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Real Life Ministry
AI And Human Dignity | Special Interview with a Tech Savvy Pastor: Miles DeBenedictus | Part 2 of 2
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We talk through the real ethical questions behind artificial intelligence and transhumanism, and why the fight is ultimately about what a human person is. We leave with a sober but hopeful Christian worldview that uses technology for human flourishing without treating machines like people.
• Miles’s doctoral focus on AI ethics and apologetics
• A conflict of anthropologies shaping AI development
• Transhumanism and the promise of digital immortality
• Why AI can mimic consciousness without being conscious
• The risks of treating chatbots and avatars like persons
• Helpful uses of AI for learning and theological debate
• Human dignity grounded in the image of God
• Neural implants, genetic enhancement, and where wisdom says no
• Parenting and practical guardrails for tech use
• AI in warfare, drones, and the danger of removing humans from the loop
• Hope over fear and an optimistic future in Christ
Check Out My Stuff On Substack. If You Just Look For Pastor Miles At Substack, You’ll Find Articles That I’ve Written. Or If You Go To My Church Website, CCchurch.com Is Where All Of My Messages Are. Pastor Miles Is Where All The X Is.
Welcome And Show Mission
SPEAKER_01Welcome to Real Life for Listening to Real Life dedicated to teaching and encouraging crypto to take off live free. Please let's share with others. Your host today is Ryan McDu, the Bible teacher of content after entrepreneurs that are making a donation at Real Life Joint Ministry as we dive into various topics while you're literally check out some of our episodes values and definitely positive impact and educate and encourage crypto dive into it. Live free and live strong.
Why Christians Should Study AI
SPEAKER_02All right, Miles, welcome back to another episode. Thanks for being with us. How are you doing today?
SPEAKER_00Doing great. Glad to be with you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, thanks for jumping in on that last podcast. That was really, really good. So uh for our listeners listening in, Miles is a pastor in California. We connected through Larry Osborne out there and spent a couple days with a dozen pastors, um, great leaders uh from around the country. And Miles came in to kind of do a special little um briefing that really shared about kind of what's going on in the tech world. And uh Miles is a pastor, he's got a great family. Um, we have some similar journeys together. And um, if you didn't listen to the last podcast, listen to it. But in this podcast, Miles, I was hoping to cover just some of the the conversations from a pastoral standpoint, uh, ethics standpoint, um, and AI. And so technology and AI, and the big concern is is like, will will AI take over the world, how it, how we interface with it from a from a Christian worldview perspective and all that. So I'll just kind of open it up. What are your your thoughts on this and maybe share with our listeners a little bit about what you're doing with your doctoral work um over at Southern?
Conflicting Views Of Human Nature
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I um I started in a doctorate of ministry program, you know, within the theological seminaries, you have doctorate ministry, it's kind of a professional degree, and then you have PhD, which is more of an academic degree. And I started in the doctor doctorate of ministry program studying apologetics. That's been a passion of mine for a long time. And so I've always been interested in the ethical and the apologetic, sort of how do you reason the faith to other people, explain it to people who don't have an understanding of the Bible. And then I shifted into the PhD work in ethics, focusing on artificial intelligence ethics. And these two things kind of meld together because one of the things you talk a lot about in the area of apologetics has to do with the question that King David asks in Psalm 8, what is man? You know, you talk about anthropology. And you may remember when I came in and shared with a group of pastors at Larry's gathering, I shared that my one of my big concerns about this discussion around AI has to do with anthropology. I think what we're facing is a a conflict of anthropologies. And let me explain what I mean by that. A lot of the people that are developing these tools that are really phenomenal tools, they almost seem like magic when you're using AI and it answers questions like a human and it's really, really smart. And now you can have actual conversations in audio. You just talk with them and they talk with you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, the people that are developing these technologies, for the most part, they are naturalists. They do not have a supernatural worldview or a theological worldview. They believe that everything happened by evolutionary process, which means that consciousness to them is a product of evolution, that at some point of neurological complexity, consciousness emerges. And so they believe that they're not just creating a tool, a technological tool, they believe they're creating the next level of consciousness, the evolution of consciousness. And so, for a number of people who are in the tech industry building these technologies, they are what are referred to as transhumanists. And so they think that ultimately technology is going to surpass humans, and they believe that at some point they're not going to, they're not just going to achieve what's called artificial general intelligence, where technology can do all the different general tasks that you and I can do, but artificial superintelligence, where it is smarter than any human and it surpasses us.
