Born to License Year-End Special: The Full Team Reveals 2025's Record Success

After 11 years in business, 2025 became Born's most successful year ever. In this special year-end episode, the entire Born team comes together to share the untold stories behind the record-breaking achievements.

Featured Team Insights:

Born Licensing Team (Amber & Alberto):
- The Garfield groundbreaking billboard campaign
- Google Pixel's first Christmas campaign (2-month turnaround!)
- BFG returning to Sainsbury's for year two
- Candy Crush Solitaire's first-ever licensing partnership

Born to License Team (Alyssa G, Alyssa C, Jenna, Brinna):
- How Keepsake's 600-card Invincible collection came together
- The Disney personalization revolution with Hippo Blue
- Plum Deluxe x Peanuts selling out before Christmas
- Steven Singer's Wicked jewelry success story
- Managing 500+ submissions

Born to License Business Development (Michelle & Matt):
- Why companies from 40+ countries are reaching out
- The surprising industries entering licensing (museums to video games)
- What Licensors really want in 2026

Media & Education (Eduardo, Juliana, Vini):
- Creating 20+ podcast episodes and cinematic trailers
- Launching the Born in Action vlog
- Building Learn to License education platform

Plus: Major 2026 Announcement David introduces Born Legal with sister Emma, expanding into promotional law and marketing compliance.

Whether you're a brand owner, licensing professional, or industry observer, this episode provides an authentic behind-the-scenes look at what it takes to run a global licensing agency at scale.

🎙 Born to License – Hosted by David Born

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Transcript

What is it like being married to David Born? 

It's intense, but I love it. All the deals that you've worked on this year, which one made you think, I can't believe we actually did this? Probably it might be the I am saying Garfield deal. I've always loved Garfield. 

 Working on Google Pixel's first ever Christmas advert was amazing. Timings were insane. It just shows how good we are. 

 What are the typical challenges that they're facing and why they've come to us in the first place? 

 People are seeing licensing as solving a problem. They're seeing it more as an expansion opportunity. 

 Born to licenses. It's more of a quality aspect and not a quantity. 

 We won't put you in front of a licensor unless we think you've got what it takes. 

 How many submissions are really involved for something like this? 

 You're talking hundreds. There's like, I think it was 500 submissions in one go. 

 How do you guys manage and track such an enormous volume of submissions? 

 Well, it was a challenge at first. Organization has been really important for Keepsake. For us, this has opened up a whole new realm. 

 Are there any trends that you expect to see in the new year? 

 I think we're going to continue seeing the impact of theatrical, what services we'll be offering. Anything that you can think of to sell your product, we can be there and advise you along the way. 

 What's it like being my ea? I'm curious. 

 Fast paced is really rewarding. I love working with you. 

 You're married to someone that has extreme focus. When David wants to do something, he's gonna do something and you either help him or you just get out of his way. For someone who's thinking about applying to work at Bourne, share a little bit about what your experience has been like. My advice is just dive in. I'm a big believer in taking a moment at the end of each year to look back and reflect on the year that's gone, how far we've come, and where we still need to go. 2025 was the year Born went from licensing agency to full ecosystem. Our Born licensing division orchestrated partnerships with some of the world's biggest brands, from Garfield and IMS to Love actually and Google Pixel. Meanwhile, our born to license div grew significantly. Now Having signed over 30 clients around the world. 

 We launched a podcast that's now a leading voice in licensing, the one you're listening to right now. We started a vlog pulling back the curtain on what it's like to run a global licensing agency. Something the industry has never seen before. We launched Learn to License, an online course built to help those new to licensing understand how it all works. And we continue to build a team across three continents that's redefining what's possible in the industry today. You're getting an exclusive behind the scenes look at what we've built, how we did it and where we're headed in 2026. Plus a sneak peek at what I'm starting next year with one of my favorite people, my sister. This is the Born to License end of year wrap. I hope you enjoy the show. 

 Before we dive into today's show, I wanted to share something really exciting with you. For the first time ever, I'm opening my vault of nearly 20 years of licensing experience through my online course, Learn to License. Whether you're just starting out or looking to level up your licensing game, this is everything I wish I'd known when I began my journey from deal structures to finding the right license, knowing if you're ready, and how to pitch like a pro. It's all there, the fundamentals that separate successful licensors from everyone else. Visit learntolicense.com and let's get you from curious to confident. Now let's jump into today's episode. I wanted to start this special edition of the Born to License podcast with the Born licensing team. This is really the longest serving business area and 2025 has been our best year ever, which is great. 

 After 11 years, some of the most creative licensing deals we've ever done launched in the last 12 months. Amber and Elby, you've been behind the partnerships that put Garfield in a groundbreaking billboard. Literally groundbreaking. We bought the BFG to Sainsbury's shoppers for a second year in a row. And of course, not to mention the first ever Christmas campaign for Google Pixel. So Amber and Elbe, today you're going to walk us through all the madness that has incurred this year with all of those. But let's start with this. Of all the deals that you've worked on this year, which one made you think, I can't believe we actually did this. Let's start with you, Alby. Yeah, so probably it might be the IMS and Garfield deal. Quite groundbreaking, as you said. I think it was quite oh my gosh moment for two reasons. 

 One, because, well, from a personal level, I've always loved Garfield. I had so much Garfield merch around the house growing up. So when the deal came through, I was like, oh my gosh, I can't believe it, because I love it. So Much. But then from. From a creative and partnership point of view. I was not worried, but I was very careful of the character and the history and how iconic Garfield is when were working through it. And I think, yeah, it was just incredible that we could make it work with such an iconic and beloved character. And especially given that, you know, it was a campaign about healthy weight and overweight cats. So you want to convey the messaging of the campaign, because that's the whole point. But then you also want to make sure that you're preserving the character and its authenticity. 

 So it was great that we made it work and made everyone happy. Yeah. I mean, for 11 years, I've been doing this, and I've done a lot of spongebob campaigns, but I really, really want to do a Garf. And I'm glad this year were able to do it. I'm very similar to you, Albie. I love Garfield. I grew up reading the Garfield comic strips, and it was just so great to work on it. What about you, Amber? What campaign? I know you've only had a short time with us this year because you were on maternity leave. You came back a few months, but you really hit the ground running. I know there is a big campaign that you worked on in that time. Tell us about that. 

 Yes. So working on Google Pixel's first ever Christmas advert was amazing. And I think for a few reasons. It'S especially amazing that were able to work on it. Firstly, the timings were insane. I think most Christmas campaigns, we normally start development as early as January. This one, we started work on it just maybe two months before or less even around two months before. So to be able to turn something around to that scale in such a short amount of time is amazing. And I think just shows how good we are at our jobs that were able to secure the licensing and work through all the approvals at such speed. And secondly, I think it was a really standout moment to bring back these characters from such a beloved movie. I think people have been wanting to see these characters reunite for ages. 

 And just to do that for Google was amazing. And it was extra special to be on set for the shoot in London, in our hometown, you know, almost just down the road from us. It was great to be able to see it come to life and to be there for the shooting and working with Thomas. He was amazing. And seeing kind of Ogilvy at their best, doing all this amazing work with such little notice was just. Was just so exciting to see. 

