How can a single experience mold your identity and shape your destiny? Our conversation with Cesar Wurm, the charismatic and empathetic VP of Commercial and Premium Brands at IHG Hotels & Resorts, has us grappling with these profound questions. He takes us down the memory lane, revealing a mesmerizing journey from heart-wrenching loss to finding his passion in hospitality, through a path filled with valuable connections and growth opportunities. Cesar's story is a testament to the power of human connection, underlining how every interaction holds the potential to influence and inspire.
But the journey to success is never a bed of roses. It's more like a rollercoaster ride with its highs and lows, and Cesar is no stranger to it. He bravely opens up about the struggles he faced, including his battle with addiction and mental health issues. Caesar's thoughtful reflections on the importance of vulnerability in leadership and the pressing need to normalize seeking help are like a breath of fresh air. His insights into the changing definitions of success and the interconnectedness of our lives remind us that beneath the surface, we are all more similar than we are different. Steer clear of the usual rhetoric and join us for a thought-provoking conversation that transcends the ordinary.
Listen to the full podcast here: https://lnkd.in/gjcbqun
#inclusion #diversity #movingtheDIAL
How can a single experience mold your identity and shape your destiny? Our conversation with Cesar Wurm, the charismatic and empathetic VP of Commercial and Premium Brands at IHG Hotels & Resorts, has us grappling with these profound questions. He takes us down the memory lane, revealing a mesmerizing journey from heart-wrenching loss to finding his passion in hospitality, through a path filled with valuable connections and growth opportunities. Cesar's story is a testament to the power of human connection, underlining how every interaction holds the potential to influence and inspire.
But the journey to success is never a bed of roses. It's more like a rollercoaster ride with its highs and lows, and Cesar is no stranger to it. He bravely opens up about the struggles he faced, including his battle with addiction and mental health issues. Caesar's thoughtful reflections on the importance of vulnerability in leadership and the pressing need to normalize seeking help are like a breath of fresh air. His insights into the changing definitions of success and the interconnectedness of our lives remind us that beneath the surface, we are all more similar than we are different. Steer clear of the usual rhetoric and join us for a thought-provoking conversation that transcends the ordinary.
Listen to the full podcast here: https://lnkd.in/gjcbqun
#inclusion #diversity #movingtheDIAL
in order to be able to become sober, I really had to look inward and see and realize the opportunities for growth that I had, at the same time, be able to be able to communicate my emotions and be able to share, feel comfortable about sharing.
Speaker 2:Hello and welcome to the Diverse and Inclusive Leaders podcast. This is the show where I speak with most inspirational and thought provoking leaders of today and unearth their unique stories of diversity and inclusion to help inspire, educate and motivate others to make the world a better place. Today I am really delighted to be welcoming Caesar Worm to the podcast. Caesar is the VP of Commercial and Premium Brands and he provides strategic direction, oversight, leadership across all of the premium hotels that IHG hotels and resorts in the United States. He's got an incredible background. I've had the fortunate opportunity to meet the very lovely Caesar in person and outside of his work time. I know he's a big F1 fan and he's very passionate indeed about supporting others when it comes to addiction and recovery. He has an extensive background education label also serves on various different boards. He's been recognized by various who's who, diversity and inclusion lists and I am delighted to welcome him to the show today. Welcome, caesar.
Speaker 1:Thank you, layla, very, very happy to be here and thank you for the kind introduction. Actually, I'm going to save that and show that to my wife and daughter, so it sounds way better than probably how I feel. But, yeah, thanks, it's an honor to be here and it was a pleasure meeting you in New York a few months back, and thank you for all the great work you do. It's really impressive what you and the team have accomplished over the last three plus years and really making very important work with major corporations across the globe. So, yeah, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2:The pleasure is literally all mine, caesar. So tell us, and those who perhaps don't know you as well as I, a little bit about how you came to be where you are today. You thanked me for the kind intro, but frankly, I could have talked for 20 minutes about all of the things you've done. So perhaps take us back to the beginning and where you started and how you ended up in this role and getting so involved in various different causes, including, you know, obviously, sitting on our Dark Global Diversity Review Council, which we're very grateful for.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, absolutely yeah. It's an interesting journey. As I look back through my life and how I progress as a person, as a professional, it's interesting. I don't know if you feel the same way, but when I look at reflection, there is a lot of crucial aspects that happens in life that you you're not sure is going to lead to anything like. A lot of these experiences are not pleasant ones writing that, but you learn and you grow and you evolve a lot and then eventually you start meeting people and you start finding those connections along the way that eventually start connecting the dots, which I'm very grateful for.
