77. Consent

In this episode, we talk about something that sounds simple but is often misunderstood: consent.

We explore what enthusiastic consent actually looks like in real life, why consent isn’t a one-time “yes,” and why it needs to stay ongoing, fluid, and responsive throughout any sexual experience.

We also talk about something that doesn’t get discussed enough — the reality that someone can change their mind at any point, and how being flexible, respectful, and emotionally present in those moments actually builds more trust, safety, and better sex.

Consent isn’t a contract.
It’s a conversation. And it should always be rooted in mutual desire.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:13

This is the Clitoral Truth.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

The podcast where we sit around naked and talk about sex, dating, and relationships.

SPEAKER_02 0:26

Hey everybody, we're going to use a story to open a discussion about consent versus perceived consent today.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Yes. It is a gray January morning, but back when it was warm and the sun was shining, I posed in front of one of our windows naked for Ryan's attention. We live in a building and we're on the third floor and the windows look down to the carport and he was getting something out of the car. And I thought it would be funny to the the windows are about like waist high. So I I think I was on this table.

SPEAKER_02 1:01

Yeah, you must have.

SPEAKER_00 1:02

I think I climbed up on this table and knelt on this table so that like full frontal nudity. Full frontal nudity in the window and hoping that he would look up, which he did, and it was fun.

SPEAKER_02 1:15

So very fun for me. So we it's got us talking about But that's a good point. It was fun for you to get noticed. Oh yeah. But it was very fun for me to see what I saw. So that's key to what we're gonna talk about.

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Everybody having fun all around. That's right. But it started a conversation about how that could be assumed an invitation, that that action or what I did. And for you and me, it probably would be, and and maybe for other, you know, for people in partnerships, it would have been for me, like, hey, get the fuck up here and you know, let's get it, let's get going. But how it isn't necessarily.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:59

Especially for strangers or right, right. But even so, even for partners, you know, not necessarily.

SPEAKER_02 2:07

Not necessarily, yeah. But a stranger, so that's the thing, as we get into consent, a stranger might be because that's the male brain will do some crazy stuff.

SPEAKER_00 2:15

Crazy shit. So I don't know. Consent, you know, goes both ways. We're gonna talk about consent. We usually think of when we think of consent, we do think men need consent from women. It goes both ways. Some points that we have, like, okay, invitations. Let's talk about what's what's actually an invitation for sex. Sometimes men think that certain things are invitations for sex that aren't like what a woman wears. Like if she wears a mini skirt.

SPEAKER_02 2:46

Standing in front of a uh window.

SPEAKER_00 2:50

Let's use the mini skirt example. That that's more common every day. Yeah, that's that's more common. That a guy might go to a club, they might go to a they might be walking down the street, they might be at the mall, they might be I don't know where they might be, but they might see a woman in a miniskirt or any other article of clothing that they perceive as sexy or revealing or hot and be like, hmm, she must want sex.

SPEAKER_02 3:16

Yes, exactly. That's what I'm saying, you know.

SPEAKER_00 3:18

And women, on the other hand, think men always want sex at any time, so they don't need to make sure men consent, which is not true. That's also so we're gonna talk about that.

SPEAKER_01 3:28

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 3:28

But men need to know back to the mini skirt, men need to know that women wear clothes for themselves mostly. And I think that it's a competence things thing, it's a comfort thing, and and you might be go, that skirt doesn't look comfortable. It's not just a physical comfort thing, it's a it's a personal comfort thing, it's an identity comfort thing, right? It could be their turn on, her turn on. That has nothing to do with your ass. And so one of the reasons why I think some men, I won't lump them all, don't understand this idea that women actually wear these clothes at the end of the day at the core for themselves, maybe hoping, of course, hoping other people like it. We all do that, we all want this to be acceptable when we go out. Most of us want to be like, hey, I'm gonna wear this shirt. I hope people like it. Whether you say that to yourself or not, we all want to belong and be acceptable in the workplace, at the mall, at the baseball game, at the whatever, right? So uh uh you look you see this at sports games when we all wear the sports teams colors, we all wore the jersey we bought. You see this at Disneyland when everybody, okay, well, I need to wear a Star Wars shirt, I need to belong. We all mostly want to find some belonging, right? So the reason I think that women men don't understand this about women is that not as many men have any sense of style or care about their appearance or have any fashion sense than women do.

