Subtle Shifts in Healing from Vaginal and Rectal Prolapse

Colleen Avis is an award-winning author and life coach helping others unlock their potential and create sacred spaces where authenticity, confidence, and joy thrive. With over a decade of expertise and a deeply personal healing journey, she empowers clients to connect with their emotions, navigate life’s transitions, and embrace lasting change.

Colleen shares her experience healing from vaginal and rectal prolapse, hysterectomy, and navigation of a pessary. She highlights the power of co-creating with providers and ways to heal through holistic modalities. 

Transcript

Colleen Avis 0:00  

I was in so much discomfort and so pain, and I had so little idea of what to do. And I went to see a lactation specialist, and they were like, because your husband's English, your son has a higher than normal bridge in his mouth, and so when he latches on, it's just gonna hurt, suck it up. I just didn't I didn't have knowledge, so my body was really just like, revolting.

Speaker 2  0:22  

I welcome to perinatal and reproductive perspectives. This is a podcast where we empower birthing individuals, partners and health professionals with evidence based insights, holistic strategies and relatable stories, hosted by a healthcare expert. This podcast fosters understanding equity and growth in perinatal and reproductive health. Here's your host, Becky Morrison gleed,

Rebecca Gleed  0:55  

hello, everyone. Welcome to the perinatal and reproductive perspectives. I jumped out of bed this morning because I remembered that I got to interview Colleen Avis, a dear friend, award winning author and life coach. Welcome Colleen.

Unknown Speaker  1:13  

Hi. I jumped out of bed excited.

Rebecca Gleed  1:17  

So excited for this episode. Tell us a little bit about yourself, and also tell our listeners a little bit more about what it means to be a life coach for you specifically.

Colleen Avis   1:30  

Okay, I'm going to take the questions in the reverse order, because the ladder is much more fun and interesting. I think the ladder of who of of the people and who I am in my life. I think the my role as a life coach, I really define myself as a transformational life coach, an integrative life coach, ayurvedically trained and studied spirituality as well as coaching and mindfulness and meditation through the Chopra center, currently through the Institute of Integrative Nutrition. And I'm a yoga certified, and it sounds like, Okay, you're in the mind, you're in the body, you're in the where are you, right? And really, for me, it's that idea of us being whole people. And so everyone that comes to to co create with me and allows me to be part of a guided a guided journey, and an advocate for their personal growth and healing. They're a bio individual, right? So for me to have you know, a different list of things that I've studied and experimented with myself allows me to support guide co create an unlocking, if you will, of my clients, they're doing the unlocking. I'm not unlocking for them, but the curiosity in which we can lead and bring some of those resources allows them to kind of lean into their own innate intelligence and harness their own unique resources and embrace the limit limitlessness of which they are. So it's important to me that we are collaborating in a way that allows clients and those that I get to work with to create their own unique, sacred space, you know, where confidence blooms and joy takes root and they live full lives. So that's how I like to think about fostering transformation within my client coach relationship. I am a 53 year old woman who has been happily married for 20 years, at least, most of the years, and I have an 18 year old son, and all these pieces of the puzzle that I was explaining about coaching are a direct result of my own journeys, my own falling down, my own fear of abandonment, my own body dysmorphia, anorexia, bulimia, promiscuousness to a level that was too much. You know, all those journeys of my own life are, are how I integrate with my clients. And so when people ask me, you know, what's your life coaching business and who you? Who are you? It's, it's almost hard to unbundle them, you know, because it's like, oh, purpose, resilience, boundless prosperity. Yes, me and them, please, right? So yes.

Rebecca Gleed  4:13  

And I think this will resonate with listeners, this humanness that you bring. I pulled out as you were talking wholeness, co creation, joy, fostering transformation, these beautiful words and to bring that into a space of healing and transformation, incredible. I also want to point back to this award winning book because you have another one volume three, which is a book of a series, and it's called sacred spaces. I'd love to hear more about it. But just to mention, Volume One was deemed a Book of Peace, if I got that right, and it was. Also in the gift bag of the Oscars. So tell us a little bit more about this book I'm so excited to to share with folks, and please grab your copy on February 18.

