Race & Safety in America w/ 2A-N-LA - Ep. 22

🎙️ Three for the Founders
Oct 27, 2025 • 69:16 minutes

This week, the hosts of Three for the Founders head to the gun range with guest Alan Wright—better known online as @2A-N-LA—and come back with more than just ringing ears. What follows is a raw, layered conversation on what firearms mean in America: as lived experience, as cultural symbol, as constitutional right, and as public hazard.

From the bing, bing of a Glock that sent one host sprinting, to the data points on suicides, homicides, and mass shootings, to a candid reckoning with how guns conjure both heritage and trauma depending on who’s holding them—this episode refuses to flatten the debate into red-blue soundbites.

Alan offers an inside look at California’s labyrinthine gun laws, breaks down common myths around AR-15s, and situates gun ownership within Black history and the fast-growing reality of Black women arming themselves for safety. The hosts push back, raising questions about school shootings, the “urban” semantics of crime, and what kind of civic covenant—if any—should exist between Americans and their weapons.

The episode doesn’t hand you answers. Instead, it sits in the discomfort: Is fear the real driver of our policies? Are guns scapegoats for deeper wounds like poverty, dislocation, and mental health? And is the Second Amendment the “teeth” behind the First—or a splinter in the body politic?

💡 Takeaways for listeners:

• Guns aren’t just tools; they’re symbols—of freedom, of violence, of belonging, of exclusion.
• The data is messy, and how it’s framed often tells you more than the numbers themselves.
• Common ground exists, but only if we stop outsourcing our opinions to algorithms and start talking like neighbors.

👉 Action items: Subscribe, share your perspective with the hosts, and—if you’re brave—ask yourself which amendment matters more to you: the right to speak, or the right to defend the speaking.

Thanks for joining us. Still got questions? Other things to say? Hit us up at Three for the Founders on Instagram, Facebook, or  YouTube and let us know. Til the next time...left on Founders...we out! 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

So Al picks up the gun, right? And he's pointed at the target. And we're standing there. He's five yards away from the target. We're two yards behind him. And he's like this. So we know he's gonna shoot a gun, right? Because we're at a firing range. And he goes like this. Bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing. And it's clanging off the thing. And LeBron and I were like, what's up? And we ran.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

I kid you know. We followed it. Of course you did. Of course you did. Oh my god. That's the right thing.

SPEAKER_02 0:29

We were not ready.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

No.

SPEAKER_02 0:32

Even though we were standing there, I was like, I'm scared. What's happening?

SPEAKER_00 0:38

What's going on? You should be scared. That is something that should frighten you. It's a gun. It's made to murder. There's a murder machine feet away from you, making big loud noises with which you are unfamiliar. It was a time to be scared.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

It was, it was a time, it was an experience.

SPEAKER_04 0:59

We're brothers. We're happy and we're singing and we're colored.

SPEAKER_03 1:08

All right, cut and print. Beautiful guys. I don't like that. Welcome to Three for the Founders, where brotherhood meets the breakdown. We've been having these conversations for years. And now you are invited to join us. We'll say the things you are afraid to say and ask the questions you've always wanted to ask. Three brothers, all truth, no filters. Let's go. All right. Welcome to Three for the Founders.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

And let me ask you guys this. Yes. You guys are educated men. You guys are smart guys. You guys are fathers and pillars in your communities. What when you think of guns and how they are perceived in your circles, what do you think? What would you say is a general takeaway?

SPEAKER_03 2:05

For me, I have a personal historical context. That Europeans came and colonized America, stole the land, killed the Native Americans, stole the land from Mexico, imported us as slaves, and the only mechanism that allowed them to do that were guns. So that's my first context with guns. Growing up, the police had guns. So the police and the black community have not historically or currently have a great relationship. So I have a negative connotation with guns. Guns to me relates to redneck, front porch, hard R racist trying to prevent people of color from being equal citizens. So I have I have that connection with guns. So it's not the guns, I'm realizing it's the things I connect and relate to guns. And so then that's been, I'm realizing now after spending our time with together, that that's my challenge. It's guns are fine, but who has them and for what? To protect who? Because they're not been to protect me. So that's why I appreciate you saying everyone needs to look at the Second Amendment, and you should have firearms, know how to use them, have them legally, whether you want to use them or not, because the people who may not agree with you may have them, and it's hard to win that argument.