SPEAKER_01 5:06

Yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

And so those the guys that just wake up and throw on whatever's easy or the same thing every day, or they don't put a whole lot of stock into what they wear. They don't get it.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:19

Be and they see some they see her go, oh my god, she she went all out. She put on these high-heeled boots and a mini skirt and that top, and wow, she she must really want something, or she's making a statement. No, she's not. She literally just got up and got dressed in a in a cute outfit that she owns, and that's wildly different than his experience because he doesn't put any forethought or effort, or he doesn't put the same forethought and effort, he doesn't have the same fashion sense that she does.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

Right.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

That's literally her just getting up and getting dressed for whatever occasion she's going to, and he thinks she's making a big statement and she's not.

SPEAKER_02 5:59

I mean, listening to you just described that, men will tend to throw something on and say, I don't look bad in that. You know, it's like I I I pa it passes. It's okay. Yeah, it's it's a low bar.

unknown 6:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 6:12

And I think a lot of men are just like they feel intimidated by fashion. And to the point that I mean, I remember when I was a young kid feeling like somebody would tell me, Oh, that looks great. You should wear that. That's really gonna get attention. I didn't want that.

SPEAKER_00 6:28

It was almost like And some women are yeah, people in general are that way.

SPEAKER_02 6:32

You know, I just like no, I don't I don't want to be out of the ordinary. I I wanna I want to fade into the wall.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

I want to wear all the car colors as a man gray, black, white, blue, yeah, and maroon, and and just fade into the world.

SPEAKER_02 6:46

But but at the same time, I remember feeling like, why doesn't anybody notice me? And you know, so it's it's this paradox of yeah, we want to stand out to the I guess to the maybe to the right people, but we don't want to be ridiculed, and so sometimes I think our fear of ridicule is stronger than our sense of style.

SPEAKER_00 7:06

And well, I'll I'll tell you what the bar needs to be raised on the on a sense of style for men because it is boring as fuck.

SPEAKER_02 7:14

And to the point that that's that has influenced fashion. I mean, I've I've read about this. That's why we have those car colors, that's why we have fifty shades of gray, and I'm not talking about the movie. Right. You you literally do have fifty shades of gray clothing, fifty five hundred shades of gray car paint. I've I read an article.

SPEAKER_00 7:31

And it's everywhere, and so uh I mean we're getting off on a tangent here. Women just accept that as like, well, okay, you know, whatever that but when women see a man actually, you know, wear something interesting, oh my god, we can't get over it. We're just in la la land goggling over this guy because he's got some color on, yeah, or something revealing, or something with a different pattern, a different texture, a different textile, like whatever it is, we're like we're we're just like hypnotized by his fashion sense.

SPEAKER_02 8:03

So we did get a funny tangent, but the point is it's okay to look good. And so I mean, if you're a guy, think of it from that perspective that women aren't necessarily saying or doing this because they they want you to want them.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

No, I I'm telling you that maybe like last on the reason board. Right. Like, don't think that's the reason why she's wearing what she's wearing. It it likely has nothing to do with you.

SPEAKER_01 8:33

Right.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

That is the the takeaway from that tangent right there. We should have a whole episode on uh we could have a whole episode on fashion sense, and I would go nuts. I would love that. Okay, so this nothing is an invitation except an actual invitation. Like in this story, if I motioned you to come up with my hand, you know, we can't hear each other. Well, I could have opened the window and said, Hey, yeah, good for a fuck? Um but I didn't. But if I motioned you up, but me just posing in the window looking at you is not an invitation, right? So you're way better off upsetting someone who sent a sign than taking and pursuing a sign that isn't one. You'd rather have an upset date because you didn't catch their drift than an upset date who didn't actually invite you to give consent.