Colleen Avis   5:12  

Well, let's not let Becky be too humble. She's in the volume three. I'm so excited. All boats rise, baby, yes, yes. If you're if you are an individual listening, join in the energy here, because all boats rise in this conversation. Yeah, so sacred spaces is sacred spaces, subtle shifts for Mind, body, home, transformation, subtle shifts create our greatest impacts. I didn't say they're easy, but in the mind, the body and the home, we have an opportunity to really just make basic changes and shifts that are transformational. And I think that's important, that we're not boiling the ocean, boiling the ocean, and being in the Oscar gift bags doesn't necessarily sound like they go hand in hand. That was a really interesting opportunity. One of the authors, Pamela bellato, is just an amazing human being. Was an author in the first book, and she had some connections that helped us get recognized at that level, the International Book for Peace Award is really an honor to be recognized as a book for peace, when really what we're trying to create with these books are 25 individual authors that come to each book. They write a chapter about their life. I ask them to stand naked on the edge of the world and authentically tell a story about themselves, and then at the end of the chapter, ask them to share a practice or a tool or a subtle shift or something that's happened in their lives to help them either Empower or overcome or shift from said story. And so it really is about cultivating community and kindness and peace and yeah, so to get that level of recognition was really quite an honor. And you know, we're just going to keep writing the books until there's no more stories to tell. Yes,

Rebecca Gleed  6:53  

but what a wonderful platform to get these stories heard. I've, you know, mingled with some of the folks in volume three, and it is an incredible group of people, and I hope these stories and tools are going to change lives. And like you said, the subtle shifts make big impacts. So today I want to introduce Colleen in a different way, in terms of sharing her own reproductive, perinatal journey, because you have quite a story to share. And I think our listeners, you know, not just birthing individuals, but also the professionals, will really benefit from hearing your story. So I want to open it up and start by asking you to share your perinatal journey starting at fertility, yeah.

Colleen Avis   7:43  

So I was very fortunate with getting pregnant. My husband and I getting pregnant. Actually, the funny story was, is I like, well, I want to have a baby that's born in May, because it's a perfect time of year. So we're going to calculate back and well, you know, you can do the math. I'm 53 I have an 18 year old. It wasn't like I was a child or a very, very young adult at the time, but even in my early 30s, I didn't really have a lot of education from my mom or my grandparents or anyone around me about how this kind of works, so I just assumed I spent the majority of my life trying not to get pregnant. Now I'm really interested in getting pregnant. It's like, oh, well, you just do this and, you know, you pull the goalie and you have a baby, right? Like, no. So as a common

Unknown Speaker  8:21  

way of thinking,

Colleen Avis   8:24  

Yeah, I was very common in that, for sure, fortunately, it was a three month journey. I mean, we were very, very fortunate. And I recognize that fortunateness, you know, as as an older, more mature woman now, and having heard so many stories and friends of mine and so forth. So we had a baby. We had a beautiful baby boy on june 30, 2006

Rebecca Gleed  8:45  

and that's my daughter's birthday too. Yeah, it is yes, yeah, Ginny, know that

Colleen Avis   8:51  

I knew we were so connected in another way, June babies, that was perfect. So it was a 23 hour and 50 minute delivery. And I also, as much as I didn't know how it worked to get pregnant, that you didn't just decide to do that on Tuesday, and it happened, I also didn't have a lot of education about birth. Again, you know, living in a relatively affluent area, an educated person, not a lot of education, not a lot of anything passed down as far as wisdom. And I think that's we can do better. Yeah, we can do better. We can do better. And if I had a daughter, I would do it different, you know, do it differently, I think. And so, long story short, I had fourth degree tearing, and very quickly thereafter, unbeknownst to me, had four three prolapse, so I was 37 years old. That's not true. I was 35 years old. 37 years old is when I actually realized that something was wrong. I spent two years running and exercising with one fist whole. My vaginal wall inside. I didn't realize that was what I was doing, but my body was hurting and had prolapse so severely that, like, I didn't even realize that, you know, peeing my pants when I was picking up my son and stuff. I knew it wasn't, shouldn't be happening, but I just figured time would heal that. I just figured, oh, there's something, yeah, it's kind

Rebecca Gleed  10:18  

of go away. Can we tell listeners, what is fourth degree tear and what is prolapse? Okay,

Colleen Avis   10:25  

so fourth degree tear is basically tear. So what do they call it? In the medical world, they call it a vaginal cesarean. So basically, the doctors that I had were a little more natural than I I didn't actually, I didn't realize that people that delivered babies were different. I didn't realize you could have a doctor that was a little was a little more natural, a little more aggressive. I really had, like, no idea. So I loved these women and trusted these women, and they were, they're wonderful doctors. I didn't choose right for myself because I didn't know I had a choice so many

Rebecca Gleed  10:59  

this will resonate with so many you have a right to choose and to match your provider with your unique needs, your temperament, your your mental wellness, your physical wellness, and I love this point of take the time to think about what you need and match that with how the provider practices their philosophies. What an excellent point to accentuate. You know,

