Why Some Listings Never Sell (And What Agents Get Wrong)

Some listings sit for 90, 190, even 290 days — and it's rarely bad luck. In this episode, Nate Steffen and Josh Gaylis break down why listings actually go stale, when it's price vs. condition, how to have the hard pricing conversation with a seller, and the moment Josh walked away from a $2M listing that was really worth $1.6M.

If you're an agent, a seller, or just curious what actually happens behind a "for sale" sign that doesn't move — this one's for you.

In this episode:

• Why great marketing can't fix a bad price
• The "my house is better than Stacey's" seller mindset
• Nate's 14-day rule for new listings
• When a remodel is worth it before selling — and when it's not
• How to use comps to get a seller to face reality
• The listing Josh walked away from, and why

Behind the Beards is hosted by Nate Steffen and Josh Gaylis, two veteran real estate agents talking honestly about the industry — not the polished version.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome to Behind the Beards, the podcast where real estate gets real, real messy, real funny, and sometimes just downright unpredictable.

SPEAKER_00 0:08

I'm Josh and I'm Nate. We're pulling back the curtain on the world of real estate. Whether you're an agent, industry professional, client, or you're just here for the chaos, you're in the right place. This is a real real estate talk. So, Josh, every agent has a listing, right? Great photos, uh, it's a nice location, it's priced well, and it sits. Why? What can you come up with?

SPEAKER_01 0:32

Why do you think that might be happening? The main thing is is definitely gonna be the price, right? You could be the best marketer on the planet Earth and take the best photos, take do the best video, have the best network that you're pushing this out to. And if it's priced wrong, I don't care, it's not gonna sell. So that's that's the first thing price. Second and third, analyzing the photos. Maybe the photos are maybe you need to reshoot it. Maybe it's not showing well enough visually online for people to get in the door. It could be that as well. And then it could also be your ads that you're running. We run a lot of digital ads and printed ads. And if you don't have good photos or good video to capture people's, you know, attention span that it's like three seconds you have to capture someone's attention, right? So if you don't make that first good impression, you're kind of you're shooting yourself in the foot. So those are the the three main pointers as to why it wouldn't sell.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Yeah, let's talk about photos real quick. Are photos the problem? Well, here are some things that the photos could be a problem with, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Unless someone lives unbelievably like in at in beautiful furniture and it's like really clean, but I would say 90 90 to 95% of the time we're staging, recommending staging.

SPEAKER_00 1:42

Yeah, me too. It's just included in the in in the listing package, right? It's included in within my compensation. And I also have one where you know they're they do live well and and they're living in the house and it and it worked out, right? So there you go. But photos, let's talk about those real quick. They should be extremely good quality. Number two, uh the staging, it should be done well, tastefully. I also talk about the order of the photos, right? A lot of times uh agents go, well, here's four pictures of the front of the house at different angles, right? Get people into the house right away that are looking at it online. Okay, if the front photo's good, sure, use a front photo, but then go right to the selling points of the house, right? The kitchen, primary bedroom, primary bathroom, make that one through four. Is there an expansive living area? Hey, is is the backyard the the uh the selling point? Pool, cabana, you know, swimming, pool bar, whatever it is, right? Highlight that stuff in order. Um, and then the other thing that we'll get into is is kind of the timing of the listing. And one of the tricks that you can use is changing the first photo of the listing, and that usually resets on all the buyers wherever they're looking on various websites and other agents, it will update that listing. So it'll it won't look like a new listing, but it'll it'll update in the top of their list, right? So changing the photos around as well. When you're looking at timing, and let's say price is maybe the issue, right? How long do you typically go through and start to say, well, you know, we're analyzing how many showings, how many hits online we're getting? Um, do we have any offers, of course? What is that magic time frame where you start talking about a price adjustment?

SPEAKER_01 3:18

It's a good question. You know, for in here in our market here in San Diego, you know, you get the best exposure within the first two weeks, right? Call 14 days. Doesn't mean on the 14th day, if we don't have an offer, I'm going to the seller and saying, hey, you need to work on your price. I typically wait and listen, during the pandemic, sellers got so used to the fact that if their house wasn't sold in three days, something's wrong. It's the agent's fault, it's the photos, it's the price, it's something, right? Now in a normalized market, I don't do anything with the price until a full 30 days. And obviously, we're tracking our metrics, we're looking at the analytics, and we're seeing, we're seeing what we could do better during that time frame. And I'll have a pretty good idea within the first two to three weeks as to what we need to do, but I'll wait till that 30th day to have that conversation with the seller. It we might not move the price, we might, you know, and I never usually wait this long to like redo photos, redo staging. It's happened before, but it happens pretty quick where the stagers come in, they do they do their job, and I'm like, eh, we need to change out these three rooms, right? So it's it's 30 days to answer your question until I really think about dropping the price. Gotta give it time.

