Episode 25: Analog Over Digital: Why We’re Craving Real Life Again in a Screen-Obsessed World

In this episode of Out Loud with Rob & Rachel, the conversation turns toward something many people are starting to feel but not always saying out loud — the need to disconnect.

From outdated rules that somehow still exist to the modern reality of constant scrolling, Rob and Rachel explore how technology has reshaped attention, communication, and connection. The discussion touches on the rise of short-form content, the growing nostalgia for simpler times, and why more people are craving hands-on, real-world experiences.

They also examine the tension between digital convenience and human connection, the psychology behind social media habits, and why some relationships feel harder to navigate in an all-or-nothing world.

The episode introduces a simple idea that might be more relevant than ever:
 analog over digital.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome to Out Loud with Rob and Rachel. This is what happens when two ADHD brains come together and think out loud.

SPEAKER_00 0:07

Hello, everybody. Thanks for tuning in again to the Out Loud podcast.

SPEAKER_01 0:11

Hello, everyone. Welcome back. Thanks for tuning in again.

SPEAKER_00 0:14

Yeah. Everything's good. Getting uh weather is good.

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Yeah, it's a little cold still in the um central Jersey location where we are. Um actually, I wasn't gonna mention it, but I will now. It's been freezing. And um I'm an educator, as everybody knows, and in my district, there's a rule that you can't wear open-toe shoes until May 1st, and then once October 1st hits, they go back in the closet. Um, it's archaic and it's sort of ridiculous. Um, I'm sure the original establishment of the rule was probably appropriate in 1950. Right. But somewhere along the way, and Mad Men became a show and not reality anymore. It should have changed and it didn't, but whatever. Um, so every year on May 1st, I make a big deal about busting out my open toast shoes. I post a picture. It's my colleagues from, you know, over the years, we know we commiserate, we laugh. And I couldn't wear my open-toed shoes yesterday because it's freaking freezing.

SPEAKER_00 1:16

Yeah, that's so funny with those rules because a lot of towns have it too, like laws, but they don't follow them anymore. It's implied that.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

And honestly, there are probably some schools within my district where the administration picked battles, and that shouldn't ever be one of them in education. Because quite frankly, why is it okay during those two months of the year, but not the rest of the year? If it was a sanitary thing or a safety thing, it should be all or nothing. Right. I don't teach with my toes, so I'm not quite sure why what I'm wearing on my shoes should affect the classroom.

SPEAKER_00 1:48

If you're gonna drop something, it just leaves more room for injuries and workers come. So I get it, but all year though.

SPEAKER_01 1:55

Right, exactly. That should be all or nothing, exactly, right? Like it's open toe shoes, like that's that yeah. So um that's that's what I've dealt with yesterday with my freezing, and I'm still not wearing my shoes.

SPEAKER_00 2:07

I'm actually surprised they allow open toe shoes at all. At all? Yeah, yeah. A little bit just because you know, they're always trying to protect themselves with lawsuits and I know that's true.

SPEAKER_01 2:18

I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 2:18

If you're a science teacher and you're in a lab or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

Well, maybe there are certain rules like that. Um, I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 2:24

I it doesn't matter, stupid.

SPEAKER_01 2:26

It is stupid. It is stupid. There's such bigger things to focus on.

SPEAKER_00 2:31

Like even a town where you live in, it's like you your bicycle is supposed to be registered. Like that's in the laws, but but most people don't. No, but no, no, nobody does. Like you don't do that. Like your bike, not an e-bike.

SPEAKER_01 2:44

Any bicycle, any bicycle that rides in town is supposed to be regarding it.

SPEAKER_00 2:46

Yeah, like that's still, I think that's still.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

I don't even think I knew that.

SPEAKER_00 2:50

Right, no, but because they don't they don't enforce it because it's outdated.

SPEAKER_01 2:54

Right. Is that to get money?

SPEAKER_00 2:56

Probably back then.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Because what would be the point of registering a regular bicycle if it's stolen?

SPEAKER_00 3:00

Probably, yeah. No, probably to get money.

SPEAKER_01 3:02

Everything's uh Yeah, I wouldn't uh I mean like what are you registering your 10-speed schwin for? Like, that's weird to me.

SPEAKER_00 3:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:09

Other than getting money, money. Yeah, money makes the world go round, and money makes things collapse as we're finding and we're not gonna go there, but it's sad. I wanted to, in the spirit of those types of things and thinking in the past and what worked and what didn't, there's a trend that I've has been coming up. Um, going back to the simpler life, I'm noticing, and the year that seems to be creeping up is 2016. So I wanted to know why.

SPEAKER_02 3:38

Yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Why is 2016 the jumping off point for people? Like when you think back to a simpler life is 2016, I guess before 2016, when life was simpler. So I asked you where if you could pick one year that you would go back to, what year would you go back to?

