How a Custom HoneyBook Build Helped This Grants Consultant Work Less and Give Her VA a System That Actually Works | EP. 40

In this episode, I'm sitting down with past client Kia Chatmon, founder of Heart for the Community Consulting a grants consulting firm serving nonprofit organizations. Kia gets real about what her business looked like before having a system, the moment she knew something had to change, and the wins she's experienced since building out her HoneyBook.

If you've ever wondered whether HoneyBook can work for your type of business;  especially if your services are custom or relationship-driven  this episode is for you.

In This Episode We Cover:

• The moment Kia hit her limit and knew she needed more than just a VA
• Why she watched a YouTube video and decided to hire someone instead of DIYing it
• How consolidating her tools changed the way she shows up for her clients
• What she delegated to her VA  and how that freed her to focus on growth
• The honest truth about actually using your system after it's built

♥️Connect with Kia Chatman: Heart for the Community Consulting heartforthecommunityconsulting.com

Heart for the Community provides grant consulting services;  grant readiness, grant research, proposal writing, and strategy development to small nonprofit organizations (those with budgets under $1M). 

🎙️ABOUT THE HOST

Hi, I'm Kenniqua Lewter, Client Experience Systems Strategist, HoneyBook Educator, and the host of the Systems Rehab Podcast. I help service providers create client experience systems that save time, strengthen client relationships, and build a business that runs with ease. 

➡️WAYS WE CAN WORK TOGETHER

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Transcript

Kenniqua Lewter (00:00)

What was the point where you knew that you needed help? Was there a situation that happened or what was that moment that you're like, okay, I just, know I need help with this.

Kia Chatmon (00:11)

realizing again as an entrepreneur, well, I can't just be in my business, but I have to be on my business. So I think recognizing that.

I have to do the work, but it's a business. So I want to grow it so that these other things I have to pay attention to. And then just recognizing if you don't want to be working 24 seven, you need help. And it's not just a person, but it's also systems.

Kenniqua Lewter (00:34)

welcome back to the systems rehab podcast. So today I have something special that I just had the idea of starting to do, which was to start bringing on past clients to share about their businesses, tell you guys more about what it is that they do. And then also just to share about how

the systems that we've done and worked together, how those have transformed and some wins that they've had in experience in their business just by implementing systems into the business. So I'm here with a special guest. I'm here with Kia and I want you to go ahead and introduce yourself. Go ahead and tell the people what it is that you do.

Kia Chatmon (01:12)

Sure, thank you for having me as a special guest today. My name is Kia Chapman. I am the founder of Heart for the Community Consulting, which serves, we're a grants consulting firm that serve nonprofit organizations, small nonprofits with budgets under $5 million. So that's the work that we do.

Kenniqua Lewter (01:29)

Okay, awesome.

Awesome. So I see that you actually went up on that because originally you were doing budgets of 1 million. So what kind of transpired in that? you were being able to go through and get more clients with a little bit higher budgets, I see.

Kia Chatmon (01:45)

Well, actually when I started, I had a higher level client and thought that I really want to provide my services and my skill to smaller organizations. But then, I guess since I'd had that experience, I why not? I mean, we won't go as high as 10, but still that five and under can be small to medium and can still use the services that we offer. So that was a decision to bump it back up to five.

Kenniqua Lewter (02:09)

okay, okay, that's awesome. So let me ask you, so like with your clients right now, you're doing the grants and the grant writing. So typically, what would you say, like how many clients do you typically work with? Like, let's just say over like a year basis, what does that actually look like for you?

Kia Chatmon (02:25)

Well, we have two different levels that we work with clients. We provide one-time services, so we provide grant readiness, research, and writing. Some clients might come and say, hey, I just want some research done to identify what type of foundations I'm eligible for. So we just might do the research for them. But then there are others that say, OK, internally, we know we want to grow our grants program, but we don't have internal staff. So we want someone on an ongoing basis to provide us with the research, the writing, making sure

we're submitting, so those are retainer clients. So I'd say over the course of a year, probably on average about three to four retainers where we're working with them for a longer term. And then maybe one or two one-offs per month, so someone who wants just research, who wants readiness, who is a nonprofit that says, we know there are these things called grants, we don't know how to do them ourselves, we've been raising through individuals or through events, are we ready for a grant? So we'll do a

readiness assessment to see if they're ready or to help them to get ready to pursue grants. So we would have maybe one or two in that one-off category per month.

Kenniqua Lewter (03:32)

Okay, okay. And so let me ask you, so right now I know you have a VA, do you have a team of other individuals that also help with the research and grant writing and things like that?

Kia Chatmon (03:45)

Not right now. would, that's the goal. That's the next step. I really would like to have, I did in the past have a few people I was working with that I trained to do the research and the writing, but I feel like really to help me to go to scale, it would be helpful to have one person who really understands research, who really understands writing and kind of be that partner to me in this effort. So that's the goal for the next step to get to that point, to be able to hire that person. But I do have a VA who's wonderful.

who

helps me with my calendar management. And I know we're going to talk about systems later, but she's really been the person to take and run with my honey book. That was one thing that I started off just as a freelancer. So it's really been a shift. I'm sure there are other entrepreneurs who can appreciate that going from a freelancer to a founder and having a business. So recognizing that there are systems that you have to have in place. So I was a freelancer. I would do a project.

