Slavery Never Ended It Just Changed Form with Tristan Matthew Chen (USA)

Slavery did not vanish, it changed its paperwork, its supply chains, and its hiding places. I sit down with Tristan Matthew Chen, director of the United States Anti-Slavery Organisation (USASO), to name what modern slavery looks like right now and why so many people never see it, even when it is tied to everyday life. 

We dig into prison labour in the United States and the uncomfortable legal truth inside the 13th Amendment: slavery is banned except as punishment for a crime. Tristan Chen explains how that exception connects to unjust incarceration, policies like mandatory minimums and three strikes laws, and a prison economy where people can be forced to work for pennies or nothing. We also talk about the less visible costs, including predatory fees that make families pay to stay connected, and how corporate contracts can quietly profit from mass incarceration. 

Then we widen the lens to human trafficking and forced labour globally, including cobalt mining in the Democratic Republic of Congo, a critical resource for batteries in mobile phones and laptops. Tristan Chen shares why USASO centres education, peaceful civic engagement, and survivor voices, and how he hopes to build local chapters that keep pressure on leaders to uphold due process and equal protection under the law. 

If you care about modern slavery awareness, prison slavery, human trafficking, and ethical supply chains, this conversation will sharpen how you see the world and what you can do next. Subscribe, share this with a friend, and leave us a review. What part of modern slavery do you think is most ignored today?

Music, lyrics, guitar and singing by Dr Ariel Rosita King

Teach me to live one day at a time
with courage love and a sense of pride.
Giving me the ability to love and accept myself
so I can go and give it to someone else.
Teach me to live one day at a time.....

Transcript

Dr Ariel R King 0:07

Hello and welcome to another episode of the Business of Life with Dr. King. Today we have a very special guest who's here for the second time, Mr. Tristan Chen. Welcome.

Tristan Matthew Chen 0:19

Hi, Dr. King. Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure to be here with you again.

Dr Ariel R King 0:23

So happy that you're here. Would you please introduce yourself to our audience and also the topic for today?

Tristan Matthew Chen 0:29

Sure. So my name is Tristan Matthew Chen. I'm the director of the USASO, the United States Anti-Slavery Organization. It's a brand new 501c3 nonprofit based here

Welcome And Guest Introduction

Tristan Matthew Chen 0:44

in America. And we are actively involved in really spreading awareness about modern slavery in America and elsewhere and sort of fighting for justice and freedom. So it's a pleasure to be here and to talk about that.

Dr Ariel R King 1:00

Thank you. It's so nice to see a young person taking on a really important issue. To get started, why don't we let people all over the world understand what exactly is anti-slavery? Because you know, for many people it means different things.

Tristan Matthew Chen 1:15

Yeah, so slavery obviously takes on many forms, and the USASO is sort of general, broad, collective human rights group that's advocating, you know, towards the end of modern slavery. And so really in America, where we see slavery today is obviously in prisons. So slavery is still legal under the 13th Amendment slavery exception. So we have slavery in prisons and the issue of unjust incarceration, the idea that there are an unprecedented thousands of people, you

Defining Modern Slavery Today

Tristan Matthew Chen 1:49

know, who are unjustly incarcerated, laboring, you know, life in prison for like a gram of marijuana, or people who are wrongfully convicted for crimes they did not commit. And then we also see slavery take on in the form of human trafficking. So, major example, the DRC, Africa, the Democratic Republic of Congo. That country is producing almost 80% of the global cobalt supply. So cobalt is a mineral that's found in our phones, our laptops, computers, and batteries. And, you know, whether we like it or not, you know, we as consumers, you know, it's like slavery in your pocket, your phone. So this is what like the USASO is really focusing on, just kind of spreading awareness about these modern slavery issues. Our main pillars are really like educational community organization, peaceful civic engagement to spread, you know, public awareness that can lead to that freedom and justice ultimately from the American Congress. And so, yeah, it's I'm so happy to be here with you again. It's been quite the year since we last talked. It's obviously great to see you. And yeah, thanks for having me.

Dr Ariel R King 3:04

My pleasure. So, since it's been, why don't you give us more of an idea of the reason you started your organization and what you're working on now with your new organization?

