High-Protein Hijack: Are Hyper-Palatable Foods Sabotaging Your Protein Goals? with Reshanda Yates

What's Aliye cooking this week? 5 quick & delicious high-protein meals!
[Grab the recipes here]

Are you trying to eat more protein but constantly feel like you're fighting an uphill battle against your own cravings? If so, you're definitely not alone, and today's episode is specifically for you. We're going to unravel the mystery of hyper-palatable foods and how they can undermine even the best intentions when it comes to high-protein eating. 

In this episode I'm excited to welcome Reshanda Yates, who shares her expertise on how to use mindful eating strategies to overcome these cravings and reclaim your power over your plate. 

Listen now and discover the truth about hyper-palatable foods and how they impact your protein goals.

Snap a screenshot of the episode playing on your device, post it to your Instagram Stories and tag us, @soulspacechef, @reshandayates. We’d love to hear what resonated with you the most!

In this episode you'll hear: 

• Why it's hard to stick to a high-protein diet when cravings strike.
• Reshanda's personal experience with binge eating and finding a path to control.
• The science behind "snackability" and how food engineers create addictive foods.
• The perfect storm of salt, sugar, and fat: How these combinations hijack your brain.
• Marketing tricks and the pursuit of profit: The hidden forces driving food cravings.
• The Willpower Myth: Why willpower isn't enough to overcome engineered cravings.
• Why "Everything in Moderation" Doesn't Always Work and what does instead
• The role of your prefrontal cortex in mindful eating
• Recognizing emotional and cultural attachments to food.
• Practical Tips for Taking Back Control of your eating

Links:

For more on how to practice mindful eating, connect with Reshanda on Instagram or her podcast. 

Links:

• Aliye's cooking videos: Watch now on Youtube
• FREE High-Protein Meals Training

Transcript

Aliye Aydin: All right, I'm here with Rashanda Yates, who is a mindful eating coach, and invited her on the podcast today to talk to me about food cravings,…

Aliye Aydin: the addictive qualities of foods, what I call hyper palatable foods, and I'm really excited to have her You have a podcast. You said it has over 50,000 downloads. Is that what you said? What's the name of it again?

Reshanda Yates: Mhm. Correct.

Reshanda Yates: It's called the Rise and Align with food podcast. Absolutely.

Aliye Aydin: Brian Align with Food podcast. That's awesome. I need to go listen to some episodes. We're in the same business group, so that's how I found you.  But I looking forward to having an expert on here. Can you tell a people a little bit more about what you do as a mindful eating coach?

Reshanda Yates: So I always like to start with why I became a mindful eating coach and that is because about 10 years ago I was struggling with binge compulsive eating. So I basically would have described myself I felt totally out of control with my eating. I would and it was this flip a coin kind of situation where I would eat really really healthy during the day and then at night is a switch would flip and then I would find myself kind of zoning out just eating so much food and then sort of coming to and realizing what I had ate.

Reshanda Yates: So it was almost like this out of body experience that I was experiencing and then I would feel a lot of shame and guilt and I felt a lot of frustration. So going through that experience and finding my way out of that experience is what brought me to being a mindful eating coach. And what I have discovered is that when you build just a particular set of skills and…

Reshanda Yates: tools, you can really just retrain yourself to respond to cravings and food and the environment in a new way. And so what I do is I help women to do the same thing.

Aliye Aydin: Got it.

Aliye Aydin: That makes a lot of sense. So, you're building an awareness for people. You're kind of helping people step back and see what's happening with them is what I'm hearing. because maybe they're not even aware that they're doing what you just described. Maybe that's their situation. But we become so unaware of our choices and…

Aliye Aydin: what we're doing on a day, right? Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: Yeah, for sure.

Reshanda Yates: it very much for me was a very automatic reaction and it was be the awareness was really all these layers of an onion is kind of how I described it of becoming aware of okay I'm doing this…

Reshanda Yates: because I feel this way and then becoming aware of what those feelings even are and…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. That's funny.