I think it would be great. It would end and you know, I would wait for the next client. So I didn't have anything in place and didn't really understand the client journey. You you work with them, but then you want to stay in touch. You want to maybe grow the relationship or have them refer you. And so HoneyBook has allowed me to put that system, excuse me, in place to do that, to work with people through a whole cycle. And so she really keeps me on track with that. She keeps me on track with my calendar. She keeps me on track as I meet people to kind of bring them into my pipeline and you know, possibly become clients.

Kenniqua Lewter (04:48)

Yeah.

Kia Chatmon (05:13)

So she's my partner right now.

Kenniqua Lewter (05:15)

Yeah, that's awesome. So it's good that you do have a VA that was able to take responsibility for after your system was built to take responsibility to keep it updated, because that's one thing

that I do find is that just in systems in general is that we'll go through, we'll build systems, implement systems, but then when there's not anyone responsible for keeping it updated, like, so if you like, don't hire me to keep it updated for you, it's like, if no one's responsible, then naturally it will become outdated when your offers change or when you get other team members, et cetera. So I know that you mentioned like, cause I had you do like the whole intake for

And when me and you ⁓ were together, when I started doing and built out your honey book for you. And it's funny because I brought up exactly like the deliverables and everything that we did for you. That was back in twenty twenty four. So it has been some time since we we actually did go through and in.

got that built for you. And then I know that I had reached out to you last year to kind of do like a touch base, to follow up with you, to see, you know, how things are going. And I know that you mentioned that one of the things with your honey book is once you did have it set up, that it allowed for you to keep your communication with your clients more organized and also more effective, which improved your client experience. Can you tell me like, as far as, because I know, like I talk about client experience

the time, but what does that mean to you and how does that actually look like in your business?

Kia Chatmon (06:50)

I think having everything in one place, because again, coming from that freelancer perspective, I think as we start, like, oh, I need a system that does this. I need a platform that does this. So you might have your calendars in one thing, and that's what I had. had my calendar in one place, my contracts in another place. My communication was just email. And so if you're engaged in a conversation, say you have to go back and find something, it's, you know, I got to find that right thread and, this wasn't it. Let me find this one. But now having HoneyBook, my contracts,

go out there so I can just go into the system and see, when do things expire? Our communication is through HoneyBook, so it's easier to find conversations or to keep conversations going there.

And again, that think that client experience, even bringing clients on board. you know, we have the the initial contact and then it and actually because things would get lost with me. I might have someone reach out. Maybe I start in my email box. Maybe I forget to write down, follow up with this person at this time. But now having those automations, OK, we had the conversation. I haven't heard from him in two days. Let's let's reach out again. So it actually, I think, even shows them, ⁓ they care or she is

interested because she hasn't, I haven't fallen into a black hole, I haven't disappeared. She's still trying to connect with me. And I think it puts me, sometimes we reach out and they're like, you know, we need to, you know, we're not ready or come back to us, but at least shows them we're interested, you know, and we want to pursue that. So I think that's, those are some ways that it's helped.

Kenniqua Lewter (08:18)

Okay.

Yeah, and that's that's awesome because, that's definitely important for like having that communication in one place. So like when you were working with your clients before, well, like I kind of want to I think you alluded to it a little bit just because you said that you were using various things before. Like I know you were using I believe it was like Calendly. You were using DocuSign. So you were kind of piecing a couple of things together before. Do you think that now that you have a system in place like a centralized

Kia Chatmon (08:39)

Thank

Kenniqua Lewter (08:55)

place like using something like HoneyBook, do you think that your clients, like have you got any compliments of people really like noticing the difference between like your before of maybe, especially your retainer clients, like do they notice a difference and have they been able to kind of like seamlessly kind of integrate into your HoneyBook system?

Kia Chatmon (09:14)

They haven't made a comment, but I know on our side, we see it and we know, you know, the benefits, the effectiveness again.

having the record of helping us to manage the relationship, I think, to again, kind of staying on top of. So even having an onboarding and then an offboarding process, who I'm in the process with the client. Actually, no, think the client's going to stay. They said they want to extend the contract. So we won't be having offboarding, which is a good thing. But even that process, having

Kenniqua Lewter (09:41)

Okay, that's good.

Kia Chatmon (09:44)

And I don't know if they considered it maybe abrupt, you know, prior to the system, but I think at least now having a process, like there's certain questions and things that, like you just shared, okay, when you onboarded me, these were the things you said you wanted to do with me. We worked together, then at the end, let's check off and make sure we did those things. Now I kind of have that process with my client. You know, we said we were going to do X, Y, and Z for you. We end, we do X, Y, and Z so it ends, but then maybe, you know, three months ⁓ later, we have a touch point. You know, how are you doing?

months later have a touch point, how are you doing? Again, similar to you and me, you reached out a year later, how is it going with those systems? And honestly, I have a little confession. So it took me a while to really note to your point about you'll help a client set up a system, but then do they really use it? It took me some time to use it, to begin to use it. And Lee, my VA, has been a large part of that. She actually knows more about the system than I do. But it is important because it can be

great. You know, you can have a great system, all the great automations, but if you're not using them. So I have to say I'm still, probably could be using it more efficiently, but I at least, we have begun. And I said we do have that onboarding. We are managing through the process. We do have the offboarding. So we do have, you know, the framework and the systems in place too. And I think as I get to that place that I want to scale,

that is going to be helpful to have those records, have those people, to have those processes in place. And then HoneyBook actually, speaking about, and maybe you can help me with this and be part of the coaching piece, there are actually...

