Hollywood, Heartbreak and Hans Solo with Danielle Frank

Danielle Frank has lived a lot of lives — Hollywood publicist, luxury brand director, debut author, professional aunt — and she's here to tell you that none of the detours were mistakes. In this conversation, Danielle traces the thread from a type-A teenager in New York with a very specific life plan, through Miramax in its prime, a 50% pay cut that turned out to be the best decision she ever made, two serious relationships that taught her more about herself than any self-help book, and the moment she finally stopped waiting to feel ready and just... started writing.

We talk about the particular kind of confidence that only comes from walking away from things that don't fit. About choosing a life that's actually yours rather than the one you inherited as a blueprint. And about why, when her nieces and nephews wouldn't stop whining, she wrote a book about wine instead.

Funny, honest, and unexpectedly moving — this one's for anyone who's ever wondered if they took a wrong turn, and needed someone to tell them the map was always theirs to draw.

A Wine Lover's Guide to Parenting is available now.

BARNES & NOBLE
https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/a-wine-lovers-guide-to-parenting-danielle-
frank/1148414693?ean=9781967598069

AMAZON
https://a.co/d/abO3q7K

INSTAGRAM
https://www.instagram.com/createagreatstory/?hl=en

WEBSITE
www.daniellefrankauthor.com

LINKED IN:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/frankdanielle/

FACEBOOK:
https://www.facebook.com/danielle.frank.7583

 Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Unravelling: The Diary of a Midlife Mess.

If something resonated with you today, I’d love to hear your thoughts,  come join the conversation on Facebook and Instagram @theglowupguide_au or visit sharonwilkesburt.com
for more resources and support.

Don’t forget to subscribe and leave a review if you’re enjoying the journey so far!

Transcript

Good morning, Danielle, or good evening for you because you are coming to us live from California today. So that's very exciting. And it's like early in morning here in Perth. So welcome.

Danielle Frank (00:28.016)
Thank you. Thank you for having me. How is Thursday? Is there anything I need to know about Thursday? Because it's only Wednesday for me right now.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (00:33.334)
Anything you need to know about Thursday? Yeah, yeah. What you need to know about Thursday is that we've got a surprisingly dull and rainy day, which actually is quite lovely. I'm not going to complain about it because we don't get them very often. But Thursday so far is looking good. So I'm talking to you, so that's brilliant for me. So welcome to...

Danielle Frank (00:44.572)
you

Danielle Frank (00:49.852)
Oh, you're so kind. Yeah. Wrapping up Wednesday. Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (00:55.726)
Yeah, for sure. Enjoy. was great. Welcome to Unraveling the Diary of a Midlife Mess. Now, this podcast is based on the, based on two things, based on the fact that I had this teenage diary.

Danielle Frank (00:58.652)
I'm

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (01:11.47)
which I kept and I found when I was around about 40 and when I found my diary it was just brilliant and hilarious because as a 40 year old me I've created this teenager, this version that I thought I was and she was ever so sensible and really prim and my diary called me out on all of it which is an absolute hoot so that was delightful. So and then I didn't keep a diary for years and then I went back to it and when I was going through my own unraveling which was probably

let's call it perimenopause season, my diary or my journal became the kind of the sounding board for all of my crazy stuff. So that was kind of the unraveling part where the journal or diary comes into it. But I often meet women as they are today, but I'm so, but I'm always more interested in who was the woman that came before, who was like, you you became what you are today, but what was the journey for Matt? So.

On that premise, my first question to you is, if Danielle, I opened up your teenage diary, what would I have found inside? What or who would I have found inside that diary?

Danielle Frank (02:18.972)
I mean, if you cracked open my diary, I mean, there'd probably be some boy crazy stuff in there. But besides that, you know, you definitely would have met a girl with a plan, right? A checklist, plan of life. I was going to be a successful, I'll have a successful career in the entertainment industry. I was going to be married. I was going to have kids.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (02:27.502)
you

Danielle Frank (02:47.484)
Maybe a white picket fence. I don't know. I wasn't so traditional in that, you know, I saw everything as linear as, you know, my parents were divorced since I was one. So I didn't have that idealized vision of like the perfect marriage. I saw my dad remarried and had a very happy marriage. you know, I didn't see things completely conventional, but also because of that, I just knew, well, I want to have a successful marriage. I don't want to...

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (02:57.527)
Okay.

Danielle Frank (03:17.338)
go into it if it's obviously nobody goes into it saying that, you know, it's gonna be not be successful. But I just was like, I'm not gonna do it unless it's gonna be, you it's gonna have success. But you know, I'm very type A. you know, everything about me, was like, you know, there was a specific path forward. And, you know, that was gonna be my guiding force.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (03:21.74)
No, you're still on.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (03:36.429)
Yeah.

Yeah, when you said to me that you had listening to exactly what you're going, the word type A just screamed with big fashion lights above my head. Love that for you. So where were you at the time? Were you in California as a child? that where you grew up?

Danielle Frank (03:47.351)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (03:52.832)
No, I grew up in New York on the East Coast. Me being in California is part of the many twists and turns and pivots that my life took from what I would have written in my journal. Yeah, I grew up in the East Coast and so I thought I'd be in New York for the rest of my life. Yeah, fast forward, spoiler alert, I'm in Cali.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (04:13.386)
Yeah. So as that teenager, like who would I have found on your bedroom walls? Who are you crushing on at the time?

Danielle Frank (04:25.672)
God, I crushed on so many people. And like, I was such a TV kid as a youngster and like watching too many things that I mean, my, you know, single mom, she would work and like, I get it. She was young thirties with two kids, like wanting to get remarried. So she was, she always went out on a lot of dates. So I was not that we were home alone, but a babysitter didn't care that I was watching. I watched an extraordinarily like large amount of inappropriate shows that I shouldn't watch. Nothing like.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (04:47.406)
Mmm.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (04:53.831)
wow, okay!

Danielle Frank (04:54.598)
porn, but like I was really into Dallas and Falcon Crest at a young age. Yeah. And I was watching, you know, like all my children, One Life to Live, General Hospital, and I was obsessed with game shows. But I was crushing on Scott Baio from Happy Days. I, I loved Don Johnson and Miami Vice. I loved, when Silver Spoons came out, Ricky Schroeder. I

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (05:08.876)
Okay.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (05:13.601)
yeah, that was a decent crush. I had the same.

Yeah.

Danielle Frank (05:24.45)
sent him a picture of myself. Now, if you remember the Sassoon brand, the logo was this. I had a shirt like this and I had Jordache jeans with 20 different pockets. And I took a picture of myself, like, you know, kind of cute leaning and I sent it. I remember, I remember like nervous to ask my dad for like an extra five bucks in my allowance that week. Cause I want to join the Ricky Schroeder fan club. And I remember, you know,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (05:32.874)
Okay.