SPEAKER_00 4:25

Yeah, absolutely. Uh, you know, 14-day rule, we'll we'll call it for the sake of this of this conversation. You know, I will use that if, and I I almost said that if this happens, uh I just try really well not to overprice a property, right? If seller says, well, let's try it for a certain amount of time. But agents, if you're out there and you have a seller that's like, no, I think you know, my house is better than Stacy's down the street and they sold a year ago. And I know you guys looking at recent sales. If you get that situation, just clear it with your client, even write it in the listing agreement that if after 14 days at this listing price, we're not getting any type of traction, or I'm calling you guys we didn't have any showings last week. We know it's a price issue. We need to adjust the price, right? And that's the other time I'd use 14 days. But like you said, we have in different markets in California, it might be 21 to 35 days average marketing time days on market, right? You know, of course, you have those properties where, you know, agents will undersell, uh, underprice a home and get a lot of different offers moving that way. Well, they agents, you have to be cautious about that is that sometimes if you put it out there, you better be sure that it's gonna draw a lot of interest, or you start getting offers at that price uh that you thought you were underpricing at. It's also could equal a very interesting conversation with your seller. So we'll leave it like that. Generally, how do you price homes? Like will you you see the comparably in a neighborhood? Do you generally like take that last sales comp, slightly price it underneath that a little bit? Because that's what I do, but I'd like to hear what you have to say.

SPEAKER_01 5:58

Yeah, no, I do, but it also depends on the motivation of the seller. How how soon uh do you really need to get out of this place quick? And doesn't mean we're gonna let this go and leave money on the table. But in those situations, you know, if say it the house, you know, is comped out at a million dollars, you know, normally we would go nine, you know, nine seventy-nine, you know, like on teeter a little bit under what it's what's what it's actually valued to, you know, try and drive the traffic and get it sold sold quick. But there's also times in in different markets, like where stuff's like taking a lot longer than 30 days to sell, and it's really like a 90-day average, where if it's worth a million and we're in a kind of a weird market, we might go $8.99 because that might be the move to get you to a million dollars. Because if you listed that property that is in a desolate area that takes a long time to sell, and you list it at a million, it could take you three months to get that perfect buyer to walk in the door to pay that price. But in my mind, you can never price a house too low. I stand by this all the time. But to your point, you have to be careful because you know that that property worth a million, right? And you and you list it at 600, you're gonna get offers at 600. So you better just be patient and you're you're using those people that that think they could get it for that number to bring up the more qualified buyers up to where that closer to that million. So, yes, to answer your question, I never price a home like at that comp. I always like to be, and then and then I also look at active properties too that are in the neighborhood to try and because those are that's competition as well, you know. So, I mean, if we look at if those specs are the same as ours and they're at a million, uh, you know, 999, we might want to go 979, 969. We want to be that much more attractive off the bat on price to the consumer when he's comparing apples to apples in this on the same street. And I so I think we're pretty we're pretty aligned with that in terms of how we how we price properties, but it's case case by case basis.

SPEAKER_00 7:51

Yeah, and the the other thing is I tell sellers when you're when you're in, because because you and I both have in our different markets, we we have unique properties, unique areas. And sometimes a buyer didn't realize that they would go that far out, but it's because it's on the price, they go out there and they start to go, wow, this is great. And I always tell sellers on the flip side of that is if you are underpriced or not where you want to sell it, let's say, we'll just use that number, right? Whatever that number is, you can always not accept it. I think sometimes sellers go, well, hey, I'm only getting the list price, and I'm not gonna don't even counter them. No, counter them with what you want. And and and that's fine. You never have to accept any offer that comes in, it just has to be presented to you. And that kind of goes into are there any, like in your region, you have a lot of coastal properties down there. Is there anything that that comes to mind when you think like price versus uh like a condition problem? Like you guys probably have some really nice uh areas down there where, gosh, the home just needs to be updated. How do you kind of take a price consideration there? Like let's say there is a comp, but it's just way nicer. It doesn't have the cost to cure. Do you get like bids? Do you get like maybe a contractor coming in, at least give like an estimate to kind of give you some idea or the homeowner some idea of what it might take to price that well?

