Uprooted by Suicide

September is Suicide Prevention Month. Please share this episode of Uprooted by Unwanted Change. Lauren Flores talks about her personal journey of grief and healing after the loss of her brother, Zach, to suicide. She discusses the importance of breaking the silence surrounding suicide, navigating the complexities of grief, and the coping strategies that helped her heal. Lauren emphasizes the significance of therapy, particularly EMDR, and the role of family dynamics in processing loss. She also highlights the importance of keeping memories alive through storytelling and advocacy work, as well as finding comfort in signs from loved ones. Ultimately, Lauren's story is one of resilience, forgiveness, and the ongoing journey of mental health awareness.

You can reach out to my personal email - laurenflores512@gmail.com

Resources - AFSP Website | What Doesn’t Kill Her Book - Amazon 

Forever Ours: Real stories of immortality and living from a forensic pathologist - M.D Janis Amatuzio

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Transcript

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Today's episode contains very sensitive material on the topic of suicide, and may not be suitable for everyone. Information shared is based on personal experiences and not meant to replace medical or other professional help. He was just really like a ray of sunshine, and he just lit up the room. He was really handsome, goofy, extremely loving, and he had great hair. He would want me to mention that. I just remember that day, like I felt like my life completely stopped in time. Like I felt completely frozen and I wasn't sure how I was going to move forward. I had, unfortunately found my brother, and I suffered a lot of post-traumatic stress disorder, PTSD. My anxiety was unbearable What do you do when it feels like the rug's being pulled from underneath your feet? In fact, the whole floor. Welcome to the Uprooted by Unwanted Change podcast about managing life transitions. I'm Kiran Prasad, teacher, speaker, and author of A Mindful Move Feel at Home Again based on my 29 house moves. On each episode, we'll focus on a topic of unwanted change, with guests sharing stories of resilience and insights into how they navigated their journeys. Together, we'll discover a community of inspiring individuals and create a system of support for one another. We have one such inspiring individual with us today, Lauren Flores. Welcome, Lauren! Thanks, Kiran, it's great to be on the show. You're welcome and welcome listeners. Today our episode is about being uprooted by suicide. Now I know this is not an easy topic for most people to talk about. But it's a very important one to address. I really appreciate you being able to do so today, Lauren. Let's begin by you sharing a bit about who you are as an individual before we move on to you talking about your story with Zach. Yeah, of course. So I am 34 years old and I'm from Victoria, Texas, originally. I was raised by a single mom and was lucky to be co-raised by my aunts and grandparents throughout my younger years. Growing up, it was just me and my brother Zach and him and I were adopted by our stepdad when I was about 10 years old, so Zach was eight. And I am a first generation college graduate and a proud alumni of Texas State University. Go Bobcats! After college, I was really lucky to start my career as a contractor recruiter at Google in 2017. After many years and hours of hard work and dedication, I became a full-time employee here in 2019, and still here today. In my free time, I really enjoy writing, traveling, and spending time with my boyfriend, and my two Goldendoodles. uh I was also featured in What Doesn't Kill Her book, um which featured a short story about my brother. So this amazing book about women's resilience and yeah, I'll get more into that later, excited to be here. Great. Yeah. We have quite a few things in common, I realize, writing, travel, dogs. I love Goldendoodles! They're so cute! Congrats on being a first generation college grad and also congrats on having the courage to share your story in a book. Sounds like you have a lot of wonderful people in your life, Lauren. and Zach was clearly one of them. Tell us about him and what it was like to be his sister? Yeah. So if I could describe him, He was just really like a ray of sunshine, He was a guy where he just walked into the room and he just lit up the room. Very nice guy. He was about six one. He was really handsome, goofy, extremely loving, and he had great hair. He would want me to mention that. He was really involved in sports growing up. He mainly played select baseball, and football, and wrestling. A fun fact is he made the Varsity wrestling team as a freshman when we were in high school. So Very athletic, very social guy. Growing up, we were just about two years apart in school, which was really fun. So you know, looking back, we really navigated through a lot of change really young in our life. Um like I said, we were raised by a single mom for the first uh eight and ten years of our life. Um and she worked really hard to