Hot Comb Survivors
It's a place where women of a "certain age" can come together to talk truth, trash and transformation about any and everything.
Hot Comb Survivors
Unfiltered Conversations: The Strength Of Women's Friendships
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What happens when four women come together to share their unfiltered thoughts on friendship, life, and growth? Join Denise, Lisa, Takisia, and Levern, the Hot Comb Survivors, as they explore the deep and emotional bonds that define women's friendships. We highlight how these connections, especially among Black women, provide solace and strength amidst societal pressures. In our exploration of long-term friendships, we emphasize the importance of vulnerability and trust. Through our shared experiences, we talk about the evolution of friendships, the comfort of having a safe space to share personal struggles, and the role of mutual investment and support. We also address the difficulties of forming new connections as we age and the protective measures we take to safeguard our emotional well-being. It's a heartfelt reflection on recognizing the value of long-standing friendships and the nurturing required to keep them strong.
Exploring Women's Friendships and Bonds
Speaker 1Hello, I'm Denise, I'm Lisa, I'm Takisha and I'm Laverne, and we're the Hot Comb Survivors. Come join us. It's an opportunity where women of a certain age will talk truth, trash and transformation. Hey guys, hey, hot Comb Survivors. This evening's discussion is going to be about women's friendships.
Speaker 1I brought this idea to the group and I specifically said women's friendships as opposed to men friendships. So is there a difference? As a jumping off point, do you think there's a difference between the relationships that women form and the ones that men form? I'm going to say yes, I think that there's a difference between the both the genders friendships. I think women's friendships are much deeper, much more involved and emotional, and just that's really all. I think they're just better. What do you think, denise? I agree with Takesha.
Speaker 1I think that men struggle to keep closer bonds, especially as they get older, full survives, especially as they get older. I find, even with my husband, he has to make a conscious effort to keep friendships, because I think otherwise he would just kind of be on his own. So I think he makes an effort to continue to cultivate his friendships, especially as he gets older, and I think, like us, it's almost effortless, although we put in time and stuff like that, because we have such a chemistry, it just really works for us and, I think, women, because on emotional level, that's, in some ways, that's where we stay, in our emotional state, we always want to draw closer and have bond. Well, I think, especially as Black women, I think this is such a there's just everyone's always out for the Black woman, like there's just so much stuff. We are constantly policed. I think there is definitely more of a need and an opportunity for us to connect. I think I do agree with you, the relationships are deeper and, like my husband struggles to do that too, like it's really hard. I think men are good at the context friendships and the situational friendships. Okay, well, our wives are friends, so, hey, this means we're good, or we're going golfing every Saturday, so and that's how the friendships stem. I think, when we need that deeper connection, that sometimes you don't get your male friends, no one knows what it's like to walk in our shoes, and I think that's an instant deep connection point.
Speaker 1I think women's friendships are complicated. I think there's something unique about us, even though I know that there are other women who have, who talk about like these friendships that have lasted through high school. But there are also a lot of conversations that I've had with women who are not able to, who have not maintained those levels of friendship, and I just think that a lot of women friendship. You find stuff like jealousy and competition and all of that. I think to some degree men don't have that. So I think to your point when you talk about men's relationships are situational. That's good, right, right. Yeah, I think to some degree too, there's a simplicity to it and I think maybe we judge them as you're not emotional or it's not deep or it's not, I don't know. I think our husbands have the kind of bond that will cause them to show up for one another. I do think they'll ride it out. I don't know if I would discount the emotionality of men's friendship. I just think they express it differently. They gotta do that flex stuff.
