The Scalability Code

Keep It Tight At The Corners: Vision, Focus, and Fast Cars With Mike Zappone

• Matt Haney • Season 1 • Episode 20

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At 19 years old, Mike Zappone bought his first limousine with no money down and no business plan—just a passion for cars and a hunger to build something of his own. Thirty-three years later, he sold his multimillion-dollar transportation company and discovered a new gear in life as a professional EOS Implementer.

In this episode, Mike and Matt explore the parallels between racing and entrepreneurship: staying focused through the corners, keeping your vision clear, and knowing when to hit the brakes. Mike shares how he scaled his company from one blue Cadillac limo to a nationwide network serving 650 cities, the lessons he learned from a near-fatal motorcycle accident, and why most visionary leaders struggle to communicate the vision that’s crystal clear in their own heads.

If you’ve ever wrestled with shiny-object syndrome, hit a wall with focus, or needed a reminder that humility and gratitude are part of growth, this one’s for you.

CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction
00:21 Welcome
01:28 Background
04:40 How To Get Business
14:50 Your Last Session
17:50 Communication Is Key
20:20 Kolbe Test
26:28 Car Obsession
31:36 Business Owner Struggles
34:14 Conclusion

Traction by Gino Wickman: https://www.eosworldwide.com/traction-book
Mike’s EOS Webpage: https://www.eosworldwide.com/mike-zappone
Connect with Mike on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelzappone/
Email Mike: mike.zappone@eosworldwide.com

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Welcome to The Scalability Code, the podcast that helps you get out of the sh*t show and start growing your business. A few times each month, you'll hear stories and commentary from visionary entrepreneurs, EOS implementers, and fractional COOs about how they've taken businesses to Level 10. And now for your host, Matt Haney.

Matt Haney:

Alright guys, thanks for joining us again today for another episode of The Scalability Code. I'm your host, Matt Haney, here with my new Italian friend, Mike Zoni. Mike,

Mike Zappone:

how

Matt Haney:

that's the best Italian I can get. It's probably the most cheesy and cliche, but, uh, it's all I got. So, Mike, thanks for joining us.

Mike Zappone:

Oh, thanks for having me on. I appreciate it.

Matt Haney:

Awesome, man. Well, what we do today is talk a little bit about our background. We talk about our current businesses, we talk about EOS, we talk about challenges that we've seen in businesses with the goal of just, uh, hopefully being relatable to some of the people that are watching us. So, as we always do, uh, it's, it's important to go back and understand how you got to where you are currently. and. As I tell everyone, spend a minute or two longer than you normally do, because it's nice to know the whole backstory. If, if we, we are always so accustomed to having to rush through our introduction because we've gotta get to what we're doing. This is actually the chance to spend a little bit more time. So take it back as far as you want, and tell us kind of your entrepreneurial journey as it started and get us to where you are today.

Mike Zappone:

So, yeah, it goes back pretty far. I started my first company when I was 19 years old. I actually ran that company for 33 years.

Matt Haney:

Holy cow.

Mike Zappone:

yeah, so it wasn't like this little, you know, teenage business. It was my mainstream income. So, uh, really interesting to be a kid running a business, you know, learning everything, you know, school of hard knocks. it was in the ground transportation in the limousine industry, back in 1988. Yeah, so very cool.

Matt Haney:

very cool. So take it back. You started at 19, you were like, I got this terrible idea. That might be a decent one.

Mike Zappone:

yes. Try to line up my passion of, of cars and, you know, how cool would it be to have a limousine when you're 19 years old, right? So that was, uh, that was really how my stupid idea started out.

Matt Haney:

That's so great.

Mike Zappone:

it worked.

Matt Haney:

you know what I always think of when I think of the word limousine? I think of, one of the opening scenes of Dumb and Dumber with Jim Carrey. Do you remember that scene?

Mike Zappone:

I do. I

Matt Haney:

driver. That's

Mike Zappone:

And he jumps through the back.

Matt Haney:

in the back and he rolls the window down. Hey, so that's what I think of limousines. Obviously there's much nicer limousines and today they've graduated into the limousine is now the sprinter bus, but so, so you had this idea, I wanna know how you got the first limousine at 19 years old. I wanna know what year it was, what color it was,

Mike Zappone:

Oh

Matt Haney:

how you decided I'm gonna pull this thing together.