SPEAKER_01 3:29

That's that's uh agree. What about you guys, Antonio John?

SPEAKER_00 3:34

As I've said many times on this podcast to my friends, is like Santa Monica in the 1970s and 80s was different. And we all came up in LA when colors, the movie, were like, yep. Colors cut 2-1, they see to one. My my first real experience around guns was when uh in junior high school, someone we knew got shot and killed outside of the 3-2-1 club in Santa Monica. It was on 321 Santa Monica Boulevard. There were the 20th Street Street Playboys, which was a black gang not far from just across the street from John Adams. And then the Korean killers came in from mid-city, K-town, and dude got shot in the back with a shotgun. And I remember Armando, the dude was coming back and at like at PE was explaining what it was like to watch somebody get shot. And he said it was weird because I knew that he'd get gotten shot. I took his shirt off and I looked at his back because that's where he got shot, and there was a tiny little hole, and I'm like, oh, he must be fine. But then I looked at his stomach and it just like was blown apart because it was a shotgun. And I remember being 13 years old trying to get my brain around that. Like, wait, a bullet goes, it's not like the movies where you know, just like that. That was my first experience that was kind of graphic around guns. And then as I I've it's been very geographically dependent. When I moved to Northern California, I moved east of Sacramento, which was a very white, affluent area, a lot of conservatives, a couple, a couple exits up from where I lived were Confederate flags. I'm not kidding. Um, a lot of guns, a lot of good people with guns. And I had experiences going out as just like you all on Sunday, going out with friends and shooting, going, Oh, I see this. And I remember one of those friends when Biden got elected. So this was recently, he was he in a group text said, Oh man, I'm uh he's coming for our guns. And I was like, You Do you really think someone's gonna knock on your door and steal your guns? Come on, are you really afraid of that? He's like, I kind of am. And that was that was a new experience for me was to see here's what Jesus feeling like I'm having rights taken away from me.

SPEAKER_01 5:34

Well, well, do you know why he felt that way? Because his algorithm said, Biden's coming for your guns. And day after day after day, that's what he heard. That's right. The same way people who are in other algorithms make you feel like every day 500 million people are dying from gunshots. You know, it's that algorithm play that that people are building in that are influencing and create and designed to create these visceral emotional reactions to things.

SPEAKER_02 6:06

And that's or every day that millions of people are pouring over the border and we're under an invasion. Thank you. Is that too? Yes. Is that another one?

SPEAKER_04 6:15

So is that too?

SPEAKER_02 6:17

So we went, right? We went Sunday. I came home, I was like, it was a little anticlimactic, firing, firing a weapon. Went to work, and I was telling somebody about my experience. I said, Oh, I went shooting over the weekend. Eyes got big. Yeah, we did a step back, right? And as I related my experience, they like moved away from me. Like I had become dangerous, yeah, because I did had a because I had a positive experience with guns.

SPEAKER_04 6:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:59

And that was really interesting to me, like to be honest, because I was just, you know, like, what'd you do this weekend? Well, I went to this, I did this, I did this. I said I spent some time with my boys. And I fired the Glock like that. When I said I fired an AR-15, they were like, You're too close to the school.

SPEAKER_03 7:23

Move away, Antonio.

unknown 7:25

Right.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

And so it's it's been really interesting watching the echoes of the experience, right? Because I didn't say, I did, I did quote, right, when we left, 2A in LA popped out, and he was like, Look, I need you to do two things. I need you to buy a gun and I need you to get a concealed carry permit. And I was like, I'm probably not gonna buy a gun. I'll just be honest, I'd probably not. But I don't see the harm in having a concealed carry permit, right? And and if the if the obvious civil war pops off that LeBron keeps talking about. We know whose house we're going to. Right. Al has 80 guns. He said, cool, just make sure you bring food. He also told me, like, when I bring the pizza and the roast chicken, like, come in hands up. And I was like, okay. That's that part. That's right. I think that there is a very definite benefit or necessity to everybody being familiar with and comfortable with the utilization of firearms. I do think that that there is a problem with people, but I think that's a problem with people because firearms didn't pull the valet for Donald Trump. Firearms didn't write Project 2025. Those people just happen to like firearms too. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 8:58

That's the issue.