Speaker 1I was reading an article and the Surgeon General talks about how we have an epidemic of loneliness and people connecting. Like usually the Surgeon General's like stop, don't smoke, don't do drugs, like it's a part where loneliness has become a major issue. So I think with the pandemic it's caused an epidemic of loneliness and people willing to connect. So if you look at all these dating sites like Bumble and all these other places. They all have this BFF piece. Now People are craving it. So I think we all know the friendship serves. It soothes the soul right. It meets the needs. When you find one that doesn't have, that doesn't get rooted in jealousy and all that other stuff, I think there's a lot more benefit to it and I think for us here it's been what? How many years? A lot, several. Well, we are the heartcomb survivor, so that assumes that we're women of a certain age, like 20 plus plus years, I think. Heavy on the plus plus, yeah, plus.
Navigating Long-Term Friendships and Self-Identity
Speaker 1So it's something interesting you had said, denise, about making new friends and you not having space for that. Yeah, well, not to seem unfriendly, I just think that to create a bond that we've created is a lot, and I don't know in this time of my life that I have that much energy to create that type of bond with too many other people. Not to say that I wouldn't, it's just that it would be difficult because we've put in a lot of years, a lot of tears, certainly a lot of laughter, and our families have bonded, and to open up on this level with someone else I would find it difficult, not impossible, but certainly difficult. And yeah, I do have. Of course, I have other friends outside of this particular seating, but I just think that to this level because relationships take time, they take time, they take effort it takes that level of energy to say, okay, I'm going to show up and I'm not saying that I don't show up for others and stuff like that but on this level I don't know, it'd be a lot. It would be a lot, I think. And it's still another level of vulnerability that I struggle with those things I'm working at as well, the level of vulnerability that I'm willing to share with someone else. That's how you protect yourself too. Yeah, because you guys, you all know me right, and now I don't have to put up too many pretenses about what that looks like. We know each other's journey, right, I think you guys love me.
Speaker 1For me, my craziness yeah, I got you and being able to talk about those things, because you can't get too vulnerable with too many people, that's how you protect yourself. This is the thing and that's why I say this is good stuff, right. So for me, because usually, outside of this particular friendship, right, other friends, other people come to you for different things and they look to you for that particular strength, I think so I think a lot of times when you're in those I'm saying friends, but I'm using it kind of loosely they're looking for that strength for you. So it's harder for you to be vulnerable in that space because they're pulling on what that looks like. So you would not necessarily, because if you don't feel like you could really share in that same way with that person, they're not necessarily friends, right? So with you guys and I think you all have a different strength and different things, right that I can kind of pull on. But in most situations I can say, oh, I had a bad day and I can do that, right, you can't do that with everybody, you cannot do that with everyone.
Speaker 1That whole friendship thing and talking about, yeah, you're my homie for life. No, like I can't. At least with a friend group like this, you know what you got, what the investment is on both sides. Right, there's a give and take and you already know and, to your point, we make yourself vulnerable and then find out that everything's a give and take, depending on who's going through what. But you find that you are giving so much, giving too much. You got to protect against that and you don't know people like that, you just don't. And that's a hard lesson to learn Because you find out that people end up like let me talk about that situation, and you're like I was really trying to give you some, like I was extending myself, and you're going to talk about that with who? No, thank you. Yeah, we have a long day behind a long couple of days, behind a long couple of weeks.
Speaker 1I mean, I think what's unique, what's interesting about for me anyway, about this relationship and the longevity. The longevity of these relationships is that you are one person when you first connect in these friendships and through time you begin to kind of evolve. And I thought about that because my mother gave me a box of stuff that I probably have had in her house that she's sick of and she wants. So I took this box home and I was telling Laverne I found a whole slew of letters that Verne and I wrote to one another. I had. I didn't even realize he had written letters. That's taking it back.
Speaker 1Yeah, when she went away to college that first year, we wrote frequently like weekly, and it is one letter I had like skipped a week or something and you're like, oh, so busy, so busy now, whatever, because it was big for us to the friend group is looking differently now, right, right, and sometimes you don't have to deal with that, like 17, 18, right, like we spend so much time. But it was so interesting to read the letter and like when the hell were we these people? What happened? But to recognize that we were at some point that people and evolved yes, these people and were able to, because a lot of marriages can't do that. Yeah, like you married someone and then they changed or grew on you and you couldn't stick it out, like the growing or the changing was so drastic, right, that it didn't. But I think it is a testament.
