Mike & Meghann: Pondering Parenthood

In this episode, I'm connecting with fellow Vermonters and parenting podcasters Mike and Meghann Oquendo, hosts of Pondering Parenthood, to talk about the journey from educators to parents, the grief and chaos of early parenthood, and the deep work of reconnecting to themselves, to each other, and to their joy.

From miscarriage and pandemic birth stories to sleepless nights, relationship strain, and rediscovering glimmers, Mike and Meghann share their honest, funny, and deeply relatable story of what happens when love meets exhaustion, and how healing comes from community, therapy, and gratitude.

🗝️ Key Takeaways

• Parenthood brings both joy and grief—and it’s okay to feel both.
• Early parenting can feel isolating, but community and honesty create healing.
• Bonding doesn’t always happen instantly; connection grows through time and presence.
• Practicing gratitude and therapy helped Mike rediscover joy in fatherhood.
• It’s okay to step away when overwhelmed—both babies and parents need regulation.

💬 Soundbites

1. “Having a kid is not all joy. It’s a lot of joy and it’s also a lot of grief and mourning—and that’s okay.” — Mike
2. “Sometimes the safest thing you can do is put your baby down and walk away.” — Meghann
3. “I didn’t start really enjoying being a dad until six months ago.” — Mike
4. “This podcast brought back a piece of my purpose I thought I’d lost.” — Meghann
5. “Parenting isn’t a checklist anymore. It’s presence.” — Mike

Check out Pondering Parenthood on Instagram, and listen wherever you get your podcasts! 

Transcript

Chelsea Myers (00:01)
Hello! Today I am here with two very special guests, Mike and Megan, who live 10 minutes away from me and are also parenting podcasters. How are you guys?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (00:18)
Good! Just got the kids to bed, so we are thriving.

Chelsea Myers (00:23)
I know we were just we were just saying like you guys are night owl podcasters I am like get it done in the mornings and This so we're you're on your game, and I'm brain dead, so this is gonna be fun

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (00:36)
⁓ I

wouldn't say that we're not brain dead either.

Chelsea Myers (00:41)
You

Fair enough, fair enough. ⁓ Well, yeah, so I mean, I know a little bit more about you guys than I do my typical guests just because I'm so excited to have other parenting podcasters who are literally close to home. And ⁓ but I'm not going to read my list of things I know about you. I would love it if the two of you could introduce yourselves. And you already know this.

who you were before you were parents.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (01:16)
Yeah. You wanna go first? I'll start. ⁓ So before I was a parent, I was a very ⁓ committed kindergarten teacher. I was the type of teacher who would often stay till like sometimes 5pm and Mike would be texting me like, where are you?

Chelsea Myers (01:19)
Okay.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (01:37)
⁓ I was a little obsessive and I gave my entire life to my career and teaching and those kindergartners. And ⁓ after I became a parent, a lot of those priorities shifted as they would. ⁓ And that was definitely a challenge, just navigating that change. ⁓ And I kind of got to the point where I realized I couldn't

Chelsea Myers (01:38)
you

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (02:06)
be fully in the classroom and be the best parent I could be. And there were a lot of reasons for that shift, but I have since pulled out of the classroom and I'm doing like small group work as an interventionist. So I'm still in education. yeah, since becoming a parent, I've really, it took a little while to find that balance of like how to show up.

at home and be fully present at home. ⁓ And I think I'm finding it. So that's positive.

Chelsea Myers (02:43)
You're figuring it out. Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (02:45)
Yeah.

Yeah. And I saw Mike. Who was I before? don't know. I Isn't that a question? don't know if I remember that far in advance. Yeah, I don't know. I was a much freer person. I guess there's a lot more freedom. So, you know, the ability to just kind of pick up and go and do things. Also, yeah, similarly, committed teacher.

Chelsea Myers (02:53)
You

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (03:08)
spent, I was a music teacher for 11 years and, you know, definitely, feel like life balance before having kids is a lot easier to attain because you're not beholden to little cretins. But then, but then they come out and all of a sudden the balance becomes a lot harder. And so, yeah, I ended up leaving teaching because, well, again, for a variety of reasons, but I needed to find some better balance. And so

I have a job now, I run a business and I'm able to work from home. And so I'm able to be a much better parent and be more available ⁓ because of that.

Chelsea Myers (03:47)
I love that. That's so that's another reason why I just vibe with the two of you. I am also a former educator. I was a special educator ⁓ for 10 years. I worked in special ed and yeah, that I was exactly like you Megan. I was the one that was there until five, five thirty. And my husband's like, you need to come home because the kids need to eat. We all need to eat. But yeah, it's the educator life is

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (04:09)
you

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (04:17)
crazy before we get into your whole parenting journey. Well, and maybe it'll tie in. What made you want to start podcasting?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (04:29)
Well, I'll let you start this one, So as a prior educator, you might feel this as well, but when you're an educator, I won't speak for all educators, but for a lot of educators, your purpose is your job. There's not a whole lot of separation there. know, a lot of people have jobs. I've got many friends who...

⁓ found jobs that work, that are just that, their job, they go, they do their job, they get paid a good salary, and then they do things with the money they make that make them feel fulfilled. But for people who join education or nursing or any of those sorts of careers, your job is your purpose. And so when I left teaching, I kind of spent a year floundering because I basically moved into a job that was just a job. I care about it deeply. It's something I want.

to succeed at, but it's not a purpose. It doesn't scratch that same itch. And ⁓ one of the things that I find lacking as an adult is sort of a sense of community. ⁓ We're very fortunate to live near people that we are very close with, and I have very, very close friends that I communicate with all the time. ⁓ But I thought...

creating a podcast where I spoke with people about their experiences with something I could relate to, like parenting, would help to build a sense of community and would provide a bit more of a sense of purpose. And so, yeah, so this was sort of my brainchild and I wanted Megan involved because we're obviously doing this together, the parenting thing. And it's turned into...

Chelsea Myers (06:07)
Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (06:13)
So it's my brainchild and it's something that I wanted to do and was my passion project and it has turned into your passion project, think. I think you're... I've become the nurturer of it. The podcast, any reason that an episode gets recorded is like 10 % me and 90 % Megan. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (06:37)
Do you plan things out, Megan? Like, do you, do you like have an outline or you're just like...

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (06:43)
it, I mean, it's pretty, it was a lot just up here. But like, we have a pretty extensive list of like, people we know we want to talk to in our circle. But I think I'm definitely the motor behind like, okay, we need to get this done by this day. So we can have this and you're leaving. So we need this done. And whereas I feel like Mike's way more just Yeah, I just want to talk to I just want to talk to people like it's funny because I in our relationship, I am the planner.

Chelsea Myers (06:47)
Yeah.

Hahaha!

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (07:13)
So like, I am the type A, I'm the, not to go into like stereotypical roles, but like I am the female in our relationship. I, I'm for sure, like Megan's one that's likely to come home and like kick her shoes off and grab a beer and watch TV. Whereas like, I'm the one nashing her like, Hey, did you do this? Hey, did you do that? Like, you know, all those things. Yeah. So not to like stereotype, but like that, that's sort of the roles that we feel. So it's funny that in this.

I'm just kind of like, just, I'm just here for the show. I'm just here for the show. Like, I just like talking to people and communicating about ⁓ shared experiences. I find that to be very enjoyable. I don't enjoy any of the other stuff, but thankfully you enjoy the other stuff. Yeah. And I'm learning a lot. And again, for me also, I feel like ⁓ my, my change in career of going from classroom teacher to interventionist, it actually took me, which

Chelsea Myers (07:58)
you

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (08:13)
I know why this was so hard, even just to consider myself a teacher still is really challenging. So there was a lot of stuff built up in how I viewed myself. so this podcast has really brought more of that passion back of something I'm excited about. Because the idea of even leaving teaching was like, what else am I good at? And so this has just filled a little piece of that, which is exciting.

Chelsea Myers (08:41)
I love that. And it's exciting for me to get to talk to other podcasters. do, I talk to other podcasters, but I don't talk to a lot of parenting podcasters. ⁓ So it's, I don't know, it's just really exciting to hear like what, what was your drive and why you're sticking with it. And I just think it's amazing. Your podcast, Pondering Parenthood podcast. Yes, that is the name of it, which will be linked in the show notes.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (08:50)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (09:11)
⁓ I just, we just keep talking about it and I figure we better name it so people can go and find it. Yeah. ⁓

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (09:15)
Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah.

affectionately

affectionately affectionately known as triple P. We call it the triple P. Sometimes.