I guess items in HoneyBook, it tells you, you know, the leads you had last month, or it shows you that dashboard of kind of your progress. And I think I'm at a place where we're just getting good with putting things in, but I haven't reached that place of analysis to look at, okay, well, how is it going and kind of what can I do to even strengthen leads or what can I do to strengthen the client experience? But we're in a good place.

Kenniqua Lewter (11:22)

Mm-hmm.

OK, yeah, that's that's really good, because I know that and one thing I just want to touch on that you mentioned is like when you get the system done is actually going through and then utilizing it. So one of the things that I try to do, because like I said, it's been about two years since we were together. But I know like just from then, there's a couple of even process things that we even do a little bit differently on our side to make sure that when we turn over the bills to our clients, that

They are confident in using it because I know it's just like that habit. Like a lot of times what we do is just with anything, anything new. It's, kind of easier to go back to what we used to do when, especially when it's a time crunch, like we know, like I got to send an invoice right now. So instead of doing it the new way, I'm to do it the old way. Cause I got to send it in like the next five minutes. Um, so just getting in the habit of going through and just utilizing it every single

day is what I tell people. Not everyone uses it every day, but I think that's a really good habit just to kind of get yourself acclimated and build that habit because it literally is a habit. Like you don't have to, if you don't want to, you don't have to go inside the tool, right? You could literally continue going through email, could literally go through and send invoices the way that you were sending invoices, but it's really, I think just like that habit that naturally you build over time. So it's good that you

you, your VA have been able to go through and work the system the way ⁓ that works best for you. Let me ask you, so since us working together, I know you had, I think it was like two offers, I believe. Have you added any additional offers or anything like that?

Kia Chatmon (13:29)

I have, and we just integrated that into HoneyBook. So as I shared earlier, so we have our one-off services, you your research, or maybe it's a, we call it a master content document, a master grant application for you. So those were two services. Then our retainers at various levels. I believe you created, you built that into the system, but this year I just introduced a training course.

So we've, and I believe we've added that into the system, but that's new. other than, then, I know if I added my grant readiness. So yes, we have expanded a little bit since then. And the most recent change we made when we first created this system, had a...

Kenniqua Lewter (13:53)

Okay.

Kia Chatmon (14:09)

discovery call link to for potential clients to connect with me and schedule a time to talk with me. What has started to happen, I think starting late last year and early this year is not potential clients reaching out to me, but potential partners reaching out to me. So potential collaborators. we just, so Lee just created a link for someone who doesn't necessarily want to work with me as a client, but someone who sees some potential synergies or partnerships in what we do.

Kenniqua Lewter (14:27)

Okay.

Kia Chatmon (14:38)

So to reach out to me that way. we are finding new ways to It is becoming necessary to expand You know what we're using the tool for because as we grow and evolve and things change But so far it's it's been growing with us. So it seems to seem so it's for our purposes right now. It seems to work

Kenniqua Lewter (14:57)

Okay, that's awesome. And even when you went through and added the additional offer, did you also go through and like, there any like animations or anything that you went and added to it as well?

Kia Chatmon (15:08)

We

think we've done that. We probably should. We haven't done that yet. It's really just, I think for the collaborators, it's just the link and the email communication to connect with me, adding it to the calendar with the course. Now with the course she did, yeah, she does have a, she did create automations for the course. So yes, that's there, but for the collaborators, no, not yet.

Kenniqua Lewter (15:31)

OK, I mean, that's fine, because with the collaborators, if you set as like a link for them to schedule a call, then the automations for the scheduler were like how basically how we even set this meeting up. They would still get those reminders automatically. So if you don't necessarily need to have an automation for that, unless there's something else you needed to send to them, like more additional questions or something. For the chorus, OK, that's awesome.

Kia Chatmon (15:33)

Mm-hmm.

Right, right. Yeah, it might not apply to them, but for the course we did, yeah.

Kenniqua Lewter (15:57)

All right. And I know that another thing too that you had mentioned is that you're sending out your proposal templates that were created for you that helped you to be able to save a lot of time. And you mentioned just like saving yourself stress. Can you want because I think a lot of times because your services are for the most part, they're pretty custom. What would you say to?

people that don't necessarily want to use proposal templates because of the service that they offer may be custom.

Kia Chatmon (16:30)

Well, we've had to, I think it's good to have a template to start and then you can tweak as necessary.

Because I have found myself doing that, ⁓ even though I have kind of my menu of services and I like people to stay within those, there might be something that maybe in conversation someone doesn't need or they need a tweak, it at least gives you a place to start. So you're not recreating something each time with each client. So you can have your kind of standard offerings, your standard language, but then if you have someone that comes to you where they need something, a little one off, you can still start with that.

template and and edit as necessary because I have found myself having to do having to do that.

Kenniqua Lewter (17:13)

Okay, yeah, that's perfect. That's what I tell people all the time. Like, okay, I know that it's custom, but there are some things that I'm pretty sure that you're going to repeat in each proposal. And is this like...

Kia Chatmon (17:21)

Mm-hmm. Right.

Kenniqua Lewter (17:24)

have the things that you're going to repeat and then anything that you have to add to it later per client, if it's custom, then just add it. But instead of creating a whole new document every single time is definitely going to save you so much time because like I said, you mentioned that it saved you time on average. How much would you say like even just the proposal piece? Like how much time would you say that that does save you between how you were doing it before and then like how you do it now inside of

at Honeyburg.

