Vintage 414 Uncorked: South African Sips, Guilty Pleasures & Corkage Etiquette

Want to go to Tuscany with Laurie in October of 2026? email laurie@thewinecoach.com for a brochure and join us for an info session on 9/28 to find out more REGISTER HERE 

Summary

Laurie Forster, The Wine Coach, pulls up a glass with Natalie from Vintage 414 Wine Bar in Cambridge, MD to swap stories, spill secrets, and sip on a few affordable wines from South Africa—including the ones they’d pick for their “last meal” lineup. From underrated wine regions to the unstoppable rise of rosé, they cover it all with equal parts expertise and humor. You’ll hear insider tips on corkage etiquette, the ripple effect of tariffs, and why natural wines stir up so much buzz. Plus, Natalie dishes on the hidden gems pouring at Vintage 414, while both confess to their guilty-pleasure wines. It’s equal parts education and entertainment—like your favorite night at the Vintage 414 wine bar, only on demand. 

Takeaways

 – Your “death row wine” says a lot about the bottles that shaped your story.
 – Barolo holds a special place as a milestone wine for both Laurie and Natalie.
 – Italian whites like Fiano and Falanghina deserve way more love.
 – Knowing the corkage rules can make dining out smoother (and cheaper).
 – Natural wines bring wild yeast, no sugar, and plenty of personality.
 – Fun, relatable wine descriptions beat snobby jargon every time.
 – Guilty pleasure wines? Embrace them—no shame in the game.
 – A trusted wine retailer can be your secret weapon for better bottles. 

Wines Tasted

Riebeek Chenin Blanc $13

Rustenberg Petit Verdot Rose $16

Natte Valleij Nat Pinotage $18

Check out Vintage 414 Wine Bar HERE or go visit Natalie in Cambridge, Maryland!

Transcript

Laurie Forster (00:30)
Super excited to introduce you to Natalie Brewer. She is one of the owners of Vintage 414 Wine Bar in Cambridge, Maryland, I met her years ago when she was a server and just learning about wine. And now she has this amazing place. I can't wait for you guys to experience her. I'm gonna introduce her in a second.

but just a reminder that on September 24th, my virtual wine tasting, Fall in Love with the Rhone Valley is going to happen. You can dial in from anywhere in the world. It'll be at 7 p.m. Eastern time. I'm gonna introduce you to three of my favorite wines from the Rhone Valley, which I've put together in a wine pack so that you'll have everything you need. Just jump on Zoom and we're gonna taste and laugh and have an amazing time.

So go to thewinecoach.com slash events and you can find it there with the link to the wines, sign up for the class, get the wines and you have an amazing night ready for you. And speaking of amazing, my wine tour to Tuscany, so many of you overwhelmingly are interested in signing up. It is gonna be limited to about 14 people. So if you're interested, email me, lori at thewinecoach.com. I'll send you the brochure.

You'll get all the details of the itinerary. And I'm also gonna have an information zoom on September 28th. That's also on my event page on my website. So if you've been dying to go to Tuscany and travel around in luxury and taste the wines and see the sites, I hope you'll consider coming with me because it is going to be a blast. This is October of 2026. So plenty of time to plan for it.

Well, I have planned for a great episode today and Natalie Brewer has been perfecting her wine palate for over 23 years in the hospitality industry. And one of things she loves to do is find wines that are interesting, that meet your palate. But she does it in a very down to earth, no nonsense way. I think that's why we connect so well.

her food palette was awakened by Chef Steven Mangasarian of Restaurant Columbia. She worked in many fine dining restaurants throughout the county and then joined her friend, Chef Ian Campbell at Bistro Poplar in Cambridge in 2010.

Along the way at Bistro Poplar, she met her now business partner, Emily Salisbury and her chef Colleen Hughes, who both jumped on the bandwagon to start Vintage 414 with her in 2020. Kind of a challenging time to start a restaurant and a wine bar, but she was up to the challenge. I'm so excited to bring her into the show.

Laurie Forster (03:13)
Natalie, welcome to The Sipping Point.

I'm so excited to have you here. I told everybody your amazing background and all about Vintage 414. today we're gonna talk all things wine from one wine woman to another.

but you also ⁓ sent me three amazing wines from South Africa. So I'm excited to explore those with you as well. But the burning question that everyone always wants to know is how did you get into the wine business?

Natalie (03:41)
⁓ I was very lucky to have been offered a job at a fine dining restaurant in Talbot County where you are when I was 16 years old, 15 or 16 years old and worked for a phenomenal chef who I'm sure you're familiar with, Chef Steven Mangusarian. And I was able to start tasting wine, not quite that young, but at a younger age, rinsing and spitting and just fell in love with flavor in general.

I had never even eaten at a fine dining restaurant before I started working in one. So I really send everything is kind of owed to him in the very beginning because he's really what taught me what true flavor was. Leading on a little bit as I worked at the Inn at Easton, that's where I met you and Chef Andrew Evans hired you to do a class with us. And I tell people the jelly bean trick all the time. I mean, especially now as I'm doing weekly tastings when they're like,

How do you pull out these notes? I'll never be able to do that. My biggest thing is just talk about it, you know, and really pay attention to everything you smell, everything you eat, try to make that brain connection. And you did that with the jelly beans and holding your nose when I was very young. So I do appreciate that. I don't think I would be able to pick out pear in any type of white wine if it wasn't for you. So thank you. But most of my career was spent in fine dining. And then in 2019,

Laurie Forster (04:54)
Perfect.