Colleen Avis   11:26  

when you're saying that, it makes me realize that it was actually deeper for me and this, this would have been so great to have, from a medical practitioner standpoint, for them to have asked me holistically as a whole person, meaning like, yes, do you understand what happens at childbirth? I know it sounds so silly, but it doesn't. I didn't know I had a choice, like I was an adult. I am a very successful business person. I understood free free will, kind of and so I just was like, wow, how lucky am I? I have great health insurance. I've got great doctors. These doctors believe that you don't go to cesarean unless you hit 24 hours. And so even though I was only eight centimeters dilated, they I had said I wanted to have a natural birth, which I did, but it was based on a limited amount of knowledge that I had, that I had read that said you want to pass all these bacteria onto the baby, and if you have a cesarean, it won't be as healthy the stress that I induced on my child during birth and myself clearly fourth grade tearing, which is tearing from front to back. Listen, I have a very healthy, functioning child, and I am grateful the experience could have been a little different, and I think as a result of what happened, and I'll come back to the prolapse definition in my words anyway, it's rudimentary, but was, I didn't have a really great experience with nursing. And even though Finn and I had a really intimate bond, and I loved him, and we held him in all the things, I was in so much discomfort and so pain, and I had so little idea of what to do. And I went to see a lactation specialist, and they were like, because your husband's English, your son has a higher than normal bridge in his mouth, and so when he latches on, it's just gonna hurt, suck it up. I just didn't, I didn't have knowledge. So my body was really just, like, revolting. Of course, prolapse, as I understand it is in my experience. You know, there's first degree, second degree, second degree, third degree and fourth degree. And those are fourth degree is the, the most advanced, I suppose, prolapse. And it's the degree, the level, the measurement in which a muscle, muscle is failing, and and in relationship to vaginal and I'm sorry to all the doctors listening, and I'm right, yeah, but in a level of prolapse, vaginal prolapse, it's the vaginas distance of pro of failure, of muscular failure, and it starts to fall through the vaginal cavity. So when I finally went to go at fourth degree for me, when I went to later, this is two years later, right? So for two years, I ran around with my fist, as many of us do, right? You know, I was triathloning, I was running, I was jumping on trampolines with literally, my hand holding. I was like a six year old boy, like, holding myself all the time. Yeah. So for any of you that are, I guess, hearing this and listening to this, I just want you to know, like, I'm even having a moment right now of self reflection that's like, don't judge yourself. Colleen, you know, I did the best with what I had, and yet I sometimes when I tell this story, I find myself judging myself. I'm like, Why did you allow that to happen? But it did, and the resilience that come from it, you know, propels you forward. And I hope that that is true for everyone that's experienced anything like this, because it can be, it can create a sense of like disconnection with your own body. And you know, lots of different things can happen. So fast forward two years, and I went in to see a amazing Ural gynecological surgeon. Her name is Dr Maria cantor. I cannot thank her enough. She's still in my life and helps me with. The bladder prolapse because I also had rectal prolapse as a result of vaginal prolapse. Yeah, very cool, yeah, which is a really fun time.

Rebecca Gleed  15:10  

So do you mind sharing a few like moments? What? And to back up, and then we'll jump back into it. Yeah. I see Colleen. I see women birthing individuals 710, years after the fact. You know you're talking about catching it two years after. But oftentimes we reflect back, oftentimes because we've had multiple children or women's busy lives, or we're coming out of a fog of sleep deprivation, yeah, sometimes it is a decade before we look back and start therapy or get the medical treatment and say what just happened? And I'm just now figuring out, Oh, I've been wetting myself for years. Let's do something about this. Yeah, and I hear these stories of I pooped my pants and, oh yeah. How do I begin to process this? Yeah, no, or these embarrassing moments where the shame wrapped up in it. And I love that we are going here today, because you're not alone, and so many other individuals, if I can just, you know, sound the alarm bells. You're not alone, and it's okay to get help. Talk about it. We're here. Yeah,

Colleen Avis   16:27  

and I am not a medical professional, as maybe understood by my lack of medical definitions and my explanations, but to anyone that feels alone or wants to have a conversation as a friend a virtual coffee reach out to Becky. Reach out to me. I mean, this is how we heal. We heal through storytelling and understanding and learning and just being vulnerable with each other. So, yeah, it's really a beautiful reflection. And I think really important point Becky and I it makes me reflect on my own situation, and I'm grateful it was two years right which we actively chose not to have a second child. We were never told that we couldn't. It just our lives felt complete with with where we were. And I mentioned that because you're making me think like, oh yeah, people that maybe had prolapse and then have a baby, and then go through that again and again. I mean, just the compounding of, I mean, I was so naive Becky that I went to see Dr Maria cantor. And I'm sure there's many amazing doctors in this space. She just happened to be in the she's she's in Reston. She was close to me. We're in the Washington, DC area. And I walked in and I said, nobody can tell me what to do about this. So I clearly have some sort of mass in my vagina. Could you just remove it so everything springs back up those literally, my words at 37 years old, and she's like, well, you don't have a mass. Like a mass was going to be better than prolapse, in my mind, she don't have a mass. But you, you know, you have some options. You have some some options. I think this is why I love her so much. As a surgeon, she was offering non surgical options. So I spent a year going to have vaginal physical therapy, prolapse physical therapy, which wasn't really going to be a great option for me with the level of prolapse that I had. I think if I knew what I know now about Ayurveda and some holisticness. And this was year, this is, you know, 16 years ago. Now, even the science has evolved. I might have tried a few other things, but my lifestyle was so cramped. I was in so much discomfort and pain that she offered me two things. One, a pessary, which is a device that can be inserted vaginally. Kind of looks like a donut. There's huge of sizes. You know, some are the size of a cantaloupe, some are the size of a golf ball, and they're basically hard rings, but malleable that can be squeezed and inserted into the vaginal cavity that kind of spring open and hold the walls