 And it only launched a few Days ago. So at date of recording, it's Wednesday, the 26th of November. It only launched a few days ago. The response has been amazing. I've seen that Google has had over a million organic views in the first 24 hours, which is great. And it's. It's funny, Amber, that you talked about the timing. That's the thing that I would talk about most with this as well, because the next thing I want to talk about is another Christmas campaign that we worked on, and that one we had a lot of time to work on. It's just funny to look at both of those different campaigns they launched so close together. One we've been living and breathing all year. Another one just came to us at the last minute. 

 So the one I'm talking about living and breathing all year was BFG and Saints Reads. It was the second time that they've worked with that character, which was great. Lb, can you take us through what the experience has been like this year? Because I know you've been the one sort of championing this. Yes. So, as you said, very different experience from Google Pixel because we've been, I think after the success of last year's campaign in 2024, we started having conversations with the agency, I believe, in January or February. So there was a lot of preparation, a lot of conversations and creative development involved in this campaign. They're very different because, of course, the Sainsbury's one involves custom animation, which is always more challenging and requires much more time than, you know, having real people recreating scenes from a film. 

 We were lucky that we had the animation from last year, so that was great in terms of the bfg. But then New Commercial Arts decided to create a new character in the Greedy Giant, which took a lot of creative development because he. He didn't exist before the campaign. So they created the idea from the book and created their own character. So, yeah, they've been two very different experiences, but both very enjoyable and creatively very rewarding. One of the other campaigns I can call a campaign, but it was really more of a partnership that we worked on was Candy Crush Solitaire and Care Bears. Now, Amber, I know that you came back to just as this was going live, but take us through that a little bit. Tell us about the partnership and how it's being received. 

 Yes. So this is County Crush, first ever license, I believe, which is amazing that were able to work with it. And I think them working with Care Bears is the perfect partnership in terms of the look and the audience. It just fits so well. So Alberto was chaplain in that campaign and managing all the approvals, which was quite a different experience from an advertising campaign just because of gaming. There's so many more elements, so many more kind of individual assets that are needed. But I think it's been received amazingly well and would love them to do another one next year. I think working with Care Bears is. There's so much more potential to kind of build on that because of the different characters and themes. With Care Bears, it's something that could really grow and expand, I think. 

 Definitely. I mentioned spongebob before and we did work on another spongebob campaign, this time with Ghirardelli. So, lb, tell us about that campaign. Yeah, that was a really fun one. That was a clip within a longer edit where they were showing famous pairs and. Yeah, great iconic duos that. To inspire the product that they were launching, which is a chocolate and caramel chocolate from Ghirardelli. That was great. Working with the Paramount team was amazing, as always. So apart from Garfield. Yes, we work with them on the Ghirardelli one and the result was great. The spot was amazing. They. They might expand to other markets and potentially renew for another term, which is great. So it's been great. It's one of those. One of those ads because we see the development right from the start. 

 So you see the script, you see the storyboard, then you see all the edits as it comes together. And I remember watching that every time I was like, oh, I really want one of those. There's this one scene at the end where it's like with. With like, marshmallows and stuff by the fire. I'm like, oh, my God, that looks so delicious. Very dangerous. When you're working on a Ghirardelli ad. You just want to eat chocolate all the time. Elby, tell us about what you did with Invesco and Bob Ross, because I know that was another one that you were managing. Yeah, that was quite unique because I think we've never worked with Bob Ross before, but the agency came to us with a few other ideas actually before that, but then they landed on Bob Ross and we. 

 We worked with the licensors to get the clip and include it within the ad. And it launched in March or April. Can't remember now. There's been too many. And yeah, the. The result was great. So you can see the coach of this basketball team turning on the TV to show the kind of like the rules of the game and a recap. And it's set in the 80s which is quite cool as well. And then they turn on the TV and instead of whatever they needed to show, there's a Bob Ross clip painting with his very soothing voice, which was very fun. And Bob Ross is really having a bit of a moment at the moment. The nostalgia, you know, the awareness of him is really strong. 

 I mean, we've touched on a few campaigns that we worked on this year and we can't cover all of them because, you know, this is. We would be recording forever. But one thing I would like to ask both of you is what do you think we'll see in 2026? Do you think that characters are going to be continued to be used in advertising in the way that we've been seen? Or, you know, do you think that celebrities will be used in advertising a lot again, which we've seen that as well. Let's start with you, Amber. What are your predictions for 2026? 

 I think characters are having a real moment in advertising at the moment. I think there was maybe one or two years where I feel like they weren't being utilized as much as they should have been. But this year I think has been an amazing example of what characters can do in advertising, especially around Christmas. And I expect other brands will be still seeing how well these campaigns of characters have been performing and we'll be wanting to get a piece of that action. So that's my prediction. I feel like it's going to be even more IP licensing next year. 

 I hope so. And what about you, lb? Yeah, I second everything and I think that the great campaigns that we've worked on really demonstrate how strong characters are in advertising. I would love a Super bowl campaign for us because I think we've done so well above and beyond for Christmas. But a Super bowl campaign would be very cool and we would probably start conversate conversations next year. So totally. I mean, super bowl, we have worked on some great super bowl ads and we are working on a few at the moment that hopefully will materialize. So watch the space. Well, Amber and Albie, thanks so much for joining. Well done on an incredible record setting year and let's hope we can go even higher in 2026. Nice. Thank you. Thanks guys. In 2024, we opened Born to License. And fast forward today. 

 The team has signed a raft of licenses across hundreds of properties. We've helped launch products in store and online. We've built a turnkey solution for helping companies tap into the true power of licensing. Alyssa, Jenna, Brynna and Alyssa, you guys have been grinding this year. Let's take a moment to reflect on the wins from 2025 and what's coming in the new year. So let's get straight into wins for this year. I'm going to go through some of the born to license clients that have launched product this year, and I'd love to chat through what made them successful. Let's start with Hippo Blue. They have launched a lot of licenses this year. Toy Story, Star Wars, Alyssa G, let's start with you. Take us through what the year has been for Hippo Blue and how it's all gone. 

 Yeah, I mean, Hippo Blue came out of the gate incredibly strong with their Disney launch. So Back to School, which is their kind of core category, is in January and February in Australia. And so they had easily the biggest Back to School season ever. What they also found was that by having a licensed product that made a drink bottle or a backpack not just a need, but a want, this led to increased business not just during that core back to school period, which is always strong for them. It continued throughout the year. It became not just a back to school moment, or not just a solution, but also something that kids wanted, they desired. And, you know, I think their whole key being personalization and really bringing, I think, an elevated product. 

 With that personalization combined with the licenses that they have, Disney has just been an absolutely unstoppable force. 

 Yeah. And we have some more licensed product in the pipeline. I feel like once we started working with Hippo Blue and the product development side of things, we haven't really stopped. And I'll go to you, Jenna, because there's been a real heavy lift involved with this because it's personalized product. Right. And I would love you, Jenna, to help those listening understand how many submissions are really involved for something like this. 