SPEAKER_00 3:58

Yeah, for me it was pretty easy. It was around that 1997 because we had internet that made our life easier. We had phones, we had GPS, which is I think GPS is one of the most unappreciated pieces of technical.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

I totally agree with you. Remember MapQuest when you had to print out 17 pages to get to upstate New York and look at them in the dark.

SPEAKER_00 4:23

But I was driving a lot when it was Hangstrom, when it wasn't even Mac, but with the books, the books, and very difficult, but you know, we it's a whole different subject, but that really helped with your like figuring out problems and critical thinking. You know, it's funny.

SPEAKER_01 4:38

My dad, it's so funny that you say that those those remember the trip.

SPEAKER_00 4:41

And you had to buy one for each county.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

Well, remember the trip ticks from Triple A?

SPEAKER_00 4:46

A little bit. You brought those up again.

SPEAKER_01 4:48

It literally unfolded, it was a pamphlet. So it was the you know, and then it unfolded into like an accordion kind of map that took you on your whole entire journey to wherever it was that you were going. And my dad would do that every time we went on a road trip. He would drive up to the AAA and have the guy highlight the entire route. Yeah, and one of us read the map the entire way.

SPEAKER_00 5:17

Yeah, it's fun. You know, as as much as like I would never want to go back, I'm so grateful of being a part because it was something that I was like slightly proud of because not everybody could do it. I know, reading maps, and 100%. Then sometimes the road goes on to the next page because it was the book, it wasn't one thing, and but I used it like seven times a day because I used to drive house to house, and back at the time it was in the inner cities like Newark and Irvington. I would go from apartment to apartment. Um for baby. I used to do baby photography. What? And like in these bad areas. Was it next to you when you were no, you just had to remember the four steps, okay? Like the like I used it by four steps ahead. Yeah, something like okay, left here. All all all all you worry about Sussex Street. Left Sussex Street. Right. Right, and that's all that's all right. That was in my left, left, left. Right. And with ADHD back then, it was like you short-term memory wasn't always good, right? And then uh, but yeah, I remember one time I I went down like I don't know the name of the road, but I went down Fifth Ave in Irvington instead of Fifth Street.

SPEAKER_01 6:23

Oh, oh, that could make a difference. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:26

There were chain chain link fences on each side of the road, and there were just people on each side of the road, and I'm driving down this road, they're throwing shit over. You know what I mean? Like, I thought that was the end of me. Like, like it was, you know, or it was bad back then. That's what happened. They knocked down all the high rises. Uh but that's where it was, it was like you know, uh they stuck out like a sword. We'll just say that.

SPEAKER_01 6:49

That's why they knocked him down, by the way.

SPEAKER_00 6:51

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's why.

SPEAKER_01 6:52

Um that's really interesting.

SPEAKER_00 6:55

In all those neighborhoods, I was always called the picture man because I was uh because the picture man's comment.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

That's really funny. I so you would go back to 97.

SPEAKER_00 7:05

97, because things were got a lot easier, but you still had to communicate.

SPEAKER_01 7:12

I do, um, okay, so if I was to go back, the things that I would need 100% non-negotiable, so I guess this would probably determine how far back I would go. Um, yeah, you need a cell phone, but I don't need a smartphone. No, right. I need like a flip. Right, like I remember my Nokia smartphone, like with the little screen, tiny little screen that you could text a few characters to, right? And everything was an abbreviation because you only had a certain amount of characters that you could get in. I didn't need to know every goddamn detail of your life if you were 10 minutes late, 10 min late.

SPEAKER_00 7:51

That's it. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

Right? Like otherwise, pick up your phone and call me.

SPEAKER_00 7:55

Now people are putting a friggin' text through chat GPP. Everybody sounds like a robot.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

And everybody has the little cute little pictures to go along with their message because you know you got it off of chat or AI or something.

SPEAKER_00 8:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:06

I don't need the bells and whistles like that anymore. I want to go back to the simple life.

SPEAKER_00 8:11

Yeah, it was good then. And it's it's really the social media aspect for me because I'm all although I'm off Facebook, I'm still on Instagram, and 90% of my phone usage is scrolling reels.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

And do you think that's a good thing?

SPEAKER_00 8:25

No, right, it's terrible, but it's um, you know, my algorithms is a good thing now. Like my algorithm stuff's actually it's goofy stuff that makes me laugh.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

Okay, good. So it's not heavy shit that's bringing you down. I can actually do heavy shit. I don't know. My algorithm has changed quite a bit as well. I've noticed that as also. Yeah. I get a lot of education. I do get a lot of special education. I get a lot of like people with disabilities and how to include, like, I do get a lot of stuff like that. So some of those things, but I also I do get my like pet adoption, like dog. I follow a lot of you know, dog fostering people. So I I get those feel-good stories too.

SPEAKER_00 9:02

What's cool though, the only thing I do like about the reels, there's so many amazing creative people out there that never like just like the mom, the dad, I know, the the divorced dad. It's funny that you say that.