provide for us both, you know, working multiple jobs and we moved a lot um over the younger years. And we really found, I would say, a safe place and stability when my stepdad adopted us. As I mentioned in my introduction, my stepdad Larry, he's awesome! uh And Just shout out to all the adopted parents out there. It really um changed both of our lives for the better. Ah, well I know what it's like to move a lot as a kid, you know, that's not easy to do. And I'm so glad your stepdad Larry, he helped bring some stability into your lives, as you say. And yes, it takes really special people to be adopted parents and single moms too. Shout out to them as well! Zach also sounds like such a special, fun, cool guy, and so handsome. I've seen the photo. Movie star looks, and that hair like you mentioned. Our listeners can actually you can see his the photo of Lauren and Zach if you go on YouTube and see the trailer reel you can see it there. So tell me a bit more. Yeah. After high school, I chose to attend community college and save money, and Zach chose a different path. He moved to Mississippi and he attended Ole Miss University. And so throughout our college years, we would keep in touch, you know, sometimes looking back, I wish we kept in touch more, but we would spend the holidays together. And I really felt that was really the only time each year that I had to check on him. Um I know my parents were always really worried and stressed during the time that he was at Ole Miss. He joined a fraternity and he got involved in just kind of a party scene. And you would think that's just a typical college atmosphere, we thought. Particulary one day I remember when we were in college, I got a call from my parents that he was rushed to the hospital because he was playing intramural football, I believe. I believe it was flag football. And someone had hit him from the side and basically caused his lower rib to pierce into his liver. So it was really, really scary. em And he almost died ah then. And it was just really traumatic and I know shortly after that he moved back to Austin. So, you know, at that time I was um also still back in Austin. I had started my career and we decided to move in together. We lived downtown together and I'm really glad that we had that last year, not knowing at the time that was gonna be the last year of his life. But I'll really cherish that year forever. It was probably the closest that we were as adults. Oh that must've been so scary for you and your family when he was rushed to hospital like that! And I'm just so glad you got to have that year of living with him. And that must've been really special, quality time. It sounds like, things were going reasonably well with Zach up to that point. You know, you're saying he was like a typical college kid, college kid stuff. When did things begin to change? When did you notice anything changing? Were there any signs? And please only share what you feel comfortable sharing. Yeah, so just looking back, there were not many signs, I think, in passing. Um you know, my from my mom's perspective, she said that she did notice, you know, increased alcohol usage, depression at times, and in times of isolation. But like I said, my brother was very social, so he was always out doing stuff. I mean, even when we lived together in that last year, you know, I was 26 and he was 24. So we were always out and about and, I didn't really notice that too much. From my perspective, he was working, I was working, we were just living our busy lives at that time. I didn't really catch onto too much. There weren't very many, memories I have of him seeing him isolated and such. But I think it's really important and for the listeners, like I would want everybody to just get educated about the warning signs. There's many different warning signs across mental health factors such as depression, um having anger, just displaying different emotions, or just in the way that someone is acting, whether that be their um demeanor and attitude towards suicide and such. I know we'll link it in the resources, but the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention is a great nonprofit I've partnered a lot with and there's so many great resources on their website and data points around suicide prevention. They update it every year. Unfortunately, the highest rate of suicide at that time was men 18 to 24. And my brother was 24 at that time. I actually just looked it up recently on AFSP website and they now have expanded that. As of 2023 stats, suicide was the second leading cause of death among individuals between the ages of 10 to 34 and the fourth leading cause of death among individuals between the age of 35 and 44. Um September is also a really special time of the year. My brother's birthday was September 20th and it also happens to be National Suicide Prevention Month in September. I know September is Zach's birthday month, you said, but I didn't know it's also National Suicide Prevention Month. That's great timing for this episode to try and help spread some awareness and talk about this important topic. Yeah, I'm so grateful