Rebecca Gleed  18:54  

up. Now, listeners one more time, what that's called a pro

Colleen Avis   18:58  

a pessary. Pessary. Pessary, yeah. And you know, a lot of this, think about this, right? Depending on where you are in your relationships, like I was in a marriage, and so you're like, Oh my God, how not how not sexy is me pooping my pants? How not sexy is the fact that I can only have intercourse or relationships with him when I'm on the bottom, because if I'm on the top, all the pressures coming down, do I have to have my legs up the headboard? I have to have a pillow under my like, it's like, hey, enjoy this. I'm just gonna lay, you know, like it just intimacy

Rebecca Gleed  19:31  

exercise, saying, If you holding your son, oh yeah, your social calendar, your ability to work. This affects daily life, daily

Colleen Avis   19:42  

life, daily life. So she said to me, I said, Well, what would you do? Of course, that's not the answer that the surgeon's always going to give you, because she really wanted me to choose for myself. And she said, I think you need to have a conversation with Jesus. And you know, there was some tongue in shape, of course. And so I went home for. Weeks, and I was like, I'm ready to have the surgery. And so I had a hysterectomy. I have my ovaries, but I had a hysterectomy to rebuild the vaginal space. I kept part of the cervix. They kind of use it as a pinch, fold it up, the new cavity up, and then my bladder was put in a sling, which, by the way, anyone that's listening that's peeing their pants, for the majority of us, a sling for the bladder is outpatient. You do not need to pee your pants. You can actually go and be an expert like this, be in their office, get a sling, vaginally, put in, through to hold your bladder up, and you can stop peeing your pants. It's fantastic.

Rebecca Gleed  20:38  

So you don't have to, oh, yes, there's treatment. You may not have to

Colleen Avis   20:43  

be. I mean, I can't speak for everyone. I don't know. I'm not a medical doctor, but so we she chose in the surgery not to do any rectal prolapse correction, okay, which was fine. I you know you you have to trust your doctors, right? Once you've made the decision of surgery, you should be trusting your doctor. Once you have the decision to have a baby, you should trust your delivery doctor. And I trusted them. I just didn't have enough knowledge. Building

Rebecca Gleed  21:06  

trust through knowledge, co creation,

Colleen Avis   21:09  

all the things I say I do, yes, but I needed the doctors to do that for me, because just like, if someone comes to me in a coaching relationship and they're like, I'm stuck. I don't know if I should stay in this relationship or leave. They don't come to me because they know the answer off the top of their head. I believe they know the answer in their heart, but they need some fostering of transformation, and in the doctor's case, is some knowledge, right? Like, yes, so please don't assume that anybody knows anything doctors that are listening. The surgery was a huge success. It's a six month recovery. Yes, it's uncomfortable and all the things. But I, for 14 and a half years, lived a very normal, active life after that, sexually, I things were back to normal, running, exercising, all the things really, really no problems. I had a little bit of tightness with the bladder, so I had to go get that adjusted, because I was like, I don't think I'm peeing enough, you know, things like

Unknown Speaker  22:12  

that post surgery or less,

Colleen Avis   22:13  

post surgery, like, two years post surgery, it was still just felt like I wasn't entering my bladder. So I was getting a lot of UTIs.

Rebecca Gleed  22:20  

Okay? So some complications. How was the actual surgery? How did you experience that,

Colleen Avis   22:27  

um, you know, like every woman that's listening to this, you're tough, you're strong. So I think, you know, the surgery was fine. You know, it's a four or five hour thing, and it's, for me. For me, it was again, this was some time ago, so maybe it's changed. But it was also a robotic surgery. I was one of the first people that had the Da Vinci, which is a robot that helps assist the doctor with so it was laparoscopic. So I had five or seven, I can't remember, scars near my pubic bone and near my navel. At this point, they're nearly gone. They're the teeniest little things that let a light and a scope and a probably a very cool, yeah, Da Vinci, yeah. They actually, they actually encase the vaginal wall and put it in a bag inside of you, process it and then remove it. Technology. Don't YouTube it if you don't have a strong stomach. Yeah, I