SPEAKER_01 9:15

I listen, I watch it's I watch this woman who does sourdough. I still have not jumped into that. I'm afraid to, because I don't I don't know if I'll be good at it. But I follow this woman and her name is the sourdough ho.

SPEAKER_00 9:27

Oh god, that's it.

SPEAKER_01 9:28

And she's I love her, like she's just crude, so great, yeah, yeah. Is who she is, and she actually posted something just this week. I didn't even know where she lives, but she said, I'm gonna respond to something that somebody said on social media, and she was like, That every every influencer's life is fake. And she was like, Why would I pretend to be a mom who lives in a trailer in Florida? Right. Like, why would I fake that? Like, why would I like I don't understand that? She's like, I am who I am. Like, I live in a she didn't say trailer, she said in a mobile home. Okay, in a which I think is the same, right? That's what they yeah. She's like, why would I pretend to be somebody who lives in a mobile home, like who loves to make sourdough? Like, that's just who I am. Like, yeah, I just like it. Um, so I do like people who are just fun, and you would never have the opportunity to meet somebody like that, right? And I think she's hysterical, and I she brings me joy in my you know, five seconds that I'm scrolling by her. I would miss that.

SPEAKER_00 10:30

Right, right. And I would feel bad for there's just so many creative people out there. Right.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

Those people who get the chance to be that.

SPEAKER_00 10:37

And I don't even think people realize how creative and the work that goes into some of the stuff these people are doing. What like they think they're just a no, it's it's it's it's it's a craft, like a like sometimes like a stand-up. It is true, it is like building that that persona and that personality and and yeah, I'm thinking of all of the people, the influencers.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

Like, I don't even know if you would yeah, they're not trying to be influencers. Right. They're just the content creators, I'll call them. Content creators. I follow another woman. She's a single mom, she takes her kids to Disney. For some of them, as you uh yeah, and she just also says, like, if you don't want to follow me, don't follow me. Like, it's totally fine.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Gina went with this, you know, this woman? Gina went to see her.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

Oh, Gina went to that thing the other day? Yeah, oh my god, I want with Danielle Cabral, it was there too. The um bougie mama from The Real Housewives. She was part of that too. Yeah, she went to the city. Oh, was that good stuff? Did she have fun? Did she buy stuff?

SPEAKER_00 11:33

Yeah, I think so. Yeah, yeah. Nice.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

I totally saw that. I wanted to go. See, those things don't show up on my thing. Gina has some good friends who watch because she she was like going to a lot of that good stuff.

SPEAKER_00 11:43

She finds she goes to the Hallmark one and all that stuff. Good for her.

SPEAKER_01 11:48

All right, good for her.

SPEAKER_00 11:49

I mean that's her vibe.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

See, but that's that's being present in the moment. See, I love that because that's bringing that's the beauty of social media. It's bringing people to events like that. Right, right. Where you're not on your phone. Yeah, exactly. Where you're experiencing people and things and you're touching. And I I when I dove into that 2016 trend, what I'm finding people are searching for is the experience now. And that's why they're thinking about where you would go back to.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

Yeah, I don't know why it's 2006. I I don't see 2016 to 2026. I don't either. But I do technological difference with AI. I mean, the world is a lot more polarizing, that's for sure. But do you think people were more but not as polarizing as the 90s present then? I don't think so. No, that's true.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

You think people were still just as stuck in their phones as they are now? Is that you don't think it makes that much of a difference? I don't think it makes in that way.

SPEAKER_00 12:45

No difference.

SPEAKER_01 12:46

Yeah, so that's why it's an interesting thing to look into.

SPEAKER_00 12:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

Like like like stats and stuff, right?

SPEAKER_00 12:51

The biggest difference as far as technology besides AI, but that hasn't affected that much, is just uh the short form content be became more popular. So the 30-second reels and then attention span went down. Right, right. That's the biggest difference.

SPEAKER_01 13:06

So do you think 16 was then?

SPEAKER_00 13:08

Was that you think that was a that was prior to the short form content? Yeah, prior to that. I don't even think the word viral was that popular then, was it? I mean, it was just I don't know. I mean, I I it's not something I ever really thought about, to be quite honest with you. I don't think so.

SPEAKER_01 13:22

But I am starting to think about it now because you know what I'm doing? I'm craving, I actually find myself craving hands-on things to do.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 13:35

I'm craving moments to walk away and put my phone down. Like I can't stand my phone.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:40

So I hate my phone. I literally find that I catch myself saying like and trying to almost dispel it. Like I literally it's become something that I I I I know I need, and I hate that I need it, and I want to fill my life with things other than picking up my phone.

SPEAKER_02 14:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

So I am craving, like I literally said it the other day in my house. I'm craving crafting. I want to do something with my hands, I want to create something. And so I have like been trying to seek out opportunities, even with my daughters, like to bedazzle things. Even if we went to the dollar store and just bought a bunch of crap and rhinestones, and we bedazzled a first aid kit and we bedazzled a little lip balm thing.

SPEAKER_00 14:33

That's fun. Just to you can have that stuff forever, too.