Mike Zappone:

So I was a pretty ambitious kid. I, I knew I wanted to do something. I was actually working at a deli, um, and the, the owner of the deli had me on this wild goose chase. He was going to, we were gonna open another store together. So he had me looking at stores all over, all over the place, and he was just never gonna pull the trigger. Uh, still one of my very dear friends. As I left the deli, uh, one of the delis I was looking at, there was a guy outside that had a limousine, turned out to be a friend of my father's, and it was this 1983 Cadillac, and it was like blue with purple tinted windows. The most hideous sounding car ever. So I bought that car, um, for$7,000, of which I had zero. And my parents, uh, contributed zero, by the way. So I took a loan out for the, for the full amount after begging and pleading with the bank to, to let me borrow money, uh, which, which they did. And so, um, yeah, that's how I, that's how I got the start, which was, which was pretty funny. So that, that car, uh, you know, was, hideous and terrible, but it, it, it caught me off the ground.

Matt Haney:

That's so awesome.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah.

Matt Haney:

That is such a, such a great, uh, great story that I love. I have to tell you, I have a confession to make. I am behind the scenes actually Googling a 1983 Cadillac Fleetwood Limousine because I, I can't help myself. Um, I need to see if this is what it looked like back in 1983 to have a limo. Is this it?

Mike Zappone:

that, that actually could be my car. Yeah, that's

Matt Haney:

That's so awesome. That is such a really cool classic. This is on Bring a trailer. We're not gonna need to get, they only want 15 five for it.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah.

Matt Haney:

for 15 five. Mike, you, you have an opportunity to get back in the game.

Mike Zappone:

To start all over again,

Matt Haney:

You could do it. It could be you. Back to you.

Mike Zappone:

I should have hung onto that car. I could have doubled my money, like it only taken 35 years. Yeah.

Matt Haney:

you, how do you get business? You go, you go knock doors and grind it out.

Mike Zappone:

I was just boots on the ground. I went to the grocery store, put up little flyers, you know, you want a trip to New York City? And, and the interesting thing, I knew nothing. I've never, you know, we, I grew up in the Hudson Valley region of New York, which is about an hour north of New York City. Never been to one of the airports, never been to New York City. My first time in New York City was when I had clients in the back of a limo.

Matt Haney:

That is so good

Mike Zappone:

yeah, it was really an, an interesting,

Matt Haney:

no clue. There was no GPS. There was, you were dealing with paper maps and maybe a, uh, uh, what is to Thomas guide or whatever where you got the grid and your

Mike Zappone:

Yeah, you're kind of plotting it out. Cell phones were, were not even, I didn't even know if cell phones were a big deal back then, or even around.

Matt Haney:

they were, they were bag phones back then.

Mike Zappone:

So it was, uh, yeah, really interesting. So, so that naturally evolved into the wedding industry. So we, you know, ended up doubling down, got into the white stretch Lincoln limousines and the Rolls Royces, and we did all of this and the business was going really well, and we hit a ceiling and I'm like, you know, geez, now, you know, I couldn't scale beyond where I was. We, we owned the market. it was great,

Matt Haney:

many cars did you have? Do you remember at your

Mike Zappone:

So at the time it was like 16 limos and we had a, you know, rolls Royce and, we were a big deal for this Hudson Valley market we were in back then. But it couldn't grow anything beyond that. And so the cars would sit all week long. They'd only be used on the weekend. And so the profitability was down. It was very seasonal, and so it was not a sustainable model. so I reinvented it myself, and we went into the corporate transportation, so we got rid of. All the white limos one at a time. And we replaced those with, you know, sedans and we started getting into sedan and SUV business. And so, from the nineties we, we grew that and that was a, a really big deal where we were doing, you know, corporate work. And that was scalable because we, you know, we, we wouldn't run outta clients and they were using us Monday through Friday. Um. And then, uh, you know, that got to a point where motor coaches were the next thing. And so now you needed to get into the bus business. And those are pretty expensive, pieces of equipment. And so to buy a a half a million dollar bus was, was a, a real scary thing to do.

Matt Haney:

Yeah, then you gotta maintain it and then you got a place to park it. Then you gotta put tires and brakes on it and ah,

Mike Zappone:

Oh my goodness. Yeah, there, there's, you know, I've, I'm a, I'm a bit of a car guy. I love, I love cars and so, uh, some of the, uh, more expensive cars that I've had that were expensive to maintain, uh, the bus made them look like they were very affordable. So

Matt Haney:

yeah,

Mike Zappone:

guys are not afraid to

Matt Haney:

brakes and calipers on a bus might be a little different than an oil chains on a, on a Lincoln. Uh, okay. So you got into the big bus game and were they. Charters or were they custom, like kind of what was the bus world like?