I can, you know, share this experience and I hope whoever is listening just knows that you're not alone. You're loved and you're worthy and you're needed in this world no matter how dark it can feel some days. I'm a big Harry Potter fan and it reminds me, I always think of this quote, but as Albus Dumbledore said, "Happiness can always be found even in the darkest of times if you just remember to turn on the light." That's always my motivational quote when it comes to mental health, because it is like a light switch. We need to check in with ourselves every day. We need to make sure to restore energy and take time away to take care of ourselves, right? Because I feel like for me when, you know, unfortunately on March 8th, 2018, when I lost my brother I think it'll be eight, eight years next year, which is crazy. but I just remember that day, like I felt like my life completely stopped in time. Like I felt completely frozen and I wasn't sure how I was going to move forward. You know, I had, um, unfortunately found my brother, and I suffered a lot of post-traumatic stress disorder, PTSD. My anxiety was unbearable for a few months and I really reached out and got help right away. My getting into therapy and for me, I feel like I had this, it was weird. It was strange energy, but I felt very overcome with this intense energy to push forward. I really turned my pain into purpose and I just have a strong feeling that was probably Zach's spirit of you know, I don't want my brother to be forgotten. And even years later, like today, I'll continue to speak about him and share his story. And I really wanted to understand more about suicide prevention and um be able to learn these warning signs and be able to help others because unfortunately, especially for men in this country, it is a very common form of death. And it's really important to just educate ourselves on how we can check in with ourselves personally and those around us, you know, in case someone might be struggling. It's not talked about enough. So I'm glad that I have the space to share it today. That's so beautiful, Lauren. And a great message to send out to anyone struggling, that you're not alone. There's help and support out there and light at the end of the tunnel. And Lauren, you're a shining example of that. So you were mentioning you did take care of yourself and got some therapy. How did you cope? If you could go into a bit more detail. How did you cope with all the uncertainty of the unknowns of the situation? And what, if anything, helped you through that heart- wrenching time, some of the coping strategies that you used? Yeah, of course. So my parents and I were really lucky to find a local grief and loss center here in town. And we all attended EMDR therapy. So EMDR stands for Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing. There are a few versions of this in-person therapy, which includes the eye movement. So think of you're sitting in front of a therapist and they use a hand motion to help the brain process the trauma or tapping. And I use TheraTappers, which are small handheld devices. Think about like half the size of a computer mouse. So you're holding those two in your hand and they're attached by a large wire to a small box that the therapist holds, that has dials on it. And the therapist adjusts the speed and intensity of the tapping. So as I'm talking to the therapist and I'm processing these traumatic moments, she told me to process them like a movie reel, right? So each section, small segments over these sessions that we would process, either that tapping motion would increase or slow down. And it was amazing! I mean, you don't... I didn't realize at the time that when you go through trauma, it stores in your body, in my legs, in my chest, in my shoulder, like everywhere. With this TheraTappers we started from my toes all the way up to my head. It was several sessions of this and just slow segments. And I will say I did this for about six months, two times a week, sometimes three times a week. And I was not afraid to reach out to my therapist and say, hey, I need to see you again, you know, during the week. She taught me how to compartmentalize my trauma. And eventually when we got towards the end of those six months, I was able to compartmentalize it. She taught me how to think of my trauma above me, like a swirling cloud. And she would tell me to pick a color. Um so imagine this, you close your eyes, this cloud swirling around you. I said, okay, it's a green cloud there. And then she said, okay, you'll decide where to store it. So anywhere, right? So for example, um my brother had a large tree tattoo, like all, like it was his whole back. He loved trees and he would always tell us it was our family tree. Yeah so I would, I immediately thought of a beautiful, oak tree glistening in the sun somewhere just beautiful. I chose to store it there. That's just an example, but I would, you know, highly recommend this therapy option. It helped my body heal and it really helped me to learn to compress that trauma so that I could continue to live my life and learn how to cope. From