EP 53: How to Stop Over-Functioning and Start Healing: Navigating Grief, Control and Recovery with Charlotte Jukes

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This episode is a real conversation about grief, recovery, and the moment you realize that doing it all alone isn’t strength, it’s straight survival.

I’m joined by Charlotte Jukes—former ICU nurse, transformational coach, and host of Pickleball & Partnership—for a powerful, honest conversation about loss, achievement, addiction, and what it actually takes to heal without abandoning yourself.

Charlotte shares her story of losing her mother at a young age, becoming a mother while grieving, and carrying the unspoken belief that she had to be strong, capable, and self-sufficient at all costs. We talk about how that belief evolved into over-functioning, fixing, and achievement—and how those patterns can quietly become addictions that are socially rewarded but deeply exhausting.

In this episode, we get real about:

• The grief of losing a parent and the powerlessness of not feeling able to ask for help
• The truth behind fixing, people-pleasing, and achievement 
• What the opposite of addiction is and the magic of self-compassion 
• Ways to heal the inner critic, stop trying to control outcomes and start trusting yourself
• How recovery, nervous system safety, and spirituality intersect in real life

This conversation is for the woman who’s been strong, capable, and reliable for everyone else, and now you’re ready to stop surviving and start living with more ease, peace, and truth.

You were never meant to do this alone, xo.

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Book your free 1:1 Next Level Breakthrough Call

Hey gorgeous.

I love you.

I'm so proud of you.

And I believe in your ability to create a life you absolutely love.

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the Girls Who Recover podcast with Dana Hunter Fela, where incredible women just like you, go to transform life's biggest setbacks into your most powerful comebacks so that you can live a life you. Love. I'm your host, Dana Hunter Ella, transformational coach and founder of Girls Who Recover, and my mission is to pull back the curtain on our mistakes, failures, shame and personal disasters, and light the way for how to use those to create your biggest and most gorgeous comebacks. Follow the show now. Grab your iced coffee and turn up the volume for girls who recover. Let's light it up. hello, gorgeous and welcome back to The Girls Who Recover podcast. I am overwhelmed with a mixture of thrill, being thrilled and being grateful, and being over the moon. Excited to introduce to you an angel named Charlotte Dukes and I'll read you her bio. So Charlotte before I do that though, Charlotte and I met. Synchronistically through our Kathy Heller community. She's a coach there. And after I read the bio, I wanna share just a quick story about how Charlotte changed my life just in one interaction. So that makes me really grateful to introduce her to you. So Charlotte Dukes qualified as a registered nurse in the UK specializing in intensive care before moving into education with Proctor and Gamble in the United Kingdom. And after relocating to Calgary in 2000, she returned to the community nursing supporting clients through some of life's hardest transitions. And we know about that, don't we? Now? A dedicated coach Charlotte, supports women in meeting their fears with compassion, transforming self-doubt into self-trust, and creating lives that feel authentic and deeply fulfilling. And today Charlotte works with women from all walks of life through her transformational coaching programs, and she hosts the podcast. Pickleball and partnership where she explores relationships, self-discovery, and the journey of reconnecting with one's true self. And Charlotte, you did almost all of that for me in one virtual interaction. So we were in a call together and I'm not, I can't remember exactly what it was that was happening, but it was a meditation and more visualization, visualizing our most abundant self and being wealthy women and receiving financial abundance. And it was almost like I was, I had a panic attack and my throat closed and my chest felt like it was collapsing and I got really hot and I couldn't breathe well, and it's so interesting because the community's really big, but what got downloaded to me was you need to reach out to Charlotte and do it now. So I got on the group chat and I got in the group and I was like, Charlotte, what do I do? Charlotte came in and gave me these beautiful tools and I won't share'em. Maybe we will get a chance for you to share them for the audience. But essentially in a very short time, did all of that. It was transformative for me. Not only did I cycle out of that, those feelings, it wasn't just the feelings of being constricted and resisting into this really emotional experience, which allowed me to create space for welcoming, abundance and feeling safe, even envisioning that experience. That has left a lifelong impression on me, Charlotte. I'm so grateful for you. Tell us about you, Charlotte. Welcome to the Girls Who Recover podcast. Hello? Oh, Dana. Oh my gosh. What an introduction. And oh, I just want to start off by saying you, you are an angel. You are such a beautiful soul. I felt that connection with you as when we connected in Kathy's community, you just, you have this energy about you and I just want to. Really shout out to you and express my gratitude for the work that you are doing. And it's just, it's so important. And I love that we can be there together and we can support women together. And I'm all about that. And I know that you are all about that too. And it's funny because, I don't often look at the chats when we're in the community and we're on these calls, but I was like. I just happened to glance and I was like, oh my gosh, Dana and I need to be there right now. And it was just, it was the synchronicity was amazing, and I am so grateful that I was able to be there for