You

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (05:48.782)
That's brilliant.

Danielle Frank (05:50.564)
He gave me the money and I signed up and I sent him this picture and I was like, I'm definitely going to hear from Ricky Schroeder. Another spoiler alert, never got that ball.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (05:57.282)
Hahaha

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (06:01.88)
How rude, but you know what, he's probably got it in his own little journal for this very day. So you were saying you had this kind of very sort of clear idea of who you wanted to be and so what was that? What was that girl dreaming about?

Danielle Frank (06:09.315)
Danielle Frank (06:21.126)
Yeah, I I think because I watch so much content, so much TV, and then like my dad, I'd see him on the weekends and, you know, what's a man to do with his, I have an older sister, like his two daughters. So we always went to the movies. So I, you know, I just, love TV, film. I mean, you know, and there too, like this is why I'm part, like, I don't want to say tomboy. This is why like I'm a guy's girl.

I was watching Rambo at a very inappropriate young age and Rocky, you know, because he's wasn't taking me to like, you know, Disney movies, but it was great. I love all that stuff. love like, but yeah, so I just, I love the entertainment industry. So I knew I wanted to like, that was it. That was going to be my career. I was going to be famous. Maybe I was going to be an actress, but I was going to do something in entertainment and I was going to be big, famous and infamous.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (06:49.454)
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (07:13.014)
Yeah, it's you know, it's so interesting because obviously growing up in New York that would have been absolutely on your spectrum in the the fact that that could have been a reality for you because I remember kind of growing up in rural England and that would not have been on our like, you know, that's that was the stuff of fantasy but it's interesting also how your geography can affect, you know, what's what's in your world, what's possible in your world, I guess. But and it's interesting because I was brought up on things like the Godfather and

Danielle Frank (07:36.358)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (07:42.96)
and the same, Rocky, all of those, because my dad was really kind of into all those things. So we, you know, I don't remember there being too many, I suppose we did have kind of musicals, bits of sound and music and that sort of stuff. But yeah, it was lot of kind of, but I suppose the 80s was that really, wasn't there? There was a lot of kind of like, guy films. So yeah, same.

Danielle Frank (07:59.115)
I mean, I love it. That's why I love like, I mean, I love all content, but I love like the gritty, yeah, I love like the gritty, gory stuff, but I love it all. Love a good rom-com as well.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (08:06.251)
Yeah!

I'm just going to go have some a good story. For sure. So Danny, I'll take me into your twenties. Like, where were you? What were you chasing? And who did you think you were going to be?

Danielle Frank (08:25.596)
So this is really the defining, a very defining chapter in my life. I studied abroad in college, 20, turned 21 in Florence, Italy. And I've always just been very curious about the world. And my dad has just, my dad definitely was a big inspiration. He started from nothing, worked his way up and he just.

I saw how he just created a life for himself, exposing himself to enjoying food and wine with his food and culture and travel. so I've always been a curious person. And so I studied abroad in college. And then when I graduated, I moved back to New York. I went to college in Wisconsin. And so studied a year abroad per semester, traveled all around.

finished my senior year and then moved back to New York because I was like, okay, this is where I'm gonna be the rest of my life. And had a few like small jobs, temps, jobs, but you know, entertainment in New York, Miramax Films was the only major studio based in New York and that's where you want it to be. And it was at the heyday of when Miramax was in at the prime. And I finally, I knew some people that were working in the domestic PR department and they told me this woman was hiring in the international PR.

And I went on the interview and this was it. This was my moments. And luckily I had interned at a entertainment PR firm that represents the talent when I was in college. So yeah, I got the job and for the next six years I was living in New York city, running around in my twenties, going out with friends, going to clubs, but working at Miramax in its heyday.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (10:11.16)
Yeah, so cool.

Danielle Frank (10:11.996)
I'm doing international PR, so going to the Cannes Film Festival, Berlin Venice Film Festival, doing press tours with the talent to London, Paris, Rome, really living an unbelievable life all while running around with my friends in the city, know, in New York City in my twenties. was, it was a time, it was.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (10:24.184)
This sounds awful.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (10:32.568)
That sounds...

incredible. And I think your 20s is such a special era as well because it's just you just open up to a world of possibilities at that point, you know, you're a fresh adult. So there's none of that kind of, you know, sort of responsibility in a sense of life. So you're just kind of enjoying it at that point completely to its full. And I always I think, you know, often says like youth is wasted on the young. But I think when you get to do that many brilliant things and you're, you know, having that those many incredible experiences.

That's not a waste, know, that's amazing. So what was it that you were studying that got you into the PR role in the first place?

Danielle Frank (11:12.184)
So I did communication arts and journalism in college. know, I really, again, I knew I wanted to be in entertainment, but it's funny, my niece just graduated from University of Wisconsin too. She just started graduation. And I was just like talking to her about, you know, her trajectory. And I was saying like, I wish back then too, like I knew I wanted to be entertainment. I wish I had a better understanding of what the different jobs are. I really didn't have an understanding of that. So, you know, I just had a basic like,

Tom Arts and journalism is kind of very vague for like, you you can go anywhere in entertainment. But it was because my stepmother knew somebody in New York City that worked at a very big talent PR firm. And so I interned there in the summer. And so again, that helped, you know, build up my resume to being an entertainment PR. And then when this job opened in the entertainment PR team or the international PR team, you know, having that

that I interned. But yeah, I still say, I don't know if I had gone into production or maybe there would have been a different path if I had thought to dive deeper into the different areas. But it just kind of navigated this way and I sort of fell into into PR.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (12:28.77)
Yeah, well it's supposed to become fairly organic then as well, I mean you know like...

I mean, when I remember us sort of leaving school and there was like a list of jobs that girls could do, you know, and it was a very kind of contained list, maybe about, there was maybe about five or six career paths that you could take and it was very limited. But today, you know, if you were a kid leaving school today, I mean, like the length, breadth, width and depth of all the different careers and roles that you can take is almost so mind blowing and so overwhelming that, you know, there's jobs today that didn't exist five years ago. So of course,

know it's much easier for a 16, 17, 18 year old today to kind of go you know I want to do that but then you'd have to be very type A to kind of go that is the specific job I want to do because if you're type B and you just see this issue and then maybe that becomes organic I don't know.