Natalie (05:00)
I was working at Bistro Poplar. I'd been there 10 years. Chef Ian Campbell decided this was pre-COVID. And the pastry chef there, who is now my business partner, Chef Emily Salisbury, we kind of walking around downtown and realized that there was a wine and beer retail shop with a bar that went up for sale. So we put a bid in on the building, didn't get it for a couple months, but ended up getting it.

We actually closed on December 24th of 2019 on the building here at Vintage 414. And then COVID happened. We started spending money between then and March and then everything was shut down. So was a little scary. We actually didn't speak to each other for three weeks, I think, because we had already spent a chunk of money and didn't know what was going to happen. And finally got down to, well, what do you want to do? And I was like, I don't have anything else.

planned. Please, I hope you still want to do this. So we did. And we ended up opening in July of 2020. We were only hoping to open in May, so only pushed back two months. There are a lot of silver linings to COVID. We opened at 50 % capacity without a bar, so we didn't need a full staff. We were still able to kind of stay in our bubble. And knock on wood, to this day, I still have not had COVID. So we did something right. Yeah. ⁓

Laurie Forster (06:16)
Wow. Absolutely. Oh, wow. That's

an amazing story. Yeah. And the fact that you are still going strong here in 2025, given that a lot of restaurants and wine bars like yours didn't make it through that period of time is quite a testament for sure.

Natalie (06:35)
Absolutely. I think we fit a true niche that Cambridge needs. And not to knock any of the other liquor stores, but there aren't, I don't believe any other real liquor stores or wine stores that taste as much as we do. The other good thing is that we're all restaurant people, along with our chef Colleen, she was classically French trained as well. We're all fine dining restaurant people. So adding retail was a whole other thing to our world.

Definitely a lot more time consuming than we expected, but I really feel like my palate has grown immensely in the past five years just because I taste almost every day.

Laurie Forster (07:13)
So I know people are gonna be inspired by that story to maybe create their own.

a wine bar, but even if they just love drinking wine, one of the things I'm curious about, because I have somebody on every week and everybody's telling me it's the summer of this or the summer of that. What is your most favorite grape right now? And then maybe your least.

Natalie (07:33)
So right now, most favorite, think, is a Gruner-Veltliner. basically because, well, thank you, Jules, because I had, as you know, I had hers, and it's phenomenal. It's delicious. But even the inexpensive Gruners, I have a liter that's $13 a bottle, and it's delicious. You don't have to think a lot about it. There's a lot of fleshy fruit up front, but the finish is almost always crisp.

Sometimes there's a little bit in my salinity as well. I just think they're really easy to drink and versatile when pairing with food too. So that would be my favorite grape right now, because it does change constantly.

Laurie Forster (08:04)
Love that.

And Gruner is fabulous because it goes with some of those really hard to pair things like asparagus, artichokes, which usually ⁓ throw everybody for a loop. And yeah, I've been a Groovy fan for so many years

Natalie (08:14)
Yes.

Least favorite and this I think I have to tell my reasoning behind it. I have to say Chardonnay and that's only because because there are gorgeous Chardonnays out there. But I think that there are more crappy Chardonnays out there than gorgeous ones at least available to me in Cambridge and people get stuck on liking that one grape and it drives me insane. There are so many other grapes that can

Laurie Forster (08:34)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Natalie (08:50)
do what Chardonnay does to food better. And it's just the closed mindedness behind that grape that I think bothers me so much. it's, I mean, I've had some lovely, lovely Chardonnays, obviously white burgundy,

Laurie Forster (09:02)
Right.

there you go. I was thinking about this question myself. So most favorite, I would say, and I'm excited because we're going to taste one here in a minute that I have been drinking a lot of Chenin Blanc this summer. It's not like it's new to me, of course, you whether it's from South Africa, which we're going to explore here now, or Chenin from the Loire Valley in France, which I also love dearly, or even one, you know, made in California.

just kind of fell off the Chenin bandwagon somehow. And this summer, I really kind of have gotten back into it in all of those different styles. I'm excited to be introduced to the one you brought to the table. that, and I'm drinking more Sauvignon Blanc. I had taken a pause on Sauvignon Blanc and I'm drinking more of that this summer. So those are two of my faves. Least is Pinot Grigio for me.

I'm just kind of over it. Now that being said, Oregon Pinot Gris, I will that's kind of where I go. But since one of my most favorites is Chenin, I'm so excited you brought one to introduce us to from the store. So what do we have here with the Chenin Blanc?

Natalie (10:07)
So this is a Riebeek Chenin Blanc. It's $13 a bottle. I don't know how familiar you are, or I know you are, but your guests are with, or listeners are with when Chenin Blanc came to South Africa, but it was in 1655 and it is the most widely grown white grape there. So it is, the style is a little different from the French and even American, obviously. For me, Chenin Blancs, French are my favorite as probably are yours as well.