Kia Chatmon (17:54)

Well, even

though I saw a DocuSign was literally the signing of it, I mean, to create it in the very beginning, think, similar to what we just talked about, I would create it so that it would be created for that client, probably saved in that client's folder, sent through DocuSign, signed by that client. But then another client comes up, I have to go find that template.

add then the clients, the company, the contact, the scope, the scope may or may not change the date. So it was all a manual process. But now again with HoneyBook, it's there.

And because of how the link, because you set up the project and the contacts, it automatically fills the organization. It automatically fills the contacts. I don't have to hunt and find and confirm the spelling, the contact information, and all of that. So.

Kenniqua Lewter (18:42)

you

Kia Chatmon (18:48)

I don't know exactly, but a lot because before it was, it was the locating, it was the editing. And then sometimes I found I could put my hands on the PDF, but not the words. So I'd have to convert the PDF to a word. So it's, it's safe time. It's definitely safe time.

Kenniqua Lewter (18:50)

you

Yeah.

yeah, that sounds like a time savings because that sounds like a lot to do. That whole copy and paste and find, it definitely saves a lot of time. So let me ask you, so when you were going through, so what was the moment that

Kia Chatmon (19:06)

you

Kenniqua Lewter (19:19)

you were running your business and I know running your business is you, is your VA. What was the point where you knew that you needed help? Was there a situation that happened or what was that moment that's like, okay, I'm going to go because I know you found me on YouTube. So it's like, what was that moment that you're like, okay, I just, know I need help with this.

Kia Chatmon (19:42)

Well, that's a good question. I think you just get up to a point of saturation as an individual, right? So, you know, one client, one client you're communicating with, maybe two you're communicating with, but then three, and then kind of juggling everything with the three, and then realizing again as an entrepreneur, well, I can't just be in my business, but I have to be on my business. So I think recognizing that.

I have to do the work, but it's a business. So I want to grow it so that these other things I have to pay attention to. And then just recognizing if you don't want to be working 24 seven, you need help. And it's not just a person, but it's also systems. And I think that's, yeah, I can't, I think, think it just, and it might be different for every person. when whatever that saturation point is for you, when things start falling through the cracks,

Yeah, when things start falling through cracks, you find yourself. I know for me, because the nature of what we do...

It's not only dependent on what I create, I have to pass it on to a client. So the point, at least on the proposal writing or the proposal writing side, their deadlines. So I had the things I need to meet, but then I have to get it to a client in a certain amount of time. And then they have a certain amount of time. have to get it back to me. you know, clients, I'm sure all of us have had the experience that not always is on the ball as you need them to be. So there was a lot of follow-up to kind of nudge them and to get them to do what I needed them to do. So that takes a lot of time.

Kenniqua Lewter (20:46)

Mm-hmm.

Kia Chatmon (21:08)

so recognizing like, okay, I can't.

There are only so many hours in a day. I don't want to work all of them. There has to be a better way. So then you start looking for systems. might start looking, and part of that might be a person, another person to do that follow up to you. But then as I've been in business and talked to other business owners and just hearing what other people use, and actually it was a colleague and friend. went through the Goldman Sachs 1 million black women program and one of the women in my cohort,

Kenniqua Lewter (21:35)

Okay.

Kia Chatmon (21:36)

We're all kind of sharing sharing our systems kind of you know, what do we what do we do? And how do we do it? And she just sang the praises of HoneyBook. So was like, okay, let me you know, let me check this out and I would bring up things I needed she would say HoneyBook does that HoneyBook does that and you know speaking about saturation, but I didn't feel like I could learn one more thing I was like this is great that there's this system, but I don't know if I want to use it So I think I went on YouTube and I watched one of your videos. It was long. It was like

I think it was an hour where you really walked us through. So I appreciated that. I was like, okay, here is something I can do. But I was like, I don't want to do that.

Again, it's that one more thing. So if there's someone who can be, if I can tell you this is what I needed to do, this is what I needed to look like, and you can do it for me, great. So that's what brought me to you. And then even beyond that, so I didn't really have to learn it, but I'm like, I don't know if I want to operate this. So was like, again, a VA, know, somebody who can, okay, I have the system, I've put in it what I needed to do, what I needed to look like, how it should flow. Now here's someone who can do it for me.

Kenniqua Lewter (22:15)

Yeah.

Kia Chatmon (22:43)

So that I can I'm still working in my business but that freed up time for me to do more work on it and again putting those systems in place as I'm able to work on it and scale it and grow it as people come in There's there's the system and it's not me trying to do everything and me dropping things ⁓ But there's a there's a process. There's a flow So it again so a time saver stress remover and also efficiencies, know for my business because

if it had stayed me in all these different places, there would only be so much I could do. So it helps with your business growth and effectiveness as well.

Kenniqua Lewter (23:22)

Yeah, I love everything that you said. It's so funny that you mentioned like Goldman Sachs program because I recently even was it in December or January, I had a client that came from that program too. She said the exact same thing. Someone told me about HoneyBook. So I went on YouTube and she did the exact same thing. She watched one YouTube video and was like, hey, I need you to sign this up. So it's funny. Goldman Sachs, you guys are sending me some people by just walking away.

Kia Chatmon (23:35)

Okay.

I'm fine.