then on, it was the EMDR therapy and then I've been in therapy over the last several years, personally, just of course for my grief because grief comes in waves. um So I continue to check in on that and I just love therapy. It really has helped me and it's truly saved my life for sure. This all must have been so traumatic, not just losing him, but finding him since you were the one to find him. I mean, that must have been so difficult. And those are all, they sound like wonderful coping strategies and therapies that you found. And uh I love the idea of the trauma, seeing it as a color, a cloud, and the tree as you were visualizing, and learning to compartmentalize. I think those are such wonderful ways of dealing with trauma. And I have actually tried EMDR before. um It was certainly very effective for me. And I'm so glad you and your family, you sought help at a grief and loss center because not everybody does turn to help. My heart goes out for you and your family, for all of you, because, you know, just how tough as a sister to lose your brother, as a parent for your child to go before you. And I wonder, did your family's dynamics, did they change after losing Zach? Yes, yeah. This is something I really struggled with for I would say, the first couple years after he passed. It was, at that time, for the last 24 years, it was just the two of us. And I never felt like I had all the attention and spotlight on me in my family. Um and to this day, I'll never say I'm an only child. If anyone ever asks, I always say I do have one brother that passed away when he was 24. Even just saying that sentence that I just said, that took me years to be able to say because the word death or passed away, they're hard, tough words to say. There's a lot of emotion that comes with those words. So, you know, to those that are listening that might've lost someone, it's okay to not say it out loud for a while. I didn't, I really struggled to accept that that had happened and now, um I do find a lot of healing by talking about my brother to keep his memory alive and to also help educate others. I felt very lost at that time. I didn't know what books to read. Luckily now we have so many amazing podcasts like this one to listen to and to relate to people. But at that time, I I just felt like I was on a, you know, road with five or six different pathways and I didn't know which one to take. And so, yeah, it's very overwhelming. But with time, it does get a little easier. And I do find that it helped me heal a lot by just, as I just said, just talking about him and, sharing that I do have a brother and that, unfortunately we lost him. And I will say when I started to talk to people and um I would tell them how we lost him and talk about suicide prevention, and be vulnerable, in my workplace and passing out in public wherever I am. That encourages people to speak up. I've seen it. I've had people come up to me over the last seven years and literally share their stories with me or think of me when they just lost someone or have a friend going through this and asked me for advice. I think that is the biggest compliment now because I've talked about it so much that it's not taboo for me to speak about. I want to, and I want to help people and share. So I find a lot of pride now in being that person um that my friends and family can go to. And people that I randomly meet. I mean it's such a connection point that you have with others. truly, I wouldn't wish this experience on anyone, but it is comforting when you find people that have gone through the same thing or are currently going through it, because you're not alone. I love that. Yeah. It's so important the more people who can get out there and speak on this topic and it does, it gives, it gives, it allows others to open up like you said, because it's still very stigmatized. It's tough enough losing someone, but losing someone in this way becomes so difficult. You feel isolated. You can't talk about it, from the people I know. uh And So tell us about how using your voice and sharing your story has helped you keep Zach's memory alive. And I know you love to educate and empower people going through such loss. Tell us a bit more about that. You know, I've been so grateful to have a lot of opportunities in my personal and professional life, um, to be an advocate for mental health and suicide prevention. So about, about six months or so after my brother initially passed away, um, I started an Instagram page for him and it's still there. It's called the Zachary Flores Foundation. The Instagram was, and Facebook page was originally a place where I felt really called at that time to share his story, to make that kind of the landing page and space for people to connect, to learn about Zach, where I could share resources and such. So I was pretty active on that, you know, for the first year or so um through the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, we had um organized a walk in my brother's memory. So I post photos of that, just different things like that that we were doing as a family. Well, one Harvard student at the