CFO Chronicles: The Secrets Behind Success

Why 97% of Fractional CFOs Fail to Hit 7-Figures (Mark Gandy’s No-Nonsense Playbook)

• James Donovan • Season 2 • Episode 39

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97% of CFO consultants never crack 7-figures

Mark Gandy’s been breaking the mold since 2001. With a 98% close rate, 250+ podcast episodes. He’s living proof that the “fractional CFO” label is killing your growth.

In this episode, he shares:


 🔑 The #1 sales secret that closes more deals than any pitch deck
 ⚡️ Why recurring revenue might actually hurt your growth
 🚀 How referrals alone fuel his million-dollar business and why it works
 💥 The mindset that took him from Big 8 burnout to a thriving 20+ year CFO practice

If you’re tired of playing small, this episode is your roadmap to real success.

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Speaker 1:

Today we are joined by none other than Mark Gandy from G3 CFO and the host of CFO Bookshelf, one of the top podcasts in the accounting industry today. In this episode we get into some pretty controversial topics around the term fractional when it comes to being a fractional CFO More on that to come check it out, let me know your thoughts. And we also get into some pretty cool conversations around running a sales call and how being curious and asking the right questions leads to closing more deals instead of going into a call thinking about I need to close this deal. Check out this episode, let me know your thoughts. Super excited for you to dive in.

Speaker 1:

I do want to send a quick shout out to our sponsors over at Universal Accounting. Thank you so much for sponsoring the show, for everything you do for the industry. If you're looking to grow your bookkeeping, tax or accounting firm, make sure to check out Universal Accounting. They're amazing at what they do, helping you build the premier accounting firm. Make sure to check them out. To our guest, mark Gandy from G3 CFO and the host of CFO Bookshelf Welcome to the show.

Speaker 2:

By the way, I know the people at Universal Accounting, so I don't know if you'll get paid twice for me mentioning they're good people.

Speaker 1:

Really great people. We just got back from their event, growcon a couple weeks ago at the start of May. It was our second time at the event, sponsoring Roger, christy, leslie all of them just awesome people. How do you know the folks at Universal Accounting?

Speaker 2:

I actually know the people before Roger. Of course, roger has a great personality, very outgoing, so I think when he stepped in and I don't know the full story he's really, I think, taken the marketing to another level. But even before the Roger era it was phenomenal. I mean great content. So they've been around. I personally I think they're underrated, but I met Roger personally through his people, reached out to CFO Bookshelf and we did an interview and again, he's a wonderful human being. But, by the way, thank you. I just I want to say something real quickly. I'm not used to doing video. I'm having a bad hair day and and and so I'm a little bit nervous, a little bit shy about being in front of the camera. It's not really. I don't think it's my thing. The reason we do podcasts audio is so people don't get to see the face. So I'm sorry for anyone watching this on YouTube once it's posted. Sorry, I don't have the Tom Cruise look.

Speaker 1:

Well, look, I have a bad hair day pretty much every day, so I just wear a hat. So you're, you're, you're doing fine. Um, mark, I would love to dive in and just hear a little bit about how you got started in the industry and before we get to where you're at now, is is being a fractional CFO. Playing with numbers and and helping out business is something you always knew you wanted to do from from your time on the playground and in school.

Speaker 2:

That is a very interesting question and, by the way, anytime someone says this it means they're stalling, but I think the Reader's Digest version almost have to step back. A couple of W2 positions started my career. I'm on the end of the baby boomer era, which is giving away my age, so that meant I worked for a big eight firm and after that I worked in the private world, and the private world was outstanding. Worked in numerous roles CFO, controllership, internal audit, special projects. But what I learned, James, was I got bored very quickly. I love project work. When I was working as CFO it would get boring because you only do one acquisition, maybe a year. Because you only do one acquisition maybe a year. There's only maybe one or two projects big that occur about every 12 to 18 months. But I love the projects. So when I was working as a W-2 staff member I can say this because the statute of limitations have expired I did a pretty big five-figure consulting project on my own time in the early 1990s and when I wrapped up I just thought this is fun, I loved it and it would take 12 years later before I could turn this into my own practice.

