Body Wisdom Academy
Welcome to 'Body Wisdom Academy,' the podcast where ancient wisdom meets modern science in the journey of holistic health and trauma recovery. I’m your host, Alyssa, and each week, I’ll be diving deep into the sacred practices and somatic tools to support you on your journey of deep inner healing, awakening,and transformation. Join me as I interview inspiring guests from the fields of holistic health, somatic therapy, and spiritual growth. Whether you’re seeking healing, purpose, or a deeper understanding of your self, this podcast is you sanctuary. So, take a deep breath and let’s embark on this journey of awakening together. IG: @thealyssastefanson
Body Wisdom Academy
Episode 60: Navigating New Relationships in Business and Love
In this episode, we sit down with Katie Grimes, a business coach with deep roots in relationship coaching, to uncover the fascinating link between attachment styles and business success. Katie and I share our personal experiences and talk about how recognizing and managing anxious attachment traits like people-pleasing and over-communication can significantly enhance professional interactions. We offer practical strategies for addressing these feelings and emphasize the importance of self-awareness to effectively navigate the intersection of personal and professional dynamics.
Katie Grimes helps you go all in on building your business, using their personal experiences & passions, without stressin' out or feelin' overwhelmed.
To coach with Katie, add your name to this list and Katie will reach out directly: https://kgkatiegrimes.myflodesk.com/private-coaching-waitlist
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Welcome to the Waking the Wild Woman podcast. I'm your host, alyssa Steffensen, and it is my intention with this podcast to deliver empowering resources, insights and tools to help you remember your sacred nature, return to your wild, intuitive roots and embody your soul's purpose. Each week, I share inspiring, real and raw conversations with experts in the field of holistic health and trauma recovery to support you on your healing journey and reconnect to the innate wisdom and healing capabilities of your body. Welcome back to another episode. This is kind of sad because this is going to be the last Waking the Wild Woman podcast episode ever, because the name is changing to Body Wisdom Academy community.
Speaker 1:For those of you who are unaware of this, I have an online community called Body Wisdom Academy. It is a membership platform where we offer trauma-informed support, holistic healing, somatic tools. It's a caring community and I do four live calls a month in that community. Personally, you get four live one-hour calls with me, and then we also have guest coaches come in, guest healers come in, so we have astrologers, human design experts, intuitive mediums, shamanic practitioners, yoga nidra instructors so there's so much incredible value in this community. You also get lifetime access to my Somatics Foundation online course where we dive into building somatic awareness, the foundations. Going through the dive into building somatic awareness, the foundations, going through the five levels of somatic awareness, we learn how to navigate and befriend our nervous system, because our entire life, your entire physical manifestation of your life is a direct result of what is happening inside of your nervous system. So when we learn how to work with our nervous system and really understand it because every single one of us has a very unique system so when we learn how to work with our nervous system and really understand it because every single one of us has a very unique system Once we understand it, learn how to work with it. That's how we really truly step into everything that we are desiring and manifest the life that we are wanting, and this is all backed by neuroscience. It's actually really cool to see the way that I look at somatic work is it's the integration of spirit and science, which I love and that's exactly what we do in this community is we integrate ancient wisdoms with modern science. So you get lifetime access to that, and then you can try our community right now for three months for only $444, which is an absolute steal. So you get all of that the six live calls every single month, the somatics foundation course plus. You'll get access to any mini courses I release, and then you get access to our chat group, our community. Get all of that for only $444, or you can pay for a full year and save $665. For only $1,111. You can join for the full year All of my one-on-one clients, so I offer mentorship for three to six month packages.
Speaker 1:All of my one-on-one clients get the whole community for free, so that's an option available for you as well. If you're interested in booking a free consultation, call with me to learn more about it and just to figure out what package is the best for you whether it's one-on-one or whether it's the community. You can book a free consultation with the link that I have provided in the show notes, and you can hop over to my Instagram page as well and you can learn more about it there as well. I talk about my community often, so, yeah, very excited to share all of that with you. Previously it was not available in membership packages like that. It was only available in a lifetime membership option, so now I have three-month packages and one-year options available for you as well. Now I have three month packages and one year options available for you as well. Also, if you are not happy with your investment which I'm very, very, very confident that you will be but things happen right. Sometimes we invest in things and we realize that the program was not what we were expecting, within the first 14 days, I give you a full refund if you are not happy. So very excited to share all that with you, and on this podcast, we're actually going to be having the healers that I mentioned to you, that are part of our community. They're going to be coming in and they're going to actually be doing a series with me called the healer circle. So that's something I'm really excited to be launching in the next couple of months as well. So stay tuned for that.
Speaker 1:In today's episode, I had my friend, katie Grimes join me. She is a business coach. Previously she was a relationship coach, and it's actually really cool because I just truly believe that relationships and business go hand in hand, like when you really understand your relationship patterns, your core wounds, your attachment style. That's going to help you so much in business. So I love that she started off as a relationship coach and then transitioned to business, because she's going to take all of that with her and be able to apply it when it comes to working with her clients in business. And this girl is hilarious and so much fun and we just really vibe and we share a lot of very similar life experiences, so I'm really excited to share this episode with you.
Speaker 2:It was a ton of fun to record.
Speaker 1:So, katie, I love how you are both a relationship and a business coach. Most people don't realize how those two areas are completely connected with each other and, yeah, you and I are both very familiar with attachment styles. We talked about that on your podcast. I think it'd be fun to dive into how our attachment styles actually show up in business.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's crazy how similar they are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want to know I don't think that we even mentioned this what is your or what was your dominant Cause? I should say that our attachment styles are not fixed. They can change. What was your dominant pattern, that you had to heal and work through Anxiousness?
Speaker 2:Okay, it's down 100% anxiousness and, if I'm honest, it can still show up with certain clients and that shows up like people pleasing and checking my boxer. You know more times than I care to admit in a given day it's being uber responsive. You know, like more than just the regular. You know people that I coach with Um, but then it can also be feeling like I'm walking on eggshells with them, like I feel like I can't really say what I want to say in terms of the advice I'm giving, the suggestions I'm giving, the life experience that I'm giving Um. So it can show up certainly in relationship to clients that I have to be really careful about Um and then the other in terms of like really in how I showed up in relationships.