Chelsea Myers (09:25)
Triple P. I like it. I'm all about

that. I call this QC. it's, I'm all about, I'm all about the abbreviations. ⁓ yeah, I mean, I could spend forever talking to you guys about podcasting and stuff. That'd be cool, but let's get into like the whole parenting thing. ⁓ So take me back the two of you. I don't know how, I don't even know how long you guys have been together. ⁓ how many?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (09:30)
There you go.

Yeah.

10 years.

10. Yeah, married seven. Seven. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (09:54)
10 years. Okay.

You made

it. You you've hit the decade mark. You've yeah, that's a that's a goalpost, baby. ⁓ I don't know. I'm just saying things now. so prior to knowing each other, prior to settling down, did you both always know that you wanted kids?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (10:01)
We've done it.

you

Yeah, I definitely knew I wanted kids even like since I was young. ⁓ That was always part of my plan that I would. I had a pretty like, even as like you would ask 16 year old Megan, it's like, yeah, I'm gonna graduate college, then I'll get married, then I'll have kids. Like it was just part of what was gonna happen. There was no question in my brain. ⁓ So yeah, that was always something I wanted to do. Yeah, I

I remember things differently, although we recently had a conversation where I was like, ⁓ I might have, I might be wrong about this. But ⁓ I think for me, I, if I had met somebody who wasn't interested in having kids, I think I probably would have been okay with that. And if I had met somebody who was interested in having kids, I would have been okay with that. Although Megan has told me multiple times when we first met, I was very much like, I definitely want to have kids.

And that might have been driven by the fact that he wanted to date me and he knew it was important. It was like one of our very early dates. It was probably only like our third date. And I had just recently ended a pretty long term relationship of someone who didn't want kids. And that was part of it. Yeah. And so one of our early dates, I was like pretty clear, like

this is something that I want in the future. And he was like, absolutely. I love kids. I really want kids. Of course I want kids. He claims he doesn't remember this conversation. It's all coming back now. Yeah. I could tell you what restaurant we were in. I definitely think that I probably, if I'm being honest with myself, I probably was more on the side of wanting to have kids. But I do think it is true that if I had met somebody that was, you know, ambivalent about it, I think I would have been

Chelsea Myers (11:49)
you

It's all coming back.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (12:15)
at the time would have been very okay with not having kids.

Chelsea Myers (12:19)
Yeah.

It's so interesting to me. Like Mike, I'm super vibing with you. Like I think when Megan and I were talking a little while ago on Instagram and you said, you were like, you remind me of Mike. you're, right? And now I'm seeing it. Cause I'm like, yeah, that was me. That was me. So yes, this is so cool and so interesting ⁓ to me. Hopefully to you too.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (12:34)
you

you

you

Hahaha

Chelsea Myers (12:49)
⁓

so yeah, so you met, you started dating, you wooed Megan with your, I always want kids, I love kids, this is amazing. and then we're like fast forwarding through all of the nitty gritty dating days. When did you guys decide, all right, let's make this happen. It's time, time to do this thing.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (12:58)
I forget it.

So we dated for a year and a half and then got engaged. mean, the whole thing was pretty fast, relatively. We were engaged by a year and a half, married by three years of dating. And I mean, I'm four years older than Megan. not that that really matters, but we knew, we kind of knew that we wanted to...

to buy a house, to have a house first. We felt that we've just personally felt that if we didn't buy a house before having kiddos that buying a house might be challenging. ⁓ And so, yeah, so like a year after we were married. Well, I remember we were in our apartment after we were married and you kind of brought that topic up and we're like, I definitely think we need a house first. And I remember feeling really like.

Come on, like we're putting it off more. And I remember feeling really sad. then Mike's like the logical one. ⁓ So after a while I was like, yeah, no, that makes sense. It's just like such a bummer to me because I was looking to start a lot earlier. We were in a, it was basically a studio apartment where it was two floors. It kind of a cool apartment. It was a studio apartment with two floors. like upstairs was just like this big open space with a bedroom and a bathroom. And then downstairs was like barely a kitchen and a living room. ⁓

Chelsea Myers (14:03)
Ha ha ha!

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (14:33)
we like went through heat every three weeks in the winter. It would have been a terrible place to have a new When it rained, the water would run down the inside. Like we had a waterfall wall. And the landlord would just be like, no, this is just Vermont. This is just how Vermont is. And I was like, Megan, can't have it. We can't have a like we can't live here with a kid. Like this is not going to do it. And yeah, and I like I would like throw the numbers and I'd be like, so we're going to have a kid and like, here's what it's going to look like. And

Chelsea Myers (14:41)
No

No.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (15:00)
I mean, I think it was tough, I think in the end you agreed. You like, we should buy weight. And so, yeah, so in August of 2019, we bought our house. And then we were basically like, let's pull the goalie and let's do it. I mean, was, I mean, we bought the house, we moved in and it was like, all right, let's go.

Chelsea Myers (15:20)
It's time. I have never heard that analogy before. Let's pull the goalie.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (15:25)
Let's pull the goalie. Really? I

think it's pretty common. I don't know if I really know about the new one. There you go. But so we we we decided to start trying pretty soon after the house. But then so that was twenty nineteen. And then we I mean, obviously, we had to wait. We had to wait a couple of months.

Chelsea Myers (15:29)
my god, I love that. Well, it's added to my vernacular now. I really like that.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (15:51)
to get the birth control through the system and everything. And then I did get pregnant pretty quickly in January, which- So you told me on my birthday. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Because on my birthday, she did like the three week test. Tested very early. And yeah. Not a good Yeah, don't highly, highly not, don't recommend doing that.

Chelsea Myers (15:54)
Mm-hmm. ⁓

the early early one.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (16:18)
⁓ And then that one ended up being a chemical pregnancy. So I like the five. It is. Miss miscarriage. It was always hard for me to like say the word miscarriage ⁓ just because it's so early. But it was. Yeah, it is. We thought you were pregnant. Right. Yeah. So we were so excited. And then I think it was around the five week, five and a half week I started bleeding.

Chelsea Myers (16:36)
Yeah, it was.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (16:48)
and we had to go in and they deemed it a chemical pregnancy. I don't think I even showed up as pregnant on their test, if I remember correctly, like their P test. So that was really hard. And we, well, I had made the mistake. So, you know, it's they say not to tell anybody prior to 12 weeks, but then if you don't tell anyone then and you have a miscarriage, you have no one to like go through that with. So it's like it's always a hard call.

Chelsea Myers (16:57)
Mm.

Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (17:18)
But I told way too many people. mean, I would I was telling strangers on the street that we were pregnant. Not like literally. No, not literally. But I would I would have told strangers on the street. Yeah, he was telling like coworkers that weren't like super close or anything. I was like, Mike, you've got to stop. Yeah, I was I was very excited. That happened. And I was like, ⁓ God. I'm also just really bad at secrets. Yeah. Yeah. He's terrible at secrets. Yeah. Can't do it.

Chelsea Myers (17:23)
Seriously?

you

So am I. ⁓

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (17:47)
I can't tell you how many times I have done surprise gifts for Megan that I just tell her what I've gotten. I don't think I've gotten a gift I don't know about in years.

Chelsea Myers (17:52)
Mm-hmm.

No, if the package comes, I'm like, Ben, do you want to just open it now? He's like, my birthday's in two months! Right? Like, yeah, no. So I get it. You're excited. You're excited. And there is that expectation that I think is ridiculous, personally. And if it's something that is important to you, then that's important to you. But the whole, don't tell anybody before 12 weeks. I mean, anything can happen before or after 12 weeks.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (18:00)
Yeah.

Yeah.

⁓

Chelsea Myers (18:25)
Yeah, I just, I feel you. I feel your excitement. And then I also feel for you having to navigate then explaining what had happened. So how, how was that dynamic between the two of you? did you handle that?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (18:36)
Yeah.

