S04E159 The AND Approach for a fuller life as a Law Firm Owner with Gary Mitchell

If you’re running a law firm that depends on you for every decision, every client relationship, and every late-night “quick task,” you’re not leading a business you’re carrying a bottleneck. Marilyn Jenkins sits down with law firm coach Gary Mitchell, founder of OnTrac® Coach and creator of the Law Firm Xelerator™ Program, to unpack the leadership shifts that turn a busy practice into a firm that actually supports your life.

We dig into the traits many lawyers share like perfectionism, control, and risk aversion and why those strengths in legal work can become weaknesses in law firm management. Gary shares a practical framework for delegation that doesn’t create chaos, including clearer instructions, permission to ask questions, and follow-up before the deadline. We also talk hiring strategy, why attitude and coachability often beat raw credentials, and how to build the right team and the right systems so you can “press play” instead of being the constant point of failure.

You’ll also hear a direct challenge to the billable-hour reflex and a case for value-based billing that aligns pricing with outcomes clients actually want. Along the way, Gary explains the core idea behind his upcoming book, The And Approach: how to grow your law firm and gain more freedom at the same time through mindset, self-care, leadership, practice management, HR, and marketing.

Reach Gary here:
https://ontraccoach.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/garyemitchell/
https://www.instagram.com/ontrac_coach/
https://www.facebook.com/ontraccoach#
https://www.youtube.com/@ontraccoach4514

Ready to level up your law firm marketing? Book a FREE Discovery Call with Marilyn Here: https://lawmarketingzone.com/bookacall

Leadership In Law Podcast with host, Marilyn Jenkins 
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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:37

So whether you're a student leader address starting your journey as a law firm owner, the Leadership in Law Podcast is here to equip you with the knowledge and tools you

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_00 0:47

need to build a successful and fulfilling legal practice.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Welcome to another episode of the Leadership in Law Podcast. I'm your host, Marilyn Jenkins. Please join me welcoming my guest, Gary Mitchell, to the show today. Gary is the founder of OnTrack Coach and creator of the Law Firm Accelerator Program. For more than two decades, Gary has helped lawyers transform their practices into businesses that actually support their lives, not consume them. With a background in entrepreneurship, strategy, and leadership, Gary works with law firm owners to build stronger teams, simplify operations, and develop the skills that law school never taught them, like business thinking, hiring, and leadership. His approach challenges the traditional belief that success in loss requires sacrificing time, health, or personal freedom. He's also the author of the upcoming book, The And Approach, which focuses on how lawyers can grow a successful firm and create more freedom at the same time. I'm excited to have you here, Gary. Welcome.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

Thank you so much for having me, Marilyn. It's my pleasure.

SPEAKER_01 1:56

Absolutely. I'm glad to have you back on the show. Tell us a bit about your leadership journey.

SPEAKER_02 2:01

Oh boy. Perfectly honest with your audience. My leadership journey began with my first management job when I was 20, and I didn't know anything. To look back

Gary’s Leadership Origin Story

SPEAKER_02 2:11

at that, I could call him many different things. I won't say it on camera. I shake my head and go, Wow. So I was a great server. I had good people skills. So the owner wanted to promote me. No training. Sound familiar? Yeah. No training, no support. I really didn't know how to manage or lead. And I look back and I go, wow. So then starting my first business at 25, I built a national event with marketing partners all across Canada, media partners, national media of attention and focus. There was leadership growth there. I think perhaps my personal most before law was running a campaign, which got me into coaching lawyers in the first place. I ran a campaign for a lawyer for parliament. And I was, I had the great fortune of having an amazing mentor who had been the years before me, decades of experience in political and running the campaign meetings, leading the team. I learned so much from him. Like I think I look back, and part of the acknowledgements in the book we'll get into in a minute are all the teachers, all the mentors, all the coaches, all the people I've had in my life that I've learned from. It's also been like if there's two topics I study, it's leadership and business. Every book I'm getting on Audible is it's very focused when people they laugh. I'm in Mexico for the winter. That's my end. I'm traveling in my bucket list while I grow my business and coach. And my I'll take a break. If I do have time, I'll take a break up the pool and I'm listening to an audiobook. Well, everyone else is listening or reading or listening to romance novels. I'm doing more full study in my break.