Speaker 2:

And then, once I got the chance, my wife and I were fully debt-free, had some money in the bank. Once I got the chance, my wife and I were fully debt-free, had some money in the bank. It's like let's go do this. So I've been doing this, James, since 2001. This is before the concept of CFO work, the virtual CFO, all the stupid names that we have for it.

Speaker 2:

By the way, don't get me started on the term fractional. There is nothing fractional about me. I think I'm pretty whole. I mean, my barber is not fractional, my electrician is not fractional. Why the heck are CFOs fractional? We're whole people. But I just knew years ago that I want to do something to where I can kind of control my own work, my own projects. And, by the way, I don't like the reoccurring revenue stream because I have too much work. There's always, always work to be done. So I just love doing the implementation work. And I do have some clients that are 20 years old, 15 years old. I don't really prefer them. They won't let me quit. But again, I love the implementation work. So that's not the Reader's Digest version. Probably went too long, but maybe that's a setup for a follow-up. Is that helpful?

Speaker 1:

Oh, it's really helpful and I love I'm going to say it probably a couple maybe controversial takes as well, like not the recurring revenue, not the, the term fractional. I think it's great and hopefully stems um a lot of questions and comments. What, what about? I mean you kind of mentioned it for you're a whole person, but is there anything else about, like the term fractional that that you're not a fan of? I mean I I saw on LinkedIn. You've been around, you've been doing this before it became a buzzword in the last couple of years, but from my perspective, the fractional piece is kind of a fraction of the cost I get you're a whole person going in. Do you agree with the fraction of the cost position of that CFO coming in who's not full-time with the company, or what is it about? Fractional? That kind of rubs you the wrong way.

Speaker 2:

Of course, the name won't mean anything, but Jim Gann, who is one of my favorite human beings here in central Missouri, who's a part of the Missouri University Small Business Development Center for 20 plus years. He referred to me as a fractional CFO back in 2014. I wrote that in a book that I've never published I don't know if I ever will and it was just a turnoff just the term, because I thought that's so gimmicky, so marketing-ish. I like to think I'm a little bit better than I am. I like to think of myself as I'm a little McKenzie or I'm a little BCG, and my thought on the fraction of a cost is I have never. My closure rate is almost 100%, almost 100%. The two times I did not get a client was because of stupidity, but my close rate is nearly 100% and I never had someone say what will this cost as we go through.

Speaker 2:

Here's what needs to be done. It's like when can you start? And then we get around talking about the costs. So it's not cheap. I mean what these people pay, it is very, very expensive. Their payback is they're getting a solution faster than if they tried to bungle through the process themselves. So Fraxel really has nothing to do with the price. Now I realize I've seen a lot of the cfo people who teach other cfos getting into the business that this is one of your propositions. It's not for me. For me, the proposition is that I can help you get to a solution faster than if you try to do this on your own. Price just never comes up. It's just kind of a non-issue. Does that kind of resonate a little bit?

Speaker 1:

It does and I appreciate your take on that and where you're coming from with the fractional piece for how I was bringing that up. I would love to get into maybe a little bit more of your sales process, because I know that's something that not everyone's comfortable with. You mentioned price really never comes up. It sounds like you do a really good job at just asking the right questions and knowing when to ask or when to push a little bit harder on that bruise. Do you have any insight or advice you're able to share with listeners who maybe aren't as comfortable with the sales process and what works so well for you?

Speaker 2:

The beauty of being a very highly analytical person. By the way, people who are highly analytical, the first question we ask when we come out of the womb is why? So someone who's highly analytical, with poor communication skills like me? It's like, how do I make this work for me? Because I hate self-promotion. I'm not the guy who wants to go to an event and mingle because I stink at small talk. But here are two things that I love, james.

Speaker 2:

I do love business, I love talking business and I love just learning. So how do I take that raw material when I'm in a conversation with a CEO and I never look at these as sales conversations. I look at them as just discovery conversations. So what I'm doing and I even have a name for it because I do teach other salespeople business development coaching for some of my clients and we talk about either the 3E process or the 4E process. Now again, this is for me. It's really tailored for me, not necessarily other people, it's for my personality, but for me the first E is just engaging, and usually I love sports. I love fantasy football, I love Major League Baseball. I have a kid who was a decathlon national champion, so I just love sports and most people I work with love sports too. What else do people love? They love their families, they love their kids. So if I'm in an office and I see kids, I'll start asking. That's a 15-minute conversation. So I call that exploring and for me that's easy because I love asking questions.