SPEAKER_02So this is this is where you get the ideas of merging like machine and man, and then machine, yeah. And so then you become like, oh, wow.
SPEAKER_00Or even like they there's certain futurists that are in these areas. One of them is an older gentleman by the name of Ray Kurtzwild, he works for Google. He believes at some point in the future you will be able to upload your consciousness into artificial intelligence, and so you'll achieve what's called digital immortality, not physical immortality, but digital immortality. Uh now, obviously, we Christians have a different anthropology. We believe that we are created in God's image, Genesis chapter 1, verses 26 through 28. And we were given a commission and a mandate from God to fill the earth and subdue it. So for us, every technology is a tool that should be used for us to bring greater human freedom and greater human flourishing. And so we should look at whatever tool is available to us, from the wheel to the blade to you know the printing press to artificial intelligence as a tool that should be used to further human freedom and further human flourishing in our partnership with God. So this is a real difference in anthropologies. We believe they're created in God's image and consciousness is divinely derived. It's given to us by God. And the other side of the coin is those who are developing these technologies who think that no, they're creating the next level of conscious evolution and that these things will surpass us. And so those two worldviews are distinctly different, and we Christians need to understand the difference and be able to articulate why the Christian worldview is a better worldview that leads to more human flourishing. And and I these are real real concerns for me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Man, so this up kind of uploading your
Mind Uploading And Digital Immortality
SPEAKER_02human consciousness. I'm kind of stuck on that. So it's like digital immortality, life extension. So the transhumanists see mind uploading as a way to keep the person's memories, personality in the going. So it would be like a backup preservation, like a mind file of sorts. So this is how how could this be good and how could this be bad?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So I mean, I don't see the concept of uploading your consciousness into AI to be in any way good.
SPEAKER_02Um But but you're but you're but you've downloaded, you you've downloaded an entire everything you've ever taught, and people could interact with an AI tool to access what you would think.
SPEAKER_00I it is frightening. I mean, I have a website, you're absolutely right. It's called AskPastorMiles.com. Right. And I've taken I've taken all of my digital data from over a decade and I've turned it into a system where someone can have a conversation with a digital version of me as it relates to theology. So they could ask me theological questions, and my digital avatar will effectively answer those questions. So it's it's very challenging. There we're trying to navigate things that are completely uncharted, like we're pioneering things that are remarkable. Um, so we do have to try to figure out um as long as these things are tools that I think are be again used to bring human freedom and human flourishing, great. But when these things are used as oppressive taskmasters, we should be aware of kind of the the Luciferian mindset behind that. I just think we we have to be very careful about how we navigate this stuff.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I saw a music video the other day. I think the guy's name is Evan Horn Horner. And he's he's a musician out of Surprise, Arizona. He's hit a national stage uh with Charles Wesley Gooden. He's like an indie rock guy, a mixture between Van Morrison, Ray Lamontang, uh some old soul kind of rock. And he's got this song called Mr. Myers, and the video is really weird because it's a sad narrative song about an older man whose wife dies and who is struggling with loneliness and pain, and uh where he's at the end of his life, and there's this dramatic kind of story in the video where his memories and his grief uh are basically what he seems to be doing in the song is debating on whether he's gonna upload her memories and then have an AI conversation with his old wife and use it as a form of therapy. I saw that video and I was like, oh my gosh, that's strange.
SPEAKER_00Well, it would be strange if we were living like 30 years ago, and now all of a sudden it's an actual like it would be a science fiction novel or movie 30 years ago, and now it's something where it's actually plausible in a very concerning sort of way. I mean, there are companies like a company called Replica and another called Character that you can basically build avatars of humans and maybe even deceased humans. And to be honest with you, this guy I mentioned, Ray Kurzweil, he had a great relationship with his dad. His dad was an amazing musician. In fact, when you see Kurzweil pianos, pianos, that's Kurzweil. And Ray Kurzweil would love to be able to bring back the digital version of his father and be able to communicate with him.
SPEAKER_02So, like, but and that's happening. That's that's that's a possibility, very much so, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00Well, but we need to recognize like I do not think that these systems can become conscious. They are computer systems that are really good at the mimicry of consciousness, but they're not conscious. And so we should not misunderstand them as being conscious, nor should we conclude that they are persons. And you know, the heads of some of these big companies like OpenAI and Anthropic, they are questioning whether or not these systems might be conscious, and then they're talking about giving them conferring rights upon them so that these systems have the same level of rights that that we do. It's like, well, no, I think we're crossing into areas that are outside the bonds of bounds of what these things are, and we should recognize that. That's when you get into the unethical uses of these tools.