But what I like about them are the true value. You can find gorgeous Chenin Blancs for very inexpensive. This one's only $13 a bottle. I'm actually pouring this by the glass right now because it pairs really nice with our peach and prosciutto flatbread. So this is what we pair with that.

Laurie Forster (10:50)
Mmm.

one of the things I know you know, they used to call this Steen So if you ever see Steen on the bottle, that is a Chenin Blanc. It's the same thing. It's just a South African term. But yeah, tell me a little bit about like stylistically, I love the price. We're all looking for that great, know, under 20, under 15, even better bottle of summer white. You know, tell me about what you love about the taste of this.

Natalie (11:14)
So on the nose, I get a little bit of tropical cream. I think it's kind of guava. It is more medium-bodied. But yeah, definitely a little bit creamy on the nose. And it couldn't necessarily pinpoint, but I think it's guava.

I love it. Yes.

Laurie Forster (11:27)
I love the crisp acidity. Yeah, and

the fruit is so expressive on the palate as well. I definitely get that tropical note and that creaminess on the nose. You kind of get out creaminess of texture with this as well.

Natalie (11:41)
especially on the front of the palate for me. It's very creamy and then the middle kind of leads into almost like the texture of pear before the acid cleans everything up on the finish. ⁓ For me, I get a little bit of citrus on the finish as well. So pairing wise, like you were saying, probably one of the reasons you like the grape so much is that it's very versatile as well. Off the top of my head, I would want like a lemon herb chicken would be great with this.

Laurie Forster (11:51)
Yes.

Natalie (12:06)
You could do almost any summer salad with this as well, or even, I mean, honestly for me by itself.

Laurie Forster (12:10)
Mmm.

Right. was going to say, was trying to think, you know, they, everybody's

saying, let's talk more about occasions and reasons for drinking specific wines, you know, cause people get intimidated by all the aromas and the flavors and you know, the way we can be really expressive about it. But this is like, you just got off of work. It's summer. You're sitting on the back porch. This is a great place to start. Like exhale time for the weekend kind of wine for me. Yeah.

Natalie (12:38)
Absolutely.

And it's complex when you really think about it, but I think that it's also drinkable enough to where you don't have to think about it, which I don't know how you feel, but sometimes that's the exact kind of wine I'm looking for.

Laurie Forster (12:53)
Exactly. I

affectionately call some of these porch pounders, if you know what I mean.

Natalie (12:57)
Yes,

yeah, they're quaffable porch founders is what we say.

Laurie Forster (13:00)
Very coiffable.

your job is really to kind of weed through everything and find those great bottles for the great price so everybody else doesn't have to. So it's a public service. Thank you, Natalie. And that leads me to a question that we wanted to touch on, which is, does price matter? And of course, we can see here that it doesn't necessarily. mean,

Natalie (13:06)
Mm-hmm.

Yes. Yes.

Laurie Forster (13:22)
I we could have another $13 bottle of wine that wouldn't be nearly as delicious as this and probably might be one that neither of us would want to drink. We could even have a hundred dollar bottle of wine and it doesn't mean that you're going to love it. So it's about understanding your taste, but also looking for that, you know, the highest quality in that price point.

Natalie (13:43)
I agree with you that $25 price range. That's it right there. If you can go 15 to 25, your experience is going to skyrocket from nine to 12 for sure. And I agree with you on that. You you get up in that 75. I think you probably tasted a lot of really expensive wine. like, why? I would take the $25 bottle any day and enjoy it more. So it does come down to your specific taste to know what you like.

Laurie Forster (14:09)
All right, well, here's a question that I actually share with people a lot, but now I want to know your answer. What's your death row wine? The wine that you would need to have one more sip of before you go.

Natalie (14:18)
You

See, I feel like death row wine is also the wine that you can keep coming back to and that you want to drink all the time. So right now, because it always changes as we taste more and more, would be Elio Filipino's 2018 Reserva Barolo.

Laurie Forster (14:40)
Mmm.

Natalie (14:40)
When my business

partner and I taste it, think it was three or four months ago, we both just looked at each other. It's just such a calming feeling when you taste a wine like that right off the bat. This is all I wanna drink for the rest of my life. If that was the only wine I could have the rest of my life, it would be it. If I'm on death row, it would be it. But what's yours?

Laurie Forster (15:00)
Well,

gosh, we didn't even huddle up on this one beforehand, but mine is also Barolo. If I had to be, I know it's crazy. I also think that's because Barolo was my first like aha moment wine where I was like, I had had wines and enjoyed wines, but it was like, wow, this is something altogether different.

Natalie (15:13)
⁓

Laurie Forster (15:22)
It's so interesting because you've got rose and tar and, you know, earthy and fruit all together. But there's a specific one from Aldo Conterno It's the Grand Bussia And I actually got to visit this winery in 2006. I think that also gives it a little bit of an edge because there's a memory there. And the 99, if I could find it again, it would probably be like a thousand dollars or something at this point.

Natalie (15:47)
man.

Laurie Forster (15:48)
But back then, I think it was probably $200. But now we already said price doesn't always matter. this, we're going all out because this is death row. that would probably be it. A good champagne, a really excellent champagne might be a close second, but got the edge to the Barolo.