Speaker 2:

Exploring and for me that's easy because I love asking questions and then I start engaging with them. Tell me, what keeps you up at night. It's one of my favorite questions. I kind of got that from Dan Sullivan what dangers do you want to eliminate? What keeps you from wanting to get up at night?

Speaker 2:

Because usually most CEOs are trying to eliminate a problem instead of maximizing some opportunity. It's just kind of human nature. Sometimes those conversations just that one question, maybe 30 to 40 minutes, and so they allow me to take notes and I'll just be circling things that I think I can help with, and then I'll start asking questions, which then turns into the education process. So as I pick on some things that they brought up, I can start circling and identify hey, here's how I think we can help you here. So that is a process that's completely tailored for a personality like mine, who's not necessarily super outgoing, but I'm good at listening and good at answering questions and that I do feel very, very confident in, and that's really the best way I could answer that question. You're not selling, you're just having a conversation, answering questions in an area that hopefully you love talking about, which I do. How does that sound?

Speaker 1:

It sounds like you're just being a human having another conversation with another human and you're removing the stigma of I need to sell you something versus I'm just genuinely interested in what's happening in your business and maybe I can help. I might have a solution that could help, but I don't know until I ask the questions.

Speaker 2:

Hey, Derp, you nailed it.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that's cool. That is something that I think so many people might get in their own way of is, if you're going into the conversation of I need to make this sale, it's all about you and that's not what the conversation is. It's about the individual you're speaking to and having a genuine interest in. If you can even help them. You can't and you can't help everyone. So the fact that you mentioned your close rate is almost 100% tells me that you're probably pretty quick to identify somewhere in your process that they may not even be a good fit for what you can do. Otherwise, you're not even making an offer to help.

Speaker 2:

You're so clairvoyant, james. I don't promote this. I do coach other CFOs getting into the business and when we get to sales I pull up two book titles. I've never read the books, I just love the book titles they're called. It's Not About Me. One of them, I think, is by Max Licato and I don't know who the other but I have a slide and I just say look at these titles and memorize them, internalize them. So what you just said was very perceptive.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, awesome. I'll have to check out those books I feel like I've heard of. It's Not About Me, but like you, I haven't read it myself. Tell me a little bit about the CFO Bookshelf Mark, and how long the podcast's been, on, what the typical conversation looks like and why people should check it out if they haven't already potentially heard about it.

Speaker 2:

You know I hate to use the word should. I learned 21 years ago. 22 years ago, you never tell an entrepreneur you should. Those are the two worst words. So I'm not going to say you should. If you like books, if you are a reader, the show might be of interest. So yeah, again, I stink at self-promotion. By the way, we're idiots. We're on a little bit of hiatus and our next show after the hiatus will be with one of the former presidents of Starbucks. It's like, why did we do a hiatus? Why didn't we do the hiatus after the episode with the former president with Starbucks? So we're really looking forward to that.

Speaker 2:

The show is launched in 2024, had already started the website about three or four years earlier. It was a weekly newsletter, which, by the way, is a lot of work, and what was happening was I was already reading a lot. So all of my CEOs they refer to me as the guy who, this guy's a reader and I get pumped for knowledge, for questions, book titles, and I finally just thought why don't I just start a rinky-dink website? And I'll just start. I had great intentions, james. I'd be doing all these book reviews, but do you know how hard it is to do a book review and how long it takes. So, instead of doing a lot of blog entries, I focus on the weekly newsletter, and I was shocked. I focus on the weekly newsletter and I was shocked. I did about 160 of those. I don't know. I look back as how did I do that? Well, back in 2020, and it really has nothing to do with COVID it was just the time I thought let's just do a podcast, because my youngest son and I and I can't believe I'm saying this we've taken it down. No one can find us. But my youngest son and I did a fantasy football podcast and the people who listened to it they loved it. They thought the production quality was phenomenal and we did put a lot of work into it. It was a lot of fun. It was a way to just really connect with one of my kids, and it was a way to just really connect with one of my kids and I thought why don't I just do this, do a real podcast, as my son would say. So that was the birth of CFO Bookshelf back in 2020.