Speaker 2:Same way, I mean it can still show up with certain people. It's the constantly checking your phone wondering if they texted um, feeling like you can't really speak up for what you want to get off your chest, um. They're very similar feelings. The only difference is like one influences money and the other influences sex, but both are high stakes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I like that you mentioned that you're still working through it, because I always laugh when I hear people say that they've healed their attachment wounds and we're never completely secure.
Speaker 1:We're never completely secure. We will never be completely secure. We'll always experience insecure attachment at times. We'll probably see ourself in all of them. Even at times we usually do have a dominant pattern. Ideally, we want to get to the place where we're securely attached most of the time, but doesn't mean that these wounds don't still show up in every single area of our life, and there's also shadow aspects and there's light aspects, and you even kind of mentioned it like those are good qualities too to really care, like you're really caring about the work that you put in. Of course, it can show up in shadow aspects as well, which you had mentioned right, like the people pleasing or just like giving too much and caring too much, but there are light aspects to these attachment styles as well, which is really important to mention. So what are some kind of practical tools of when you actually catch yourself in that pattern, how do you even catch it and what are tools that you actually use to work through it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great question. I think that when it comes to the anxiousness that I experience, remember like there's, like you said, anxious, there's avoidant, there's secure, there's a combination of them in any way shape or form. When I'm experiencing anxiety, I've learned to tune into my body, so I've learned to say what is the feeling that I'm feeling, because the action, like I really believe in, like state story, strategy, right, this is comes from Tony Robbins. So if we work backwards to the actual strategy, the action I'm taking is picking up my phone a lot. It's feeling like I need to respond quickly. It is over giving and over delivering beyond what the scope of my work is with them, like when they sign up to do two coaching calls, it might be I just pick up the phone and call them to just make sure that everything's OK.
Speaker 2:This has only happened, knock on wood, three times total in the five years I've been in business and all five left, or all three left early in those five years, which was interesting. So it was a blessing, quite frankly. But if I go into the story that I was telling myself, it was very much. They're not going to be pleased with my work. I have to like, I have to prove that I'm worthy of the amount of money that they paid me, which is super fucked up, because I don't ever actually feel that way with any of my clients.
Speaker 2:But if I then go into where I want to start, which is state I've started to get better at noticing, oh, the anxiety comes in the form of the pit of my stomach, like I feel it between my solar plexus, between the ribs, and then I feel it in my actual, like above my pelvis, and I feel this like it's almost like someone turned the light switch on and you just feel the energy, just like trying. It's almost like the buzzing of the light, you can feel it and there's a shortness of breath. There's usually a lot of migraines, um, which I don't. I in the past had not correlated with. Oh, this is somebody who is not good for my own health and wellbeingbeing. Whether that's their fault or mine, I don't think it really matters as much as it's just me. Acknowledging this relationship is not as safe and supportive as I need it to be. I'm not feeling safe to be who I really am, so that's usually how been showing up for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I, um, I definitely see myself at times in those like patterns and behaviors as well. So like my dominant style was disorganized for sure, oh, yeah, and then both.
Speaker 2:I just learned this.
Speaker 1:Yes, and it's awful. I would have crippling anxiety but I would show up very like avoidant and I always thought like I would get such bad anxiety in relationships. So I felt it deeply and I wanted to move towards but I also wanted to pull away. So it was very contradicting thoughts and experiences and, depending on their style, would be like that would depend on how they were um reacting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it would exactly. Would I? Would I either go towards or would I pull away? The interesting thing is how I was able to work through that was I had to actually become more avoidant initially, cause it goes either way, like either we're going to go further into that sympathetic, which is the anxiety, or we're going to go into the dorsal, which is like the shutdown, and become more avoidant. So I actually did become like completely avoidant. And have you ever heard I always laugh so hard at this? Have you heard? Like the black cat golden retriever, have you? Okay, you have to look it up. Um, I actually just found out about it. This was this. I guess it went viral a couple years ago, but I just saw a relationship coach talking about it and it's hilarious. They say that the the woman should always be the black cat and the guy should be the golden retriever.
Speaker 1:Saying that, saying that, and it can go true, right, but this can also be very toxic.
Speaker 1:But it's also very hilarious, like when you just look at it.
Speaker 1:So they say the guy should always want the woman slightly more and she wants to be the black cat. Right, you want him to be the golden retriever and I think, like the reason that they say that is because most women, we are just more caring and nurturing, so we're more inclined to want to be more of that golden retriever, like the puppy. But if we can pull back and be more of the black cat, then it causes him to come more towards you and it's hilarious because it's so, so accurate. It could also you can take it the wrong way and it could become a little bit toxic as well, and I was already very avoidant at this time, so I don't need to step more into the black cat. But it's so helpful to have that picture, like if you notice yourself being anxious and wanting to lead, lead, lead towards, tell yourself be the black cat and like even just saying that and having that vision is like helpful to disrupt that pattern and it makes it kind of funny because it does work 's so?
Speaker 2:true. By the way, I have three best friends who are all married and, as being the only single friend in their group, their feedback has been he does need to love you, just like, a little bit more. He needs to be like, and you need to give it time for him to be able to do that. Because if you sleep with him too soon, you know feeling he hasn't formed his feelings yet. If you're, it's just sexual.
Speaker 2:And that was the hardest part for me because I knew that men really connect through sexual, like sexuality. So it was interesting when friends would come to me and say the same thing like you have, like you in this case, like you have to be the black cat, you have to be like a little bit more reserved. And it's not that you want to play a game, it's not that you don't want to just be yourself, it's just like he hasn't really deserved the time and attention, hasn't put the effort in yet for me to be the golden retriever sometimes, like he just doesn't know me well enough yet so I can't really give.
Speaker 2:And my girlfriends call me a golden retriever. And first things first. I like every time I'm walking down the street and I see a golden retriever, I, I act like a golden retriever Like I'm like everything goes up and I'm like oh, my God, can I go pet it?
Speaker 2:And the joke with my friends has been like you have golden retriever energy.
