Feedstuffs in Focus

Beyond climate debate: Finding cows that do more with less

• Feedstuffs

Share episode

A collaboration between the Angus Foundation and the Bezos Earth Fund and Global Methane Fund has sparked passionate debate throughout the cattle industry. At its heart lies a $4.85 million research grant focused on exploring genetic differences in methane production among cattle—but as we discover, this project represents far more than environmental concerns.

Matt Perrier of Dalebanks Angus, whose family has ranched the same Kansas land since 1867, offers a producer's perspective on why this research matters. "Our interest is trying to find cows that do more with less," Perrier explains, highlighting that the primary motivation isn't climate change mitigation but identifying cattle that convert range forage more efficiently into meat and milk. The research builds upon promising work at land-grant universities suggesting that cattle emitting less methane may be retaining more energy for productive purposes.

What makes this initiative particularly significant is how it bridges different worlds. For ranchers, it promises economic benefits through more efficient animals. For environmental groups, it offers potential methane reductions. The research structure ensures the beef industry maintains control of the data while accessing funding that would otherwise be unavailable—a pragmatic approach to advancing genetic selection tools that benefit producers first and foremost.

Beyond the technical aspects, Perrier points to another valuable outcome: changing the conversation about cattle production. Rather than merely defending against environmental criticism, this research positions ranchers as proactive stewards willing to innovate. "We're as concerned about the environment as anybody," Perrier notes, "and that's why we're doing this." This forward-thinking approach may represent the next frontier in sustainable beef production, combining generations of ranching wisdom with cutting-edge science.

Subscribe to our podcast for more insightful conversations about the challenges and opportunities shaping the future of agriculture!

Sarah Muirhead:

The Angus Foundation, through its genetics subsidiary, angus Genetics Inc. Recently received a $4.85 million grant from the Bezo Earth Fund and Global Methane Hub. It's a move that has raised strong emotions among some in the cattle industry. Welcome to Feedstuffs In Focus, our podcast taking a look at the big issues affecting the livestock, poultry grain and animal feed industries. I'm your host, sarah Muirhead. In today's episode, Beef Magazine's Clint Peck is joined by Matt Perrier of Daleb anks Angus to talk about the recent agreement and its focus on exploring the genetic differences in energy efficiency between ruminant animals and the level of methane they emit during their lives.

Clint Peck:

Thanks a lot, Matt, for being with us. Before we dive into a discussion on the Bezos grant, can you give us a little bit of your backstory and where you're at in the beef industry today?

Matt Perrier:

Sure, sure, I appreciate you having me on, Clint. Yeah, Matt Perrier, from Eureka, Kansas, co-owner and manager of Dale Banks Angus, which is our family's ranch. I've been in the Angus business since about 1904 when my ancestors started here, and ranching in this same area since 1867. So when we get to talking about sustainability issues, I think that every rancher would agree that the number one industry maybe in the nation that is focused on sustainability true sustainability financial, social, family and of course, the resources would be farmers and ranchers. And so, yeah, sustainability is a big thing and that's one component of this discussion we're having today. I've been here since, well, I was born and raised on the ranch, went to K-State for a little while Kansas State University, worked in a variety of fields within the beef industry, but outside of my production roots here at Dale Banks within the beef industry, but outside of my production roots here at Dale Banks and then moved back here in May of 2004 with my wife, Amy, and our one-year-old daughter, Ava.

Matt Perrier:

And Ava just graduated from Kansas State a couple of weeks ago and it's been a good ride, been a very educational one, but that's what we do on the daily today educational one, but that's what we do on the daily today. Also have a actually have a podcast that I smaller podcast that we produce here for farmers and ranchers called Practically Ranching, but the main gig obviously is running a registered cow herd and marketing bulls to folks throughout this state and region.

Clint Peck:

Great Well, we really appreciate you coming in and talking about us with this, about this Bezos project. Can you kind of outline a little bit about what the project is all about, and then we'll kind of go from there, sure.