Tristan Matthew Chen 3:16

Yeah, I think ever since I graduated from Gettysburg College in Pennsylvania. So, for those who don't know, the Battle of Gettysburg in 1863 was the turning point of the American Civil War. It was the bloodiest battle the North and South fought over slavery. So going to Gettysburg, you know, being immersed in that history of the Civil War, you know, being a part of fraternity. I mean, I was a part of

Why He Founded USASO

Tristan Matthew Chen 3:41

Phi Gamma Delta fraternity chapter, which was established in 1858. You know, when you're there at Gettysburg and you see the battlefields and you study history there, and then you also, you know, take into account the modern issues that are currently going on, it was really hard for me to sort of ignore everything that's happening that most people have no idea about. And so that was sort of at that point in time when I was a student when I made that commitment to dedicate myself to freedom and justice and you know, advocacy. And so where I am now, obviously in college, I had my history abolition club. I was really passionate about organizing my fraternity brothers and campus. But now, you know, I've sort of you know taken that next step. You know, how do we do that on a bigger scale, on a bigger level with a greater impact? So that's obviously my goal with the USASO. We actually just had our first event at Gettysburg on April 20th, you know, the second Gettysburg address. And it was, you know, a panel discussion that I moderated with there's like Gentry Smith, he was a former secretary of state for diplomatic security, Bruce Bryan, a guy who spent 30 years in prison wrongfully incarcerated until clemency, Richard is a lawyer, Jack. And we just had this great conversation about you know the current state of affairs of modern slavery. And so I guess that's where my head's at. You know, how do I continue to organize these events, to continue to create these partnerships with people who have a genuine interest in like supporting the cause for justice and freedom? Yeah. So honestly, you know, planning that and really excited for the future, but it's good.

Dr Ariel R King 5:42

I I love the fact that you actually had an event in the same place again, but with people who are basically saying to people around, well, you know, slavery was supposed to end, but the truth is it hasn't ended. Um it never really did end, it's just transformed into other places, you know, kind of like a balloon. You squeeze it in one place, but the air is still there in the other place. Can you tell us more about young people being involved in what you're doing and how you're encouraging and educating young people on this issue?

Tristan Matthew Chen 6:15

Yeah, I think history is so important. I I love history and history, you know, at Gettysburg, obviously, Abraham Lincoln, with his Gettysburg Address, he tells the world, you know, it's for us the living to continue the unfinished work. You know, that is the current fight to end modern slavery. So for young people, I think it's just important to remember history and to realize that moral obligation that we have as citizens, to speak out for what is right and just, and to really see and demand accountability. Because at the end of the day, you know, everything that I am doing is just trying to

Youth Action And Moral Obligation

Tristan Matthew Chen 6:52

recognize that legal obligation that Congress has to uphold due process, to uphold equal protection of the laws. And it really is quite terrible to see you know all these corporations capitalizing on unjust incarceration and prison slavery, capitalizing on you know violent exploitation, the literal enslavement of children in the DRC, you know, children who are mining cobalt with their bare hands in toxic, deadly conditions, in caves that will collapse and kill hundreds every other week, whatever. And you know, at a certain point, you know, uh, when does enough become enough? You know, when does someone decide, okay, how can I help? What can I do?

Dr Ariel R King 7:38

Right. I love that. How what what can I do? How can I speak up? I think that's incredibly important for people since we're all over the world, and most people don't understand the system for the US. Could you please speak more about what you talk about prison, uh people that are in prison and how that's an exception to the anti-slavery rule? Um, because many people don't understand that. And remember, we are an international podcast that people come from all over the world, so they might not understand this, and this is extremely important.

Tristan Matthew Chen 8:08

Right. So in 1865, right, they create that 13th amendment, which is supposedly the amendment that ended slavery in America, except for a punishment for crime. So legally, you or I could be enslaved if we are, you know, duly convicted of a crime. Um, so slavery is still legal in text. You know, if you read the American Constitution, it says neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime. So basically, all the people who were enslaved, you know, were mass arrested, put into prison to really just exploit,

The 13th Amendment Prison Exception

Tristan Matthew Chen 8:45

continue to exploit that free labor. And you know, here we are today in 2026, right? The exploitation of slavery through the 13th Amendment loophole since 1865 must finally end, right? That is the general argument to end American slavery.