SPEAKER_01 3:54

I love it.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

I've been studying leadership for the better part of my adult life. Then in working with lawyers and law firms, working directly with law firm owners, it's become almost a singular focus because when you think about it, leadership is number one. Everything else comes after that. Like everything. Oh, this is the problem, this is my pain point. This it all goes back to the leader, to the law firm owner, their decision-making process, how they build their teams, how they delegate, or not, or not, or their ability to let go of control and perfectionism, or not.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

Or not these are not the kicker there.

SPEAKER_02 4:35

And I say with a smile and a laugh, because there's no judgment here. Lawyers have been conditioned a certain way their entire lives. They've started out with personality traits that are probably a hundredfold the average human being. These are not just lawyer traits, these are human-being personality traits like perfectionism, like having a sense of control, risk averse

Lawyer Traits That Limit Growth

SPEAKER_02 4:56

with procrastination. And then the risk averse plus the perfectionism plus the difficulty in letting go with control, that puts up some huge barriers to law firm owners in growing the firms, right? So you're going along, you're the number one provider, the clients come for you and your name, and you're working 60 billable hours a week, and you're trying to run your business on the side. It doesn't work. So at some point you have to make a decision which hat is going to be the predominant hat, the lawyer hat or the entrepreneur owner hat. You can't have two full-time jobs. And when I'm working with my clients, Marilyn, I always work with their strengths, right? Like their what is we go with with their why. What is their why? What is their ads?

unknown 5:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

What are we doing? Then we look at their strengths and weaknesses. We want to bolster their strengths and we want to fill up fill the gaps left by their weaknesses with building their A-T. And this is psychologically how I help them to let go of control and perfectionism, is we focus intently on getting the right people building the right systems. They can see it works, and that's how they're able to let go of control. And as soon as they do that, Marilyn, they're on the path to more freedom, whatever their end is.

SPEAKER_01 6:18

Yeah, I think the first thing is they always say that the thing that you don't enjoy doing, there's someone out here that do that does enjoy it.

SPEAKER_02 6:24

And they're 10 times better at it.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Yeah. Um regret or regret it.

SPEAKER_02 6:28

Let's do the math, right? If you're a managing partner of a small firm, your billable is somewhere around five to upward, maybe a thousand dollars an hour. If you're doing a mint task, I was on a consultation with a law

Buying Time Back With Better Help

SPEAKER_02 6:40

firm owner two weeks ago, and he told me, and his director of operations was on the consultation as well. He told me he had spent the previous day 13 hours on billing.

SPEAKER_01 6:51

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02 6:52

I just I shook my head and I was like, Do you realize how much money you are leaving on the table? It's a typical in their mind, they think I don't have the money to hire an admin person or this person or a that person. And I'm thinking it's just so blatantly obvious to me. It's like, you be the lawyer, yeah, right? Go out and bill whatever you bill. Uh billable hour is not my favorite subject. I actually try to get them to value-based billing, but if it's a standard system and you're following the billable hour, do the math. And what will always happen is you're going to find someone who's better at it, and it's costing a fraction of the time, which he means money, that you're doing to take that task. And even more importantly, over time, the long run, it's keeping you from the high-level strategy uh and leading time that you need. You can't, you're spreading yourself out thin on tasks that could easily be done by other people, other people that are better at it, other people that will cost you far less. So that's another now. Talk about and so people often ask me, what do you start with first? I'm like, and because they're all interrelated.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

Everything is they come back to your why, right? You've got to work your way down to from your why in your head to the why in your heart. And then your and comes in. You have to know your why before you can do that, right?

SPEAKER_02 8:12

Yeah. What is your why for doing this? What do you envision? And again, as a coach, I'm not there to say you're right or wrong. It's your why. Your particular Marilyn's why is different than Gary's why is different than her client's why. I'm not here. I'm here to help you get it. Right. And cut through lawyers always because they're so stuck on speaking of time, they're so stuck on bill equals time. I've recently come up in this a consultation helped me time to this. 20 years in, Marilyn. But you got to be still learning every day, right? Every day. To get away from the lawyer brain of oh, so we weekly calls and blah, blah, blah and I could see it in there, see it buzzing in their when they see the retainer, they're dividing that by the hours of coaching. I'm like, oh, you're not buying my time, you're buying your time back, and you're buying 20 years of lessons learned from mistakes. That is priceless. Like the old saying, Pavarani didn't make $10 million in one-hour concert. He made $10 million because he spent 40 years gathering the experience and the skills to be able to sing on that level.