SPEAKER_02I'm wondering if it's gonna be like a form of therapy in the
Avatars For The Living And Dead
SPEAKER_02future.
SPEAKER_00Like sadly, it's already been used that way. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You know, because like you go to you go to Grok or you go to whatever, there's like kids' modes, and there's all these different, and then there's these avatars, and and you were there's a good and a bad. Like the good is is that there are some really unbelievable learning opportunities for somebody using AI. I mean, I I use AI at times as almost like a theological like fighting partner, like to discuss interlocutor. Absolutely. Do you know what I mean? Like, I never I've like I couldn't the I mean the only other alternative is just to find live guys, obviously, that can debate with me um about issues, but I'll be like, give me a counterpoint on the idea of replacement theology or fulfillment theology, and then it spits out all these things, and I'm like, oh my goodness, that was good.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, I think that people need to recognize, and I say this every time I share on these subjects, I say the AI that you're using today is the worst AI you will ever use. It just gets better and better and better. And the scary part about that is it's already really good.
SPEAKER_02It's already really good. Yeah, it's really, really, really good. So there's an ethical there's so there's a so there's a worldview though that's happening. So you have a some kind of agenda where we're moving and migrating towards transhumanism. Speak to that for a moment because and then you get the guys in the uh prophecy perspectives, you know, they're like, oh, well, this will be like the days of Noah, you know, like this crossbreed between Nephilim and you know, like fallen angels and uh uh human beings. So this is where we're heading, and this is a sign of the time where we're moving towards kind of this hybrid of humanity. Um, speak to that just for a moment.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think that it's important to recognize that uh the Christian believes that humans are the only creation of God that bears God's image. And so they are distinct and unique and have a dignity that is greater than any other conscious being. So because we are imprinted with the image of God, we're totally different. Uh and Christians need to argue for that because there is the pillar to begin to see these systems that are going to be able to surpass us in the ability to recall information, in the ability to create information, like the speed at which they can work and create information. They they just end up being better than us, but that doesn't mean that they are better than us from a dignity standpoint. Humans always need to be seen as the the pinnacle or the the center of what God has
AI As Tutor And Debate Partner
SPEAKER_00made. Now that may seem like a like a like a crazy way to say it because it's like, oh, well, you just think humans are better than everything. Well, yes, God, God's the one who said, I made you in my image. So he we bear the image of God. So we we just have to argue for that being distinct and important because there's going to be an impulse to see these systems as better than and the replacement for. And this is this is kind of what some of these people are pushing for. And then you get into the the bioethical questions of you know, yes, there are ways in which now using AI technology, we can change genetic makeup and structure of humans to make them smarter, faster, taller, you know, better looking, all these different things. Um, but should we? You know, is that actually how we should use these tools? And then there's going to be the question of merging with technology. You know, already Elon Musk has a company called Neuralink where you can implant a chip in your head and it has electrodes that go into the brain. And there's some amazing things that you can do with this. Like we can give people who are quadruplegics the ability to be able to use a computer with their brain. It's it's really amazing. But there may come a point in time. See, right now, the communication is one way. The brain is able to communicate to the computer. The computer is not yet able to communicate to the brain. But what if there does come a day where we can just upload information directly into the brain and make you smarter? And now you have access with your brain to all of human data through artificial intelligence. So then you get into other ethical questions of whether or not that is right or good, or should we do that?
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Or then you get into the question of if that's the case, will the system be able to read what your thoughts are? And then we can have thought control. We can say you're not allowed to think about those things because we can read your thoughts. And all this may sound fanciful and like fiction, but we're we're definitely moving in that direction.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah.