I- I- How did we handle the miscarriage itself? I took a couple- I don't remember how- if I took a couple days or just one day or maybe the weekend was coming up, but I definitely took time off work. and I just remember being on the couch and like crying a lot and he'd make me tea and it was really sweet but like, I mean you can speak more but I- obviously-

Chelsea Myers (18:44)
Yeah, like, yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (19:08)
it was more something that I was grieving. I think I think you grieved like that we weren't having a baby but there's a there's a lot there's a lot about the pregnancy process that when you're the non birthing partner you you're you're there but you're on the sidelines you're you know like I didn't I didn't experience being pregnant I didn't you know I was there and I could witness certain things so

Yeah, for me, it's like we're pregnant is doesn't necessarily mean anything at the moment of we're pregnant, right? It doesn't really mean anything until like your your belly is big. I'm like, there's a baby in there. But even then, it's like it wasn't real until a baby came out. And it's like, now we have a baby. Here's this baby that we have to take care of. So I think it was more and throughout a lot of the pregnancy, it was more of like, how can I best support you going through this thing? Because

as sad as it was, it also was kind of like, nothing is happening to me. So. ⁓ So, yeah, I mean, it was hard to like have to call everyone and then tell them. And like, that was not pleasant, which is why the next time that we got pregnant, we we really shrunk the group of people that we told. was like, you get one person, you get one person, and that's it. And that way you have someone to go through it with. I remember actually feeling way more comfortable telling certain people.

right away. it's like, no, because if anything happens, I want my mom to know I my best friend to know like, those are the people that I need to know regardless. ⁓ Whereas the first time around, it was like, do we even tell family? Do we you know, so we're like, super selective. And afterwards, I felt like we're a little more understanding that there are specific people we really want to know no matter what. Yeah. We have the conversation was like, you can tell this family member and you can tell this friend. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (20:40)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (21:05)
And that's it. And that, I mean, it does make it easier because to have to make 20 phone calls and say, yeah, you know, this is what happens. Just like by the time you get to the second or third person, like I don't want to talk to anyone anymore about this.

Chelsea Myers (21:18)
Yeah, absolutely. And I am acknowledging too, like you said, like you said as like the non-birthing partner, like you're not experiencing anything, you're not experiencing anything physically, but you're certainly, we're grieving the loss of an expectation for sure. I don't want to like assume, but I would assume.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (21:30)
bright.

Chelsea Myers (21:43)
So Megan, for you, when did you decide, like, okay, I went through that and that was really, really hard, but I think I'm ready to try again.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (21:56)
Yeah, so that happened and I would have, I think, miscarried around in February. Right? Yeah. It's like very early Really early February. And then they told us like, might want to just wait one cycle, but then you can like try right away. Like, there's no issues doing that. And I think I was good with that idea. But then March happened of 2020.

Chelsea Myers (22:25)
Especially as educators, we all know what happened.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (22:25)
We all know what happened then. And that

was a terrifying time. So I know we had conversations at that point of like, we don't even know what this virus is. Like, do we even want to get pregnant? How safe is this? How safe are we going to be? And so we did. We definitely took a month off. I don't know if we took two months off. was it's all kind of blurry. We well, I mean, we had snuzz.

We're going to use nicknames for kids. This is our first. ended up having her. I was she was due February 4th or something like that. So I think we had intended on waiting. And I think that lasted a month. Yeah. And then we were let's just do it. Because I think, you know, like and everything is so like it was such a time warp, but it's like.

Chelsea Myers (22:56)
Mm-hmm.

You

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (23:21)
After a few weeks, it's like, we don't really know what's going to happen. And like, we could keep saying, like, let's just wait and see. But it was like, there was so little information. And I think, you know, some people would say, yeah, no, we're just going to wait and see until we actually get information. And we just took the approach that it's like, well, we could be doing this for the next six months and we might not have any information. So let's just go for it. Specifically, remember, he had had a phone call with his grandmother and she was like,

there's always bad things going on in the world. That's why you have a baby. Like, we want the world to get better. So it's very important to note that I come from an Ashkenazi Jewish family. And so like having babies is a pretty big, pretty, pretty big deal. It's like, you know, the world becomes a better place because you have babies and ⁓ she was like, just go for it.

Chelsea Myers (23:52)
you

Yeah. Yeah!

could go wrong in the middle of a global pandemic where we're

disinfecting our groceries on the porch, right? ⁓ So you got pregnant.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (24:22)
Yeah. So we got

pregnant. And I think that was in May, if I remember correctly, of 2020. And, you know, we were doing the whole remote teaching thing. So that was wild. ⁓ But in a way, it was a little bit nice that I was home. And so the first trimester,

Chelsea Myers (24:39)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (24:47)
I was home and then we went right into summer break so I like was able to take naps and throw up when I needed to and just lay in my bed and eat Captain Crunch and so in a way that was nice timing for a first trimester situation. Um, yeah.

Chelsea Myers (24:54)
you

Ugh, Captain Crunch.

Yeah.

Did you- because like you said everything blurs together, were you back in person by the time you hit the third trimester?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (25:17)
Yes. Yeah, that was that was pretty scary. ⁓ Go leading up to it. And there was still so many unknowns, but everyone was like, No, we need these kids back in school. And it was the hybrid year. So we'd have half the class two days of the week, then we'd had one day of the week where we were home. So that part was nice. And we did online things with kindergartners. Ridiculous.

Chelsea Myers (25:18)
What was that like for you?

Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (25:46)
and

then the other half, the last part of the week. ⁓ But I remember going in and having to do the temperature check every day, having to take my, hand, or I was doing the hand sanitizer a bunch. And then like after doing that, after a a couple of weeks, I'm like, what if this alcohol is like bleeding into my skin? Like, don't even know what medically that's, don't think it is, but my brain was just like, I can't put anything.

Chelsea Myers (26:15)
my God, yeah. Well, I just, I'm thinking from the viewpoint of your third trimester is so tricky anyway, because you're like nearing the finish line. So there's all the emotions that come with that. You also are, I mean, a lot of people, I don't know how you were feeling, but a lot of birthing people are just done being pregnant at that point. And you're dealing with kindergartners in a global pandemic.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (26:26)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (26:45)
Like, did that, did you have any anxiety around that?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (26:47)
Oh

my god, absolutely. I was driving home every day listening to NPR talking about the cases and the rise and fall and just constantly taking in media information about it. just, you felt like you were just living in a dystopian novel. I kept having to be like, this can't be real. Wasn't that class a tough class too? You had a couple of kids in that class that were pretty aggressive. Yeah, there were...

Chelsea Myers (26:55)
Mmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (27:17)
There were a couple of kiddos where it could get ⁓ physical. so that was its own issue. ⁓ I felt I did have a lot of good support in the school. So that was good. But and then I had to wear a mask every day on top of that. But so it was was definitely extremely challenging. I feel like part of me is blocked a lot of that out. I don't remember specifics.

Chelsea Myers (27:44)
I think a lot of us, yeah, I was going to

say a lot of us have blocked that out, but not all of us were also about to have a baby. Although there were a lot of COVID babies. There was nothing else to do.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (27:53)
Yeah.

Yeah. That's true.

That's right. Tiny little baby boom. We made friends. I mean, we had moved in like six months before the pandemic started, but we ended up making a bunch of friends on our road because they all had babies within. I mean, one of our friends, like literally across the road, I mean, their kiddo was due like two weeks. Two weeks apart or something. our original due date. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (28:21)
Everybody on your street was getting freaky at the same time. ⁓ my God. ⁓

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (28:24)
That's right. That's right. I do feel

like there was a little bit of ⁓ more calm just knowing we were in Vermont and everything was much less scary than if you were in a city or somewhere else. So that that was a little helpful, but I wouldn't I mean, I was still very anxious about it.

Chelsea Myers (28:34)
Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. I know I say, I reference being very thankful to be in Vermont for a lot of reasons. We are like our own little world and I am so thankful for that.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (28:52)
It's like its own little bubble.

Chelsea Myers (28:58)
so you're approaching maternity leave again during a pretty high stress time. ⁓ okay. Well, no.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (29:02)
Well, not really. I

wasn't planning on going to my maternity leave. We were in our winter break. so the baby's due date was February 4th. We were in our Christmas break. had Christmas with our family. She decided to come five weeks early. So on New Year's, she was a New Year's baby.

Chelsea Myers (29:13)
⁓

Okay.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (29:32)
New Year's Day. Yeah. So right after Christmas, we actually had our our virtual baby shower the day after Christmas at my family's house through like a Google meet video link that his friends could sign on at a certain time. My family could sign on a certain block. We like mapped it out. So you still feel like you had some connection with people. But we did that like the 26th. And then we we ended up having a pretty intense

Chelsea Myers (29:43)
Yeah!