you. So yeah, I just so appreciate that. Yeah. And would love to hear from you, Charlotte, the audience for girls who recover a gorgeous, eclectic, powerhouse group of women who have overcome many a setback and transformed them into gorgeous comebacks. And so for the first part of our conversation, I'd love to hear from you about a specific setback that you've experienced and the bridge of transformation as you co-created that into a gorgeous comeback for your life. Laura's yours. Tell us your story. Thank you, Dana. Oh my goodness. The responsibility. But do you know, and it's funny because I came into this not really know, thinking what shall I say and what's important? And I'm just really trusting that, I'm just going with the flow. And what's touching my heart right now is a time in my life. I was actually 27 and my mom. Was diagnosed, had been diagnosed recently with cancer out of the blue. She was so fit and healthy. She was 56 years old. And it just hit all of us. It hit our family. And at the age of 27, I lost my mom and it just, it devastated me. It just changed everything that I thought life was supposed to look like two days after my mom passed away. We found out we weren't married at the time, but my amazing husband that I'm still with now, after 30 years, we found out that we were expecting a baby. And I just thought, oh my gosh. First of all, how am I going to cope with this? And second, wow, what a gift, because I really felt like this was my mom giving me this beautiful gift of life. But that was a really tough time in my life, and I think I felt like there was nobody there for me. I have two brothers I desperately wanted a sister to be able to talk to because I didn't feel as though I could talk to my brothers. My dad was really struggling with grief himself, and basically he abandoned the three of us and left and went and did his own thing. I really felt as though I was on my own. It was all up to me. I couldn't ask for help and how could anybody else possibly know what I was going through? And this was how I went through my life. And we moved continents. We, my husband and I, and then we had two children. We moved from England to Canada. So again, another big change. And not knowing anybody, and again, it was a struggle. And I'm on my own. I have to do it all. I have to do it all was the voice that I kept hearing in my head, and it's weak to ask for help and who could possibly help me anyway. And I had a great career in nursing. In fact, I look back and I job shared with this most amazing friend, colleague, nurse, and we were known as the dream team. And, but the pressure, the pressure of achieving and having to do it all was just incredible. And I think it's interesting because, life, the universe, God divine keeps showing us these lessons until we get what we need to learn from them. And these lessons kept coming up for me and. This beautiful baby that I'd had my first baby. This gift from my mom was going through the biggest struggle of her life and struggling with addiction. And I didn't know what to do. And as a mom, I was lost. I had no control. I felt helpless. And it was interesting. I started at that time to listen to audio books. And one day we were in the middle of a huge house renovation that we were doing ourselves. And I was listening to an audio book by Byron Katie yeah. Loving what is, and Byron Katie was interviewing a woman called Charlotte, whose daughter was addicted to substances. Wow. And I was like, talk about synchronicity, right? She's talking to me and I literally stopped, I think I was painting at the time, and I stopped and I sat on the floor and I listened harder than I had ever listened to anything before in my life. And the message I got was that I was addicted. I had the addiction to fixing everybody, to fixing my daughter, to fixing my husband, to fixing my other children, to fixing my friends, to fixing all my clients and my patients at work. And that was a huge turning point for me. I didn't quite learn the lesson at that point. It did take a little bit more. And I think I did share with you prior to today that I was actually at work one day and there was an incident that happened where a client with quite severe mental health issues who I had known. And we had built up an amazing relationship and I was working in the community. So I was actually in his home, but he, he, his perception of what was happening, of reality was not, was not real. And he felt like he was unsafe. And he actually came at me with two knives and it really stopped me. It literally, I froze. And it stopped me in my tracks and I thought, okay, I keep getting these lessons. I keep being put in these situations where obviously there are lessons to learn here. And I was given the gift of being able to really take some time to step back from that achieving role of having to be there and having to be everything for everybody else. And it allowed me to take a pause, which I think we judge ourselves for doing. And I think we judge other people for doing because we keep going. And that was certainly the voice that was in my head, but I was given this gift of a pause and a time for real. Inner reflection and healing and compassion for myself, and that was when I realized that I had been approaching things in a way that I no longer wanted to continue. And that was when things change. Things changed with my clients too. I started coaching in a different way, and I started talking to myself in a different way and talking to everyone else around me and those that I love, and the changes that I have witnessed because of that has just been so incredible. I just feel so blessed now because I wake up every morning excited and in love with my life, right? Not that everything goes right all the time, not that everything goes the way I intend it to. I feel so at peace. And you know what, Dana, for the first time in my life, since I was probably 10 years old, I'm having fun. What? Yes. So that's my, yeah, that's my Charlotte story in a nutshell. Ah, that is such