Kenniqua Lewter (23:50)

So that's really interesting. And I love the fact because that was actually going to be my next question was about the DIY version because I know that.

people sometimes know that they need systems and then they decide to set it up on their own. But it's great that you kind of mentioned why you didn't want to necessarily do that just because you knew that it would probably take time. And I know that when me and you start working together is you were you were already on top of it. Like you had everything that you needed submitted. I want it done. But you already knew then I'm going to send this to my VA. Like you already told me that like

After you get done, I'm going to give all this information to my VA. Like even the videos, you were like, tutorial videos, my VA is going to watch them. So that was awesome because you were already laser focused of like, I'm going to get this set up and I'm going to delegate for someone to actually go through and maintain it. So that was really good.

All right. So also to so the next question that I have here, I actually I think I already asked that question, so I'm not even worried about it. But yeah, so I really like this information that you that you shared about it. One of the things too is that what do you feel like the experience was like working with us of going through incentives? So you you came to me, we set up your system. How would you say the experience was like actually getting it done and working with us from like a client experience standpoint?

Kia Chatmon (25:17)

I had a good, had, was, because I could see you were using HoneyBook, like even our communications, like, okay, so this is what HoneyBook will do for me, these, you know, the timing, just helping, you know, the communication flow was good, your responsiveness.

definitely were responsive to all my questions. The follow-up was good. I know I think I dropped the ball on my end. I think it took me some time. I think you follow up again with that kind of off-boarding. mean we did our off-boarding but then it was follow-up. But I think I was probably at a place I was overwhelmed. And I probably didn't want to tell you too like well I haven't really used it the way I should. So there might have been a little bit of let me get back with her but I'm really up to par.

Kenniqua Lewter (25:52)

It's okay. That's, that's

natural. You don't understand how many people are in that same boat. Like I'll reach out and like I'll do like my 30 days, 60 days, 90 days. And of course I do a year and stuff like that, but you'll, there's other people that are in the boat. They're like, I've been so busy. I didn't do it. Like it's okay. We can get, let's get back on it. We can do it.

Kia Chatmon (26:14)

But you

put so much work into it, you don't be like, I haven't used it yet. But that was good. And then I also appreciated, and I think I might start integrating this into my world like that loom video where you're walking us through, because I think many of us.

Well, me, I'm a note taker. So we can have a conversation. I can take notes, but sometimes, you know, they're so hurried or I put a shorthand and I can't remember what my shorthand meant to me. So the video recording of walking through the process is walking through what do, that I could also go back to, or, know, to your point could give my VA. So even, you know, lovely, don't think she's going anywhere, but should she change the next person coming in, you know, should they, when they need to be trained, it's there. So,

Kenniqua Lewter (26:58)

Mm-hmm.

Kia Chatmon (26:58)

So

I think the systems that you have in place, know, using HoneyBook for your client experience and communicating with us, just your due diligence and clarity and openness and patience with me as a client was appreciated. And then that recording that we have is kind of that takeaway so that I don't have to like email, you know, K'Nigel, what was it that you told me? Because he would be receiving a thousand and one emails from me the video that you still might receive one or two, but

Kenniqua Lewter (27:22)

you

Kia Chatmon (27:28)

lot of the questions are answered in the videos that you have it for posterity to go back to when you're in the midst of using the product.

Kenniqua Lewter (27:35)

Yeah, I think the video tutorial, because one of my goals is when I work with clients and just, like I said, from us, the time that we work together and then like fast forward even now, like one of my goals is to make sure that because I know the one of the gaps of like done for you services is the learning curve when I turn it over to clients. And so my goal is to make sure that as I can put them in the driver seat,

And maybe in the passenger seat after we get done doing the build. So like we do the 30 days of support. Now we do like support tickets. Like I don't mind the emails, but now we do like submitting support tickets and stuff like that, which is always good for just added support for the clients. But that's so important to like those videos of your account to show you how to actually go through and use it. Because it's like, OK, I do have like a whole honey book.

like quote unquote course that I did before, but that's not helpful if it doesn't look like how yours looks, you know, using your actual using your actual account and making sure that you know how to do, because the thing about it is I feel like HoneyBook is so robust. Like you literally have a grant writing company and research company and you're using HoneyBook.

Kia Chatmon (28:38)

Exactly.

Kenniqua Lewter (28:54)

I also build it out for clients that have pet concierge that do venue. So it's so many different types of industries that can use HoneyBook and yet everybody.

can use it differently. So it's always like kind of important to show you like, this is how you navigate it for yourself. And you don't have to worry about all the other things that don't really matter to you in particular. So next question I have for you is like just about like the investment. So have you in the past made any type of like investments in your business that were

like a few thousand dollars. Have you made any type of investments like that in the past?

Kia Chatmon (29:37)

Yes. And that's something that I think will just ⁓ a piece of advice for other entrepreneurs. It's, you gotta be careful because again, I think when you start it's like, I need this, I need this, I need this. And so you can look up and you've spent thousands, you know, on all these things. And then you learn like, I really didn't need that. I didn't really need that. So I'm getting better. I am getting better. Really taking a look at,

And that's actually something I want to do again is look at all of the platforms and all the software because really for the nature of my business, the research and the writing, there's not a lot of equipment, but there are subscriptions, but really and systems. So they're really, that's something I want to do this year is really kind of step back and look at all of my needs and how I'm currently meeting those needs and if everything is necessary. Because again,

Kenniqua Lewter (30:14)

Mm-hmm.

Kia Chatmon (30:29)

you can look up and you know, it's and sometimes you can get surprised because you might buy into something and you get that introduction. I think that's happened to me. You get that introductory rate. Maybe it's like $25 a month coming out of your account and then you look up and $80 came out and you're like, what's that? And it's like, oh, it went up. So, so yes, I have done that and I'm getting better to really take stock in what I, what I need. And if I'm due,

Kenniqua Lewter (30:41)

Yeah.