Danielle Frank (13:18.236)
Yeah, and you know, I mean, that's sort of the beauty of right, like it's a gift and a curse, all the, you know, access to social media and the worldwide web and all that it is. But that's one of the beautiful things that kids today have access to is hearing about all these other opportunities. And of course, there's more way more opportunities for women than there ever was, you know, back then. And and, you know, with social media and with

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (13:27.181)
Mmm.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (13:39.148)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (13:43.852)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (13:47.716)
everything accessible. I'm hoping, and that's what I said to my niece too, cause she's very set, like I want to be a lawyer. And so I'm not trying to distract her from being a lawyer. I was just trying to open the conversation like, well, you know, I just want you to be open-minded to like, maybe there are things that like, cause when I was younger, I said, I wanted to be a lawyer. When I was very young, I was like, I want to be a lawyer. Cause I thought I was going be an entertainment lawyer.

But then I started to actually learn what's involved in being a lawyer. It's not very creative. I'm a creative person, and it's more very linear and facts and documents. So I was just trying to have that conversation with her, maybe understanding what it is you like about law, because she is very creative. And there's so many things that you can parlay your interests and your capabilities into so many things.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (14:14.902)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (14:38.038)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (14:38.077)
to keep an open mind, you know, that's all.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (14:40.948)
absolutely. mean, I meet so many women that have backgrounds in sort of law or...

signs or any of these things and they tend to they've usually that's their former self because now they've got to do something way more creative whether that be starting a business or just really kind of moving into the arts or something but there's that kind of need to like it's an itch that just needs to be scratched isn't it so it's like you know the look they the more sensible jobs in a sense tend to kind of go your soul kind of goes no no i need i need to go and do the thing you know so yeah so

I do see that quite often with many women.

Danielle Frank (15:21.5)
Yeah, you and I think thinking back on it now too, it's, you know, thinking about your question about the diary and, you know, seeing has, you know, my parents, as I said, were divorced when I was one and my mom, you know, wasn't the greatest with money, struggling, you know, and, you know, she did a great job raising two kids, but that I think was also part of my design. Like, again, being type A, like a lawyer is successful. I never want to be in a situation where I'm reliant on

You know, like she'd be relying on like the alimony check to come and like, you know, things like that. Like there was one time, like, cause my dad used to give me, the check in my little Snoopy suitcase. And I remember one time I left it in his car and my mom was just like incensed because I left, you know, after that, he just mailed the check and this was before direct deposit, but he would just mail the check. I wasn't in the middle, but I, you know, I think that was part of like, I'm to be a success because I remember she was just so like reliant on getting that weekly check.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (16:10.018)
Yeah, yeah. Yes.

Danielle Frank (16:20.568)
And I was like, yeah, I'm, you know, that was part of the drive. Like I'm to be a successful lawyer because they make a lot of money and I'm, you know, I'm going to be successful.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (16:25.536)
Yeah. Yeah.

It's so interesting, isn't it, how kind of those early experiences inform like who we become really. So for you moving into your 30s then, now I'd say, know, had life started to look the way you imagined it and it absolutely had because in your 20s, you're having this fabulous life, know, red carpets and film festivals and all the rest of it. Then I'm going to say, yes, did those experiences in your 20s, did they continue through the next decade?

Danielle Frank (16:34.447)
Absolutely.

Danielle Frank (16:56.356)
Well, my experiences, this fabulous life that I started in my 20s, I'll tell you, it's still continuing. But there's a lot of spoiler alerts along the way. there's been a lot of twists and turns. So I was, you know, working at Miramax in New York and having the time of my life. And I had this group of guy friends. I was like, you know, maybe again, it's the Rambo watching Girl and Me, but.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (17:04.174)
amazing.

Danielle Frank (17:23.164)
I was always like great friends with guys. mean, I have my best girlfriends and all that, but there was like four guys and me and like, we'd go out all the time. And I knew one of my best friend, Matt, I always knew he liked me, but he was just like my best friend. And slowly like all the other guys were like, you know, we're nearing, you know, 27, 26, 27. And, you know, it's very big, especially on the East coast. Like have to get married by this age, have kids by 30, 31.

So all the guys just started to, one got married, one had a serious girlfriend, and we were starting to slow down a little bit. And I remember thinking like, all right, well, maybe this is my next chapter, right? Like maybe now I should be heading into thinking about marriage. And I said, here's Matt, my best friend. That's what a partner should be. And he's just the greatest human being. And so, yeah, we just started dating.

and we moved in together and everything was, you know, great. But there was something in me, think, so it was just a multitude of things. I mean, again, with my job, traveling, you know, I travel all the time, travel to LA all the time for what's called press junkets. And I just had this like nagging feeling in me like, wait, this isn't, this isn't it. This isn't your journey. Like,

You know, you've never felt like, you know, you have to go on a timeline. You know, I love every time I travel to LA, I was like, and I had a friend in college that I visited in LA a couple of times. So I always had this fascination with LA. And so I just started thinking like, wait, I'm not quite ready for marriage yet. There's plenty of time for that. There's plenty of time for kids. There's still a lot I want to do. And then I just got it in my head that I want to move to LA.

Like, when in my life am I gonna do this? I'll plenty of time to be back in New York and on the East Coast and marry kids. I just gotta do it. I gotta do it. And I just started to, you know, it's like, it's so, it's the worst feeling in the world being the one that breaks up with somebody. It's like, it's almost, mean, it's, don't know which is worse, but I almost prefer to get broken up with because it's just, you know, breaking someone's heart who's the kindest, greatest person. was the greatest boyfriend. But I just realized like, I loved him. I wasn't,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (19:40.642)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (19:45.496)
in love with him. And I think part of that was because I just had this, you know, I wasn't ready for that next chapter. So I broke up with him and I said, I'm gonna move to California. And even though I love my job at Miramax, I was kind of just getting restless. And, you know, I was looking for the next best thing. And so I was looking for some studio jobs and there were no studio jobs at the time. And once I get something in my head and I'm like, I'm,

I got the itch, I'm ready to move. But one of the PR companies that represents talent, I used to travel with them and they'd bring the talent from the film. So I knew all the publicity agencies and they were hiring for somebody in LA. And I just didn't think I wanted to be in personal PR. No disrespect to people that go that journey. I didn't think that was my path, but I just was like in my head that I have to get out to LA. So I took the job.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (20:17.357)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (20:40.418)
Wasn't for you, yeah.