Human Dignity Versus Machine Performance
SPEAKER_02You know, I've got a uh one of my favorite books is uh Christian Ethics by Dr. Grudom. Grudom is a great per personal friend of mine, he's been on this podcast before. Um world-class theologian. And if he was redoing books, he'd probably be updating all the AI stuff and the transhumanism trend. So what do you think on and uh what do you again? What do you think about that movement though? The the two passages I'm referencing is one from Jesus in the New Testament. I think it's in the the Olivet discourse in the Gospel of Matthew, where Jesus says, you know, as it was in the days of Noah, so it will be in the end, and something along those lines I'm paraphrasing. And then it's a reference back to, I believe, you know, the days of Noah back uh right before the flood. There's this describe describing of the condition of mankind, and they had intermingled into fallen angels uh created, you know, um by God fallen in some capacity to marry and you know whatnot. And so I do personally do hold to the position of the Nephilim seem to be some kind of obscure uh, you know, mention multiple times in the Bible, you know, and I've got friends that are like, no, those are like those aren't fallen angels intermarried. I'm like, I I I'm just gonna decide I think they are. So with that perspective, and I don't know where you hold to that, if you'll clarify that, but it it could we be seeing some of that? Like this is it's not the fallen angels, but it's like demonic activity where we're kind of moving towards this transhumanism, and it's bogus kind of concepts, but it's not actually bogus concepts, it's actually it is kind of the trend.
SPEAKER_00I think that so that that is a really interesting passage of scripture. In fact, I was just referencing it yesterday in my message at my church. Um, I I would tend to lean in the direction that you do as well on the sons of God in Genesis chapter six. The word in the Hebrew is Ben Elohim, and the sons of God Ben Elohim is used in other places to speak about angels. And so I I would say there's two predominant views about that passage. Some people try to interpret it, the son interpret the sons of God as being the godly line of Seth,
Neuralink And The Ethics Of Enhancement
SPEAKER_00and the daughters of Ben being the ungodly lines of man. I don't think that that jives really well with ancient ancient Near Eastern literature, where Ben Elohim seems to be angels. So a little bit of kind of context would be, I think, helpful and important. Man created in God's image has a capacity that angels do not have. You know, there are other conscious beings in God's creation, created order that are advanced of consciousness, um, and that would be angels. And there's all kinds of different kinds of angels that we know of, from cherubim to seraphim and so forth. But these angelic beings have an advanced constant consciousness. But Jesus says in the gospels they do not marry or are given in marriage, so they don't procreate. Only humans have the capacity for procreation, and then not only that, humans are embodied souls. See, I see their consciousness as being the soul. So we are embodied souls, and these other spirits, these angels, they're not embodied souls in the same way that we are. So we are lower than them in hierarchy and rank, and that's created order, but we are greater than them because we bear the image of God and we have a creative and procreative capacity that they don't have. So they can't create tools and things like we can, and they can't procreate more of them. So angels are not making more angels, and yet it sure seems like in Genesis chapter six that these spiritual beings did try to do some form of procreation with humanity and created some sort of weird uh, you know, something weird came from it. Nephilim is what we're we're talking about. Yeah, and some sort of intermixing of these things, which is a remarkable and strange thing to talk about. And I know that some people just get totally weirded out by that. You know, we're just we're just saying what the Bible speaks about and trying to interpret it properly.
SPEAKER_02So and then that consistent in that consistent line through scripture where there's these giants in the land and all that, and again, I don't want to get so stuck on that major point, but I again there is this crop, there's a contamination of the human race, you know, that was problematic. And so you are we going back to the days of Noah with this transhumanism agenda.
SPEAKER_00One of the ways one of the ways in which I think we're going back to the days of Noah, um, during the days of Noah, this was prior to Babel in Genesis chapter 11. So humanity had one language, and the very next verse after it talks about the sons of God in Genesis 6, it says that that God saw the wickedness of man that it was great in the earth, and every intent of his thoughts was only evil continually. So man, after the fall, after he has the knowledge of good and evil from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, the things that man creates tend towards evil because the thoughts of his heart are only evil continually. And then when you go to Genesis chapter 11 and you see the Tower of Babel, there in Genesis chapter 11, when God looks at the situation of what they're seeking to build, he says, now nothing will be withheld from them. I think that the creative capacity of humanity created in God's image does not have limits. I think that we basically have an infinite creative capacity when we're united under one language. But after the fall, everything we create is evil. And so now, post-20th century, because of artificial intelligence, we've basically done away with Babel through binary, through binary information. We now have one language and we are creating tools that enable us to do some pretty remarkable and amazing things. The upper limits of our creative capacity, we don't even we don't even fully know. So that's one way in which we're living in a similar time to the days of Noah. We can do all kinds of wicked things. Do I think? That there are spiritual entities, principalities, and powers that are seeking to do um things that are totally against God's command and their estate where they're to remain. You know, this is what you read of in in um Peter's writings in first and second Peter and also in Jude. Uh do I think that that's happening today? I sure do. Like, I I don't think that they're extraterrestrial aliens, but I do think they're interdimensional beings. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's that's kind of where I I I would fall too. I um with the whole alien conversation, I'm like, you know, I don't I don't believe in aliens, I believe in angels and demons. And so could there be a demonic manifestation, you know, could