Kia Chatmon (30:58)

things as effective as effectively and efficiently ⁓ as I can with with what I have or through things and similar to HoneyBook like I said I was doing it probably is replaced at least two if not three other other applications and I did do that comparison like okay right now I'm paying this and this and this so what is that per month versus what this is and there definitely was a savings so

Kenniqua Lewter (31:19)

Mm-hmm.

Kia Chatmon (31:24)

That's been my experience.

Kenniqua Lewter (31:26)

Yeah, so you actually brought up a really good point, too, because over since the time that we've actually did your HoneyBook setup, the price of HoneyBook has gone up. So do you feel like even as the price went up, does it make you question like, OK, maybe I don't maybe I shouldn't be using this. Maybe I should just try to do something else. Or how did you feel about?

Kia Chatmon (31:36)

Mm-hmm.

Kenniqua Lewter (31:53)

like the price going up and did it still seem like it was worth it to you?

Kia Chatmon (31:54)

Right.

That's a good question. it's similar to what I said, because sometimes we, find myself in that place with another, actually another subscription that I have, because I reached, the business has grown to where we're beyond the free. So we have to do paid. And so I find myself comparing other.

Kenniqua Lewter (32:11)

Mm-hmm.

Kia Chatmon (32:15)

platforms offer a similar service, but I also find myself saying, I've become so used to this one. All of my information is in this one. Is it worth it to shift? And then could I find myself in a place where, I mean, do you want to do that? Like every time it changed, do you keep shifting and shifting and shifting and shifting?

So that's a question that I've started to ask myself about some of these systems that I've invested in.

And so far I don't have any plans because there is so much in Honey Black. You the templates that are in there, my contracts are in there, my projects are in there, the clients are in there. Again, that analysis where it's showing me, Kia, you had this many leads this month or you collected this much money this month. And the investment I made with you to set it up. So I probably won't, I probably will keep it. I probably won't leave it just because of the investment in money.

in me getting familiar with it, in my VA getting invested in it. And I think that's the question we probably have to ask ourselves as those prices go up is look at not only the monetary investment that you made, but the time, the training, and then saying, okay, if I do shift, I'll have to go through all that again.

So my answer, at least as far as HoneyBook's concerned, is no. I probably will stay and ride with them. Unless it becomes exorbitant. I if it becomes exorbitant, then maybe that's the question. Like, what's your threshold? But I don't think it's reached its threshold with me right now.

Kenniqua Lewter (33:50)

Yeah, I love that you said that and kind of really broke that down like that, because that's the way that I think about it as as well. It's like all of the the time spent learning something. And that's not just with Honey Book, that's with anything like I kind of put that.

Kia Chatmon (34:04)

Mm-hmm.

Kenniqua Lewter (34:05)

that filter on any tool that I use is all the time that I spent learning it, everything that I have in it. Like as a business owner, do I actually have the time to go through and switch everything then learn something just to possibly get over to the other side and then they raise their price too, you know? And so.

Kia Chatmon (34:22)

And they will. They will.

Kenniqua Lewter (34:24)

Yeah, and

they eventually will. So it's kind of like one of those things I kind of, and then I'm not, I've never really been that person to go switch from something that I'm paying for to like, I'm just gonna piecemeal things together of free tools because I feel like those kind of allow for you to hit those types of limits. But

adds to your point is that it does have to become a limit. And I think with any tool or software, like you should have that limit, like, okay, this is just too much. It's no longer worth it.

you know, as far as HoneyBook goes, it's like if I'm signing clients, it's paying for itself as I'm going through and I'm signing clients. And so and that's like the one of the main tools that I use. So, yeah, I was just wondering about your take on that since you since you mentioned that. So what I want to do is I kind of want to go through and I appreciate you sharing all of that that information because you shared a lot about just like your your journey about like systems and how.

and how that's actually like transform your business. Because I think a lot of times, like I talk about systems all the time, but I'm just like a systems person. And so it's good that for someone to hear it from someone that, no, I'm not a systems person, but I know that I needed systems. I think it's really good for people to hear like your perspective on it as well. So I do want to kind of shift the conversation into, know that we can do some type of coaching or strategy.

Kia Chatmon (35:28)

you

Kenniqua Lewter (35:48)

I kind of want to shift the conversation in that direction and just kind of open it up to what exactly like is your biggest struggle or what do you need at this moment that maybe I could help you with.

Kia Chatmon (36:00)

guess if you can give me some insight, again, on the analysis piece, because we have the, because I get, know, I open HoneyBook and it has this dashboard. And a lot of times I'm not even looking at the dashboard, I'm just going into what I'm there for. I'm going to the scheduler, or I'm going to the particular contact, or I'm going to the contract. But I know it, I think it even has tips for me there. Like it tells me how many leads I had in for a cert, for the last month, or I currently have in. And there's probably some other things I'm forgetting in that dashboard.

So you have any insights into how we can use HoneyBook to analyze or the analysis components that HoneyBook offers of our, the insights, I guess you giving insights of the insights that HoneyBook is giving us as business owners and how we can use that, that would be helpful to me.

Kenniqua Lewter (36:47)

Yeah, so what I because I'm looking at it right now. So as far as the the insights here, so a couple of things that I would recommend. So it does allow for you to go through and download your reports. So I would recommend number one is downloading those reports. So maybe like just like on a monthly basis, just download them and gives you a chance to kind of review what's going on. A couple of things that it does point out. So it does show you like your gross revenue that you're making.