Speaker 2:And so, as I was listening to you, I was like, yeah, this makes sense.
Speaker 2:Why, like you know, relationships necessarily haven't panned out the way that I thought is because in the past I'm just like so open hearted, like I try to, I try to really date from a place of acting as if I've never been hurt before.
Speaker 2:And for some people a lot of my mentors have said no, no, no, that's not how we do it. We, we date based on the judgments that we, that we've posed, and I'm like, but why is that fair to anybody else that I'm like going into it, scorned or upset, or the case may be, and I think, similar to what you were saying earlier, like with the right person who creates a sense of security within you, you, in the moments when you are feeling um, a little bit more, the moments when you are feeling a little bit more anxious or you are feeling a little bit more avoidant, if they can be that steady rock, it really allows you to kind of work through the emotions. I mean, I always say that being in a relationship, alyssa, is equally as hard, or should say getting into a relationship those first, you know, few months ish are as challenging as starting a business. You will learn more about yourself starting a relationship and starting a business than any years in therapy any years in coaching because you just are blown wide open.
Speaker 2:Insecurities, fears, doubts, judgments, past experiences, childhood trauma it will all come to the service surface and I really like that.
Speaker 2:You said that you really identified as what was it called disassociation no, the disorganized, disorganized like I saw a post on instagram come up recently and he's and it was so articulate and I'm going to butcher it a little bit, but it was essentially like there are times where you feel so secure in a romantic relationship and when he's showing up consistently and he's telling what you want to hear and he's planning the dates and he's doing all these things Great, but then he will pull the pull away just a little bit. Whether he's stressed or overwhelmed, whether he is. Maybe it has something to do with you, but you just don't know. And for me, my old response used to be anxiousness in the respect of reaching out and being like hey, was it like trying to act like the cool girl and like everything's fine, but inside I'm like dying. Act like the cool girl and like everything's fine, but inside I'm like dying. And my tendency now is more black cat, I will, I will pull back further, like I will completely um, avoid. And that's not to say that that's healthy, I'm just saying that that's been my reaction to kind of counterbalance.
Speaker 2:And uh, that came up in a relationship that was only you know a couple of weeks in, came up in a relationship that was only you know a couple of weeks in and I found the person to be texting me four times a day and being really curious and being flirtatious and being a little sexual and planning the dates and like a little bit of sarcasm and just like just kind of this, like flirtatious energy. And then one day it was just gone and I remember being like okay, you went down from four to one time a day and then, and then I was like I remember anxiously being like and you don't didn't call me the nickname that you call me so in my head that's when it started the disorganism. I was like, oh my god, I started to go anxious. Then he texted me and was like, why so quiet? And I was like, why so quiet? Are you fine getting me? Like you're the one who's like? I didn't say it. Instead I was like I'm just feeling anxious and so I'm trying to work through it on my own.
Speaker 2:And I wasn't wrong to feel the way that I felt because, sure enough, a few days later it was like the slow ghost, you know, and I was like just one text here only responding to mine, and I was like what, I'm not even gonna bother, like this is just a waste of my time. Like you should have said something a week ago when things changed for you, right? So I'm just mindful of the way I show up in relationships. Now I actually, right before this call, got on the phone with somebody that I'm getting to know and just shared a little bit of that story with him. Like, hey, things are moving along great and there's something you should know about me I want to lead with an open heart.
Speaker 2:It's really hard to do that when I've been burned in the past. So, um, just trying to like express my anxieties a little bit more and the avoidance that I can have because with the right person in that moment, that won't bother them. But you, we, I mean you and I come from the same school of like. We didn't talk about marriage, we didn't talk about kids when you first got to know someone, because that came across too desperate. And now I'm like no, we're talking about it, I'm fine, I just I don't need to be the cool girl anymore. But also, I'm not doing it from a place of desperation, doing it from a place of I know myself and it's a sense of security.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, and I liked how you mentioned too. So I really resonate with that and I'm sure a lot of women do. Do you find that consistent, that pull away? Like pretty much consistently in every relationship there is that phase of like everything's going good, everything's like feeling secure, and then all of a sudden there's a little pull away.
Speaker 2:My experience has been. So. Three years ago I was in a really healthy and happy relationship and the things that ended the relationship were the things that we didn't discuss at the beginning, like marriage, like kids, the things we valued, right. We just sort of thought the other would change their point of view by the end and you know when you fall in love with each other and that didn't change. I was growing too fast and so I ended up leaving that relationship and what I found over the last three years was, yeah, the slow pull away and or just the hard pull away is very much what's happening.
Speaker 2:I mean, I date men, so I'm not sure if it's happening in lesbian couples, but it's certainly happening with men. Is this lack of communication? Like it's okay to just say something's missing, or hey, I've gotten a chance to get to know someone else and I feel like I really want to give it a shot. I'll never forget a guy that said that to me before I dated my last. Uh, had my last relationship. It was the sexiest thing anyone could have. I was like are you sure? No, like had my last relationship. It was the sexiest thing anyone could. I was like are you sure?
Speaker 1:No?
Speaker 2:like because it was just so like, hey, I'm getting to know this other girl, while I've had a chance to get to know you and I really want to see where it's going to go with her and I just wish you the best.
Speaker 2:It's been so great getting to know you and I've taken that line with me in every mini relationship that I've had, because I think there's a level of respect, there's a level of kindness and you're just being respectful of someone's like time and feelings and energy. But yeah, the the ghosting is real and it's it's to the point where they'll earn your trust by showing up consistently so say they're texting, often getting curious about you. And then my experience has been they start to do that repetitively, week after week, with dates spending time together, physical touch, words of affirmation, like all the love languages are being hit, and then, like maybe a month in, I'm like okay, I feel like I'm going to have sex with them, or like I feel like like let's just see where this goes.
Speaker 2:And nine times out of 10, what's happening is they are just ghosting, even whether it's before sex or after sex, and there's just no communication and you're like what the like did you die?