Speaker 2:

We've just finished our 200, about our 250th episode, and again, the show is based on business books. We get tons, tons of hey. We'd love to have him on the show, but it's like they're not book authors. It's like people want to use the show as a launching pad for marketing, but no, we love business authors. Our shows are about an hour long. I think I'm one of the few podcasters who actually provides an interview arc. Mary Childs of NPR said I've never seen this before. Had a lot of A-list book authors say we've never seen this before. So that makes us feel good. They really appreciate the work because each show takes a lot of time. You have to read the book. Sometimes I read the book twice and then do the interview and then we put the show notes together. So enjoy it, but it's hard work, as you should know. Now.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that's so good. Thank you so much for sharing that. That's awesome you mentioned you've said a couple of times now you're maybe a little shy or you don't like the self-promotion. You have a successful business you have a couple times now you're maybe a little shy or you don't like the self-promotion. You have a successful business. You have a successful podcast. You're obviously doing something right for people to know about you one way or another. How do people find out about you and how do new clients come through the door to work with you and your team?

Speaker 2:

you know. So I have to say that uh and, by the way, it's's not really shy, is I have learned over the years. That's the nice thing about getting old you kind of learn things about yourself in a healthy way and a lot of analytical people. We are not self promoters and there's, by the way, there's nothing wrong. I wish I were a self promoter. But if you go to LinkedIn you can tell oh, he loves self promoting. It's kind of like public speakers. There are two types of public speakers. They are the people who they either have to or they need to. But I belong to the third type and so self-promotion it's kind of either need to want to, but I belong to third, which is have to.

Speaker 2:

But to answer your question, g3 CFO is where I do my main business. Now I do not take on any client. I only take on clients who've been referred to me, and there's a reason for that. That means they are pre-inclined, they're pre-disposed, they're also been pre-qualified. So the people who refer to me, they know what they're going to get. The people who refer to me, they know the type of clients I want to work with. So the only reason I have a website is mainly because of a lot of the posts I've written, they're not written for people who are looking for a CFO. They're written for the people I've worked with in the past or currently. So you can go to G3 CFO to learn more. You can also go to CFO Bookshelf if you want to listen to the podcast.

Speaker 1:

Do you ask your clients for referrals or you just do such an awesome job that they just do it without-. I don't ask.

Speaker 2:

I do not ask Because what happens is one of my favorite all-time clients and I can't say his name. Plus, he's very, very humble, by the way, you learned through experience right and one of my first clients. He loved the work so much you can't help it. You can't help it. It's like you don't. You know, you don't cover up a light or a candle which is a parable from years ago. So when you do good work, you kind of want to share that with other people, and there have been some times where I've had too much work and it's all because of referrals.

Speaker 2:

Now, the referral game is hard. It's, it's a marathon, but there's a trick and a concept in the early stages. But once you've been around doing this for about eight, nine, 10 years, you've got a great living for the rest of your life, as long as you want to do this. So it's not that I asked. I've never asked because to me that would be too cheesy. I want people to think I'm always busy, which I am, but I don't have to ask because they're doing it without me asking. So now, does every client do that? No, because some of them are in very highly competitive environments Like this car dealership may not want me working with their competitors because they like having me all to themselves. So I would say that about 60%. Yeah, they love just putting my name out there and most of my client work referral, referral, referral, referral from clients.

Speaker 1:

That's awesome. Appreciate you sharing that, Mark. Last question for you what's the best piece of advice you've ever received?

Speaker 2:

I will have the perfect answer in three days.

Speaker 1:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

So everyone listening. I was not prepped for this question, so this is going to be authentic. I go back. I attended strategic coach for three years, by the way, highly recommend it. Even if you're a one person shop, I highly recommend going to strategic coach, at least for three years. They used to call it the foundations program. They prefer people who have teams. In a way, I do have teams. I have external contractors that do work for me, so I'm managing some pieces, but that was my way of skirting that requirement. Stephanie Song is one of the. I don't know where her role is in strategic coach, but I was struggling with a product that I was wanting to put out and she knows me to a t. She knows I'm a perfectionist. She knows that I I don't want to put anything out there.