a gorgeous story. So I think there are so many directions we can take this, but my first question is, I just ask questions that resonate in my body. I check in with my when someone says something and there's light or resonance in my body I'm like, that's where we need to go. So I heard you say two things at the very beginning. One is you. Had a hard time asking for help and believed that you couldn't, that you, not only could you not ask for help, but there was nobody who could help you. And then this belief that I think many of us share, many of us who identify as being in recovery, many of us who have transformed setbacks to comebacks, many women, maybe all women, call me out if I'm wrong. But this idea that we have to do it all. We have two ovaries, so we gotta do it all. I don't know what the connection is there. So this idea that surface is when we have conversations around, you use the word addiction. The addiction of fixing. And there are so many addictions, but what they all have in common is this belief of being separate, right? The cavern, the canyon between. Us and connection with, in this case, the help or the community. And so you're in this position too. I just wanna honor this because my experience is a little different, but my dad died very suddenly when I was 23. And so this period of just feeling totally ungrounded in deep grief and unclear about where to go. And then the same thing, I couldn't ask for help. I didn't ask for help. I didn't believe that anybody would understand and I too believe I had to do it all. So I'm curious about where do you think that comes from? Where did it, where do you think it came from in your life? Where do you think it comes from for women in general? You've coached a lot of women, you've helped a lot of women in different areas. I'm sure you've noticed that too. What's the origin point of that? What are you noticing about. Us not really being able or willing to ask for help and deeply believing that we have to do it all, both the great separators. That's such a beautiful question, Dana. And I think, yes, I've spent a long time unfolding and uncovering, my, my deep seated beliefs and the roots of, why I am who I am, why I believe the things I believe. I grew up with two brothers. I certainly felt as though I was the weaker sex. I certainly felt as though my brothers had it all together, achieved so much. These were the messages I was getting from my dad, and I would say from my dad rather than my mom who took so loving, so beautiful, such an amazing soul, and very similar. I learned from her to give, and that as women, our needs don't matter. Our feelings don't matter. I remember one day and I was, I don't know, maybe seven around that age and trying to talk to my dad about a feeling that was coming up for me, and I don't remember what that was. I couldn't even put it into words, but what I do remember is that I was shut down very quickly. That was dismissed. And I got the very clear message from a young age that we don't talk about feelings. We sweep things under the carpet. We avoid difficult conversations. If you are feeling something like anger or sadness, that's not a good thing. You need to stop that right now. And so I think we grow up, and I certainly did believing that everybody else's feelings mattered and mine do not. And so when I've got to these points in my life, like when my mom passed away. And I didn't have that person that I could go to. And she was amazing actually at, sitting down and naming feelings and feeling the sensations and really leaning into that. But yes, at those times when I really needed somebody to just hold space for me, that wasn't available. And the voice that was looping in my head was, you are being weak. You need to figure this out. No one is interested in how you're feeling or what your problems are. Get on with it. Which is Ah, horrible. Yeah, and it's so interesting too, and, the thing that's coming up for me is I've interviewed a lot of in fact, all of my previous interviews I think have been from America. And so I'm like, oh, it must be an American thing. And so to hear your experience from UK and Canada, which really it's okay, America, what America has done is just strengthened the patriarchy. So because it's like story after story of women who are saying the same thing, Charlotte, all of my listeners are like, okay there's something in the water. Because we all had parents who were doing the best that they could with what they had. And so I'm seeing like, oh, there's something in the water. It's a systemic issue. You use the word weak, which makes me think then what we're valuing is strength. And strength means shut it down. Yes, there's a really there's a really, I was at a karaoke experience not too long ago, and there's a country song that's there's this mom talking to her daughter and her daughter's going through a breakup and she's basically fix your makeup. Hide you're crazy. Act like a lady, i'm like, oh, no wonder. And it's sung by a woman. So it's not like a man problem. It's a social construct that keeps us in suffering, detached from our own feelings and being, yes. Yes. And I think, I've looked back at this as well because my parents were born during the Second World War. So I look at their parents and I look at what they were going through and oh my gosh, when you say they were doing the best they could, a hundred percent. There's no blame here whatsoever. We are all doing the best we can. But yeah, so I, yeah, I look at my grandparents and I'm like, oh my gosh, I can't even imagine what life was like for them. And then, and I know, like my dad was sent away to boarding school when he was six years old, so Oh my gosh. Of course. Did he feel loved? I'm sure he didn't, did he feel rejected? Yes. Could he talk about his feelings? No, I don't think, either of my parents were encouraged to do that. But what I love now is that I think we are coming into this time of awakening. We are coming into a period in our lives where. It is okay to start talking about how we