salty bake club

Beyond Borders: Taking Action for Palestine When It's Hard to Look

• sara grace • Season 1 • Episode 9

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Here is where you get in touch. Work with me, share your experience or requests > this is how to reach me. Love, - Sara

Compassion over comprehension. These words echo throughout this deeply moving conversation with my dear friend Ilav about staying engaged with the humanitarian crisis in Palestine when it's easier to look away.

"I cannot not look," Ilav repeats throughout our discussion, describing how she channels the pain of witnessing suffering into action. As the daughter of political refugees from Iraq, she shares her lifelong connection to Palestine and why she feels compelled to keep her heart open despite the emotional toll.

We explore what those of us in positions of privilege can actually do to help. From boycotting specific brands (McDonald's, Starbucks, Coca-Cola, Pepsi, SodaStream) to following journalists reporting from Gaza, there are concrete actions we can all take. Ilav recommends trustworthy Instagram accounts that provide verified information about which companies to avoid and how to get involved in meaningful ways. I have linked all the resources we discussed for you by the end of this text.

Perhaps most poignant is our discussion about teaching children about difficult realities. Ilav shares how she approaches these conversations with her five-year-old son, gradually introducing concepts while emphasizing love and unity rather than hate. "We need more love, we don't need more hate," she reminds us, highlighting that many Jewish people stand in solidarity with Palestinians.

We also challenge the "good vibes only" culture that has permeated wellness spaces. True connection comes from being willing to engage with hard topics and staying present for uncomfortable conversations—whether in our personal relationships or our relationship with the wider world.

As we conclude, we remind listeners that our shared humanity transcends borders and identities. "Until the people in Gaza aren't free, none of us is free," Ilav says, emphasizing that compassion doesn't require complete comprehension of a complex situation.

 I'd love to hear how this episode resonates with you—share your thoughts and join this crucial conversation.

HERE ARE ALL RESOURCES AND ACCOUNTS WE SHARED IN THIS EPISODE:

  • The App we talked about is called Boycat - It shows you which brands support this war in going on and HOW they are involved in it. They also show suggestions of alternative Brands that you could use instead.
  • Instagram Accounts Ilaf suggests: 
    • JEWISHVOICEFORPEACE https://www.instagram.com/jewishvoiceforpeace?igsh=cWN0a2tyeTJ5Zmtx
    • MORTAZ_AZAIZA https://www.instagram.com/motaz_azaiza?igsh=dTFhdjJsN2ZweDRn
    • ART_OF_RIOT https://www.instagram.com/art_of_riot?igsh=aHNqb2oybDc0cjZ4
    • WIZARD_BISAN1 https://www.instagram.com/wizard_bisan1?igsh=MWh4bDdwZzhqODl5dw==
    • HIND KHOUDARY https://www.instagram.com/hindkhoudary?igsh=MWdtdGx3ZDQ5bTg4bg==


Speaker 1:

Bay Club. This week's episode is a little bit different than the topics that we tackled before. We're going to talk about what is going on in Palestine, or rather what we can do. I'm not the right person to educate you on the conflict, the war, the genocide, but I can use my voice and my platform to remind you of your privilege and use your voice and, even though it might be uncomfortable, I really urge you to listen to this episode. We're not going to go deeply into the topic of what is going on there, but what can we do? And I'm having my beautiful friend Elav, who agreed to sit down with me. She is one of the only people I know that keep staying engaged, that keep their eyes open to what is going on down there. She is sitting down with us today to share a little bit about her resources, about what we can do and how we can cope with it all. So let's get into it.

Speaker 2:

Exciting, so let's get into it.

Speaker 1:

Exciting welcome to salty bake club. I'm so, so glad that you're here. We are having an episode that differs a little bit from the topics that have been before, but it's really dear to both of our hearts. And you are here because you are the only like the single person I know, who is really practicing to keep their eyes open in hell. So today we're gonna talk about how to cope in really difficult conversations and we're gonna go into the topic of not really what exactly is happening in gaza, but what can we do. So thank you for being here. Thank you for sitting down with me. Since you're here, on salty pay club, I baked you something that I feel like embodies you. Oh, obviously it had to be something with chocolate.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's not like a huge cake because you are such a such a beautiful, petite, but such a cool person. So we are having a very chocolatey strawberry rhubarb muffin with a little bit of sweetness and sass, and I love you so much.