Reshanda Yates: as we're going to be talking about today what part of that awareness is what's happening in the world around me, because I was the kind of person who I used to really struggle with, for example, certain foods like Oreos for example, and that's something I hear a lot of people talk about Oreos specifically.

Reshanda Yates: And I'm sure we'll get into a little bit about that,…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Mhm.

Reshanda Yates: but I would feel like, okay, if I eat an Oreo, I'm going to eat 10 Oreos, and I got so frustrated about this, why can't I just eat one cookie and stop? …

Aliye Aydin: Mhm. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: if I want to allow myself a treat, why can't I just stop? And so it was becoming aware of not only what was happening inside of me, but also what was happening in that food, but also there's this other piece of the psychological component which is encompassing like marketing and they're all interrelated. So really becoming aware of multiple layers of this too.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I mean, we'll just start with why I wanted to have you on.

Reshanda Yates: Mhm. Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: So, I help people. I have a high protein cooking membership, right? So, women over 40 who are interested in eating more protein. We all hear, " it's better to eat more protein." And as a chef, I come at it from very much fun and flavor perspective.  and I've started eating that way. so I started thinking about ways that people could possibly have difficulty with changing the way that they're eating or what obstacles they would have to eating more protein. And one of the ones that came up was I thought about, I can't stop eating the thing I don't want to eat right there that I'm not supposed to be eating, whether it be just unhealthy food or cookies or crackers or whatever it was in that unhealthy category.

00:05:00

Aliye Aydin: And then I started thinking about and I haven't read a ton about this…

Reshanda Yates: Yes. Yes. Absolutely.

Aliye Aydin: but about hyper palatable foods and about how these processed foods that are created so that they basically hijack our brain, And that we can't help but crave them. And I think one of my big messages for people it's not your fault. It's not about your will power. And I think that's what you're lot talking about a lot too is the shame and the guilt that we get stuck in and we don't even realize all these factors of play.  some of which you just mentioned it's cultural it's psychological it's chemical I mean I guess what I'm talking about is very chemical right yeah

Reshanda Yates: And I love the fact that you bring up the point about willpower and the part about hijacking your brain because yes, I mean it is in intentional conscious choice to engineer foods so that you can't stop eating them.

Reshanda Yates: That is on purpose.

Aliye Aydin: …

Reshanda Yates: And when I first learned about this, it actually angered me and it was one of the biggest fuel for me to really learn how to navigate this world. And I've talked about before how in my opinion it is a very hostile world, especially for people who are vulnerable to overeing, which is a large percentage of the population.

Aliye Aydin: M Yeah,…

Reshanda Yates: When you look at the research within women, 65% I think it was like I might have that percentage wrong…

Aliye Aydin: that's okay.

Reshanda Yates: but it's a high percentage okay of women…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah, right.

Reshanda Yates: who have identified with feeling like they don't have a handle on their eating.

Aliye Aydin: So, let's go back a little bit.  What is a hyper palatable food for people who are like, "What in the heck are they talking about?What does that mean?" Can you describe that?

Reshanda Yates: Absolutely. So, basically, it is what we've been talking about. It's just food that's been engineered so that it makes you want to eat more and more and more and more of it. it's typically very easy to consume.

Reshanda Yates: And so it is engineered with a certain combination they figure out how much salt and fat and sugar and sugar is usually a big part of this process. But they manipulate the food in such a way where when it touches your tongue, it sends signals to your brain that cause you to desire to keep eating the food. So, they have this term called snackability, which it's actually a scientific term that they use that food engineers use to get your food to make you want to snack and…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. …

Aliye Aydin: Right.

Reshanda Yates: snack and just keep going back, right?

Reshanda Yates: It comes I mean the things that they focus on down to the dust on the Doritos or the dust on the Cheetos…

Reshanda Yates: because what happens is when you lick your fingers to get the dust off of your fingers that plays a role in making you want to eat more. the stimulation of your tongue on the finger, it's just crazy.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. my god.

Aliye Aydin: Totally. Yeah. Absolutely.