Speaker 1:So, taking back a little bit, one aspect that really influenced me a lot, I was, you know, I was losing my mom at 12. It was very unexpected, you know. She went just for what should have been a fairly standard procedure catheter characterization, you know from the heart but she had a complication and you know, unfortunately couldn't do anything and he did immediately. So, as you can imagine, that was a shock, right? I mean, I was super close to her at that age. You're still forming as a person, evolving. You're just hitting your, you know your, your development years and you know so it was a very hard time for us, but at the same time, it made me grow right in some aspects much faster, in a much more agile way, because you have to adapt and figure out and deal with things that you wouldn't have to deal otherwise.
Speaker 1:So that has really made connections and engaging with people a very important aspect, because, as we're talking just a little bit earlier before, we start taping life short right and you never know, and so I think that cherishing and valuing connections, valuing people and appreciating what each person brings to the table, no matter, right, what their background is or their educational level, we can all learn from each other, and that's something that really held true as I began in the hospitality career, because I, you know, I wasn't a great student, so I couldn't I couldn't be a lawyer or or a doctor, but I start working in Brazil as a room service waiter and then I said, wow, this is a kind of fun experience. You engage a lot of people, you deal with different type of people. So I got an opportunity to study hotel school and began my professional career in hospitality and being here in the US for 22 years Somewhat unexpected, right, I came here for internship and I thought it would be a one year deal, but 22 years later I'm here and happy to be here.
Speaker 1:But yeah, that has really played a very important factor in my life. And then I was very fortunate to have great leaders, great team members. That really helped me to realize what's important how to focus on production and performance while being kind and ensure that we don't lose the humane aspect of people that really helps each other be at their best. And, yeah, so that is really kind of the journey. And then over the last few years, the DENI space became very dear and dear to my heart. I got an opportunity to sit at the board here at IHG in the America's board, so we do very important work and support the company to have a better culture and really allow the opportunity for everyone to grow and have great opportunities. And then it brought me to different circles and that's how I met you. And so, yeah, it's interesting how there was not like a linear path, but the zigzag that eventually took me to where I am today.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for sharing Caesar, and also it's really pertinent where you talk about the path in life not being so linear and clearly you can see the impact, the profound impact that it had on you losing your mum at the tender age of 12.
Speaker 2:Do you think that that was a big driver for who you are now and, ultimately, the work you're getting involved in it? Is it so purposeful? It's so meaningful and allowing the different mindsets to be welcome at the table. Whether it's the boardroom table, family table, it doesn't really matter, but do you think that that has been a big driving factor for you?
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, I think so. I believe was really a time where it kind of start to shape me, and for many years it wasn't a positive. Things right. I start rebelling as a teenager. I start drinking at a very early age and I was parting going to clubs at 14, and then that lifestyle evolved and so I had an addiction problem for many years, which thankfully now being able to be sober for eight years plus, and so it's interesting, right, it was a very painful experience.
Speaker 1:He had quite a bit of a time where it wasn't necessarily. I think it brought some aspects where he became positive and kind of allow me to relate better to people, allow me to have a certain perspective in life, but also I suppressed a lot of those emotions and didn't share and that eventually, right, it led to very harmful behaviors and way of life. So it's interesting to your point where once I realized, hey, I can't keep up my life as it is right, otherwise I'm gonna lose my family, I'm gonna eventually I become homeless and certainly die at one point. So when I decided that, hey, I need help, I need to change how I'm doing now and that has also became a very positive and I think really they start off a lot of personal growth, a lot of professional growth, because in order to be able to become sober, I really had to look inward and see and realize the opportunities for growth that I had.
Speaker 1:At the same time, be able to start to be able to communicate my emotions and be able to share, feel comfortable about sharing, and find ways to cope with the pain, with the anger, in positive ways versus just numbing the pain, finding ways to numb the pain.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, so that led to a lot of learning, a lot of reading and a lot of growth to start be able to speak more freely and, it's interesting, even as all sober for about six plus years I wasn't that comfortable talking openly about it. There's certainly a closed circle that knew. But just the more I began to open up, the more positive responses I got, where people, hey, I'm going for the same, or my son, my wife, my partner, you name it and then you start realizing, wow, right, even if someone may have whatever medical issue or something else that could relate and be able to help them in some way. So that's when I start become to open up a little bit and I think, yes, to some degree, it has a lot of impact, even if indirectly, in my personal life and work.