Parenting Tech Wisdom And Guardrails
SPEAKER_02you know, like you see in the Bible where angels appear as people, you know, so um so you know, in the in the biblical framework, I'm like, no, no, no, I think there's angels and demons and whatnot. But I I think jumping back to the conversation on the trend towards transhumanism, you know, this how fast do you see this coming? Where, you know, I mean, right now I've got a pair of Ray-Ban glasses that have all this technology that I'm actually I'm curious in buying because I'm like, dude, I like I'm like a quail hunter and I want to film some of the hunts. And then I understand as well, like my my buddy, the executive pastor, has got a pair, and I'm kind of like, dude, that seems really cool. And so it's like one more component to this movement towards this, you know. And then I've got a brother who's got Parkinson's, and they've got he's got, you know, the deep brain stimulation going on in his brain to help him. And I'm seeing the advancements of technology, and it does help him. I'm seeing these advancements, and I'm like, we're moving there quick, but how quick do you think we're moving towards transhumanism and at what level?
SPEAKER_00Well, I think things are moving at an accelerated pace and faster than we probably would have imagined, even just like five or 10 years ago. So I have no idea the exact timing, but I think that things are gonna move much faster than we realized. We're gonna see advancements that we couldn't have imagined even just like 10 years ago. And and I keep coming back to the fact that when these things are used as tools to enable humanity to be free and to flourish, they're great. So if we can use these tools to get rid of things like Parkinson's and ALS and all these other affordable things, then praise God, let's let's do that. If we can if we can give sight to people who are blind, then that that would be awesome. But when we do need to use every tool with wisdom. And so the technology and the things that humanity has to create going all the all the way back to the earliest tools that we've been able to create, we should use those for freedom and for flourishing, and we should use them with wisdom. And that does mean there's certain things that we should say no to. Like if we can use this technology to make superhumans genetically, I think we should say no to that. Oh, yeah. Um so because then you get into the discussion of eugenics, and these things basically it's evil. So so yeah, we we do need to be very wiz wise in how we approach this and think through it consciously that we're we're making decisions with wisdom and not just like, hey, this this looks like fun, let's try it.
SPEAKER_02Well, and I think the concerning thing that people need to be aware of of because you're when you talk about the tech giants that are building these systems, it's not like millions, right? Like there's some uh there's like my guess is like a handful of like leading people that are making these decisions and implementing these systems, and based on what we know, they're not operating with the Christian worldview. Is that fair?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, I'm very grateful that you know, most of these people are in Silicon Valley in California. Um, and I am grateful that there are some strong Christian witnesses there in that area, but predominantly the worldview that the these people hold is is mostly naturalistic and not theistic. Um so so yeah, and they also don't have the same ethical model that we are running from. You know, we we run from a biblical uh morality based upon the Ten Commandments and all of what we have in the scriptures. And for the most part, these individuals are functioning from kind of a secular humanistic enlightenment ethic, which is mostly good. Like it's better than alternatives, but it's not it's not the right ethic. The right ethic is the biblical ethic.
SPEAKER_02Well, I mean like I've read articles about you know concerts being sold out with AI and holograms in different parts of the world. I've seen on Spotify, I've seen on Apple, trending top musicians. It's all AI, it's not even a real artist. Now, obviously, there was a real person behind it. And then I've read articles about you know kids that commit suicide because mom took their AI tools and their chatbots and their avatars, and they're devastated because they thought that they had some relationship, and then you have an entire sexual revolution that's tied to technology now, and so there's definitely this movement towards it's like almost wanting to personalize it. Yeah, I mean, look, we have Alexa, like I I like she's a real person, you know, and I and I know that I don't think Alexa was a major success, but I it's definitely moving in that direction in every household, you know, that has enough money to have access to technology, you know.
SPEAKER_00I think again this goes back to wisdom in a big way. You know, my my kids, we haven't allowed our kids to have social media, you know. A couple times we've had the we've had the conversations that are kind of a we're it's like a negotiation from our our son trying to tell us why he should have Instagram. It's like, well, no, I I don't think it's good for you, so I'm gonna say and how old are you?