Mike Zappone:

It was like charter buses. So basically, you know, forward facing, we did, you know, the, the black buses with the black leather seats. And so they were pretty fancy compared to your traditional, you know, getting your white bus with the multicolored seats. So it was a little bit more of an executive level service. Um, and that evolved into. A brokerage business where, you know, my client that was traveling with me in, in the New York Hudson Valley market would say, Hey, who do you know in Chicago? And we, I had a friend from the shows and we started sending work to them and that ended up where we were doing work, you know, in, we were servicing 650 cities at the time. So it was a pretty neat, you know, model for us to be able to broker out and, and ironically. That segment of our business was the most valuable. Uh, at the end when we exit. When I exited. That was the

Matt Haney:

Really the, the, the referral piece. I mean, you didn't have like written agreements with the guy in Kansas City?

Mike Zappone:

Nothing. Yeah. It was so, that was the part that people were excited about. And so, uh. that was my journey. And then along the way, you know, I say I have business a, DDI tried commercial real estate. I opened up restaurants, I opened up car washes. I had an auto dealership. I, I've done everything and had a couple of successes, which were fortunate and some train wrecks that I still have the scars from. so that was

Matt Haney:

well those are what makes you but the best entrepreneurs, the failures. so you sold your business. What year do you remember?

Mike Zappone:

I do. It was 2021. Uh, I sold the

Matt Haney:

And who was the acquirer or the type, I mean, you have, tell me who, but like what type of person was

Mike Zappone:

It was, it was a family business. It was a private equity backed family business. And so, uh, yeah, they, acquired us

Matt Haney:

And what did your fleet look like at the time? Was

Mike Zappone:

So it was coming outta COVID. So it was really a, it was a rebuild time. So at the time, you know, we, our fleet sat for a year and then all of a sudden things just went crazy. And so that's where the multiples were up in our business. And so, uh, it was a perfect time to, to exit. I, we were thinking about an exit, but, the stars aligned. I was 53 at the time, did the typical thing, right? It took a year off. My wife and I traveled all over the place, you know, and it was great. And. Then it was like, now what? You know, I'm, I'm bored out of my mind. I, I have a lot of energy. I, I wanted to open another company. And so the debates were going back and forth on what, you know, what we were gonna do, what I'm gonna open, you know, what's our next step. And, uh, I found out about a OSI read the book, I was instantly hooked. I'm like, my goodness, why didn't I know this 30

Matt Haney:

Where have I been for 30 years?

Mike Zappone:

Yeah, that would've changed. It would've changed so much pressure in my life. And so then I found the opportunity to be an OS implementer, and that's like, you know, I'm like, my goodness, this is the best. I don't have, you know, there's, there's no employees kind of, you know, I don't have grandchildren, but I imagine it's like being, you know, I get to go in and, you know, all the excitement and you know, kind of watch and Yeah. And I get to, I get to leave at the end of the day. Yeah. And it really

Matt Haney:

when you leave at the end of the day, that's when they bring in a fractional integrator like

Mike Zappone:

Yes, yes.

Matt Haney:

because they come back and they're like, oh my God, that was such a great session. Um. How are we gonna make this stick? How are we gonna continue to follow this through? What does accountability look like? I'm just a business entrepreneur. I don't want to, I want the benefits of this, but I don't want the headaches of it. And then I quietly raise my hand and say, this is exactly what we get to do. So I hear you. It's, it's that sending that grandchild off to back to the parents, is the best day for us because that's where we love jumping in. But I want to finish a thought here. So. You were, um, 2021. So that means you've been an implementer. Do you remember what your implementer class was, what year you were done? I mean, you're either on like year three, four or five, depending

Mike Zappone:

no, actually I'm just coming into my second year, so

Matt Haney:

in your second year. Okay,

Mike Zappone:

yeah. Yeah.

Matt Haney:

And how has it been, like, how's that entrepreneurial journey been?