SPEAKER_01 14:37

Right, but like, right, and and also, but just to like do, just to make, just to create, just to get away from the phone. I can't stand it.

SPEAKER_00 14:44

Yeah, yeah. And your kids are creative too. They are like kind of fall right into that. Yeah, and and but I think most people are creative. I think they have a creative edge to them.

SPEAKER_01 14:55

I think everybody has a creative edge to them, but they just we've gotten so used to taking the easy thing and just pulling our phones into our hands and that.

SPEAKER_00 15:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:04

I I I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 15:05

I'm I'm it's a well part of it, it's an actual addiction. Right, that's true. That's what yeah. So you're dealing with addiction.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

You know, it is it is an addiction. Yeah. And I noticed, I mean, I even saw something. So uh again with the algorithms, right? It's an addiction, and then it shows up what you I've been very, very focused on that pencils over pixels movement in education. Um, I wrote a blog about it, we talked about it, and there's this movement. Um, I mean, I don't know how much ground it has grow, you know, gained at this point, but I saw it about parents and some school districts, quite frankly, pushing away technology and more hands-on learning. And I but I believe kids are craving that. I do. I don't think they realize they're craving it, but I believe they're craving it. And I think uh society needs to.

SPEAKER_00 15:55

Well, we had an experience when we had the we did something in our town with the feelings gallery that we had, and we had some, you know, uh just a few different stations, but the kids were yes, I went I didn't really notice it that day, but I went back to look at my b-roll, and I think they sound like they were just like And you know what was amazing a couple of kids just stuck out like how immersed they were.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

Not only were they immersed in it, but when I was at the table making just simple bracelets with the kids, right, the spontaneous conversations that were coming up, the eye contact, yeah, the back and forth exchanges and the the imagination. Like I had a whole conversation with one boy about the color red and why he loved the color red and what it meant and like the the shades of red and how the deeper He was having a con like I wasn't even having to pull too much out of him. When your head's in the phone, when your head's in a video game, when your head's in the like you don't have opportunities like that.

SPEAKER_00 16:55

There's a lot of unintended benefits when when you're creative like that. And also just um the marketers, the entrepreneurial types are catching on too, because a lot of the business model is gonna be the analog business model coming up, they predict. And as simple as charging people to walk with them.

SPEAKER_01 17:18

Well, right, that's so what I'm so in our entrepreneurial areas, right? Both of us, like that's what I'm starting to look into now is experiences. Yeah, I want to give experiences to people, and um it's interesting when you start to do research on what people are looking for, they're looking for human connection. Yeah, it's you're a hundred percent right, like the the value in it is is exponential, like and we're we're losing human connection, right?

SPEAKER_00 17:50

And well we're we're we're we're losing it also just within our families, right? So never mind like just um I'm sure, and this sounds awful, but I'm sure you can make a living just calling some people.

SPEAKER_01 18:05

Just to say hello and checking up on that.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

Well, like that's a business. You know what I mean? Yeah, like it it's wild, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:12

I I find it so interesting though, because it's it's it's funny how we you know, technology and the internet and all of that, and I know that people have said this before, but like was built to bring the world together.

SPEAKER_02 18:30

Right.

SPEAKER_01 18:31

But what has happened is the complete opposite, is that it's it's isolated everybody. So now you're like, I I I just find it it's so interesting how the one thing that it was meant to do, it has done the complete opposite.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

Yeah, like you you you wonder what that balance is because I connected with you because of the internet. Right. So far, so good. Is that right?

SPEAKER_01 18:57

That's been an intended bonus. I think it has.

SPEAKER_00 19:00

You know, I reconnected with my buddy Eddie and some other pe some amazing people in my life is because of the internet, right? But the chaos that it has created, you know, is is is as intense.

SPEAKER_01 19:14

I think that it's a matter of going to it for certain things and being really good at compartmentalizing the bullshit. Yeah, yeah so weeding it out, like like shutting it off, like filtering other the other shit out and just using it for like the positive. I mean, I is that even more.

SPEAKER_00 19:35

I just got into discussions with things I really didn't care about, but I love having debates and discussions and discourse. And what I found is that I would I would upset so many different people, whether it's text or social media, without being a jerk off or anything, right? Because I'm able to compartmentalize, but other people let it go. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 19:58

That's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

And it was also having those conversations with the wrong person.

SPEAKER_01 20:02

Oh, well, yes, right.

SPEAKER_00 20:04

But but those are the but those intense people are the people who I enjoy having conversations with.

SPEAKER_01 20:09

Do you think you enjoy the intensity of it? Do you think you enjoy the I like the debate?

SPEAKER_00 20:14

The right thing. The angst it brings. Yeah, I I enjoy that. But then I can be like, okay, it's over. I'm fine.

SPEAKER_01 20:23

And then they walk away fired up, like with Molotov cocktails coming out of their brains, like ready to just blow up the world.