Natalie (15:57)
Right. ⁓

See,

for me, feel like champagne is where I wanna start. So if I'm on death row, it would just be sad. I wanna finish with the Barolo. Right, exactly.

Laurie Forster (16:12)
I can't end that way. Yeah, if you had an escape route, then we could do some champagne. Love that.

All right. So we're going to taste a rose that you brought to the table. But right before we get there, I'm wondering what regions and I guess, you know, we're exploring one right now, but what regions do you feel like are underrated that people need to revisit or maybe change their mindset around?

Natalie (16:37)
It's so funny you should ask that because I almost brought it up when you said Pinot Grigio was your least favorite grape because I tell people all the time, any Italian white except Pinot Grigio. So for me, the Italian white that you've never heard of and it happens still to me and I'm sure you all the time because they, you know, they're all indigenous. They all use the region as their names. I just like, I love Fiano I absolutely love Fiano.

Laurie Forster (16:57)
Mm-hmm.

Natalie (17:06)
to just anything Italian that's white, it's not Pinot Grigio.

Laurie Forster (17:10)
There are so

many great Italian whites and you're so right. You know, I love Falangina, same general area as your Fiano. But if you just look all across Italy, there's so many indigenous grapes and grapes that are native to that area that aren't gonna be your, you know, varietals maybe that you're used to, but there's such great value. And, you know, right now whites and well, rosé is kind of maybe, you know, taming down a little bit, but whites are...

outpacing reds as far as what people are consuming, which is crazy really. Yeah, because for so long, red, you know, it's just was like king and not that people aren't drinking red wine, but the growth in white wines is so far outpacing red. It's really, it's really interesting to see.

Natalie (17:41)
Wow. ⁓

Right.

I'd like to...

I like to think people are thinking out of the box. We just did a Portuguese dinner and when I was researching the Portuguese wine, obviously it's summer, so we did three Portuguese whites and it was kind of cool because they're all very indigenous, obviously. They have all these grapes you've never heard of. You don't see them planted anywhere else because they don't grow well everywhere else. And while Italy and France were busy exporting these grapes all over the world, Chile to Napa and growing them, Portugal was

Laurie Forster (18:10)
Mm-hmm.

Natalie (18:24)
kind of like, nah, we're good. We'll do our own thing. And yeah, and I think that they're extremely underrated as well. And especially for us on the Eastern shore, all of their whites pair so well with seafood, especially crabs. I found like Alvahrinos and just broncos in general pair with steamed crabs, crab cakes alike. They're really good and underrated.

Laurie Forster (18:26)
We'll keep it in house.

Yes.

I got to go a

couple years ago and everywhere octopus is on the menu. And I love octopus, know, just sauteed, you know, if it's done well and people, if you think it's rubbery, it's not, you've just never had good octopus. ⁓ But they're whites and the octopus, the, yeah, the alvarinos are so good. I mean, it's really, really wonderful. So I love that. And you know, mine might surprise you. I was thinking,

Natalie (18:51)
⁓ yeah.

Absolutely.

Right.

Laurie Forster (19:13)
that while you were speaking that Australia is a region that I absolutely fell in love with when I was first getting into wine. And I actually visited there, this is way back 20 years ago. And I was stricken by how many fabulous wineries and great wines they have over there. A lot of them don't even make it, you know, at the time make it here to the US.

But I think there's a lot of great wine, like the Eden Valley Rieslings out of Australia, Pewsey Vale being one of my favorites, just so good. So take another look at Australia, not the party wines, the good stuff.

Natalie (19:48)
Right. ⁓

I agree. We have a Grenache on the shelf right now from Australia that is lovely. You don't think Grenache Australia at all, but it's delicious and it's definitely its own style. It doesn't taste like a French or American or even a Spanish Garnacha. It's very unique and delicious. So I agree with you 100%. That's awesome.

Laurie Forster (19:58)
Right.

Yeah. Awesome.

All right. So speaking of underrated for many years, people were afraid of this pink stuff, but now we're all on board. I know it's so amazing. So you brought us this Rustenburg Petite Verdot Rosé. This is so unique. You're right. This pink is so, it's like a magenta. It's gorgeous.

Natalie (20:18)
Look at that color! It's juicy.

It's scary. It's scary.

It scared me.

Laurie Forster (20:34)
It's scary. I'm not scared. Tell me about

this.

Natalie (20:39)
It scared me. So it's a 2025, of course. So in South Africa, their harvesting season is earlier. So we're in their 2025 vintage of rosé right now, which is kind of fun and weird if you're not used to it. But I love it because the juice is so fresh and lively. as soon as you barely waft it under your nose, you can smell it.

Laurie Forster (20:52)
Yes.

Yeah, it's got a really expressive nose. love that. And Petite Verdot is that this is still unique for South Africa, isn't it?

Natalie (21:02)
So it's.

Yes, it is. I don't believe it's been maybe in the past 20 to 30 years that they started expiring it and growing it there. But it's all red fruit, very juicy. I get a little bit of like almost rose water. There's definitely some floral underneath on the nose.

Laurie Forster (21:18)
Yeah, so much berry fruit on the nose. mean, yes. Yeah.

And when you take a sip, really, that intensity that you get on the nose follows through on the palate, but it does finish dry. So you have all that fruitiness. there's a lot you can do with this food pairing wise. And I'd love to know how you use this, but it's not sweet. It's not, you you think all this fruit, people, this is dry.