SPEAKER_02 9:30

Yeah, that's a great point.

SPEAKER_00 9:31

So always err on the side of I'm gonna assume that's a no. And we're gonna get to we're gonna get to, yeah, enthusiastic in in just a minute. Enthusiastic yes.

unknown 9:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:45

Or enthusiastic consent is sometimes what it's called. So let's talk a little bit about exhibitionism here because we have to talk about this when it i especially in regards to this story. I am an exhibitionist, so this applies. I like to show off. I like this was just a funny little stupid thing. I wasn't thinking, you know, necessarily about sex right now, per se. But and it gets into foreplay all day, too.

SPEAKER_01 10:13

Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

But we're we're partners. I think that there is some difference in uh you know the partner consent and what might happen and what might not, and what, you know, and and like date or or stranger consent, right?

SPEAKER_02 10:32

Right, exactly. Well, and the whole concept of exhibitionism, and we have a whole episode on exhibitionism and voyeurism, but I mean what people and I think a lot of times men misunderstand is it could just be, even if it's something as blatant as you standing naked in front of a window, it could, and it's in front of a stranger because it's just exhibitionism.

SPEAKER_00 10:55

If I wasn't with you, I would maybe do that. Yeah. If I saw a guy down there, I'd maybe do that. Doesn't mean I want him to come up and fuck me. I don't I don't know him, I don't do which isn't to say I haven't fucked people, I don't really know. It's just to say you have to understand the nature of exhibitionism and and what it is and what it's not.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

And where it goes off the rails is when you think that that everything is an invitation that's like that, especially the more blatant acats, like naked in front of a window. A lot of guys are gonna look at that and say, Oh, she must want it right now. I'm gonna go knock on that door. And that would be the wrong thing to do in most cases.

SPEAKER_00 11:33

Right. Unless, again, I motioned up or or and we're gonna get to this too, but my advice for at least women, I I can speak for for that, is to be as direct as possible.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 11:52

So but exhibitionism sometimes is just showing off.

SPEAKER_02 11:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:58

It's usually for me, it's for me.

SPEAKER_01 12:03

Right.

SPEAKER_00 12:03

It it's that's what it is. It's a kink that turns you on, yeah. Yourself on.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

Right.

SPEAKER_00 12:08

What however it affects other people, like great and all, but uh if you were a stranger down there and I was doing that, it wouldn't be an invitation for sex. It would just be my exhibitionism kink that needs to that that I need to experience. Right. Which is just, you know, in this case, showing nudity.

SPEAKER_02 12:33

Right. Well, and and I what I'm thinking of as we're talking about this is like we go to music festivals and like electronic dance music festivals, and people dress in all sorts of things, lots of revealing stuff. And you do too. And I do too. And that's that's another thing to be conscious of. So we had this story about you s standing in front of a window, and what if you did that in front of a stranger? Well, you still got a window and a wall and a staircase and a door in between. And a locked door, yeah. A locked door. Right. But you're in that scenario, you're in a a a more public place, and you're close enough to touch. And this is another thing that men need to understand that that's not an invitation to touch just because you're you're wearing a woman is wearing something that's revealing or half naked in their opinion, or whatever. That doesn't mean they can just come again.

SPEAKER_00 13:29

It gets back to men need to realize she did not wear that for you.

SPEAKER_02 13:35

Right.

SPEAKER_00 13:35

She wore that for herself. Sometimes, again, it c maybe her girlfriend bought it for her birthday. She wants to wear it. Maybe it's her turn on and and she's you have no idea what her sexual orientation is. Right. It doesn't have anything to do with you, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 13:54

Right.