SPEAKER_01 9:09

Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, at my company at Compass, we have we have something called Compass Concierge, which is a cool problem. I mean, a cool, a cool platform that that we utilize when there's a property that, you know, say it's sold for two million bucks, but it was updated and the kitchen was nice and the bathrooms are nice. But in the house that I have that's coming up on the market, the bathrooms are are pretty good, but the kitchen is needs to be remodeled. And without that, they're gonna get, you know, a hundred, a hundred thousand-ish lower than what it's worth. If the numbers make sense to do the kitchen remodel for 30, 40 grand to get that million dollar price, they'll front, they'll front them the money and they'll take it out the proceeds. It it doesn't happen a lot where I tell people you should remodel your kitchen and do all the bathrooms and then come on the market. I mean, at that point, you're flipping the house, right? It's a flip. So for someone who's living in the home that needs to sell it, that uh typically they use the compass conceillers and to do like paint, flooring, staging, right? It's not massive renovations, but in a in a coast, a hyper coastal market like Del Mar, yeah, you know, putting in a new kitchen and floors, flooring and doing the bathrooms could yield you a much higher price than what it's gonna cost you to do that. But in certain certain other in other areas around my market, it wouldn't be worthwhile.

SPEAKER_00 10:27

Yeah, based on market for sure, I think. Like I tell people, hey, should I redo my kitchen? Well, let's look at the price point of what it is, and it's if it's doable and it's it's something that someone can come in and modify and it's clean, no, right? Because you know, you're you want to be able to have to have your sellers, whatever money they put into it, they will get back out of it and not just the same amount they put into it. They want to be upwards, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:49

And and that's timing too. That takes time, right? I mean, yeah, I have really good guys that can do a remodel pretty quickly, but you know, you you have to weigh the the the pros and cons with doing that renovation at the end of the day, it just has to make sense.

SPEAKER_00 11:03

Yeah, and so you know, what is a stale listing, right? I'll I'll say say something about this. A stale listing to me is that if you have it's on the market however many weeks, and you see that you've gotten one showing request for the week. You go to open houses, you're doing open houses there at the property. Um, you get one person that comes in and it's a neighbor. This is where you gotta really kind of have some conversations with your seller because you got to drive that interest. And I think that's what backing up real quick with that 14-day rule comes in. When a listing goes on, it should get the most amount of attention within those first 14 days, right? Um, not so much that's when you need to do a price adjustment, but that's when you're really evaluating it. One thing I'll say that I do is I do a once a week check-in call. Sometimes it's a Zoom with my sellers at the same time on on every on the same day every week, and they get an analyzation of what's going on, right? And a regroup of uh feedback from parties that have seen it. Ultimately, what I'm trying to do with that is let them know we don't want this to get stale. But have you ever had a uh a listing, let's say, that got stale that that maybe need to be relaunched? Have you ever taken anything off the market, had that intelligent conversation with your seller and said, hey, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 12:19

I mean, it's happened many times, you know, because over the over the course of 13 years, there's been times where, I mean, even in a even in a not good market, like say it's a good market, you know, listings will go stale because of the price, or maybe it's the furniture. And you know, a lot of the times it's not my photos, it's not 90% of the time, it's not photos or staging because that gets nipped in the butt right away. Like if my clients have if it's bad photos, I'm gonna reshoot it. If it's bad staging, I call a staging company and we, you know, we we shift things around. But yeah, I have had listings that say are like, you know, and to your point, I weekly, weekly updates. How many people are coming through the open houses, how many private showings did we have, how many online lookers, how many people are looking at your listing in my company because we have access to that with our tech. But after 60 days, you know, I'm I'm probably gonna want to do something with the price, and not only just the price, I don't want it to have, I don't want it to be 61 days on the market with a new price. So, what what I'll do is I'll I'll cancel the listing, but at the same time, simultaneously, I'll have a new listing agreement signed. I'll discuss with the seller how important it is to make it fresh on the market, and then we'll also change around the photos to your point with the order. We'll make and the description. We're gonna make this look like a new house, even if someone's seen it. But to to other people's, you know, surprise, even after 90 days, you're like, everyone's seen it. People are starting their searches at different times all the time. I might have listed it 90 days later, fresh, and someone is like, someone might have never seen it, and then that's the first time they're seeing it. So it's nice that it's one day on the market versus 90 days on the market because they're gonna be like, What's wrong? Or it's overpriced, you know. So it just hurts you. The longer you're on the market, the harder it is to sell it for the price that you're listed at. You know, anything eight over eight figures is different. Like 10 plus million dollar homes could take longer to sell, it's just a smaller pool of buyers. But in my market, in the two to five million dollar range, that's typically how we operate.