SPEAKER_00 20:29

I had an interesting revelation how I've been feeling, how how to describe it. And uh I I talked about the last couple of podcasts, I think, about how some people keep everything at equal weight. Right. Okay. So and I was we were talking about a little bit um how you know used to be back in the day, was you cared about three things, four things, they were important to you. Right. And it wasn't 15 things. And like somebody, like I look at you, somebody you're a good example. So I I if I had to describe you, I would say This should be interesting. Rachel cares about five things. I'm just thinking politically. Okay. Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_01 21:09

All right, let's hear him.

SPEAKER_00 21:10

Now, if Rob Wilson only checks off two or three of those five things, you're fine with that.

SPEAKER_01 21:16

Yes, I am.

SPEAKER_00 21:18

But there is there there are so many people that I was.

SPEAKER_01 21:22

Well, because so to I I again I can't speak for other people, but there are certain things for me that are lines in the sand, right? And then there are certain things that that are negotiable. Right. So if the non-negotiables check off the box, the others like we're not all good and we're not all bad, right?

SPEAKER_00 21:42

But even if it's not all the non negotiables is what I mean, it it it's you you you underst just because there's three that you agree, you you understand where I say.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

No, no, I understand it. So I mean if you're an asshole about certain things I'm not going to do.

SPEAKER_00 22:00

No, no, no, I don't mean that. What I'm saying is I think there's some people that have 15 boxes to check off. And you have to check off all of them.

SPEAKER_01 22:07

Every single one of them. I think that's a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 22:09

But if you don't but if you check off 14, it's like what's wrong with you?

SPEAKER_01 22:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:15

You know what I mean? That's all it's it's like, you know what do you think that is?

SPEAKER_01 22:18

What do you think that is, that all or nothing thing about um because nobody's like, I don't know. I just I guess for me, I say I never want to be judged with such a scrutinizing lens like that. So I won't judge somebody else with because there's a really there's a it's a far fall from all the way up there, right? So if you put yourself as somebody who I'm holier than thou and you know this is what I expect from you, the minute you yourself don't measure up that way, you're falling hard and fast. So I myself will never put myself above like so I think that's why I'm sort of accepting of other people's misgivings.

SPEAKER_00 23:11

Like unless they affect a misgiving I don't even mean that I I just mean by like things that are important to you it's it's not like uh it's just important to you.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

I don't expect it to be important to other people is that what you're saying because it might be part of your your your culture or something I see what you're you're you're right. Yes. Yeah you're absolutely right yes right that's what I mean like like do you think that I mean being a teacher is part of why I'm able to do that do you think I'm able because think about I don't know in my classroom yeah but in my classroom as an educator you have to accept every student that's in front of you no matter how they come to you even if they hate you culturally or like I don't have a choice.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

I can't wear that okay so I from my experience the people who are like you and I don't know if this was the case with you almost every single time are adults like us who grew up in a household where politics didn't run the conversation.

SPEAKER_01 24:15

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 24:15

So now that's true.

SPEAKER_01 24:17

We've talked about that before but is that what you politics did not run right households I don't remember policy over politics things issues we talked about.

SPEAKER_00 24:28

Well a lot of people that I'm talking about it's an ideology. Absolutely right so so so we talked about specific issues right that's all we talk about yeah yeah we agree on a lot of like most things in my house we talked about issues not right exactly not overall so not overall umbrella like yeah so on Facebook you'll hear people say the dumb libs or or or or the gop or like like right right so so my god I just had such a revelation yeah right so so when I hear somebody says oh the libs are the G O Ps or or I hate that or in public a private conversation because I say once in a while yeah I don't say it and I hate it but but it's different when you say it publicly in front of because that's when you really mean it and generalizing it right but um well also I don't like anything that puts you into I don't put me in a box.

SPEAKER_01 25:24

I think that's another thing like don't try to define me because if you try to define me I will do whatever I can to prove you wrong. Yeah and the other I think that's a big thing with me also like don't put me in a box.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

You can't figure me out and I think that's what happens with the the people where you have to check off all 15 boxes is when they can put you in a box they are uncomfortable with me. Yeah they're or with the person yeah uh hundred percent yeah so I find that a lot yeah I thought that was a uh an interesting uh because I was trying to figure out like why are some people so it's just too high of an expectation is ever reached I I know I bring it up once in a while but I think I finally nailed it. So what what that allows me to do is like who to stay away from you know like even as an acquaintance you know well right because along with it is going to come the other shit. Yeah yeah eventually you're gonna have to check off all the noise right the noise and then the aggravation and I mean that's why some of my friendships only last a year because I can avoid ten of those boxes for about a year.

SPEAKER_01 26:29

And then the like 365 or 366 day 366 is when shit starts to unravel.

SPEAKER_00 26:35

Yeah exactly I mean does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 26:37

It does make sense. It does make sense.

SPEAKER_00 26:39

But the best political discussions I have and the most honest are ones who did were never it wasn't brought brought up in a political family.