Speaker 2:So I'm not sure if I actually answered the question, but you did answer the question and you answered it in such a genuine way. I personally appreciate the detail that you went into and also how you talk about the discomfort with speaking about these things. There's a book that I'm reading at the moment and one of my favourite authors we've mentioned before. We started talking about stoicism. I actually have it here for no incident. It's called the Obstacle is the Way what you've described that going through this journey of hardship, going through the trauma coming out the other side. It is so inspirational because addiction can affect anyone in many different guises. Honestly, there's times when I get to the end and think, oh my goodness, I'm absolutely desperate for a drink. I'm sure that the people who are listening in to this podcast be the mics, be it people starting out in their career, be it people going through grieving, the loss of power.
Speaker 2:It's happened to me recently and it changes you as a person. It absolutely changes you. Without sounding too morbid on the podcast, because this is a really inspirational story of success and actually coming out the other side. But they say you lose a part of your childhood when you lose a parent, and I think how you articulated yourself there was very much that trauma and turning that adversity then into an experience with which you learn from you, gain that resilience and actually realise the only person that is going to solve this is me. And look where you are right now and creating that safe space for others around you. Like you say, it's like a snowball effect, people opening up and saying I've just done it now. Oh, my goodness. There's been times when stress, anxiety hits you. You think, goodness, you just want to reach for a drink. And there's the tipping point for that, when it becomes something that is a problem. This is something that is a casual drink.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think you're hitting something very important. And another reason why I'm very purposeful about sharing whenever it's appropriate or opportunist like this, is because, as humans especially nowadays with social media or whatever else we're so much more connected and you have so much insight into other people's lives or at least what's portrayed that is. It's. It's hard right. Sometimes you look at people and they are very successful or appear to be successful, appear to be happy and they have everything. But I think it's important to share that.
Speaker 1:Hey, yes, it's not an easy journey, right, and there's always. People have stuff going on in their lives and, yes, they may have great things in their lives, and hopefully everyone does, but hopefully everyone is happy and can achieve success and have the best possible. But also, I think it's important to recognize that everyone goes through some things. Everyone has adversity, obstacles, and it's important to acknowledge, when people are going for that, they don't feel like they're alone, they don't feel like, wow, you know, this is just me. So hopefully they can, you know, find some peace in that aspect and find someone to share whatever they're going through and find inspiration to. Hey, I can overcome these or can find a way to see the light at the end as well.
Speaker 2:Indeed. And when you talk about the light at the end of the tunnel and you also talk about the fact that we have many things going on below the surface, you know you're you're a father, you're a husband, you're a leader, you're a boss, you're a colleague the list starts to go on, and it will be really easy to judge that book by its cover. Obviously, we met in person and you know I hope your, your wife doesn't mind me saying this but you're very you know. You're a handsome guy, you're in a senior role. It would be super easy to think that actually have that made, or perhaps that was something handed to you on a plate.
Speaker 2:You know, so so important that we look below the surface and you know, when it comes to what diversity means and we had this conversation over dinner table which I just loved is diversity means different things to different people. You know, in particular when it comes to, you know, mental health, and for for guys actually as well, there's a far greater. You know even suicide rate and the likes with men. And you know work, for there's a charity in the UK called the smart, and I'm not sure what. They have them in the states, but the amount of guys that you would get calling up because of the whole taboo piece of men in particular talking about their vulnerabilities. I was talking to my counselor about this a little while back and she said it is really rocketed the amount of men who are now coming to see me and I thought that's fascinating because we're starting to talk about this more.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:I think I pull mail was very nice. Tease my husband about this is you know, big boys don't cry. Yeah, north America, and that's how, that's what you grow up with really, until there is, you know, leaders who have made it to the top and are willing to be vulnerable, and that vulnerability it's. You know it's a huge superpower. The ripple effect it can have is really quite tremendous.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm glad you brought it up because it's yeah, it's a problem and thankfully, to your point, it's improving. But you know, I personally known someone who you know committed suicide few months ago. You know someone my age and you know a family and, to your point, it's like it's so sad when someone is in that state that they don't see any other option. And, to your point, I think, if we normalize that, hey, you know, it's okay that you don't feel 100% or it's okay to not feel great all the time and there is so many ways, right, we can discuss and we can open up. There's professionals, you can talk to their things. You know meditation, whatever works for those people, but I think just talking about it and sharing experiences to normalize, so don't feel that, hey, you have to be ashamed to say I need help and there is a way.
