An Interview with Robert Parker Jr: An Encore

Summary

In this episode of The Sipping Point Podcast, host Laurie Forster interviews Robert Parker Jr., a renowned wine critic and founder of The Wine Advocate. They discuss Parker's journey in the wine industry, his views on wine criticism, the evolution of wine tasting, and the current state of affordable wines. The conversation also touches on the impact of California's drought on wine production and the rising popularity of craft beer among consumers. Parker shares insights on developing taste memory, recommends essential reading for wine enthusiasts, and compares Oregon Pinot Noir to French Burgundy.

Takeaways

• Robert Parker Jr. reflects on his unexpected journey in the wine industry.
• Parker emphasizes the importance of enjoying wine without the critic's lens.
• Today, consumers have access to a wider range of affordable, quality wines.
• Spain's wine industry is experiencing a significant renaissance.
• Developing taste memory requires practice and a keen sense of smell.
• Recommended reading includes Kevin Zraly's and Karen McNeil's wine books.
• Oregon Pinot Noir has similarities to French Burgundy but also distinct differences.
• California's drought poses challenges but may also lead to better wine quality.

Check out The Wine Advocate for wine ratings, great articles and more!

Transcript

Laurie Forster (00:00.687)
Welcome to the Sipping Point Podcast. Join Laurie Forster, the wine coach, as she guides you through the world of wine, food, and so much more. Lori brings a fresh and fun approach to the world of wine. So whether you're a seasoned wine lover or just getting started, this is the place to explore how to sip, savor, and live your most delicious life. And now here's your host, Lori Forster.

I'm taking a break this week to be with friends and family and celebrate the holidays. So whether you're celebrating Christmas Hanukkah or just celebrating life, I'm wishing you the best of the season. And I thought for this week I would replay one of my favorite episodes I've ever recorded for The Sipping Point. I got to interview fellow Maryland native Robert Parker Jr., one of the world's most influential wine critics. He started The Wine Advocate.

Obviously now retired, but what he did to transform the wine world, the way we rate wines and lots of other things is impressive, however you feel about his ratings. And I thought I would share this with you. He talks about his humble beginnings and what he built with the wine advocate. So enjoy. Robert Parker, thank you so much for coming on The Sipping Point. We're thrilled to have you. Hey, Laurie. Thanks. It's great to see you again.

So how amazing was that? Because probably when you started the little newsletter, which is not a little newsletter anymore, some people probably thought you were crazy. I think I read that people told you to stick to law because that was your first career as a lawyer and attorney, that you're that little newsletter, which you had a small following, which is now a large following would get you into the hall of fame at the CIA, the culinary Institute of America. Was that a surreal moment?

It wasn't so much surreal, but I mean, when you start these journeys, and certainly when I started in 1978, I mean, you never know where it's gonna go and you just wanted to basically break even financially and somehow have some fun. so, I mean, it just, happens and then all of sudden you get there and they unveil this bronze plaque of you and you're like, wow, you know, I'm the first wine critic in here. It's the Vintners Hall of Fame, not the wine critics or wine writers Hall of Fame. So I was really touched by it. And it was important and I think it's just one of those things that

Laurie Forster (02:30.092)
So many things have happened in my life I never ever expected would happen and they've all been good things. so, it was pretty cool and I hope I'm not the last wine critic to get in there. So, I've sort of broken through the line, know, so it's just not only Vintners and some, I guess, some historians that are in there. Yeah, broken through the wine glass ceiling, I guess, right? Very good. Well, since we interviewed a few years ago and had a great time and in that interview, talked a lot about how you got started in business.

I think it was at that time you just sold interest in the company and everybody was predicting that you were going to retire and sitting here I noticed you're not retired, you're still working. So I guess reports of your retirement were greatly exaggerated. What's different for you now since the company structure has changed? I sort of thought you might ask this question because everyone wants to know, they expect somehow things have changed and things really haven't changed. mean the company.

And I no longer have a majority interest in wine advocate, but I have a nice chunk and obviously I'm interested in the ongoing legacy of it and I can never give it up. I love what I'm doing. As long as my mind is intact, as long as my palate is intact, I'll just keep tasting and writing. So really, from my perspective, a lot of the crappy work I did, all the administrative work and tax returns and all these records you had to keep, I no longer do that.