SPEAKER_01 26:48

I always always I would I would probably imagine that's because in those households it was a safe place to have civil discourse. Yeah yeah yeah that's to have normal conversation well to be able to think on your own I was not brainwashed in any way shape or form in my house um it was a very um it's interesting because if I looked back on my childhood like my parents I mean I guess you could say that socially they were very liberal.

SPEAKER_00 27:23

Yeah yeah a lot of people are though like like who aren't even liberal.

SPEAKER_01 27:28

But right but there were lines it like there's lines in the sand like there are lines in the sand you didn't cross like there yeah and there were rules you know so I mean but we didn't politicize them. No what's funny what what my political thing you didn't look at it like that.

SPEAKER_00 27:41

I mean my mom died in 85 dad 96 but I don't even know if they're Republic or Democrat.

SPEAKER_01 27:45

I mean I know what obviously my mother's still alive and I knew what my dad was definitely with that.

SPEAKER_00 27:50

I mean that's how little it was talked. Right right yeah um I mean I would assume Republican back then 20 years in the Navy in the military you know that that usually led to well my dad was in the National Guard.

SPEAKER_01 28:02

No dad was a member of the National Guard um I think the military is just statistically moral right right I mean yeah like I don't say my dad was a a veteran or anything you know like he was a n s in the national served in the national guard he wasn't like you know I didn't I don't use that I don't even really mention that that much um but I had no idea like he never I I never heard him complaining about Jimmy Carter or Ronald or anything I never heard my parents complaining about that either. Yeah like I never heard him complaining my the only things that my parents would talk about and my and they my mother is a history buff. Now she talks politics and I can't stand it. But back then it was more of a history thing not a political thing. It was more of this was what happened during this time careful because history request right like this I or it was a I remember where I was when JFK was shot like I remember what this time was like during the civil rights move. Like it was more about talking about those things educationally not brainwashing not sides not it it was more in an in a in a in a point of in for like a point of information kind of way.

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Yeah not in a divisive way that we have to check off all 15 boxes. I I usually eventually get around asking about the parents and and that usually you find that people it's the fathers too even with the women I talk to usually it's the fathers that were were uh most influential that was probably a sign of the times back then right men were a little bit more able to even with the 40 year olds and the younger crowd yeah it's usually the the dads so that so the millennials how old are their parents uh they're probably sixty okay so they're like our the parents are Gen Z's I mean Gen Xers right millennial nephews and and and a niece and so the parents are Gen Xers or the late 60 early boomers early boomers now maybe yeah so yeah so I I I I need I need a little bit more clarification again.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

Gen X was from 65ish right to 80? 67 maybe okay yeah okay 80 79 80 uh yeah yeah 80 yeah I think 80 was the I think so okay so then I mean like when did 24 hour news start? Like what would you say the 24 hour news cycle started? In the 90s early 90s?

SPEAKER_00 30:49

Probably mid.

SPEAKER_01 30:50

No that was like I didn't give a shit about anything probably until 98 when I started working Fox News was around then or or CNN was it?

SPEAKER_00 30:59

I don't even know.

SPEAKER_01 30:59

But that's what I mean.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

I I can't tell you but CNBC was a big one.

SPEAKER_01 31:02

I I don't I don't remember caring about anything were world aside if it happened like 9-11 obviously like that you couldn't not pay attention to but like I remember only caring about the election because I was away in college and I couldn't vote but not really issues necessarily do you know what I mean? So I don't know that I really I can't remember I don't know I can't put a No let's see let's want to ask chat yeah I mean when did a 24 hour news cycle start? That would be a very interesting Let's see what do you think I would say 2001 okay so I am going to say before that because 911 was 2001 so I'm gonna probably say before 2000 when it was Y2K they were already 24 hours before Y2K Okay let's see. When did a 24 hour news cycle start let's say the birth wow no that doesn't make sense earlier it says the modern 24 hour news cycle really began in the 80s 1980 CNN launch law was launched oh wow but not everybody had cable then that's true so like when I didn't know CNN was around that long I did it was Ted Turner yeah 80s and I remember I do I do remember when it but but you didn't you didn't watch like I don't remember it being the thing you went to all the time to find your news early 90s this says that uh when a golf war started so that's what I would say yeah I that's exactly I I mean I said 911 so I was a little 90s 2000 yeah I said before 90 before 911 definitely I knew because I remember yes I remember 911 you were 247 watching the news and it wasn't a new thing you already were already watched like you were able to watch the like when I think of non-24 hour news cycles what comes to my mind is like the poltergeist screen remember at 12 midnight when like the static came on and if you turned anything on so after that to me was 24 hours I guess. Yeah yeah going now going back to the analog I I've been actually thinking of doing this uh going back to an analog phone no but some Christians are actually Catholics and Christians are starting to do it not many it's not like a big trend but doing a Shabbat was a Shabbat's oh where you turn off completely for twenty oh for the whole weekend yeah it's Shabbat is only tw it's sundown sundown to sundown okay one sundown yeah that's but even that would it's great yeah I I I mean we all should uh it's we should all but they don't but the thing is though I mean they do but they don't because there are ways to get around it like you have timers for the lights and like things like that. So like it depends on how much you want to disconnect. Are you just talking your phones?