feel. And that was one of the main reasons why I thought, oh, podcast, because that had never been on my mind. It wasn't in the cards for me at all. And yet here it was, the opportunity was presented and I really sat with it and thought, I haven't had a voice for a long time, and I feel like it's time now to speak up because when I speak up and I become vulnerable and share how I am feeling, oh, it gives me chills. I can't tell you, and I'm sure you've experienced the same Dana. I can't tell you how many women and men have reached out to me and said. Thank you for sharing what you shared because I thought I was the only one. Yes. And I'm like, I thought I was the only one. Yes. The power of shared stories and what happens, it sounds like it's happening for you too, is that although it's not a direct ask for help in that way, it's being liberated to say, I have a voice, I'm sharing it, even if it shakes and we're gonna be talking about feelings or reality or whatever the truth is. And in doing that, we set other people free who are siloed in that same island of, I'm separate, there's no one else. I can't ask for help. And so you're, the work that you're doing is helping liberate. Others, and that's so powerful. I wonder about this other word that you use and it's come up for me, Alec, also, and it's this idea that this, it sounds like an equation of a. Achievement on one side of the equal sign and worthiness on the other side. I like to call it achievement is, and it sounds like you had a strong case of that. And tell us a little bit about how that impacted the way that you moved through the world, the way that you navigated your relationship with your daughter, and then this idea of fixing, are those related at all? Say more about your, the word achievement and achieving. Yeah it's interesting, isn't it? Because I think, I saw what was modeled for me was if you achieve, you do well at school and you do well outside of school as well, you have to have all these extracurricular activities, which I did. It's funny, I was talking to my husband the other night about our childhood and he said, what was a typical weekend for you? And I was like, oh my gosh. Three hours of orchestra because we all had to be in music and then, and it, and the list went on. So achievement was very much tied to my worth. And at some point through throughout my teen years, I think I'd always had it in my mind that I would follow in my mom's footsteps. She was a nurse, she was a registered nurse, and then she went into counseling. And so I always had it in my mind that was what I would do. But at some point around the age of 15, I thought, hang on a second, is that really achieving? And so then I had these grandiose ideas of, oh, I'm going to become a journalist. I'm going to become a broadcaster. I'm going to follow. There was a lady that I loved, a, a female journalist. I think she was the only one I was aware of at the time in England, Kate aie. And I loved her and I thought, oh, I'll be Kate Aie because then I will have achieved and then. I thought maybe I'll be an airline pilot. Honestly, Dana, I had all these ideas of what worthiness looked like, but it was achieving things that really weren't in alignment for me. And then I got the very clear message from my dad no, you can't be an airline pilot. You can't be a journalist. This is not the world that you are allowed to live in. You need to go into nursing. So that's very interesting too. And I did, and I loved it. And I was very good at my job. And at some point I realized that I wasn't actually fulfilling my heart's purpose, and that was when I pivoted a little bit. But it's interesting when I think about my daughter as well, because. I know, and this is hard for me to say, and it is me being vulnerable, but I know I put a lot of pressure on her too. I was the first born, I was a girl. She was the first born, I had postnatal depression when she was born because my mom had just passed away. And I didn't know what I was doing. And again, I didn't ask for help, but I know I put a lot of pressure. On her to achieve. I wish I could rewind and take that back, but I can't. And she, I have watched her go through anxiety and not feeling connected. And I love that you talked about addiction because I firmly believe the opposite of addiction is connection. Yes. And she didn't have that connection. I didn't have that connection. And it wasn't until I heard the words of Byron Katie saying very clearly in my ear, Charlotte, you are addicted. That I was able to reframe that. And from that moment I found a new way to be that was peaceful and in ease and flow. And almost overnight it, it really changed my thinking, and this is where I help women moving forward now, is changing that perspective, changing that dialogue. Because almost overnight I thought, okay, I am the one with the problem. I am the one that I need to focus on. Not her journey is hers. Everybody else's journey is that I need to look in inward and look at me and what I am doing and thinking and my energy that I'm putting out into the world. And so I remember it was about a month later and my daughter she wasn't at home. She'd actually. Left home, she'd run away. She was in a completely different city. She didn't have a cell phone. We never knew when we were going to hear from her. In fact, we often thought it would be a call from the police to say that she was dead. That's common, right? And it was about a month later and she phoned and I remember the phone call was very different and I listened to her and I didn't tell her anything or give her advice. I was just there. And I listened to her and a lot of it didn't make sense because I think she was high at the time. But I was just there. And two weeks later, she was picked up by the police and taken to a hospital. Where I was then able to say, please keep her, don't release her. Let's get her the help. And anyway, that's her story, her journey. But I honestly think, because I reframe my thinking, I put out a different energy into the world, she