 Oh, I mean, the first collection in last year, that one was the big one because they went straight, you know, as Liz said, straight out the gate with a. A massive library of the Disney lot. So you're talking hundreds. There's like, I think it was 500 submissions in one go. And that was just for Hippo Blue. So. And obviously it's a different way of working. So it's all personalized. There's different variations of the designs. So it isn't just as straightforward as let's upload a concept. It's all the different variations and it's also explaining how the products work. So it's a new. I think it's new in the industry. I think there's not many people who do that. Obviously, and getting that onto a system which is. 

 Really built for, like, mass retail was something tricky that I had to work with the Disney team to make sure that we got that, you know, submitted properly. But they were great to work with, and we got it done, and now we're continuing with all the new collections. So, yeah, we're like a machine going through a thing. 

 Yes. And staying on product development. Let's have a chat with Alyssa C. About another one of our clients, Keepsake. They launched Invincible Trading Card Collection. Now, that collection, 600 card checklist, over 3,000 unique cards and parallels. How do you guys manage and track such an enormous volume of submissions? 

 That's a good question. So it was a challenge at first, but with every client, we do have, like a PD line plan. That way we're all on the same page, and we had a Keepsake do that for us. That way they could list out all the 600 designs, and we kind of just kept track with them and glanced at the Excel sheet every so often, making sure we're all on the same page. Skybound has been very great since they do email submission. So it's a lot easier than uploading design by design onto a submission system. Luckily. But, yeah, I would just say organization has been really important for Keepsake for us. 

 Yeah, absolutely. Organization. And that's that spreadsheet that you mentioned that you guys treat as a bible. Absolutely. Very important. Staying on Keepsake. Now, I know that they launched at San Diego Comic Con, and it was a huge success. Brynna, is there any. Anything that you would add to that about, you know, their experience, the launch, how it went? 

 I would say this has opened up a whole new realm for Keepsake. Specifically, activating at Cons has really turned their business around. For example, with San Diego Comic Con, when they launched, they sold out. Everything sold out. There was a line around their booth constantly. They had so many fans engaged. All the people who were, you know, walking by could see the work that they put into their booth. It really just elevated their business. And it's really, like I said, opened new doors for them. 

 Yeah. And we're so thrilled to see what. What they do next with that property and beyond. Let's talk about one of our most recent launches, and I'm talking about something that came out last week. Plum Deluxe with Peanuts. This absolutely beautiful product. Alyssa G, back to you. Can you tell us a bit more about the launch? 

 Yeah, I mean, Loose Leaf tea kind of a stayed category. And so they came to us really looking for ways to differentiate and to sort of bring more people into the ritual of tea drinking. And so we took that kind of mission to heart. How do we find IPs that resonate both with their sort of existing fan base, but will help them expand that world? So knowing that were on target for a holiday launch, we found them a partnership with Peanuts. And it has been, I mean, to say it's over delivered is probably still an understatement. They've been absolutely blown away. I know that they're going to sell out before Christmas actually hits, but they're also selling out. 

 I think, you know, the biggest complaint is from their operations guy who has to pick and pack in the warehouse and he is just like, I can't keep up with these orders, guys. What a fantastic problem to have. We have a pretty stacked slate of seasonal launches aligning for Plum Deluxe next year and we can't. We are, I mean, we couldn't be more excited to continue building what I think they've really started to demonstrate to the industry that they're here. They're like real players in this space and I, I too think this will be game changing for their business. 

 And the actual product, like the tins were so beautiful and then they had the accessories. Jenna, can you take us through a little bit about how it sort of like came together and how it went from getting the license to going live with this beautiful product? 

 Yeah. I have to say, they are so passionate about what they do. And, you know, when our clients are, I mean, all our clients are passionate. But I'm English, I love tea, so the fact that I'm passionate about tea, it was just a joy to work with them. And also Andy, who heads up the company, he is obsessed with Snoopy and he. So his childhood dreams kind of came alive there. So we had like little sculpted Snoopy stainless steel engraved teaspoon, like little touches like that add to the collection in this already gorgeous tea with the loose leaves. I mean, it's honestly like for them to do that to there be their first, like, licensing product. I'm, yeah, super excited we're going to do more Peanuts. 

 We've got as Elizabeth got more in the pipe line and yeah, I think they smashed out the park. So I can't wait to work on more products with them. 

 Let's talk about one of our other clients that I'm super excited about at the moment is Wolfpack. This year they launched Popeye, they've launched Danny Phantom, Alyssa C. I know you've been living and breathing Wolfpack. This year and there's probably not a lot that you've been working on that you can actually talk about because there's a lot of things that aren't live yet. But how's the experience been working with Wolfpack specifically on the launches that have already gone live? 

 Yeah, it's definitely been a learning curve. Luckily they've already kind of known the licensing process because they already have the Warner's brothers license. So hope the licensing manager over there, she has been great to communicate with. You know, we've really built like a great rapport. We have weekly meetings just to go over what is in the pipeline. And. We'Ve done two King Features launches so far and one Paramount and they've all done really great. And I see the marketing on their website and I always see them on TikTok on their lives and I can tell that they're just really passionate about the business and passionate about the licenses. And they have about four different designers and each designer has their own interests and their own likes. So they pick the collection that they're like most passionate about and then they work on that collection. 

 You can really tell through their designs. 

 And definitely watch this space. There's some really exciting stuff coming in. Q1 of next year for Wolfpack and beyond. Brynna, back to you. Let's talk about Steven Singer Jewelers. I had the pleasure of seeing them at the Wicked for Good premiere in New York last week. I think it was. That was a lot of fun. So they have launched their second. Partnership with Wicked. Tell us a bit more about that. 

 Yeah. So they launched their second collection which kind of revamps their first collection. Their first collection sold out. It's not coming back, unfortunately. But this collection has taken the new looks for Elphaba and Glinda and reworked them magically to be new collectibles. As far as the marketing is concerned for. Was a lot of advanced prepping. When you have something as big as Wicked, everyone's in on it. Everyone's trying to get that little slice of the pie. So the Steven Singer team really pulled everything together in advance. Launched prior to the debut of the movie and it really came together beautifully. 

 Yeah, it looked really. I mean the packaging was just beautiful. So huge. Kudos to the PD team, Jenna and Alyssa for that as well. So that's some of our clients. We have a lot of clients. A lot of them watch great products. We can't talk about them all today in this short snippet, but I'm sure we'll have the opportunity to talk to Them. Talk about them another time. Alyssa G. I wanted to just talk. Generally, you're constantly having conversations with licensors. On a daily basis, you're pitching to try and secure licenses for our clients. Tell me, what are the key things that you feel like licensors are looking for at the moment when they're considering if they want to license out their property to a new company? 

 Yeah, so I think the hot button seems to be at the moment, differentiation. And that differentiation is kind of being demanded at retail. And so we're finding a lot of this is more of a pull strategy from retail. And so it's, how can we create something that is essentially not just incremental within the category base for the licensor, but also potentially incremental or something special for a retailer to own? And that seems to be really driving a lot of the key conversations that we're having is, you know, we know that retail is demanding something different, something special, something exclusive or ownable for them. And that is really, I think, shifting the business a bit in terms of how the licensors are now approaching who they're partnering with as licensees. We're seeing this, for example, in. 