Speaker 2:

I love you so much I actually already tried a piece and I was like it's so good. How do you feel today? Good, a bit nervous, but I think that's normal. I think it's a part of it but a bit nervous but also very excited.

Speaker 2:

Thankful I told you that before, yeah, but a bit nervous, yeah, but also very excited. Thankful I told you that before. But like I'm so thankful that you're using your platform for this. That means the world, and also that I have a friend like you who cares and who also thinks it's important and like I think that's yeah, that means a lot.

Speaker 1:

It's like a community and that's yeah, yeah, I relate so much. It means, or it is so important to have people around us with shared values. Right, and it is really hard to find in the society, where we barely ever share what's truly on our hearts, like, honestly, I. I mean there's a thousand reasons that I love you so, so much and you are such, a, such a good friend, and one of them is that you are this word is very overused, but I'm still going to use it authentic. You are such a person who leads from the heart. Thank you, and especially in a topic and a time like that, I know and I can imagine that being guided by our hearts and keeping our hearts open, right, that is so freaking hard when we are confronted with such terror. Yeah, why is the topic so dear to your heart?

Speaker 2:

I've thought about that myself, like what, what is like why? Because I have like palestine since I've been like 15 years old, yeah, I've just like they are in my heart and it's like why? Where did it start? I don't know where it started, I mean. I mean we can't forget, like I have. My parents are from iraq. They were political refugees and like I guess it's in our, in us, you know, and they've always yeah, I don't know, they've just had a special place in my heart and like the first essay I had I wrote about it, it was just like I it goes so way back and I, they, I always talk about them as like my brothers and sisters, yeah, and it's just yeah, I think that is what it comes down to.

Speaker 1:

We in this society, we're connected, right, we're globally connected and because of that incredible tool, the internet, right, we are seeing and we can engage in so many things that we usually, usually we wouldn't be able to see otherwise. But also that brings some responsibility, because once we see it, we can't really unsee it.

Speaker 1:

Once we see it, we can't really say, oh, that's not for me, like right, that's not, that's not my topic, that's not happening in my country and that is I have a real issue of with the fact that so many people milk this topic. Yeah, and they're. They're really like they're watching it on the news every day, but they instruct their shoulders and be like, well, what can I do? And there is a part of me that really understands that. But also I think it is our responsibility because we have the information to use it. Yeah, right, yeah, and there it. We have that privilege. Yes, and the privilege is like we have. We don't have to look yeah, we can't exactly.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so using that privilege is what it comes down to yeah, and I I thought about that too, like when I grew up like my parents were watching al jazeera, and Al Jazeera is not covering anything, they're showing everything and that's what I grew up with. So I think that's also a thing where I grew up seeing that, since I was a child and also I feel like how can I not care, how can I not not do anything? Like it's like I can't, I just I can't, I don't know how I couldn't. I think that's also something inside, like I'm just I cannot, I cannot, just not look, I can't. People tell me like, like, don't look, don't look at the pictures, don't look at the videos. It's making a sound. I'm like I cannot, not look, I can't. Yeah, it's like I just I can't.

Speaker 1:

We need more people like you, because this is the, the engagement, right, the whole. You're saying I, I cannot and I'm. I'm sure that has to do with with your past, with your heritage, with being confronted with that topic for such a long time, like it's probably even part of your identity, right, and and that is a beautiful thing, but it's also it's also, I want to say it is at some point I don't know if a burden is the right word because it's a, it's a really important path and it's not something. It's there's a lot of negativity, really sensitive words but obviously also has negative effects, right, which we can't even compare to what's going on there, yeah, and to people who are actually sitting in this crisis, in these war zones.

Speaker 1:

Can you speak a little bit about your courage, straddling that with the negative effects that it brings? Because I think it is important to understand. I'm looking at it, I know that it's gonna bring heartache, I know that it's gonna bring anxiety, I know that it's gonna bring grief, but I'm still doing it. So it's an informed decision of like, I know this is hard, yeah, but I'm still gonna do it, yeah, and that is what I think is very, very honorable, would you share a little bit of what it brought for you?

Speaker 2:

so what I always think about is like I am sure no one of them actually wants their pictures out there, like in that way, like dead bodies, like desperate, like all those things. So I'm just feeling like, and the fact that we're watching these pictures, videos, like they don't like how to explain that, but like I feel like I know that it it makes me sad, it breaks my heart, but I'm literally doing it with them, for them, like I feel like, um, because they don't. I don't think they want that, I don't think they want their mother's dead body on a video, on a picture, um. And of course, I have had like oh, I, I think I haven't had one good night of sleep the last one and a half years. Like I think, like you wake up, and sometimes you wake up and you're like, especially in the beginning, I was like is it a dream? Like is it over? Is it like that? Um, and we cannot forget like this started, like this goes way, way, way back.