SPEAKER_01 9:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:25

So that's the thing. I use that argument too when I'm introducing or arguing for. I do argue with lawyers. Can you believe it? Who am I? But I argue the same point for the value-based billing. Clients care less about how much time they want an outcome. And many times in their brain, an outcome is worth a certain amount. And it doesn't matter how long it takes you to get to that outcome. Right. The fact is you're getting to it. That's the thing. So lawyers will automatically say if I work, if I move away from the billball hour, I'm gonna make less. You actually have the potential to make more, and your clients are more happy because they're not getting dinged every six minutes, right?

SPEAKER_01 10:10

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Who wants to see phone call to clients six minutes or point six? Right?

SPEAKER_01 10:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:16

Anyway, so there's a lot of what I work through with my clients, and it's in the book. Everything I've done in 20 years is in the book, is a lot about mindset, taking a different view. We have the lawyer mind, highly skeptical, critical, analytical. Right. These are not bad things, these are the reasons why we hire lawyers, lawyers. Those are qualities that make for a great lawyer. The trouble is, transitioning in a growing firm is those skills are diametrically opposed to the skills required to be great at business. It's the whole left brain versus brain challenge. So a lot is to gently help them understand this is the way you think. It serves you very well in your practice, being a lawyer, serving your clients. But we need to look over here. I always like to bring humor. It's just my personality, Marinette. It's not all serious. Right. So I think your left brain has had Olympian level training. While your right brain has been binging Netflix on the couch with potato chips.

SPEAKER_01 11:24

I love that. That's hilarious.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

We need to get your right brain off the couch.

SPEAKER_01 11:31

So is that are do you you're starting obviously with talking leadership that where they are, are you working on mindset and as well as processes?

SPEAKER_02 11:39

Oh yeah. Mindset is actually uh three. So chapter three of the book. There's first kind of a profile of the ascending law firm

Mindset And Hiring For Attitude

SPEAKER_02 11:49

owner, their personality, their fears, their hopes, their dreams, what keeps them up at night. There's even a journal entry as an appendix at the end of chapter one, which is I think people will find very entertaining. The endorsements so far are pretty spectacular. I think have captured the lawyer mind pretty well. So then it talks about lawyer traits, right? And then it talks about creating that mindset that is required for success in business. So there's a lot, and it's all a crunch. Then there's self-care and practice management, also, all before we dive into the business strategies. There's a reason why I do that. Everything I've learned in life and business has come down to I truly believe attitude accounts for 99% of everything.

SPEAKER_01 12:32

Good point.

SPEAKER_02 12:32

You can you can come from the best law school, you can have the best grades. If you don't have the right attitude, you won't go far. Whereas somebody with a B coming from a second tier or even third tier law school, B average, chances are they were probably working to put themselves through law school. So that shows work ethic, shows dedication, shows hard work, right? And I've seen it over and over again. Someone new, fresh, right at it. They don't have experience, but they're a sponge. They do what it takes, they study when they have to, they get to it, they get it done. So that's one of the philosophies I help them understand with respect to hiring as well. Well, there's a this is a true story. I think it was in my second or third year, I read an article printed about a very successful firm in the US. Their hiring strategy is they buy they always bypassed first-tier law schools. Okay, so they started at second tier and down and down, and they were looking for B, they bypassed A students as well. And they were looking for B students because what they found over time is that those B students were actually working at the same time. They were not handed the education on it, they were not silver spoon students. Nothing against those people for having a great life being born into a family that has wherewithal and money. No. When you have to work for things, it builds a certain kind of attitude and strength, like thick skin. And so they found these people, when they landed at the law firm, worked harder, got along well with others. Teamwork. It was about the task. Yeah, it was about the clients, it was about the service, it was about doing whatever it would take to get the job done. And every it seems every evolution, every new client, I see the same thing, right? Someone can be super talented, but they've got a grudge on their shoulder or they've got some level of entitlement. It holds them back from being their best self, right?

SPEAKER_01 14:30

Yeah. Now, do you find that which one of those is better at, and we're going back to a leadership question, better at delegating? Because I know that it can be the point where it's I can just do it faster if I do it. And that's obviously not the cost-effective business planning type thing you want. Delegation is so important. Do you find either one of those is better at it or both need to be taught?

SPEAKER_02 14:51

Both need to be taught, but the one that has a better work ethic will be taught and managed less. You'll have to manage them less, you'll have to teach them less. The one have the higher grades, has the entitlement and attitude, will think they know more than they do, will not come to you and ask for help, is not open to as much constructive criticism for growth. I bet they'll be the ones who disappoint you more often. Now, here's the thing delegation. That's a biggie as well. So it's a human thing, it's not just a lawyer thing. I've come up with another equation.