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (30:02)
thing happen on Christmas night or Christmas Eve. can't remember. was Christmas night or Christmas Eve. ⁓ Our dog, sorry, I'm kind of like all over the place. Our dog at the time ⁓ bit my sister-in-law during that holiday break and ⁓ that was a very tumultuous time. we ended up going home and taking him with us and

Chelsea Myers (30:14)
No, it's fine.

no.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (30:31)
um, we had to figure out like, you know, we knew our baby was coming soon and we ended up having to figure out how to rehome him. and we had, so this was a rescue dog that we had like, had gone through obedience classes with. We had actually taken a class on like, you have a dog, now you're having a baby, what to do. We had been doing like a variety of things and then, and then he bit.

I mean, thankfully, she was okay. I think she still has a scar on her face from it. But it was very scary. And just knowing like, we're gonna have a toddler at some point that's unpredictable. And she wasn't doing anything wrong. She just tried to move him from the couch. And so that was that was very scary. ⁓ I don't want to say that that like triggered something, but it was a very stressful couple days there. ⁓ And then New Year's Eve.

Chelsea Myers (30:57)
Mmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (31:21)
I my water broke. So I woke up. He was on. I feel like you're better at this story. This is a pretty. Yeah. So we we watched soul that night. The Pixar movie. Yeah. That's a good. And during watching the movie, you kept saying that your stomach wasn't really feeling great. But like you weren't you were like, I was like, is it gas? Feeling really tight. Like everything was tightening randomly.

Chelsea Myers (31:35)
The movie? I love that movie.

like a contraction.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (31:49)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

so we didn't... I was like, I don't know, it just feels weird. And so like we finished the movie. was like probably like 1130, 1145 a night. You had actually fall asleep during the movie. Yeah. And then my friends had texted me and they're like, let's just hop on like a video call and, you know, bring the New Year together. And so like we were just we were alone in our home. We were just together and we hadn't had any. I hadn't had anything to drink. Obviously you had had nothing to drink, but...

So at like 11 45, I hop on a call with the guys and I'm like, I'll pour myself like a small bit of scotch. We're bringing the new year and then I'll go to sleep. And so then like two and a half hours later, we're still on this call and I'm like three beers in and several scotches in and some were playing a drinking game. I don't even remember what it is. And it's like two thirty in the morning. And that's when I woke up. And yeah, Megan, Megan comes over and she's like, I think my water broke. And in my infinite manly wisdom, I turned to her and said,

Chelsea Myers (32:30)
You

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (32:47)
No, it didn't. You just peed yourself. And she's like, nope, that happens after the birth. That's not rebirth. And so I'm like, I'm pretty drunk, not having meant to be like I was not that was not the plan. And I'm like, OK, it's like, what do we do? And I'm just on the toilet because my water is coming out. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (32:49)
Of course.

just like slowly

leaking. Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (33:14)
Yeah. And I'm just like directing

him like you need to grab this. But before that you ended up back in bed and you're like somebody needs to call the nurse and she's like staring at me like someone needs to call the nurse. And I'm like, I am not talking to a nurse right now. I can barely put two words together. What do mean? So she she calls the nurse and they're like, yeah, you know, if it's not, if it's not. ⁓ it's important to note the baby was breach.

We knew the baby was breached and we actually at that week's appointment, you were going to schedule the C-section. Yeah. If they were still breached, they were going to schedule it. So we call the birthing center and, ⁓ and they're like, yeah, you know, if the water is not like rushing out, it was just like a small trickle. Like you don't have to come in right away, you know, take your time. And then at that point you got up and it like, it gushed and then the nurse was like, yeah, come on in. And we had been taking a parenting class and the class that

Chelsea Myers (34:06)
Oof.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (34:13)
I had missed it, but the class we had that had just happened was like the build your hospital bag. Like our homework assignment and he had like, I think a migraine. Didn't go to that. And so I didn't go to it, which again is funny because I'm the planner. So like, I'm the one that should have had this done, but Megan had hers on. didn't. So Megan's on the toilet directing me like, we need this and we need that and we need this. And I'm just like scrambling around.

And then I'm like, I'm drunk. Do think I should make coffee? Like, do you think that will help me? And Megan's like, sure, make coffee. And like, we hadn't taken the, we got a, a stroller ⁓ car seat, like carrier combo that was sitting in the box, lovely wrapped up in the box still. So I was like, this whole box is coming with us. So like that got tossed in the, in the trunk. ⁓ And because it was COVID, we weren't really sure like,

Chelsea Myers (34:54)
you

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (35:06)
Oh, yeah. You know, a lot of people you weren't you when you when you were in there, if you left, you couldn't go back in. And so we were like, we didn't know what we were going to need or what we were going to be able to access. We're like really throwing everything we can in thinking that we're going to basically be stuck there for however many days it was going to be. And then, you know, so we're getting in the car or we're going to the car and I'm like, so who's driving to the hospital and things like, well, obviously I'm driving to the hospital.

Chelsea Myers (35:12)
Mm-hmm.

my god.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (35:35)
You can't we can't tell the story like, yeah, you got drunk and then drove me to the hospital. That's not how that can go. And and so we ended up going to Northwestern Medical Center, which is like 25 minutes away from us. Yeah. And we're like 20 minutes into the drive. We're like in St. Albans ⁓ pretty close. And I just like look at Megan. I'm like, are you have you had any contractions? Like what? Because she she's just driving the car. Everything's fine. Like she's

Chelsea Myers (35:46)
Yup.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (36:04)
hat, you know, like, everything's good. And I'm like, yeah, have you had any contractions to give up like seven? Like what? I'm like, what? do you mean? Um, and so, yeah, so we get there and we get in and I mean, so you're, you're water broke it like two 15 to 30. It probably took us about an hour. It's like, get everything together.

Chelsea Myers (36:10)
Ha!

my god.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (36:31)
and go. We were probably at the hospital somewhere around four. Yep. And by 5 48 5 44 we had a baby born BSC section.

Chelsea Myers (36:42)
Whoa,

so you did have a C-section.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (36:45)
Yeah,

they like touched my stomach with the ultrasound one. They're like, yep, she's still in breach. And they were like, you know, it was sort of a situation where it was like everything was fine. Harpy was good. but they were like, you've lost a lot of water. It doesn't really make sense to like, we know we're doing a C-section doesn't make sense to wait. The longer we wait, the more complicated it can be. So we were like, let's go for it. And I think, you know, in Vermont, there's only like one doctor who can deliver and it's not at that hospital. So.

Chelsea Myers (36:49)
you

Nope.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (37:13)
⁓ And with the water breaking, wasn't even a chance to even try to like turn her or anything. So it was a C-section. Yeah. But I think I was so amped up on like those, what are endorphins, that I wasn't scared. Like the C-section actually went really seamlessly. ⁓ And the team, the surgical team was amazing.

Chelsea Myers (37:19)
Yeah, that

adrenaline and endorphins. Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (37:43)
Like I had this woman who I feel like her sole job was just to calm patients. And she was just like this older matronly woman. She's like her head forehead against mine. She's like, you're gonna, we're gonna get the spinal now. And she's like talking me through every single step. And she's like, just take deep breath. She was so wonderful. I remember feeling like really calm for how like stressful that could have been. So.

Chelsea Myers (37:52)
this. ⁓

my god.

Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (38:10)
can't say enough good things about our experience actually with all of that. Yeah, we've done, I mean, we did both at Northwestern Medical Center and both were amazing. I were, mean, there were, you know, a few hiccups here and there, but. Whereas the second was also a C-section because of breach. So there must be something structural. I don't know with me, but I. There you go. Yeah. But I, with the second, I did have a lot more like.

Chelsea Myers (38:29)
⁓ maybe they just don't want to turn. Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (38:38)
anxiety and symptoms like I got really nauseous my color was all draining out of me and they had to like keep giving me the whatever they give you to feel better yeah I don't know it helped

Chelsea Myers (38:47)
I don't even know. I had a C-section. I don't know what they gave me. I don't No, but that's good. I'm glad it helped.

So just because it's my job to weave us.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (39:01)
Yes.

Chelsea Myers (39:04)
So, yeah, so luckily you already knew you were having a C-section, so you got there. That was quick. I mean, that was lightning. You guys got there, you got prepped, you got in. Yeah. And you had like...

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (39:16)
really felt.

Chelsea Myers (39:19)
the Zen master of nurses or anesthesiologists or whoever this woman was, like to just make sure you were grounded and centered. Mike, were you with her? Were you able to be with her?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (39:22)
you

Yeah, so I was able, they had me in the OR. yeah, mean, there was no, having done it now twice, once during COVID and once not, it was exactly the same ⁓ both times. So they didn't have any different restrictions. I mean, I was in a mask. I don't think I was in a, we weren't in masks. I wasn't in a mask the second time. I think it was just the first time.