SPEAKER_00 14:15

Same here. It's uh the the 800 to the you know 1.8 million range. You realize that the higher price points, there's a different type of buyer that goes into those. There's a different type of uh expectation from those buyers as well, right? They're not expecting to see any work, they're expecting to see that you've done that preliminary stuff. And I like what you said there. You know, failure is the best teacher in life, but also it's the best teacher in real estate to where, you know, agents, if you're out there and your sellers like, well, what do you think? Do you do you want to sell? Do you do you want to stage my vacant house? Yes, it's just make it part of your package. It's all about the the presentation. Like you at Compass, we have Southern Sotheby's has, you know, same thing, same same technology. We have a minimal requirement of what those photos and the and the package has to look like. But even before that, don't put your iPhone photos up in the listing, stop it. You know, go ahead and and negotiate what you're worth with your compensation, but it's a it's a two-way street, it's a team effort. You know, make sure you're putting your own your own expertise and value into it because ultimately it's gonna show when people look at the listings online. Interesting. Yeah, I can't think of a time where I had to pull one off and do it. But the other thing I want to say with you is you know, that 30-day rule of taking it off the market and resetting it a little bit so you can reset the days on market counter if you're listing it in the MLS, if it's not off-market exclusive, right?

SPEAKER_01 15:42

And you gotta be proactive. I mean, you'll see some listings here in in mind market that are 190 days on the market, and it's like a it's a $900,000 property. I'm like, what are these agents doing? Do you think you're gonna get someone to come in the door after six months being on the market and paying your price? Like, give your sellers a chance at least. Like, do something. That's that's the problem with our industry is people just let things go. It doesn't sell, it doesn't sell. On to the next one.

SPEAKER_00 16:07

Yeah, I think that's a huge problem. It just to let it sit there and and and wait and wish is boggling. I see them too. 290 days on the market. What are we doing here? Like, do you want me to bring in an investor and undercut this by uh whatever amount to just get it off the market for you? Oh no, they're trying to hit their price, are they? Right? Like, that's what you hear agents say. You're like, well, that's never mind. Uh yeah, you don't even know what to say to that because it's like there's nothing being done, and it really is disheartening. Uh, I want to do uh a little, a little little breakdown here. And actually, I I just a little scenario here. Like, let's say you've had a home that's that's 30 days on the market, it's it's got 200 views, four total showings, no offers, right? You mentioned the 30-day rule. Like, what does that conversation look like with your seller? Let's let's analyze this.

SPEAKER_01 16:57

Yeah, they're tough conversations. This is what this is what's hard about our job is is the tough conversations. The way I look at it is I provide all the feedback, like I said, all the data, all the analytics. I look at other active properties that are also sitting on the market, and I say, look at this. Compare these two properties. You have the same property and they're listed $35,000 below you. That's why they're pending. So there's gonna be a reason. You're gonna have to come to the conclusion with your seller as the advisor to prove to them why their property is not selling. And a lot of the time it is the price. And after 30 days, it's I just shoot it to them straight. I'm not like, hey, let's keep let's keep doing this, let's keep doing the open houses every weekend. And it's it's a mute point. I mean, if if if they're really stuck on the price, then I like to reset it and change photos around, change description, maybe change some furniture around, um, maybe put few fewer photos so that I actually get people in the door versus just seeing it online. Like, yeah, views are nice on Zillow and Redfin, but what what what do we want? We want an offer. We need people in the door. That's that's kind of the conversation I have with them to get them to come to the table and and it's more reality versus you know, dreaming.