Speaker 2:

So this has been miserable for yeah, but like what's going on now is like extreme, it's extreme, it's really extreme, it's yeah, um, but it's also, I think, for me it's like I watch it and then I'm like okay, love, you gotta do something. And that's why I keep on sharing, I keep on talking about it, I keep on boycotting, I keep on like, I stay like because I'm like that's what I can do. I'm trying to use the pain and also remind myself this pain is like this little compared to what they must be in. Yes, and I'm just, I'm trying to just like use it and do something, because I think if I wouldn't do anything, I think I would just dig myself into this hole. That's like that you get sucked into because you're just like so I think that's how I'm coping with it by doing something.

Speaker 1:

Talking about it just like ugh, I believe that not doing anything makes you numb, right, it makes you close your heart off from the potential hurt, grief, terror, anxiety right for being engaged with it. But this, I think and that is a personal opinion is even worse because it takes our humanity from us. We are inextricably connected. We are one big human world. All these identifications and borders and these nationalities right, they make it so easy for us to separate, yeah, but to actually remember that we are all one. And that might sound cheesy, but it's not right. It's what we gotta come down to again and again. And we we gotta open our hearts again and allow that terror in, because otherwise it's gonna take, it's gonna separate us more yeah, that is what's happening in the world.

Speaker 2:

So much that's really hard to see I mean, I notice it myself, like I'm I'm not gonna lie about it like people who have stayed silent and who are aren't showing any like, who are just like shutting off and just doesn't want to have anything to do with it because it's it's too much negativity for them. They say, or stuff like that, I just like I noticed myself, just like, no, I can't deal with that. Yeah, I don't want that. I cannot have that person in my life. I just I can't, because it's too extreme, is too much. It's like we're beyond that, like we we can. And so, of course, it's separating us. Yes, definitely it is separating us. And but, yeah, I, I still, as I said, I share, I talk about it because maybe one day they'll start, you know, wanting to hear and wanting to care and all those things, because you never know yeah.

Speaker 2:

And you never know.

Speaker 1:

You also mentioned that you're boycotting. Yes, let's go a little bit into that, because I know that you're quite informed of, like that's an easy thing we can all do. That is something that certainly has an impact. Yes, what brands, what big commercial organizations? What is out there that we should boycott and buy?

Speaker 2:

So, first of all, we should definitely boycott McDonald's, I know, first of all, we should definitely boycott mcdonald's I know um, like that was.

Speaker 2:

I know we should boycott mcdonald's, like we're talking starbucks. We're talking coca-cola, like pepsi, all these brands, um and uh, actually, soda stream too I read that, yeah, so the stream too. So what I have done and this is like what I have done is like I follow pages like I fall, I think that's um, there are some really good pages and I am really bad at names. I follow all of them. I don't want to like say something wrong, like pronounce um an instagram page wrong, but and I get a lot of information there, but I also check it out myself. Yes, I always double check it, like I. I always do that because I still want to like, know more and and when, when I if you send me these pages afterwards, I'm gonna put them in the show notes.

Speaker 1:

Perfect, everybody who's listening. It's so hard to get really good resources right, so I'm gonna share that.

Speaker 2:

Yes accessible and there are. There's also an app you can download where you scan the, the barcode. Is it called that? Way yeah, and unfortunately I don't feel like the app is updated enough and but there are like some brands and it will show you and it will also like inform you why.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it will like tell you why and how oh, this is great yeah yeah, yeah, it's, it's really, it's really great and, and especially because it's hard, it's hard to remember. Okay, why not the coca-cola? Why was it mcdonald's like what, and in what way are they, uh, funding that and in what way? But it's like you got it there too yeah and so that's also amazing.

Speaker 2:

And but like I, I, I, the the instagram accounts are gold right now. Yes, like they are gold, and of course, you have to like, double check, like some accounts, they, they. You need to be careful, yes, and but I follow the, the big ones and the one that I really feel like you can trust them. I will.

Speaker 1:

I will send you some nice, thank you yeah, yeah, and I know that's once again something that is so golden but also dark in the big world wide web.