SPEAKER_00 13:54

But and at the end of the day, maybe she just wants to feel good in her body. Yeah. Maybe that is what's comfortable to her. Yeah. She didn't want to wear something else that is less comfortable to her. It has but but yeah. I think that um sorry. Um yeah, it was along those lines.

SPEAKER_02 14:28

Okay. But I I I mean, I just guess just w in those scenarios, I think there are a lot of men who, again, will do that gigantic leap in logic to say, oh, if she's wearing that, she wants it. She wants sex, she wants to be touched, she wants to be handled. And we hear stories all the time of women who complain that, yeah, I I wasn't out for that. And then guys were touching me. Just like I was I was there to be touched. That was the reason I came. And that's not true. That couldn't be further from the truth in almost all cases. There might be some, there might be some rare ones out there.

SPEAKER_00 15:08

Yeah, but if there is, again, we're gonna get to enthusiastic consent and what needs to happen in order for you know, because uh again, like in this episode, we we just had an episode called The Chase. We want to have enthusiastic consent without killing the buzz, so to say.

SPEAKER_02 15:27

Yeah, killing that vibe.

SPEAKER_00 15:28

Or yeah, without killing without killing the vibe, right? Everybody wants to have fun, but we want to have like safe consensual fun.

SPEAKER_01 15:36

Right.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

And so let's talk about though getting into this enthusiastic consent. My thing is that if it's not a fuck yeah in all caps, it's a no.

SPEAKER_02 15:49

And how do you get that fuck yeah?

SPEAKER_00 15:51

So my advice, like I said, to women at least, is to be as direct as possible in your no. So we so my advice in order not to kill the vibe or the chase, you know, make it fun. Sometimes it's like, well, I don't want to be robotic and be like, please fuck me now, you know, like that's not fun, you know. There is some unspoken stuff when it comes to the pursuit and the chase that can be fun. Body language, touching, flirting, you know, i it's not all just give me a DM, please, and tell me when you're ready. Like, right, you know, direct message me. No, that's not fun, right? Be direct in your no. Not necessarily in your yes, be direct in it's a no. You know, and so let me get into examples of here's some examples of responses that would be a no in my book, uh-huh, because it's not a fuck yeah in all caps, and that's a smile. That is not code for yes. That that's not good enough. It could be a nervous smile if you don't know that. It could be a smile because someone feels unsafe and they're trying to stay safe, which we'll get to. A laugh, a any language that is not really fuck yeah-ish, like uh even if they say yes after this language, like I guess, yeah, I g yeah, like that is a no for me. And again, this is my opinion, this is like kind of a gray, nuanced area like I suppose, but I mean with the amount of of essay that happens, I think that there's some tried and true things here I think we can rely on. Language like I guess, sure. If there's any ums or uhs or hesitations, no. If someone says I don't know, and then go again, all of this language leads could lead to a yes if she says or he says I mean those are all filler words. Those are all hesitant filler words, that is not a fuck yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:05

Those are fawning and freezing terms terms.

SPEAKER_00 18:08

Those are words that I would clump into that's that's a no.

SPEAKER_02 18:13

Right.

SPEAKER_00 18:13

No?

SPEAKER_02 18:14

It's a no because she feels unsafe and she's fawning or freezing in that s in that scenario.

SPEAKER_00 18:21

Right. Or he, whoever.

SPEAKER_02 18:22

Right.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

I think that that's why I say to women specifically, if if it's a no and you know it's a no, don't use the filler words. Be as direct as possible. Because you're using these filler words and you may get to a no, but it wasn't a very strong no, huh? It took some time to get to that no, and hate to say it, but if your person on the other side of you feels they have any wiggle room, they may try to to weasel in there. Unfortunately, it's like we gotta be direct. I I think if it's a no, be direct as possible. Now, like getting into what if you're in a situation where you feel you can't give that direct no because you're afraid of what may happen. So clearly you're in a situation where you don't trust that you could say a direct no and everything will be peachy. On the other end, this is where you get into some gray area of fawning and you're a guy, what would you tell guys in that situation?