 We've been approached, actually by a couple of retailers wanting to collaborate with our licensee on something special that they can then have within their stores. So it's almost a complete shift in the approach of what the licensors are essentially looking for. Because, you know, I do think that the tides are shifting. We're really feeling, I think, a groundswell away from how things have been done and into a new way of working. 

 I think, speaking of licensors, one change that I've noticed this year compared to last year is that there's been a real shift of attitude towards us. I think that in the first year of our business with Born to License, it's a pretty unique business model. It's quite new to the industry. And there was, you know, a little bit of uncertainty, perhaps not really understanding how we're working, what we're all about. This year it's changed big time. You know, I don't want to name any names, but some of the biggest license halls in the world have been singing out praises. Why do you guys think that the. That the licensing industry is really starting to warm to our business model? Let's go to Jenna. 

 I think, and this is my. I've said this before. It's a personal observation. I feel like licensing has always been. Has the same blood. The big players, the people who you know, contribute to mass retail. And sometimes it's easier to continue that way of working for licensors because they know that's where their bread is buttered, they're going to get their money. But also it kind of becomes, you know, I've been in the industry for 20 years. Everything's quite, can be quite samey. It's changing now the last couple of years, and I feel like we're kind of injecting a little bit of new blood into the industry. And we've proven that in the last year. The people that we have taken to license stores that, you know, there's proof in the pudding now. 

 So once you get that one success story under your belt for a client and they can, and it's proven it can be done, then it opens doors elsewhere. So I'm excited for all of our clients. They all deserve to have lots of success. And I'm just, yeah, what else can we, who else can we get on board? Who else can we, you know, inject blood into three. Guess what you're about. This is what Bonds and lizards does. 

 Absolutely. Well, let's focus on 2026. And Alyssa, see, I have a question for you. If you were to put a number forward with how many product launches, individual products we're going to release in 2026, what would you say that number is? I'm really putting you on the spot. Just for everybody listening, I didn't, I did not tee up, Alyssa, to answer this question. Okay. 

 If I had to do the math, I would expect there to be. If we're going to have approximately. 70, I would say clients across in 2026, I would expect there to be around 60 collections between all of our clients. Just because it does kind of take a little bit longer to, you know, sign the contract and get concepts approved, pre production approved. So altogether, I would say maybe 60 collections across all of our license. 

 And when they. In each collection, there could be 10, 15, 20, 30, 50. I mean, with something like Keepsake, it's hundreds. So we're talking about thousands and thousands, really, of product that will be going through our product development kind of process in 2020. 

 Oh, I'm sure once you consider Hippo Blue, Keepsake and Wolf Pack, it will be thousands of products. 

 Yeah, there's certainly a lot. And of course, this affects Brynna's. Role as well because she's doing all the marketing. Brynn, tell us a little bit about the marketing process that you're currently working on. 

 So because a lot of our clients are doing this for the first time, even though they may be experts in what they were doing with unlicensed products. Licensing is a whole new ball game where everything needs to go for approval if they're using the ip. So it's been a learning experience for a lot of our clients. My job is kind of to walk them through what to expect and that experience. And sometimes it can be a rough experience and other times, depending on the client, they may be more organized, more structured. It's a lot smoother. So it's been interesting navigating with each of our clients. The process for marketing. Marketing is its own beast in a way, but it's been fun. 

 Very good. Well, I've lost one last question for the team. Let's look at 2026 and let's think about are there any trends that you expect to see in the new year? Whoever wants to jump in, feel free to jump in. 

 I think we're going to continue seeing the impact of theatrical again, mainly at retail, but that will trickle down to all tiers. I think that's been probably the biggest shift. You know, we call it the Barbie effect. Barbie really reset the game around theatrical launches. And you know, I think we all sat five years ago and wondered if theaters were gone for good. And the way that theaters have come out of this fighting and said, hey, no, we're a moment, we're an experience, we're an in person thing that you can look forward to, you can book with your friends. I think has been really like gratifying to watch that. 

 You know, like theaters are back and movies are back and go to the movies is back and then how that's obviously being reflected in kind of pop culture moments that we're able to experience at retail, in malls, that sort of thing. So I think we'll continue to see more and more of that. 

 Awesome. Yeah, I totally agree. Alyssa, anyone else want to chime in with some predictions for next year? 

 I think that like licensor cross collaborations are going to continue to pop off because, yeah, years ago there's no way you'd get, I'm not naming anyone in particular, but you wouldn't get two massive IP owners doing like crossover product crossover promotions. It just, it wouldn't happen unless it was really special. And now that seems to be popping off quite a bit. And I think that's going to lead the way for everyone to, you know, get their bit of the pie there because people love it. Like, you got the nostalgic, you know, thing coming. Well, it's Been around for a few years now, but you know, everyone loves that. So then if you get two nostalgic brands, do a crossover, you've got a hit on your hand, so it's a no brainer. And then that, you know, rolls over into everything else. 

 And to Alyssa's point, with the, you know, with big film franchises, you've got, then that goes into the live event space and then you've got product at the live events. Like it's just a complete rollover. It just, yeah, it's a massive big spew. It's great. We love this. 

 What about you, Bernard? 

 I actually think that animation is going to start trending upwards in 2026 and beyond. Only because you think of what just happened this past year. We had a massive hit with Netflix for K Pop Demon Hunters. And everyone I have met has been singing its songs. Just obsessed with the franchise or hopeful franchise and really wanting to see more of that. And I think with animation there's less restrictions around it. You could be more, it's more of a freeing space to kind of imagine worlds and different things that you can't really do with live action. Or maybe people are tired of seeing cgi. They'd rather have the animated style of, you know, whatever the IP may be. So I think animation is going to be. More prominent. 

 Especially when you think about a few years ago you had, what is it, the spider man into the spider verse. 

 Massive. 

 It was absolutely insane how many people just love the art style, the different ways that different animations came together just in that one movie. And then the second one was just as big of a hit. I think the third one will be a no brainer. It'll be the same thing. And that's also across things like Japanese anime that is also becoming more mainstream in western cultures. So I really think that's going to continue trending upward. 

 Good one. 

 And alyssa C. For 2026, I see a trend of brands collaborating together to create products to really capture the consumer's attention. For example, just this past year we've seen McDonald's collaborate with hello Kitty and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles to create that toy for the Happy Meal. And I know that Care Bears is really open to collaborating with other brands like I know they've done. I think it's Strawberry Shortcake and Care Bears have collaborated together to create like an icing or Claire's collection. And same with Loungefly, Minnie Mouse and Swarovski, the jewelry company. Yeah, they've all come together to create like a limited edition, 300 piece collection. So I think it's going to be a lot more brands collaborating together to kind of create just like that experience for consumers. 