Natalie (21:38)
Thank

Hahaha

No, not at all. On the palate, I get kind of like a cross between Morello and Bing cherries on the very front because it is very juicy. I say that because Morello tend to be more sour than Bing, but they're very deep and they're both very deep and complex. So that's definitely of the red fruits. That's what sticks out most to me. In the middle, I get a little bit of orange peel. And then again, the acid in the finish is very short and kind of brings it all together. But because the fruit is so forward,

100 % anything spicy. First thing that came to mind was Thai food. Definitely. mean Indian food, even barbecue, if you do pulled pork with a spicy and vinegar sauce, it's gonna not only smooth the wine out, but calm the spice down. Which I think a lot of people are confused by, they think that you always have to have like a Govertzerminer or a Riesling when you're doing spicy food. And it's simply not true. Also, like you said, the color looks like it's gonna be sweet.

Laurie Forster (22:38)
Yeah.

Yes.

Natalie (22:51)
it's not sweet at all. Just because we're pulling out these fruit notes doesn't mean it's sweet. It's just juicy.

Laurie Forster (22:52)
Mm-mm.

Now I'm looking at your wine rack behind you there with all these different selections, including these three that we're having during the show. But can people, if they come in to visit you, can they grab any bottle off the shelf and enjoy it while they're there? Or are certain wines for while you're eating there, certain wines for takeaway?

Natalie (23:17)
So we do have a wine list. On our wine list, we change seasonally and we offer three ounce, six ounce pours, and then of course a buy the bottle price. Our three ounce pours are offered for you to build your own tasting basically. we're, build your own flight rather. I'm not telling you this is this flight or that flight. You can talk to me about it and I'll help you pick from what we have and your palette and what you like, certainly. As far as on the shelf, absolutely. We do offer a corkage fee. So I'm not sure if people on

understand the difference in retail versus restaurant pricing, but it is quite different and I'm quite honest about it. Retail pricing can be anywhere from a 35 to a 50 % markup. Again, we're in Cambridge, Maryland. We do a straight 35 % markup. Restaurant can be anywhere from 300 to 500%. And that's simply because we are washing your dishes, we are waiting on you. It just comes with the price of dining out. So we offer, if you'd like to take something off the shelf and drink it,

Laurie Forster (23:54)
Nice.

Mm-hmm.

Natalie (24:16)
$15 for each fee, really isn't that much if you dine out of you Yeah, I figured you probably I try to take my own bottles to restaurants. So I know that $15 is not much at all ⁓

Laurie Forster (24:19)
Wow, that's very reasonable.

Yes. I think most places

around me are 25. And then certainly, you know, if you go to a larger city somewhere, you could see a lot more than that.

Natalie (24:37)
yeah, even 35. And for me, being a restaurant person, it's understandable. The restaurant has to make money off it as well. If you want to take it home and wash your own glass, feel free.

Laurie Forster (24:45)
Right.

Yeah, and I love that, you I

think some people are confused about the corkage thing. So I'd love that you bring that up because, you have to check with the restaurant to see if it's allowed because different counties are different in different states. I think there's some etiquette to it as far as I'm usually if it's just me and my husband going to bring maybe one special bottle. I'm not going to grab a ten dollar bottle at the at the grocery store and bring that.

but a special bottle and then I'm probably going to order either a glass of something else or a bottle of something else, depending on, you know, what, how big of a night it's going to be from the establishment, just because, you know, I think that's just nice.

Natalie (25:26)
Same. Same.

We always start with a cocktail and end with a digestif. Might have, you know, a bottle that we bring in the middle or start with a bottle of bubbles that's theirs and then just bring one. But yeah, absolutely. There is definitely an etiquette about it.

Laurie Forster (25:33)
Yes.

Yeah.

Now, I don't want to get deep into any kind of politics, but I am very curious tariff-wise what's going to happen because South Africa right now is one of the ones that's I think, sitting around 30 % tariff potentially, which could obviously be really detrimental to all these great value wines that we're discovering and want to enjoy.

I'm hoping that they get that figured out so we can drink great wine for less. But label wise, I'm going to show this label is kind of a nice, I would say traditional look to it. The old Chateau kind of look, the Rustenburg. But then again, we're going to get into a red here in a few where this is a little more artsy and modern, I guess you would.

think of it that way. Do people come in and pick out their wine by the label? Or what do you think?

Natalie (26:37)
Yes, they do. And that being said, I have to say, because, I didn't even realize this until just now, when you showed the label to me, people ask me all the time, they're like, did you buy this because your name's Natalie? And I'm like, my God, no.

Laurie Forster (26:38)
Yes.

I was gonna ask you that when we got to this wine.

Natalie (26:52)
No, and

if I'd thought about that before we picked the wines for this, I wouldn't have done it. Nope, it's because it's a naturally fermented wine. So we can wait to get into that when we taste it if you want. But as far as labels go, I always tell people, at least in our store, if you see a beautiful label, you can count on the wine being good because we're not going to pick something because the label's good. We're going to be like, my gosh, and I love the label. That's great. If you see a horrible label, please know the wine is good because we are not

Laurie Forster (26:59)
No, I love it.