SPEAKER_02 19:22

Yeah, I would tell guys in that situation that get the enthusiastic yes. Again, looking at this from the male perspective, because you said you don't want to kill the vibe, and sometimes you can do other things to to imply yes. If you're a guy, unless you're sure, get the enthusiastic yes. And and if you hear an if you hear any of these things, uh just like you said, assume it's a no. Yeah. Assume it's a no and go for the enthusiastic yes. Right. And don't push, push, push. It would be more like, this is how I would approach it. I'm seeing signals from you. I'm just gonna and it might kill the vibe. I don't I guess I don't care because I don't want to be accused of rape. It might be that I would have to say, I'm getting these signals from you. Do you want to do this? Okay, so yeah, it's a bit of a vibe kill. It is, but but but I I guarantee you, if you get any of those signals from a woman and you later get accused of sexual assault or rape, rest assured you are one. You're a rapist if you did that. Because it was a no to her. So I would just say, be safe. If you don't know this person, if you're not in a relationship with them and it's this sort of gray area, trepidation do not go for gray. Hesitant you will have reason to to regret it.

SPEAKER_00 20:37

Yeah, don't go for a trepidation trepidatious, hesitant yes. Now, here's here's a scenario though. What if get some of this hesitation, some of this language, and then you get a yes, and so then you back off and say, No, we're not gonna do this tonight. Let me take you home, I'll call you, you you know, and she's like, Oh, wait, wait, you know, and then she initiates Well that's a different then that's different.

SPEAKER_02 21:03

That's a that's an enthusiastic yes.

SPEAKER_00 21:05

I think that if she's initiating, uh-huh, and I I initiating is not standing there, you know, coming to a yes. Initiating is making a move.

SPEAKER_01 21:17

Right.

SPEAKER_00 21:18

She is making a move on you. I would say not ten out of ten, but some high number out of ten, it's an enthusiastic yes.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

Right, I would agree with that, and then you're probably pretty safe. The part that I get nervous about is when you get this smile or this laugh or this this kind of demure, kind of coy thing that you think that's what you're thinking it is. But what sh she's she might be afraid. Right. And so if you keep pursuing, if you get any of that unenthusiastic stuff, my advice is back off and then let her initiate back.

SPEAKER_00 21:54

Let her initiate, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 21:56

Because if you if you get this stuff and you think, well, it might be, so I'm gonna keep pushing. And it might be, so I'm gonna push a little more. And it might be she's getting more and more scared, more and more insecure, and she might in the end say yes, and she never meant it. Or just go along with it.

SPEAKER_00 22:11

Maybe she didn't even, you know, ever say yes.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

But but make no mistake, if you get accused of sexual assault later, you know, leading are guilty.

SPEAKER_00 22:20

Leading questions though along the way, is this okay? Leading a a a question along the way can go a long way.

SPEAKER_02 22:29

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:30

Ask her, do you really want this? Is this okay? Give her more than one opportunity to make up her mind or whatever about it. Is it is maybe a good Are you sure this is okay? Is is a good piece of advice as well as you as you go along.

SPEAKER_02 22:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:45

If you're the one who's being more dominant in in the bedroom. And in this case, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:49

And I guess a frame of mind would be put her safety first. Put her safety ahead of your desire. And so if you do that, if you keep that in mind that that you want to keep her safety.

SPEAKER_00 23:01

Her safety above your desire will never go wrong.

SPEAKER_02 23:03

And her feeling safe, you know, making sure that she feels safe in all this, yeah, you're gonna be on the right track.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

Right. Consent to me too in this situation is more about the energy and the moves and the vibe they they put out than the words they say. So again, you can't really if she's not feeling completely safe, you can't really trust the words as much as you can trust the energy and the mood and the m and the moves she is making or not making. There's a re like, hey, is she making any moves?