 Yeah, I think you're right. I think we'll see a lot of that. For me, you know, I'm sort of building on Alyssa G's thoughts. You know, E. Com just continues to grow exponentially. There's so many young, amazing companies that are, you know, two or three years in operation and they're doing tens, hundreds of millions of dollars of products. How can retail compete with that? You know, went through Covid where we're basically just getting things delivered to us all the time. And yes, there is an appetite to get out and experience the world. I do feel like shopping has changed forever. And so malls, shopping centers, supermarkets, department stores, they need to really entertain. They need to really provide an amazing experience for people to go. 

 Incentivize them to go in, experience it and buy product in a way that is different to them going on Amazon or going online and just buying something there. So I think that licensing is the way to do that. Licensing is a way to activate and entertain and draw people in. And I do feel like licensing will play a really big role in the future of retail. Well, thanks everyone for jumping on. It's been an amazing year. Thank you for all your hard work. 2026 is going to be unbelievably exciting and I'm so thrilled to have you guys on the team. And yeah, wishing you all happy holidays. 

 Thank you. You too. Looking forward to next video. 

 A quick pause here. If what we're discussing is really resonating with you're going to love what I together in Learn to License. This isn't just another course. It's two decades of real world licensing experience distilled into actionable strategies you can use immediately. I've worked with everyone from startups to Fortune 500 brands and the patterns for success are surprisingly consistent. The course covers all things that you need to consider when it comes to licensing, particularly those who are just starting out. So visit learntolicense.com, your future licensing deals will thank you. All right, back to our conversation. So, Matt and Michelle, you run business development Born to License, which means you're the first conversation companies trying to figure out licensing have. You're seeing all the pain points, the confusion, the opportunities. So let's take a moment to pull back the curtain. 

 Let's start with the inbound interest that we're getting. What types of companies are reaching out to Born to license. Michelle, do you want to share a bit more about the companies that you're speaking to? 

 Yeah, look, it's such a broad range of not only companies in terms of the product they make, but the stage of business that they're at and also particularly where they are. So, I mean, just in the last six months alone, we've spoken to companies across the Middle East, Bulgaria, Central Europe, the uk, Asia, Australia. That's been sort of where I've been focusing my attention. And I mean, we're finding that we're getting everything from inquiries from companies that want to do video gaming to museums, music licensing. You know, sometimes we get gorgeous little local schools and preschools that actually are just even looking for like product and sort of, they're not quite understanding what licensing works and whether or not they need a license for something like that. 

 Everything from like die cast cars, like adult collectibles, kids toys, clothing, a lot of companies, I'm getting quite a few companies throughout Asia as well that are seeing opportunities that are resonating in UK and the European market and they want to replicate it there or vice versa. So you do get a lot of people that are seeing opportunities in other markets, work and think actually that could work for us. So I mean, it is literally, I think in any given day I probably speak to companies that do everything from, you know, collectible items to, you know, online video games to, I don't know, books and museums. Yeah, like, so such a broad range. What, what about you, Matt? Is it different for you? 

 I mean, I really am thinking about this question ahead of time. It's, it's truly what you said. It's so broad to say one specific area. It's really difficult. I tried to consolidate what I could. I said there's a lot of food and beverage snacks, frozen foods, no sugar drinks, and health and wellness companies. I've also seen a lot of, and I don't want to mention their names, but they're industry leaders with strong social media campaigns that one would think you could kind of go out and do your own licensing program on your own, but they really need help. And it's really interesting. Soft goods, home decor, clothing. But then there's just some unique products that really have their own niche areas that just. That are carved out, that you just, they're one of a kind. Interesting. 

 What I'm hearing is like every day is different. You get in on online, you look at your inbox, you don't know what's Coming through, who you're going to talk to, where they're going to be, what you're going to talk about, which I guess is. Is a lot of fun. You just never know what's. What's around the corner. Let's talk about some of the pain points that these companies are coming to you with, Michelle. What, what are the typical challenges that they're facing and why they've come to us in the first place? 

 Like, why are they interested in doing licensing? Like, what problem is that solving for the business? I think. I don't know what you think, Matt, in your market, but I definitely feel like people aren't seeing licensing as solving a problem. They're seeing it more as an expansion opportunity. So, like, we're already doing A, well, why don't we add B. So, you know, I get a lot of skincare and makeup companies that have got great traction at retail or really good online e commerce. And I mean, you know, to glance at their business, you wouldn't necessarily have to go into licensing that they see an opportunity either with a brand that would work either for, you know, a women's nostalgia product or kids or, you know, sort of young adults and teenagers. 

 So I don't know, I feel like a lot of people that come to me are more so looking at expanding their existing business or looking at like financial growth opportunities through licensing as opposed to, you know. Well, I guess that in and of itself is a basic business challenge, isn't it? Is how do we make more money, how do we get bigger, you know, brand exposure? How do we cut through different markets? I think the other thing, I don't know whether people are thinking about this from the outset, but I definitely think where we see success with licensing is that if you have a product that maybe sells well to a certain market, I think licensing adds an emotional connection for customers that you can't shortcut as a business owner. 

 And I think that's one area where you do see people saying, hey, we're doing this well, but if it was had this brand applied, you know, kids or adults or people are going to really connect with the product emotionally a lot quicker and be have a higher propensity to spend money on it. 

 So that's the reason why they're thinking of licensing. Matt, why do you think they're coming to a higher out of all companies, why are they coming to Bourne to license for help? So I, I mean, for me, I really think it's these companies are going out on their own, trying to get involved in the licensing industry and are just facing a lot of different roadblocks. Especially the biggest one, as you can imagine, is just connecting with brands and licenses. Be a cold call or LinkedIn. It's, it's very common. You know, I know from my own past experience, even when you have a proven track record, you might not get to a person you need to speak with. 

 And I think what Born to License really can offer is we have those direct relationships because we either have current clients working with those contacts or we have previous histories in working with them. So I think that's one reason we're connecting with a lot of potential clients. I also find that a lot of the companies really need help on developing overall licensing strategy. They think it's just as easy as like, oh, we want a Peppa Pig license because we do pigs currently on our products and it sells well, but we think Peppa Pig will be even better. And while that probably is true, I wouldn't call that really a licensing strategy. 

 And finally, the biggest thing I think is when it comes to these potential clients, they aren't familiar with the structure of a licensing contract and what it should look like from the ranges of how much is an acceptable royalty, how much is an acceptable minimum guarantee. And what we can do for them is really use our existing. Frameworks for other clients and say, like, hey, you know, this should be 10% royalty, because the last deal we did was 10% and someone from the outside would have no idea what's an acceptable rate or not. So I think those are really key aspects as to why people are coming to Born to License for help. And how do you guys decide? 

 Because I'm mindful that we get hundreds of companies contacting us on a monthly basis that need our help from, you know, somebody who's making Oscar the Grouch cupcakes and wants to sell it at their neighborhood market, all the way up to Fortune 500 companies or those kind of bigger companies that are doing enormous volumes of sales. How, how do you guys decide on what is right for us, where we can help, who's the right fit for us as far as a client go? Michelle. 

 Do you know what? It really varies. I think it's a case by case basis. And I certainly. It's not as simple as a financial decision always. I certainly think there's situations we see companies come to us that maybe they've only been doing business for less than five or 10 years. They might not have, you know, like a huge success track record financially. However, they've got the infrastructure in place. They've got, you know, a exclusive retailer on board. They've got success in a particular niche market. 