And so don't do any more editing anymore, you know, and so so a lot of those things that were sort of the ruling aspect of any job Are gone and so I just get to you know, I taste what I want I mean, I'm still I just gave up Bordeaux this year, which was a hard one to give up But it was in the plans I wanted to get a younger guy in it and we hired this guy from England Neil Martin I think it was eight or nine years ago to he was to be the replacement for Bordeaux and I thought it was time

And so, but I'm still doing Northern California. I'm still doing verticals of Bordeaux and retrospectives of Bordeaux and I'm doing my value reports from importers that I really have a lot of confidence in. So I mean, I'm still actually quite busy. mean, my wife thinks, what is this thing about retirement? You're not retired. So, but I love it. I mean, I really think retirement is a formula for early death. I mean, I think you really need to keep the mind active. You need to have challenges in life. And so, I still have them and I think I'm all the better for it. Great. Well,

Laurie Forster (04:48.131)
you know i have a bunch of questions here i went out on face book and lots of wine lovers that follow me on face book and ask them if you could ask robert parker jr anything what would you ask him so i have a bunch of questions here and i'm really excited about it so if but if folks want to connect with you on social media i know you're out there i'd i see on twitter

and you tweet stuff. Are you comfortable with that? It is actually you tweeting it, right? No, it actually is me. I mean, it's Facebook and Twitter. I got into it reluctantly, I have to say. And I think I have around 77,000 followers on Twitter now. And so it gives me a chance to just put some good information out. mean, most of it's wine related, but sometimes just really good messages about humanity and compassion. I'm not just a wine.

tasting robot as some people have tried to portray me. you I think that, and I enjoy it. I enjoy the fact that there's, you know, that all the, the thing about social media is, I mean, there's a lot of, there's a lot of bad stuff, but most of it's pretty good. And the fact that you can, you can convey your thoughts and your feelings and ideas instantaneously and make contact with people that are, that hopefully are interested. And so I like it. I mean, I have to say I was sort of dragged into it, but I'm enjoying it.

Robert Parker Jr. Okay. I'm at the wine coach folks. If you're not tweeting with me, you need to do that too. Okay. Stay tuned. We're to be back with Robert Parker of the wine advocate on the sipping point. This is Lori Forster, the wine coach. We're back with Robert Parker, world famous wine critic, your questions being answered now. All right. So here's some of the questions and some of them later about some of your tweets, but what's something that you think

people misunderstand about you? Because once you get, I guess, the level where you're at, it's almost like the legend becomes its own personality. What would you think is something people don't really understand about you? It's not out there. Well, I think because of the image of well-known wine critics, there's this, I think, this false myth that exists that I'm arrogant, that I'm

Laurie Forster (07:01.623)
intolerant of criticism and things like that. I think people who meet me often have said that, you know, he's the guy you want to hate until you meet him and then you really like the guy. I'm down to earth. mean, I'm down to earth. was, you know, was born in Moncton, Maryland. I live in Moncton, Maryland. And of course, I'm a terrapin from the University of Maryland. I think that's probably the biggest thing, I mean, is that I look at wine as an incredibly fascinating beverage, you know, and it

brings joy to your life and it's fascinating, it's diverse, it's challenging, but have fun with it. And I think sometimes people lose in the sort of maybe the cold, more analytical prose of criticism. They tend to think, man, man, this must be just not a happy guy or some guy who's sort of cold and calculating and snarky. And I'm not at all. And I think that that comes through very, very easily when I give lectures or people meet me in public.

But you know, it is what it is. I I've been doing this a long time and people will, the tendency for everyone, and I do it myself, is you draw black and white conclusions about people just from some image or some observation even though you never met them. True. And it's funny what you say about the critic mode and you know I'm married to a chef. And so one of, you know, in my comedic wine tasting, I have a few jokes about how painful it is to go out to dinner with him because he just knows too much about the food.