Matt Perrier:

And I need to make sure and make it clear I am a member of the American Angus Association. We submit, you know, registrations and transfers and data, and actually used to work for them for a brief time decades ago. But my vested interest in this project and this discussion is that solely of a breeder of Angus cattle and somebody who's pretty focused on trying to make every generation a little better than the one before, and so that's where I guess I got involved in this issue and wanted to learn some more. Just a little backstory on this particular deal. I'm embarrassed to admit that I didn't know anything about this research project with the funding coming from this foundation, until about a week ago. My son said oh my dad, I just got a text from some friends that said that the Angus Association's taken 4.7 million dollars from the Bezos Fund and I said, oh my, what's it about? And he said methane research. And I said well, the Angus Association has been doing methane research for a couple of years. In fact we were part of a project through Kansas State University that then American Angus helped fund and look at some of that initial methane collection data that K-State was doing for the last year and a half and they're going to present some of that stuff actually at Beef Improvement Federation next year. And we also had sold some genetics to Oklahoma State University, who is focused on a similar project, a little bit different approach to it.

Matt Perrier:

But all this was about was, in my opinion, in my perspective and I think the Angus leadership would echo, this was about trying to find cattle that were forage efficient. And so when they're out there grazing on pastures or grazing on a high roughage hay type ration like I would guess 90 some percent of us in ranching do in the cow-calf segment, how do we find the ones that are most efficient at converting that forage or grass into meat or milk or the next calf? And so that's where my interest was, that's where Angus Association, angus Genetics Incorporated's interest was for the last two years, and I think, as we saw that initial data, we said there may be something here, not just on the methane emission component, but that it is linked to their efficiency of production. And those cows that emit less methane and still produce the pounds of calf weaning and the next calf in subsequent years, are probably wasting less as methane and retaining more as milk and production and fat and meat and everything else that a cow is supposed to be doing on forage. And so that's where the interest was.

Matt Perrier:

The Angus Association then said, okay, what more do we need? Because these projects ended with K-State and what Oklahoma State is doing. They're great projects but they're very limited in their scope. Why? Because land grant institutions have a hard time getting funding today. And so, as the Angus Genetics Incorporated looked at that arm of Angus Association, looked at trying to get enough phenotypes that we could actually make some good real data. It was going to take a lot of money, and so they they built a research project proposal and I I don't know some of this stuff not being on the board, I'm just relying on what I've read on those press releases and website and things. But they were trying to find somebody that would fund this proposal and got connected somehow with an outfit called the Global methane hub I think is what it's called and the kind of a clearinghouse that tries to put folks who have a good hypothesis and a good research request with those who have the funding that wants to go into that kind of area. And that's where I think the Global Hub matched our project that the Angus Association and AGI had come up with with the funder, which is this basis earth fund.

Matt Perrier:

And again, I I'm embarrassed to say that I didn't even see the press release back in, like I didn't even I. We were breeding cows, we were trying to get corn planted there, you know we didn't fall calves. There was a lot going on. I missed it and I'm embarrassed to say that, but I didn't know anything about it until Lyle said that his friend group had dialed it up and keyed it up and he saw it. Well then, I got on Facebook Sunday night and plenty of people had seen it and I know there were some discussions, as did I.

Matt Perrier:

Right, yeah, I just didn't hear him. And so that's when I guess I started drilling down and asking some questions and I texted a guy that I knew on the American Anglican Association board and asked for some clarification and some input and and and went and found those that information the Anglican Association had put out there before and then of course they tried to put some information out there to target exactly the questions that had been raised on social media and things like that. And so that's when I finally kind of learned about today's part of it, which is the funding source. I knew what we had been doing with K-State here personally and some of that research through the beef industry. But yeah, that brings us up, I guess, to today.

Matt Perrier:

But yeah, I think, while you and so many others have called this this Bezos project, it's actually this beef industry project that the Angus Association put together and worked with some folks in New Zealand and Australia months, if not maybe even a year or so ago. I know it was being talked about a year plus ago because what they saw initially from K-State and Oklahoma State and some of that research that was available, said we think there's something here, oklahoma State and some of that research that was available said we think there's something here. Now how do we make this big enough that we can actually get good, good data that might lead to some genetic selection tools? Then they shopped it around and then the Earth Fund or Bezos Earth Fund came into the picture and said, yeah, we're interested in funding this. And because of that and I'm not in the grant funding or the research funding arena, but everyone that I have either been involved with and as I've asked questions, because that was one of the first questions I had, as I've asked questions about this specific one when an entity, a research entity like AGI, structures a program, a research proposal, agi structures a program, a research proposal, they get to put in there. Who gets to see that data? And now they're working with this group of folks from New Zealand and Australia and I think maybe UK and Ireland, and each of them it's specified, each of them gets some information back in response for them putting phenotypes and information into this big 20-some million dollar project.