Danielle Frank (20:45.244)
and bought a car, threw everything in it and drove out to LA. And now I'm, you know, 29 at this point. And I was at the PR company for three months. And I, it was, I saw the first day I walked in into the agency, there were like three publicists in their office crying. And I was like, it was a very toxic environment. It was run by these two women who

It was just very toxic. And I just, know, the personal PR journey is not for me. you know, I had dinner plans and like a client would be like, I want to go to somebody else's premiere. Can you walk me down the red carpet? I'm like, I got to cancel my dinner plans because they want to go to somebody else's premiere. I'm like, I get it. That's the job. But like, that's not, I don't know. I care more about my life. And also like I'm 20, you know, 28 or 29 at the time. Like, I'm still my selfish. Like, I want to do what I want to do.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (21:29.132)
Hmm.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (21:41.559)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (21:41.672)
but yeah, something happened with them, like at the agency and I just, in all my years at Miramax, you know, sure, there were nights that I went out to the club the night before and I was like, the next day. But there was never one day that I was at Miramax that I had that pit in my stomach of angst of like, God, I don't want to go into the office. When I was at this PR agency in three short months, I can't tell you how many mornings I woke up with that. That like.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (22:01.192)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (22:11.534)
ulcer feeling like, I just don't want to go in. And that was another pivotal moment for me that I was like, you know what, like we spend most half of our life at work. And obviously, you know, we all wish we, you know, we're trust fund and didn't have to go to work, but you know, you want to enjoy it to some capacity. You want to be passionate about it and excited about it. And I was like, this is no way to live. And I just, something happened. One of, one of,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (22:13.388)
Ugh.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (22:30.53)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (22:39.664)
the clients that I had, shared all your clients with each owner. And one of the clients I have as a producer and something leaked in one of the trades of his next project. And the owner of the company calls me up like in a panic, like, how did this leak? And so I finally spoke to the producer's assistant. He's like, don't worry about it. He leaked the story himself. His friend is the journalist that the producer leaked the story himself. The client like.

So I called the owner back and I was like, no big deal. So and so he leaked the story himself. Not a big crisis situation. And she was so incensed because she didn't have control over the situation. She just laid into me and I was like, and again, type A would never quit without having another job. I just found myself being like, thank you for this opportunity, but I don't think this is working out. And so here I am now, 29 and

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (23:08.547)
Right.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (23:25.87)
and

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (23:30.326)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (23:37.452)
yeah, I think, you know, sort of like you're still, you know, like I said, I don't, didn't have a husband, I didn't have a mortgage. So there's a little bit of naivety and like, I'll be fine. And, and that's when, you know, I took another big pivot in my life and I say, I traded red carpets for red wine and I ended up, segueing into the wine and spirits world.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (24:00.302)
This is brilliant. So I mean, like, and it's so interesting. And actually, it's interesting that, you know, through your 20s, even because, you know, I always say, you know, we don't listen to our bodies and you talk about that feeling in your body. That's your, you know, there's such a sure kind of soul that your insides kind of go, no, this is not it. This is not it. You know, we kind of ignore it. We override it. And, know, but it's like it's

Danielle Frank (24:18.203)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (24:23.746)
We, you know, we're given these kind of, these messages, these guides all the time, you know, and, you know, as you say, you walk into a room and you know, you know, every signal is speaking to you like.

this is not the place for you. But I think it's brilliant that at such a young age, even being, as you say, type of person that you were that you needed to have a plan for the next thing that you just kind of went, yeah, thanks, I've learned and I need to learn from this and moved on. And I guess as well, having done that really the hardest thing, which was that breakup, it proved to you in a way that, you know, I can do this, I can move on. This is not the worst thing that can happen is that I can walk away from these things. But to have all those

experiences pre-30 is such a gift in a sense, you know, to be able to kind of go, right, okay, I'm ready.

Danielle Frank (25:12.252)
100%. And I, you know, I'm sure as we continue talking, you'll hear the other, you know, life pivots happen to me. And I would say it's like, you know, I love, I mean, I love shining a light on all the life pivots and transitions because that really is your story. That's really your journey. And everything gives, you know, gives you, it's your armory to make you better to tackle the next change. And that's exactly, you know, moving from New York to LA and

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (25:28.652)
Absolutely.

Danielle Frank (25:38.684)
you know, shifting gears when everybody was getting married and I was like, nope, not that already started it for me. And that's why, you know, it was already started to build my armor of, you know, confidence and belief in myself that like, all right, I did it. That's why when I left the PR agency, I'm like, I'll be fine. I have confidence in myself and I know that, you know, I can handle it. you know, and like I said, it's, you know, having gone through some transitions and pivots.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (25:59.203)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (26:05.07)
it's given me the confidence to know that I'll be okay and I can stand on my own two feet.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (26:09.868)
Yeah amazing. So Tami, 30, so you so you pivoted into the wine industry. Tell me about that.

Danielle Frank (26:15.834)
Yeah, so now I'm in my thirties and now I'm as far away from wanting to be married with kids at this point because now I'm living in LA and I am having a blast. So yeah, just, you know, I had friends in the entertainment industry, some, you know, actor friends and, know, you're just surrounded by it here. And now it just felt like a new life for me.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (26:37.848)
Can I just stop you? Had you met Scott Bio at this point?

Danielle Frank (26:40.996)
No, I never met Skunk-A-Pam. No, no. Or Ricky Schroeder or any. my God, you know who I met last night? Do you know who I met? I met Harrison Ford.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (26:42.894)
man, okay sorry. man, carry on. Telly!

Stop it! Stop it!

Danielle Frank (26:53.084)
I know. I have, I know that was like, that was the best. I don't know if you can see. Oh yeah. So yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (26:59.254)
That's pretty cool.

my god! Okay so I'm looking at a photo that Danielle showed me of her with Harrison Ford. Whoa! Okay that's pretty cool.

Danielle Frank (27:09.346)
Yeah, so one of my, one of the brands that I work with currently, Glen Morongi is a Scotch and he's a big Scotch drinker and there he's spent a couple of your partnership. And so there's a limited edition Harrison Ford Glen Morongi Scotch whiskey. And so there was a launch event last night and he came and I got to go and my God, I met Han Solo and Indiana Jones. That was highlight of my life. But anyway, so I digress, but.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (27:34.382)
That's pretty cool. Okay, so back to the story. Sorry, that was a terrible interruption there, but I needed to know at that point.