He can tell instantly by tasting a piece of fish if it's been frozen before and all kinds of good stuff. Do you find you have a hard time if you go to a dinner party with friends or you're being served just everyday wine from somebody? Can you turn off that critic and just enjoy wine for wine or do you find it's hard to break out of that shell? I have no problem turning off the critical.

because I really want to have a good time when I go out and drink and eat. I mean, I really don't want to. And what happens though, as you can imagine, is when you get invited to somebody's house for dinner and you haven't been there before, they'll start saying, well, could you give us your tasting note or comments on the wine? And basically, I hate that. I mean, I just, they're just, I want to be treated equally with everybody else and I just want to enjoy the wine as much as possible. And I agree completely with you said. I remember I took a chef who was a chef at the Four Seasons restaurant in D.C. to my favorite bistro in Paris.

Laurie Forster (09:20.785)
And I thought the food was great. This guy was not happy with anything. He ruined the whole night. So, I can totally understand. I I think that I learned my lesson maybe 25 years ago at a dinner party with a bunch of doctors where the guy that hosted it asked me to come in on a wine and I told him I thought it was fraudulent or it had not been well kept. And a week later I get like a three-page letter from the guy saying how I embarrassed him in front of his guests and stuff. said, see, don't.

Don't ask, don't ask. Just let me taste the wine and just keep my mouth shut. But I can turn that analytical easily off because at the end of the day, I'm a hedonist. I want to enjoy things and so I am able to. That's nice. You don't have to name names, but are there great $15, under $20 wines that you love on a daily basis to enjoy with dinner?

Or do you find that now that you've tasted these legendary, amazing, expensive wines, it's hard to go back? Well, Laurie, may come as a shock that I don't every night sit down and drink, you know, a Chateau Lafite or a L'Èveil of Scars or have a great burger. No, I don't. We tend to have pretty, pretty, food, you know, both my wife and I love to cook and our food is generally just simple grilled foods and, pretty basic.

And so with those, I mean, I tend to drink mostly Mediterranean-styled wines that are from Spain or Southern France or Italy. And I like that. I mean, I'm very happy as long as it's a well-made wine and it's flavorful and it's interesting. know, great wines require a certain respect. And when you're just having dinner at night, casually or with friends, it's nice to, I mean, you certainly want a good wine, but you don't want to have the most famous wine in the world because almost everyone feels obligated to say something about it.

And that sort of takes away from the whole point of just enjoying company and the food and etc. So, no, I'm not at the point where I will go back and drink the box wines and whatever. But the thing is, today is probably the best time ever to be a wine consumer. When I started in 1978, finding inexpensive wines was not easy. I mean, we found them, we tried them, but the quality was not there. Today is a proliferation of quality through...

Laurie Forster (11:39.473)
throughout the world where you can find great values from Spain, mean, from Southern Italy, from Argentina, Chile. I mean, you just name anybody, South Africa, Portugal, whatever. I mean, the list is incredible. And I think consumers, they can drink incredibly well at 15 to 20 dollars a bottle. Just open your eyes and try these wines. And I think it's hard for consumers to realize that there are a lot today, there are a lot of 15, 20-hour wines that are every bit as good as the 75 or 100-hour wine that's more prestigious and more rarefied.

But what it has is a historical pedigree behind it when in fact it may not be as good as some of these less expensive ones. Right. And by the way, last weekend I had Bartholomew Broadbent on the show and he said to say hello and he was representing some great, were talking about Portugal as being a great place to look for value. This year my New Year's resolution, because I try to be realistic, was to drink more Spanish wine because I do think there's such great value in regions that

are just really coming into prominence that people just don't even know about. It's not just Rioja. There's so much there that I feel like I'm not even scratching the surface of what's available. I tell people, to me, Spain has been this awakening giant. ever since Franco disappeared, think the entire wine culture changed from a sort of a

culture based on large co-ops where all these small farmers had great vineyards and old vines, but they would sell everything off to some co-op and it would get commingled with the more crappy stuff, and so the results were not impressive. And there's been this sort of this wonderful entrepreneurial spirit that has resulted in so many areas. mean, when I started in 1978, think about this, there were...

I mean you couldn't find a wine from Humila, know, or from, I mean, or a white alborino from Northwest Spain. I mean, these things just didn't exist, you know, and these are inexpensive, really nice wines. Yeah. And we even recently had Manuel Lozada from New Monthea on the show, and you know, he's got a $20, but he also got some really amazing wines, more expensive wines. So it's not just affordable, they've got kind of everything.