SPEAKER_02 8:59

They just happen to like fire too. And so to the point that, you know, the largest group, right, listen to black women. I don't know. Maybe that's a thing. Like the largest group of gun owners that's grown the last five years is black women. Maybe they know what they're talking about. Maybe that comfort with or that owning of or that participation in having armaments isn't the demon that we think. And what we're still talking about is white supremacy. What we're still talking about is white violence because that's what we've associated it with. We made the joke, right? John said, are they going to start profiling serial killers? Because if they are, then I have to start carrying my papers because you drive a true. They look like me, the global minority. Right? Yes. And so I think there's a piece of this conversation that, frankly, I'll be very honest, is uncomfortable to say for me as somebody who is pro-gun control. I think I'm a little bit further back on the scale than the atomic bomb and the tank. I don't know that anybody needs to have anything more than a rifle. I won't say I enjoyed firing the AR-15, but that felt like a lot of that felt like a lot of weapon for everybody next door to have to me as I was as I was participating in that. That's that's how I felt about it. Um I was looking for trying.

SPEAKER_03 10:37

I'm sorry, is it legal for anyone to just get an AR-15? I thought only like special people are special permits for that. Like I can stand a handgun, but I didn't know anyone can just go get an AR-15.

SPEAKER_02 10:48

Well, he is an FFL03. Oh that I am. Is that a certification that you've asked somebody?

SPEAKER_01 10:55

It's a federal, fed, it's a it's a federal firearms licensee. It gives me certain privileges as a collector. But no, anybody can own an AR-15. There is no special permit required. It's nothing but a rifle. So why don't John before before I go into the context? What's kind of been your framework or your thought process on guns if you as you see them personally in the media, in your circles? What are you seeing relative to people's attitudes and your attitude towards firearms?

SPEAKER_00 11:29

Yeah, well, as as we're talking this, I'm going to answer that question. It comes back to another thing that we talked a lot about on this podcast, which is symbols. The gun is a symbol, it's it's a huge American symbol of everything that you just said. I'm glad you asked that question, Alan, because there was a time where we were talking about the Confederate flag as a symbol. And I asked these guys, these gentlemen, do you understand a southerner's connection, emotional connection to that symbol, meaning their lineage? And Antonio said, Yes. Do they understand my emotional connection to that symbol? And I like that because it was, hey, there are everybody's experiencing a different thing with guns as a symbol. The problem is this is a symbol that actually can kill things too. You know, as it was built to murder people and things, and that's where the that's where the intelligence and the wisdom has to come in. And when I hear you talk, Alan, you you believe in what I call gun control. Even though you say, you know, because when you describe sensible background checks, not just anyone could get them, you know, that and and a process, to me, that is gun control. And so that there's even something in how we define these different things that is that is dividing us.

SPEAKER_01 12:36

So for me, I think the issue that I have with politicians, mainstream media, is that they're disingenuous. I I think a lot of people think that you can go out to a store like like Antonio, like you said you probably would not buy a gun. But let's for argument's sake, you had a great time, a wonderful time, you loved it, you're pumped up, you're you're excited about going out and buying your first gun.

SPEAKER_02 13:07

You mean I'm LeBron?

unknown 13:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

Okay, you're meaning I'm a go through to buy a gun in the state of California. Now, I'm sure you guys are all familiar with our governor, and he never misses a moment to tell you we need more gun control. So let me tell you what you would have to go through if you wanted to buy a gun. Number one, you would have to go to a local store, a local, and and these stores are called federal firearms licensees. Walmart? Walmart doesn't sell. They sell it. I don't think anymore. There was a period of time where they kind of stopped that. Okay. Let's just let's just say a normal gun store. Sure. I've driven past that. You would have to go to a gun store and you would have to take a safety exam. And you would have to pass that exam. And assuming you passed the safety exam, you would then have to pass a background check. And assuming you pass the background check, you would then have to wait, not one, not two, not three, not four, not five, you would have to wait 10 days before you after you paid for your firearm to actually go pick up your firearm. So when people are like, oh, we need more gun control, I'm like, well, how much more can you do you need? And believe me, I'm just scratching the surface of California gun control laws. Let alone like them dictating what you can buy, how you can buy, et cetera, et cetera. The list goes on and on and on. But it is not what people, I think a lot of people, if they listen to media, they think you can go down to the gun store today, pick out a gun, pay for it, take it home, and start shooting. That is not. It's not the way it works here. That is not the way it works in any state.