Speaker 1:

Right fact checking yes because obviously, this is such a wide topic and there's so many opinions and there is there's so many really loud voices yeah, and usually the loud loud voices are the ones that have been promoted right, and if we only believe what we see on TV, well, somebody owns that TV channel, right? So I think it's really important for everybody out there to realize that war is an industry and what we see is carefully selected. That doesn't mean that everything is wrong, but I really want to form the awareness in people that what we see is carefully selected by somebody in power. Yeah, definitely. And their social media comes in, which is a wild chaos and there is a lot of like, there's shit shows going down there too, and that's not just beautiful, but it gives people a voice. It gives people a channel to speak up and also for people who, who, who are there, who suffer right now, right To to have a voice.

Speaker 2:

Exactly, yeah, and you have a lot of the voices are actually coming from, uh, journalist people in, like it's literally there, I know they're, but they're, they're being targeted, like it's it's, it's a disaster, it is a disaster. It's actually dangerous for a lot of them to even and to even report. But like, and we're also talking like people who were just like you know, like, or like a normal photographer who became a journalist, who maybe didn't like, but that just like okay, I have to inform and got its life, like it's putting its life at risk. So you have a lot of voices from inside of us and I think that's voices we need to listen at. Like we need to listen to those. And I think that's voices we need to listen at, like we need to listen to those. And you see, like I'm not kidding Like I read an article in Sweden we call it Aftonbladet, or here you would call it maybe Zeit in Bild or something like that and you read something and then you're like, of course, if I only I only read that, of course I won't get the whole picture like I won't understand that, like what's going on there is bad, like there's a genocide going on, like it's bad, it's bad, it's really bad, yeah, and yeah, that is an important point that stands out right, because, yeah, we said that war has two sides and it's just wild and weird whatever voices are out there, but there is a genocide going on there and that is as terrible as it gets, and especially here, I mean I think it's weird that it's weird is not the right word it is horrific that here in Austria I mean, it's less than a hundred years ago that we had a genocide going on here yeah, right, yeah, it's something that is just not acceptable.

Speaker 1:

And it doesn't matter what you think of the big companies or whatever your opinion is, that is unacceptable.

Speaker 1:

It's a line that we have to draw and where that also then really made me stand up. And actually you talked about those journalists being down there. It was a last week. I watched a video of a journalist and and she was just how just being confronted with the look in her eyes and her voice shaking. The look in her eyes and her voice shaking is what made me do the last step of initiating our, our talk today. Right, I mean honestly that we're here. You said thank you for you using my platform, but my voice, but I credited it all to you, like I would not be here having that important conversation if I wasn't within, within your field, because, once again, we need each other. If I wouldn't have you as such a big inspiration of keeping her heart open, her voice out there and her eyes open, even if it's terrible, I probably would not feel important or strong enough, but that's what it comes down to. We have so much power as these tiny humans?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we have, and we just have to stand up and use our voices. Yeah, we do, we do. We have to do that. We are so privileged. We're here, we have it so good right now. We're sitting on this bed and we're have it so good right now. We're like sitting on this bed and we're like you know where, we're having it so good right now and I'm just like we have to use our voices we do, we do yeah it is.

Speaker 1:

It's the. It's the one thing that we can definitely do exactly, use our voices exactly. It's not gonna allow us to feel what anybody in the situation is feeling, right, but we have to try to be an ally. Yes, okay, we talked about um boycotting some brands. We talked about following journalists who are actually in the war zone, right, who are reporting using social media. What else is it that people can do, like people like you and me, sitting on their couches, using their privilege, using their voices.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, exactly, using our voices. Keep on talking about it. Talk about it Even when it feels uncomfortable to talk about it. That's actually when we need to talk about it, because that's when I'm like okay, and you come into a room and you can feel like, okay, these people maybe don't want to hear that, but that's when you maybe should talk about it, because that's maybe people that need to, you know, to open up more yeah open up more.

Speaker 2:

And also like I think it's really important to share and like because of the algorithm. Yeah, it's like, it's a thing. The Instagram whole thing. I don't know how that works, but it's a thing. Yes, it is a thing. And like, yeah, boycotting. You do have demonstrations too. Yes, and yeah, I think, like, and, of course, you can donate. You can donate too. I mean, right now it's very limited. They are not getting any access to food and so on, but there are trucks standing outside waiting. I think they let some trucks in now, but there are so many trucks, so many trucks with so much things inside, so I mean donating and yeah, I just heard one or two days ago that I think two or three dozen trucks might be allowed in by.