Laurie Forster (13:50.929)
All right, so someone wanted to know how do you develop a taste memory? And I think they're talking about the ability to one, be specific with what you're smelling, which is a lot of what you're tasting, but also the ability to pinpoint what you're tasting. They're interested in becoming a master sommelier. How do they create this taste memory that will get them through the process that we were chatting before the interview about?

the documentary SOM and people are like obsessed with that documentary. To me, I don't know, I'm not that, I've done my intro testing but it's almost like you have to become obsessed and just that's all you do. Is there another way of doing it besides flashcards and obsession? If you're gonna really go to that level and that's a pretty advanced level where you're trying to isolate smells and think about the textures and the flavors that you're really encountering.

That takes some work. mean, the bottom line for most consumers is, you like it? How much do you like it? Would you buy it again? And if you get beyond that, it gets pretty serious. certainly, I was born in a farming family. mean, the flavors that I identify with were vanilla, chocolate, Coca-Cola, milk. Meals cooked forever, because that was what my mother made. mean, stuff that was cooked for a long time. When I got interested in wine,

and I came back and formed a wine tasting group in 1968 at the University of and then when I went on to law school two years later, I remember thinking how can I discipline my nose and my mind to isolate smells? And what I did, and I did it for a long time, but it worked, is that anything I did, walking on the streets of downtown Baltimore, I often went to Lexington Market for lunch when I was in law school, I would isolate smells. Like, okay, on a warm day,

the melding tar in the road is a smell you often will get in wines. Garbagey smells. know, I mean, you know, what is that smell? It's something rotting, but what is it? Can you identify? Lexington Market was a great place. You got to meet from the smell of fried chicken, you know, to the fresh flowers, to vegetables, things like that. And I always tried, you know, like watermelon or things like that. I mean, just to isolate these smells in my mind. And I thought that would help make me a more disciplined taster.

Laurie Forster (16:16.185)
But at the same time, this requires a sort of an obsession and that's not really for everybody. I mean, I went on to make a career out of it, but for most people it's really find me a good wine and do I really need to know whether it's black cherries, black currants, blackberry or no, you really don't. And if you can tell, if you can just get to the point where you can tell the difference between red fruits, black fruits, blue fruits, you've come a long way. And the most important thing is which one do I like the best? All right, so.

Trust your own tastes. I definitely am all about that. All right, we're gonna take a quick break and we've got more great stuff with Robert Parker of The Wine Advocate on The Sipping Point. This is Lori Forster, The Wine Coach. This is The Sipping Point. We're talking all things wine with Robert Parker, Baltimore's own world famous wine critic just inducted into the Hall of Fame at the Culinary Institute of America. So if you're looking to really get into wine,

to learn more, someone asked, what books do you recommend besides just the basic grape varietal terroir stuff, which isn't that basic really. That's what this person's saying. But are there some go-to books that you would point people to read? Well, I think there's a number that if you're going to learn anything about wine, you basically got to read these books at least once. I think Kevin Zarelli's basic wine book is still one of the great bestsellers for a reason.

It's that good. And he's updated it periodically. think Karen McNeil's Wine Bible is another terrific book. It's a little bit more advanced, but you can learn an amazing amount from that. A book that's probably hard to find now, but it was one of my classics when I was learning, was Steven Sparrier's Academy de Venn wine course. He taught a wine course in Paris, and he based a book around it called The Academy de Venn.

wine course and it was a terrific book. And I think it probably never got a whole lot of exposure in United States, but I think if you go to like the Wine Appreciation Guild or some of these places that have libraries of these older books, you can probably find one for sale or eBay or whatever. But those would be the three off the top of my head. And we have a book, The Wine Advocate is publishing by our editor in chief, Lisa Parati Brown, who's a master of wine. She has a book just coming out and I wish I had one to show you, but we're just being shipped on how to taste wine like a

Laurie Forster (18:39.181)
Professional wine professional and when she told me she was doing this I'm adding up the view with the book and and she's I just thought well all that's been worked and reworked and worked in the in the classics I just mentioned to you, you know, Karen McNeils and Kevin's and Steven Spurs books, but But I'm telling you she she's nailed it I mean and so I think some of your readers would love to take a look at that book when it I think it should be available in another couple weeks Because she's really done a great job and she was a she's a master of wine, you know, and when she took the exams she

not only a master, she was number one in her class of applicants. And she's American, so that's not easy to do. And I've some training with the Court of Master sommeliers and I've also done my advanced level with the WSET, which eventually awards the Master of Wine. And the Master of Wine is very academic. There's a lot more to it. Whereas the Court of Master is a little more service oriented and restaurant focused.