SPEAKER_00 34:08

Oh yeah for me the phone I mean that would be amazing.

SPEAKER_01 34:10

Yeah that's true it's so funny my my uh mother in law's in a uh uh she's not Jewish but she's in a Jewish rehabilitation like nursing home and they shut down for for the Shabbat no the elevator like the shop is like how come the elevator won't let us press the buttons yes there's there if you go into Robertwood Johnson hospital there's a Shabbat elevator there's one elevator that runs it's I call it like the loco local it stops at every single floor so that you don't have to touch anything. Right yeah it's great I remember I when I was going through chemo I um my second cycle of chemo was given every week and it was given on Saturdays and the Cancer Institute wasn't open on Saturdays so I would have to go to the wing fifth I remember North Tower fifth floor I think it was fifth floor the oncology wing at Robert Wood and it was on a Saturday so that was the only elevator that ever was running and I remember it was well that's Saturday I mean this was only the uh local local only three floors at this oh no this one was yeah you stopped at every single floor um my kids have actually mentioned that like what it would be like to just shut off for 24 hours. Yeah I think it would be freeing I think that you would read more books I think that you would I yeah I I actually like just it's okay to do nothing. I actually felt during the pandemic like I wasn't on my phone 24 hours. I wasn't overloaded with technology then ever during that time. So my daughters have even mentioned recently that they would it would be nice for them to just like shut down for 24 hours. And it's it made me think about like back in the day when our parents and even even when I was younger and even when you go on vacation don't you find when you go on vacation you you you sort of check out a little bit more because what like I not as much as I should when I I'm addicted I'm a fool when but when I was um away right for the all inclusive like I barely touched my phone you hardly watch TV because the TV sucks in vacation on vacation most of the time anyway you don't know the local channels you don't know when things are on and if you're in a hotel there's like five channels so you're watching you know Guy Fieri on like you know um diner's diet whatever but you tap into like more creative shit like I I I there should we should start a movement. We should start a movement yeah what's another fancy way to move away from pencils and paper like sometimes I get off my phone but I'm on my computer but I'm not doing anything like scrolling I'm I'm working on like my blob and I always I know but even that is still you lose so many hours like I find that I walk away and it's three hours later and I'm like holy shit I've been staring at a screen for three hours. Well right right now I know yeah I mean your eyes are buggy like your back my back is killing me. I've been going on three or four mile hikes actually I I think that's great. Yeah well see and you even sent me the picture of uh that's okay it'll show it'll come you sent me the picture today you found the um what you I used to do a little thing when I would walk the dog what did you see on your walk today you should do that and today you saw that little um ID badge with Jesus in it oh that was uh like a Rorschach test that was Penara I I walk out and and I see this you know ID badge that had like wet stains in it because I guess it rained and it looked like Jesus. And I said it we went back and forth it was like a Rorschach test. To me it didn't look like Jesus it looked like the outs the outline of a ghost with the flying and then it was very funny. Yeah and you were same thing. It's definitely not the same thing but okay thank you for giving me that um creative license right I think we should definitely tap off instead of tapping in yeah tap tap off right in in out tap out so says the people who uh do the podcast we could do it and not watch it right yeah but yeah you listen yeah yeah instead of I actually don't I don't think that listening to something I that's in music you listen to music it gets your brain moving I mean listen I'm not perfect again I'm gonna say I won't ever put myself all the way up here because it is a long fall down.

SPEAKER_00 38:45

I'm pretty good right now with my text exchange that there's not much going on so that that has helped me a lot.

SPEAKER_01 38:51

I d I don't have a big text no thing.

SPEAKER_00 38:54

So to me I only text when I need to I got very little going on but I always found weird the people I know the best are the people I text the least like like my dearest friends. Oh like you don't need to keep it local anybody I know locally is only people I tax like in town because we have a lot more in common with what's going on with the schools and what's going on in local politics. So there's there's sometimes more to talk about than even even your family.

SPEAKER_01 39:28

A hundred percent yeah yeah yeah but they're like there I listen I have a text thread that's called the vault and it's like those people want to be in that one no it's it's it's things it's really reserved for like yeah it for things for the vault like yes absolutely it's shit you don't talk about with anybody else and it's also shit that like that like inappropriate no you I saw I saw that inappropriate in what way I don't know just like things that you think are funny but it could be yes there are things like that I got people like that but there are also things like I can't believe how effed up this is and this just happened like about work. Right oh okay like because we all are in the same you know we we we it's that dynamic I guess it's my but not just work like we worked together for so long we don't work together anymore I don't work with these two individual I'm not even gonna mention who they are because they're my people they are my ride or dies like these are the people who legitimately if I said I need you to meet me in this place with a shovel right and a tarp they would be like what time? Uh oh and they are the people who I can literally call and say show up with a shovel and a tarp. It would never happen because that's just not yeah but I could and they would ask no questions except where you know what I mean like those are just they get it they've been there at my worst I've been there at their worst we've seen each other through some shit. Um and they're just non-judgmental there all the time I got a couple people like that they just live too far away to get it. Well right to see them every time I know they at my they're they're they're within an hour both of them in different directions but yeah uh they would they would be there. They would be there. But you don't have to see each other every day. No. We don't speak a lot uh we don't even text a lot actually but if I t they are the constant you know what I mean like just the people you've been through so much shit with that like they get it.