Speaker 1I think and to Denise's point, I don't know at this stage and this age that I'm willing to make that investment and I think at some point you become settled and invested in who you are. Like I earned this. Yeah, good, the bad, the ugly, the whatever, the scars, all of it. So that whole kind of compromise and all of that. I'm like I don't know how much of that I still have in here and it's that bad to say no, it actually isn't still coming here and it's that bad to say no, it actually isn't.
Speaker 1But when you think about like the four or five circle of friends, right, there's this situational, the work buddies and this and that I think there's always opportunity for that and me, being an introvert, I always like shut all that stuff down. So for me I'm like, okay, gosh, she just wants to have a meal with you, laverne, like just go and just do that. Like it's not that serious, she's not going to ask you for money and nothing, just talk to the girl. Cause normally I'd be like, yeah, I'm just going to just go home and lay down I don't have like new people energy or newer people energy, because you are who you are. So I made a commitment Like I'm going to at least try, especially at the situational not at work, but people I've come across and in different experiences I'm like, okay, it's not going to be like this, it's not the goal to get them to this. Like you never know what you're going to learn, put yourself out there. Like I am a professional people person, so I need to go out and people a little bit more, especially as I'm thinking about retirement.
Speaker 1It's about talking to people and looking at opportunities. So I'm being a little selfish in. Well, yeah, I'm about to retire here too and it's like, when I look back, I made some really wonderful connections over the years, but that thing stuck like this you never know who becomes, who makes it out of that friend circle too. It's long gone. At that work friend circle You're like, well, okay, well, that was it Recent season, lifetime, right. So you know, there's always a reason. So it's kind of placed in.
Strengthening Female Friendships Through Support
Speaker 1I think, kind of from my spiritual perspective, that God has placed the people in my life that he wanted to have in my life and that he knew that I would need. And I'm comfortable with the fact that that's kind of who the people are, who are around me, and then kind of being selfish with who I share with beyond that, and I think if you're in a position Laverne a little bit to your point where you you are expected to be on a lot right, and so I'm an introvert. I'm an introvert living a very extroverted life, but I'm also a chief diversity officer, there's an expectation, right, of how I interact with people, my ability to talk through conflict. There's an expectation I'm an ordained minister. There's an expectation about how I show up in that space because there's certain things I can't do or say or where? Yeah, because people are, oh, you're a pastor and if I show up in a way different than what you expect, then I'm concerned about what it does to your whole frame of reference, spirituality, whatever. But here in this group I show up in some daisy duke shorts and I'm like, well, we seem like she's going through something like that and then that's it, but it's just going to be some jokes. But I don't feel like there's going to be this judgment and there's a huge impact beyond you just deciding to wear Daisy Dukes. So, listen, I was having a little bit of a midlife, late midlife crisis. It still fit. You know, I'm going in and just because they could fit, yeah, boots with a fur, what.
Speaker 1I was cleaning out my closet the other day, I was like, oh, with the fringe. You know that green leather suit. I remember that green leather suit. Yes, that still was back in my closet. I do remember that you should, because you borrowed it for like three years, forever, for a long time, one of my favorite outfits, actually. Oh, remember denise and her cat suit. Oh, we going last night I was a threat. So who's coming, they coming. Who, denise, and her cat suit? I was just talking about that too. I was. I was just talking to Richard about that. A little black cat suit, a little sprinkle. Yeah, yeah, denise's cat suit. My fuchsia and I had a fuchsia laser that I used to wear with it. It was my favorite outfit. I'm surprised it wasn't standing in the corner waiting for me most weekends. It probably was in the 80s, 90s, right? Probably was 80s, 90s, right, probably was. I think it was 90s, 90s, early 90s. I had that. Anyways, the things we remember.