Speaker 1:And it's interesting, as you were talking earlier, I had no idea when I first began my journey, so bright that I was kind of starting to learn about diversity, because as I start to explore, I gotta find ways to get sober and sustain.
Speaker 1:I went to groups where we share and you talk and you share your experiences and also, interesting to your point, that I really began to realize at that point that the differences between people that seems so different from the surface. It's so minimal, so minimal, right From making one wrong choice or not choosing to do something, or you had very successful and they lost everything. So it's easy to look at someone and judge right, either for the good or the bad, based on what you perceive his or her life to be. But it's so interesting to see that people go through experiences and the difference between being on the top or the bottom it can be so minimal, one little thing in your life, and so I think it's that was a great learning for me to be empathetic and be kind to people, because it was really enlightening to me.
Speaker 2:It's so profound when you're talking about these things and it makes me think of a film. It's quite an old film now, but I had Gwyneth Paltrow in it and it was called Sliding Doors.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you can see it, but basically she. There's one scenario in the film where she misses the train. So she's in London the tube, she misses a train literally by her hair. And there's another where she just about makes the tube and you don't know whether it was the first instance or the second instance and it tells both the stories and what happens.
Speaker 2:But it is such a good classic film and when you were telling that story it reminded me of that film, because one little thing, one person that you meet, one experience that you have, it's the ripple effect of various other things that then can happen and it starts to make you think well, what is success? What is life all about? In the last couple of months I've been thinking well, I really lost a lot of my motivation. Actually, is you kind of think, right, lost a parent, and where is the drive? And you can see how you can easily fall into that hole and not come back out of it again if you're not surrounded by brilliant people. You know your wife, your daughter, my husband, my son, my mom, my brother. But reminding ourselves constantly of all of the stuff that we have to be grateful for, I just think is absolutely critical.
Speaker 2:And then it clearly you know, some of the things that you've achieved are, I think, tremendous, but I would be really interested to know what success now means to you, and also a little bit about the impact that you're having on the various boards because, without the executive sponsorship, when it comes to all of these different profound subjects in the world of inclusivity, we have to have people that they believe it and they're willing to champion it, like you are.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, wow, what success. I think that's another one that certainly evolved over time. You know, if you had asked me that a few years back, you know I think it would be the you know that race mentality where it's like, hey, you know, have a good title, make good money. And you know, certainly that's important, right, we wanna have a good living and be able to have financial stability. I think that that's great.
Speaker 1:But now, when I look, is really more holistic. It's more about having harmony in life. You know, having a good you know good place from a personal level with you know, my family, the people I love, be healthy mentally and also physically and certainly as well from a work perspective, of course. You know, deliver a good job, good performance and be a good inspiration. I mean, I'm just about to turn 44. So I still have many years I had, hopefully, and be able to still do a lot professionally. But also I came to a point where I wanna help as many people as possible. So, from a professional side, just help, mentoring, help facilitating introductions, you know anything you can do to hopefully pay it forward and to your point, the same way that people gave me opportunities, believe in me I wanna make sure that I do the same, and it's very rewarding when you see that and use a big sense of success. I don't know, I mean, has it evolved as well to you over time or has been kind of status quo, your take on success?
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. You're like interviewing me now, I'll see, I love that. Has success evolved for me? Every time I think, yeah, absolutely, I think absolutely, I think you do to your point. You have some of those consistencies where actually you realize you know it's great to have stability when it comes to financials, in particular for me, having had baby Peter, who's now 15 months old you realize hang on a moment, this is not just about how hard can I run at this. You know I did it in two years of business. I didn't pay myself salary, and you know, because I believed in the mission of everything that we were doing.