Natalie (27:21)
going to put up something that is absolutely awful if the wine is not phenomenal. So people do definitely come in, they come up to me, my gosh I picked this out because of the label and then I try to give them tasting notes on the wine and make sure that that's something they're going to like that matches their palate as well. Overall consumers, I mean I touched on it a little bit, me if I were to go into a wine store I shop by region.

Laurie Forster (27:27)
Yes.

Natalie (27:45)
For myself anyway, and and you probably to something that I haven't seen or haven't tasted in a really long time Not everybody's afforded that knowledge, so I think a lot of people do shop by label ⁓

Laurie Forster (27:45)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I mean, I

said, you know, hey, if you want to do it, it's great. Sometimes it's going to work. Sometimes it's not going to work. I mean, that's all there is to it. You know, the QC names, the labels, you know, it just, it really depends. But what I think is most important when you're shopping for wine is to find a wine store like yours with somebody who, who, you know, really curates what they have in the store, who will spend time with you, understanding what you like, and then translating that to what's on the shelf.

Natalie (28:03)
Hahaha

Laurie Forster (28:24)
And sometimes it's trial and error, doesn't always work perfectly the first time around, but the next time I come in, you're gonna know what I like, my style, or I tell you what I'm gonna make for dinner, and you can kinda lead me in the right direction.

Natalie (28:39)
Absolutely, and I think that's the most fun part of my job. I love being able to figure out people's palates without having tasted with them just by what they can tell me. One of the easiest things is, you you buy a couple bottles, take pictures of the wine that you like, especially if you can't remember what the name is. Please take pictures. We all have computers in our pockets now. It's going to be, if you take pictures of what you like, then I can gauge what else you're going to like knowing that you

Laurie Forster (28:49)
Mm-hmm.

Natalie (29:09)
that and kind of get to know your palate that way if you're not drinking with me. But yes, having that store that you can go to and trust, which is why I think we are a great niche in Cambridge because that doesn't exist anywhere else in town.

I'm pretty much always here when we're open. It's very rare that I'm not here. People always ask me about the beer we have because we have retail beer as well. They're like, have you had this? Have you had this? I honestly don't taste any of the beer because there's only so much rent space up here and it's all reserved for wine. So you're on your own with beer. ⁓

Laurie Forster (29:25)
Yeah.

Okay, all right. You're on your own. All

right, perfect. Well, since we already showed your namesake, ⁓ Nat Pinotage, that is gonna be our red that we're tasting today. Or wait, Nuttah, I believe is how you said we should pronounce this. Nuttah-Villay, but on the front it just says Nat, but it is a Pinotage, which is the classic varietal, you know, very specific varietal from

Natalie (29:47)
Yeah.

Yes, it's Nata Fale and it act...

Laurie Forster (30:07)
South Africa.

Natalie (30:08)
So if you can hold up the label again, it to us would say Nate Valage, that's actually how you pronounce it, Nata-Fale in South African. So ⁓ naturally fermented Pinotage, of course, Pinotage is a cross between Cinsault and Pinot Noir. This particular one, I guess, do you want me to explain naturally fermented or do you want to? Okay.

Laurie Forster (30:17)
Okay, love that.

Yeah, please. So if you've been hearing about natural wines,

this is a natural wine. If you are looking to get into that.

Natalie (30:36)
Yes.

So there are only wild yeasts used, not store-bought yeast, meaning it can be yeast found on the grape itself, yeast found on the equipment, the yeast found in the air. It adds a total kind of rogue feel. When I'm explaining it, I like to say compare it to sourdough. ⁓ Instead of using store-bought yeast for sourdough, you just use wild yeast because it can be tricky and you have to have a really good wine maker.

Laurie Forster (31:04)
Right.

Natalie (31:06)
to be able to make it work out so it tastes good. So this wine is definitely geeky. There's also no added sugars or sulfites, only natural occurring ones during the fermentation process. So this is what I like to call healthy wine. Yes, yes.

Laurie Forster (31:18)
Nice. ⁓ okay. This is medicine right here.

Well, it definitely has a lot of like red and dark fruit on the nose, but you can tell it's got some really nice fruit, but also some earthiness, which I think is a natural wine thing, but it's not funky people. that's the one thing that people, people that say they're not into natural wine will say it's too funky or

Natalie (31:25)
Mm.

A like, yeah.

So.

Laurie Forster (31:43)
barnyardy this does not have that this really smells fresh.

Natalie (31:46)
I will say that I opened it earlier today and it did have a bit of barn on it, but for me it was a lovely barn. It's blown off now. I've had this in the glass, I don't know, maybe 15, 20 minutes. So it has blown off entirely, but when I first opened it I was like, oh, poop, yum.

Laurie Forster (31:54)
Okay.

Okay.

Yeah. Well,

I mean, they do say in France about the wines of the Rhone Valley that the best ones smell like a chicken coop. I don't know about that, but, you know, many of the, you know, greatest wines of the world have that sort of barnyard, old McDonald's farm. We could make other crass comments, but those are the kinds of, you know, smells you may get in some of your red wines from all over the world, you know.

Natalie (32:12)
Yeah.