Speaker 1But, yeah, what about some of the things that the friendships have gone through? They've gone through marriage, divorce in some cases, children, graduations, elevations in career, families, ebbing and flowing, all of those things. But we've grown through it. We grow and the relationship, friendship, grows. It just takes a different turn. But there's some few friends that I can't even ask, not friends, but associates. I would not even attempt to enter certain conversations.
Speaker 1I don't feel like the friendship is ready for it and it's just like, as you say, especially when families are going through ebbs and flows, it's just something so wonderful about having like female relationships and friendships that I know that when I'm going through stuff. Y'all gonna be there Like it's never a question for me and because I know I've been through a couple, two, three things and so thankful you guys were there, because this it can be a lot, it's life-saving I definitely call it like I'm gonna send out the right. Yeah, all right, it's like midweek friendship assemble and, speaking of which right, it's almost time, big week, 8 o'clock, 8 pm, drink because some things are going wrong, and definitely appreciate the is it me check? Because I feel like nobody will check you, like your girlfriends. Sometimes you need somebody to go. Yes, it is you Like, is it me? Yeah, oh, no, we need to go right now.
Speaker 1Take care of business. And definitely, I think in a marriage, particularly when you're young, your marriage is young and you're going through having somebody kind of bounce that where you feel like I can come and bring my business to and one not be judged and put it all out in the street, right. And secondly, that's not going to be used against you. Yeah, you know at some point that it's not. Like at some point we're going to be somewhere, somebody gets mad, blah, blah and it's thrown back in your face in a way. That's not, that's not cool.
Nurturing Friendship and Family Bonds
Speaker 1So I think having that space, it's beneficial not only to us individually, but just in terms of our marriages, the way we raise our children, having the kind of back and forth about you think this school is a good school, or or should we be doing this with the kids? Let me tell you what my son said last night. I think in a lot of ways that's just so very therapeutic. Let me just run this by you, because I know I placed a lot of calls to tea. Let me just I think of one situation in particular that I was going through, and I think what's great, too, is about the fact that there are a number of us. Is that, to your point, denise, each of us brings something different right. So if I'm having this kind of conflict, I'm gonna call so-and-so. This is what's going. I need so-and-so's ear on this. So it's just like really having five or six mini therapists. It's true, for free, for free. Yeah, no, copayments, don't adopt the most. That's great. Always take my insurance, always, your insurance is always good here.
Speaker 1So how is it now, as you see, the kids forming their village and their friendships? Well, in particular, ellis, the youngest right. What I love about our village is that he is tapping in on your daughter and your daughter like he keeps saying oh, I spoke to Amaya and I spoke to Jordan and they said that I should and they're helping me write this and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah dah. Especially because him because I know you may have some anxiety about what college is going to look like or what have you he's able to tap in on that, like I'm super thankful for that, super thankful for that, and just watching how they are interacting and the families are growing and all of that, it's amazing and how they just all kind of tap in with one another from time to time and they take it on themselves. Yeah, they do, they have their own little chat.
Speaker 1We did that part. We did that part. We brought them together, we showed them what our friendship looks like. We've modeled for them, I think beautifully, and so I think they kind of get a good idea of what friendship should be. I think the modeling is so important because you don't have to say much, you just point to the example. Right, well, this is what I do with my girlfriend and it becomes natural. It's what, it's just what we do.
Speaker 1I know jordan's best friend I think you met xavier talked about this village so much that he was enamored. He was in love with the idea and got dossiers on all of us and this is someone who was adopted by black parents, so he didn't even have that I'm tearing up. Like he came and he was just like wow, I want that. Jordan, can you be my village? Can our kids take gymnastic lessons together Neither one dating anybody at this time, but can our kids take gymnastics together? And it's just such a great thing to see. It is a beautiful thing. It is beautiful and not only.