SPEAKER_02How old are you?
SPEAKER_00My oldest is 17. And so we told him I said, you know, you'll be 18 soon enough and you can make your own decision. But for now, I'm gonna make my I'm gonna make the decision for you. I just don't think it's it's beneficial or helpful. And I think that there's certain AI tools that also it's like you may not have the wisdom enough to know how to use this properly. And um, so helping people learn how to use things properly is gonna be really important.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02Miles, you're a good dad, you're a good pastor. I'm proud of you. I mean, as a guy who's you know so pro-technology and you know, just pumping the brakes on your kids, I'm sure they don't like that, but um I'm sure that that they will appreciate it later. And it I hope so. I hope you're gonna have to have a good transition plan for them because that world by the time that uh they turn you know, you and I we grew up just fine without Instagram, so I think that'll be oh yeah, yeah. I I have a I'm very pro technology, love it, but I also tell people look, when I went to seminary, I made a decisive decision. I'm gonna toss my cell phone for three years, and I I'll be fine. And people panicked, they thought I was like going crazy, and I'm like, I'll be fine. And I rode my bike to the train station, Dart Rail in Dallas, jumped on the train, was downtown Dallas up to 10, 11 o'clock at night, rode a train back. It was fine, it's fine, it was good, it was great, you know? There you go.
SPEAKER_00You made
AI In Warfare Drones And Autonomy
SPEAKER_00it.
SPEAKER_02I made it, I stayed focused and did well in seminary. So talk to me, talk to me about uh just kind of like the military for a second. Where do you see some of this stuff? And I know we we're running out of time, but go ahead and if you don't mind, just share a little bit about kind of like some of the things that could be coming because I hear all sorts of conversations as how technology's like, you know, we're doing massive drone uh stuff and trying to link AI with drones and all that. So speak just kind of from a kind of world defense side and technology.
SPEAKER_00I mean, there are major companies, probably the most well known is Palantir. Uh Palantir is an artificial intelligence system you know company that is being used by the Department of War in the US to be able to plan and execute military work. And then also, because of everything that's happened in Ukraine over the last several years, there's been a revolutionary revolution in military affairs. It's called RNA. The revolution in military affairs has really moved in the direction of drone technology. So you're gonna have artificial intelligence and drone technology working significantly, and it's gonna be side by side with human operators. So the human operators in the military are gonna have almost superhuman capacities to be able to see the battlefield and to execute military moves in pretty remarkable ways. Um, there are a lot of concerns around this, and there are a lot of issues, and you may have seen in the news in the last few months the argument between one of the major foundation companies for artificial intelligence is the anthropic. So there is a big, you know, conflict between Anthropic and the Department of War and how their systems would be used for warfare. And this was right before everything started in Iran. And so, yeah, there are some amazing ways in which these technologies are going to be used in autonomous weapons and the speed of decision making on the battlefield. Uh, and then cyber warfare and offense and defense is going to be pretty insane in these areas. So these tools are already being used effectively, and the way that they're going to be used even more is going to increase. Um, there are a lot of major ethical concerns in this, and this is like an entire area of the AI industry is in the ethics of warfare around AI. And there are a lot of concerns with it. I mean, obviously, I'm an American and I want America to continue to be a superpower. And I think that AI is going to be really important in that. But at the same time, I want us to have very judicious and wise use of this stuff because um, you know, giving artificial intelligence the autonomy to function in warfare, I think, could have a lot of downside risks. Yeah. And so we should be we should be super sober sober minded and circumspect in how we do this. So removing the human from the loop is going to be a real danger.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So if you were a decision maker on federal government spending when it comes to military and national security, do you buy jets or do you buy lots of drones and spend money on AI and drones?