Speaker 1:Like what happened and so how, like for someone who's experiencing that. So, cause, sometimes they aren't ghosting, right? So guys, like everyone communicates differently how do you know if they are just, you know, going through something needing space? Sometimes guys aren't the greatest at communicating. You know what they're going through or their daily stressors that they're dealing with. How do you know if someone is, just, if they have stuff going on, obviously, having that conversation with them? But what are questions that you would kind of like ask and have to really, I guess, really get to know whether they are actually ghosting you or they just have stuff going on that they need space. So I think it's twofold.
Speaker 2:I think one is the setup. So then that way, when I do ask I've already told you once before that I'm going to ask right. So normally when I'm like first starting to date someone, I'll be like hey, if we're ever in a place where you just need time to yourself and you're like stressed at work or something outside of your control happened or there's something going on with me and you and you don't really have the words to say it, you can let me know that you need time. Because if you don't let me know that you need time, whatever it may be, like I'm gonna, I'm gonna assume that like you're ghosting or like whatever else, and I am not somebody who goes. So I would really appreciate it if you would just tell me like hey, just I'm a little bit busier than normal. It has nothing to do with you. That's really reassuring. I say that to. I said that to the guy.
Speaker 2:I'm getting known Like you can also text me and be like it has nothing to do with you or it does have something to do with you, but I just need some time, like, so that way, when it does happen, I'm able to be like hey, I noticed you're quieter than normal. Do you need a little space? Or you're a little quieter than normal, like you know, I'm noticing you're a little distant, like is there anything that you need from me, or do you want to just reach out when it feels good and it's acknowledging that, like I know that they have other priorities, while also being very respectful of my own time and energy right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like that. You mentioned that I am actually. I experienced that with someone I was seeing and he responded that exact way of like this has nothing to do with you. He's got a lot going on. He's also like a dad and he's he's working crazy long hours right now. So we didn't have a chance to see each other one weekend where we had plans and he just communicated he's like sorry about this weekend has nothing to do with you, had a bit of a rough weekend and um, but still it's like.
Speaker 1:Initially I kind of took it like so then I'm like oh, do you want like space, should we take a break? And he's like no, absolutely Like I don't want that at all. But it's funny how I reacted that way. It's like that's my avoidant part, to pull away. So it's like it's so hard to like find that balance. But you like obviously having the open dialogue and the communication of like when is it time to like lean in and when is it time to really notice when to pull away and to really know your patterns.
Speaker 1:And for me, because I'm so avoidant, like I end things before they start, I am so bad with that like that is my pattern and I know this and I actually came up in an intuitive reading for me, um, with this woman that I see she's like Alyssa, like she let me know she goes. You are going to be entering into a relationship soon. She goes do not end things before they start. You have a habit of doing that. I'm like, oh yeah, I do so. Yeah, it's just knowing our own patterns and what we tend to do, because I I am so quick to think that if someone is a little bit distant, that they're not interested in me and that they should be like pursuing me constantly. But sometimes people need space and we all have things going on and to really understand that not everyone's going to move at the same pace as we are. Not everyone's ready to. We all have different experiences in our lives and different things that we're going through.
Speaker 1:I'm in a place right now in my life where I have so much space, like my life is so good and it took me a long time to get here where I have so much space for a relationship I really do. But I can't expect this other person to have the exact amount of space that I do right now. Right, like I have to make the choice of am I willing to date someone who doesn't have the space Cause it's not going to look the same of? Am I willing to date someone who doesn't have the space because it's not going to look the same, or do I want to find someone who has just as much space as me? Like, we just really have to like weigh these different options and see what it is that we're really looking for. But yeah, I know what it's like to not have that space, right, so it's like yeah, I know what it's like to have not have that space and time for somebody.
Speaker 2:But then, in same breath, I just was talking about this today with the same person I was like I just feel like I'm in a plate. We were talking about red flags and like our own personal red flags that we bring to a relationship. I was talking about overthinking and anxiety. You know he had mentioned, you know, kind of prioritizing someone a little too soon, right, and I was like I can totally relate to that and I feel like what I've observed and this is what I said back to him was I was like I'm in a place where I my my work schedule, the relationships I have with my friends, everything my relationship with myself. I'm able to prioritize myself first and I have enough room to prioritize someone else. So I'm not going to hold back, I'm not going to be like oh what are you doing at 12 o'clock?
Speaker 2:Like I'm going to do it because it feels really good and if that's too much or or not enough for someone, that's fine. But I started to get to know someone who was like divorce, had kids, blah, blah, blah, and I was just like, oh, there is no space for Katie here and it doesn't feel good. Because I started to get quieter and it was interesting when you were talking about that, the avoidant part of you, when you had said to him like, oh, do you need space? Like do you need to take a break or something. It's like for me.
Speaker 2:I would say that, but I wouldn't call it my avoidant part, I would call it my anxious part, cause, like, I want to avoid the disappointment of, not of the anxiety that I'm experiencing, cause I want to kind of know, like, are we moving forward or we not? Like, do you just need a day or do you need like a year? Like what do you mean? You tell me, that will make it so much easier for me to just sort of settle down. And it's probably similar in business, right, when we know we have consistent cash coming in, we're able to sit down, relax, enjoy, be creative, be in our feminine, and when there's uncertainty in a relationship, it can create a lot of discomfort.
Speaker 1:Totally, totally. When you don't feel completely secure in that relationship, just like with your finances, it's like if you're not in a place financially where you feel like you have, you feel really secure, you know the money's coming in, you're not concerned about it not coming in, you're operating from such a different place. But when you're in a relationship, especially in the beginning stages, it's like building a business at the beginning, right Like it takes a while to get to that place of security within your business, to know that you have that constant stream of income coming in. It can take a while, just like a relationship. It could take a while to really build that security in a relationship. So it is common to have these anxious and avoidant patterns show up in the beginning of business and in the beginning of a relationship.
