in our internal hierarchy of needs, the things that we need that gets placed right up on top four folks who may struggle with some of the attachment or other kinds of traumas that we talked about in the first half.

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:07

Exactly. And I think, you know, it's a little harder with food. We have to eat right to survive. You know, we don't necessarily have to smoke, but I like to, in my treatment, especially for things like food addiction and, and also for smoking is, trying to find replacement behaviors or replacement foods that help kind of And with food addiction too, they have these certain foods. I also, I I, I have them play around with, well, what if that food wasn't off limits, but you got it in a different form rather than the, highly processed bag of Lays. What if you went to a restaurant that had kettle chips, right? And what if you tried that and to see if, that might help kind of break that, automatic go to, go to 711, grab that thing. It actually breaks up the time between, the the desire and the acquisition, and that actually slows them down enough. And especially if they're kind of out in public, if they're at a restaurant, they're much less likely to binge on it, more likely to enjoy it. And if they're doing this at the same time as opening up their diet And they do, and I'm like, well, what if you did that without the cigarette?

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:11

When, when in the addiction world, that is a sort of an alternative to abstinence-based models, where are you gonna go from drinking a ton to drinking zero when it's safe enough, you can have someone slowly reduce. Or just sustain at some sort of lower level and, and with some issues that's, that's appropriate. the best example I can come up with the first thing anybody does when they go to rehab, let's say they go to rehab for heroin use, they start smoking cigarettes and they go, they go through a pack a day. And I think that's not great that someone smokes. It is infinitely better than shooting heroin into your veins. And so in that way, you're reducing the risk for potential harm. So they were in a controlled environment. There were no drugs being taken, but when you would see them make their coffee. In the, in the lobby, the amount of creamers that were put in was this. These coffees were 50% creamer, very sweet. Probably not drinkable for for a lot of folks, but that was what they were doing as an alternative to the drugs they were using. Infinitely better and healthier than whatever they were using. So I think in the same way, rather than taking something that's less harmful, the way you're talking about is, let's actually do something that's a little bit more healthy. Take something that's harmful. What's the healthy version of that you could do? So the ritual is maintained. Maybe that's the ritual that's important, but it's in a way that's actually sustainable and not hurting you as much.

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:13

And also that feeling of that lack of safety or the lack of being loved. And you really can start to achieve that in your life no matter who you're surrounded by. If you are cultivating that in yourself and really finding safety is just nervous system regulation. And a lot of, changing old paradigms of thought and adopting ones that are more aligned with what you want for yourself as opposed to what you're afraid of.

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:14

Good question because that's, a sticky issue. What you don't want to happen is the partner. to being so concerned that they begin to take responsibility for the other person's health. So the partner becomes, say, in relationship to food addiction, the partner becomes preoccupied with making sure there's only healthy food in the house Not, you could make some sort of factual statements about, eating this much is not good for you. We'll take it from there. at some point, drawing a very firm line that, I love you to pieces, I cannot watch you hurt yourself and it's too stressful on me. You need to get some sort of treatments or we can't be friends anymore, or I need to, especially when it comes to kids. We're not gonna support you anymore unless you go get help

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:17

But when somebody confronts them about, you know, if it's food addiction about their appearance, that actually is far more damaging and leads to even more food addiction or binge eating or, that kind of compensatory behavior. So I wanna caution people, if you are seeing people with food addiction. When it comes to substance use, I think it's a little bit different, right? You, you, you have a lot more potentially dangerous situations for other family members and you can bring that into the, the picture so that they're made aware of that along with your feelings. So I think that that's really helpful.

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:19

We might think, oh, it's the reasoning. You drinking this much is impairing your performance at work. You drinking this much is expensive. The person can always, and will always come back and say, I'm fine at work.

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:20

Yeah.

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:21

Not my wife is complaining about X I'm having trouble at work. I really try to get people to then, okay, well if that's the case, but what's, what's the in, how is that a problem inside for you? It's a well worn groove. It's a ritual. It's what their family did, et cetera. The more that I can get them to hold that conflict. Most people, not everyone, but most people, will choose to begin some sort of change process or at least exploring the idea. That's number one is help, is giving them that conflict back. I'm not gonna come in very heavy handed talking about why it's a problem, why they ought to change. I'll just sound like everyone else in their life. And the problem is when you take a stance like that, it's the human reaction to take the opposite stance. And then we believe what we hear ourselves say. So if you come in and say, this is a problem, drinking is a problem for you because of X, Y, Z, they're gonna take the opposite stance and then believe what they say, which is why it's not a problem, and so you have to be pretty tactful about and respectful, giving them that conflict back. After that, once someone has begun to wrestle with that, I just invite them to explore what they want to do about it, and once someone has gotten there, you can pretty quickly formulate a plan. But I think it's that initial piece that often gets missed and the person leaves feeling judged, shamed, more closed to future treatment, and more intent on continuing and hiding what they're doing.

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:24

And I really like that you have them formulate their own plan. That might be harm reduction, that might be complete abstinence, but it really has to work individually, and I think that's probably what makes you stand out as an addiction treatment specialist. So for somebody who is listening who's like, Ooh, I think I might have a problem, what's the first thing that you recommend that they do?

Dr. Kenneth Skale: 0:25

sharing it with someone that you trust who cares about you, that's probably step number one. And then really taking an honest look, if you feel you're able to do that at what is, how is this affecting me? What's the impact on my marriage? What's the impact on my health, my work, my wellbeing, my general level of alertness? How is this dimming my light? You might say. And I think after that, if someone comes to the conclusion that this is a problem, there's a lot of options to go talk to somebody. So there's a ton of community groups on the substance side, you have AA, NA, Smart Recovery is a great one. Smart Recovery is a community based, cognitive behavioral model where it, there's not as much emphasis on religion or spirituality as in the AA tradition, and so people can just go and literally learn skills to stay sober and connect with other people, which is great. There's also Refuge Recovery, which is, you might consider that more of the Buddhist 12 steps, so folks who have, can't quite get on with the more westernized religious tradition in AA, they often take to Refuge Recovery, which is a great option, then call a therapist. and, and you sort of want to think about the two things. One is, well, if this pro, this behavior is a problem for me, what? And I, and I recognize that, what's the plan to get that under control? Second is why is this here in the first place? And that might be a bit of a longer, more intensive therapy process. But to really nix it so it doesn't pop up in another kind of addiction. You'd really want to go through some sort of course of therapy where you're looking internally at what's the emotional function, what feelings of mine are, are not processed? What have I been through, I've never talked about. And, and work that out.

Dr. Supatra Tovar: 0:27

How is this actually dimming my light because there is, there are so many pathways that you can take. There's also Overeaters Anonymous, everybody. And you know, certainly people out there, who, who can help you if it's a food related addiction and things like that, you can come talk to me, of course about that. Absolutely. And you know, just on another note too, people, I, I run a pretty large Facebook group. It's just this labor of love that started in COVID times when everyone was looking for a therapist. It's called Therapist Client referrals. You can, you can. Email me directly and I can help you find a therapist. Yay. I love this. I learned a lot. Dr. Ken, thank you so much for helping me understand addiction just a little bit more.