Reshanda Yates: and their budgets. my god. so I feel like we can't talk about this without talking about marketing as well cuz all of this is centered absolutely in marketing and…

Reshanda Yates: getting you to buy. it's all profit driven.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Nice.

Reshanda Yates: And so a ton of their marketing budget is spent on research so they could dissect down to the nth degree what will make you reach back into the bag.

Reshanda Yates: how can they make that food? another one more thing I'll bring up is layering. So, we get bored like if you eat a chicken breast,…

Reshanda Yates: right, you're going to come to a point where you're like, "Okay, I've had enough chicken breast, right?" But if you bite into a Snickers bar, you've got a layer of nougat,…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Right.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah,…

Reshanda Yates: you've got a layer of nuts, you've got a layer of caramel, you've got a layer of I think they even put a little saltiness in there. So every time you take a bite, it's like your brain is thinking, this is a new experience that I'm having,…

Aliye Aydin: that's nice.

Reshanda Yates: " Which makes you want to finish the Snicker Bar.

Reshanda Yates: So they're very, very conscious of what they're doing. And so why makes me so mad and part of the reason why I'm so passionate about this.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: And that's basically hyper palatable food in a nutshell.

00:10:00

Aliye Aydin: It's like we've come to expect our food to entertain us, it's not enough to just eat. It has to somehow be fun or what you're talking about. You want to have to reach back in that bag for that next bite.

Aliye Aydin: And okay, I know it's awful, but I also know it's ingenious because our brain is working the way it's meant to, back in hunter gatherer days, we wanted more sugar for more energy, It was really so for survival.

Reshanda Yates: Right. Mhm.

Aliye Aydin: So what they're doing is they're tapping into the way that our brain works for survival knowing that we need this salt and this fat and the sugar and they're using it against us basically.

Reshanda Yates: Yes. Yes.

Aliye Aydin: I mean is really what's going on, Because if you're also unaware of this Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: Just why hijack?

Aliye Aydin: This is the definition of hijacking for sure.

Reshanda Yates: Perfect word. Mhm.

Aliye Aydin: So many different and I'm never going to look at that word snackability the same again. I'm never like, "Wow, snackability." That's what that means.

Aliye Aydin: That means we've hijacked your brain so you can't stop eating it.

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. Mhm.

Aliye Aydin: My So, I think this might lead to the next question. in our food diet culture, we have a lot of fear of fat and sugar and salt, especially. my god, whenever I add salt to a dish on a cooking video, people in the comments freak out every time. They're "Salt?" And I'm like, "A little bit of salt. it's need to make food taste good," so…

Reshanda Yates: Okay.

Aliye Aydin: where is that balance between too much salt is bad, too much sugar, too much fat, or is it a combo of all of them? what's the difference between that hyper palatable Cheeto and something that's crunchy, salty, and cheesy that's a nonprocessed food. You know what I'm saying?

Reshanda Yates: So that Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: And I want to address this in two different sections. So the first thing is the fear part which I can relate a lot to cuz fear of it it's almost like when you start having more awareness about stuff then that's when it's like your fear gets activated because you're like my god look what am I putting into my body…

Reshanda Yates: what is is this going to cause this disease is am I going to be able to manage this am I going to be able to control myself around this food or whatever the fear is that's coming up and…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: That was me, I was just anxious around food. And then I had gotten to a point where I was just so mentally focused.

Reshanda Yates: My mind was just spinning on food constantly, trying to manage it inside my head, trying to keep track of everything, trying to stop myself from eating certain things, and just always anxious and worried about what I was eating,…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. No.

Reshanda Yates: which is no way to live. It's like by the time if you can eek out every single little health benefit from your food, but you are miserable, what's the point,…

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. What?

Reshanda Yates: right? Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: I know. Exactly. Totally.

Reshanda Yates: And so, you talked about …

Reshanda Yates: what is that balance? And I actually don't think it's, either this type of food or that type of food.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Okay.

Reshanda Yates: I really think it's a yes and approach, which is kind of like my philosophy in life. I'm always looking to find ways to like you said, have balance.