Kia Chatmon (36:50)

and then we'll

Kenniqua Lewter (37:17)

so far in the year. It does do like files, books, like the files that you're sending out like contracts, invoices, things like that and it breaks it down per month so you can kind of see like how much revenue that you're also getting per month and you can download that.

It also gives you like a booked versus sent file. So this part can be helpful because let's say you're sending and it breaks it down basically into two categories like your contracts, your contract and invoices, then forms that just have invoices and just contracts. So this can kind of help you to understand. It gives you like your booking rate percentage. So let's say you're doing grants, you're sending out proposals for grants.

and you send out four proposals, but yet only two people booked, that's going to give you a booking rate of 50%. So you can use that data to kind of figure out, well, why is it that these other two, why didn't they book? And so you can use that information to see, okay, are you doing sales calls?

Kia Chatmon (38:24)

Yes.

Kenniqua Lewter (38:25)

Okay. And you're doing a sales call and then you are sending out the proposal after the sales call. Okay.

Kia Chatmon (38:31)

Right. If yes, if

that's the next step they want to take, yes.

Kenniqua Lewter (38:34)

OK, OK, so just like, for example, so like if you're doing a sales call, let's say you do have a booking rate that is a little bit lower. So a good booking rate, I would say, and I would personally just say is about 80, 75 to 80 percent. Like I would say, like would be like a pretty good booking rate.

If you're not getting that booking rate, I would look at number one, the sales call to see what's going on on the call. So kind of going back, reviewing some of your like download some of your, your calls and just review them and see what's happening on a sales call. Like they told me they wanted to move over. I move forward, but I sent the proposal, but they didn't complete it. So either a they gave what my coach likes to tell me is a false. Yes. So they told you yes, but.

They really didn't mean to like they knew they weren't going to do it when they told you yes. They just said yes to kind of like please you or kind of kind of get off the phone. So we want to kind of kind of determine that on the sales call or B, it could be the proposal itself. Like what's what's missing from the proposal? Are there FAQs in the proposal? For example, like if you're getting people that might have frequently asked questions, but those aren't necessarily addressed and you have a lower booking rate, then maybe add that to the proposal.

when you send it out. Maybe it's the offer. So maybe if you didn't cover what that pricing was and the sales call. like in your sales calls, and then we're just using an example, but in your sales call, do you normally tell them what the price is or do you have to later tell them the price?

Kia Chatmon (40:05)

No, tell them because they typically ask and you know want to know before the contract is sent. So yes, the proposal.

Kenniqua Lewter (40:11)

OK,

awesome. so that part necessarily because they're not surprised when they get the proposal. So that that information helps. So that's what you can kind of see inside of HoneyBook. So you can see what that booking rate is. So I definitely would use that data to determine, OK, am I doing what I think I'm actually doing? Because sometimes it may feel different, especially if you're sending out a lot of contracts and invoices, you might not necessarily be paying attention to like who's signing, who's moving forward.

as well as even timeframes of, how long is it taking someone to book? And if it's taking them maybe longer to book, why is it taking them longer to book? Is there no expectation that's set for them to book? So that's a couple of things that you can look at. And then the other section that they have under the reports is there's also just a booking section. So.

It'll tell you like the number of bookings. You have the gross booked amount. So it'll tell you like your gross booked amount, all your collected payments, outstanding payments, refunds. So that's pretty good, especially if you do have outstanding payments that maybe clients, you know, they haven't paid. That's definitely something to kind of take a look at to see what's happening. Even refunded payments. So like if there is a situation where you're, excuse me, where you're refunding clients, then that's something to kind of take a look at too to see, okay, our refund rate

is kind of going up what's going on here. And then the last part on this page, we're actually two more things. So the, the last section of here is this, the lead generation from your contact forms. So like on your contact form, you'll have a question to say, like, you know, how did you hear about me? You'll be able to see that in the reports. So this data could be used if you're having a lot of people say they're coming to you from Instagram.

Kia Chatmon (41:56)

right.

Kenniqua Lewter (42:07)

but yet you're on Facebook all the time then

It may be data to use to be like, okay, well, if everybody's coming to me from Instagram, maybe I don't need to be doing Facebook as much. So it kind of allows for you to kind of use this data to see where, is everybody really coming from? Like I know like what myself, like majority of my people come from YouTube or they come from like a client referral, maybe, you know, podcasts or whatever, but they're not coming from Instagram. So I don't do as much anymore on Instagram. Cause it's like my people just, they're just not coming from there. So that's how you can use that data.

Kia Chatmon (42:38)

brain.

Kenniqua Lewter (42:41)

And then the last thing I would say is that you can also ⁓ filter data based off from the report based off of tags. inside your honey book under your company settings, you can have tags. And I believe you have some tags, but you can always add more and tag for various things. But I always recommend to tag by offer. like.

your different offers so you'll be able to basically organize and categorize your contacts and your projects by offer. So let's say if you needed to send and bring up everybody that had your one on one grant offer.

You can go through, bring everybody up and see the status of them or even reach out to them, maybe with another offer. But in the report, you can also organize by tags as well. So if you want to see data specifically to your one-on-ones, then you can just bring up data for that as well.