SPEAKER_02 15:02

Thank God. Sure. Now some of the things. So the the the end result of that, right, is the last five people who have been highlighted for uh gun violence, specifically political against politicians, the dude who shot Charlie Kirk, um, you know, and and the guy who shot at President Trump. Right? Yeah. All of these people purchased their firearms legally. Yes. Right? So they went through that. Um and and so the the the the turn of the right the the the fallacious definition of insanity is to continue doing the same thing, expecting different results.

SPEAKER_01 15:50

Oh, I'm so glad you said that, young man.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

I'm so glad you said that definition. Um and so my question is, and and Chris Rock said this as a joke. I think it was Chris Rock, right? As John is enamored of comedians because they will save us. He said, we don't need gun control, we need bullet control. He said every bullet needs to be tagged with who bought it, right? Every bullet needs to be traced with this, and so I ask you as uh uh a proponent of guns, right? I I think that I think that's a fair like do you think that that would address the common perception that guns are the issue, right?

SPEAKER_01 16:43

It may address it may address the perception, but I'm less concerned about perception, I'm more concerned about reality. It would do nothing for the problem. And I think the the the issue that I have with politicians is that gun control would be the equivalent if I stabbed you and you're bleeding out, right? And you also had a hangnail. The stab wound and the hangnail are both problems, right? But imagine you being more focused about the hang the hangnail than you were about the blood gushing out of your body. It is not it is not the thing that is guns, are not the thing that are really causing the problem. And for for me to make that make sense, I have to give some context. Okay? Context is king. So I'm gonna I'm gonna do my best impersonation of LeBron. I'm gonna give the math. So I think I have heard politicians at every level talk about the COVID-like epidemic that has gone violence, right? And so what I think we need to do is I think we need to look at the numbers. So let's start off here. The United States has approximately a population of 340 million people, right? Okay, just for context, we have about 280 million automobiles in this country versus 340 million. So almost as many cars as pink as as there are human beings in the country, citizens in the country, right? We have 400 million guns in the United States. So for everybody who wants to outlaw guns, good luck trying to go around and collect 400 million guns, household to household. It's not gonna happen. But I just again context more guns than cars, more guns than people, right? We have approximately, and let me give this every year, three million people die in our country. All right, 340 million people every year, three million people die.

SPEAKER_02 19:21

Is that a little bit less than one percent?

SPEAKER_01 19:26

LeBron, you're the Mav guy. You tell me. I know, that's why I'm looking at him.

SPEAKER_00 19:29

Yes. Thank you. But you already die of everything. Of everything.

SPEAKER_01 19:35

No matter what, about three million people every year are going to pass away. Okay? Out of our 340 million. Of that, 3 million people that die every year, 60, well, in the most recent year, 45,000 died of gun-related deaths. Historically, that number's always kind of been between 30 and 50,000, right? So let's just say on average, about 40 to 50,000 people die every year as a result of gun bias, right? So then one has your ask yourself, how big a problem is it? Three million people die every year in our country, regardless. Of that three million, only about 40 to 50,000 die of gun deaths. Of those, and so let's break it down even further. Of those 40 to 50,000 that die of gun-related deaths, 60 percent of those are suicides. So not the mass shootings that you always hear about on TV, not the the school shooting. No, no, no, no. 60 percent of those people perish because of suicide. Okay, so that leaves about 18,000 or so, 15 uh to 18,000 or so homicides that take place every year. Now, I'm I'm I'm I would never be little one life, let alone 15 to 18,000 people, but I just there needs to be context. When you hear people just 18,000 sounds like that's a lot, but gun violence doesn't even crack the top 15 reasons why people pass away in this country. And so that this I just want to give some context to the people who are listening and watching your podcast. When you hear the media say that it's a COVID like epidemic, in their minds, they're probably thinking hundreds of thousands of people pass away from gun violence every year. No, it's more like 40 to 50. 60% of that is suicide, the vast majority of it is suicide. Now, what weapon do you always hear about more often than not? Particularly in recent times, the AR-15.