Rebecca Gleed  23:24  

have a lot of women in my practice who come to me around the psychology of the hysterectomy, of how is this going to change my life, whether it's intimacy or hormones or some of the grief of you know, what this, you know, encompasses post hysterectomy. So I wonder for you, did any of that come up? So,

Colleen Avis   23:50  

you know, I was able to keep my ovaries so hormonally and physically because the surgery was such a success for me, you know, and with intimacy, a lot of that didn't change. What I didn't know again beforehand, but I learned very quickly after, was that energy center, that feminine Sacral Chakra, if you want to talk about, you know, a more spiritual approach to, you know, it's a bright orange space, you know, the root chakras at the bone, the tailbone, and then moving into

Rebecca Gleed  24:27  

soup. I mentioned this in my chapter. Actually, I know. Tell me why. This was part of my journey of unblocking my chakras. And the sacral chakra was my hardest to shake, and I knew and part of the work I do is, is fertility counseling. And there was a moment when I was working with a couple I actually, I have it hanging up behind me, my orange sweater, but I said, today is the day like it's. Orange, and I walk into the waiting room, and I kid you not, my client was dressed head to toe in orange, and I knew at that moment, and we looked at each other and it would and I never come to work in order. I'm more of a like gray, black, you know, brown, to change things up. That was the moment. I knew it was at least partially unblocked. But, you know, coming back for you how what meaning and form did it take in your journey? Yeah,

Colleen Avis   25:37  

I mean, I struggled quite a bit with feeling like I had removed myself from myself. I didn't quite know the power that was held again this senselessly. Say out loud, there's a lot of things that go into getting pregnant, but the space in which you carry that precious life, I mean, I think it's such a gift to be that intimate with a human being. I believe that we choose to come here. So I believe our son chose my husband and I as parents. And so when you are chosen and this person takes residency up in your body and trust you to do what is your best to do. And God, I took care of that baby when he was in utero for those nine months. People used to come to and go, I've never seen a pregnant lady eat this healthy like, This is crazy. Like, even my urges to eat things that weren't good. I was like, I can't do it. This is, you know. So you would think knowing and feeling and having such a connection with the sacral ness of that space for that process, that I would have thought about it a little bit more before I just removed it. But I think I was in so much discomfort, and it was mentally taking such a toll on me that I did what I needed to do in the moment, and then on reflection, I spent about six or nine months really beating myself up like how so did I do enough to protect that energy space that was a sacred space in which Finn and I, my son's name is Finn, were connected by cutting through so much of my nerves and blood flow and sensory organs and the energy lines that run through that have i dissembled the ability to be my own best self, because I've just cut the tree at the trunk, so to speak, so that the the prosperity of things that come through the wholeness of ourselves. So I struggled with that a lot.

Rebecca Gleed  27:45  

How did I restore? Was there a restoring component for you? Yeah,

Colleen Avis   27:49  

I think you know a lot of that restoring was healing things that had nothing to do with the sacral space or the pregnancy. Frankly, at 16 years old, my father chose to abandon our family. There's a lot of abandonment. A lot of her a lot of things. Actually, book one talks about that chapter, if you're interested. And there was an abandonment issue. There was a which presented itself in, you know, being promiscuous, which presented itself, and not taking care of my body. I think I shared bulimia and anorexia and things like that. And so there was a dislike for myself that was kind of underwriting. And even though I didn't think it presented itself when I cut part of myself out, so to speak, I think I I fell victim to a lot of those unhealed spaces. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker  28:42  

I hear this so often, and

Colleen Avis   28:46  

nice to share that with me. Thank you. Yes, you

Rebecca Gleed  28:49  

are so not alone in that this is such a sacred experience that it's almost, in a way, the body saying this is going to resurface, and I want it to resurface so you can take care of it, so this doesn't haunt you into this sacred space. Yeah, right.

Colleen Avis   29:11  

I totally believe now and what an amazing healing journey I've been offered in this life, I actually believe I chose it. I chose my mom and dad. I chose all those things to go through this life and learn so many things. I know that the prolapse and the way the delivery happened and the nearly 24 hours of birthing were intentional. The Universe said we're going to make this really freaking hard so that you have to address yourself, you know, we're going to the universe. Knew it had to be physical for me, right? Somebody had to, like, slap me in the face. There's

Rebecca Gleed  29:52  

the meaning making out. There's really hard. This woman

Colleen Avis   29:56  

can, can mind bend her way at. Thing, we got to push her on the ground, and that's what they did. That's what it did. And, you know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have it any other way today, but it's been a journey. It's been a journey, yeah, and this