Danielle Frank (27:38.972)
Yeah, yeah. So yes, so now I'm in my 30s. I so I so I leave this company and I'm like, you know, looking around, there's no entertainment jobs. My sister worked for an agency that worked for Bacardi USA and the East Coast. And my sister just loved this job. And she heard they were hiring out here. And it was like a big step back. I mean, I took like a 50 % reduction in pay. It was very entry level. But it was like you work from home, you got an expense account, a car allowance and

I was like, oh, this sounds fun until I figure out what it is I want to do. Well, fast forward 10 years with Bacardi. Now I'm coming on 12 years with Moat Hennessy. Spoiler alert, I'm a little older than 21. A lot older. So, you know, I fell into this industry and it's just, you know, I've been very fortunate that when you get to work for great companies representing great brands. So yeah, so now I'm in my thirties, I'm working at Bacardi and I work my way up there.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (28:11.171)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (28:14.84)
you

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (28:19.886)
Only just.

Danielle Frank (28:36.796)
And it's just, know, the wine and spirits industry is really a fun industry. And like I said, when you get to Shepherd and work with brands that have such history and that are, you know, you know, brands that, you know, consumers want to, you know, consume not just physically, but mentally, you know, it's like they have such, what's the word I'm looking for? It's just, you know, it's a lifestyle. Like these are lifestyle brands, you know? Anyway, so it's just,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (29:04.236)
Yeah. Yeah.

Danielle Frank (29:06.716)
It was a blast running around LA and yeah, then you know, then I'm starting to get like now it's like 33 I had a had a boyfriend for a little bit that didn't work out and now I'm now I'm starting to think like, okay All right. If I'm do marriage and kids I got to start thinking about it So I meet my friend's brother He's divorced with two kids a doctor. I it's gonna be great and we end up falling in love

And we date for about six years and talking about marriage, talking about kids. Now, in hindsight, throughout our six years, he would go back and forth whether he wanted more kids. And we finally got engaged and I wouldn't move in with him until we got engaged. We finally got engaged. This was like a few months before we broke it off.

I think it took me getting engaged, moving in for me to finally kind of open my eyes. And once we were engaged, I just started to see, he really didn't want more kids. He didn't want kids. said he'd have a kid, but then he'd go back and forth and be like, man, do really want one? And I was dead set on having kids. and so, you know, I, I say, like, I think I needed to, you know, go through to come out of it, you know, finally needs to get engaged. So it just opened my eyes to be like, wait, this isn't going to be a marriage at last.

and why embark on it if it's not gonna last. And I wanna be with somebody that wants to have a kid with me, that's dying to have a kid with me. So I broke it off. And look, there were other things in the relationship. It wasn't just about kids. There were a lot of other things that I kind of, you know. But yeah, so.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (30:42.069)
Yeah

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (30:54.801)
Yeah, but that's a biggie. I mean, that's a biggie in terms of, you know, your values and your sort of goals because a kid isn't like, you know, it's not a Christmas gift. They're around for a long time, you know, so you've got to kind of want to be in the game. But yeah, yeah, that would be a big one.

Danielle Frank (31:02.81)
Yeah. Yeah.

Danielle Frank (31:09.432)
Yeah, so yeah, so here I am now 38 and now you're standing, you know, especially as a woman, you know, and this was 14.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (31:15.814)
Yeah, because there's very much that TikTok thing going on, there? mean, we're kind of, you know, it's all, as you say, when you're in your twenties, you're like, oh my God, I've got ages. But then, of course, as you approach your late thirties, that becomes a very different, even if you're not outwardly kind of going, oh, that's this is my thing. You know, there is definitely this internal clock that you're aware of. So, yeah.

Danielle Frank (31:24.038)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (31:37.692)
Yeah, and you know, so then I just, but you know, I broke up with him and I moved out and I remember I didn't cry another tear after I moved out. It was almost like a sense of relief. And again, as we talked about building that armory in yourself, like I knew I'd be fine, you know, because of my past pivots, career, you know, moving from New York to LA. I've now, you know, another,

step in that direction of knowing, you know, that you don't stand on that bridge forever. You cross it intentionally and I'll get over that bridge. And it was, it was empowering. It was empowering to make that decision to walk away. And, you know, so now I'm living on my own and I was like, you know what? I don't need a man. I froze my eggs. I'm like, if I'm not with anybody by 40, I'll have a kid on my own.

So now I'm back to, you know, having fun and I met this great group of people. I don't know, just happenstance. I started to meet these like this group of people in Santa Monica, Venice, California, where I live. And they're all like, they're all my age, late thirties, early forties. And it just, it became like my pod, my people. And we're all sort of similar mindset. you know, didn't go that, some had been married and divorced, but

for the most part, like, know, independent thinkers and like, you know, didn't follow the timeline. So all this is going on. And then I I start traveling a lot for work. I moved into a new position, traveling a lot for work and, know, making a little bit more money. So now I'm just traveling for pleasure as well. And that's, that became a big part of who I am. I really like want to see the world and I want to do everything that I can.

And so, you know, I'm now turning 40 at a big bash and I'm like, well, wait, I have these eggs, but I'm not ready yet. And now I'm traveling and I'm doing all this stuff. And if I had a kid on my own, like I couldn't live in Venice, California. I couldn't travel. Like I'd have to move to like, you know, Bakersfield or somewhere, wherever that is, you know, I like, I could do this on my own and I wasn't ready to sacrifice this now, this life I carved out for myself.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (33:45.868)
You

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (33:53.294)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (33:53.82)
So that was 40. then shortly after, I met a young man who was 28, very, very handsome man. I thought it would be a fling. We end up dating for six plus years into my 40s. we had talked about, we talked about like, knew I had my eggs frozen and like, know, he...

At 28, he wasn't quite there yet. So we're both like, great. We're both not there yet with kids. And then, you know, I switched companies. I moved up. You know, I had this great career making great money. And all of a sudden he is too. And so now I started introducing him to this world of travel. And we both just, it just became our life. And we both kind of agreed on like, you know, like,

We kind of like the life we've forged for ourselves. We're building for ourselves. Maybe kids isn't the journey. And at this point I'm like 46. Yeah, and the idea of like first starting that journey was daunting. Yeah, we ended up breaking out. There was some drinking issues with him and we're still friends and all that, but.

You know fast forward that's kind of where I am right now. I just turned 52 and This is this is my life now and I couldn't be happier right if I was a mom I'm sure I'd be just as thrilled and But I'm a I'm an aunt to my niece and nephew. I'm auntie. I'll to so many my friends kids I love it. I take them to escape rooms dope them up on sugar send them home for bedtime Yeah, I love that I love being

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (35:34.284)
Yeah

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (35:39.247)
Yeah, wisdom off, send them home. Brilliant. Yeah.