SPEAKER_02 22:04

But let me ask you a question Al. Because I I I I I trust look, I trust your numbers. We had a, we had a we don't have a producer, but we had a dry run to this conversation at Chili's. And the bartender, you know, shut up.

SPEAKER_03 22:21

Shut out.

SPEAKER_02 22:22

And so, but my question is, right? Because it's a priority issue, it's not about the guns, it's about the deaths. And so those call it 15,000. I will go with the smallest number, 15 to 18,000. But people who are afraid of the unknown, the uncertainty, the uncontrollability of going to school, of standing up and spouting a bunch of bullshit, if I'm a you know, yeah, Charlie. Call it what it is, yeah, of being at church and the ability of one person to end those lives is I think where, and we've talked about this before, we're starting at different places, and so we're ending at different places. I'm not disagreeing with any of the numbers that you've thrown out or the perception in the mass media. Like I said, when I was talking to this this colleague, I watched her shrink as I said, I shot a Glock, I shot an AR-15. I watched her perception and processing around the larger story. I think that's a real thing. And I know that that in my educational institution, we have protocols now because any one person who may have purchased it legally can end so many lives. Okay, so let's let's let's let's let's disappear.

SPEAKER_00 24:12

So that's that's where I want to go. That's where I want to go.

SPEAKER_01 24:16

No, I'm with you, I'm with you. But here's the thing I'm gonna tell you something that my dad told me. Now, my dad is not an educated man, never went to college. He's not legal, but but he's wise. Crazy people are gonna do what crazy people do, and criminals are gonna do what criminals do. And and us inventing laws that are not going to do anything to make people feel better is not the answer. And I think that's my concern. So so let's dig into it a little bit more because again, I think it's contextual. So if if if the 15,000 are not sliding 15,000, um, but what is why do people feel the way that they feel? I think even if there you go about feeling recoiled, Antonio, when you told her what you did, she's recoiling because of what she sees on television, she's recoiling because of what she hears and sees in her algorithm. And without any context, she's led to she but probably believes that these kinds of things are going on on a daily basis. And so again, I'm gonna go back to the numbers. Three million people die every single year. 15,000 of those are homicides. Let's dig into those numbers. What do they really look like? I'll also say this the reason why I asked you, Antonio, what what's the weapon that you hear about more than any other? It's the AR-15. We do something about the AR-15. Do you guys know that 97% of all mass shootings are done with handguns and not AR-15s?

SPEAKER_03 26:15

I thought they were all done by white males.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

I'm talking about the weapon.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

But but LeBron's question was about the weapon. Well, that part too. That part too, yes.

SPEAKER_01 26:32

I just want to be clear that when when people are out there, you know, AR-15, AR-15, the the weapon of choice for mass shooters is handguns. Why? Because they're far more concealable than a rifle. And so 90, so only about 3%, look, there's only 15,000 gun deaths every every year via homicide. 97% of those are done with a handgun. So to me, if politicians were sincere about eliminating mass shootings, they would focus on the weapon that 97% of the people use, not 3% of the people. And again, this is a situation where the AR-15 looks mean, it looks something. It's a weapon of war. First of all, I hate the phrase weapon of war.

SPEAKER_03 27:23

Oh, you look at nutty. We are the weapon of war.

SPEAKER_01 27:26

Handguns have been used in in war, it in every war that we've had historically.

SPEAKER_02 27:32

Handguns have been worn in every war. I don't know if they've been used, but John's got a big thing. No, they've been used. No, no. John's got John's got the furrowed brow.

SPEAKER_00 27:42

So of the 15,000, how many are children?

SPEAKER_01 27:48

I can't, I don't have that fact in in hand. But but what's the definition of children?

SPEAKER_03 27:54

And so that's something that came out of a woman's body.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

That would make you a child. That's the case. Exactly. John, John, let me let me address directly address that.