was able to change her response to that and change her energy. Energy and frequency and releasing all our such magical healing tools. So let's go a little deeper into that. I'm curious. So you've moved, you've got your kiddos, your mom has passed, you're painting you're in fixing addiction and achievement is, and maybe not awake to it, but prop separated, unable to ask for help. And th this is after the, this is after the incident with the patient, right? Or the client? No, this is all before. Okay. This is all before that. Yes. And when you heard the Byron Katie podcast, so something happened, you said you stopped. You put your paintbrush down. You were present with what Byron was saying. I say Byron, like we're besties.'cause definitely coming on the pod podcast. I'm available for you by Byron, just so you know. And then something shifted in you. Can you talk a little bit, can you talk a little bit about that shift point, that pivot point where it sounds like not, you didn't just set down the paintbrush, you sat down an old identity and some paradigms that were strangling you in favor of a beautiful release. So say a little bit more about what that experience was like. Yeah, I think it's, yeah, and I can visualize myself there in that moment. And I think, Katie's words were just, they were so meant for me. And I'm sure they were meant for they're meant for everybody. But in that moment, they were meant for me. And I think. What her words did when she, because to everybody else externally, obviously my daughter was the one with the addiction. Obviously everybody could see that was involved with that. But Katie completely turned that around. And this is the beauty of mindset work, and this is a lot of the work that I do now, is, we are stuck in our old ways of thinking, which Dana, I'm not knocking them because they served us very well. Yeah. They kept us safe. They helped regulate our nervous system at a time when we needed that at a time when we were figuring things out. And the only way to move forward was to put on these masks. I was obviously ready. This was a pivotal moment for me, and her words really allowed me to drop all those masks, all those limiting beliefs that I had before. My beliefs about myself and the world that I lived in and the kind of mother I felt like I needed to be. Everything just dropped away in that moment when I thought about it's me with the addiction. I am a addicted to the hamster wheel, the rat race, the having to achieve. I'm addicted to putting out there into the world, the face of, Hey, look at me. I'm perfect. I've got it all together when inside I was falling apart. I was sad, I was lost. I was crying out for help, but I had this facade of, look at me, I'm perfect. And Katie's words allowed me to just drop that and really, yeah look at myself as being the one,'cause I'm the only one I can change. I can't change anybody else. And neither is it my responsibility to change anybody else. That's their business. And Katie says this very clearly as well. If I'm not in my business, I'm either in your business or God's business, and I have no right to be there. And that's how I've moved forward now is. Am I in my business? This is a question I ask myself every day. Am I in my business when my husband leaves his socks on the floor again, like really after 30 years? You don't get that. You should pick them up. Come on, dude. In the laundry basket. But when I'm chastising him for that, I'm not in my business. I'm in his business and I have no right to be there. I love that so much. So two, two things I wanna hover on. Man, this is really powerful. I love that you loved on your old paradigms. I love that. In the recovery community, I think so many of us are quick to shame our old ourselves, the old version of ourselves that was really just there to make sure that we're safe and we're gonna make it make, I know for me, there's been a there and the women that I coach and mentor, there is still a lot of shame about the old, the unrecovered version of ourselves or even the present unrecovered. And can you just say a little bit more I think this is like your magic potion, what you just said among many others. Can you say a little bit more about loving on that part of ourselves and what that looks like in your practice, either with your daughter or with your husband, or with yourself? Yeah. And that is so powerful and I feel so grateful that, that I have become aware of this because I think so many of us have that inner critic that is very judgmental. And I, yeah. How many times throughout the day we are like, you're not good enough, you're not smart enough, you're not earning enough money, you are not caring enough. I think a lot mine is you're not doing enough, you're not being productive enough. You're not being efficient enough. Exactly. Exactly. And I know, and I really remind my daughter of this now, she's been sober for three and a half years now, so I know. Oh, I'm just so grateful. But I remind her because she has a lot of shame as well. And I say to her, your addiction was a blessing. And I really learned a lot from GBO Mate as well. Yes. And I love his books. I've read his books. I just I think he has such wisdom. It's incredible. But if it were not for my daughter's addiction I'm sure the alternative was she wouldn't be here now. Her addiction saved her because her pain was so great. That she couldn't see a way out. And whether it's an addiction or whether it's a behavior that we are used to reacting in a certain way, whatever that is, that's a protection mechanism. And we needed that. Yes, we so desperately needed that as children, as teenagers, as in our twenties, whatever age, even in our fifties, sixties, seventies. We need those mechanisms in place to protect us and to keep us safe. And the ego is all about keeping us safe and protecting us. So in the work that I do and in the work that I've done on myself as well, it was never about turning my back on those parts. It was about loving them. Loving that part of me that so