I mean, they put you in the full get up, right? You're like in a full, full get up. But I think, yeah, I mean, I definitely had to have a mask on the first, in the first one. ⁓ And. Yeah, what were you feeling? Well, you were drunk. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (39:59)
Yeah.

I was gonna say, like, what was that experience like for you?

Yeah, you were still... you were still

drunk.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (40:19)
just sobering up in the OR. was

definitely like, ⁓ yeah, so I mean, yeah, because I also hadn't slept. Megan at least had gotten like a couple hours of sleep. ⁓ Yeah, it was it was a very surreal experience. had I had experienced my mom had passed away a couple years prior and under some pretty awful circumstances and we ended up having to

do some cleaning her apartment and I had to put on like I put on a full painter's jumpsuit and like booties on and so they like give you the gear before you go in the O.R. and I put it all on and I'm sitting in a chair and I'm looking down and I'm like, huh, this looks familiar. I had a pretty rough relationship with my mom, so I'm like drunk, trying to sober up, thinking about the last time I had been wearing something like this and then they're like.

Chelsea Myers (40:48)
Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (41:11)
ready for you to come into the OR. That's a lot. You come in and you know, like they've got a when you're in for C-section, they have you cut the woman is covered up. You can really look to the chest almost drape and there's her little head poking out. And you don't know, you know, you don't know what's going on. Like there's like a lot of chaos happening and and then there's a baby and then there's like a screaming baby and they're like, you know, oh, you can go to the warming table where the baby is and

Chelsea Myers (41:26)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (41:42)
This thing is covering like white stuff and all I could think was, I think what's gross. What is this? This isn't a baby. What is this? Yeah, right. That's exactly right. ⁓ But yeah, was all. I don't know that the second experience was all that different other than I knew what was coming.

Chelsea Myers (41:48)
Yup.

This is an alien.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (42:08)
It still is all just like, it's just chaos the whole time until then there's a baby.

Chelsea Myers (42:13)
That's... yeah. And then it's chaos. It's just more chaos, yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (42:16)
Yeah. That's

right. Continuous chaos for the rest of your life. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (42:19)
for the rest of

your life. It just changes what the chaos looks like. ⁓ Was your second early as well?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (42:29)
Only three weeks. So our first was five weeks to the day early, which they had actually said if she had been born one day earlier, she would have immediately had to do a NICU stay just for hospital protocol. And we would have had to go and we would have had to go to the bigger to to UVM. Yeah. For the birth for everything they. Thankfully, she came out super.

Chelsea Myers (42:30)
Only three weeks, okay.

Mm-hmm.

to UVM for their NICU.

for everything. Okay.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (42:57)
super healthy like her apgar score i think was nine and ⁓ no issues breathing there were the only she just was jaundiced a little but like the tiniest they didn't even have to really do anything for it and she was tiny but she was sorry they just constantly checked billy rubin but they didn't they didn't end up having it like she didn't even sit under the like the under the light at all really like it was very very minor yeah and she was tiny but she was actually a pretty good weight for five weeks early so

Chelsea Myers (43:01)
wow.

She was just ready.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (43:28)
She was ready. Which

based on, it's funny how these things go and I don't know how much of it is real or we make it up, but like totally makes sense based on her personality. She's got her own timetable. ⁓

Chelsea Myers (43:38)
who she is now. Does things on, I was gonna say does things on her own terms. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, so let's get into it a little bit. Let's get in, because you know we're gonna go there.

Everything was a whirlwind. The way that she came into the world was not what you expected. ⁓ Mike, you were going through a lot of things. There were a lot of things swimming around. And Megan, even though you had planned for a C-section, this was not the way you planned for it. So as you're transitioning into these first few days, first few weeks as brand new parents, what kind of feelings are coming up for the two of you?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (44:03)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (44:22)
How are you processing what just happened?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (44:24)
Yeah, I mean the first five weeks, and again, she was five weeks early, so really, though that time span, she was just a potato that slept all day. I remember thinking like, wow, this is really easy. We just feed her and then we put her down and she sleeps and then occasionally I have to change her and it all just starts over, but she was just sleeping all day. ⁓

And then that quickly changed. we hit her actual date of when she should have come and she was starting to cry like all of the time and just couldn't be calmed or satisfied. Like she just was an unhappy, unhappy baby for a very long time. We went through.

⁓ many months of if she was awake, she was crying. And if she was asleep, she was attached to one of us. Yeah. So like she would take really long naps, but she had to be attached. So like I remember during my paternity leave, I remember we have that like the yoga ball that you buy, you know, when you're pregnant. So I would like have to bounce on the yoga ball with her on attached to me until she would fall asleep.

Chelsea Myers (45:42)
Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (45:50)
And then I would basically lay in bed and like, I had a switch, I would just play video games for a few hours while she was asleep. And then she'd wake up and cry. And then she would do that for a while and then strap her back on and bounce her to go to sleep. was literally the only thing that could calm her down because everyone would be like, well, try baths or try going in the stroller, try going for a drive. She hated the car seat. She hated the stroller. And it was also the middle of winter. you're not. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (46:20)
Yeah, you're not going on walks.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (46:20)
You can't do that.

And then she hated bats. Like there was nothing that everyone would, you know, have all this wisdom never worked. You know, we just screamed. We tried the whole like you put them in and you kind of let them like fuss a bit. But she there was no fussing for this one. There was she was fine or she was dying. Like those were those. That's what it was like. So people take, well, you know, just let her fuss for a few minutes. It's like I would love to do that. I would love to let her fuss for five minutes. I don't think she knows how to fuss.

Chelsea Myers (46:39)
Mmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (46:51)
⁓ to the yes screaming bloody murdering there was one night it went on so long that we ended up calling the doctor and it was like past hours you know we're just like she won't stop screaming they had her they had us like check her body to see if there was like little hairs you know how they say they can get wrapped and there's no signs and eventually she just tired herself out but ⁓ like clockwork

Chelsea Myers (46:51)
She skips right to the... to the... Yeah.

Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (47:18)
every night like 5 to 8 p.m. just screaming and Mike and I would take turns in the rocking chair and just like rock her and do everything we could but it's like you couldn't we couldn't like regulate ourselves because we're just you're just constantly hearing screaming huh I say that hell is just overtired babies all around you screaming and you're just constantly trying to get them to sleep that would be my hell

Chelsea Myers (47:38)
Yeah.

my God, can, yes. Yeah. I can absolutely picture that. and you, you did, you just briefly touched on it. Like you couldn't regulate your own nervous systems. What were you doing to cope? mean, I'm not going to say what was helping because nothing was probably helping, but what were you at least trying to do to cope?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (47:50)
you

Yeah.

Yeah.

We

definitely, ⁓ know, pre-parenting, you're always like judging other parents and you're judging, I would do it this way, I do it that way. And I remember you go through the whole hospital training about never shake a baby. And it's like going through that whole thing with our first, was like, okay, I understand why you have to get this training because you get to that point. And so Mike and I were constantly like,

Chelsea Myers (48:29)
Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (48:41)
I'm tapping out, need to put the baby, like we would just put her in the crib and walk out of the room for like five minutes. Or if the other person was regulated enough, they'd go in and do it. if you have to do that, because, and I'm like the most patient person. Like I have a lot of, I'm a kindergarten teacher, so I have a lot of patience. I would get to those points as well and just need to take a break. ⁓

Chelsea Myers (49:01)
Yeah, you kind of have to be.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (49:10)
And sometimes just go into a dark room and like put my head under the blanket and just I needed sensory deprivation sometimes. Yeah. You were probably. Yeah. Video games and like. yeah, I was totally dissociating. ⁓ I mean, I also like I didn't really I mean, again, like as I mentioned earlier, when you're the when you're the non birthing.

partner, you've sort of missed out on like nine months of bonding to this little creature. ⁓ And so like I didn't bond to our first one. ⁓ Like probably at about a year, like it took me a really long time to like feel connected. I I didn't I wouldn't say that I I've been I've been through a heck of a lot of therapy. I didn't start really enjoying being a dad until like probably six months ago. Like I've had moments here and there.

⁓ But like, really, it's like six months ago, it all kind of clicked for me. And I've got two, know, one is five and one is two. but so yeah, it took me a really long time to bond with snuzz. And I definitely went through like a pretty intense, depressive time. I like regular said to Megan, like we've ruined our lives. We've made the worst decision we possibly could have made.