 Where all them, I mean, sometimes we have people coming to us where they might be manufacturing, you know, accessories and products for a huge retail chain in Europe and basically the retailer who has, you know, two, three thousand stores or across Europe has gone, we'll go and get us some, you know, Halloween costumes, you know, or something or you know, we want something particularly licensed. Just trying to steer, just trying to steer clear of specific things I'm talking about at the moment. But yes, I mean sometimes comes down to things like that. But I don't personally make my decision based on finances. Obviously the financials need to be there. We are never going to put, and this is what I say to potential licensees as well, Matt. I don't know if you get this. 

 Sometimes people that are brand new to licensing, they'll say, hey, we make. You know, kid toy cars and we really want to do, you know, Disney cars. You know, what happens if we start to take on the license or you know, we want to take on the license but then the product doesn't get approved. Like they don't quite understand. Like we won't put you in front of a license or unless we think you've got what it takes because that's our reputation on the line as well. And also we're not going to waste the licensors time and we're certainly going to not ever going to put people in a position where they're not up for success. And I think that's what I try and work out when I'm having my initial conversation is how committed are you to this? 

 Do you have infrastructure in place that if this opportunity comes about that you can actually execute it and how can we support you? So. So yeah, it's not just a straight numbers game for me. I don't know Matt, I think sometimes you have, you might have slightly different criteria that you look at for your market. 

 Yeah, I mean for me, for North America and just again, being familiar with the, you know, the US market from a licensing standpoint. You know, what I've really been doing for the most part is not judging anyone, like not judging a book by its cover. Because I would say a lot of times, like maybe even half of the opportunities I might have like a gut feeling that might not work out but also have that initial conversations because I look at them as the experts in what they're doing and they should be able to get me excited and intrigued if this is really a good opportunity. So I will usually have my calls with just about everyone that's on my schedule. 

 And you know, a lot of the times it is for me, I look at it from a financial standpoint and the fact that if someone tells me they can only do $50,000 in sales for a brand. You know, it's a quick conversation to be like, listen, most license stores are not going to be interested in this opportunity. You know, when your company is matured or something changes, please feel free to reach back out to me. But I'm not going to waste anyone's time in saying that we can get a license for them and dragging out the process and collecting fees when we know it's not going to work out. So, you know, I think that's what's nice about, you know, Born to license is it's more of a quality aspect and not a quantity. 

 Yeah, we're really looking for larger opportunities, long term success versus, you know, we're not just in it for some upfront money and you know, collecting fees and things like that. That's just not the mo. I think that's really great that you said that, Matt, because when we're looking at opportunities that are coming in and clients that want to work with us, we want to build long term success with our clients and you know, we want to be helping them build their licensing business and achieve that growth within their company for years to come. So you know, we would like to be working with our clients in three years, five years, even 10 years time. You know, we want to have that long term kind of partnership with them. 

 And that's, you know, every time we're assessing whether we want to sign on to a client on with a client, we're thinking, is this just something that we can do that they want to do quickly in and out licensing? And if that's the case, we probably, you know, wouldn't want to work with that particular client. 

 Yeah, I feel like we've all been around in licensing long enough to really know that the successful licensing arrangements are ones that are strategic and long term and not the quick wins and not the, as you say, Matt, you know, we're making pork products. Let's make a Peppa Pig. Like sometimes the most obvious branding solution is actually not the most sustainable business, you know, strategy. So I think you don't know until you get in the weeds with people. Like, I mean, I had a licensee recently who on Paper, if I just looked at their business would have thought what do they want to do with licensing? 

 But it was actually the commitment they brought to the table and they were actually one of the examples where they tried for six years to knock on the right door of a particular license or for something they wanted to do. And it wasn't until they came to us, I think it was within a week. Dave, I think you had the meeting set up with the exact right person. But they put, the licensee, had put in so much work and thought to what they want to do that we knew from the get go. These guys, even though they've not done licensing, they know the kind of work and thinking that it's going to take to actually make this a success. So that sort of thing, you're sort of looking for the back sort of stuff as well, I think. 

 So before we wrap up, I'd love each of you to give me one piece of advice that you would give for someone thinking about reaching out to or start licensing in 2026, whether it's working with us or working direct with licensors or with another licensing agency. Michelle, what would be your number one piece of advice for next year? 

 I think. Oh, what would be my number one piece of advice? I think just honestly it would be like getting in the weeds and doing the research and whether that's something we work with the licensee on or not. Like not just having a limited like one dimensional approach to something and just going, oh there's a new Spider man movie coming, we make socks, let's make Spider man socks. Like I think it's more about actually where's the long term growth and opportunity. Like and just doing a bit of research or having experts do that research for you and just being in the weeds a bit more with the properties and the licenses and their broader business strategy and yeah, not looking at quick wins, just going in the weeds a bit more, I guess. 

 What would you say, Matt? I mean first and foremost I would hope that the potential client has already done some research into the licensing industry and what it might take, but reaching out to us anyway and having that initial call, we can really help. Like I've noticed it answers a lot of questions for those potential clients and they're kind of then like motivated to try to again do it on their own. But I believe they're going to fall into or just find these pain points or failures or roadblocks where using an agency like Born to License to help to me is a no brainer from this fact of like, to run a licensing department, you really need one to two people at a minimum. 

 And that can be upwards to $150,000 a year versus we're offering almost a solution for like 10% of that along with expertise and results that you're going to get. So I think it really comes down to if this is something that you're truly motivated and you believe in, you know what, licensing can do that using an agency is really the best way to get started. Not to say you can't do it on your own. It's just I think a longer, more expensive process. Yeah, I think that's great advice. I mean my advice would be my single piece of advice for anyone considering licensing in 2026 would be to simply do it. Licensing rocks. We've had so many clients that are just having such wonderful success, but for now we'll wrap it up. 

 Michelle, Matt, I'm so excited to see what exciting new clients you're going to bring to the portfolio in 2026. And, and thanks so much for the chat. 

 Thanks guys. Lovely to speak. 

 Yeah, thank you. Here's what most licensing agencies don't do. Create a podcast, launch a vlog, build an education platform and give away insights for free. But that's exactly what we've done this year because we believe if we make the licensing industry more accessible, we all win. Juliana, Eduardo, Vinnie, you've been helping me build the media and education side of Born. So let's talk about what we've created. I want to start with the Born to License podcast. That's what everybody's listening to right now. We've now released over 20 episodes. Eduardo, you've been responsible for turning the recordings into clean episodes as well as creating compelling trailers. Can you share a bit more about the process? How do you turn a 50 minute podcast recording into a really compelling 60 second trailer? Well, this process is amazing actually. 

 The process is really about finding the emotion core of each conversation. I try to approach it like I'm creating a movie trailer, you know, so you need the tension revelation and the part powerful hook with seconds. My process starts with watching the full interview and identify what I call golden moments where there's some great hooks. Those three five seconds where the guest drops the an inducer secrets shares a surprise insight or reveal something that's really great. 

 Great. 