Kia Chatmon (43:37)

Okay, no, that's really helpful. Especially the leads, because that is something that I want to, in the beginning, it was referrals, which was great. know, previous co-workers or clients referring other people, now I'm ⁓ active on LinkedIn.

for my social media, but there's still other places that I talk about or that the business is. So would be helpful to have that, how they're finding me so I know where to invest additional time and effort. Yeah. Okay. Thank you for that. That's, yeah, that's helpful.

Kenniqua Lewter (44:05)

Yeah, that's definitely healthy.

No problem. Did you have another question?

Kia Chatmon (44:12)

No, think that's Yeah, again, I know we just probably need to spend some time and dig in because it's...

I wonder if any of us really use anything to its fullest, like even my phone, like you have all these bells and whistles on it. But for me, it's really just a phone, contacts, know, apps when I go to stores to get my discounts, but there's probably, you know, a thousand other things I don't tap it for. So HoneyBook, I'm better than when we first started working together. So I feel like I've taken like a step, but I think there's still some, you know, some additional steps we can take to make sure we're using it to its fullest. But we're off to a good start.

Kenniqua Lewter (44:28)

Yeah

Kia Chatmon (44:48)

And it's definitely helped, again, know, giving back time, reduce stress, made the business more efficient, I think improved the client experience. And I know as I grow, having it in place will definitely be helpful.

Kenniqua Lewter (45:01)

Yeah. And I think right now you have the basis, like the foundation of utilizing and having systems into your business. And that's really all you do need. How you actually go through and even scale it beyond that, because you're already using like the contact form, the proposals, questionnaires, email templates. I think I already said schedulers and you have automation. So really from there, it's really just about.

adding

more automation as you go. So as you go through and you see that, like, for example, your new offer that you created is going through and just literally like mapping that out. So like when a client comes in for that was a group offer, right? Membership.

Kia Chatmon (45:34)

bright.

A training course, a five week training.

Kenniqua Lewter (45:49)

A training course.

Yeah, so the training course, it comes with calls. Is it live calls?

Kia Chatmon (45:55)

No, just

live online, a live online course. No call.

Kenniqua Lewter (46:00)

okay.

Okay. And but they're paying through HoneyBook.

Kia Chatmon (46:03)

Yes.

Kenniqua Lewter (46:04)

Okay. And so when you set that up, what form did you use? Did you use a HoneyBook lead form for them to pay for that?

Kia Chatmon (46:13)

can't remember, you know, Lee does this for me.

Kenniqua Lewter (46:16)

Okay, yeah. Yeah, so I was just curious of how how you were said they only pay one time though, right? Or is it recurring? One time?

Kia Chatmon (46:22)

Yes, no round current, just

a one-time payment.

Kenniqua Lewter (46:25)

OK. OK. So yeah, so that's a pretty easy, pretty easy setup. Not much automation that you would need to do there. You already said that there was something set up for automation, but really it's just pay for it, provide the deliverable and automation. So that's fine. But that's where like where you were.

Kia Chatmon (46:31)

Mm-hmm.

Kenniqua Lewter (46:43)

system will basically continue to elevate is just through the automation. Like you already have the foundation. So as you're going through and you're adding more things, you're tweaking things, it's just about going through and just adding more automation where you see necessary, right? That is actually going to benefit you, but you're already using the foundational pieces of what you need inside of HoneyBook. Like you already have that done. So if you're adding something, you literally can go,

through and duplicate anything that you've already done. Like if you have like a questionnaire you can literally duplicate that questionnaire, change the questions and change pictures or whatever for your next offer and you're good to go. So you already have the foundation just you probably just need a little bit more automation for other things that you that you're currently working on.

Kia Chatmon (47:16)

Right, right.

Yeah, I definitely feel like we have a strong foundation. That's why I we probably won't leave anytime soon because so much is there.

Kenniqua Lewter (47:42)

Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. Well, I appreciate this conversation. It was nice speaking with you. I do want you just to share with the listeners of, know, what you're if you have anything that's coming up that they can take advantage of with grant writing, because I know that that's our grant research. I know that a lot of businesses could definitely utilize that if you have anything coming up and where they can actually get in contact with you.

Kia Chatmon (48:07)

Sure. Well, if there happen to be any nonprofit leaders listening or you're on the board of directors with a nonprofit that needs any grant services, again, we get you ready for grants, get you well positioned. We can do writing for you as well as research. ⁓ And for those who might be interested, I'll do my grant ready. It was a grant readiness course or grant readiness training that I offered last month. So I will be doing that again in the past this summer. But we are heart for the community consulting. So W.

www.heartforthecommunityconsulting.com and reach out to us there or view us there, see what we have to offer again. Grant readiness research and writing for nonprofit organizations, five million and under. A lot of our clients, while not all are black led, we really enjoy working with black led organizations. They face different challenges which we understand, so we really help to help you get well positioned to get some of the funding that's

out there because it's, I would say it's always been a competitive ⁓ field. However, with so many cuts, so I should say that we focus on private and corporate foundation grants. And now with so many cuts happening on the federal level, there are a lot of folks who weren't paying attention to private and corporate foundation grants and now they're kind of jumping into this pool with us. So it's more important than ever that we're grant ready and that we can put our best foot forward. So we will work with you to make sure you can do that.

Kenniqua Lewter (49:14)

Okay.

All right. Well, thank you so much for sharing that and speaking with me today. It's been a pleasure catching up with you.

Kia Chatmon (49:38)

Yeah,

this has been good. Thank you.

Kenniqua Lewter (49:40)

Thank you.