desperately wanted to achieve. Having that little one come sit beside me and me holding space for that little one and saying, little one, meaning the small version of you. The small version of me that was confused, that was lost, that didn't understand the world, and really creating this space where the little version of me had a voice, has a voice and can let me know what it is.'cause there's incredible wisdom there. Incredible wisdom. And when we really sit with that and listen to the wisdom and then offer support and whatever that little one needed in that moment, but offering it now. Wow. That's where the healing is. Yes. And my understanding with that is we aren't just healing our own small, the small parts of us that need love, we're going back generations when we create that kind of healing experiences. Is that your understanding as well? A hundred percent, yes. And it's almost not only can we heal the past, but we can transform it. So it's no longer an anchor, it's jet fuel for the women that we're becoming. Yes. Yeah. And it's no longer holding us back. It's giving us permission, like you say, jet fuel to propel us forward. Yes. And I think, it's I was brought up with judgment and, structure and a very critical way of being. And I think when we can, when I've been able to reframe. That critic, that judgment and have compassion for all the different parts of me and move into self-forgiveness, Dana, that's huge. Self-forgiveness. Giving ourselves the permission to forgive ourselves for not understanding the situation that we were in and for doing the best that we could and not judging that, oh my gosh, there's a place for us to be expansive, to grow and to move forward and show other women people, but women predominantly. You know that there is a way, there is a way forward, and that's, honestly, if you're listening to this and you feel like you are alone, I've been there. I thought I was alone, but there is a way forward and you are not alone. And these feelings are feelings that other people have. I felt, yeah, there is a way forward. And it's not like just some people, it's, if you're taking a breath right now and you're a woman, it's likely you're in this club. The Secret club that nobody talks about, that everyone is a member of. Yes. We all wear the badge. I'm curious about. This is perfect because you said you, part of the transformation is the way that you began talking to yourself differently, which flows into the way we talk to the people we love and our community. And then you just said the antidote to judgment is compassion. And so I'm curious about, can you give specific examples because I love the concept of the inner critic. I also like that you gave specific examples of what she's saying to you. Can you al help us alchemize a phrase to that your inner critic used to say to you, and now what your inner, what do you call her now? Goddess, healer, Sage. What she says to counter use the word reframe, which helps, makes me think there's an alchemy there where it still probably comes up. What does it sound like? What's the practice you use to shift it and what's the new compassionate love language that you're speaking to yourself over yourself? Oh my gosh, I love that question, Dana. You asked the most beautiful questions. Yes. I think, awareness is the first step. We don't know what we don't know, and I was living in a fog. I think many of us live in this. Fog for want of a better word. We don't know any other way. And it's not until somebody else holds that space for us and allows us to really feel into the feelings and the sensations that for years I pushed aside, not important. Can't feel them. It's not until we are given that space to really feel into that, do we start to become aware? So awareness is the first step for sure. Okay. I am trying to think of something. My inner critic is a voice that I hear, don't put that out there. Don't say that. Maybe it's a podcast episode that I'm creating that, that I'm thinking, Ooh, that would be fun to do. And the voice is, don't do that. Nobody will appreciate that. And they'll judge you and they'll laugh at you. You are you're not worthy. You have nothing important to say. Yeah. So now I pause and that is so important to take a moment and breathe into that. And it sounds so simple, but it's literally sitting still in the moment, breathing and acknowledging that voice. And I actually say to myself now, oh honey, I see you. I get you are here. I love that you are here. Come sit beside me and tell me more about that. Ah, and just allowing the space for her to have her voice and to speak and say, I'm scared if you put yourself out there. I'm scared of being rejected and finding that inner sage, goddess queen that resourced part of me. The part of me who has that inner wisdom, who knows that I am part of something bigger than myself, and allowing that part of me, the real me, the self with the capital S to then say, I get that. I see you. That's normal. I get that. But I've got this. This is something I really want to do. This is something that's close to my heart. Other people may judge me, and that's their stuff to deal with. And I think really acknowledging that, that other people's reactions are beyond my control. And like I say, they're not my business. That's their stuff to deal with. And to give you another example, because I've really brought this into my marriage as well, and this has changed, we've been married for 28 years. We've been together for over 30 years. I think, knowing what I know now and having more self-compassion, I can now have more compassion for my husband too. So when he reacts in a certain way, then I can hold space for him. I can breathe into that moment and know that his reaction is nothing about me. This is him. This is his little one. His little boy reacting in that moment because that little boy didn't get what he needed at the time. He didn't get the love he needed or the acceptance or whatever that looked like. And now I can hold space for him too, and I can say to him, oh, I