 This become my anchor point. So yeah, then I use the rose questions as a narrative. They create natural suspense moments instead of just showing answers. And the other style I try to. It's cinematic, kind of cinematic. Like I guess Stephen Bartling do that. So I charge approach that way. Yeah. And that's it. I do remember the brief I gave you when you started was I chose the Steven Bartlett Diver CEO trailers, which really rely on kind of really dramatic music and also having a lot of hooks and moments in there. So people watch or listen to the trailer and it really makes them want to watch the whole theme because they want to know answers to the questions I've been asking. Is there a favorite episode that you've had from this year? 

 I guess my favorite one is with. 

 Hasbro and I. I have more, actually. It's with Hasbro, Funko and with Cheryl. 

 He talk about. 

 Yeah, she talks about AI and this kind of stuff. It's really cool. If you didn't watch it yet. My devices write that. Yeah, all of those were great. Hasbro, Funko, Sharon Wiseman. The Future of Licensing was a really popular episode as well. Let's talk a bit about the Born in Action vlog, which is very new to us. Eduardo, you've been doing a lot of the filming for this. How has that experience been to basically follow me around with a camera? Well, I would say following you, if a camera has been an incredible master class in authentic content creation, you know what it fascinates capturing those unscripted moments where real business happens, where the real David happens behind the scenes. And it's not about just the business, but it's about your life. 

 So in the last months, I guess I've learned a lot about the industry, but I've learned a lot about David as well, you know. So, yeah, this is. This experience has taught me to like anticipate moments before they happen. I learned to read the energy in a room, position myself for the best angles without disrupting the flow. 

 And I guess what's been most rewarding. 

 It seems how the behind the scenes footage demystifies the license industry. 

 So, yeah, that's it. 

 Yeah. It's been a lot of fun having you follow me around with the camera, looking for the best moments, the best angles. Vinnie, you had this same experience a few weeks ago. We were in London. We're in New York. How did you find it? It's okay. I mean, obviously it's not always born for. I would prefer to be in front of the cameras. But what is the most challenging part for me is that you have to keep really. I'm missing one eye. I should have a third eye because I need to have one eye on the camera screen. Or on the phone screen, one eye in front so I don't bump into people and stuff like that. And I can follow David and one eye on the floor so I don't trip over anything. So I feel like, you know, it's. That's the trickiness. 

 So, you know, do you know to bump into a post, a lamp post that would be iconic, probably, or step on dog or anything like that. And in places like Times Square and. And even central London, it's a lot of people and you're navigating all those people and you don't want to get people's faces too close to the camera because you always want David to be, you know, in focus. But that was hard. And the cold, you know, my freezing fingertips, you know, at times I thought I'd clicked to record, but it didn't. And it was not because it didn't click because my finger was so cold that it didn't register on the. On the iPhone screen. You know, it didn't feel like it was a human finger because it was, you know, below human temperature. But I was always clicking. 

 I know wintertime in New York and London is, you know, very hard to get warm fingers for filming. But Vinny, you are at with me at Big Ben at Tower Bridge. You were there in New York at Times Square, Brooklyn Bridge. So you were there for some big moments, which was great. Let's switch gears to learn 2 license, which is our education platform. Juliana, you've really been championing this, from finding the brilliant studio to hiring an amazing film and editing crew. Can you talk a little bit more around the vision for Learn to License and why we created it? 

 Yeah, actually Dave had this vision in May this year. So everything happened really fast and we started to look for people to shoot and start writing what David supposed to say there. And it happened very fast. At the day that we recorded, David was super professional. It was very easy to work with him. He just has this ability to talk in front of the camera, which is amazing. And we have everything ready it by what, five months. So it was super fast and really amazing. 

 It was. It was really fast and well done for all the work that you did. It was a really, I mean, we used like masterclass as a sort of North Star, and I feel like we hit the quality of that and it's been really well received, which is good. Juliana, while I have you, let's talk generally about your role as my executive assistant. You are the superstar that makes sure my emails and schedule stays under control. Amongst many Many other things. What's it like being my ea? I'm curious. 

 Fast paced. I have to be very fast. It's challenging. You are always ahead of everything. So I have to be like that. But at the same time I feel that is really rewarding and you're always like, give me responsibilities and things that I didn't think I was, you know, I could do. But you make me just go there and do everything that I couldn't imagine. So it's really amazing. I love working with you. You are so nice and it's been an awesome year working with you. It's amazing. 

 Well, this has been my first year with an executive assistant. I'll tell you. It's been a complete game changer for me because you sort of making sure that I'm organized and handling emails and just organizing my life really does mean that I can focus on those big picture things that every business owner needs to focus on in order to achieve the exponential growth that we really need to achieve. Vinny, Amy, let's jump back to you. You're a bit of an all rounder for the business, including being my husband. Can you share with the listeners what is it like being married to David Bourne? It's intense, but loving. 

 Well, I have to go back to Juliana and say that I also have a lot to thank Juliana for because I think if Juliana wasn't around, my life would be much harder because, you know, I find that, you know, David has been somewhat more stressed than usual this year. But I think it's because of all the new ventures and projects that we embarked on and if Juliana wasn't around, I don't know if either of us would have been able to cope. You know, that would have been serious friction. So, you know, thank you for that too. But being married to David, you know, let's cite the emotion and you know, the feelings. You know, you're married to someone that has. Extreme focus on things, that is determined and perseverant. 

 So when David wants to do something, he's gonna do something, you know, and you either help him or you just get out of his way so he can do what he wants to do. But obviously I'm always willing to help and I admire David's ability to be. 

 So. 

 Ambitious and entrepreneur on everything he wants to achieve. And that's why I married him, because I don't have that. Well, I think we make a really great team. And you know, I think that there's a bit of a groundswell at the moment from entrepreneurs on LinkedIn and on podcasts and general business publications, talking about how important it is to find the right partner and getting that support in the household. To run the business is extremely important. I actually posted about that on LinkedIn today. A beautiful photo of you and me, Vinny, and talking about the contribution that you make. Even though I get all the credit that you're certainly doing 50% of the work by just making sure that I can continue to be the very best that I can be. And it's had a lot of feedback on LinkedIn, which is really good. 

 We have a new role going on at the moment which is being advertised right now, which is the role of licensing assistant. Eduardo, you've only been with us for a few months. I think it's three months tomorrow. For someone who's thinking about applying to work at Born, can you share a little bit about what your experience has been like? 

 Well, these past few moments have been incredible. 

 I'd say, like, I'm loving all this. What struck me was that this isn't just a job. 

 I'm not just executing tasks, but I'm learning. 

 And what's been most valuable is the. Is the mentorship as bad. I'm not just like observing the business. I'm actually involving the search engine discussions, understand why certain decisions are made, learn how to spot opportunities, and that develops my skill as well. So I would say for anyone considering applying for this, my advice is just dive in, come ready to learn. Yeah, I think that's really good advice. And I can't believe it's only been 90 days. Yeah, we've done achieved so much with the podcast with Born in Action, with, you know, all the great work you've been doing on our socials and everything. So, you know, I'm really excited about where we can take this. Guys, before we wrap up, I just want to say a big thank you. 