Mike Zappone:

So it's, it's really interesting. I, I was used to selling, very much used to having a team and used to selling to corporate America marketing on a different scale. And, and so now I'm marketing myself as an individual brand, which is really neat. I'm, I've not done it, so I feel like I'm learning all over

Matt Haney:

Well, you haven't done it in 30 plus years.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah, exactly. I need to go back to the supermarket and start putting those flyers up. But it's, uh, it'll work then it'll, it'll work again. But it's, it's interesting. It's, you know, it's humbling and, uh, you know, it's exci so it's both exciting and aggravating at the same time.'cause, uh, having. Been successful. And I think, I dunno if every entrepreneur thinks this, if you come off one success, of course you're gonna kill it on the next one. And so when you have a slow start, it, it's, you know, it really, it really humbles you. I did have a little setback. I don't wanna get too much on a, I had a severe motorcycle accident, uh, in September of last year that, you know, put me in a trauma center for a few weeks in a wheelchair for a few months. So, broke an awful lot of things. So that was a setback in my, in my

Matt Haney:

So you are, uh, you're, you're like 13, 14 months post-injury now.

Mike Zappone:

Yes, absolutely. Yeah. Miracle

Matt Haney:

And how is your recovery going? How's it, how's the

Mike Zappone:

Yeah, I just, you know, it's hard to not be filled with gratitude. When I, uh, when I, you know, I broke, uh, my shoulder, my back, you know, both ribs, uh, six ribs and my pelvis ankles. I broke also, or ulcer of bones, but they didn't think I was gonna be able to walk. And so, uh, you know, it's really, uh, humbling. I, I can walk, I'm, I'm as normal as I was before the accident, so it's hard to not have gratitude. Uh, so the recovery in that case is, is, is fairly, uh, well. Still a little pain here and there, but you know,

Matt Haney:

con congratulations for, for just waking up and grinding through and, and dealing with it, and also for the outlook of just humility and gratitude. I think it's, you know, we, uh, we live in a crazy, crazy world and a crazy United States today and. You know, uh, government shutdowns and all sorts of stuff, and people, and I share your sentiments of, gratitude because, every day I'm grateful I get to get up and do what I do. I absolutely love the fact that I've gotten to build my career where it is. and a ton of fun. well, let's talk a little bit about some of your clients and some of the, uh, the issues that you guys are seeing in session rooms. so, um, well hold on. Before we do that, I want to, I want to go back to something you mentioned earlier. You said, you know, it's, as a formerly former successful entrepreneur, how can I not be successful in this journey? And my story is very similar in the sense that I was successful in a construction services company and. I ended up selling my portion of the business to my business partner, who's still a very good friend of mine. And, and I was, all high and mighty on the fact that I had done something well and here I am. And then I immediately turned around and invested in a, a startup as business and failed. And I was like, what the hell am I doing? This is not what I want to be doing. I was doing it just to be, you know, self-fulfilled, arrogant, whatever you want to do. But it got me to my journey for the last eight years, which is realizing that I'm my best next to a visionary business owner. I'm the person that loves standing next to that. Business owner that's figuring out what they want to do and how they want to get there and what the steps look like, et cetera. So that failure brought me to where success came in, this newest part of my entrepreneurial journey. So you, you hit that on the head and it, it triggered me to, to say that. So, interesting.

Mike Zappone:

it is. It's and, and humbling, right? It's like,

Matt Haney:

yeah,

Mike Zappone:

I, how did I, how did this happen? But, um, and again, like you, you said earlier, you learn your best lessons when you're, uh, you know, when you're coming off of a, of a spectacular crash.

Matt Haney:

Yeah, that's exactly right. Pun, pun and pun intended. Literal and figurative with you, I'm sure. Um, well, let's, let's jump in. What, what, um, you know, give, give us think back. This is what I like to do. Think back to your last session. How long ago was that roughly? Do

Mike Zappone:

Actually, it was just, it was just last week, so

Matt Haney:

That's perfect. So you'll be fresh on

Mike Zappone:

fresh in my.

Matt Haney:

set up the client, tell us what they are, what they're doing, and then one of the issues that arise, um, in, in the session room that you guys were able to sort of navigate through.

Mike Zappone:

Okay, so they're a law firm. And so, uh, I, I love working with, uh, with lawyers who are just, uh, it's an interesting dynamic and, you know, I think they're really having a difficult time. And I know we went through the whole process. They're, they're about, uh, this is their second quarterly that we've run. Um, so they're, they're fairly new in the journey, but still, struggling to clarify the vision. and I find that to be such an interesting, scenario where. As an entrepreneur, you always think like the vision's so clear in your head, you know, you see it as vivid. Yeah. So vivid getting it on paper and then getting the team to align around it, and then being able to communicate that out. it's, it's a process. And so, uh, I think what we did in, in this last session was we really just. Clarify that vision that's been in the, in the, you know, in the visionary's head, and we're able to, to define it a little bit better, and now they have a, a path forward to where they're going. But, um, I didn't think that would be the hardest part of getting a business owner to, uh, you know, usually

Matt Haney:

What did you think it would be? Not that, not that I would've thought differently, but I'm just curious.