see that you're really bothered by that. What's coming up for you? And then it's nothing about me. I don't need to react because it's not mine. Wow. Charlotte, we need to come and have another conversation about marriage. I think I'm gonna do a series on marriage. Okay. I love that. Thank you for that specific example. It's so nice to hear and I wanna tell a quick story and then ask you about spirituality, so just so you know, that's where we're headed. When I ha had kids. My mom is incredible. She's brave, she's courageous, she's stoic. Si similar genre of upbringing where it's no, we're not talking about feelings. Those aren't a thing that we're discussing. And why did I mention that? Oh, when I had my own kids, I was like I don't know how to love my own kids. Not, I'm not saying my mom loves me in her own very brave, courageous way, but there was a gap for me between what I felt like I wanted to experience and what I was available for. And I felt very shut off. And at that time I had was in recovery for a long time. I'd mentored a lot of women, but I still felt like there was a block between me even understanding what is compassion?'cause I don't think I got the chip in my brain. And two, what does it sound like? And I wanna give a shout out to you specifically, but it reminds me of there was, I have a friend, we've been friends 10, 12 years in recovery, and one of the reasons I was so drawn to her is because of her deep compassion. And every time anyone comes around her and they bring up something hard, she's very, as you can imagine, people love to come to her because she says just what you said. She said, oh honey, that sounds really hard. Tell me about it. And I heard her say that, and I thought. That must be what compassionate people say. So I started literally parroting that phrase to my daughters and they loved it. And it was almost like the seed of compassion was planted. It's still growing admitted, like still a little bit of a hardcore I'll just say I'm growing in compassion. I'll let it there. I'll let it go there. But this idea that it's possible to overcome the inner critic through love and compassion and what she sounds like sometimes is, oh honey, that sounds really hard. Come and tell me about it. Yes. And watching what happens within myself, with my daughters, with you and your little one, creating more space to integrate that need for love really is all I can call it. It's a need for being seen and loved. So thank you for that reminder and shout out to Emily if you're listening. Love you so much my girl. And let's talk about spirituality. So you hinted at it a little bit. We've talked about divine, we've talked about the word divine. You use this capital S self. Is spirituality a part of your transformation? If so, can you speak into what that looked like? The bridge from setback to comeback and what it looks like right now. Yeah. It's interesting because growing up, so my grandparents were very Church of England and I loved that church. I used to go and stand up in the pulpit after the services and pretend that I was giving a sermon. I just, I loved the grandeur of the Church of England. But again, it was very strict. There were very. Set rules about what you could and couldn't do. And then my mom believed in God. She was a Christian. She was very dedicated and went to church every Sunday and had this most amazing community of people, of women around her. And I saw that and I loved that. I thought that was amazing. I actually, at the time, felt like that was out of my reach. But she modeled that and I loved that about her. But I think, there again, there were rules and there were, there was so much structure for me. It just didn't feel aligned. Yeah. And I couldn't quite put my finger on it. And I remember at the age of 16, it was one Sunday morning and my mom was like, okay, come on. It's nearly time for church. And on the other hand, incidentally, my dad was an atheist and so he never went to church and he stayed at home. And this one particular Sunday morning, I said, I'm not going. And that was like, I had committed the ultimate sin, right? It was just like, oh my gosh, I didn't think I could be in more trouble. But I felt at that age, it was time for me to test that out a little bit because something wasn't quite right here. And so then I think I went for a long time. Being lost and not really knowing what felt aligned for me and what didn't. And yeah, I suppose throughout my nursing career I focused on the science of healing and it wasn't until I started my own business back in 2016 when I took on more of a holistic energy type of healing coaching that I thought there is something there. I don't know what it's called. I don't even feel like I need to put a name to it. But what I do get a sense of now is that we are energy. Everything about us is energy. We are all connected by energy. I always laugh when I say that because my children repeat that back to me and say we are all connected, mom, because I think I say it so many times, but yes, we are all connected to each other. Everything vibrates at a certain frequency, and I think I just. I really embody energy and the energy I give out there, the energy that I receive, I truly believe we are connected to something bigger than ourselves. And we can call that whatever we want to, we can call it God or, universe or admin or, yeah, it doesn't matter. But that's, and also it doesn't care. It doesn't care what we call it. It doesn't care exactly. But I love, I meditate every morning. I love my morning meditation. I've also started in the the beginning of this year, I've started doing a nightly self-forgiveness meditation as well. And I just feel so alive and so connected to. Everything to mother nature to earth, to, to the universe. Yeah. So I know it doesn't matter what it is or what I call it because I know I'm a part of it, and yeah, that feels so good and juicy. It brings us back to the beginning of the conversation, whereas generally a setback of any kind is rooted in the great separation