Dr Ariel R King 9:02

And pardon me, what does that for for people that don't know, what does that look like when you have you when you talk about American slavery in prison? Because you know, the words are understood, but that most people don't know what that means. What does that look like?

Tristan Matthew Chen 9:17

For me personally, and so there's obviously a big movement to sort of end that slavery exception in Congress. You know, there's a movement that exists, but you know, when you really take a look at what is causing unjust incarceration in America today, you have to look at three strikes, mandatory minimums, habitual offender laws. You know, these are what is driving unjust incarceration. It comes from the war on drugs, right? The corrupt marijuana prohibition that has been used to blatantly oppress black and brown people. You know, how can marijuana be legal in Washington, D.C., the capital of America? You can buy it,

How Prison Labour Exploits Families

Tristan Matthew Chen 9:52

you can possess it, you can grow it. Yet at the same time, in states all throughout the South, you know, predominantly the major ones that have historically exploited slavery, you know, life in prison for marijuana possession, life in prison for the most trivial things, you know, for stealing a slice of pizza, a bicycle, it really is quite egregious when you think about what's going on. And the three strike laws, the general idea is that, okay, you were arrested twice, you know, 10 years ago, you're getting arrested this third time and charged with you know felony possession of marijuana. That third strike is like that is what triggers you know these crazy life sentences, decades in prison. And so the reality is, right, we're not even looking at the fact that the estimates are like four or six percent of people who are incarcerated are innocent. So, in terms of wrongful convictions, it's well above what the estimates say, like above 100,000. We're not looking at those people who are innocent, wrongfully convicted of a crime. You also have to take into account, right, those who have received blatantly cruel and inhumane punishments because of these three-strike habitual laws. And so, you know, that there really is, you know, lawyers agree, judges agree, you know, you know, these laws, right, these three-strike laws, they tie the power of the judges, right? The judge is unable to do so. I'm like, I'm sorry, like I wish I could take into account your circumstance that you went through all this, but I have to give you this terrible punishment because the law says so. But then again, you know, the law, right, in 1791, they had the Eighth Amendment, the right for no cruel punishment, but at the same time, you go to the slave store and buy, you know, so the law is not always just. And the law, you know, there needs to be accountability when it's just blatant crimes against humanity. So that's really what I'm trying to focus on, what I'm trying to encourage others to focus on, yeah, to spread that awareness.

Dr Ariel R King 11:51

That makes sense. So most people don't know and realize that in American prisons, you are it's mandatory to take a job, and that job can pay as little as I think a dollar an hour, but also there are businesses that actually contract that work. And this is something I wanted you to talk about because then people can better understand this idea of modern slavery. Because other than that, when you go to prison, you think, okay, you have meals, you have bed, you have education, you, you know, you get the library, you know, you you get exercise. What are you talking about? So I think that most people don't understand that. So if you can talk a little bit about that, I think that would be so helpful.

Tristan Matthew Chen 12:31

Yeah, it it really is a system that's just hidden in the dark and that most people have no idea about it. You know, there's another nonprofit called Worth Rises. They have this giant prison corporate database that actually documents right over 4,000 major public and private corporations that are capitalizing on mass incarceration. You got telecom companies, you know, using prisoners, you know, when you're answering that phone for customer service, you got food industry, you know, using prisoners to in met in some cases, you know, literally serve food at a restaurant.

Dr Ariel R King 13:06

Pardon me, let me understand this. You're saying that there are prisoners that are working for companies, but not getting paid by the companies, and that's where the modern slavery comes in, or getting paid very, very little. For example, some minimum wages in parts of America are $19 or $25, but they're getting a dollar an hour or 50 cents an hour. Is that where the idea of slavery comes in?