Mike Zappone:

So I would, I would've thought it would've been like processes and, you know, and, and, and, and ironically again, the people, maybe because I'm dealing with a lot of professional services, they're, they're pretty good at their processes. And so, uh, that that component works. I find that, you know, the, the focus, the accountability and communication. Are the three things and communication is, again, it's just one of those scenarios. I think Gino said it really well where the thump thump, you know, scenario where, you know, people are tapping a song on the table and the person across'em has no idea. They just hear thump, thump and, and so, um, and then, you know. As having been an entrepreneur, I know what it's like. You know, I hired my first employee because it was overwhelming. I needed help. Right? So you just, you're, you're on fire, you bring somebody in to help you out. I don't know how I'm holding that person accountable. I'm just trying to put out a fire. And so, you know, that turns into a hundred employees. It doesn't change as you scale, it just becomes a bigger fire, right?

Matt Haney:

It mag it, it multiplies. You're adding more fuel to it.

matt-haney_2_02-06-2025_192447:

You are listening to the Scalability Code. I'm your host, Matt Haney, founder of Sinclair Ventures, and we help visionary entrepreneurs like you get out of the shit show and focus on growing your business. We offer fractional COO and leadership coaching services that free up that brain of yours to focus on what's next. Learn more about us at SinclairVentures. com. Now back to it.

Matt Haney:

No, you, you said something that I don't think comes up enough. but it's that communication piece. and, and going back to your point of truly distilling what the vision is, I, I think every single time. The visionary has an idea of what the vision is, but they don't quite know. And if there's one common theme I see all the time with visionaries who are, are, um, vulnerable and, and humble is they say, everyone looks to me to have the answer. Like, I hired these people, they want me to come up with the answer. I don't fucking know the answer. Like, I'm just trying to figure this out. I don't know. So to your point, having them hammer down into the vision and really spending the time to get that clearly articulated and written down. As well as your ideal customer profile, as well as your go to market strategy, it can change. But let's get it written first and, and continue to work against it and ask the same question over and over again and say, so what I'm hearing is that this is our ICP and this is our GTM. Yes. This is our vision. Yes. Okay. Let's keep focused on that. Um, but you're right. It's one of those things, the vision, you would think you're a visionary business owner. Of course you can articulate what it is. No, They're flying the plane while they're building it. figuratively, but it's something that I see quite regularly. And then I'm gonna tag onto the communication piece. I read this article, which if you remind me, I'll send it to you, or I shared it on my LinkedIn page recently. That's about a, basically a superpower of facilitation and I think that. Uh, implementers specifically, and I would argue that fractional integrators as well have a unique ability to integrate and, facilitate, right? And be able to bring that cross-departmental communication. I am a translator. Most of my business is translating what the visionary said to what I'm actually hearing is what I do. So it's like, okay, they said this and I said, yeah, they said that they did. That's exactly what they said, but. They actually meant this. Oh, okay, good.'cause I heard that. And it's like, yeah, but they're saying it the way they know how to say it, not the way that's relatable to the rest of us spending that time translating.

Mike Zappone:

In incredible, isn't it? And especially if you have a visionary and a high fact finder, uh, you know, in the room and, and trying to get them to line up and that, that exact conversation, you know, I've heard it a million times. You need to be a translator in the room to say, you know. This person needs all of the details and you just need to give them the 30,000 foot view. So we, we have to come up with some sort of a connection to get you to understand A and b.

Matt Haney:

Are you a a Kolby fan? Do you use the Kolby test?

Mike Zappone:

I, I am. And you know, I was a little skeptical of it to, to be honest, when I first, uh, first took the test, I'm like, you know, there's a million of these. My, my wife has a degree in forensic psychology, so I'd, I'd kind of heard it and been around and I was like, yeah, whatever. And, and, um, we took the Colby test in, in bootcamp, one of my, uh, my co uh, It was really interesting when I, when I read with Kobe. And we were polar opposite. I was able, we were able to have great conversations and so I was able to tailor what I was saying to him and vice versa. And actually he just texted me about an hour ago. Ironically, we're close friends, where initially I was like, man, I just, this guy's, he's not one of my people. He just kind of rubbed me the wrong way I thought, and, and we just needed to be able to come up with it. So I, I was not a fan of Kolby and I am now.