time, Kerry Garvin, she reached out to me through Instagram, and she was so moved by, you know, the page I created and the foundation. And she asked me if I wanted to be a contributor to her book, which is called What Doesn't Kill Her. It's a beautiful book that's a collection of women's stories of resilience. And so this was perfect timing for me looking back because it was a way for me to write. And it was so recent still at the time, but it was a way for me to write his story and to share about him. And I'm so grateful that I was able to be a part of that. You can find it on Amazon. I know we'll link it here, but it's fantastic. After that, I just became so in love with writing. I journal a lot. I think that's where, you know, having that opportunity, it helped me heal. And I really wanted to drive that forward. At Google, I've been an active mental health and wellbeing advocate since 2018. I have spoken on panels at work through our employee resource groups regarding mental health. Um I have also in my immediate core role, I've been able to contribute to mental health and well-being activities and programs for my peers. And I'm always continuing to seek opportunities to give more visibility to suicide prevention and awareness. Always just, you know, it's at the forefront now of everything I do and um being ah through this journey over the last years, I feel like, I feel like it's just a part of me now. It's definitely one of my core passions and I always look for those opportunities. And Lauren, what did you say? How long ago was it? Or how soon after losing Zach, were you able to get out there and speak about it? How soon after? probably about a year or so because I was going through the therapy for that intense six months or so. And then at that point, I felt like I was getting to a good place. Then I worked on the book story for quite a while. And it was cool behind the scenes to see that book getting published, and then slowly getting back to work. Um And then once I do get back to work, I felt very motivated, inspired to, uh, find opportunities to speak about mental health. I find a lot of healing in public speaking now. That would be great because you're the right person for this. You're a natural at speaking and you have that passion. I'm so glad you also brought up about writing, providing healing because yeah, writing is so therapeutic. Whether we journal, create an Instagram page as you did for your loved one, or perhaps even a book in their honor. And I did read you the book. It's a wonderful book. I got that. By the way, I can put the information about that book and other resources in the show notes. Yeah, You've found such lovely ways to honor his memory and turn your pain into purpose. Um, and after the loss of a loved one, I know how special occasions like holidays, birthdays, and other milestones can be really tough to face. How's it been for you? And how do you cope with or manage during or through those times? Yeah, so the first few years were really tough around the holidays. Um to be honest, I didn't want to celebrate at all. And I want to remind anyone listening that may have had a recent loss that it's OK to not be OK. Each day will feel a different level of heaviness. And as you continue to take steps forward, each day gets a little easier. Um, with grief, there are the five stages of grief. So some days it kind of feels like a wave, like a literal ocean wave hitting you. And other days you might wake up and feel a little lighter. Just, I learned really quickly that with the holidays, you know, if I wanted to cry, I cried. I found a lot of comfort being around my family, even if we just sat there in silence, like just being with them on those special days. Because we're all going through grief together. I I know my family and I have found a lot of comfort in storytelling. So we would share stories, photos, and memories of Zach. And of course, even to this day, tears are still shed because we just miss him so much. Um but about two years after Zach passed away, we also lost my Nana on my mom's side. And she was like a second mom to me. So this grief hit me harder. Um, at that time in my life, I felt all the intense emotions again. It felt like, I was just hit by that. I say the huge wave in an ocean I felt like my body was prepared for it. I had been through, unfortunately, this intense grief. And when I lost my Nana, it felt, it felt, intense, but I knew I was going to be okay. I had gone through EMDR. I had started to build the coping skills and built my toolkit for myself. And I knew that this pain and this loss is just imaginable, but ah I know that my Nana would want me to move forward. And I know, and I saw how much it pained her when we lost Zach and she had Diabetes and she was just really sick. And um she would tell us she wanted to go with Zach towards the end and that broke my heart. You know, we were just all so close. So I find comfort now knowing that they're my guardian angels watching over me now. But um really after I lost her, I had to take some time off work. I took about two months off for mental health leave