Chelsea Myers (50:16)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (50:37)
⁓ Our life was so good, what were we thinking like? And like, yeah, I just, I honestly believed, was like, this is what it's gonna be like for the rest of our lives. Now we're just gonna have a screaming child for the rest of our lives. And yeah, I was pretty miserable. And then around, it was April, we went to visit ⁓

some buddies of mine that live out in Troy, some college friends. And we were both there with, with snuzz. And she had gone to sleep pretty easily and then woke up and was screaming. And I couldn't be with my friends. The place we, the house we were at had a, had a bathtub and Megan was in this bathtub, like getting some time to herself. And so like my friends are all like hanging out and I have to like, take care of this screaming child who has no reason to scream and whatever it is, like shouldn't be sleeping. And I like finally get her down.

I go downstairs and my buddy is like, are you okay? And I was like, nope, I'm not okay. And like, I just like unloaded and said all of these like pretty terrible things that I'd been thinking, but I'd said them out loud. And my friend was just like, why aren't you talking to us? Like, this is, you can't hold onto these things. You gotta let it out. And that was super helpful. And then like probably around six months, things started to change. She became more of a...

I don't want to say normal, like she wasn't screaming all the time. The sleeping became a little bit easier. ⁓ Once she could sit up, I think a lot of it was digestive, but right. All the probiotic stuff and all that. ⁓ But nothing. Yeah. Once she could sit up, things evened out. Yeah. But I mean, it took a long time. It took a long time. Yeah. And everyone would would tell us like, ⁓ three months, she'll be fine. Three months is the mark. Three months came and went and it wasn't fine.

Chelsea Myers (52:15)
Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (52:35)
And then you just felt like, there's no hope for us. Like what is happening? ⁓ And then one of the suggestions of the pediatrician was like, well, maybe it's an allergy. And I was breastfeeding and I was very adamant that I wanted to breastfeed. ⁓ And so to the idea of having to like take out another thing for me, like I just couldn't handle that. And I'm like, I'm not, I'm not gonna change my diet. I can't do that.

⁓ and maybe that's selfish of me, but I was like, I can't give up another thing. And it, I mean, I don't know how that all correlates. She, she hasn't had an allergy. ⁓ but her digestion, I think just matured and yeah, was really wild. She's just a fierce little kid. You know, she's just like, she's like, ⁓ she's loud and independent and she just was figuring it out. I suppose.

Chelsea Myers (53:09)
Mm-mm.

Yeah.

You

I mean, there's so many things that you hit on that are so important. And I love how candidly and almost like offhandedly you mentioned them because to me that signals you feel comfortable talking about it. And that's the goal, right? So like Megan, things that you said were like, yeah, sometimes I just put her down and walked away.

And that is a really hard thing to do for a lot of parents. But when you know, like, and they say over and over again, like they're in their bed, their crib, they're safe. You can walk away, but to hear you, a parent who has been through it and you are on the other side of it, like it's true. You can do it. You can put your baby down, you can walk away and it's probably safer for everyone involved if you do that. And then Mike, to hear you talk about not.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (54:21)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (54:27)
being able to bond for quite a long time, that's not abnormal either, especially when you're dealing with overstimulation and lack of sleep. I love, my dogs are choosing now to start chewing on bones. I love that you brought up that moment with your friend because whether it came from just

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (54:46)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (54:56)
complete overwhelm or it was just time to come out. Like you did, you just, let your guard down and you let it all out. And that's another stigma with dads. Dads are supposed to hold it all together. And dads are like, just like you said, I didn't carry the baby for nine months. So I've got to put up with this stuff. The other side of it is that I love that your friend said, talk to us about this.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (55:22)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (55:23)
Right? Like, that's so powerful.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (55:26)
And just validating like, he, I know he said like, that sounds really hard, like, because we've just been bombarded with all these like, Oh, it gets better, it gets better. Oh, it's gonna get it's gonna be great. You're gonna not feel this way. It's like, well, I do feel this way. Like it's and that's okay. And like, we need to talk about that too. I think you know, so my aunt is a grief counselor. And I'm she's sort of like a mother figure.

Chelsea Myers (55:32)
Yeah!

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (55:54)
and has been for a long time. And she talks a lot about like the grief that comes with having children and that, like, you know, everyone thinks you have a kid and it's super happy. And it is like, there's a lot of joy that comes with having kids, but like, we didn't sit down for a meal together for months. Like we, we did not, all of the interactions that we had were gone because we had this incredibly needy little kiddo.

Chelsea Myers (56:19)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (56:24)
And with our second, we certainly lost out on things, but we didn't lose out on as much because our second one wasn't as, wasn't as, you know, it as intense. so when you're going through it for the first time, the things you lose feel like they're lost forever. And when people say, don't worry, you're going to get it back. It's like, I don't know that to be true. Like I don't, it doesn't feel that way. ⁓

But my aunt was really good about saying like, you know, it feels like these things are lost forever, but you're going to find one day you're not even going to realize it. Like those meals that you weren't having together, all of a sudden you are having them together and like, you're not going to get everything back. And there's certainly grief associated with the life you've left behind, but you will get some things back and you know, you'll get new things that you didn't have before. And I think

It was hard in those moments to recognize that. But after the fact, was like, yes, we did get most of those things back. And look, even after having the second one, there were moments where we grieve having missing on just the three of us. know, like it's having a kid is not all joy. Like it is a lot of joy and it's also a lot of grief and mourning. And that's OK. I mean, there's you can have room for both. Just when my first one was turning four,

she was like, are you happy I'm turning four? And I said, I'm happy and I'm sad. It's like, I'm happy that you keep getting bigger and that you keep learning new things and I'm sad because you keep getting older. And even at four years old, she was able to kind of pick up on some of that. So there's a lot of that with parenting where there's a lot of joy and there's a lot of sadness. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (58:15)
Yeah, it's

that and it's the both and, and I think that's something that is being pushed a lot in the whole mental health realm. ⁓ instead of saying, but we're saying, and like there's space for all of those feelings. just watch inside out if we're going with the Pixar theme for this, for this episode, right. Inside out and inside out too, they're all pushing all the buttons. It's not just one all the time. ⁓ so.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (58:28)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah ⁓

Chelsea Myers (58:45)
The question that I feel like I have to ask, especially hearing Mike you say like it was only within the last six months that you really started enjoying fatherhood and parenthood.

What made you guys decide that you wanted to have another child when you were struggling to sort of maintain, I want to say maintain your sanity, but like find a new balance after having your first?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (59:13)
Yeah, so our first was probably four months old or something and we had gone on a walk and Mike basically said like, if we have another like we're gonna get divorced like there's no way we can sustain this is there's no way I can like approve having more right now and ⁓

And I was just like shocked. Like I knew he was struggling but I didn't know it was like to that level. ⁓ And I mean that was pretty devastating to hear and I wasn't really willing to accept it. ⁓ I don't think I really ever did accept that. I just kind of let it lie for a while.

Chelsea Myers (59:39)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:00:01)
Because we also weren't trying to have a second one Right, we knew that if we were gonna have a kid it was gonna be when they were two when the first one was two or three. Yeah. And, I mean, time really did just like play out. And things did get better and things did get better. But I think I knew I needed this was something I remember telling you specifically like I need to

Chelsea Myers (1:00:17)
You

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:00:28)
have another and know that's my last so like I can have all the closure like I can know this is my last pregnancy and and then every time I put baby clothes away and sell them I know that okay we're done like I need to have that closure for myself because I wasn't prepared for that with the first obviously ⁓ so that was a big part for me and then also knowing that I really needed or I really wanted my my first to have a sibling

Chelsea Myers (1:00:31)
Hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:00:56)
grow up with. ⁓ Those were my two like in my mind kind of non-negotiables. ⁓ I don't know how you perceived me hearing you but like I guess I don't feel like I ever really... Well I think that while like I didn't love parenthood with our first... by the time we got to about a year, year and a half old

It was at least like more enjoyable. Like, yeah, you know, they can do things. They're not they're not quite potatoes. Right. It's like I was certainly finding moments of joy and and enjoying it and enjoying her and and all that. And so I think once she once she had reached like two. I, you know, I still loved to. Yeah, two was a great age. We a lot of fun at two at the first.

Chelsea Myers (1:01:30)
Yes.

Everybody

hates 2, it's 3 that you really have to watch out for. Mm-hmm. I have a 3-year-old right now. Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:01:53)
Yeah, yeah, three is horrible. Three is rough. Treenager. Two's are fun. Yeah.