Speaker 2:And so I think there are some of the practical sides of success and what that means, and, of course, you know, I guess, the classic achievement roles, et cetera. But when it really comes down to it, and when you lose someone that you love so very much, that you have looked up to all of your life and Frankly, I feel I'm still in denial about a lot of it I haven't quite adjusted it. I'm seeing him talking to him all of the time, but it's, yeah, memento mori. My new favourite expression is you could die tomorrow, and so actually, what are you going to remember when you're on your deathbed without being too philosophical?
Speaker 2:Actually it's no. It's your loved ones, it's your family and having some sense of a deeper connection, of purpose. And when you lose those connections can't remember the name of the book now, but lost connections by Johan, I'm afraid I can't remember his last name, but I was reading about this and losing those connections at times in life have been the really difficult places where I think I struggle. And so reconnecting with loved ones, realising that if I've just sent that one email is not going to be something that I'm worrying about when I'm on my deathbed so yeah, success is love, yeah there you go.
Speaker 1:That's beautiful. Success is love. That's great.
Speaker 2:I feel like we should be meditating right now, Caesar.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've gone into another zone because when we first started speaking, both came on to the call and we're like oh, so busy, so much stuff to be going on with work, the juggle, etc. But it was like the book by Daniel Coleman, I think, thinking about it and actually having those moments where you are reconnecting and these are the things I love. I love reconnecting with people I admire and slowing down for a moment because I say, well, we just don't have enough time to think, let alone do my counsellor to me once. Be a person being, not doing. You are a human being, not a human doing, and I can't really like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's a great call out because it's so easy to get caught up on. There's so much things we can do in a day and you can keep working right until whenever, and sometimes it's good to your point. Just make sure that you're recharging, that you're taking care of yourself, that you take time to appreciate and that allows you to be more productive and healthier. For sure, that's a great point.
Speaker 2:So before we wrap up, I'd love to ask you a couple of lightning round questions. If I'm a, I've obviously asked you about what success means to you. But what does diversity, inclusion, belonging, equity, culture mean to you, because you do have a fascinating cultural background as well?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:I think in a simple way.
Speaker 1:I just think generally speaking, embracing others, acceptance, to your point earlier. Diversity means it can be so different, so many people, but I think you know whatever you think about, you know different socioeconomics, race, backgrounds, experiences. I think just having that, being able to, you know, accept others for who they are and I'm a big believer that how I come from and try to do that, is really the assumption that people are good, people want to do what's right and, you know, sometimes it's hard to understand when others don't have the same view as you do. But also, to our discussion, right, the experiences in your life shape who you are, so they may have gone through something that you know wired and help them bring to whatever or whomever they are. And so to me, yeah, that's what it means and I think the more acceptance, the more openness we have, that's going to lead to better understanding and, you know, allow more inclusion, more equity to happen.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, that's my take and finally, if you could talk to your 12 year old self, what might you say?
Speaker 1:Yeah, be kind to yourself and don't take things too seriously. You know, just enjoy and do your best.
Speaker 2:Yeah, lisa, it's been an absolute joy having you on the show.
Speaker 2:My favourite comment was that last one that you just said, because it reminds me of what my dad would say as long as you try your best, darling, nothing else matters ultimately. None of us are perfect. We're all fallible and you know a whole number of things that I've learned from this podcast and I hope others take away as well, are, you know, the power of vulnerability, the power of humanity, simple things like kindness when you do not know what someone might be going through, trying our very best not to judge a book by its cover, because we can look at social media, we can look at people that we think have got it all and actually what is having it all? Yeah, I love it's family and you know your path to recovery. Your path through your personal life and your career, I think, are truly, you know, an inspiration for many, and really it's without in the absence of role models, understanding real models who have been there, done that, like yourself, are absolutely critical if we're going to build a better future for our other new generations of leaders coming through.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, sure, so that's awesome.
Speaker 1:Thank you, it was an honour and really enjoyed the chat.
Speaker 2:Caesar, thank you. My name is Leila Mackenzie-Delis, founder and CEO of Dialglobal. You've been listening to the wonderful Caesar, one of IHG. If you've been affected by any of the subjects we covered today in the podcast, please make sure you do reach out and get help, or reach out to one of the team on myself, even Caesar himself. Do visit us on Apple, spotify or your favourite podcast subscribe. Do give us a little like and a review, if you'd be so kind, and you can find that podcast at wwwdalglobalorg. Forward slash podcast. See you again very soon.