Delegation Mistakes That Create Bottlenecks

SPEAKER_02 15:26

Everything lawyers are, all human beings are. After all, lawyers are human beings. Some might disagree with that statement. Sorry, I like to keep it, I like to keep it light. That's my only lawyer joke. And I lost my track. See, I sometimes when I bring in humor, it's boom, the thoughts out the window. What was it about?

SPEAKER_01 15:46

We were talking about delegation.

SPEAKER_02 15:47

Right, delegation. Okay. So the typical person when they delegate, and this is leadership, all leadership, you've done it a thousand times. In your brain, you can't wait to get this task out of your brain and off to someone else. So you're very short in your instructions. You're assuming I've done it a thousand times. This person can pick it up really quickly. They're bright, they're smart. First mistake.

SPEAKER_01 16:11

Right.

SPEAKER_02 16:12

And it's it's time in, time out, that's the first mistake. Lawyers and anyone else in a leadership role will make. Human condition. Second mistake is they won't let the person they're delegating to know that they are available, open door, if that person has any challenges or struggles or questions. So I'm always here to give you feedback. Third mistake they make is not follow up sooner than later. If you've given someone a task and it's due by Friday, don't wait till Friday. Check in with them on Tuesday or Wednesday. How's it going? Here's the thing: when you put the investment up front in effectively delegating, the payoff is amazing. Properly it is very quick. We're dealing with smart people. That's what I find in my coaching. Even though I'm teaching them new skills, new approaches, new strategies, we're dealing with very smart people. They learn quickly when they're given the right direction. Again, think of it as an investment. Don't think of it as, oh my God, I just spend a half an hour giving instructions. If you got now, here's the other equation. I go back to it. If you got the right people and you're giving the right instructions, this is a winning formula. You'll find out very quickly if you don't have the right people, if you're doing your part of it, if you're delegating effectively, following up, making sure they've got support, making sure they know you can always come to them. They can come to you for follow-up, but you'll know very quickly if you don't have the right people. The next I use is you get the right people, the right systems, press play, plug and play. That's what I call it. And this is how you scale for growth. And it gets you on the path to freedom because you are not the bottleneck anymore. Right? People to come to you for a simple decision on something. You have empowered your people, you've given them growth opportunities, you've given them support, you've given them very effective instruction, followed up, been compassionate as they learn. Remember when you were starting out, remember your senior lawyer and the lack of direction he gave you or she gave you and all the stress it caused you. Don't be that. Be the leader you wanted when you were coming up. Be the leader that you would have appreciated when you were coming up in your career. And the investment, Marilyn, you know this from your interaction with law firms. It's just amazing the return on investment for that. So it's just it's helping them to just look at things in different ways.

SPEAKER_01 18:44

Yeah, and you know, this one side about uh beyond that, you create the system's SOP or whatever, and you didn't delegate that, you give that to someone. You've now given them a value in your company, right? So not only have you just bought back your time, this person's gonna do more for you, which will give you more time, which will be more productive in the long run. It's a win-win with the right person in the right seat.

SPEAKER_02 19:10

Exactly. And you're empowering them. Here's another tip, too. Get them engaged in the client relationships as early as you can. This is to them, it's a reward. It's like instead of head down in the cubicle,

Empower Teams And Bring Them To Clients

SPEAKER_02 19:24

never seeing the light of day, or clients, the people who are benefiting from their work, they're going to a client events. They may go with the senior partner, the managing partner, however the makeup is. And you go and meet with a client, and that person can be their witness. And when you know that there could be good feedback, the managing partner looks over at the associate and says, Do you think I missed anything? Nine tens of nine times out of ten, that associate's gonna have an idea that you didn't think of, and you're demonstrating in front of the client that you have a team of people that are capable, it's not just you. So that ends the whole argument. They come to me for me, they come to me for my expertise. Okay, okay, let go of the ego, because that's nice. It's nice to feel wanted, yes. But if you want to grow, you have to grow, you have to delegate, you have to get these responsibilities off your plate, demonstrate to the client that it's not just you. You've built a team of amazing talent, talented people, dedicated, and it's not you. That's how you can be climbing a mountain, laying on a beach, touring monsu pinchu, whatever it is, whatever your end is, until you like there's a number of steps, and they're not always in the same order, Marilyn, because it depends on who we're dealing with, right? I do not ever with anything profess cookie cutter with HR, with onboarding, it's always got to be a little bit customized to the individual. And it's the same way I approach my coaching. I never treat any two law firm owners exactly the same because they're not. We are individual human beings, and we may have the same traits, but all to varying degrees, right? We have different experiences in life, different experiences professionally, and these all form the way we think and the way we work. Uh, yes, it's harder as human beings. We want to press the easy button, one policy, one across the board. We know the results that come from that approach.