 Your support has really allowed me to be the best I can be this year and we've had a lot going on, but it's probably been, well, it has certainly been the best year that the business has ever had. You guys helped me juggle all the demands with running a global licensing agency. So, yes, I wanted to again say a big thank you for everything. Wishing you wonderful holiday break and looking forward to more greatness and more growth in 2026. Yeah, thanks for having me. Thank you for being a great boss. 

 Thank you. 

 Before we wrap up this end of year episode, I want to introduce you to someone really special and share some exciting news about 2026, I'm about to start an exciting new venture with my sister Emma, who has spent decades specializing in the area of advertising and marketing law. She's bringing that to expertise to our new business area, Born Legal. If you've ever wondered how a cereal box ends up with Win a trip to Disney World on it, or why promotional legal copy is always in tiny font, Emma is the expert to tell us about that. Emma, first things first, tell us a bit more about you and your background. 

 Hi David, thanks very much for having me on the podcast. So I'm an advertising and marketing law specialist. I've been practicing in the area for a really long time, probably over 20 years, and specialising in trade promotions, competitions, promotional offers and general advertising and marketing law around FMCG and a few other areas. 

 So Born Legal is launching in 2026, which is very exciting. Walk us through what services we'll be offering. 

 Yeah, sure. So we'll be working that advertising and marketing space, focusing on whatever needs to be reviewed, whether it be TVC's, radio scripts, out of home print material. We'll have a strong focus on trade promotions. So competitions, promotional offers, you know, you buy one, get one free, limited offers, discount offers, games of skill, games of chance, anything that you can think of to sell your product, we can be there and advise you along the way. 

 So one of the things you mentioned was trade promotions. Let's dive into that a little bit more because there is a bit of a crossover, can be a crossover with what we do in the licensing space as well. Let me give you a bit of a scenario. So I'm walking down a supermarket aisle and I see a Bluey yogurt with Win a Trip to Bluey's World on the pack. That sounds simple, but from a legal point of view, walk us through what has happened between the brand having that idea and that yoghurt actually being on shelf. 

 Yeah, sure. So, I mean, the legal side of things is pretty important to get organized early on, particularly on packed promotions. We know there's really long lead times when it comes to getting those, whatever permits you may need and getting that final printed copy. So essentially the early stages involves briefing in the job to your legal counsel, really getting the mechanics sorted, the prize details finalized. There's usually a lot of the bigger promotion, the more stakeholders there are involved. So you might have quite a few people that need to review the terms and conditions to make sure that their side of the activities is covered and the promotional mechanic reflects what everyone understands to be going on. Same with the price. So that can take quite a few weeks to get sorted, going back and forth between these parties. 

 As I said, once the terms and conditions get to a stage that they're finalised, you may need to apply for permits, depending on the regime you're working under, which can take a few weeks as well. And in amongst all of that, it's really important also to have your advertising material reviewed. There's no point having a really robust, well set out set of terms and conditions if your advertising material is going to be misleading. That's particularly important when it comes to on pack promotions, because obviously if there's a blunder on the pack, that's a very expensive mistake to rectify. So early days, get that promotional material in for review, making sure that it's compliant, making sure it clearly reflects the promotional mechanic, clearly reflects the prize and keeping consumers happy. 

 What can some of the consequences be if somebody doesn't get this right from a legal point of view? 

 Sure. So, I mean, there's various consequences. I mean, there's not only reputational damage for the company at stake. We know that consumers can often get onto social media and have a bit of a rant about a promotion. There's also financial penalties for misleading and deceptive conduct and that sort of thing. So I think, in my experience, though, the bigger problem can be that reputational damage, what a brand essentially trust to do when they run a promotional activity, is garner goodwill from their customers. You might be trying to promote brand switching, so you're trying to really get consumers attention when they're at the supermarket and you spend a lot of money on the prize and all that sort of stuff. So if you get to a point where the promotion blows up, something goes wrong. 

 You've not only lost all the money that you've spent on your prizes and getting the promotion off the ground, but also that really reputational damage that can really impact a brand. Particularly, as I said on social media, consumers do like to jump on and have a bit of a whinge when they feel that they've been hardly done by when it comes to these sorts of things. 

 I have a lot more questions, but I think what we'll need to do is have a standalone Born to License episode about this in 2026, because I feel like we're just scratching the surface of this really interesting area. But I do have one last question for you now, EMMA. Looking ahead 2026, what trends are you seeing in the area of law and in marketing and advertising law? 

 Yeah, sure. Well, Trade promotions in particular, we know from years of study that the promotions that do well are the ones with high frequency, lower value prizes. So rather than having one big prize, consumers feel that their chance to win is much higher and then you get better engagement with your customers if there's lots and lots of prizes on offer. So with brands sort of understanding and having that knowledge, what we're seeing now is that you'll get sort of almost like a two tier prize system. So you'll have a high frequency prize which is often an instant win prize and then you'll get, everybody goes into a draw to win a bigger prize which could be, it could be cash, it could be a holiday, it could be a car prize. 

 So that's what we're seeing big brands doing more often and seeing a lot of big on pack promotions. So big long lead times coming out into market because essentially you know, you're really trying to grab consumers attention and that's what you can do by having that promotional activity on pack in store. 

 I always talk about the attention, the window you have to grab someone's attention in the supermarket. It's like a matter of seconds, isn't it? And I always talk about that from a licensing point of view and you can talk about it from, you know, a trade promotion point of view is that you have such a limited amount of time to capture the shopper's attention, don't you? 

 Yeah, absolutely. I mean we've got, we're super busy, we've got really busy lives at the moment. And the other thing I know about promotional mechanics is that it can't be too complicated. If you get a consumer picking up a packet and they don't really understand what they need to do to enter in a matter of seconds or they don't understand how they win the prize really quickly, you're going to lose them. As I said, we're flat out people at the moment. So particularly around Christmas everyone's got lots of things to do. So it's really important to do what you need to do to grab consumers attention. You know, if they've got a product that's got a promotion, a product that doesn't have a promotion, you just want them grabbing your product and moving on to the next thing. 

 Well, I have a lot of questions to ask as I said before, but let's put a pin in it for now. Let's go and have a wonderful holiday break. A happy new year in 2026. Let's have you back on for a full episode because I feel like there's a lot more to cover. But thanks Emma so much for joining us on the Born to License podcast. 

 No worries. Thanks very much. Look forward to it. 

 And say hi to Mum for me. Me. All right, thanks, Emma. So there you go. That is a wrap for the Born to license podcast for 2025. I want to say thank you so much to everybody who's been listening. I hope you've found it valuable, entertaining. I hope you've learned a lot more about licensing. There is a lot more to come in 2026, so stay tuned. In the meantime, happy holidays, have a wonderful new year, stay safe and speak to you in 2026. I hope you've enjoyed this episode of the Born to License podcast. Don't forget to like and subscribe. And if you're eager to learn more about licensing, I encourage you. Take a look at my course, Learn to License. I've condensed almost 20 years of learning in my licensing career to help others understand how licensing works. 

 And as a reward for sticking around, here is a discount code for you to put in. That code is born to license 25. I hope to see you there.