Matt Haney:

Yeah. No, it's fascinating isn't it, that you're like, oh, okay. what do you think my kby is? Are you familiar enough with the numbers?

Mike Zappone:

I'm, I'm not intimately familiar to say it, but I would say that, I would say you're like a, I'm gonna guess, I'll tell you mine, and I think we're probably close. I'm, I'm 5 4, 8 3. Um, so I would

Matt Haney:

I'm, I'm, my last one was 6 8 3 5.

Mike Zappone:

okay.

Matt Haney:

So I highly, um, I'm more, I'm, I err more on the visionary side. then I do anything else. And that makes it a little challenging as a, as an integrator. But I will say it allows me to facilitate well and, and be communicative. fact finding is not something I generally love, but the integration piece is always fun for me too. So that's always nice. So when I have people that understand K or at least a no, the, they've become, and Kby is DA dozen in, in one sense of the word. I do think that in our world, in the US world. being aligned with Kolby benefits us more.'cause it's easier to actually communicate with those people that are familiar. But I have used Culture Index very successfully. I've used predictive Index very successfully. But I do think that having one of these assessment tools in your repertoire. is impactful because now with ai, one of my favorite things to do is to dump two assessments into AI and ask AI to predict what's happening and how would this person work together and what are all the things, and you know what it is. Really, really cool how it works.

Mike Zappone:

That is

Matt Haney:

so using that, is, is fun and you can see it and it's like, oh, I had no idea. And it's like, well, is this accurate? Yeah, it's really accurate. Okay. Not everything is perfect, but if we at least use it, then we'll, we're able to know how to communicate more effectively with somebody on our team. so anyway, that's my experience with some of these assessments.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah, and I think it's funny, you know, with EOS using, you know, use one language, use one operating system. And so I think, you know, having Kobe as a, you know, as a tool is just, uh, you know, if they choose to use something else, that's fine, but, uh, having it consistent is just really wonderful. You know, just jumping back to the, the, the last two nineties that I did, they were both, Really concerned about time. And so I think it's wonderful, uh, to have somebody like you in, in, in the community that actually will go in and help do the lift. And there's, there's this fear of like, I love this. I know I need it. I just, I'm at capacity. I can't do it. And, and being able to say, Hey, there's help out there for you. So thank you for, for being a

Matt Haney:

I'm helping a couple EOIs that are, writing a book, and I think it might be added to the EOS library at some point. But one of our, the book I think is essentially around making EOS stick and how do we make it sticky? and then how do we get it one level down leadership team. Most people high functioning. Professionals in some capacity. They're interested in accountability. They see the value in tracking and metrics and la la, la, right? But one level down is a level that we are trusting the leadership team to be good at facilitation and integration. Maybe they are, maybe they're not. But, um, I think having a, a way to keep it sticky is really one of the things that. Is easy to just assume is happening. and, and, and people understandably are embarrassed if it's not sticking or they feel like, oh, I should be, I should know how to do this. I should be doing this. But our scorecard hasn't been touched in six weeks and we don't have milestones in our rocks, and I'm not clearly identifying what the hell an issue is. And, and, and, and, and, um, and it doesn't. It's, it's not, um, hard to do. It is hard to implement and get it to stick. And having had 20 different engagements over the last eight years and more with our team, it becomes second nature to us as experienced operators on EOS. But we need to assume that the person on the other side of the table or the other other computer screen across from us doesn't quite know how to get it to stick all the time.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah. And, and I think that people are, are pretty generous with themselves as far as, you know. You don't see if, if you saw the problem you would've fixed it. If you recognize it, it's

Matt Haney:

Exactly. Nobody is like, God, that's a problem. I can't wait to not touch that. No, they, they want to, they, they genuinely want to get it done.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah, and I use the analogy when, you know, when you go on vacation, you come home and you're looking at the landscaping at your house, and you're like, oh, geez, I'd, I'd never realized that this needs to be redone. You know, you see it every day, and, and it's just, it's just part of, you know, you, you ignore it. And so when I come in or when you come in, there's, you're a fresh set of eyes on it and you're gonna, you're gonna call those things out.