Speaker 2:You're reminding me of something that I did when I first started my business. It was very similar to how I used to anxiously date. I would change my standards. I would change my values. So in this case for business, I would change my offers. I would change my standards. I would change my values. So in this case, for business, I would change my offers. I would change my prices. I would change the amount of time I would be speaking with someone. I would overgive and under deliver.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry over give, not under deliver. I was just constantly trying to mold and shape myself into whoever would buy for me. I showed up the same way and I'm not proud of this, but it's honest. In my twenties and thirties probably teens, twenties, thirties I was doing the same thing with men. Oh, you like to ski? Oh, yeah, I like to ski. You like to do this, you like to do that? Oh, you want to listen to this music? Okay, like you want to hang out with these friends? Great, I don't really like these friends, but I'll hang out with these friends, like just constantly shape-shifting myself, and that that comes from growing up in an alcoholic home. I mean, mom was great one day and loving and attentive and caring, and then the next day she'd be gone and like, literally and figuratively, emotionally she'd be gone, um, physically she would be gone for days and not knowing when the next meal was going to come or not knowing if she paid the electricity bill, like these were things that were constant upheaval in as a young, young child, from the age of three into the time I left. I think it left when I was. I left a few times, but at 21, I really left and I feel like looking back on myself. Of course that makes sense, why I would show up the same way in business. You know we're now I'm in a different phase.
Speaker 2:So, like year three, I started making some serious coin and that money was showing up consistently and I got a little cocky. I overspent. What I didn't realize is on terms of overspending. I also was making myself high. What I didn't realize is on terms of overspending, I also was making myself high. I had also stressed myself out so bad years one and year two because of the shape shifting of like, oh, this client wants this, ok, I'll do it for that price. Ok, that client wants this, I'll do it for that price. But I made myself physically sick. So gut infections, not sleeping well, issues with you know, know gi, all that stuff. And it's the same feelings I was feeling in my love life back in the day. I just I just couldn't correlate it.
Speaker 2:So at that time I was still relationship coaching and showing up on social media, talking about this anxious avoidance, secure attachment style and dating, taking a break from dating and getting back out there to really know yourself and focus on yourself and trust yourself. And I think what was interesting is like then, year four, my prices were the highest they've ever been because I was confident in my ability as a relationship coach and on the side on the low, I was like business coaching, meaning I had some groups that I had formed. Everyone was paying the same price, it was the same offer. But I found myself feeling insecure, like who am I to charge this much, while I'm also going through a breakup and having this repetitive pattern come up where these guys act one way the first week goes great, and then even the first month, and then they just completely act differently. And my mentor always says to me you have to let someone prove who they are to you. You have to. You can't just go in assuming and you can trust them Like you got to see them on their good days and their bad days, and the way they treat the waitstaff and the way that they treat you every day is going to be different. So with enough time you'll be able to see if you really want to move forward with them. And I think what I started to observe is during that year three.
Speaker 2:Year four that's when those three clients came in that were just brutal and I pulled way back. I was going to so much therapy because it was bringing up to me, like all the fears, doubts and insecurities about being a business owner and never really doing it to the success that I had done it before. Was I going to be able to do it again? I had a $20,000, $30,000 a month. Could I sustain that? Was I eventually going to be one of those coaches that was able to promote that? I did that. No, because the money dropped as soon. I couldn't hold space for it. Just like I couldn't hold space for it. Just like I couldn't hold space for a secure relationship, I just was. There was too much insecurity going on, too much healing that needed to be done.
Speaker 2:Um, while also to the point that of the work that you do, my nervous system was fried and I had no idea what a nervous system was. I had no idea. I had no idea what it was. All I was hearing was that you need to manage your stress. I, I feel I don't feel stressed. I don't know what you're talking about, and what I've since learned is like we have been through so much shit whether it's things outside of our control or things within our control that it raised the bar on how much stress we can actually handle that. We don't even know that we're stressed. We don't even know what it's like to get a good night's sleep. We don't even know what it is like to have a good poop Like. We don't know what it's really like because it's so inconsistent and um, the point I'm trying to make is that kind of year four.
Speaker 2:The prices were high but the clients weren't coming and I was like shit, something's got to give. So I dramatically lowered my prices in half, started giving more things out for free in terms of like consults and turning them into coaching calls, and that was kind of for me a protective, a protective mechanism. It's kind of like having a FaceTime or conversation before going on a date. I needed that time, an hour consultation or what I call like just go, let's do a free coaching call to really get to know someone, cause I wanted to see how did my body feel after we got off the call, how did it feel during and how did it feel before and when I started doing that.
Speaker 2:I have, knock on wood, have the best clients and have never run into that situation in the next last like two and a half years, because as soon as I feel like it's not a good fit. I've recently refunded someone and I was like everything was great, but then I started acting anxious and I was like you know what? I'm actually not the best coach for you. This is. These are some things that I think you can focus on. She was so responsive and so well-received. But I think I do the same thing in dating Whether it's a phone call, text messaging, facetime, anything before going on that date, so that I can check in with myself to be like do I really want to go, does this really feel good to me? And with that breeds more confidence. I get that a lot from dating apps. The guys on the dating apps will say God, you really know yourself, you really know what you want, and that's such a compliment, business or relationships.
Speaker 1:We aren't secure in our worth. So it's like, how can we become more secure in our worth? Not by affirmations, but by developing those skill sets communication, feeling really confident as a woman on your own and I know that there's a huge, you know, like right now it's I'll even call it a trend of like a lot of people saying that we need to go back to traditional ways of living, which I'm all for women being at home with the children, absolutely that's an important rule. But I think that, like, don't ever underestimate the power and the value of becoming an independent woman before you get into a relationship and then you can actually surrender into that, because then you actually know that you don't need them. There's something really powerful about knowing that you don't need them, but that you want them and you want them to provide and take care of you.
Speaker 1:And that, like entering that space now, when I'm like dating and also in my business, like I'm so confident in my skillset, like I know what I offer, because the amount of like just what I put into not my own healing, but like into my skill set, into my education, into the results that I've seen with my clients and I know what I give my clients, like it's this is my life's work, like I've dedicated my life to this work.
Speaker 1:It's not a business, it's not just a career to me, it is literally my life purpose and I know what I'll give to those clients. So, going into that it's the same thing with relationship that if this isn't a good fit I won't take it personal, right, like going into a romantic relationship or a business relationship and you enter that with a level of confidence because you know what you bring to both of those right, and it's just, it's. It's so different where in the past, where I, when I was a business owner and I actually had a fitness studio, I was a personal trainer for years and I was a nutritionist for years I didn't have the confidence. I actually very much was what you were saying. Like I was like people pleasing and I was like overgiving and I felt weird asking for money and I wasn't even asking for much money back then.