and the spiritual transformation. The energetic transformation is rooted in the great connection of us, all of the energy field. The spirit of the breath of the freedom that you find in the forgiveness practice. I love, someone said the synonym for forgiveness is freedom. Yes. Oh yes. And guess how we can create lives that were, you said, I just wanna say this out loud. I forgot to, to elevate this. You said what I want every woman in the world to say authentically I'm in love with my life. And that happens when we feel peace and the freedom that comes with self-forgiveness and self-compassion and being awake to things like, oh, there's a message. It just happens to be from Byron Katie. Yeah. But it was intended for Charlotte. Yeah. So the great connector that connects us with who and whose we are and what we need in the moment if we're awake and available to it. So help us then, Charlotte, connect to you. Tell us about the work in the world. Tell us how it might benefit women who are in recovery, women who are set backing to, to come backing and let us know how we can work with you and where to find you. And I'll drop all links in the show notes so you can. If you're gonna find Charlotte,'cause I'm obsessed with her. Oh, thank you Dana. I so appreciate you. Yes. I just, I love if you feel a calling I'm not everyone's cup of tea. I always say that that's the English in me. I say it on my podcast. But if you do feel like something resonated and you would love to know more and you would love to connect, even if you just want to say hi. I would love to say hi to you. Send me an email. Look me up on Facebook or Instagram. I do work one-on-one with people. I hold space for them in beautiful containers. Yeah I have a course that I started teaching as well called The Connection Course. Yes that's not, we've just finished another run of that, so that's not coming up again until next year. But I do group coaching as well. But I would love to hear from you. I would love to hear your story. I would love to hear what resonated with you, what you disagree. With me, anything that I said because yeah, I would just love to hear it all. And Dana, I also, I meant to say this at the beginning, but I also want to say to you I hadn't listened to your podcast before and then I listened. I went on your show and I thought which episode shall I listen to? And I thought, oh, you know what? I'm just going to go back to the beginning and listen to your first episode. Oh my gosh, it gave me chills. It's beautiful. You speak so from the heart. There is so much wisdom there. And I felt even more connected to you. So I really, again, I just want to thank you for the work that you are doing and what you're putting out the world. You are amazing. It is a great pleasure, and I chuckled because I feel like that version of me who was terrified to even record the podcast and press publish, I went into a fear blackout. So I'm like, I actually have never listened to that episode again. I'm so glad that it's still coming strong and through. My heart to your heart because that is me in total terror. So if you wanna hear the Terrified Podcast starting version of me, episode one is your best place to start. And I wanna commend you, Charlotte, because I am. A grateful recipient of your on the spot coaching. And when she says she coaches for transformation, she means it. And I bet the work that you do with clients looks very different. But we've today talked about disconnection, separation. Inner critic. The inner judge, shame, addiction, fixing addiction to fixing. I see you nodding and I can't help but like Charlotte can support with all of those things, a transformation. Not just because she's an expert, but because she has personal experience that she's brave enough to share, which my experience that knows that's gonna call us forward. So do not hesitate. Charlotte is incredible. She will reach out, she will reach back out to you in the middle of a call that she's supposed to be in charge to. Yes, I'll, yes. So what is one thing that you would say to a woman who might be, she's paint, she's in painting right now. She's where you were, she was painting, and it's not Byron Katie anymore. It's Charlotte Dukes. What's the thing that you want her to hear today as she puts down her paintbrush and makes space for her new life? Oh my gosh. I'm just connecting with my heart quite honestly, because I am seeing that version of me sitting on the floor, putting down my paintbrush, and I see, and I sense your exhaustion and your desperation. That there is no other way. And I want you to know that there is a new way to be. There is a new way to show up in this world and to be with yourself and it's incredible and it's hard to believe that you can get there, but it's already inside you. Yeah, it's not out there. It's been here the whole time and I love that your course is the connector, the connection isn't that interesting. Okay, Charlotte, as we sign off, I'll just invite you to open your hearts. I've opened mine and just receive this from me. I love you. I'm so proud of you. I'm so grateful for you and your work in the world, and I deeply believe in your ability to create a life that you love. And thank you so much for joining us today. Dana, thank you so much. From my heart, back to yours. I love you so much. Whoa. Did you just feel what I felt? There's a whole lot of that and so much more to inspire you to create miracles in your own life on upcoming episodes of the Girls Who Recover podcast. And if you loved that episode as much as I loved making it follow the show, give it a gorgeous rating and a five star review, and then share it with your best friend to be a light in her life. And don't let the fun stop here. You can find me on Instagram at Girls Who Recover. For more ways to create a life that takes your breath away. And Sister, in case you haven't heard it today, I love you. I'm so proud of you, and I believe in your ability to create a gorgeous life you love starting right now. See you in the next episode. Wa.