Danielle Frank (35:45.372)
But I also love that I have that, you cause I'm such a nurturer, but I still get to now enjoy this life that I forged for myself. And it's really just shown me that, you know, that's what life is. Life is a journey. And sometimes when you step off one path, you step onto another and you realize like maybe that was the path you were meant to be on all along. And for me, that's what it's been. So for me, it's, I've traded off, you know, having kids with now creating this life of adventure, you know, I'm

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (36:13.506)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (36:13.616)
always picking up where can I go next? I just got back from Spain. I'm going to London next month with Royal Ascot. just booked, like, you know, there's really, like, because I don't have that, you know, I don't have, my dog is like, what do mean you don't have responsibilities at home? I have a great, I have a great dog watcher, but it's a lot easier with a dog. I don't have to pay for college. I have somebody that watches my dog. So I've really enjoyed this, this new path that I've carved for myself. And

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (36:23.404)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Hahaha!

you

Danielle Frank (36:42.844)
And with that too, I'm doing things that, you know, now for me, my story has become about doing everything and anything I can that I want to achieve in my life, right? That I might not have been able to do if I had kids, right? Like, you know, I really am trying to check everything off my life's, you know, quote unquote bucket list. Like I told you, I loved game shows growing up. I went on a game show a couple of years ago. Like check, did that. I write, I,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (36:57.271)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (37:02.99)
Mm.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (37:06.424)
Amazing. Brilliant.

Danielle Frank (37:11.868)
I have a creative outlet, I love writing. So I wrote a book 14 years ago and I was like, if I do nothing with this, it's gonna plague me in my death bed. So last year, at the end of last year, I published my book and that's what I'm out and about promoting.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (37:24.878)
Oh wow, okay. So 14 years, right, okay. So it's that long ago and you wrote your book. Okay, so that's, I mean, what I love so far about this story is the fact that so much of it has been completely organic in the sense that, you know, you started out as a teenager with a very clear idea of what you were going to do. And then...

Danielle Frank (37:29.82)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (37:45.647)
And it's not that you've been bumbling through, you there's been some very sort of clear paths and clear intentions, but the whole time it's not, it's you, you're tuning in, you're listening to yourself, what feels good for me right now, you know, it's not doing the, you know, this is what you should do at this age and this is what you need to at this age, or by this age you need to have this, you know, it's that kind of, I suppose it's taken those brave steps probably through your twenties.

that gave you that sense of confidence, I suppose, to able to kind of go, no, I'll be all right, I can do this. And I love that you've got to this point in your life now, you know, in your 50s, you kind of go, I'm pretty good with this. And it's been intentional throughout, which is like incredible, really, you know.

Danielle Frank (38:25.98)
Yeah, some of it, like you said, like some of it's just, it's life. What's the joke that like, make plans, God, I forgot I out next thing. But that's exactly it. It's like, sometimes the most empowering decision is acknowledging that the job, the relationship, the version of the life you thought, whether it's costing you peace or just it's not, it's.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (38:34.346)
Yeah, and God laughs. Yeah.

Danielle Frank (38:51.612)
it's not working out the way you thought. And I think sometimes when we pause long enough to listen, like those pivots can be imitations, not endings, like that lead us to, you know, a life that feels more aligned and honest with how we want to live. And that's what's happened, Bri. Yeah, it's all sort of been happenstance. Yes and no, because it's also, it's been happenstance, but I think it's also intentional that like just

having the confidence, know, like, you know, taking those life lessons, right? taking every time I had a life pivot, you know, I really use that as a lesson, you know, looking at it as a chapter in the storybook of my life, right? So, you know, if you don't heed the lesson from the past, it's not gonna propel you forward and it can hinder you, it can hold you back. So I think each of these things just, you know, like I said, build up my armory to be like, great, what's next? What's next in this fun life?

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (39:33.838)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (39:41.986)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (39:49.764)
It doesn't have to be so cookie cutter and so planned out. And I'm seeing with each new journey that each one has been exciting. So what's next? What's next in that next chapter and the next story?

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (40:07.5)
Yeah, I love that. love the fact that, mean, and pivots, even they're tough because obviously you have to often face yourself in those times, you know, and that can be...

very challenging. as I say, as much like, you know, and I often say this, that kind of like, you know, it's, it's only in the lessons that we learn things about ourselves and the lessons are never fun. It's never like we're going through a period of being taught a lesson that we're kind of going, my God, I'm so much fun with this lesson right now. You know, they're often brutal. They often resolve when you sort of, you know, sit on the floor and tears, but it's only when you come through it that you realize that kind of like, that was an

That was an incredible gift really to have that lesson. And obviously when we make those pivots, it's the same thing, know, they're, they can be tough. It's hard to turn away from one thing into like, you're taking that step off the cliff, isn't it? And kind of building your wings on the way down or whatever it is. It's like, sometimes that can be a really hard choice.

Danielle Frank (41:03.258)
Yeah, I mean, and like I said, you know, some people don't heed the lessons, right? And then, you know, of course they can be scary. But I think once you start to extrapolate the lesson from, you know, the messiness, the messy middle or whatever you're going through and see when you can see that you took something from it and it drove you further, you know, it helped propel you forward.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (41:07.886)
Hmm.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (41:16.526)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (41:27.1)
Um, I don't It's really powerful. It's been powerful for me at least, you know, it's not easy. It's not easy to take away the lesson, but when you can really look internally and that's why writing like that's why, um, that's what writing does for me. So when I broke up with my fiance and I say, like, when I say I didn't cry another day, when I, when I moved out, like, I'm not joking. Like I cried a lot when I was in it. And I realized like, this is, this is not good. Like you're not supposed to be so unhappy in a relationship and feel lonely in a relationship. And.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (41:29.708)
Yeah. Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (41:54.048)
Yeah. Yeah.

Danielle Frank (41:57.165)
No disrespect to people that go to therapy. It works for many people. For me, I'm not gonna say it doesn't work. It wasn't my avenue. I found myself not being honest with my therapist. And I was like, this defeats the purpose. The whole idea is, you know, obviously they're not supposed to tell you what to do. It's to get out of you, you know, for you to hear it for yourself, right? And so that's what writing is for me. So when I broke up with my fiance, like, I would just like write myself letters.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (42:00.974)
Hmm.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (42:20.227)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (42:25.852)
And that's how I brought it to the surface. And I would just like read it or write it as like a story, not like a story, but like, I remember when he did this and blah, blah, blah. And think about how unhappy you were. Like, I don't know, just writing bubbled it up to the surface for me. And that was really, that was really therapeutic. And that's my way of just assessing it and looking at it on the paper and be like, yeah, no, like you never want to feel that way again. And so I've used that, you know, and, and,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (42:26.509)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (42:37.195)
Yeah

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (42:43.37)
gosh, yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (42:50.51)
you