Tristan Matthew Chen 13:28

In several states, the payment is zero. In some other states, maybe like 10 cents. It's basically zero because when you take into account how predatory the prison industry is, you know, I don't the statistic is disgustingly high. The number of families that go into debt for trying to just talk to their loved ones, you know, charging exorbitant fees by the minute. And then you got the the healthcare, you know, all these companies trying to make money.

Dr Ariel R King 13:56

And my apology, my apology. So if I'm understanding too, it's not just that the people that are in prison are working, but they literally have to pay for communication with friends, family, whoever. They also have to pay for, I guess at times, laundry, and they have to literally pay for living while they're not getting paid for working. Is that the idea?

Tristan Matthew Chen 14:17

That is the idea. The idea is that there are all these companies who are exploiting the most vulnerable communities, who are exploiting many people who do not deserve to be in prison, who are blatantly, cruelly incarcerated. And so, you know, in many of these maximum security prisons in the South that are currently, you know, maximum security prisons, they were once slave plantations, you know, where there are prisoners in Louisiana picking cotton on this prison, that was once a slave plantation. And so it really puts things into perspective how far we've gone. And in the grand scheme of things, right, in the universe of time, like it wasn't that long ago, 1860, it was like not that, it was pretty recent. And to see and to know today that America is still dealing with the slavery exception, with unjust incarceration, you know, capitalizing on DRC slavery for the global technology, you know, we there has to come that point when people, you know, ask themselves, all right, how can I help? You got to go back to that. And going back to your question about how we involve the youth, I think it's just awareness, you know, being able to talk about these issues honestly, to understand history honestly, and to recognize the truth. Because the truth these days, you know, trying to erase history, trying to not look at it, it doesn't change the fact. The fact is still there. We just have to ask ourselves, okay, what can we do? So yeah, it's a big task, but I have hope. And the power of hope is very important because you have to be able to hope for change to create it.

Dr Ariel R King 16:01

Exactly. I I love what you're doing, and I think it's so important. You know, that many people say, Well, why do that? It's not going to work. But the truth is if you start and you have hope and you actually put your your mind and your talents to it, of course it's possible. Everything is possible. I think it's wonderful that you're actually doing this in order to change the accept. You know, it's really interesting to me that it says, you know, you can't have slavery except in prison. And that exception itself basically makes for exploitation for anybody and everybody of those who are in prison. And I think that makes a big difference. How about if we talk now about slavery that has to do with trafficking and uh even child trafficking and and you know, that's trafficking of, of course, organized trafficking of sex trafficking, labor trafficking. Tell us more about that and what your organization does to inform, educate about that, and if in any way it at all work with in the US system to try to do something about that type of slavery.

Tristan Matthew Chen 17:05

For sure. So I have two leaders on my team on the USASO who are survivors of human trafficking and slavery.

Trafficking Survivors And Real World Work

Tristan Matthew Chen 17:12

There's Bernadette, who's our chief advocacy officer, a survivor of slavery in the DRC, and Harold, he's a survivor, someone who came from India and basically, you know, forced to work. And, you know, when I talk to them about these issues, we talk about like the importance of amplifying survivor voices, you know, people who have experienced unjust incarceration, and the importance of bringing these voices with you know, citizens and leaders. So I think that is an initiative that's very important, amplifying survivor voices and just recognizing that these issues are real, they're prominent where even where we live, you know, even if we don't know about it, it doesn't mean it's not happening. And I would just say that just being able to work, it's important for people because everyone gets so busy, you know, everyone has jobs, it takes a lot of energy, right, to devote yourselves, it takes time. There needs to be more people who have that just passion and drive who want to get themselves out there and figure out what they can do to help. And so that that's really like why I'm on here to sort of spread this message. But yeah, in human trafficking in America, it's a big problem. You know, men are human trafficked. The statistics are, I mean, that that's a whole nother slavery issue that we are actively, you know, as because it's a very broad, you know, anti-slavery global movement. And there's still like a lot of work that we're doing. You know, it's a very brand new organization that's just developing. It's not even a year old yet.