But I think I think what it was was basically like I was in a place where I was sort of like. I still am not sure that having a second is what's best for me, but I know that having a second is what's best for everyone else. And I think that.

It's more like at that point, it was sort of like me not wanting a second wasn't as strong as like knowing that my first would be better with a second and knowing that Megan really needed really need to have a second. And so it basically became a game like a cost like a cost benefit. ⁓ Cost benefit. Yeah, exactly. Where it was like she needs this more than I don't need it. And so I'm happy to kind of go along for the ride. And now at least I know what to expect.

Chelsea Myers (1:02:39)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:02:47)
the likelihood that the second is gonna be like the first is really low. If it is, we at least know it's gonna end at some point that we got through the first time, we'll get through the second time. And this came along later on, but right before we had the second, I decided to go back into therapy. Like there were some things that came up that were like really intense. I spoke with a friend of mine who was like, you need to get your shit sorted out before the second baby comes. Like you need to.

She was like, your wife does not need to be like having a baby while you're like, while you're all over the place. whether it's medication, whatever it is, like you need to get this figured out. ⁓ And so I decided to go back in a therapy. I think literally I went and like a week later. Mouse came. It was that summer. And so we should just add in, was so probably like between year, year and a half, like we, had

kind of agreed that we were going to have a second. And then our second wasn't, we were going to push it off, but then she came unexpected. Like we were pregnant. Yeah, we didn't, we had a plan. I didn't listen to the plan or I apparently didn't get the notes on the plan. ⁓ And so we had mouse probably about six months earlier than we had originally wanted to. ⁓

Chelsea Myers (1:03:55)
Mmm.

You

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:04:12)
But yeah, so I decided to go back into therapy so that when...

when we started having the newborn and all these things, I was like simultaneously going through therapy and like sorting out a bunch of stuff that I hadn't at that point sorted out. ⁓ And so we were also very fortunate that Mouse was a super easy baby, like very, very easy I mean, they were complete opposites. Like you could, I remember, it's wild. I remember having a friend over just drinking coffee and our second was like in tummy time on the floor.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:34)
It's funny how that works.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:04:42)
And we're just like chatting away and then we look over and she just fell asleep. Like my first would have never like she needed us bouncing in the dark. It was a while. was mouse was like sleeping through the night. I think by like three or four months, like she was getting like six, seven hour stretches. Such a good sleeper, which. Our first at by 18 months was not sleeping through the night like.

Chelsea Myers (1:04:47)
my god.

Wow.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:05:12)
was still waking up once in middle of the night we co slept with our first we had to co sleep we were not really long time we were not pro co sleep sleeping until we had but then one of those things that i was super judgy about and then i was like okay this is how i'm gonna but we are pro sleep and the only way that we got sleep was by bringing the kiddo kiddo in with us so

Chelsea Myers (1:05:22)
until you had your baby.

Yes.

Yeah,

yeah. I also just like side note, I love your pseudonyms for both of your kids. Snuzz and Mouse. Well, and then it also like when you're talking about mouse, it like their temperament. See, I don't know if that's why you chose the pseudonym, but like just like a quiet little mouse. Like, I don't know. ⁓

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:06:00)
Mouse

was very squeaky as a baby. so the first the first one named her mouse. She's she's squeaking. Yeah. Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (1:06:07)
The first, ⁓ Snuzz Nicknamed Mouse. Okay, I kind of love that. I also

love that you keep making the analogy to the potato ⁓ because that's literally what we called our second and I still call her a potato all the time. I just call her sweet potato now. But like, again, it's that other side of parenting, right? Like we're sold.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:06:22)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (1:06:32)
They're beautiful. And when they put them on your chest, you're just like, this is the most glorious thing I've ever held. it's magic. And no, like you were saying, Mike, like they're covered in vernis and blood and they're sometimes purple or blue or gray. And then they just look weird for a while and they don't do a whole lot. So for like, for parents who are like, yeah, I didn't, I didn't really like, I didn't feel.

they just kind of lived in my house, right? Like they lived in my house and I had to take care of them. That's an okay reaction. That's a perfectly valid reaction to the circumstances that were presented to you guys. ⁓ I'm going to, it's going to feel like I'm fast forwarding, but it's just for sake of time. You guys have both done such a beautiful job of like,

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:07:04)
Yeah.

you

Chelsea Myers (1:07:31)
interweaving both of your kiddos stories throughout this whole time, which has made my job a lot easier because I don't have to follow a strict timeline. You're doing like comparisons in real time, which is so nice. But I want to go back to that comment that you made about six months ago, you finally started to find your groove mic. And I'm going to touch on that too. But Megan,

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:07:50)
Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (1:07:55)
Do you feel like you've hit your groove as a mom?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:07:58)
Yes, I had a much easier time ⁓ right from the beginning. I wouldn't say I had any trouble bonding. ⁓ It was that fourth trimester was hell on earth. I'm still saying, but I very much felt connected to her and bonded and everything. ⁓ I feel like once they hit

Chelsea Myers (1:08:15)
Yeah.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:08:26)
Like once a baby hits 18 months, that is when I'm like, all right, we're cruising. ⁓ Anything prior to that, it's just, it's really hard. Yeah. And the sleep, the sleep is so important for me. ⁓ I remember, I don't remember how old she was, but maybe like nine months or something. And she, the first had woken up at like four in the morning and was like ready to be awake.

Chelsea Myers (1:08:36)
Survival.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:08:54)
and I was just sobbing like in her room and I'm just like pleading with this nine month old like please just sleep and she like picked up her pacifier and put it in my mouth. ⁓

Chelsea Myers (1:09:07)
⁓ my god.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:09:08)
I was just... So sweet, but I just remember feeling so broken. I just need to sleep. ⁓ So yeah, once the sleep is sorted out and everything, I feel like I've been cruising.

Chelsea Myers (1:09:10)
That is the sweetest thing I think I've ever heard. Here, mama.

Yeah. Yeah.

ask that question for several reasons. One is just out of curiosity and two, I don't know if I have ever felt like I've got it down. And I know that there's a lot of us out there that are like, no, dude, I'm still in survival mode, but at least there's glimmers along the way. So yeah, go ahead.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:09:53)
What's interesting

for me, I feel like I'm going to go backwards because I'm all about the early ed. Like I'm an early educator. I absolutely love young children. Once they hit like that, you know, fifth grade and on, I feel like I'm gonna just not know what to do. And that's probably when he's gonna like, soar. So at least we're a team, but I can't.

Chelsea Myers (1:10:01)
⁓

Girl, let me...

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:10:22)
I don't know how people manage older children.

Chelsea Myers (1:10:26)
So I don't, I try

so hard to not make this about me at all, but I will say I was the same way. I was always an early educator, like kindergarten through second grade. Don't give me anything higher. That is where I thrive. And I am finding I have, my oldest is going to be 10 on the 22nd and it's hard, man. I'm like, I don't know what.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:10:50)
you

Chelsea Myers (1:10:52)
to do with you or how to answer the questions that you're asking. She's also neuro sparkly too. So I'm like, and I'm a special educator. You'd think that I would, but I'm like, girl, I, got to sit down. ⁓ but yes, so I can relate. see you on that. And I'm, and I'm hopeful for you that you can still cruise.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:10:55)
you

you

Okay.

I would say an

area that I could use more growth in, which again he's much better at, is like consistent boundary, like the discipline aspect. I'm a lot more like lenient, flexible. How can we negotiate this? ⁓

Chelsea Myers (1:11:20)
I, yes.

I am as well. Yes.

That is

yes. And when I ask my husband, I'm like, why did they just listen to you? Or why did they leave you alone? Why did they just leave you alone if you're in a room? He's like, I don't know, they just do. And I'm like, they never leave me alone, ever. Okay. So Mike, I said I would come back to it, you said you're finding your groove. What does that look like and feel like to you? What of the last six months, what's different about them?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:11:32)
Great.