Speaker 2:Like it's so crazy, I was asking for like next to nothing and I feel like changing your hours, like did you ever like change your hours? Like, oh, you can only meet at 7pm, or like 5am, oh, okay, great, like I was just constantly working. I was like what?
Speaker 1:the hell I'm so flexible. Some people wouldn't pay me and I would feel weird asking for the money, even though they had the sessions. Like, oh, I don't want to ask them for the money. Like so crazy to think back on that Cause. Now it's like I have. I'm proud of the, of what I charge, because I know what I give. I know how much like value that I give and what they receive from this program. That, yeah, I have absolutely no problem asking for money. But it was it, didn't it? I didn't get to this point by saying affirmations or reprogramming my subconscious mind. I did that by showing myself that I'm worthy of it, by developing the skill sets, by working on myself, by doing the inner work.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you mentioned something at the beginning of this. You talked about communication, and then I want to go into the mother thing that you said is, when it comes to communication, it is a muscle that I've had to flex. It is one of those things that I'm not good at it because I'm a coach muscle that I've had to flex Like it is one of those things that I'm not good at it because I'm a coach. No, I'm good at it because I have had a mentor, a sponsor in 12 step who has walked me through what to say in that text message when I really need to express how I feel about a particular situation or when I'm experiencing anxiety, before going in and negotiating my salary, like just this, like grounded, get to the point, calm, cool and collective. And I've practiced it with a coach that I hired, brianna, who's a good friend of mine, and you know, just just fire off a text message to her and then have her reply back to me. It's a skillset that I bring to my, my people. I coach and mentor. It's because and I've client said to me that it's like you're so good at being so feminine in your message while also being really fucking to the point Like this is what I need.
Speaker 2:And I was like I appreciate that feedback. I said, but it does, it did come with practice. And it came with practice not for me doing it solo. I did it with somebody so that they could read the message and be like, nope, cut that back and it comes up now. I mean I just kind of like I told you. I got on a phone call with somebody that I'm getting to know and wanted to express a couple of things that were on my mind based on past experience and fear, and I was trying to be direct but was being a little indirect, and so he summarized it for me. He's like is this what you're saying? And I was like it's amazing how you guys just summarize it.
Speaker 1:He's like you did it for me, the other day, you know, like it's just, it's practice and I think there's a great book on the on the um.
Speaker 2:There's a great book called mother hunger which talks about women and their relationships with their mothers, and you just said something that was really important. You said you know, getting back to the way things used to be and the role and the importance of being a wife and being a mother. You know I think I don't know who it was, but some guy just got a ton of shit for talking about this. I didn't watch the commencement speech but essentially what I took away from it was my own personal experience, not that he was condemning women and telling to be barefoot and pregnant. My own personal experience. Not that he was condemning women and telling to be barefoot and pregnant. I think what I observed from it was, um, when I heard it, as I said, oh, I read this book, mother hunger, and they talked about how a child's nervous system and attachment style can become secure If the mother is able to like, go skin to skin with the baby for like nine months and that's a shit ton of time on. A mom right Like this is a full-time job, 24, seven. It's not unpaid. You're not going to sleep Like um, you're going to have to put all your needs to the side, but it doesn't have to be that way, especially if you have a partner Right, and I think that there is a really important responsibility and I don't take it lightly, you know. I think it's one of those conversations that I've been having as I'm dating is to say do I really want to take on the responsibility of being a mom? It's a huge responsibility and one that unfortunately, for better or worse, my mom did an okay job, and there's times that I think she did an amazing job and there's times where I failed and, um, I think it's. I think it's okay that I've had that experience and it's what's actually created this purpose and passion.
Speaker 2:For me is it's hard to describe. You said this too it, this is your life's work. It is for me, really hard to describe what I do. I it's not that I'm a business coach, it's not that I'm a relationship coach. It's literally that I like look at your life and say, okay, what's bringing you joy, what's making you upset? What are your feelings? Where does this come from? Like, let's go into nervous system regulation and teaching you this small exercise by rubbing your ears. It's completely going to like calm you down, right.
Speaker 2:It's like this wide range of shit that the person comes back and goes. I learned more from you in six months of coaching than I did in three years of therapy. Like, how do I know myself so well? And I'm like it's because we're sharing our personal experiences of like what they can anticipate, or this was my experience. Here's what you might want to be cautious of. One of the things that I say to women, and men too, when I'm coaching them is don't be surprised, when you make the choice to do this inner work on yourself and create healthy relationships in your life, that everybody from your past, especially exes, will come back from the fucking woodwork and watch it. It'll happen within like two to three weeks and 99.9% of the time, alyssa, it happens, and they text me and they're like thank God you gave me a heads up, because that would have thrown me off my game.
Speaker 2:Um, and then the last thing I wanted to say is this concept of not needing. Not needing a partner, but rather wanting them. You know, I think the way that it was drilled into me as a young girl was you can't, it was coming from a place where you can't trust a man to be there for you. And when, in fact, that's not true, um, you know, I've I've had an amazing relationship with my father, who's consistently been there for me for years and years and years. Um, however, there is a swing that I'm seeing with women, myself included, where there's a hyper vigilance, there's a hyper independence. That's happening. And let me give you some examples that I'm seeing with clients.
Speaker 2:Uh, business owner comes to me and she's feeling stressed out, sex drive is low, wants to get back to being herself and wants to be able to have uncomfortable conversations when needed, in or outside of work. And she comes to me the other day and she's like I'm just feeling really disconnected. You know, like I feel, like I'm constantly doing, I'm the one who's leading, I'm the one who's constantly making the plans and checking the checklist and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. She's in her masculine right, but she's in her disempowered masculine Cause she excuse me, she's in her masculine the go, go go. And she's feeling a little disempowered. Masculine because it's a little bit of like aggressive, kind of like I'm fucking annoyed, like why do I have to be the one to do that? But it's also disempowered feminine because she's like why is this me, why do I have to be the one right, like kind of like a martyr, like oh my god what was me totally.