SPEAKER_02 28:07

What I will say is hold on, Alan. John, finish that question. Address that, and then I know he's gonna I know he's gonna answer it, but where were you going with that?

SPEAKER_00 28:17

I think where I'm going is gonna fit with what however Alan answers the question. Well, you can't answer the number question.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

So what I will say is I think I don't have the exact number, John, but I do know that the definition of what what the media and politicians generally uh espouse is up to 18, up to 17, 18 years old. And so most of those gun deaths of children take place between ages kind of 14 to 18. Yeah, those are children. They're not young children, they're 14 to 18. Now, no, no, no. I need you to keep that same energy for what I'm about to say. Bruh, you know I keep the energy. Come on now, Alan.

SPEAKER_04 29:03

I need you keeping energy for everybody.

SPEAKER_02 29:06

As somebody who deals with as somebody who deals with 14 to 18 year olds, those are children. Yes, as grown as grown as the f I think they are.

SPEAKER_01 29:16

I'm saying though, that I think when the media says children, they're not thinking about kind of young adult high school age kids. They're thinking about elementary school and younger. So I just again, my, and I'm not saying that you guys feel this way. I'm saying that I deal with people in this space all the time. And I'm saying that even if you don't feel this way, trust me, a lot of people that are gonna be listening to this podcast think that when we say children, we're talking about young, young children, elementary school age, junior high kid, and not like civic school kids.

SPEAKER_02 29:54

Right. And here's where I'm gonna say that there are too many people who, so Janine Pierrot, right now, who jumped from Fox News to become the uh assess attorney general of the District of Columbia, is now trying to try people, uh, try children 14 to 18 as adults in order to have a more uh uh uh a harsher sentence for when they get convicted. And so as you know I love you, but I don't believe that that is true based on what I see out loud. There are too many people who understand that children, right? I have I'm talking right now about uh health insurance, and we can keep them on till they're 26, except that my job uh has a little bit of extra blah blah blah blah blah, and I can keep them till they're 30. You know what? I deal with the 24 and the 25-year-old all the time. And they're growing, but they're children, but they ain't grown, they ain't grown, but I that's that's not only anecdotal, but it's societal. Like it's not true that they think like when you say children, we're only talking about babies.

SPEAKER_01 31:04

No, no, I'm not saying that. So so let me be clear.

SPEAKER_02 31:07

Let me let me try to let me try to I misunderstood.

SPEAKER_01 31:08

Let me try to land this if I can. I misunderstood. Yeah, let me try to land this if I can. All right. The reason why that age is so important in our conversation is because of societal issues. You guys asked me, I I don't view guns as the problem. And I don't think the solution to the problems are gun related. I think there are bigger issues at play here that the media doesn't want to talk about, that politicians don't want to talk about.

SPEAKER_03 31:36

Don't want to talk about.

SPEAKER_01 31:37

It's much easier to blame the gun. And we don't have any solutions for the underlying issues that I'm gonna get into. Yeah, but it's far more easier for me to throw out some gun control law that's not gonna do anything to address the problem, to make people feel warm and fuzzy and like I'm doing something when I'm really not.

SPEAKER_02 31:56

Let me be clear. Let me be clear. I I roll with it. Was that better? Was that better? I don't know if it was better. Like that's true. I like John, I want to I just want you to to finish that underlying thought.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

Well, I want you to.

SPEAKER_00 32:13

I feel like I want Alan to finish this argument, Alan. I want to finish.

SPEAKER_01 32:17

I want to answer John's question, right? But I appreciate it. So I think that 14 to 18 percent, I mean, sorry, that 14 to 18 age is going to be more relevant as I speak about what I'm about to say, right? So we kind of talked about some context between the number of people that died, the number of people who died of gun deaths, the number of people who died of homicides, right? Of all the homicides in the U.S., all the gun homicides that are in the U.S., 55% are isolated in 120 cities. And if you laid those cities side by side with one another, they would constitute about 42 miles and 42 miles. So it would be the size of Rhode Island, if you would. So my point here is that these gun deaths are very concentrated, they are not spread throughout the United States as one might think. They are very, very highly concentrated in highly urban cities where people highly rural cities.