SPEAKER_00 18:08

Yeah, it's it's a pretty cool thing. Like, there's a lot of things I think about with with something like that, right? It's it's it's what's the feedback? It's like going through a bad breakup. Like, this isn't working for either of us, really. This isn't. I'm trying to sell your house. We you're throwing the stats down, throw you guys in the marks, 200. There's you know, there's four showings, but like that's that's that's not what we we should have four showings in in a week within a three-day span, whatever that is, right? And then you have, like we said before, your market stats and everything that you can bring in, and there's something missing here. And so I often ask a seller, hey, what do you think the issue is? And that's a good way to not go, here's what the issue is, obviously, but not to say, like, I have all the answers sometimes. What do you think the issue is, right? Um, and that kind of brings me to another question I had like, what's a conversation that you've had with a seller, or what type of conversation do you dread having with your seller? Let's let's say it like that. This could be a uh a really uh even a recent story.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

The toughest conversation with with a seller is when the seller is also pretty set in stone on having an as sale and they're not happy with the price, they that that you're under contract, they're kind of just like, okay, I understand why why we should take this. You know, the market's changing, even though Sally across the road sold for a premium. I I do understand that as a seller. But but the hard conversation is once you do get into a contract with that buyer, and the buyer says it's an as-is contract, they signed everything, they said we're not gonna ask for any nitpicking items, and then they come with a 150-page report of estimates line by line in the inspection for every single item, and it's like it's like a $60,000 repair request. So that's the hard part. And if you've never done it before, you're gonna be anxious and you're gonna be like, I know, I know, we should just get rid of them. No, because the next buyer is also gonna have potentially these repairs aren't gonna get fixed because you're not gonna fix them, right? No, no, I don't want it to fix them. Okay, so if you go back on market, you're gonna have to disclose all of this to the next buyers. And I understand that you want to just say no, but that is the it's the it's a bad decision, right? Like I always say, let's address the health safety items. Okay, you gotta understand if you have a newborn, if you have a newborn kid that that they do, right? They're concerned about this leak, they're concerned that there could be mold, you know, so they they want to do the mold inspection, we gotta give them some more time. So those those are kind of the things as that's hard, right? Is is getting the seller to understand that if this, if you if you don't come to the table at least, like they asked for 60, offer them 10. They might come down to 30, and then you're $20,000 apart. And you need to ask yourself, Mr. Seller, over $20,000. Are you real are you willing to start from scratch to potentially actually sell the property for less and still have the repair issue to deal with?

SPEAKER_00 21:06

Yeah, in my area here, it's commonplace for sellers to do pre-listing inspections. And I adopted that because in what you're saying, I'm just gonna tie this together, right? Because not every market in California is that commonplace, right? But one of the things I love about it is it helps your sellers start to be realistic of their house isn't perfect and no house is perfect, right? So sometimes buyers they have an agent on their side saying, just ask for all of it, right? And you're preparing your seller in that situation, going, hey, this is this this is just simply a second round of negotiations, but let's put yourself in their shoes, right? You have a child, health and safety. I I like how you did that because honestly, that's something I always look at. Nobody wants to feel unsafe. You don't, that's unreasonable. And then the other thing I would say too with that is some of it's so nitpicky, right? Where You uh, as a buyer, they might be asking you to repair it, like might be a broken door handle. Just use that as a weird example for a moment. But in the end, there could be a combination of repairs and credits, right? And one thing I always tell my, and you tell me if you're the same with your sellers or buyer, right? If you're a seller, if you can get away with just offering credits on some things instead of doing a repair where there might be, you don't know, you're not aware of it. So let's make sure we say that right on the call, right? But if there is additional problems that you and I both don't know, well, you might be getting out of this with just a credit and there might be further repairs, right?

SPEAKER_01 22:39

And also to point out if your seller is like, I'll just repair it, you're liable for that repair, right? Who's doing the repair? Are you doing it? Or is your handyman doing it? Or is it a licensed person? Like, it's just better on the sales side to always offer a credit. It's done. You've made them happy, you've closed escrow, and it and it's good, right? On the buy side, it's the flip side. I sometimes actually like to do the repair with our people if possible. They might say, No, we want to use our licensed plumber. I was like, All right, let me look him up. But a combination. So on the seller side, like giving credits on the buy side, I like to go for repairs, but sometimes it's a combination of both.