Speaker 2:And I said to her are you allowing your husband to be in his masculine? She's like I don't even know what that means. And I was like, well, does he ever offer to, like, take the trash out? I'll clean the plates when we're sitting on the couch and like, bring them into the other room. And she's like all the time. And I said, and what's your response? No, no, no.
Speaker 1:I can do it.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, I got it. You're carrying something heavy. It's clearly very heavy and too heavy for you, but you're no, no, no, I got it. I was like we got to swing in the opposite direction. We don't have to swing to the full extreme of opposite, where you're like, oh, just sit back and relax and everything's great he takes care of a lot.
Speaker 1:on him, right.
Speaker 2:But where are there moments where you can allow him to lead and and be in his empowered masculine where he makes the plans? I was on a date recently and somebody said, oh, how do we get there from there? And I said, oh, I think it's right here. And he goes well, I got it. He pulls it up on his phone and I started to direct him again and he goes, katie, I got it. And I was like, oh yeah, you got it. And I just like laughed. I was like, yeah, I don't, it's the hyper independence Because I've been independent for such a long time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know what it's, this need to still think that we need to prove ourselves. And it's like getting to that place where you feel so confident, like yeah, I know I can because I've already proven it. So confident like, yeah, I know I can because I've already proven it, but I can allow you to do that because you can already see that I can take care of myself. But I don't need to show you. There's nothing more attractive than like when a guy comes over and just starts doing handy shit for you. Absolutely I don't care how much money a guy makes, he's got to be handy, like he's got to be you know, and also my mentor says to me, my sponsor.
Speaker 2:She says, um, a guy can be an eight in terms of looks, personality, whatever. The moment he is chivalrous, the moment he just makes you feel like he's got you 10. And I'm like, yeah, that is so true, so so true. It's just like I said this to her the other day I go, I'm just tired, I'm like tired of taking care of myself.
Speaker 2:It was just having one of those like in my disempowered feminine energy, money wasn't flowing in the way I wanted to and I wanted to lean on that money but I couldn't And't and at the time and I just was like why is this happening to me? And she said what's going on? I said I'm just so tired of taking care of myself, I just want to like lean on someone just for like 30 seconds. She goes I know, honey, but you have to take care of yourself. I was like I know, but I've been taking care of yourself. I was like I know, but I've been taking care of myself for like 35 years. I'm 40, going on 41. That's a long time. And we just had a moment and laughed and I was like it's fine, I will take care of what I need to, but like I just want to lean on someone.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it's healthy to want that. You know, like it's. It's super healthy to want that and there's nothing wrong with wanting that Like there's. No, we don't want to shame that either, cause I don't think that's coming from a place of desperation to say that we would desire a partner to be there to support us and to help us when you've been single for so long. I don't have them often, but I do have moments like that. I've been a single mom for 15 years. I've raised my daughter on my own. I would absolutely love for a partner like I, you know, like just to help with help with things, anything right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, not to have to make all the decisions all the time. So there's nothing wrong with desiring that and wanting that and allowing ourselves sometimes to be in the pity If we know that we're not going to stay there. It's like when we attach to the victim mindset and the victim's story is, when it becomes unhealthy, when that becomes our identity, like I'm the victim, poor me, and I was there. I'm a single mom, poor me, I'm a victim and I used to play that card but that was very disempowering. And then I made the decision to stop being that, because I can't attract abundance into my life if I identify with being a struggling single mom. So I let go of that identity.
Speaker 1:Not to say that I don't have moments still where I'm like, fuck, it would be nice to have someone take care of this. Of course we're going to have moments like that. That's a good thing. It means that we have space and we desire a partner and we're going to allow them to do that. So, yeah, I think that's really healthy. There's a healthy balance, for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree with you. I think, like I said, it was just a moment. It was just one of those moments where you're like it would be nice to just exhale and have someone be like it's okay, it's gonna be okay, you know, and it's okay, it'll come, you know. I feel like it's inevitable, whereas, like, whether it's the relationship or the money in business, it's inevitable that it's going to happen. It's just a matter of trusting enough to say. There's a lot of uncertainty right now and I'm not sure how I'm going to get from here to there, but I'm willing to to trust and I I heard a, I saw a meme the other. It said I'm all for. I hear I'm supposed to let Jesus take the wheel, but it seems he's been off-roading.
Speaker 1:I actually saw that too, I was like yeah, Jesus is off-roading right now.
Speaker 1:That's really true. And you know what? Also I want to talk I want to touch on this too, because this has just really helped me and it's been really powerful is we have to understand that, while, yes, we may want to like be able to be more in our feminine, relax more into our feminine, we might have this like picture in our head of how we want things to be, and also we get conditioned by, like everything that we're seeing on social media of how a woman should be, how a man should be. Keep in mind that we all have a unique divine blueprint that we come in here with. That's why, for me, nothing's been more powerful than really understanding my natal chart, getting a natal chart reading, understanding my astrology what I actually came in here to do also my human design, and in my chart I have a lot of Mars energy, Like I have actually a lot of leadership energy. So my North node is Aries, which means I'm supposed to step into a leadership role when you have a North node in Aries.
Speaker 1:Your past life was Libra, meaning you had many past lives in the sign of Libra, which is about relationship and balance. So she had told me when I got this reading. She's like you've mastered relationships and compromise in the past. She goes you're still going to take that with you, but relationships aren't going to be the forefront for you, the most important thing in this life. She goes, it's going to be your purpose and your mission. And like understanding, that actually helped me feel less guilt, because I almost felt guilty. I'm like, should I have such a strong desire to like, like my honestly, like my purpose and my work is like everything to me, like just just like my daughter is, but like I would say, just like equally, that's how I'm able to provide and take care of my daughter is my purpose.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I I struggled with that for a while, Like almost like I felt like it was selfish. And she's like you are actually meant to be more selfish in this life because you've mastered compromise in the past, and that was something that I struggled with in the beginning. I really, really struggled with compromise in my relationships and losing myself in relationships and becoming enmeshed and becoming enmeshed, and now I've had to break that pattern of codependency and really step into my own independence so that I can be in an interdependent relationship. But yeah, so it's important to like explore these areas too, because it's not black and white Like. It's really important to understand, like what did we come in here to accomplish and to do in this lifetime? And for some people, that is being in a marriage and being focused with your kids and not working like that might be your purpose in this life, and for other people it will be a career.