So I think ⁓ for a large portion of my first time on this planet and for good portion of my second, parenting has always been like a checklist. It's like a chore. It's like, gotta do this, then you gotta do this, then you gotta do this. ⁓ over the last, yeah, like two years after being in therapy and really beginning to heal some of my childhood trauma and...

parenting does a lot of healing too. ⁓ I have found it much, much easier to live in the moment and to be present. And when I am present with my children, it is an absolute joy. When I lean into like, we're gonna sit and play this game now, or we're gonna read these books now, and as it has gotten easier and easier for me to be in the present and to not.

focus on future or past or whatever, it has become more more enjoyable. ⁓ And so, like, I would say that at least daily I am sort of astounded that I am so lucky to be these kids' And ⁓ I've also found that practicing gratitude, you know, mean, there's a lot of like, you know, like,

your, your, ⁓ what are the words, your mantras or gratitude or all these things that like, I think when you say them out loud, feels kind of silly and foolish. But when you, if you like actually practice them, like, like if you like at night with our first, I got into this pattern of asking her like, are you grateful for? And then she started asking me, what are you grateful for? And so I was put into this position where I had to like, really be thoughtful about what I'm grateful for. And when you do that for a while, it

Chelsea Myers (1:13:24)
Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:13:49)
it doesn't become a practice, it becomes a default. Your brain defaults to what are you grateful for. And I am in a place now where I'm far more present and I'm able to be far more open to what I'm grateful for. And I think because of that, I really love and enjoy being a parent to the point where like, I'm now like, I don't know if I'm done.

⁓ We are done. We've gone through the process of being done,

Chelsea Myers (1:14:19)
Whaaaa-

Okay. I

was like, whoa, that's the twist that this episode didn't see coming.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:14:29)
Yeah.

Like a month ago, he started making comments like. Well, because our second is now starting to like, like even just like over the last week, our second is like saying sentences now. Like before, she was going on. But now, like even today, she was like, open door, please. And it's like, I'm not ready for that to be done. Like, I'm not ready for them to be too big to like sit on my lap and rock. I'm just not. I'm not ready for that.

Chelsea Myers (1:14:42)
Yeah.

Yeah

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:14:59)
⁓ I never thought I would never thought. Yeah. So.

Chelsea Myers (1:15:05)
Yeah, I'm shocked that really that was the twist that I didn't see coming. ⁓

yeah, I so again, there are so many things that you brought up that are important for a lot of us to remember that these things are skills, and that they are a practice, but the more that you practice them.

the easier it becomes to embody them. And like you call them, you talk about gratitude. What are you grateful for? In my life, I call them glimmers. And it's just, you're looking for the glimmers. ⁓ And I absolutely love that your oldest is now inquiring that of you because you modeled that for them. Yeah, I have to find a way to wrap us around. And it's so hard because literally I could talk to you guys.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:15:27)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (1:15:55)
forever. And no, this has been so hard for me because I don't know if it's because you're just Vermonters or if I feel like I know you because we've been chatting but like, it's been so hard for me to be like, to not be like, my god, me too. Or like, that happened to me too. Because that's not what I'm here for. So I have to put my podcaster hat back on my host hat back on. ⁓

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:15:56)
Mm-hmm.

I'm speaking in English.

Chelsea Myers (1:16:22)
How do I want to do this? You're just, you're seeing it in real time. ⁓ this is, yeah, Megan, when you listen to my podcast, this is the stuff you don't hear. This is what I edit out. what I think I've appreciated most about both of you being together, cause I, I don't often get to meet with couples or co-parents or even just two people at once.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:16:32)
But great.

Chelsea Myers (1:16:51)
So what I've really enjoyed is being able to explore your journey to and through parenthood through both lenses, right? Through Megan's experience and through Mike's experience. And I think that's what's so cool about your podcast too, is that it is exploring the duality of that. And you're talking to people in your lives and getting their experiences too. And I'm so freaking excited that now I can go listen to the episodes because now we've chatted. ⁓

And then my brain just closed all the tabs. See, isn't that great? Like I sounded like I knew what I was gonna say and then it disappeared. ⁓ okay. So yeah, we're all about, I mean, Quiet Connection, we're all about smashing stigmas and we're all about talking about the things that we're told we're not supposed to talk about. And the two of you have done that so beautifully and in two very different ways. So I'm super...

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:17:41)
Thank

Chelsea Myers (1:17:48)
I feel really lucky to have been able to sit with you in this and get to hear your journey through two very different sides, two different experiences. I don't know. You both have the same kids. You both went through the same things, but you experienced them in very different ways. Yeah. So this is me encouraging listeners to listen to Pondering Parenthood podcast.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:18:07)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (1:18:18)
Check the freaking show notes, people. Show notes are where the good stuff is at. That is how you find out things about my guests. And that's where you'll find a link to the podcast. If my listeners want to learn more about you, about your podcasting, about how they can sort of follow your journey, where is the best place for them to find you?

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:18:39)
So our podcast is on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, iHeart, and YouTube. ⁓ So it's Pondering Parenthood. And then ⁓ we also have an Instagram where I'd love to get more engagement once we have more followers. ⁓ And that's the the handle is pondering parenthood pod.

Chelsea Myers (1:19:03)
Mm-hmm.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:19:04)
They can also email us at ponderingparenthoodpodcast at gmail.com.

Chelsea Myers (1:19:10)
Yeah,

you guys are legit. You've got a- you are legit.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:19:15)
We're looking to, mean, currently we're interviewing like family and friends, but we would love to start getting a diversity of experiences on our podcast. We'd love to have you come on our podcast. And I don't know if we could get Ben on there too, but I would be really cool. Maybe I don't know. two. It'd be great.

Chelsea Myers (1:19:27)
I would love to be on your podcast.

Ooh, like both of us at the same time. Yeah. Whatever you guys, whatever you guys want

to do, I would be absolutely honored. ⁓ So listeners, that's your call to action. ⁓ Check out their Instagram, the podcast, email ⁓ them, email Mike and Megan and get on their show. Okay. Support, support more Vermonters. Okay. We're living in...

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:20:01)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (1:20:04)
this little bubble up here and you can come be in the bubble with us. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Now comes the fun part that you weren't expecting. You thought you knew Megan, but you did it, but you didn't. I'm doing a new thing. ⁓ It's the elder millennial in meme. Everyone's all about text messages and voice memos and everybody's easily reachable and you can get someone at a moment's notice and

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:20:08)
Love it.

No, I really did.

Chelsea Myers (1:20:34)
I'm taking us back to the days where you had to call a landline and if nobody answered, you had to leave a message. So my next guest, you don't know who they are. You don't know anything about them, but you called Quiet Connection today and they didn't answer because they weren't here yet. So you have to leave them a message and you can literally interpret that however you would like. But the fun part is, is you get to come back to the episode before yours to get your message.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:21:04)
Wow.

Chelsea Myers (1:21:04)
That's my

little, right? I'm trying it out for season six and seven. But yeah, so you're leaving a message for whoever this person may be.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:21:14)
I'll tell you. Me?

Chelsea Myers (1:21:15)
No, I'm

challenging you, Mike. You both have to leave your own messages.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:21:20)
I guess I'm gonna yeah I'll start. Yeah I'm just gonna kind of pick up where we just left off. I'm just gonna be like practicing practicing being present and practicing gratitude or like the keys.

Chelsea Myers (1:21:25)
you

I it. I know that's it. They just, they just pushed beep and they're like practicing. ⁓ okay, Mike. That's very wise. All right.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:21:38)
That's my message.

My message would be that I think that we were all meant to be on this podcast and we are creating community right here right now and it's what's connecting all of us together and I think that's beautiful.

Chelsea Myers (1:22:00)
You

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:22:13)
So thank you, person, for joining this Quiet Connection community and we can learn from each other.

Chelsea Myers (1:22:23)
I love that as well. love both of those. Those are both very you. And I don't even know you that well, but it just matches the vibe. ⁓ I love that. And yes, that's the whole goal, right? Everyone who comes on Quiet Connection, you're now part of the family. You're now part of the community. The village that we were all promised, this is it. And you're a part of it now. You're in. You're VIPs. ⁓ Anyway, I...

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:22:30)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (1:22:51)
I'm so glad that we finally got to chat and see each other's faces for real. Maybe for real real someday since we're really not that far away. And yeah, just thank you for being honest, open, vulnerable and yeah, I see you. I see, I literally see you, but I see you.

Meghann And Mike Oquendo (1:22:55)
Me too.

you

And I want to thank you Chelsea because I feel like listening to your podcast has really helped me become more open with how I'm communicating things. Like, there have been so many times where I listen to an episode and it's like I experienced that and they just put it so eloquently that like

the same exact things I've thought and felt, like I couldn't express them myself. there have been so many, so many moments like that. So it's just really cool to finally meet you.

Chelsea Myers (1:23:42)
⁓

my gosh, I literally cannot tell you how much that means to me. That's whole goal. My whole goal is so that whoever is listening feels seen and doesn't feel alone. So that means so much to me.