Dr Ariel R King 18:57

But yes, pardon me, but you've been working on this issue for many years. So I want our listeners to understand that you're not a new person to this and you're not someone that you know is green, that you are quite professional and you've done a lot in this over the years. So I just want our listeners to understand that. Um, this is understood. May I ask some more thing, you know, the US government. I know that you're saying that you're looking at if not informing the US government, at least allowing the US government to know that you're there and that you're working on this issue, and that there should be a a movement in order to take out the exception of slavery um within the Constitution. What is your idea on working on that in the future?

Tristan Matthew Chen 19:40

I think just continuing to advocate for the end of slavery in America and the DRC and to really generate awareness.

Dr Ariel R King 19:48

Um I should say all over the world. We don't want to talk about America, but there's 194 countries,

Advocacy Strategy And How To Join

Dr Ariel R King 19:55

and I've lived in 12, and I know for a fact that there is for sure.

Tristan Matthew Chen 20:00

Right, in DRC. And I've seen it, I've seen it.

Dr Ariel R King 20:03

Even in the richest countries, I've seen it. So, you know, it's not just a DRC, but right now I think we're talking, especially you're talking about America because you live in America, and that's your major experience.

Tristan Matthew Chen 20:14

So there are the two major ones that you know Wall Street and corporations are truly capitalizing on. But yes, you're right, right? The general in the anti-slavery in the world for sure. I think what that looks like to me is just continuing, right, this fight, you know, continuing to wake up and to pursue justice and freedom, to encourage others, right, to find the will, the willpower to use their voice for change, right? I'm interested in finding the leaders and and people who can recognize that their voice has power, that their action has power. If enough, if if enough people can come together with their groups and organizations, then I don't see why change can't happen. I don't see why freedom and justice can't be served. You know, I went to Gettysburg and then I grew up the other school I went to is St. Andrews Episcopal School. And you know, St. Andrews Episcopal School has had like a lot of like notable alumni. I mean, like, for example, you know, Baron Trump and all these other super wealthy billionaires, whatever. But I think just being that close to the presidential power, you know, it these issues are quite simple. You know, it's about right and wrong, good and bad. And you know, at the end of the day, there needs to be justice and freedom.

Dr Ariel R King 21:39

And I love that. I love I love your passion. I love the fact that you're a young person that's been working on it for a while. You know, many people can talk, but very few people actually take time and energy, you know, their capital in order to make it happen. So I commend you for that. I think it's fantastic. We're running out of time, we only have several. Minutes left, believe it or not. So could you tell our audience how can they get in touch with you? And also uh if you want to make a call out to have uh like-minded people or volunteers, please do so now.

Tristan Matthew Chen 22:12

Yeah, well, thank you. I I think Dr. King, people can just go to the website www.usaso.net. There's a contact button, you just fill out the form. I want to get involved. The general idea, you know, assuming that more people do become involved, is right, the idea that we have a chapter program that little chapters can start to organize and branch out all throughout the world, furthering this modern fight against slavery, furthering the fight for justice and freedom. And so my hope is that as this does grow, more people do want to get involved. But eventually, right, uh, you you don't want to, I don't want to do this forever, right? You want to get to that point where there's clear justice and freedom and victory, right? Yes, exactly. I I want to get to that point when I can turn on the news and see that the American Congress is upholding due process, is upholding equal protection of the laws. Because again, right, there is that legal obligation to to uphold the problem.

Dr Ariel R King 23:12

Now it's just a matter of following it and and right and and making sure that that we hold like whoever it is to task to make it a reality.

Tristan Matthew Chen 23:20

Equal justice under law, you know, in the Supreme Court. And the so let's make all these ideals that America is supposed to be become a reality.

Dr Ariel R King 23:31

I love that.

Tristan Matthew Chen 23:32

And let's enjoy and let's have fun and let's rejoice in freedom, peace, unity, and liberation. You know, that will be the day, and you know, pray to God.

Dr Ariel R King 23:42

I'm looking forward to that day. I'm sure I'm going to see it when I do. I'm gonna think of you first. I want to thank Mr. Tristan Matthew Chen. You're amazing as usual. It's wonderful to talk with you again and to our audience. If I am not for myself, who would be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? If not now, then when? That was by the philosopher hello. And I've added, if not me, then who? Thank you so much for joining us.

Tristan Matthew Chen 24:10

Thank you.