MW, I mean you're memorizing all the different kinds of diseases that affect the vine and the formulas for all kinds of different things that are part of the process of making wine. So it's no small feat. It's tasting plus plus plus. So as you know, if you pull that kind of knowledge out when you're serving somebody at restaurant, they're going to fall asleep at the table and have you running out the door. That's true. It's a hazing process in the wine industry.

So here's a great one, and I'm a big fan of Oregon Pinot Noir, but somebody wanted to know, what are your thoughts on Oregon Pinot versus French Burgundy, and what do you think are the main differences other than the place, but more the style of the wine?

That's a great question. I should give you the disclaimer that you probably know that I have an interest in a winery in Oregon with my brother-in-law. I don't write about it or talk about it. I'm not going to mention the name either. But I have, I guess, an intimate idea of what's going on out there and we've been making wine there since 1990. So, mean, we have almost 25 vintages. There's a lot of similarities between Burgundy and Oregon. mean, first of all, I think you have these sort of this fierce independence of the producers. You know, they're small.

Laurie Forster (20:48.497)
They're farmers by and large. The people that make the wine are the ones that, you know, they work in the vineyard. Most people don't have PR experts out there. They're both cool climate areas. Both have challenges in the fall. In Oregon, it's the low depressions that descend from Alaska that come down and sometimes wreck a vintage with too much rain. Burgundy has the same problem with the fronts moving in off the Atlantic and...

dropping too much rain at the most critical time. But when you don't have sort of a nightmare vintage, and you only have one maybe two or three times a decade, the other six or seven vintages can be quite fascinating. to me, the difference is, Oregon wines tend to have about the same alcohol level as Burgundy's. They all run about 13 to 14, 14 to two, which will be the highest in the ripest years. I think Burgundy's tend to be slightly crisper and higher in acidity.

than Oregon Pinot Noir. But Oregon Pinot Noir compared to California Pinot Noir tends to be higher in acidity than California Pinot Noir, which is riper and fuller and generally more alcoholic. I do think Burgundy, because the soils there, the great vineyards are all plant on limestone. Oregon has no limestone. know, it's this Wilkenzie, Lomey soil, you know.

Sandstone decomposed sandstone stuff. So I think you don't get the minerality in Oregon Pinot Noir that you get in Red Burgundy. Size wise and age worthiness, think both Oregon Pinot Noir can last a long time. I mean, think we've certainly seen with ours, which are not blockbuster wines by any means, because you can't make a massive wine in Oregon for the most part. that they age quite well. I'm not sure they age as well as a great ground crew from Burgundy, but

but they certainly can last and evolve for 10 or 15 years if people are looking for that. But as you know, most people today are buying wine to drink within 30 minutes of purchase. Like Domino's, 30 minutes or less. I love it. Well, I'm a big fan, and although sometimes I think, oh, you know, it's $30 really for a starter, Oregon Pino, which for a lot of people, you know, is beyond what they might spend. For a Tuesday night, if you look at relative price value next to Burgundy, you know,

Laurie Forster (23:07.541)
and you can age it, you're getting a little bit more for your money, I guess. I've seen such a proliferation of new vineyards in Oregon. think it's going to be, think because Oregon is getting a lot of press, a lot of favorable press in the travel magazines. Portland is a great hipster city. It's a cool place. mean, it's really just a wonderful one. And it's being discovered. I think we're going to see in the next five or six years an overproduction of Oregon Pinoir. And what that means for the consumer?

Less money. Less money and there are to be wineries that are going to offer $15 to $20 Pinot Noir that are pretty good stuff. really think that has to happen because the high prices, mean the $30 to $50 or more Pinot Noir, that's a limited market. And when you only had let's say 50 wineries doing it, you pretty much could sell it all. But when you have 400 wineries doing it as you do now,

It's a lot more difficult and the demographics change completely. We're to take a quick break on the sipping point. We'll be right back. This is Lori Forrester, the wine coach. listening to the sipping point. We're back with Robert Parker to finish up what I think is an amazing interview. Here's your next question. You talked about killer vintages, you know, some of that cold air affecting the vintages in Oregon. Somebody is very and myself, lots of people out there.