SPEAKER_03 33:23

13 out of 15 out of 20 of the most killed people are in red states. So those are mainly in the South, Louisiana, Missouri. So I sound like not California.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

Well, so you got to be careful with that too, because when people say red states, okay, but these things are very city dense. And so I'll give you the top cities where the most deaths, most gunned homicides take place, highest homicide rates. Jacksonville, Mississippi, St. Louis, Missouri, New Orleans, Detroit, Memphis, Baltimore, Washington, D.C. So five of those six were all South.

SPEAKER_02 34:05

South in red states. Yes. So that's fine.

SPEAKER_01 34:09

All would all well, all the ones I just named are Democratic-run cities. You said Memphis. You said St. Louis.

SPEAKER_02 34:16

You said New Orleans.

SPEAKER_01 34:19

St. Louis is urban.

SPEAKER_03 34:20

St. Louis is not rural. It's in Missouri. It's the white one, the whiteest.

SPEAKER_01 34:25

But I'm talking about I'm I'm naming the cities where gun deaths are taken up. Let me just land and then I'm gonna go over here. Let me land and then you guys can come in and say whatever you like to say.

SPEAKER_03 34:37

Land the play now. Oh it's under the bus.

SPEAKER_01 34:40

So again, I would say St. Louis, Missouri, urban, New Orleans, urban, Detroit, urban, Baltimore, urban, Washington, D.C., urban. I don't care who the governor of the state is. That's not a part of my argument. You guys are bringing up something where I'm not landing.

SPEAKER_02 34:54

So no, but Al, you said, let me name the cities. Cities by definition are urban.

SPEAKER_01 35:00

It's hot the homicides are highly concentrated. Concentrated. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:06

So it's that correct me if I'm wrong, Al, it sounds like you're pro-gun, pro-second amendment, and that the problem is only black people in urban communities and that white people ain't shooting nobody. That's what it's saying. That's what it sounds like from the context of what we're saying.

SPEAKER_01 35:28

I say what I mean, and I mean what I say. You don't have to interpret my words. I said what I said. We said what we said.

SPEAKER_02 35:35

But no, but this this goes back to the part that I was talking about, and I asked you this the other day, right? When you say urban, if I'm talking about urban radio, I'm talking about black radio. Urban gets used in a lot of different ways. And the reason, right, when you said I'm gonna name the top cities, by definition, you're naming the top urban areas, right? That's what I was saying. And my only pushback before you landed the plane, I wasn't taking the I wasn't taking the reins from you. We're not going back up. I'm saying that cities don't regulate guns.

unknown 36:11

Right.

SPEAKER_01 36:11

But that was my point was not regulation here. No, your point was who's doing it.

SPEAKER_00 36:16

You're trying to give us the scale and the scope of the numbers.

SPEAKER_01 36:19

I'm trying to say where these things transpire the most. Because these things are condensed, because they tend to be in urban cities where people sit on top of one another, where there's lack of access to quality health care, where there's lack of access to quality education, where there's lack of access to upward mobility, where the earnings gap is getting further and further apart. Things like gangs sprout up. Things like drugs.

SPEAKER_03 36:54

The Proud Boys, those kind of gangs or what? The Proud Boys The White Supremace Group, those kind of games. Okay, I'm just talking about same energy, LeBron.

SPEAKER_01 37:03

Same energy. I don't look at it. I get LeBron that you feel like there's a narrative out there that it's all the black froth's all the black people's fault. And and and and I get that there is a big racism focus. That's not my that's not my point here. Exactly. I'm just trying to deal with the the facts of the matter. The data. And for for me, we don't have a gun problem in this country. We have a suicide problem in this country. We have a mental health problem in this country. We have a wage gap problem in this country.

SPEAKER_03 37:46

I agree with you.

SPEAKER_01 37:47

We have a health care problem in this country. And I'm I would be willing to bet if we could address those things, you know what would go down? Gun deaths in this train.