SPEAKER_00I think for the very near future, and probably for a pretty good amount of time over the next few decades, probably, you're going to see human operators working side by side with artificial intelligence operators. Yeah. It's a really great company. And I'm very interested in this company in Costa Mesa, California called Andoril. And Andoril is creating these AI jets that basically fly with human-operative jets. So it's basically like the AI jets are like the wingman of the human-operated jets. So you have a you have a uh F-35 flown by a human, and they have like maybe four or five drones that are flying with them in combat. Like there are some amazing things that we are developing and using drones that could go the speed of a jet. They're jets, yeah. They're already building these, they'll be being done by Andoril pretty soon. And um, it's it's pretty amazing technology. And the idea is that one human operator flying an F-35 will have like three or four or five drones that are flying with him as kind of like up in front of the battlefield. Yeah. And he is the one conducting what's taking place. But all that to say, like every technology in human history has been used to give power to a certain group of people. So look at the Assyrians in the eighth century. The eighth century BC, the Assyrians dominated the world through Sargon and Sennacharev and Tiglath Pelezr, these different kings that are known in antiquity. And why did they dominate? Well, one of the reasons they dominated was the chariot. And they they had the ability that other people didn't have. So when new technologies come, they give the holder of those new technologies the ability to be the dominant power. And America has had the dominant power for the last 80 years because of the nuclear bomb. And now when you get into AI, you know, America is wanting to be the dominant power and currently is in the area of AI. The next major battle between superpowers will probably be between China and the United States, and it will have everything to do with artificial intelligence. But my concern is when the technologies we have are used primarily primarily for warfare, I think that that is a dangerous place to go to.
SPEAKER_02Well, we'll have to do another topic another day. Because, you know, previously I've said one of the greatest threats for American peace and prosperity is Islam. And now I would say it's maybe it's AI. And if you if you brought in Islam and AI together, boy, we would be in big, big trouble, you know, if if uh and it looks like you know China is our greatest competitor with AI and the technology.
SPEAKER_00Well, I will say some of the some of the biggest investors in artificial intelligence are Saudi Arabia, the UAE. And they are wanting to do a lot of building of AI data centers. And so you you can be certain that Islam will not not be involved in all of this as we go forward. They'll certainly be involved in all of that.
SPEAKER_02So everybody knows this is the future. We've got to move there quick. You know, I mean Phoenix, Arizona, I don't know if you know this or not, but we have TSMC. Yeah, and we're building some of the largest chip fabs in the country right here. And so we're we are said to be by some uh the the new micro Silicon Valley is what some people have said. Of course, that's you know, high hopes, but nonetheless, a lot of sand out there. There's a lot of sand. Yeah, I don't know how we're gonna do it with water. We'll we'll have to see. But Lord Willie, I I've or I heard that we're, you know, typically weather cycles and 50 gear runs. And according to the climatologists of the state, we're in the beginnings of a wet season. So anyway. Um, Miles, thank you so much for the time together. Anything else you want to share with our listeners? Um, things that you might be working on, or just want to encourage uh people as it pertains to kind of navigating the Christian faith and a fast-changing technological culture.
Hope Over Fear And Where To Follow
SPEAKER_00I mean, one of the primary things that I would say is what Paul says to Timothy God has not given us a spirit of fear and power and love and a sound mind. And so I think we should be very sober-minded in these things. We should recognize uh based on the view that we have of eschatology, even if you don't hold a premillennial eschatology like you and I hold, um, our ultimate eschatology is that we are with Christ in his kingdom, and it will be an enduring kingdom that will never fade away. And so that's the ultimate hope that I have. Like I tell my church, I want everything we do to be done with joy because we have an optimistic vision of the future. So there's a lot of things that you could look at in the area of AI that could cause you to be pretty pessimistic. But in reality, we have an optimistic vision of the future, and we as Christians should be sharing that with people because I think you're gonna see a lot of people who are pretty fearful. And uh, in fact, the the polling on AI, yeah, Americans have a very low view of artificial intelligence right now. And so there's a lot of fear around it. And there's an opportunity for us.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and they're using it every day, they just don't even know.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly, exactly.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, well, thank you. Thank you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, those are the things, those are the things I would say.
SPEAKER_02That's good. What about just getting a hold of you and following you?
SPEAKER_00Uh check out uh check out my stuff on Substack. I think a lot of people have been writing to me about how that it's been an encouragement to them. So if you just look for Pastor Miles uh at Substack, you'll find articles that I've written. Or if you go to my church website, CC Church or Crossconnection Church.com. CCchurch.com is where all of my messages are.
SPEAKER_02And you're on X and Twitter. Yeah, Pastor Miles. Pastor Miles is where all the X is Twitter now. Okay. So and then the Miles is M-I-L-E-S, correct? Sir. Okay, cool. All right. Well, thanks for being a part, Miles.
SPEAKER_00Thank you, Ryan. Appreciate it.
SPEAKER_02All right, guys. That's another episode. Hope that it encouraged you and challenged you to think uh with wisdom uh about these matters that we live in. So remember to live free and live strong.
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