Rebecca Gleed  30:11  

is a gift, just to highlight the work that you do for anyone listening, that Colleen can co create with you, if you're beginning your journey, or this is bringing up something for you. This is something right you can ally and CO create with anyone and go on their journey and create new meaning and restore and transform. I just think you're such a gift in terms of the work that you're doing. So thank you. You know, you

Colleen Avis   30:39  

know, you know what's really beautiful about this, and this is what I really mean by holistic. Is some people in old school ways, would look at you and I and say, they do this. They compete, quote, unquote, they compete. And in with women. I think that's often even more elevated. Yes. And what is so, if nobody gets anything out of this conversation about my vagina, what I do hope people see is you have a deep desire. We said all those rise right yeah, to to whomever you're in community with. You want them to be with the right match for them. So I keep a relationship with people like you and and obviously people like Dr Cantor, but other people in the mental health space, because someone might come to me, and if it's not the right fit, let's get them with the right fit, you know. And so that's just a real beautiful thing about about your heart in this community that you're creating. And so thank you for, like, highlighting that for people. It's really beautiful.

Rebecca Gleed  31:49  

And you highlighted something in the beginning about this abundance mindset that you bring. I share that too in my practice, that we have resources out there. And sometimes that does look like, well, I know this person over here, let's bring them to the team, or let's, why don't you do this portion of your work with them? And I'll be here over you know, on the sidelines, cheering you on. And so this abundance, this idea that let's elevate, there's enough to go around. You know,

Colleen Avis   32:24  

I actually believe we are, we are born abundant, and we learn a scarcity mindset. And so you actually don't have to cultivate abundance. You already have it. You just have to put down. Yeah,

Rebecca Gleed  32:35  

yeah, you already have it. Gotta figure that one out. So, yeah, just put it down. So, so here you are at 53 like, what did your 40s look like in terms of this journey, or Yeah,

Colleen Avis   32:59  

you know, my 40s were a lot of awareness. Big, big flashlight went on because, you know, I was like my late 30s when this had happened, and, you know, fortunate for all the wonderful care that I had. And so the exploration began for me with, okay, I trust and love these doctors, and I am 100% behind Western medicine, and there's got to be something else. Because the way that I went through this, the lack of knowledge, the lack of understanding, the doctors just doing it, the way they do it, there's got to be another way that this integrates my intuition and my own spidey senses in my own, you know, personal intellect was like, There's something else. I didn't know what it was, so I went off to learn meditation. And I did that because I thought by meditating, getting still and silent, I could learn well, I landed up taking the teacher certification. I never thought I would teach or share meditation. It was all for me. But that was the beginning of a huge ripple where I then moved into, you know, mindfulness and Ayurveda and coaching and, you know, holistic nutrition and whatever, all the things are that I've that I've taken on. And every time I took it on, I was taking it on for my own journey to kind of get the most information I could apply it to myself. And so my 40s were about finding other ways. It was like, How curious can I get? What

Rebecca Gleed  34:27  

resources are available? Incredible to try this,

Colleen Avis   34:33  

and I didn't really quite understand why, but wow, you know, it's an inside job.

Rebecca Gleed  34:41  

Isn't it? Yes, we have to be healthy as providers, as healers, as fill in the blank, yeah, because we can only go as far as we've gone, at least. That's one of the beliefs that I carry as a practitioner, is I've gotta continue my. Work, which is why I have my own therapist, I have my my team. We we need each other. We need to stay healthy so we can do this work. The overflow can happen now that you're we're reflecting back, what what advice could you give those on their own journey of fertility or postpartum, and then also, for those in a providing role, what words would you give them?

Colleen Avis   35:28  

Yeah? So if I was talking to my colleague, quote, unquote, in this space, right, someone who was in a similar space, and I would say this was true if you're a woman, if you're a woman, that's gonna define that Like honestly, even if you're a man who's supporting a woman to first trust your own insight and knowledge, and even though you might not feel like you have enough, begin to feel into your body and think a little more with your heart and your gut and your solar plexus and your sacral plexus, then Then just your mind, right? We now live in an age we didn't then we do now, where there's so much information on the Google and information is free. Information does not create transformation. What creates transformation is seeking out maybe some information, and then deeply listening to yourself, looking for different potential, you know, potential opportunities or being resourceful, or curious and inquiring, and to really ask yourself, what do I need? Right? What do I want? And then looking and seeking for the opportunity of maybe who the best practitioner is. So, Go in, go in and ask. And if you need help, going in and ask. Call a sister, call a coach. Call a yes, you know, call, call someone who you feel like you can have a confidential and safe conversation with even our, even our health care providers. You know, you can call and have conversations with counselors on a lot of our health care plans for free. Call and pick their brains and ask them, right the there's so many resources. So yeah, I think it would just be harness, harness, and trust yourself

Rebecca Gleed  37:06  

of the worlds that we live in and our busy minds, how in the world? Because that sounds so nice to just that in quiet and in peace, many of us struggle with that. Do you have any wisdom or or any practices that folks can take away from this episode of, how do you do that for those who haven't learned meditation or mindfulness, what's, you know, one or two practices that we can offer our listeners? Yeah.