It's a thing, I don't use them in tastings that we do here because people, like the general public doesn't understand it, but I think you know as well as I do, we discuss what type of poop it smells like and tastes like because it's a thing in the wine world and it's not a bad thing at all. I wish more people understood it. ⁓

Laurie Forster (32:39)
Yeah.

It is, yep.

Love it.

Natalie (32:47)
Yeah,

on the nose I get, like you said, both red and dark fruits alike. I get both red and black plum. ⁓ And then a tiny bit of like Kalamata olive, just a tiny bit towards the end. Or maybe it's just a meaty note.

Laurie Forster (32:54)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, no, I'm with you on that. And then I did take a little sip and what I love is it has some really nice medium mouth filling and a little touch of a feel of tannin, but not overwhelming. But it seems like it has good acid to stand up to a lot of different foods as well.

Natalie (33:15)
Yes.

what I like about this and it can be a little confusing and maybe a little too geeky because there are tannins and acid alike but for me this is a great wine to hold up to like a Pinot Noir drinker that doesn't want to go heavier than that this will hold up to a rack of lamb because of the tannins that exist so for me I could drink this by myself by itself

Laurie Forster (33:28)
Right.

Yes.

It's delicious and I almost

feel like you could put a tiny more of a chill on it. ⁓ Not a lot, not a lot, but it does have that good fruit and you know, just cellar like I have a wine fridge just off here to the left. If I took this out at like 52, it'd be fine and then it warms up as you're drinking it. ⁓ Yeah, I love this.

Natalie (33:48)
Definitely.

Yep.

Absolutely. also,

like the, there's a little bit of woody herb. I don't, can't tell exactly what it is right this second. I don't know if it's thyme or oregano, but that lends itself to a lot of food as well.

Laurie Forster (34:14)
So we have three great wines under $20. I mean, under 19 for that matter. And all great for this time of year, because this

bread, this pinotage, grilled meats, all those summer, you know, things that we do, I could see this going with. And even to your point about Pinot Noir, maybe even a grilled salmon. Yeah.

Natalie (34:33)
Absolutely, it's definitely

light enough, again, it has enough body to hold up to salmon 100%. I was gonna say, ⁓ grilled vegetables, you do a one tray grilled with anything, this is it. And easy enough to drink while you're grilling, still has that slight chill on it, yeah, absolutely. And I mean,

Laurie Forster (34:49)
Right. Yeah. I know. I haven't had a ton

of natural wines yet, but this one is promising. People either seem to love them or not. we'll...

Natalie (34:58)
I'm glad you like it. They

are rogue. think that you need somebody to taste them for you first. Because I've had a ton that are, you know, they taste like sour beer. you don't want that. Not everybody wants that.

Laurie Forster (35:10)
Yes. Yeah.

Right.

Some people in our business can get a little crazy about describing wines. What's the craziest thing you ever heard?

Natalie (35:22)
The crazy descriptions I think are more what I read online than the people that are selling it. I have a really good relationship with all of our, as I like to say, cork dorks or my wine reps. We work with 29 different distributors and I'm pretty tight with all of them and they know how real I am and that I...

Laurie Forster (35:33)
⁓ Perfect.

Natalie (35:41)
cut them down in a heartbeat if they say anything too cheesy. I think that for me, wine descriptions, think, and this is the difference in you and I where I'm more of a customer base. What bothers me are what customers say. So if a customer were to come in and say, ah, can I have the best SavvyB you have?

Please don't call it Savvy B. It's a Sauvignon Blanc. We have lovely Sauvignon Blancs. Don't call it Savvy B. Even like, oh, can I have the best cab sav you have by the glass? Well, there's no need for me to have 12 cab, cabernets on by the class. So I only have one. Do I think it's good? Absolutely. But I guess just brief terms bother me more than anything.

Laurie Forster (36:05)
Right.

Right.

Natalie (36:25)
As far as, yeah, but I want to know yours because I bet yours is like awesome.

Laurie Forster (36:25)
Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, I almost

feel like I try to say less because I've noticed, because I do a lot of consumer facing events as you do as well, you know, with everyday wine lovers, I'm not doing classes for Somms and other wine educators that, you know, I think it's intimidating when you start labeling off six, eight different fruits that they're supposed to have smelled and tasted in the glass.

I will try things like, you know, instead of, you know, kumquats and huckleberries, which I don't think I've ever tasted in my life, I will try to get people to say, you know, what candy did you eat as a kid that you feel like you might smell in this glass? And then like with this rosé, like if they maybe get a hint of melon, you know, maybe it's the Jolly Ranchers. Yes. And I think that's fabulous. Or those little strawberry candies that had the wrapper that looked like it was a strawberry. I forget what those

Natalie (37:01)
Ever.

That's exactly what it was.

Laurie Forster (37:22)
called, but yes, exactly.

Natalie (37:23)
Church, church candies, yeah. That comes up, all Twizzlers

come up for us all the time. When we did our Portuguese dinner, ⁓ Juicy Fruit was on one of the Broncos that I had. It was all over the nose and the front of the palate and it tasted just like Juicy Fruit gum. I agree, I love that. ⁓ that's great.

Laurie Forster (37:29)
Right.