Speaker 1And if you talk to friends like outside of the group or associates or what have you outside the group, you guys already know, right, we have a couple of people, a couple of couples, that are like trying to tap in, like y'all do what, you go where you talk about what, like they always say I have friends at church and I have some of Richard's friends that we just talk the village up all the time. It's like, wait a minute, People really crave it. I really wish I had that. I was like oh, it's over. Let's speak to a point about loneliness. So many people, and couples especially, are lonely for companionship. I think a lot of people don't have it. And with a good group of friends, especially a couple, right, it just gets a balance when it's just a couple and one person.
Speaker 1Our age, that emptiness stage we're all beginning to. What do you do now? Right, reconnect with each other and re-imagine yourself. Kids are going to see you looking at retirement. And now I'm looking at you, you're looking at me, we're like what, the white story. What are we going to do? Like? I've met a couple of people that they were afraid to retire because their kids are not home and they've gone on to college and they're like what am I going to do with him? Like, that's real, but it's real, it's a lot, it's a lot to be home and now say, because you put so much energy into raising them, right, these beautiful, wonderful beings, you put all this energy and they like, and you look at each other like who are you? So I found a lot of my other people that are going through that as well are experiencing okay, what are we going to do now? Because now it's just us. That's an exciting time, though. I think so too. It is like a rebirth, I agree.
Speaker 1And then you have to reconnect with your husband as friends. Right, because you spend a lot of time with your husband as co-parent Handling the tasks of life. The tasks of life Y'all are building empire together and now it's okay. We need to reconnect as friends. A lot of young couples I tell them all the time I said make time for date night. I said because it's important. I said because when the babies are gone, and at some point they will be gone, you're going to go. Oh, y'all going to be sitting at that kitchen table looking at each other. I said always take. I was like you don't have to do it all the time, but once a month, once a out and hang out. You need to know each other, hold hands. Your relationship changes. You change your ideas, change All of that, your interests, what you like, what you don't like. It all changes.
Speaker 1Like you said, reconnecting as a friend is really important. It is really, really important. We tried that before, yeah, we don't. We still don't know. I really important. We tried that before. Yeah, we don't, we still don't know. So what is our truth? Friendships.
Speaker 1I think one truth is that friendships are definitely cultivated over time. It's really cultivated over time. And trust, it's an investment. Right, it's an investment? I agree, I think so too, but I have had an instantaneous connection. So I was like, I can tell you, cool, like takisha, I think, the first time, because our husbands were friends. First they met each other playing golf yeah, 20 blood years ago, right and then you came over with him and the minute I met you you're like yep, bonded, same here. Yeah, like which is unusual for me because I can be very guarded, but I can be very guarded. So I think again, I think for me anyway, that's the god saying here's this person. I think that's true. There's something you need or something that the two of you can give to each other. So I think sometimes that happens at 10. Yeah, and sometimes I think, like in a situation like all of ours, I think, you don't even know that there's a voice you have. You just know that something was filled with that relationship. So that's the truth.
Speaker 1These relationships are sustaining and worthy of sustaining, and it just and it, like you, like you said, it takes time. We build on them. Yeah, unless you find that I want to talk about trash. For me is that when you have these relationships with and start to build other friends, sometimes it can go sideways and people can use things against you, and I felt like one or two situation where that's happened. I'm just surprised I'm still open after all that. It took me a while because I was closed and now I'm just surprised I'm still open after all that it took me a while because I was closed and now I'm just open again. But someone wanted to be a part of it so bad, and it just wasn't like your couple knocking. You're like, yeah, this is not going to happen. And it was just got real nasty and negative, like there's a reason why you wouldn't have the secret pass code to get in. You were trying. I think that is the trash. I think that is the trash.