Danielle Frank (42:53.126)
And that's why when the last boyfriend with the drinking, when it was getting to a point where I was like, this isn't making me happy and I don't need to stay in this. I know I'm fine on my own because I got out of that, you know, engaged relationship and I was fine. It gave me the power to be like, you know, it's not working. I'm not happy in this relationship because of the drinking and because of the excessiveness and all that. And so it gave me the confidence to be like,

You know, I'd rather be on my own. mean, frankly, I don't know if I could ever live with anything anymore. I love living by myself. It's just I've gotten too used to it. The older you get, the more sensitive you are. But yeah, so, yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (43:22.424)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (43:29.834)
It's good. It's working for you. So when you look back, I mean, like, I always like to look back at the threads and I often think, you know, you can't, we can't ever sort of tell, you know, the tapestry or whatever it is that we're creating as we're moving forward. It's only when we look back. And when you look back across through all of your career up to this point, or all of your life up to this point, you know, the Hollywood, the luxury brands,

the book. What has been this thread for you that has been running through all throughout that? I I can say for me that I've always loved writing. That's always been my thing. And today, as I say, my journal, I'm still a daily journaler. I'll still go and get all my stuff onto the page because like you, for me, that's real therapy. Has there been any threads for you that have run through throughout your life career?

Danielle Frank (44:23.356)
You know, it's an interesting question. mean, it's I think it's like. don't know if it's a threat, it's a combination of things, I'd say that like. It's the it's the confidence like it's the confidence and it's also so I mean, talk about writing. I started to I started to just write down like, you know, I have crazy stories and things I've done like from Miramax and traveling.

to this place and staying at this hotel and on a private jet for this film and going here and like, I mean, have an armory of stories and then into my 30s. So I've started like writing all that down. And I think every time I look at it, I'm like, is such an amazing life I've carved out for myself. So reflecting, reflecting on all that I get to do and thinking about what I get to do next, where I'm going to go next, you know, I'm a big foodie, like, I'm going to want, I want to try that restaurant next week or.

You know, I still haven't been on an African safari. So when am I doing that? You know, just I think just like always taking a look at my life and what I built for myself. You know, I call it like the story of my life, as I say. And that's what my Instagram handle is at create a great story, because I'm you see all the pictures of all the things I'm doing to create a great story. That's my life. And for me, that's what it's about. You know, really just.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (45:41.166)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (45:46.274)
looking at that and that propels me forward. Like you're, you know, you're doing a great job. Like I've got a lot more I want to do, but I, I'd say like, God forbid anything happened to me tomorrow. Like I feel like I've lived a very full life and that continues to propel me forward. That's knowing that, you know, I'm doing good with this, with this one life I have.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (46:05.826)
Yeah, yeah, I love this. You know, I like this podcast is called the unraveling because there's often a time when, you know, the wheels fall off. But I think as you've already stated, you know, the wheels have fallen off, I suppose, in the sense of a number of times. But and I guess, as you said, the thread is the confidence to kind of pick it back up and move forward and, you know, take what you take what you can from it. Is there I mean, throughout all of these things?

throughout all these sort of experiences, what's the thing that you take away from it the most to what that brings you to where you are today?

Danielle Frank (46:44.624)
Yeah, I mean, I think, you look, it's not all rosy, right? Sometimes the wheels still fall off, but I keep a spare tire in the trunk. You know, it's like it's it's just yeah, it's it's just keep getting back on that horse. Keep you know, put on that spare tire and roll on through to the to the next. You know, there's always going to be some messy middle and it's just it's looking ahead. Like I said, you know, you don't stand on in the middle of that bridge forever.

you've got to look forward and put one foot in front of the other and cross that bridge intentionally and get to the other side. And when you, you know, when you give yourself the confidence to do so, then, you know, the rest will follow your legs will follow, right? It starts with your brain saying, I can do it, but one foot in front of the other. And then, you know, your body follows. It starts all with, you know, with what you tell yourself.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (47:29.454)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (47:38.702)
Yeah, 100 % brilliant. So your book, tell me about your book. So you wrote this book, you say, it 14 years ago you wrote this book?

Danielle Frank (47:46.072)
Yeah, so, you know, I just, know, the world is a really crappy place right now. And, you know, I love writing and I'm very, I've always loved rhyming for some reason and I'm very creative. so I was working on an actual children's book series called Johnny's Remote Adventures. And what this was is each book takes Johnny to a new country where he meets somebody his own age.

And it's all about teaching kids about other cultures, right? In one book he goes to Mexico and he meets Juan who, know, these are the foods he eats and these are the holidays he celebrates. so, and at the end of the book, Johnny is back in bed and he realizes we all sleep under the same star of skies at night. We're all the same just because we look different. And the idea is this is because, you know, kids can be real jerks and, you know, we hear more and more about what's going on in the world. And so my, you know, the thought with that is like, I just, wanna,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (48:14.819)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (48:21.998)
Brilliant.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (48:35.416)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (48:41.692)
I want to have a seat at the table to how kids are raised well. And it starts at such a young age, hate and discrimination. I just believe it's learned and if they can keep an open mind. So the idea with that series was to get to the kids. Well, 14 years ago then I break up with my fiance. Like I said, just because I realized the path to motherhood might not happen for me, it doesn't mean the nurturing goes away.

And at the same time, there was a book that came out called Go the F to Sleep, wildly popular, written like a children's book, made for adults. And it really opened the genre for this adult children's book. And so I thought, huh, well, maybe instead of trying to reach the kids when they're five or six or seven and reading Johnny Remotes Adventures, this idea came to me. was watching my niece and nephew. They were very young at the time, although great kids.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (49:10.445)
Yeah, sure.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (49:19.192)
Uh-huh.

Danielle Frank (49:37.66)
Obviously every kid has the propensity to wine. And they were whining about something and I said, uh-uh, Auntie Aniel drinks wine. She doesn't listen to wine. And so it all came together in my head of creating this project, A Wine Lover's Guide to Parenting. I started thinking about the fun parallels of wine terminology to human behavior and how I could like do plan words and things like that. And also somebody who works in the wine and spirits industry as a lover of wine. I love the idea of making wine knowledge

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (49:52.302)
Brilliant.

Danielle Frank (50:07.248)
fun, easy, accessible, right? Wine doesn't, shouldn't be daunting. When I go to the restaurant with my friends and they hand me the wine list, no, it's not, you don't need to be in work in the industry to enjoy wine. It's everybody has different palates and tastes and what it evokes from you. So that all came together in this project called Wine Lover's Guide to Parenting. It's 11 lessons on how to raise your kids to wine terminology. And every time I use a wine term, it gives the definition.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (50:20.193)
Uh-huh.