Reshanda Yates: So, I'm looking for ways that I can know that I'm making the most empowered choices for myself and…

Reshanda Yates: enjoy indulgences in moderation. And I also want all of this to feel free. I'm micromanaging myself. I don't want to feel like it's this, experience of just contraction and restriction. And so that's one part of it, right? And that's really more of really understanding how your body responds to different foods. when you're eating, you can be mindful and…

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: your mindfulness activates a part of your brain called the prefrontal cortex, which allows you then to actually be in the experience, not being hijacked by the food that you're eating.

Aliye Aydin: Mhm. Right.

Reshanda Yates: So that's one part of it.

Reshanda Yates: Another thing you mentioned is, what's the difference between if I cook a whole foodbased meal for myself and I add a little salt and I cook with some fat, and I might use sugar in or…

Aliye Aydin: Right. Right.

Reshanda Yates: maybe a little honey and a stir fry sauce or whatever, what's the difference between that and what they do in, a bag of Cheetos or Doritos or whatever. And the difference is the processing the process.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Right.

00:15:00

Reshanda Yates: It's the process that when we are cooking in our homes it is not the same as when scientists are figuring out…

Reshanda Yates: how to chemically engineer a product to activate a specific reward pathway in our brains is not equivalent to each other.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Right.

Reshanda Yates: So now the discussion about how much salt you should be eating and things like that. That's not my lane. I'm very clear my name my lane is really about …

Reshanda Yates: once you have the information of how to get yourself on that path. but Comparing a bag of Doritos to some chicken breast with some salt is just not comparable.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. No, I know.

Reshanda Yates: That chicken breast that you eat,…

Aliye Aydin: It's so true.

Reshanda Yates: yeah, it's going to activate there's a few things that are happening when you eat whole foods. and I don't want to open up a whole different can of worms, but in a nutshell, what's happening when you eat whole foods is you're activating pathways in your body that lead to satiety.

Reshanda Yates: that lead to I guess we could just really stop it there. Society because that's really exactly right.

Aliye Aydin: I was just going to say that that's the thing,…

Aliye Aydin: right? you're crunching away on those chips, but you're not necessarily ever satisfied by them, which is why you keep crunching away on those chips until you just can't take it anymore or you fall asleep or the bag's empty. I mean,…

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. Exactly right.

Aliye Aydin: seems to be your choices. Yeah. Right.

Reshanda Yates: And another thing I was going to mention is there's actually research that shows and I would have to go back to the article. I can't remember what the citation is, but that when we eat foods that are truly satisfying, we don't just get the dopamine hit. So when you eat, a hyper palatable food like a candy bar or something, you do get a dopamine hit from that.

Reshanda Yates: But with foods that are actually satiating, you get a second dopamine hit that's in your stomach.

Aliye Aydin: Wow.

Reshanda Yates: And yeah, and so that's like a signal that okay, I'm done eating.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah,…

Reshanda Yates: I'm satisfied. I've gotten what I needed. So they're just not comparable at all.

Aliye Aydin: that is such great information. What do you think about the term everything in moderation? I've come to kind of have a different outlook on it because people tend to group everything in moderation meaning everything like your junk food and…

Aliye Aydin: your whole foods. So if you're eating everything in moderation, how is that junk food not taking over your brain? So in a way saying that doesn't really work right. I mean people I say that in my opinion with not an understanding of how our brain does get hijacked. people say, " everything in moderation." And you can use it as you don't realize you're addicted to that the cookie or…

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. Sure.

Aliye Aydin: the sugar or whatever it may be. and that's really what brought me to looking for somebody to talk about this because I think maybe I fall back on that a lot as an excuse from eating something that I know isn't the best, going to make me feel the best. And I'm like, " everything in moderation." And the next thing you know, I'm like, "What's moderation? I mean,…

Reshanda Yates: Okay.

Aliye Aydin: what the hell does that even mean?

Reshanda Yates: I get what you're saying.

Aliye Aydin: And then with this other added thing of …

Reshanda Yates: So, yeah.

Aliye Aydin: and…

Aliye Aydin: my brain might be being hijacked, so there's really no such thing as moderation happening. do you have an opinion about that term or Right. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: That expression is just too general.