SPEAKER_01 21:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:25

Chaos. People leaving all the time, it's a revolving door. None of this is easy, but it's not as hard as it may seem when you make a few little shifts. We're not talking about changing everything, but making a few little shifts compounds over time. And then you see the light come on because they're seeing results.

SPEAKER_01 21:45

I have a coach that's actually said you can't see the full picture if you're in the frame. So sometimes we need someone like you to point out what we can't see.

SPEAKER_02 21:53

Oh, it's very it's actually very true. And I do too. Uh yeah, like I need that too. We all that's a human thing for sure. We're in it. We can't, we're so focused on what we're doing, and we're all busy people. We're doing a lot of things at the same time. Here's another thing I've learned finally. In some areas, I'm very slow learner, Marilyn. At the finale of the events in Toronto, when I was 28, okay, my mother looks at me and she goes, she looks around and then she looks at me and she goes, Gary, you have no idea what you've created, do you? I look around, whatever, but I what do you mean? Exactly. She says the other thing I've learned expensively, thank God I've had I've lived long enough to so you got it, is it I'm enjoying every step of the way. I encourage my clients too as well. Enjoy the journey. Enjoy this little win, enjoy that big win. Just enjoy it. Yes, we need to be focused on what our Y is, what our and is, we're ready. From my experience, the Udiverse, uh, whatever you want to call it, sometimes has different ideas and can take us in a better direction if we stay open. And that's being more present. And being more present is actually enjoying the moments and enjoying the journey. So that's a valuable lesson. I try to uh impart that on my clients as well because they're working very hard, as we all are.

SPEAKER_01 23:25

Yeah, all of a sudden, yeah, your kids are grown and you're like, what happened? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:30

Well, that's the other thing, right? If you don't mind missing your daughter's recital or your son's soccer practice, your anniversary, not taking a vacation, working the nights, working weekends, that's all fine with you. Do not buy my book and don't hire me.

SPEAKER_01 23:48

If a lot more firm owner wants to grow their business and create more freedom and save time at the same

The And Approach Book Roadmap

SPEAKER_01 23:53

time, what is the obviously buy your book? What's the one principle that they should focus on first?

SPEAKER_02 24:00

Build from strength and build your day team.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

And how would your book help us? So you talked about chapter three, so the book, the and approach. Tell us a bit how that, who is that focused for? How can that help them? Just succinctly drawing it to the close here.

SPEAKER_02 24:21

It's written in the words of the law firm owners that have endorsed the book, they've read and endorsed it. They're former clients, they've endorsed it. Whether you're starting out, whether you're in solo practice, whether you're a junior lawyer, whether you're a senior partner at a national firm, or you're running your own firm, this book is a must-have. It's the most holistic approach to growing a practice, okay, and then firm beyond that. So beyond mindset and self-care practice management, there's HR, there's a hiring strategy, onboarding strategies, retention strategies, bonus structure, incentives, all of that. There's a ton. Leadership is the second largest chapter. So I've put many different scenarios of what leadership in a law means looks like. Strategies for how to become your best leader. By the way, that managed my 20-year-old manager leader to the campaign leader, to the leader now that I am. When you become a better leader, it feels better. The energy you are getting back from the people you are working with is positive. It's collaborative. It grows, it moves forward. There is a reward beyond financial here for you, for those of you who do want to improve your leadership skills. Your life will be better quality. That's one of the added benefits. So there's obviously marketing, that's the largest chapter. Marketing, business development, HR, leadership. It's the whole thing, really, for law firm owners. But like the lawyer said that Reddit, if you're a lawyer, you want to grow in practice. Here's your roadmap, here's your blueprint. It literally is the culmination of everything I've done in my professional life in the outside of coaching lawyers as well. Things I learned as an entrepreneur the hard way. Yeah. Most of us entrepreneurs, that's we don't learn when we get big wins and we succeed. We learn from falling down, picking ourselves back up, doing a little bit of post-mortem. What was right, what was wrong, what can I improve, and going back on it again. See, that's a different mindset, too, that I have to work on with because lawyers don't like to make mistakes. It's it's hurt their shield somehow. It's like they can't make mistakes.