California has this major drought. Now there's all these water restrictions going on all over the state. What are your thoughts on? And when I was in Sonoma in the fall, the winemakers were saying that this was going to be a good thing for the wine, the drought. I don't know if that's just optimistic thinking or rose colored glasses. What do you think the drought in California is going to mean from a wine perspective? You have any thoughts? Well, keep in mind that the original

wave of immigrants that planted vines in California were all dry farm vineyards. There was no drip irrigation that was available in 1800s or even up until before Prohibition. And even post-Prohibition, most of the vineyards that were, some of the famous old vineyards that were planted in the 1800s like Monterey Rosa and Sonoma were dry farmed. And drip irrigation came in because it was easier and you could, as a farmer, if you could afford it, you could easily control the growth of the vine and the vegetative process.

Laurie Forster (25:27.957)
The drought is scary. just came back from California and northern California is less affected because they had more rain. But when you get south of San Francisco, and for the first time ever, should tell your readers, one of the greatest drives you could ever make in the world is Big Sur, the coastal highway. It's just absolutely breathtaking. But as soon as you get south of San Francisco, things are drying up.

and you see the reservoirs there. mean, you're seeing islands in the middle of these reservoirs that I've never seen before. So I think it's scary. think ultimately they're going to have to curtail the consumption of water. There is really the only solution is change in the climate. Certainly these fantasy ideas of building some conduit from Oregon and...

and pushing the water down to the Los Angeles area, just think, or pipe drains, literally. But I think farmers are going to have to cut back. I think they're going to be surprised that the root systems will probably, it depends on the soil types and everything, will probably survive. And it will push the root systems deeper and deeper in search of moisture to survive. And they'll probably find that the water, the drip irrigation, is probably like a convenient

antibiotic or drug that they really didn't need after all. Now, there's going to be exceptions to that. And I think one of the things about lack of water in California when it gets pretty hot is it helps manage the tannins that develop in the grape skins. And so by controlling the water, you get softer tannins. If you had no water, the grapes may shrivel up and get more raisiny and then the tannins would be more stringent and bitter and we wouldn't like the wines as much. it's a definitely, it's scary. I mean, I have to say

Northern California looked pretty good to me. The reservoirs looked pretty good. But once you get south of San Francisco, it's almost like two different states in terms of the climate. Well, this question comes from me, actually, because a couple months ago, I was interviewing Hugh Sisson for the show. I think you know Hugh from Heavy Seas. And I noticed on your Twitter that you had been tweeting about a couple of beers, craft beers. I call them micro-brews. I guess I'm aging myself because that term isn't really used anymore.

Laurie Forster (27:42.457)
There's so much going on in the craft brew scene And even I was in New York a few weeks ago the wine market council releases studies every year about wine drinkers and what people and you know I think the wine industry is kind of nervous that they lose some market share of of connoisseurs who are getting into craft beers now, too, and there's so many options so are you gonna start

tasting craft beers like you're tasting wine or is this just a fun little hobby? Tell me about some of your tweets about beer. Well, it's funny that you picked up on that because you know, I've got, you know, you can teach an old dog new tricks. And I think I was sort of fascinated because some of my friends said, you got to taste some of these beers that are being, these really small production beers that have basically drink by.

drinking the next three weeks or whatever and they're bottled, unfined, unfiltered. And I was just blown away by the quality of them. And the thing is, I was saying, I can see why the wine industry is nervous about them because you can go out and buy a four pack of really handcrafted, tremendously interesting, complex, delicious beer for $15 or $20 for a four pack when that just gets you into sort of the...

the introductory wine level. So I can see, and I think it is taking away from the wine market to a certain extent, but I have to say, aside from that argument, I think it's great. I just think it's wonderful. I was at a wine shop actually in Baltimore right before I went to California and they brought down all these, they had to go up and wait in line in Vermont for, I think it's called Hilltop Farm, for these beers sell out. People sleep overnight in sleeping bags to get their allocation.

And this guy did that and he brought them back and said, I want you to taste them. And we're tasting these just brilliant beers. Most of are IPAs. The stout's too heavy for me. But I just thought the wine industry has a challenge here because they're much less expensive. The quality goes up and up and up. And of course, the investment in making a quality beer is much smaller than planting a vineyard, waiting three years for the vineyard to mature. And then you've to have barrels or at least tanks.