Reshanda Yates: It's just not nuanced enough. Somebody is just saying it as a blanket way of eating.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: It's just not enough context, …

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Hey.

Reshanda Yates: because you don't know. let me back up a bit. So the approach that I take is that everybody has their own unique goals, values, everybody has a different situation in life, So we always have to take the context into consideration. And when it comes to eating everything in moderation, what I do, I say indulgences, I indulge in moderation.

Reshanda Yates: But when I first started down this path, that was not an option for me. As you said, I didn't have enough awareness. I didn't have enough skills. I didn't have enough tools at the very beginning to be able to do that. Which is why I do sort of come out against this thing. I don't know if you've heard of it called intuitive eating because I personally feel that I've seen it personally do more harm than good. not only in my own life, but in, the lives of my students. and I just personally feel that you can get to a point of eating intuitively. You just have to have the skills. You have to have that practice under your belt, right? I'm trying to think of a metaphor for this right now, but nothing's coming to mind.

00:20:00

Aliye Aydin: I've not heard of that.

Reshanda Yates: But something I'll just give you one of the things that I tell my students when they're first starting out because I work with a specific population of women…

Reshanda Yates: who tend to struggle with compulsive overeating, things like that. And when they're first starting out, they don't trust themselves enough, which honestly, they don't have any reason to trust themselves right now because they see what they're doing to their bodies. they see that they're not eating in alignment with what they want to be doing, which is eating healthy.

Aliye Aydin: Okay.

Reshanda Yates: And so, you have to build that trust over time. it's kind of like being with a partner. You don't just trust them with everything right out of the gate. you wouldn't give somebody your bank account information on a first date, But when you build that trust over time you're married or you have this 10-year partnership or whatever, then you do that.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Right.

Reshanda Yates: So, it's the same way when it comes to discovering how you can really be eating indulgences in moderation and…

Reshanda Yates: still be eating healthy on a regular basis. I tell my students to use the yes and method. And it's all based on my philosophy of looking for ways to add things to your diet that are going to support you versus focusing on I got to take that away. And so an example of this would be like last night I had pizza for dinner.

Aliye Aydin: Mhm. Uhhuh.

Aliye Aydin: Mhm.

Reshanda Yates: But just because I had pizza for dinner doesn't mean that I can't still eat,…

Reshanda Yates: some broccoli, a salad. it doesn't mean I'm going to be all or nothing.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Right.

Reshanda Yates: And so this is a way that I find it's a really simple way to start taking steps toward starting to get that balance because at first you might be eating depending on the person 80% junk and only 20% health nutritious foods.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Mhm.

Reshanda Yates: But you can start bringing those nutrition foods balance gradually up and then to maybe your 50/50. But then over time you're going to start to notice with the right tools and skills, right? you're going to start to notice, these foods make me feel better. And I'm starting to finally crave more of these nutritious foods. I'm starting to notice that when I eat these foods, I feel crappy for the next 24 hours or whatever. And you can start to get your reward pathways to be more in alignment with what you want to be doing on a regular basis.

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: That can happen. Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. That makes so much sense.

Aliye Aydin: I feel really vindicated right now cuz that's how I tell my students or my members to add more protein is to just add more protein and it pushes the other stuff aside. Right? So, you put protein on your plate first.

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: I'm always about the size of your hand to start with. Let's start there and then you can fill in with the other things. But it's not about restricting. It's about adding more of the thing you want…

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. That's…

Aliye Aydin: because it's important that mindset.

Reshanda Yates: how And it feels more abundant that way. It feels more like you're not,…

Aliye Aydin: Yes. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: stopping yourself or controlling yourself.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yeah. It's so true. I love this Instagram post that you had.  I thought this was so beautiful cuz it encapsulated how I think about food. It was a while ago, but it said your food is not just fuel and it's not just fun. And then you had this list of what food is and it was nourishment, fun, celebrating culture, creativity, nostalgia, energy. And I was like, yes, this is what it is.  I think that that's why it can be tricky because food brings up so many different things for so many different people that it's hard to just pinpoint exactly how to change the way that you want to eat if that's a goal of yours. some for me a big part of it is culture. I have a lot of cultural foods. We'll say coffee for example. I'm half Turkish.