Matt Perrier:

Our part of it, I think, is 4.85 that AGI is sharing with those other entities and AGI just gets a portion of that 4.85. But we get to write the rules and we get to use this data. This isn't something that we're a for hire entity, that we're doing the work for the Bezos Foundation and then just saying here you go, take this data and use it however you wish. The way it's been explained to me and everything that I read on that press release from 45 days ago or now, I guess, almost 60 days ago would back up the fact that these cooperative groups in the beef industry beef, dairy lamb, I think there's some other ruminant types of entities that are part of that but it's our data to use and to do something with.

Matt Perrier:

The funder is just saying we support the thought process because, yeah, you cow guys are into it because you want to make more efficient range cows. We're into it because we being the Bezos Foundation, because we want to see if we can limit the methane emissions, and so it's a win-win for all of us. But yeah, my interest and I would say that the Angus Association's leadership interest, is not about reducing our carbon footprint. I hate to say that, but I don't think that's it. Our interest is trying to find cows that do more with less.

Clint Peck:

Our interest is trying to find cows that do more with less, and there has been some pushback in the industry so far, especially on social media, which we all know is a tough road to hoe right there, or the Angus Association's acquiescing into the thought process that methane, that cows cause methane problems, greenhouse gas warming, climate change, all that and really what you're saying is that this has been an initiative by the industry to try to make cows more efficient, especially those out on grass, those range cows, like you said, and make them more efficient and maybe in turn, do the win-win thing of producing less methane as they graze and as they ruminate.

Matt Perrier:

Yeah, yeah, and I'm all about win-wins and unintended positive consequences, and I recognize there's a risk of unintended negative consequences, but the way this research is structured and the folks who are at the table, both A putting the research program and seeing if are there, is there enough heritability in this information that we can make a good tool, a good selection tool, and if not, we're not going to do it.

Matt Perrier:

But if we are, can we move the needle? Those folks all are driven by the goal of ranchers' ability to stay on the land and produce cattle into perpetuity and this is just one more way that I believe and I think the Angus leadership and all the folks that are involved with this project believe it's just one more way that we can find someone to help us get the tools. Because I'll be honest, I mean I don't. I don't know what 4.8, some million dollars looks like, but I don't think that very many breed associations even the Angus association is significant of a player as they are in the beef industry and as many registrations and data and everything else that comes through here. I don't know very many Angus members who would say else that comes through here. I don't know very many Angus members who would say, yeah, this cow efficiency deal is really important to me and let's just fund that.

Matt Perrier:

Let's increase dues or registration numbers or registration fees or whatever the case may be, and let's fund this from within. This, to me, is an opportunity to get what it is we want funded and find out if there is enough, if there is enough heritability, if there's something here from a data standpoint, that we can find cattle that are more efficient on range grass and hay and things like that, like that, and let someone else pay for it who, by the way, isn't going to get to even see the data until we have used it and developed what we need to do out of it. And so, yeah, we all talk about chicken and egg kinds of deals. This isn't even one of those. Whichever you want to say, came first, the chicken or the egg? Right, the beef industry, the ruminant industry, angus Genetics Incorporated was that first one. This BEF fund came much, much later to the table and said, yeah, we'll help you get the research, get the phenotypes collected, get everything analyzed.

Clint Peck:

And, as you mentioned, there's a lot of forward-thinking research being done out there in the land-grant institutions. I know Nebraska, Kansas and there's lots of other states that are doing this and the Angus Association and Angus Genetics have a great track record of working with those land grant institutions and in all kinds of research and I think it's probably encouraging that this research that Angus is doing now using this money is kind of kicking off a whole other round of research and maybe another angle or another look at the possibilities that there may be methane production through beef cattle that could be impacting climate change and we can maybe do something, our share at least in the cattle industry, do something about it and just increase that body of knowledge out there.

Matt Perrier:

In total, Right, yeah, and you know I love industry and land grant research and that's the model that we in the beef industry and breed associations. That's one that we've worked within for years and it's an excellent one. I think today some of those research institutions, because of budget cuts and you know changes in all different areas of their business, they probably don't quite have the funding and the staff and grad assistants, everybody else, to do what we could do 30 and 40 years ago. But what's cool about it is it's kind of an almost an incubator concept. Okay, so Kansas state was working with the Angus association collecting a little bit of this phenotype, a little bit of these phenotypes through these green feed machines, and you know there's not enough data there to make an EPD or something like that yet, but there probably is enough to go. Hey, there are differences and we think there are differences within related animals.