Speaker 2:And to your point, there's no reason to shame or shun anybody for the purpose that they're living out because it's so different. I love that you touched upon human design and astrology. I feel like I have some work to do around astrology. I'm still learning about human design, but I do feel like when I learned that I was a manifesting generator and the different characteristics within that, it just made so much sense that I have a lot of ideas. I have a hard time picking those ideas and there are many things that I am here and leading.
Speaker 2:I'm here to do and lead those conversations about and it may might make no sense. Why to someone else? Why sex, business, money, uh, hormonal health, like has anything to do with anything, except it makes perfect sense to me and it makes perfect sense to my clients when they realize, oh, I'm a recovering perfectionist and codependent who cares about what other people think and I'm trying to run a business and I'm trying to be in a relationship while also have a great relationship with myself, but I'm stressed out and overwhelmed and sometimes I feel stuck, you know, and it's like those are my people, I'm like cause.
Speaker 2:That was me, it sometimes still is, you know, and I can share those moments. Um, and I think it's interesting too that you you mentioned like, you're here to lead, and I listened to a podcast the other day with Matthew Hussey and Lewis house and they were talking about relationships and Lewis had mentioned that when he was first getting into his relationship with his now fiance, one of the things that he she had asked him is what are your priorities, what are your top three priorities? And he said you're not going to like this, but three go like this, and I think it was taking care of himself, like financially, emotionally, spiritually, like putting himself first, um, physically, like working out. Second was purpose, because if you can't, if one has to go before two cause, otherwise he can't show up in his best, as his best self. And three is relationship, because if he's showing up as his best self, he's living out his purpose. Automatically he is able to show up in romantic relationships or just relationships in general, and they, the three, feed into each other.
Speaker 2:And I, that was the first time I had heard that and the first time that I was like that is 100% the season that I'm in, which is let me be me, let me go live out my purpose, but be there with me to like ride this ride Right and you will get the best version of me. My arms will be open, my heart will be over, my legs will be open, everything will be open because I will feel safe enough to just be myself and be able to help other people without compromising my own needs and compromising the love that I'm about to share with someone else. So I think it's incredible that I always laugh when we get on these podcasts with you and I are like we'll do a coaching session together, because we have a lot in common, and it's no wonder why Kayla introduced us because it's kind of crazy.
Speaker 2:Like every time, I'm like, oh, yeah, that makes sense why she's feeling like relationships are kind of quote-unquote not lower priority, but like aren't as high as some of the others, and I love that. We share that. That too totally.
Speaker 1:I know I feel like I'm just getting together with like a high school girlfriend whenever we have these conversations. Yeah, it's awesome. A lot of time passes without seeing each other.
Speaker 2:but like, it's almost like picks up right where you left off and talk about the power of the internet and the power of social media and the power of getting in coaching groups. Cause that's what's happening. Kayla got into a coaching group, met you, she met me. It's like she was like you two need to meet.
Speaker 1:I'm so glad she connected us. Why don't you share a little bit about your coaching group and where people can find you and how they can work with you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely so. If you want to check out my podcast Anything for Love, it's on Spotify and iTunes and you can follow me on Instagram, kgkatiegrimes. I would really encourage you. If you're listening to this podcast and something I said stuck with you, please DM me. It's me on the other end, so you can just send me a message and I'm going to tell you how much I appreciate you sending that message, because words of affirmation are definitely a love language and it keeps my purpose. It fuels my purpose is when I hear that what I'm saying actually matters to someone, and then in terms of my coaching group.
Speaker 2:So right now, what we're doing is twofold. One is called the energetic entrepreneur. It's for busy female business owners who got a lot on their plates and they're feeling a little stressed, overwhelmed, stuck trying to reach their goals, and what we're finding is a lot of the women that are there are wanting to make more money, but there's personal goal that they're trying to achieve. Maybe it's a losing weight, maybe it is to have better orgasms. I mean, we're seeing the gamut of what people are looking for and so we're doing Kayla and I who I was just talking about. I've hired her onto the team and we are doing a four-week program to just walk everybody through an initial assessment and then giving them accountability and steps that they can take throughout the four weeks to decrease their stress, and we actually give them scores so they can see how much progress they've made in four weeks, which is really incredible.
Speaker 2:And then we're doing the same thing called the energetic relationships, and it's for women who are in relationships or trying to get into relationships and are feeling similarly, like there might be some overwhelm or they're not feeling as connected to themselves or their partner and are really wanting to dramatically change that.
Speaker 2:And what we're seeing is we can do that in four weeks, which is pretty cool. So there's a lot of one-on-one attention, even though there's like no group calls, it's only a text message support, but it's like very personalized, very customized, and it's under $200 US, which is incredible, like it's not going to be that way for long, because we're just noticing we're giving so much and people are seeing really fast results. But I'm really, really excited about it and, yeah, that's where we're starting everybody. And then we're moving people into sex, love and money, which is a group program similar to kind of how yours is, where they can have coaching calls and be able to talk about sex, talk about love, talk about money, talk about orgasms, like whatever we want to talk about. Um, just come into community with each other as women and share what we need and want and how to have uncomfortable conversations or get back to those orgasms or like whatever I think I've said orgasm like four times.
Speaker 2:but clearly it's a hot topic within the group, but yeah, that's it Amazing.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, katie, and I'm sure we're going to have more of these conversations, I'm sure of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the last thing I'll say too, if anybody, if it resonated with anyone you can certainly message me on Instagram If you want to come into one of those groups. If not, you can email support at katigrimescom. That's the best way to get in touch with us. And, yeah, really thank you for creating this platform. I think that the work that you're doing really does matter and I know I've gotten a behind the scenes look at what that really looks like and I'm honored and I'm glad that we're on slower paths and journeys. So, yes, I will do this again and you can come online and we'll just keep sharing the message. Awesome, thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you.