Matt Haney:

Oh, the dumb new guy. How often is it fun? You get to be the dumb new guy. Um, I love that. I'm like, I'm gonna have to ask you a question'cause I really don't know and it's like I probably have already formed the answer in my head, but I'm gonna see if I can get them to say it. And, and that's just, it's that outsider's perspective. We're not special. we're just not walking around the business with the business swamping us in the face every day. Um, so it does give a, a true outsider's perspective.

Mike Zappone:

absolutely.

Matt Haney:

let's see, what else should we talk about? Um, you mentioned it and I took, it took every bone in my body to not take the bait, but I'm gonna take the bait this time. Tell me about the cars. Tell me about, uh, the journey and tell me where you are today with your, with your obsession.

Mike Zappone:

So it's, it's, it's, uh, it's a sickness as, as, as my wife calls it. So I, I love cars. I've, I've always loved cars. so I started, uh, I raced cars early on, so I was racing in the s, you know, the American sedan class. And I was up by Lime Rock Park, which is in Connecticut. And at the time I was getting lapped by a Mazda Miata. which was very, I had all the horsepower in the world, right? And this little car was just, you know, running circles around me. Uh, that led me into getting into lotuses and some of the lightweight, you know, more nimble, uh, sports cars. And I, I just, I love every kinda car. My favorite cars are generally now the underpowered, uh, nimble cars. I love the Mini Coopers. I love the, the Mazda Miata. My son actually raced, uh, Mazda Miatas for a while, uh, after he got Man of the Go-Karting. So he got, he got bit by that bug as well. You know, and as far as other, other vehicles, I just, I, I love a car striking emotion for me. I look at a beautiful car. If you see a Ferrari, you see a well designed car. They're just, it's just gorgeous.

Matt Haney:

No, you're, you're exactly right. I'm, I'm in the background, uh, over here trying to, trying to pull up some, I, I too, went through the car phase. my most fun, I took a. I took an early four door Jeep, um, and put an LS three in it, which was a ton of fun. Um, and got it, got it, made it up to a 10 speed transmission and it was, you know, almost 500 pounds of torque to the rear axle. And it was. Incredibly fun and, and dangerous at the same time. My kids still tell the story about how much fun it was. and then I ended up transitioning that into a, a 65 Corvette that I swapped over into, a stroker, was it 3 43 stroker? I took the original matching motor and transmission. Set it on the shelf and, and swapped out a, a fuel injected, dependable, reliable powertrain. and that was a ton of fun'cause it was a convertible with the side pipes and the spinoff wheels, all this stuff. But I didn't realize,'cause I was young dung and stupid that in the state of Texas in the summer. Driving a convertible is absolutely miserable. So I was like, wait, I can only drive this thing during the winter because I get so hot. You sit down at a stoplight in Texas in July, it's a hundred degrees outside, you're running a, you know, high performance engine in here, and it's, you're hot is you're just sweating your ass off. So, uh, Yeah. you're just finger melting. And my wife's like, why aren't you driving that car that you spent all this money to build? And I said. It's too damn hot. She's like, well, get rid of it. Get onto something else. So I love cars. I'm in the middle of, you know, I've kind of gone the simplistic way. Now I just have a Tahoe out front that I love, but I'm like, maybe I'll get into something else. So I'm kind of thinking about maybe an air cooled Porsche, maybe, I don't

Mike Zappone:

those are cool. I, I did a frame off restoration on a 69 Corvette convertible.

Matt Haney:

Oh, have fun with three 50 was probably a big block engine. Yeah.

Mike Zappone:

Big. Yeah. It was a beautiful, beautiful car. And I finished it, drove it, hated the way it drove and sold the car. It was, uh,

Matt Haney:

Though they're not fun to drive. Yeah. And then the, the, the, that version has the longest nose of any car you'd ever seen. It's like they, they could have put so much more under the hood with that big monster hood.

Mike Zappone:

And then you hit the brakes and you have no idea which way it's gonna go. It's, yeah, it's like, could be left, could be right. It might stop. We don't know.

Matt Haney:

That's so awesome. Uh, so what do you have now? What's out there?