Laurie Forster (29:55.349)
to make the wine. So the investment is much smaller and you have a young generation that's really taking to it. So I hate to say it that my nephew in Oregon whose father runs our winery out there and makes wine, he plants hops on our vineyard because he's making craft beer. nice. So I mean and Oregon hops have a... There's big beer scene out there. Yeah. Oregon hops and he always tells me, listen, there are hops out in Oregon.

are so much better than what you get back East. And I said, well, I'm not going to get into that argument because I don't really know. But I think it's fascinating. And I think it's not going to go away. It's the same thing as we see with spirits, with the bourbon craze. I mean, you see the Pappy Van Winkle. It goes up to $3,000 a bottle. No one can get it. it is crazy. But we're seeing, again, that's a uniquely American product. And it's a fascinating product.

And it's what I also was fascinating in New York, gentleman from Nielsen got up. also collect data on alcohol consumption and generationally, you know, everybody's about the millennials, right? I'm a Gen X or nobody cares about us. There's only 35 million of us, but the millennials are the same size magnitude wise as the baby boomer generation. So, of course, you know, a lot of manufacturers want to capture that market. So if you look at millennials.

even though women have always slanted a little bit more towards wine consumption, with millennials, it's even more exaggerated women towards wine and males towards a beer market. So it's going to be a challenge for the wineries. mean, certainly they seem to have the female market in that generation, but most of the guys are really getting into this beer, the craft beer craze. there's, you know, we have

local ones here that make, you know, basil white beer. I mean, there's all kinds of cool things going on. Yeah, I mean, I think we, I mean, I'm sure Hugh, I mean, could tell you, I mean, obviously, Dogfish, you know, in Delaware, it was one of the first great success stories of a sort of a small scale brewery. I don't know how big they are now, but I mean, their stuff still sells out. Right. And some of Hugh's wines.

Laurie Forster (32:10.105)
I'm at wine's beers. I'm in the Freudian slip there. They're so delicious, they're almost a wine. But he knows a lot about wine too. So no, but I think that trend is a legitimate trend that's here to stay. And it's interesting though, the dynamic between women and men in the millennials. So I mean, I can't really comment on that because I'm long away from a millennial. Me too, me too. All right. So thank you so much for all this time. One more question. Sure.

I always joke with people and I'm sure you get this question a lot because you're also in the wine business. What is, people ask me, what's my favorite wine, which is always a difficult question to answer because I love so many different things. But I always joke that my death row wine, you know, if I was on death row and I could only have one more wine is the Aldo Conterno Grand Busea 99 Barolo. It's one of my, yeah, one of my amazing wines I had first in Italy and I've been able to find it since. So if you could give me

one

I think it would probably be a Guy Gal Cote Routier. Their most famous one and the one I think is the most interesting and compelling is their La Moulin. And I would say if you could get the 1978 or 1985, that would be a wine that would, you know, if I had one last wine, that would be it.

All right, I'm going to take a look for it. Well, Robert Parker Jr., founder of The Wine Advocate, we so appreciate your time here on The Sipping Point and answering all of our listeners' questions. I appreciate it and I hope you'll join us again. Hey, thanks a lot. I appreciate the time to share my views with your readers and thanks for what you do. I it's a great show. All right, cheers.

Laurie Forster (34:18.253)
Again, wishing you a great holiday season and a happy new year. And speaking of new year, on New Year's Day, our episode with Hugh Sisson from Heavy Seas Beer, you heard me right, beer, because we cover more than just wine here on The Sipping Point, will drop. And I'm so excited for you to hear all about how he built his brewery and got named the number one IPA in the country.

So tune in next week on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeart Radio, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Go ahead and subscribe so you don't miss an episode. And you can always download my free app for iPhone and Android. It's called The Wine Coach. You can listen to the podcasts in there and get so many wine recommendations, videos, and more. I look forward to seeing you until next week. Thanks for joining us on The Sipping Point Podcast.

We hope you enjoyed this fun and flavorful look at the world of wine, food, and beyond. If you liked what you heard, be sure to subscribe, leave a review, and share with your fellow wine lovers. Until next time, keep on sipping!