Speaker 1:

But before the the war quote unquote war officially started, right, I think october 2003. There were a couple hundreds coming in every day, every day. Yeah, like that's, it's just a drop on the hot stone, but it's necessary and yeah it's donation, exactly donation too, and that's what I'm coming up with right now.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and also like I talk about it a lot with my son because I believe in the next generation too.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, you have your mother of two beautiful children. Yeah, yeah, share, share about the journey with them.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, the topic I mean, inaya was, as I said, this has been ongoing since, yeah, yeah, long, long, long time. So it didn't like just start in 2023, but like in I was born 23 right, I think so and so she was like born and then you know all these pictures, everything came out and I remember like for me it was like breastfeeding her in the night and just scrolling and scrolling and crying and scrolling and crying. So inaya, for me, is also like, when I see those babies, children, and it was like I just saw inaya, I just saw inaya all the time. And leo, for me, is like, you know, he's in the age now he's turning five so you can talk about these things with him and I do, I do talk about it with him. I tell him that we're not eating, that we're boycotting, that we're not going there, we're this, and I talk about palestine and I'm very like, open about that, and he knows palestine. He knows palestine. It's super sweet and he'll be like, just like from nowhere. He will be like palestina, like he's very like, and he's like palestine and he's you know, and maybe doesn't get the exact details and all these things, but it's fine, it's gonna come. I just want him to, just the way I have been with my parents on demonstrations and been involved in all these things. I don't know how much I got then, but I feel like that made me a bit also to the person I am today. So, yeah, I'm involving them. I'm definitely involving them, but I'm also, like it's so important for me that they don't have any hate, like I don't want them to hate anyone. I don't. This whole thing also would like like.

Speaker 2:

I always say like, we're standing united. Like there's been so much topics about like, okay, being up against jewish people. No, we're united. You know, we're one like. You have one of the biggest accounts I'm following on instagram and I don't want to say something wrong and what it's called, but it's like it's run by jewish people. It's like, and we are united, we want the same thing. We don't. We don't we. We want the same thing and it's so important. It's so important not to mix that up and not to like no, there is no hate there, not at all like we. That's one thing. We get this hate like no, we need love, we don't need hate exactly, and so I think that's also so important.

Speaker 1:

It is so, so important and what do we feel right? Do we keep fueling the hate with all the rage and the anger and the news, or do we keep fueling the love? And we, we, we educate it, we talk and we, we, we work towards that unity. Yeah, yeah, and does leo know what? What war?

Speaker 2:

is. And yes, we've talked about war. And I tried to say for me it's like and maybe this is a bit, but like I talk about genocide yeah, because I think it's that's the more appropriate word for it and and and I talk about that and I but I say it in a way where I'm like, yeah, they're, I'll be like they're, they're, they're not getting any shoes. And then we, slowly, I was like, okay, they're not getting any food. And I was scrolling the phone. Sometimes I don't even notice it, but like we're sitting and I'm just scrolling the phone and I'm just stopping and I just look at something and he'll be like mama, what is this?

Speaker 2:

what is that mom? What is that? And I'll be like, oh. And he's like, no, I want to, I want to look and I'm like okay. And then it's like a child and he's like why is this child sad? I'm like, yeah, the child, the child's mama, isn't there anymore and he'll be like, but the mom will come back. I was like, leo, the mom won't come back and but that's why, like we love, we love, we love them and we, we will help them. And like we, you know, and I'm trying to like make him understand that, okay, if we love them, if we help them, it's gonna get better. Yeah, somehow I'm not telling him okay, the child will probably like, maybe starve or something like that.

Speaker 2:

I'm trying to still like give him some kind of hope and but yeah, maybe I share too much, maybe it's too, but it's hard, it's hard to know whether that is a.

Speaker 1:

That is a very personal decision right.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think it's once again very, very important to to respect each mini environment's decision right, and that your family's decision and I also like I just I love the thought of. You know, obviously a five-year-old can't comprehend the big matters, but we can plant seeds once again. We can plant these seeds of love, yeah, and if I mean, I'm not a mom yet so I'm probably not qualified to to talk about that, but what I imagine, or my idea of it, is like just just think of our grandparents generation, or the one before right, how we would transport ethics and morals and teach children about, yeah, the hardest subjects were fairy tales, and I know in the us it's probably it's, it's a little different, but here in europe I grew up with really terrible fairy tales and I also believe that children can cope right if they have that loving, supportive environment.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so they are very, very able to look at things Obviously not at the harsh terror unfilled very, very clearly. But yeah, it's important to nurture the next generation.