Aliye Aydin: Giving up coffee because of health reasons has been one of the biggest struggles of my life because I have emotional attachment to it from being a kid. I have cultural emotional attachment from being trig. There's so many things that I've really had to come to terms with can you give up coffee? And the first the answer was absolutely Never. I'd rather die. And then I really had to realize wow this is making me feel not good. this too much especially coffee caffeine. And it's been a really gradual becoming more truthful with myself about…

00:25:00

Aliye Aydin: how I'm really feeling when it's a drink. But not just glossing over that part where I feel like a total spaz because I've had too much coffee. Even though it tastes amazing and the smell makes me so happy and all of it when I'm a spaz,…

Reshanda Yates: And I've had Turkish coffee.

Aliye Aydin: it doesn't make up for it, And I think that …

Reshanda Yates: It's good.

Aliye Aydin: so good.

Aliye Aydin: I mean, I just love coffee and I used to make it for my dad when I was a kid. there's just so many emotional things that I recognize in it that I wasn't ready to give it up.

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: But now, I don't give it up. I just drink less of it now. And I really like the smell of it. my gosh.

Reshanda Yates: Yeah. The smell of coffee is just so I feel like even non- coffee drinkers admit that it smells really good and…

Aliye Aydin: It smells so good, doesn't it?

Reshanda Yates: I could just sniff.

Aliye Aydin: I know.

Reshanda Yates: Yeah, I could sip all day.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: You do bring up something that I think is a really good point though is being a coffee drinker, …

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. That too. Mhm.

Reshanda Yates: it's such an identity piece. Yeah. And I remember a few years ago realizing it, really thinking about that, my gosh, me thinking that I'm a coffee drinker is an identity and It's a habit that I've formed into my identity. And it really blew my mind to think about what if I just gave up coffee? And I actually did stop drinking coffee for a while.

Aliye Aydin: Mhm. Right.

Reshanda Yates: Just to see what that would feel like, …

Aliye Aydin: Right. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: and it was a really interesting experiment to go through that.

Aliye Aydin: Because I think part of it's ritual, too. I think there's a huge part of food,…

Reshanda Yates: Yeah.

Aliye Aydin: right, that's ritual. And then when we don't have that ritual, It's attached to our identity.

Aliye Aydin: 

Reshanda Yates: Mhm. Right.

Aliye Aydin: Who am I without this thing that I do every day? Coffee is comforting. It's warm. Smells good.

Reshanda Yates: Mhm. …

Aliye Aydin: I love that. is there anything else you want to add about addictive foods or how can people get a hold of you if they want to work with you? If they're noticing maybe

Reshanda Yates: they can check out my podcast for The Rise of Plan with Food podcast. I'm on Instagram at Rashan Diates.

Reshanda Yates: And I guess what I would leave people with is just that, if you feel like certain foods are hijacking you and you can't stop eating them, recognize that there is a path forward where you can totally feel in control with that food. And it all just starts with being more aware.  So I would say I would love to leave people with one tip which is just next time for example you struggle with overeating Oreos try being super present while you're eating it and you'll be surprised when you super present very aware and you just sit there and eat the Oreo very very slowly for example again it comes back to your prefrontal cortex coming back online and you can start to taste

Reshanda Yates: everything that's in that cookie. you'll be surprised people actually start tasting the chemicals in them and then they become right and…

Aliye Aydin: less good.

Aliye Aydin: Definitely. Yeah.

Reshanda Yates: then you become naturally disenchanted with it which is an internal incentive to stop.

Aliye Aydin: Yeah. Yes.

Reshanda Yates: So that's the tip, the little nugget. I love to leave people at least one actionable nugget. So that's where I'll leave you with today. My pleasure.

Aliye Aydin: 

Aliye Aydin: That's perfect. Thank you so much. I appreciate it.