Speaker 1I think that when I spoke earlier about competition, so I know that I've been in situations where there are people who I will make relationship with or have friends with, who will be jealous of the friendship that came before, right, and feel as if you somehow have to compete with those friendships, and I think that's a uniquely woman thing. That's true. What's the difference between women friendship and men friendship? True, I think that's uniquely. At least I haven't seen it or heard it expressed in male friendships. But there is this kind of pull to. I need all of your attention. If we're good friends to the exclusion of there's enough love for anybody, there is like this is all cemented. We can fertile this. We can fertilize this here, right, and I think, with what people recognize, okay, that not breakable, but we'll love you too. Then you can go kind of go for it and become a beautiful thing. But I've had that experience. I think that's kind of trash. I've had a couple of that, but this is a little bit off the subject.
Speaker 1But on the subject, in your life walk, have you had friends to like dump you? I might've been dumped and didn't realize it. Yeah, same here. I feel like laverne tried to dump me for a little while. Oh yes, I remember that time, you know, because we were young and you know how.
Speaker 1You began to explore all the avenues, and then I was in love. Coming in, she found this. She fell in love with this, whatever, and I took a. I took a backseat. Lisa was going to boss her out. She's going to be ignored. I wasn't having it though. Yeah, so we rolled that way. She pulled me back in. You see, I'm here and he ain't right. Is he bought a bond as no, he's not.
Speaker 1No, I thought I cultivated a friendship with someone and she straight up told me well, there's a season for every. I was like what? Wow, you flipped the switch on me. I was like what, I was a season, oh, okay. And she felt the need to say that. Say it Like, just wither away, like most people do. Yeah, like I said, I might have been duffed and didn't realize it. Right, right, fade to the black. I could not believe it. What did you say? I was like usually stuff like that happens if you had like a little falling out or there was some misjudgment about something or whatever, literally out of the blue. So I chucked it up to god protecting me. I really did, because I don't know too much about what's going on with her right now, but I just said because I couldn't understand, it literally came out of the blue and I couldn't understand like what is the big deal? Like I said, did anything happen? No, it's just. When I reflected on it, the Lord was to say it's okay, don't even stress it, you just fade away. That's okay, don't even stress it, you just fade away, that's it.
Speaker 1This walk has shown me that I've had plenty of examples of what long-term loving female friendships look like with my aunts. Their friendships have lasted from childhood to from life through death. They've just been really good examples. So I thank God for being able to see those and I'm showing my daughter especially how that looks, how women just, yeah, can be friends and just be chill. But then you do have some friends who are deeper, that you share intimate things with. But it takes time. That that's it truly does.
Speaker 1What's the transformation? I don't know what is the transformation. I don't know what is the transformation. I'm sorry. I think one of the reasons we all are together is because none of us really have matured past 14. As long as you grow together, even if that is at an incredibly ridiculously slow rate, I think that's fine. I still can't sit together in church without giggling and having to be separated. It's fine. I mean, denise and I still can't sit together in church without giggling and having to be separated. So I think it's ridiculous. There is some of that. We do it at funerals and all kinds of weddings. It doesn't matter.
Speaker 1I think the transformation piece for me is I think you get to a point where, if you like me, cool. If you don't like me, cool. I think that's transformative, right? I mean, yes, I am. And being 100%, completely comfortable with that, it took me a little while to get there I realized that I think that I'm a people pleaser, that I want to please people all the time. So it's still taking me a little bit of time to manage what that looks like, if I'm going to be honest. But I'm definitely more so there than I was. I would say 20 years ago, like, oh, it's okay, you don't have to like me. I'm definitely more so there than I was.
Speaker 1I would say 20 years ago, like, oh, it's okay, you don't have to like me, I'm all right with that. And guess what? Life is good, right, and I've got people who like me. So, right, I have people that absolutely you want to see. They're on my phone you want to see. Right, they're all on my favorite list. You Love you. Oh, we have a new God child. So now it's the next phase, it's Village 3. All right, guys. Well, thanks for tuning in. You're welcome. Friends, one more time, let's try it one more time. How many of us have them? Friends, the ones we can't depend on? Friends, hey, how many of us have them? Let's be friends.