Mike Zappone:

So I'm the Mazdas. I, I really like the, uh, the Mazdas are great track day cars. And so my son, uh, went from Go-karting and he wanted to get into cars and so we were gonna go open Wheeler or sports car, and Mazda had a teen program, so he was about. 12, 13 years old, got him into a Mazda, uh, MX five and started racing that series. Um, I was so impressed with these little cars. I drove one and I'm like, this is it. It just requires so much of the driver to perform. They're not fast in any way, shape or form. You have to extract every ounce of performance of it. So, and that kind of. Led into the, the lotuses and all the other lightweight handling cars that I have. So I, I really like the Mazda, but I still like all of the Italian cars. And, uh, of course, you know that you can't beat the Corvettes and some of the old

Matt Haney:

So what are you able to get from a horsepower perspective out of that, outta that Mazda?

Mike Zappone:

like 200 and something. It's not,

Matt Haney:

Yeah, but it's torque, right? I mean, it'll move for a little car,

Mike Zappone:

I if you, it's, it's, it's a handling car. It's like a windup car. So as, as you are, yeah. So on. When I'm on, I'm doing an HPD, like a high performance driving event. if there's a new C eight Corvette, I can usually catch them, in the corners, pass'em through the back, and then they'll catch me back on the strai. And so it's just a lot of fun to be able to pass a, you know, a four or 500 horsepower car in my little

Matt Haney:

yeah. There's nothing more humbling for a man with an ego getting past, bam, yada.

Mike Zappone:

I think I'm paying it back'cause that happened to me back in the eighties, so.

Matt Haney:

Oh, that's so funny. Well, um, let's let, let's think about a couple other things before we hop outta here. But, um, what, what are some of the, the struggles like that you're seeing business owners deal with? I know, um, like what are, what are some of the big, the big issues that come up?

Mike Zappone:

I, I think it's focus, I think generally, you know, a lot of, uh, the business owners that I deal with are, are, are visionary and they're always. They're always seeing things and, but, they're, they're chasing those shiny objects all the time. So we're gonna do another vision of this, do that. And I, I love how Gino put it, you're more likely to, to die of, uh, indigestion than you are of starvation. And it's just so true, you know, that, That you. know, Yeah, do what you do, do it well, you know, maximize it. You know, I, I have companies that are, you know, Hey, we're gonna expand. We're gonna do another office. I'm like, your, your current office is not even at capacity, you know, so, uh, they tend to worry about capacity issues that they don't have. They're always, you know, uh, chasing that, that next thing. So I think focus is a, and it's, it's a little boring too when you, when you say, Hey. Focus on your, on your path there, that that gets old. So that new, exciting thing is always around the corner. So I think that focus has been

Matt Haney:

The old shiny object syndrome is a, is a total, total thing.

Mike Zappone:

Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and it does, it really impacts, you know, when you're, you know, multiplicity, you're doing two things at once. You're, you're doing two things poorly. So just do the

Matt Haney:

I, I also find it, it, it, people lose a ton of credibility when they're just constantly, you know, turning from one way to the other. Um, and, but visionaries generally don't think about that.'cause there's, there's sometimes a common theme of. You know, you know, arrogance, fulfillment, narcissism, I think that word gets beat up. But I do think there's a lot of self focus on some of these visionaries. So keeping their focus on the business and letting us as accountability partners, keep them focused and is great. I mean, I just, I had this phone call this morning with. Um, one of my visionaries, after we got off RL 10, we immediately jumped onto a quick, just kind of debrief for one reason or another, and he said, man, I'm sure glad you've got those two or three things taken care of. Because I'm, he was off on the front of the business doing big deals and doing. Um, you know, closing deals and raising money, right? That's what he should be doing. And here I am on the background going, did we get the job description done? Who's handling the recruiter? Who's talking to them? How are we not overlapping? All the things that are tactical by nature that, um, keep us focused. So well,

Mike Zappone:

that's, that's the magic, right? That's rocket fuel right there. When you can line up, you know, line that up. That's what makes things happen.

Matt Haney:

That is what makes things happen. Mike. Well, hey, listen, this has been my pleasure, my pleasure to get to know you and, um. I wish you the best in your, your EOSI journey and also your race car journey. Um, and keep, keep that, keep that Miata tight in the corners because uh, that's, that's where it matters, right?

Mike Zappone:

absolutely. That's the only place it matters.

Matt Haney:

It's the only place it matters. Well, thanks again for joining us on the Scaleability code. Mike. It's my pleasure to have you and hope to see you online and, uh, lemme know if there's anything I ever I can ever do to help.

Mike Zappone:

Vice versa. Thank you so much.

Matt Haney:

All right, man. Take care.

Mike Zappone:

Take care. See you. Bye-bye. 20 Mike Zappone

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