SPEAKER_00 41:34

Yeah yeah yeah you know and they can kind of read between yeah yeah you don't have to tell their full story and explain every little thing.

SPEAKER_01 41:39

Yeah and you don't have to talk right and you just have to be and they're not there to fix everything and you know it's it's nice to have people like that. They're they're few and far between but uh so that's my text that's the the aside from that I don't have a big texting game. I'm not big in the texting game. No I think quality over quantity yeah I guess so you know I I'm gonna try and actually I think I'm gonna I'm gonna make a concerted effort. I am gonna say right now in front of our Out Loud podcast family that I am going to make a concerted effort to unplug. I really think I am and to find some things that I used to do that I used to really like to do that don't involve this thing.

SPEAKER_00 42:25

Yeah. Does a camera help if I went out and start doing street photography that that that would it does help.

SPEAKER_01 42:31

Yeah I mean that wouldn't count as technology right no because that was around even I mean a camera's a camera right I got a lot of film cameras and I brought it I actually think that's great.

SPEAKER_00 42:40

I was gonna go back and do film.

SPEAKER_01 42:42

That can you yeah yeah I have every yeah I actually have film and like can you can you develop remember back in the day when you used to have a I had a dark room in my house I used to do that yeah that's what some of the equipment up there over there.

SPEAKER_00 42:54

Can you I think I wouldn't do that.

SPEAKER_01 42:56

Why?

SPEAKER_00 42:57

Uh it's just is that really expensive?

SPEAKER_01 42:59

No it's just uh you know just uh counterproductive I I'd rather spend my time taking the picture yeah it takes longer yeah yeah and just send out the film yeah yeah I can understand that but I did I remember I went to sleepaway camp and photography was one of the things that you could sign up to do and I always used to love that because of the dark room. I thought that was the coolest thing standing there and holding the tongues and watching your picture emerge and not knowing whether it's sucked or not and then realizing like you got the back of the person's head instead of what you were looking for. Yeah the contact sheets and the thrill of it all was pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00 43:35

That's creative but maybe that'll be my analog I'll pull up some of the filled cameras.

SPEAKER_01 43:40

So analog is that like the thing go back to analog right like return to analog yeah I think if I guided like analog over digital instead of pencils over pixels analog over digital. Yeah yeah analog over digital that should be the next movement hashtag analog

SPEAKER_00 44:00

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 44:02

I think our kids need it too.

SPEAKER_00 44:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:04

They don't know what it's like.

SPEAKER_00 44:05

No.

SPEAKER_01 44:06

At all.

SPEAKER_00 44:06

No, they don't they don't know the struggle.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

I don't know that it was a struggle. Was analog a struggle?

SPEAKER_00 44:13

Well, it it was a s it not a struggle. It was more of a struggle. I mean, just to get someplace was difficult.

SPEAKER_01 44:20

But I don't think we looked at it as difficult, right? Now it would be considered a struggle. But back then did we really think it was a struggle? I don't think I thought it was a struggle.

SPEAKER_00 44:32

Now you didn't know any better.

SPEAKER_01 44:33

Right.

SPEAKER_00 44:34

Yeah. I remember having a conversation with China's uncle who passed away, but he'd probably be 90 something right now. And uh I would say, you know, I I think I was actually talking about the Hankstrom Mats. He goes, Rob, I I was picking continent as a cat.

SPEAKER_01 44:49

Right.

SPEAKER_00 44:50

Right.

SPEAKER_01 44:51

You know, like everything's relative.

SPEAKER_00 44:53

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So everything's relative. One generation always makes fun of the generation. Not make fun of the city.

SPEAKER_01 44:59

Well, it's like the old adage that my parents we used to walk home, you know, back and forth to school both ways, six miles uphill both ways. You know, I I remember how hard it was. Now you guys get dropped off in the front of the school and you complain when it rains. Like I I mean, I've heard myself saying stuff like that. You always want the next generation to have it easier than you.

SPEAKER_00 45:18

Yeah, and now it's not to the point where it's like bus stop stops every five feet.

SPEAKER_01 45:22

And now, yeah, like, but not to the point where it enables them to not be able to do anything. I mean, that's I think where we need to draw the line. No, absolutely, right? Analog over digital. I'm all for it. We'll see you next week.

SPEAKER_02 45:36

Take care, bye.

SPEAKER_01 45:37

Bye.