Colleen Avis   37:37  

So number one, there's a couple free things on my website. If people want there's a couple of free things, because there's so many potential. And it's going to be unique to you, right? It's going to be bio individually to you. What's going to help you find a calm and a space and a peacefulness? What's your website? Colleen? Oh, it's Colleen Avis coaching com, and there's a resource page of a whole but you can download free chapters from the book. There's an writing to your emotions free guide kit. There's a wellness tool. Check there's a bunch of stuff. Thank you. Maybe there's something there that's interesting to someone. I think what the common answer here is is connect with your breath. I love that. Okay, I connect with my breath all the time. I think it's fantastic. I say, use it. It is scientifically true that it is going to help you shift, and it's too common of an answer to give. So the suggestion that I make to people is when you walk from your car to the grocery store door or your car to the school door, park a little further away, and when you choose to get out of your car door. I want you to sit in your car with your hands on your wheel until you say to yourself, I am going to have a mindful experience walking from my car to the front door of where I'm going. Oh, am I ready? Okay, do not get out of your car and get halfway there and then remember, no, put a sticky on your steering wheel. I have a sticky on my steering wheel, and remind yourself, get out of the car. Take a deep breath, exhale and just feel your feet hit the ground. Just be present with yourself. Just allow yourself to think about how it feels to be moving your body and how your feet feel on the ground when you hit the grocery store door 30 seconds later, you can go back to the buzz of life, but give yourself that pause. You can do it. You're going to the grocery store anyway, so don't tell me you can't do it.

Rebecca Gleed  39:28  

This is accessible. No, accessible, yeah, yeah. So

Colleen Avis   39:33  

maybe that's a silly one, but to practitioners, well, it's silly, but it's impactful. I do it. My clients do it me too. Yeah, it makes shifts. Yeah, and call me if you want to do anything different. I'm happy to noodle with you ways that work just me and you having a coffee, whatever I mean, you being whoever's listening right now, yeah, to practitioners. I guess the flip side of that right is don't assume anybody knows anything. Don't assume any. You know, I have two brothers that are medical doctors. I understand the we gotta go, we gotta move, we gotta go, even if it was a handout, even if it was just like a little handout, you know, that said, Have you considered these three questions about yourself and explored what it is you want from insert this experience. Just give people the opportunity to get curious about themselves. You don't to give them a fact sheet. Like I said, information is free. I can get information all over the place, but to help me create a transformational, curious space. God, I would have loved if someone gave me three or four questions that said, Have you considered that there are multiple ways to think about having a

Rebecca Gleed  40:37  

vaginal birth bring the humanness into it? Yeah, are

Colleen Avis   40:41  

you kidding me? There is really tell me, right? You don't have to spend a lot of time explaining it to them, give them a resource or a website or two that says these are three places you might want to go and learn about what this process could be like for you. People are smart. The second, doctors and practitioners and coaches and therapists think that they know something that the client or patient doesn't you're done that's that is not a fair way to be treating another human being on the other side of the conversation. Yeah,

Rebecca Gleed  41:12  

so I loved what you said before, being curious as

Colleen Avis   41:16  

help them. Be curious. Help us, please. I've never

Rebecca Gleed  41:19  

heard the same story twice? I've said this time and time again, and probably on multiple episodes, but truly being curious as providers opens up the opportunities to understand how this person is an expert in their own lives, and they people know more than you think and don't make assumptions. So you

Colleen Avis   41:41  

know, when I said that, Dr candor had told me to go up a conversation with Jesus, full transparency. Dr candor has become a personal friend. She's actually in the second book. We gotta get her on. Yeah, she will love it. You'll love her. And if you want all the proper terms about all this stuff, then she should be here. But the reason I mentioned the have a conversation with Jesus. That was her way of telling me to go. Think about this for myself. She as a surgeon, a surgeon, did not say, you have to go have surgery. She said, I want you to by saying, she said, she said, Go, think about this. We're not going to schedule you tomorrow. Now, there are reasons surgeons might need to schedule you tomorrow for things that are much more life and death, but what we're talking about here is finding people that are going to offer you that