SPEAKER_01 23:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:43

Is she just standing there waiting for you to make all the moves? That's the kind of a clue right there.

SPEAKER_01 23:50

Right.

SPEAKER_00 23:50

And the vibe, like, and some people are more in tune than other people's people uh about a vibe or an energy or whatever. But I if you're like, oh god, I have no idea, I would start paying attention and do some work to feel in tune with people's energies, people's vibes.

SPEAKER_02 24:10

I was on a date at one at one time and we were actually at home and I was with this woman who we were just talking, you know, just small talk, getting to know each other. And so it's after the date or this is the date? This is the date. Okay, this is the date. So it was home date. Yeah, home date. I don't remember what the situation was. I don't remember what it was, but I was gonna I was gonna make her lunch or something like that. It was middle of the day. Middle of the day thing. It was like on a Sunday or something, and I said, but I don't want, you know, if you don't feel comfortable doing that, we can do it another time. I don't remember why we did that, but she ends up here, we're having this small talk, she jumps on my lap and starts making it out with me.

SPEAKER_00 24:56

An example, folks, of no consent.

SPEAKER_02 25:00

Right, right. And that's how it felt in the end. You know, I I wasn't ready for that, and I wasn't I wasn't really.

SPEAKER_00 25:09

You might never have been like I said, yeah, you might never have been ready. Maybe it was just a no. Yeah. It was always gonna be a no either way. No consent.

SPEAKER_02 25:18

Yeah, I learned from that. It's like, well, and I'm such a stupid guy sometimes. It's like they come over to your house, and again, this is this is about consent. You know, I could have jumped to the conclusion she's coming over here to get fucked.

SPEAKER_00 25:31

Right. But obviously she came to that conclusion, and it was it it's wrong either way, right on both sides.

SPEAKER_02 25:37

And I wasn't ready, and and the thing is, it was our first meeting, and I wasn't feeling that chemistry. Yeah. It was not there was no consent there. So yeah, and and to this point, clearly she was not reading the room, which is right, because we went from talking about check the vibe work to she's on my lap kissing me.

SPEAKER_00 25:58

There's no energy moving toward that. There's no vibe. You're not making any moves. Like, and so this is what we're talking about. Look for an energy or a vibe moving in that direction, yeah, and certain moves. Because you could be the only one feeling that the but this is a a two-way vibe, a two-way energy, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 26:20

It's that, you know, sexual tension, that anticipation, and that suspenseful energy that is moving somewhere. If that if you know that's not there, yeah, I mean, you gotta, yeah, like pull your head out of your dick or clip for a second and read the room and not be so consumed by yeah, your desire. One thing that I wanna say going back to this enthusiastic yes and a direct no, is that it's more likely for a man to be raped by another man than it is for him to be falsely accused by a woman. It just that's the data that's out there.

SPEAKER_02 27:04

Yeah, let that sink in for a minute.

SPEAKER_00 27:05

It just doesn't happen. So if you're out there and you're thinking it's a major problem for a guy to be falsely accused, it is extremely rare.

SPEAKER_01 27:16

Right.

SPEAKER_00 27:17

You're more likely to get raped by another dude. Okay. Just throwing that out there.

SPEAKER_02 27:22

And I've heard that in my experience with women, and like we've talked about before, you're the first one one of two that I've dated who did not have some sort of sexual abuse in her past. And when they talk about that to me, it was usually something on a date. A lot of times, anyway, it was something on a date. And I remember one situation where it was just like, he was they talked about it afterward. She had to run. She literally had to run.

SPEAKER_01 27:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:52

When it was all over, he was like, What's going on? What's wrong? And he he did not believe he did anything wrong. And to her, she felt like it was a full-on assault.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

Right. You know, we all, I mean, you and me were two people sitting here, like you said, there's two women that you dated, and you dated a lot of women who say they never had any situation like that, and most women that I know have. How many men do I know that have been falsely accused of such? I don't know any guys that have so th I I mean it's not it's not like rocket science, you know. How many women do you know who have been essayed? How many men do you know who've been falsely accused of it?