Matt Perrier:

A certain sire group is emitting a little less methane is a little bit higher body condition score. They're likely eating about grazing about the same. Let's go forth and let's figure something out, and so that then is leveraged with some dollars from another source into a bigger project that, yeah, the land grant and breed associations and beef industry producers got to kick it off and start it. Now we just figure out how to how to carry it on. And you know again you mentioned their climate change and methane production by the beef industry.

Matt Perrier:

I put a post out on Facebook it's been four or five days ago and I started the thing off and it was about this exact topic because there was a lot of negative energy and still is about this decision. But I started off with I believe in climate change, but I don't believe that we're at fault. My personal opinion and you may disagree with me. There may be people listening to this that may disagree I don't think man's impact, especially in the recent years, is driving climate change. Do we have a portion of it that we're guilty for? Maybe, but there were wild swings in the weather, naturally, for millennia. I don't think it's our fault and I certainly don't think that it's ruminant's fault, and that's why I think that we need to look at this for what it is, and that is a forage efficiency project.

Matt Perrier:

And if we're able to quantify and dispel some of the myths about cattle's impact on our carbon footprint or on the environment or on methane or whatever you want to talk about, that's great. That's great. But the focus here for me and I think the focus for our Angus Association is can we figure out a way to find cows that produce what it is we want? Can we figure out a way to find cows that produce what it is we want? Big wean and wait calves breeding back every year, long lasting stay in the herd until they're 14 years old, all this stuff and do it with less forage. It's a goldmine. I'm all for it. It's going to take a while. It's going to take a long while, I would guess, and a lot of money, and that's why we're here talking about millions of dollars, not just hundreds of thousands that we could have probably done on a smaller project.

Clint Peck:

But you know it goes back to sort of your introduction. It goes back to sustainability in the beef industry, being able to prove that we don't have that impact on the environment that some are claiming that we do in the beef industry. But then, like you say, the win-win of making cattle more efficient, if it's out there to do so and to identify those animals and, yeah, whatever gene markers they are, whatever EPDs that may be down the road sometime, can only benefit us all. And again, telling our story in a positive way so that we can keep cattle ranchers on the land, and I guess, speaking for myself and for Beef Magazine, Matt, we applaud you and the Angus Association, Angus Genetics Inc.

Clint Peck:

for your efforts in leading this charge, along with a lot of others that are out there, and it has to do with sustainability and keeping ranch producing beef for us and people around the world.

Matt Perrier:

You bet, you bet. Yeah, it starts with genetics, and I think we, as genetics providers, have to take those leadership steps, and sometimes they're not easy. Sometimes the fear of the unknown gets the better of us, but I think these discussions are healthy. I think it helps us understand why it is that we do this every day and get up and take care of these cows and get them bred and fed and managed and marketed and everything else, but I do think that, in today's day and age whether I believe that man has a direct influence on the environment or climate change, or anything that I know to be true If I sit here on River Road in the Flint Hills of Kansas and say that nobody that matters is going to change the way they're coming at us with anti-media agendas.

Matt Perrier:

If, though, I and a bunch of other ranchers step forth and say we see a reason to do this from a true production standpoint. We think we can do more with less inputs. We think we can make cows that will do more with less acres all these things. That believes that cows are the problem with climate change sees. Okay, here are a bunch of cowboys that are wanting to do methane research. Are you serious? Maybe they're not so bad after all. So I think that's one more again unintended positive byproduct that we have a potential, as we're gaining these phenotypes, to find the cows that do more with less have a potential advantage to. Instead of just sitting back and throwing rocks at these quote unquote environmentalists, we step up and say we're very interested in the environment. So was our dad and our grandmother and our great grandmother and the five generations that have kept this place together. We're as concerned about it as anybody, and that's why we're doing this.

Sarah Muirhead:

I'm Sarah Muirhead and you've been listening to Feedstuffs In Focus. If you would like to hear more conversations about some of the big issues affecting the livestock, poultry, grain and animal feed industries, subscribe to this podcast on your favorite podcast channel. Until next time, have a great day and thank you for listening.