Unknown Speaker  42:33  

thank you for this. What a gift. Oh,

Colleen Avis   42:36  

what a gift to get to share it. It's always healing to talk about our own stories and and reflect, I will tell you I am wearing a pessary because, after 16 years, you've and and being 53 which is a little more normal time. And so I am now under the curiosity of have a conversation with Jesus about or conversation with myself, is how I look at it now, with Am I happy wearing a pessary? Or is there another solution for me? And I think the answer is probably the pessary. It's also hormonal treatment and vaginal estrogen. And you know, I'm a different human than I was at 37 says the back of my hands and the top of my knees. But, you know, I'm looking at this a different way, this time, with different curious eyes and insight, and I also listen deeper to other people's stories and try to learn from them. So be curious,

Rebecca Gleed  43:32  

look at it different angles, and it's going to look and feel different at different seasons of your life. Yeah. And I think your story is going to help so many people feel less alone and feel seen and heard. And can you share a little bit as we wrap up about the services that you offer and what that might look like and what folks can expect? Yeah. So

Colleen Avis   43:59  

the majority of my business and practice is in one on one coaching really. You know, people that are looking to move past I don't even really like to use limiting beliefs, because I don't actually think they're they're limiting. I think they can be really empowering. But people that are looking to connect more deeply with who they are answer that question as to who they are, get creative and curious about the solutions that they might have themselves. Step kind of boldly into what it is that they're looking to create. You know, I like to really think about that fostering of transformation, and it starts with understanding, like, what's possible for that. You know what? What is even possible? I think a lot of people think, well, this is it. I'm 53 and this is kind of how life is. And you know, my mom had this disease, and my grandmother had this disease, and my grandfather had that disease, so therefore I'm going to have this disease. And like I said, I love Western medicine as much as I love Eastern 5% of your propensity or your possibility. To have a disease similar to one that you are of someone you are related to, 5% is the chance of that happening. 95% of what happens to you, mind, body and spirit is your lifestyle. So I like to look at people's lifestyle with them. You know, whether it's relationships, whether it's money, whether it's food, you can't untangle it, but let's get curious. Now. Let's empower you to step boldly.

Rebecca Gleed  45:26  

And how can people find you? Where do they find you? You can

Colleen Avis   45:30  

find me at Colleen, Avis coaching.com you can find me at my email. Colleen avis@me.com I am an incredibly open book, approachable human being. I used to give out my cell phone, but then I find, like, some of the AI spammers, like, get you, but

Unknown Speaker  45:48  

we'll keep that confidential,

Colleen Avis   45:49  

yeah, but there, you know, there's and there's fun ways, like, I run a women's meditation group on Thursday mornings. It's been going for eight years. You know, there's other fun ways to connect. I have a calendar on my website. I do 30 to 60 minute like exploration, get to know each other for fun conversations. So I think my website and my email are probably, probably the best.

Rebecca Gleed  46:10  

And for folks who are not living in the DC metro area, do you offer virtual options?

Colleen Avis   46:16  

I do. You know most of my clients are virtual, and most of my clients well, I guess half and half, right now, about half are local and half are virtual, but I find, like, I almost get more out of people sometimes when it's virtual, because they give me the whole hour. They're not trying to run in late or run out. Yeah, virtual is definitely a way for sure.

Rebecca Gleed  46:35  

Okay, so anyone can reach you. This is so fantastic. And I told you, I woke up this morning I was so excited, like I get to talk with Colleen. I'm so so looking forward to today. So thank you for coming in. For folks who want to purchase a sacred spaces volume three, which is one of three in a series. It is being released on February 18. I can attest this group of of writers is it is such an incredible group, and these stories come with a tangible tool that can support your journey. Anything else that you want listeners to know about volume three,

Colleen Avis   47:16  

just that. By supporting the book, you're supporting people who have many been first time authors who, for the first time, are trying to step in a place of healing, because a lot of people that write their chapter for the first time becomes their own healing journey, and so you're really stepping in and supporting that kind of community, which I think is brave. The other thing is a portion of the proceeds of the book goes to an organization called impact others, as well as a small food pantry in my hometown, which get chapter, get book one, and you'll know why I know about food pantries in my hometown. But so you know it's it's also about, how do we get stories out? And it's less about some business of a book. And so we do give a great amount of the proceeds away to people that are building wells and people that are making sure people have coats. And so the ripple is, the ripple is large, and the book on February 18 will be $1.99 very intentionally, or it's more important for us to get the stories out and create awareness than anything else. So there's a lot of lot of people are being supported. If you want to jump in on that, yeah,

Rebecca Gleed  48:19  

get your copy February 18, thank you. This is Colleen avis. Thank you for coming on today. Thanks, Becky.

Unknown Speaker  48:25  

Hi. I'm great.

Speaker 2  48:32  

If you would like to learn more about how we can help, visit our website at perinatal reproductive wellness.com, and while you're there, check out the latest edition of our book, employed motherhood. We also invite you to follow us on social media at employed motherhood. Finally, if you enjoyed listening to the show, please subscribe and rate it. Thank you. You