SPEAKER_02 28:36

Yeah, I mean yeah, if they've been accused at all, it's probably not falsely.

SPEAKER_00 28:41

Right. If if it was a big deal, uh huh, if that was happening a lot, we'd know some dudes. Oh, right. That that was happening too.

SPEAKER_02 28:49

Right, exactly. Exactly. I see what you're saying.

SPEAKER_00 28:51

Alright, last point here. Consent can change at any time. Consent is a is a wild thing, but it's wildly important. It it can change at any time, and I think that's not like you said people need to.

SPEAKER_02 29:05

You said yes a few minutes ago. Now you're saying no, you can't do that. Exactly. It's not true. Yes, you can do that.

SPEAKER_00 29:10

So uh for whatever reason, and we don't even need to go into them, it doesn't matter. It's again a vibe check, a safety check, an energy thing. Uh oh, I just learned something. Uh there's a million reasons why consent may change within the space of a date, within the space of ten minutes, within the space of a week. It it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_02 29:32

Right.

SPEAKER_00 29:33

But it can it can change.

SPEAKER_02 29:35

So within the space of a sexual act.

SPEAKER_00 29:38

I mean, I'll tell you a little story. Uh I was on a date with a guy, uh, I didn't know that I found out later that he had just broken up with a longstanding girlfriend and she had moved out, and this was his first date back into the to dating, right?

SPEAKER_01 29:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

And it was me, and we go out, and and he's a really quiet, shy, reserved guy, anyway, probably. But then there's this fact of him trying to get back out there, right? And I didn't know that. And the date's not going particularly well, but there is this that we there was sexual tension, I'd say. And anyway, we end up back at his place, he makes me a nice drink, um, everything's going well, one thing leads to another, we end up in his bedroom. You know, we're we're both putting moves on each other. It's it's it's going well. And it gets all the way to the bed, and somewhere in that mix, he pulls back and says, I can't do this. And again, I had no idea what his situation was that she had moved out. I don't n I don't remember. It wasn't just like yesterday, you know. It it had been months, but still I don't remember, but I just remember that we it was getting hot and heavy. Like it the the the act was gonna happen, you know, soon. Did I get upset or angry or no?

SPEAKER_01 31:11

Right.

SPEAKER_00 31:12

I understand, like, consent changes at any point in time. I don't need to know the reason. I didn't ask for the reason. I just calmed down, put my clothes back on. There there's there's a reason. There's gotta be a reason. And and even if the even if the re I don't need to know it, and even if the reason is I don't know what the reason is, but I just don't want to do this. Like it doesn't fucking matter, you know. The consent changed, and yeah, I I went home with blue balls. Get over it, you'll live. Yeah, we all get that, and it it could be frustrating, but when you put someone's safety above your desire, always 100%. And then it you know came out later that he was not over this girlfriend and was not ready to to do that with somebody else, maybe let alone date them. So just yeah, always remember consent can change. Be putting people's safety over your desire. In this podcast, we often use the terms women and men when discussing relationships and sexual dynamics. However, we want to acknowledge that not all women have vulvas and not all vulva owners identify as women. Similarly, not all men have penises, and not all penis owners identify as men. Our podcast welcomes individuals and couples of all orientations and identities. We aim for inclusivity, but fully acknowledge that our attempts will never be perfect. We are learning and adopting new language as humankind and our world evolves.

SPEAKER_02 32:55

Hey, just a heads up. We're not therapists or doctors, but we do coach people on sex, dating, and relationships based on our own experiences, research, and the wild stories we've heard and lived along the way. What we cherish for your inspiration and education, but it's not a substitute for professional medical or mental health advice. If you're facing a serious issue, please take out the right kind of support. In the meantime, keep listening, stay curious, and let's keep the conversations going.