and that was the best decision I made during my professional career. I was able to fully unplug and just focus on me and my mental health once again. You know, holidays will never be the same, but you have to just focus on the living family that you are so grateful to still have, even if it feels unbearable. Sometimes just being around your family and sharing in those feelings of grief together can bring healing. I will be honest, I still get really emotional in the holidays and especially September because it is Zach's birthday month, but I do find comfort with also knowing that it is Suicide Prevention Month and the work continues. Yeah, a new loss can definitely bring a huge wave of grief again. I can relate and I'm sure a lot of people can relate to that and to the holidays, how tough they are. But yeah, when you have to face another loss, you're having to go through all those emotions again and the five stages of grief again. But obviously, you had those techniques now and I'm so glad you were able to access them and use some of the techniques you'd learned when facing this this other loss as well. And I'm so sorry for your loss of your beloved Nana too. I'm glad you had each other, your family for support and you could all relate to each other of course, what you're going through. And that's a beautiful way. We've done that as well of sharing stories, photos, memories of our loved one. That's a beautiful way of doing it. Lauren, I know you're very spiritual in your beliefs like me. And people talk about connecting, finding some connection with their loved one after they're gone. Are there any ways in which you still feel Zach's presence or closeness and like that? So I see a lot of signs in my daily life. I have always believed that red cardinal birds are our loved ones coming to say hi. I can remember actually, I believe it was back in 2021. So shortly after he passed, I was working at home one day and I looked up and I looked outside on my balcony and I saw two cardinal birds just sitting there, looking at me. And I was like, oh my gosh! I just smiled. I remember and I just thought, that's probably my brother and my Nana just checking on me. Um I also see the car that my brother drove a lot. I know my parents say this too, and it sounds silly, but sometimes when I'm making a big life transition, like when I bought my house or anything I'm going through in life, I'll see his car and that gives me comfort. So just little things like that. I think they're just little winks from the universe that your loved one's there and still looking out for you. I love that little winks from the universe. I really love that. Yeah, I've experienced that myself. And you said birds because with my mom, it was a bird. And it's not until it happens to you, you know, and you believe those things. But it was after I read this book, somebody recommended. It's by a Japanese author. I can't remember the name, but it's called Forever Ours. It was very comforting and it talked about those signs. Yeah, that's so beautiful, when you feel they're in some way, you feel they're still close. They're not gone. They're still by you. Sometimes people can feel really angry at first when they lose someone to suicide. Did you have anger? Are you at a place of forgiveness and acceptance about Zach taking his own life? I would say I feel at peace now and I have forgiven him. I was very angry and very confused at first. I would say for the first couple years, I just desperately craved answers. I wanted to know why. And I just, I couldn't, it took over my mind. It was, I couldn't sleep. was all I was thinking about why. Why did he do this? Why did he not leave a note? Why did I not know? Why did I not see the warning signs? But I learned very quickly through my years of therapy that we will never know why. That was not my life and I could never be inside his brain at that time. It wasn't selfish of him. He was struggling mentally and unfortunately the darkness of his mind just overtook him at that time. It's understandable you would be angry and hurt. And also it's human to want to know why. Again, it's getting to that acceptance stage of grief, accepting that you'll likely never have the answers, never know. And you have a lot of empathy for seeing it from his perspective that he must have been in so much pain to do that. I'm glad you've reached that stage in your healing and found peace. When we face an unwanted change, especially a trauma like you did with the loss of Zach, can often change us forever. Has that been your experience? And if so, in what ways has it changed you or your life? Absolutely. I would say going through this experience has made me a more aware and proactive adult. I'm constantly checking in on my own mental health and those around me. Now that I know the warning signs for suicide, I'm checking in on friends, especially long distance friends. And those people that mean the most to me. I've also seen myself evolve in the workplace. I'm not afraid to tell anyone if I'm having uh grief or if I'm having a tough day. We are only human and no one is perfect. So through