SPEAKER_00 23:17

Absolutely. And I think what's very, very uh educational about that is also you have to also put the whole deal in perspective for each client. I know we're talking about listings, right? But you know, for the seller, uh, you know, look at it like this, right? Are you getting a good deal? How many offers did you have? Right? Do you have two offers in backup, right? Do you want to start this process going? So there's a lot more. We could have a whole nother episode on on just that. You know, one last thing I wanted to ask you, okay? Seller's price. They're like, no, this is what it's worth. You're showing them the comps, you're showing them this. I'm kind of leading you into this question because I've had this before, okay? And this is kind of a fun one. You're telling them, look, there's two homes that have already sold in your neighborhood that are exact same. You're you're you're priced higher, you want to go higher, you know it's never gonna sell at that price. How do you talk to them about price at that point?

SPEAKER_01 24:14

I mean, is are we at a standstill? Like, are we totally he's like it's this price or nothing? Absolutely. The the only way I'll take that listing is if you you mentioned this earlier in this episode, is if we put in in the additional terms after two weeks, if we don't have any good activity or offers in, then we need to reduce the price. And sometimes I do three weeks, as it's happened a few times where sellers are like deadlocked on their two million dollar price point when it's worth one six. I'm like, listen, I know I'm gonna do a good job for you, but the price needs to be right, and I'm telling you, you're not gonna sell it for two million. But if you want me to work for you, work with you on this, the only way I'll do it is if you agree to in two to three weeks, if you don't get activity like you want, and I signed six month listings, you're gonna reduce your it's in the listing agreement. It's like he's already signed off on it. I don't have to wait. So after the three weeks, we're dropping the price. Otherwise, if they're not open to doing that, Nate, I'm at a point in my career where I'm not there's no point in me taking that listing. Zero point. It's a waste of my time.

SPEAKER_00 25:15

That's that's the answer I think I was, I was I was guiding you towards, right? Like, here's the thing uh sellers out there, if you run into an agent that's adamant about the price and you want to do it higher, and you're like, come on, I thought you were a great salesperson, and I thought you could do this. That's what you're telling your agent, and they're staying strong, that's the agent you want to go with because that's who's gonna sell your house. Uh, there's also been situations where you have one where it's already been, you're already in a listing agreement, right? They're standing strong in their price, and so your options are you have four more months left on your listing uh agreement, right? And into the listing period, and uh you're saying to yourself, what do I do with this one? Do I get rid of it, right? Has the seller given me every opportunity to sell it? Because a listing contract is a contract. It's stated in there that you are to work together to try to sell the property. Just because a seller wants a higher price, even you've you've done your job, doesn't mean that they can cancel the contract. It has to be a mutual cancellation. And so in the end, that would just be a judgment call between you and your broker whether you want to cancel the listing agreement for the for the seller. The worst thing that can happen there is this the property just stays on the market at the same price, and you know, everyone's just being unrealistic. So um, but I think there's a good there's a couple of words right now that I think for a seller or any client that is not working with you and and following direction, not like they like like we're gonna tell you what to do and you better do it. It's it's a team effort. But if they just become too difficult, then there's the bye-bye now. You invite them to go somewhere else. See if you could refer it, obviously. But um, if you can't, then bye-bye now is just as good.

SPEAKER_01 26:49

Don't waste your time. Don't buy listings just to have inventory.

SPEAKER_00 26:53

Yeah. Uh and we see this all the time, right? Agents get excited. They're like, Got a listing, put a sign in the yard, and you're like, that is never going to sell. That does you and them no good, especially guys like you and I, Josh, where we have monetary, we have money that we're putting into them. And what we're talking about with staging, man, three, four thousand dollars on each one at least. Um, that's coming out of our pocket till that thing sells. Photos, that's coming out of our pocket until it sells, right? That doesn't our our our photographer and our stager, sure, they might have a few ways they get paid, but they want their money now. It's not like, oh, when I sell it in 60 days, I'll pay you. No, that's coming out of pocket. That's part of our budget, that's part of our budget. Yeah. Awesome, man. Always great talking with you. We'll hop off the listings, um, and uh we'll have a brand new, fresh topic next time, man. Go get them out there. Can't wait for the next episode, brother. Thanks for tuning into Behind the Beards. If you've enjoyed today's episode, do us a favor, subscribe, leave a comment, and share it with someone who'd enjoy what you've heard here today.

SPEAKER_01 27:52

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