Learning Through Risk And Coaching Wins

SPEAKER_02 26:34

That's very that attitude is very acceptable within the practice of law because obviously making a mistake can lead to serious ramifications. So it's there's a lot of pressure. But in business, we don't learn and what unless we make mistakes. So there's strategies I use to help them make them calculated risks, not just trying everything willy-nilly, but based on 20 years, based on these scenarios, based on these factors, with this information in front of us, this is your best bet. So we go with we go with proof, understanding the lawyer mind, and then they'll take a little bit of risk, and then a little bit more, and then a little bit more proof. They gotta have proof, like right. I don't fight that. I show them proof, but it's so much fun actually because it's a challenge and it's made me grow in my skills. Like I look back and go, wow, I I still don't know anything. That's my attitude.

SPEAKER_01 27:31

But they it must be rewarding to see someone come through some big challenges and go, I really needed that.

SPEAKER_02 27:39

Yeah, the best reward is when they don't need me anymore. Yeah, it's I had one client say to me one we worked together two years, and he said, Your business model is not the best for revenue and ongoing revenue because you make yourself irrelevant. And I said, Yes. That's what a good coach does. I'm not here for the rest of your life or career. I'm here to part what I've learned from myself and from my clients, help you avoid the mistakes, the costly mistakes, the stressful mistakes, the mistakes that keep you from reaching your goals, or can he seriously lengthening the process at the very least. That's my goal. And so when you're that's my job, my role. So when you're at a point where, and it's like we can both feel it. The client and I can both feel that it's hey, you're ready to go.

SPEAKER_01 28:29

Kind of we're done here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:31

Check in, shoot me an email, keep in touch. I'll reach out to you. I want to see where this goes because I love to see from the very first client who two years later, I guess he was around 40. Two years after we worked together, he became the number one income earner at the 100-year-old litigation firm. Wow. The biggest file the client that firm had ever brought in. We're gonna do a secondary launch in Vancouver. He has endorsed the book, so there's some full circle going on. Yeah, it's a it's an amazing way to make a living. And people will go, why lawyers? And I'm like, it just I stumbled into it from my background, and they really do need help. And the people that I work with are outstanding human beings, making a contribution in their communities, making a contribution as entrepreneurs, small business, right? In North America, small business accounts for what 80% of it's something very high, right? So I'm happy to be working with all entrepreneurs that are making impact in the world, right?

SPEAKER_01 29:33

Agreed. And again, the name of your book, The And Approach.

SPEAKER_02 29:37

The And Approach, how to grow your law firm and gain more freedom.

SPEAKER_01 29:42

I love that. So I know that our listeners

Where To Connect Plus Marketing CTA

SPEAKER_01 29:45

are gonna want to connect with you, reach out to you, uh, obviously get your book. Where would be the best place for them to do that?

SPEAKER_02 29:50

The easiest place, Gary Mitchell on LinkedIn or my website, on trackcoach1word.com.

SPEAKER_01 29:57

Okay, perfect. We'll make sure we have those in the show notes. And uh Gary, this has been a great conversation. I really appreciate your time today. And I hope people got a lot out of it and they pick up your book as soon as it's available. And it's available soon.

SPEAKER_02 30:08

It is pre-sales announcement goes out next week, which is for viewers when this gets live. It's April 21st. Pre-sales go up go.

SPEAKER_01 30:17

Fantastic. And that's the Marilyn. Thank you, Gary. That's a wrap on today's episode of the Leadership in Law Podcast. Before you go, I want to make sure that you know about something that could be a real game changer for your firm. If you've been doing the work, showing up, serving clients, but your marketing still isn't producing the caseload you know you deserve. That's exactly the problem Law Marketing Zone was built to solve. My team and I work exclusively with law firms, and we don't do cookie cutter. We build a strategy around your practice, your market, and your goals. More high-quality leads, better cases, less stress, and more profit. Head over to LawmarketingZone.com/slash book a call and book your free case growth session today. The link is in the show notes. Thanks for listening, and we'll see you next episode.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Leadership in Law Podcast. Remember, you're not alone on this journey. There's a whole community of law firm owners out there facing similar challenges and striving for the same success. Head over to our website at LawMarketingZone.com. From there, connect with other listeners, access valuable resources, and stay up to date on the latest episodes. Don't forget to subscribe and leave us to review on your favorite podcast platform. Until next time, keep leading with vision and keep growing your firm.