sharing my experience with others I've also become a more, I would say empathy forward coworker. I'm approachable, I'm vulnerable in the workplace, which took years, but through demonstrating that to others, it just has allowed me a lot of opportunities. I mean, the more that you talk about it, when you're ready, of course, you'll connect with others and you'll find healing in that. I've always valued connection with others, which I do find very fulfilling in my daily job as a recruiter, but I personally feel so strongly about this topic and I want to keep sharing Zach's story. These are great traits you've developed I'm so glad you've brought this topic out of the shadows and into the light today. I know people who've lost someone through suicide and they feel isolated in their grief, perhaps having only a close friend or a therapist to be able to talk to about their loss. Now, is there anything else you want other people who are going through a death through suicide to know just to leave them with some final thoughts? Yeah, well first of all, I'm so sorry for your loss and just know um that you're not alone with that feeling. I would say just take life, you know, one hour at a time when it feels too overwhelming. Like I said previously, you know, some days will feel like that ocean of grief and other days will feel a little lighter. So just be easy on yourself. Don't be too hard on yourself and it's okay to let out emotions. If you wanna cry, cry. If you're angry, that's okay. Remember there's five stages of grief. I would also highly recommend to look for a local grief and loss therapy center in your local area. These therapists specialize in this field and I will say their work has truly saved my life and developed me into a young woman that I'm very proud of today. Um, I would also say find a way to let out your grief. So journaling, yoga, meditation, physical activity. uh Often just going outside and getting fresh air helps when you feel really overwhelmed. I know for me personally, I have, like I said many times here, but found a lot of healing through writing and also public speaking experiences like this. So when you're ready to talk about your grief with others, share it. Whenever you're ready, and there's no timeline to be ready. Like I said, it took me a couple years to even be able to say the sentence that my brother had passed away. To be able to articulate his story in a thoughtful uh kind way. So whenever you're ready to do that, you'll start to see how your vulnerability will truly inspire and encourage those around you. And it will also bring opportunities and other people into your path that have maybe just experienced this grief or uh they have in the past, you know, that common bond. I'm sure you probably heard the term trauma bond, but it is a real thing. Oftentimes, you know, when I was just starting to get out there and speak about it, I did feel very close to, you know, other, especially other women that have lost their brother. I think for me personally, that was a really... um cool bond to build with other people. And just remember too, suicide has no age limit, so the more that we can talk about it, we can really save lives. Those are such helpful insights you've shared with everybody. I really appreciate that. Lauren, if our listeners would like to connect with you and learn more about Zach and about your advocacy work, how can they do that? And I can add that to the show notes as well. Yeah, definitely. You can reach out to my personal email. It's laurenflores512 at gmail.com. oh Great. And Lauren, thank you so much for being here today, showing such courage to speak about a topic most people would really struggle to talk about. I really appreciate you being here. Of course, thank you so much for having me. I truly feel like I manifested this, podcast for myself. I've always wanted to share his story on this platform. Um, and I'll continue, you know, fighting the good fight for mental health and suicide prevention. It is so important to me. I'm so grateful to have been included on this podcast and I hope it reaches a lot of people across the world. I hope so too. The world needs more people like you, Lauren, fighting the good fight. You truly have managed to find meaning by turning your pain into purpose, the final stage of grief that I've spoken about before. And I'm sure you've helped many others in their grief to not feel alone and to be inspired by your strength in moving forward. Thank you also listeners. I hope this episode has helped you become better aware about suicide and shown you that there's life after loss and healing. Please tune in next Tuesday for my Tips for Rootedness episode. I usually do that solo episode alone, but I may have a special guest joining me next week. And if you enjoyed listening to today's episode and found it helpful, please subscribe, share and join our Uprooted by Unwanted Change Facebook group. New episodes will be brought to you every Tuesday, wherever you get your podcast, including a YouTube version with captions. In the midst of chaos and uncertainty, may you find peace and rootedness.