Speaker 2:

Is it set Seth Godin who says just ship it, ship it. I need this little audio of Seth Just ship it. Mark Idiot, ship it. But Stephanie once said Mark, your 80% is another person's 100%. And the light went on and I play that comment over and over. That was back in 2015. So we are 10 years later and I still got that voice. It's the best advice is, especially if you're trying to launch something brand new, just ship it because you're 80% and, by the way, the people that are listening we are the best in the world at what we do. I mean period, and sometimes we may be holding back because we want it to be a little bit better, and for me, that's a serious issue I have to deal with even every day, but that's been great advice for me.

Speaker 1:

I love that. Your 80% is better than someone else's. 100%, that's a hundred percent.

Speaker 2:

That's a great for you. For you it could be your 60%. Is another person's a hundred?

Speaker 1:

percent because you are an a player. We'll go. We'll go with the 80. We don't need it. We don't need to pump my tires that much, but I appreciate it, mark. Um um. No, that that's awesome advice and that's a great spot to to end this on as well. Um, thank you so much for everything you shared and in all of your knowledge. I really enjoyed this conversation and I I hope a lot of people listen and enjoy and comment and spark a conversation on this episode. If anyone does want to get in touch with you, how, what would be the best way they could do that If you're open to it LinkedIn, linkedin.

Speaker 1:

Perfect, all right, we'll put your profile link in there. I'll make sure it's the right, mark Gandy, because trying to get you on the show reached out to your name twin.

Speaker 2:

I have some good stories on that, but maybe that can be an episode number whatever. I have some funny stories on that, but that maybe that can be an episode number whatever.

Speaker 1:

I have some funny stories on the other, mark gandys, I, I would imagine, because even just your first response back, uh sorry, our, our response. Uh, I think I'm getting them mixed up, but I reached out to who I thought was you and he was like actually, you know this, it's this mark here and you know they share the same name he, he.

Speaker 1:

He's better looking and was a better baseball player too, but it's okay, it's okay real, I guess real quick, just because we're on the topic, have you guys ever had a chance to meet up in person, or you just exchanged a lot of messages?

Speaker 2:

we've. We've done back and forth. Uh, on linkedin. He's in texas, I think houston, and I don't get down there too often. I've been in san antonio, dallas, but I I that's a good idea. I need to meet him, he's another.

Speaker 1:

He's another cfo as well, if I'm not mistaken he is another. Yeah, so that's that's where it was. It was like what are the, what are the odds? Same name, same profession, yeah that's cool, yeah, awesome. Well, thank you so much. I've taken up a lot of your time here. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I hope people reach out and, again, really enjoyed the conversation.

Speaker 2:

You, you are, you are great. This. You made this easy.

Speaker 1:

Thanks for tuning into this episode of CFO Chronicles the secrets behind success. I hope you found value in today's conversation. As we wrap up, I'd love for you to do two things. First, make sure to subscribe to this podcast so you don't miss any future episodes. If you enjoyed today's discussion, please rate and review the show. It helps others discover the insights we share here. Second, if you're ready to take your business to the next level and attract the high-end clients you deserve, head over to accountingleadsnowcom or click the link in the show notes to book your strategy. Call it's time to position yourself as the advisor your clients need. And don't forget you can connect with me on LinkedIn to stay up to date on what's happening in the world of accounting and financial growth. We've got exciting topics coming up, so stay tuned for the next episode of CFO Chronicles. Until then, keep pushing forward your for the next episode of CFO Chronicles Until then keep pushing forward.

Speaker 3:

Your growth is just one strategic move away. Thanks for listening to CFO Chronicles the secrets behind success. We hope today's episode provided valuable strategies to help you attract more high-paying clients. Be sure to subscribe, follow and share with fellow professionals. Connect with us on LinkedIn and leave a review or comment to join the conversation. Your feedback helps us bring you the best insights in finance and marketing. Until next time, keep striving for success and unlocking your business's potential.