Danielle Frank (50:35.258)
the back of the book, gives a basic understanding of how wine's made. It's written like a children's book, it's illustrated and it rhymes and it's just a good laugh.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (50:38.999)
Okay.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (50:44.142)
okay. Can you give us an example?

Danielle Frank (50:46.854)
Yes, I'd love to read your chapter. So this chapter is you don't want your kids to ferment. So in wine terminology, the fermentation process is when you convert the sugar into alcohol. Now we think of something as sugar is sweet, alcohol we think is harsh and biting. So this is about you don't want your kids, you have to teach your kids manners so they don't turn into someone harsh and biting. Manners, manners, manners are the key to it all. These lessons need to start even when they're small. Teach them this from day one before they start to crawl. You don't want your kid to be the sour grape in the bunch.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (50:57.751)
Uh-huh.

Danielle Frank (51:16.666)
and turn into a spoiled brat that kids wanna punch? When they start talking, make sure they know thank you and please, to always say bless you when they hear someone sneeze. Please and thank you are an absolute must. Without that, your child's a total bust. There's nothing worse than a child's behavior that is crude, because it'll continue as they're older and become someone who's rude. People don't take kindly to and aren't nice to those with attitude, because it's very off-putting and puts others in a bad mood, oftentimes causing confrontation and leads to a nasty feud. Wanting to put a little bit of poison in your child's food.

That's really how you want your kids to be viewed. Wouldn't you prefer that there's someone who's wooed? Without manners, they'll ferment and turn into someone harsh and biting. They may turn into a kid who's rude, obnoxious, and always fighting. So teach your kids some manners and to have some heart and soul. Without that, your kid may well turn into an a-hole.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (52:06.314)
Brilliant! And I suppose there's probably so many of them, isn't there, really? It's like the whole kind of like, you know, like, I think I've seen before that you said about letting wine breathe and obviously as a mother, if you're a parent, have to go... Okay, we're just gonna breathe through this moment.

Danielle Frank (52:07.465)
Thank you.

Danielle Frank (52:20.1)
Exactly. Yes, not only do you need to breathe, but you need to let kids breathe too, right? You need to give them room to grow. There's a chapter in there about not, you don't want your kid to be a mulled wine. Mulled wines are heated, spiced, and sometimes served as a punch. So is your kid heated spice? Are they being a bully? You know, it's an important lesson. you know, some people that'll say, you know, you're not a mom.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (52:27.95)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (52:47.897)
you wrote about parenting. It's just human decency, decency, human behavior, teaching your kids manners, not to be a bully, to be worldly. It's all good human decency. So it's all in good fun and good.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (52:54.252)
Yeah. Yeah.

It is, it's what you'd consider the fundamentals wouldn't you? You'd think it'd be the basics and you you would hope that would still be the case. Yeah absolutely. Jo, do you think you'll ever go back to, I mean I think the kids book before sounded great as well, I love that idea. Do you think you'll ever go back to that or is there any plans for further writing from you?

Danielle Frank (53:05.058)
Exactly.

Danielle Frank (53:16.962)
Yeah, well, I'd love to go back to that with all this promotion. I I went through the hybrid publishing model. That's why I shelved this 14 years ago. It's really hard to get published. And so I finally mentioned, I heard about this hybrid publishing model. So, you know, it's, I'm paying for everything. I'm doing all this promotion myself, but I had a publisher, you know, behind the process, guiding the process.

It's a lot of work and it was a lot of money and you know that too was part of my checklist like great I don't pay for college. Let me invest in putting my book out there to the world But yeah, I mean obviously the ultimate goal is wouldn't it be great if a publisher wanted to I know my next iteration is a whiskey lovers guide to dog breeds So I've worked on that But yeah, I'd love to I'd love to get back. have you know, I want to finish the children's book series I'd love some interest in that

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (53:39.127)
Yeah.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (53:58.447)
Okay.

Danielle Frank (54:04.794)
I have a great, you I really love true crime. I have a great serial killer story that like I've written as a short story. So I'd love to write as a novel, but you know, my day job takes priority. pays my bills. So I don't know. It's, you know, it's something I do on the side. It's one day when I retire, hopefully that's going to be, you know, I'm going to do a lot of baking and writing and learn how to garden.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (54:16.823)
Yeah

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (54:25.262)
Yeah, I love that. So if I could now, I mean, this has been just like such a full, brilliant and intentional life, which I think is just what's so wonderful about it, you know. But if I was to go and pop you into a time machine and I was to take you back, what would you go back and whisper to that little Danielle or that teenager Danielle?

Danielle Frank (54:36.988)
Okay.

Danielle Frank (54:54.844)
I would whisper, don't change a thing. I think everything happens as it should, know, everything, you know, like, you know, like we said, it's part of your arsenal makes you who you are. Um, and I wouldn't trade that for anything. You know, I love the person I love. Not only do I love the life that I'm I've created for myself, but I love the person that I've become. I think I'm kind, charitable.

All that is just based on everything that's happened in my life. And I would say just don't change a thing. Keep at it,

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (55:29.486)
I love that, I love that. I often hear people kind of say, you know, just...

you know, just had more confidence or that, you know, don't listen to the bullies or whatever it was. And you kind of think, that's so, it's so sad to have that, you know, to go back and sort of say, you know, like, like you somehow got life wrong in a way. And it was never wrong. It was always, you were always meant to do the thing that you're meant to do, you know, which is, and it might be messy. It might be that we kind of fall down, you know, holes along the way, but that's part of it, isn't it? Really? It's part of the whole, the whole journey.

Danielle Frank (55:58.939)
Yeah.

Danielle Frank (56:08.454)
Yeah, that's part of who you are. So, you know, as long as that who you are is obviously a good person, you know, and, you know, not murdering people and all that, then keep at it. If you were somebody in your past that was like dissecting a roadkill, like, you know, Dahmer, maybe the future person should go back to them and tell them not to do this.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (56:10.561)
Yeah

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (56:22.304)
Yeah, keep at it for sure.

Sharon Wilkes-Burt (56:30.478)
Yeah, yeah for sure yeah, I'm not sure I speak to those people but yeah, you're right. Go look at that.

Danielle, thank you so much for joining me today. It's been such an absolute joy to speak to you.

Danielle Frank (56:46.544)
it's been so lovely to chat with you. Thank you for having me on your fabulous podcast. And I hope your listeners enjoyed it and they keep at whatever they're doing. You know, like we said, the wheels are going to come off. They always do for everybody, for all of us. Just pull the spare tire out of the car, put it back on and keep going.