Yes. Yeah, and people connect

with that. They get excited about it. There's nothing intimidating about candy, okay? But so I almost, when I hear people that are in that old model of, this is medium bada, clear, medium plus acid, that's kind of from our SOM training. You get that, medium plus acid, medium plus tan and.

Natalie (37:48)
Yeah.

Laurie Forster (38:06)
going through all the different earth, fruit, this and that. I mean, I feel like you've lost everybody already. So I really do cringe at that sort of old model.

I feel like people want to see you having fun, wines are going to be fun for them. They want to be engaged.

Wine is about connection, Anyway, I think all three of these are delicious. So if you were getting off of work and going home, like you said, to watch a funny show or funny movie, what would be your after work pour?

that you would enjoy.

Natalie (38:38)
I mean, again, restauranting, always tend to start cold because I've been working and talking to people and I tend to suck it back kind of quickly. So I'd have to say Provence Rose right off the top of my head because it's easy. It's light. There's a little bit of salt usually.

That, any white from Puglia is probably my like, like I said, Italian area that I'm going right now. If I had to do red, it would be a Bardolino I love Corvina the grape, and Bardolinos are way less than Brunellos. So yeah, that would be it, I think. What about you?

Laurie Forster (39:01)
Mmm.

Yes, absolutely.

Yeah, I think my go-to, I'm thinking of what I have in my fridge right now. So if we're going there from here. Yeah, I have a dry Vouvray that I'm excited to try one of these evenings. I have a white from Planeta, the La Segretta blend. It's a Bianco from Sicily. So that I'm excited about.

Natalie (39:23)
Yes, like what do you keep in your fridge?

Love Sicilian.

Laurie Forster (39:41)
Always bubbly. I always have bubbly in there just in case I'm feeling a bubbly. And Gruet is kind of my go-to for like every day because it's just such a great value and so well made. Or a cava, or a Spanish cava. those, yeah. Yeah.

Natalie (39:48)
Okay.

I was gonna say, Cava's definitely my go-to with bubbly. And again,

like you can find under 15 to 20 bucks, they're delicious and very easy to drink. ⁓ So may I ask one question of you? What is the last wine you had that you were embarrassed to tell people that you drank?

Laurie Forster (40:04)
Nice.

Sure.

Well, sometimes if I'm grocery shopping and I, you know, I normally will buy from an independent retailer like yourself, but sometimes I'm at the grocery store and I might need a bottle. So that can happen. But ⁓ I don't know if it's super low brow, but Bieler ⁓ from Provence makes a Rose and it's eleven dollars, ninety nine cents. It's their kind of starter. And that's

Natalie (40:36)
Yeah.

Okay.

Laurie Forster (40:44)
a go-to for me as far as everyday.

Natalie (40:47)
I'm not mad at that, that's not embarrassing.

I was just going to say my kind of embarrassing thing that I do kind of on a regular basis basis, my friends have caught on and my parents and we all really enjoy it. We call them brewskis. It's not beer, but we make our own lambrusco So whatever sparkling white I may have open at the end of the night, obviously the sparkling doesn't hold from day to day. So I'm constantly drinking sparkling after service. If I just want to change it up a little bit, I look up at the light reds that I have open and throw a splash on top and I make my own.

Laurie Forster (41:00)
Okay.

Ooh!

Natalie (41:18)
Lambrusco.

Laurie Forster (41:20)
I love that. I'm going to have to tell my

husband because he likes to put red wine and white wine and he says he makes rosé. So it's the same kind of concept. I love this. Yeah. Well, no shame in that. You're just not wasting wine, which is a sin. So, well, Natalie, if I know everyone that's listening is going to want to come into Vintage 414 and visit you, buy some wine, enjoy some food, get your suggestions and recommendations.

Natalie (41:27)
Yeah.

Laurie Forster (41:46)
Tell folks how they can get in touch with you and when they can come see you at the restaurant.

Natalie (41:51)
So we are open Wednesdays through Sundays, Wednesdays 11 to 8, Thursday, Friday, Saturday 11 to 9, and Sunday 11 to 4. Monday, Tuesday, which is when we're recording this. Cheers. Why it's been so quiet in the shop. But yes, come see us. We can help you with all your retail. Again, my business partner and our chef are classically French trained chefs in both their worlds, and our food is phenomenal as well.

Laurie Forster (42:06)
Yes, cheers!

Awesome. Well, Natalie, thank you so much for joining us. This has been a lot of fun. I'll post all the links to the wines to vintage 414.

Natalie (42:28)
All right, well, thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. And yeah, this is awesome. This is a lot of fun. Cheers.

Laurie Forster (42:34)
Yeah.

Laurie Forster (42:35)
So if you're in the Eastern Shore area, you must go to Cambridge and visit Natalie at vintage414. I'll post the link to her wine bar, the three South African beauties that we tasted during this episode. And don't forget to go to my events page at thewinecoach.com. Check out my virtual tasting September 24th and my tour to Tuscany in 2026. I want you to be one of the few people that join me for this week of,

decadence, luxury, and delicious wines.

next week I'm gonna be joined with Mark Davidson of Wine Australia. If you think Australian wines means party wines with little critters on the bottle, I am here with Mark to change your mind. I love Australian wines. There's so much great stuff out there to explore. We're gonna be doing it next week. And until then, cheers.