Speaker 2:

It is, it is, and then I mean that's how it, and then it goes on and then, like they will, hopefully they'll learn something.

Speaker 1:

I want to circle back to something you said. You noticed how people who closed their eyes you felt, you felt like you had to. You just cannot be as engaged with them anymore. I relate to that a lot because of like very different scenario, but in I'm a yoga teacher and I've been in that industry for a decade. Yeah, and there is a lot of toxic positivity, there's a lot of spiritual bypassing, there's a lot of good vibes only culture right, and it is. It doesn't really matter what part of life you look at. These topics are are relevant for, for our homes, for our jobs, for how we are in relationships. But it is so important that we are cultivating a a culture right, because a culture is what we do, how we do things. That's what a culture is, and I think it's really important that we cultivate a culture where we don't just say good vibes only yeah, where we actually keep looking where we actually engage in the heart parts and just in like in relationships.

Speaker 1:

A really good relationship is one where you can talk about the shit, yeah, where you actively stay in the heart conversation and that counts one-on-one and friends, or in in romantic relationships.

Speaker 2:

That counts also with the world out there yeah and with important topics like those yeah, and like I've noticed that I, especially now the last one and a so important and for me, I don't even feel safe and good when I'm around people who don't feel like they want to talk about it I mean my friends, I mean friends. Then that's also what made me like, okay, that person, I just I can't. It's something else when you go into a room and you don't know the people and you realize, okay, you, I just I can't. It's something else when you go into a room and you don't know the people and you realize, okay, you, but when? When?

Speaker 2:

If I'm going to have someone in my life, like a friend or someone, I really that, really, if someone cares and loves me, this should also be something that they um, that they should be willing to, to try to see or wanting to hear more about, and not be like, no't, I don't wanna, that's not no yeah, yeah, some a quote that I heard on the main enough podcast, and it was um a look of it, men on who said it was compassion over comprehension.

Speaker 1:

You do not have to understand everything about a topic, everything about a person, to have compassion. Yes, to round up that conversation, what should be in the center of everybody's eye, mind, heart, right is our humanity. That we don't boycott and share, and keep our eyes open and our voices loud to hate on somebody else.

Speaker 2:

Exactly as you're saying. Like the whole thing is like we need to show each other more love. We don't need more hate. Yes. Like we want everyone to be free, but like until the people in Gaza are aren't free. Like no one is free. Like no one of us is free. How can we be free? Like there will always be like a heavy stone in our hearts.

Speaker 1:

Like everyone needs to be free yeah, and even if you decide not to look there, there is again shared humanity. There is war, there is genocide, there are people, children, being killed. The terror is there, even if you shut your eyes in front of it, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 1:

So to once again sum up, tools that everybody can do is stay in community. That everybody can do is stay in community. Stay in community that makes you feel safe and where you support each other in that hard time. Share on social media, use your voices and share from good resources. Exactly, Really, really important. Do your own research, yeah, Fact check and double check. Another voice don't eat at McDonald's Starbucks. Really, really important. Do your own research, yeah, Fact check and double check. And otherwise, don't eat at McDonald's Starbucks. Checkout, Really. Go on the World Wide Web. There's lists out there with brands that are certainly engaging with that. That war keeps on going. Again, war is an industry and a lot of people profit from it, and I'm saying billions right, so we can use our acts in where we put our coin.

Speaker 1:

Keep talking to people. Exactly that's how we are here. Yeah, exactly, yeah. Yeah, I'm so thankful that we sat down today. I'm so thankful for your presence in my life because you are where I find a lot of eye-opening moments, a lot of resources, but also beyond that, like your compassion, just as a woman, obviously is very shown in this topic that you're just able to keep your heart so wide open. But also beyond that, you are such a powerful woman, a beautiful mom and you're just one of the most beautiful women I know.

Speaker 2:

You're so sweet and I love you. You're amazing too. Thank you for doing this with me.

Speaker 1:

Thank you, hey Bay Club. Thank you for watching this week's episode. I know it's a difficult topic. It is hard to listen to, but that is why I'm on here again just wanting to express extra gratitude, because this is important. We are one and we have to stand up for those who are struggling. Down in the episode details you find all the links that Elof sent me. I also put some additional resources in there. If you want to help follow some of these accounts, comment or share this episode, I really think we should stand united and there is so much you can do. Thank you, I love you.