SPEAKER_00 37:58

Well, Alan, that's that's the perfect serve service to where I want to go with this. The I want talking about energy. I want that same energy that you have and people who stand on that same on those same facts that you have. I want that same energy going into solving those problems instead of defending guns. And because what I'm feeling from you is the proper defensiveness of having been attacked by the mean the media and having politicians that don't represent you, and having politicians on every side seize on an opportunity, horrific opportunity to make their case inflated, not use true facts, and play on the emotions of people. Yes. And I so I think you are properly fed up with some of that. And so you come to a conversation like this or any conversation with bullets in that gun. Like I'm gonna tell you, and here are my bullets, the three million and the million. Well, I'm saying stab wound hangnail analogy. The stab wound right now is the fact that kids still get killed at schools. And we gotta we gotta do a better job fixing that. And if it's if they have access to ARs, they're gonna be able to do it more quickly. And I know we can talk about what how much what are the percentages of those that actually showed up with an AR versus a handgun. I hate that we're even having that conversation, but we should. Where I'm going with this is the car analogy falls apart right away. As far as getting scale and scope, because we we buy a car to get places and we might get two or three or four. But when you get in a car, the purpose of that car is to get you somewhere and you're in a covenant with other car drivers. That covenant is I have a license, I'm gonna go on the right side of the road while you go on the right side of the road, and then we're gonna go take a left because when the light says this, it's green. Like we all there's this very complex thing that we all submit to. And so we're in like a covenant with one another as car drivers. You don't have a covenant with me as a gun owner, other than your moral character, your attention to the brotherhood of mankind and being a good citizen. So, like for me, Alan, I I have zero problem with you having 80 guns, however many guns, because you are a man of character and intelligence, you have no desire to hurt other people. Your origin story with how you got a gun was self-protection, and I completely respect that. And then it became a hobby, and now it's a cause, rightfully, for you, like you're talking about. However, how do we have that same covenant with everybody that buys a gun, just like we have that covenant with everyone who drives a car?

SPEAKER_01 40:27

Can you think solved for that? I think for me, the covenant is the same. There is, I can't, how many times have we heard about some guy, some nut job, who plowed into a crowd of people in a car? Right?

SPEAKER_00 40:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:46

How many people do we know who get behind the wheel drunk and go out and drive and kill somebody because they opted to drive intoxicate? Now if what do we if if they wanted to address that, if they wanted to create a requirement, pass a federal law that said anytime you got into a car, you'd have to blow into a breathalyzer to start your vehicle, would we all be cool with that? Or would we be will we feel like it's infringing upon our right? And even if we were cool with it because of the greater good, how easy would it be for me to tell LeBron, LeBron, just blowing it out so I can go home? It's not gonna work. It's not going to work. And so that's my issue with the gun control conversation. It's not focusing on the underlying issues, it's not going to do anything because criminals don't care about your gun control law. They we have laws against murder, right? We have laws against assault. Did that stop the guy from murdering Charlie Klerk? No. No. No, crazy is going to do what crazy does. Criminals are going to do what criminals do. If you want to try to address that, let's create less crazies and let's create less criminals. And we do that by addressing the underlying issue. My issue with politicians are they don't have answers to any of that stuff. It is far easier to say, let's throw on some other stupid gun control thing that is not going to do anything towards California compared to other less stringent gun control states, though. Uh I would say next next to all in terms of in terms of what's the what's the outcome of these stricter gun control laws?

SPEAKER_00 43:01

Is it any better? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:03

But the fact is, first of all, I'll say I appreciate the math and the facts from now. Just remember that there's three types of lies: lies, damn lies, and statistics. So both sides, pro or against Republican or Democrat, can always massage and manipulate the numbers because that's what I do for a living. But there was a good argument. Now, just like breast cancer is not a big deal. Heart disease is a bigger killer of people and women.

SPEAKER_02 43:36

It's number one. Number one as I went to my cardiologist to death. It's number one.

SPEAKER_03 43:41

I'm so glad that you go. But we politicize, we market breast cancer, we have we spend money and research on cancer because that's the sexy thing. That's what they market you to believe in. Now, that's why I think this argument or debate, not an argument, is so emotional. Because when you throw the facts away on both sides, it's emotional. And we just have to deal that people have emotions. The the two A community have their emotions and beliefs. People who are against guns have theirs. And like I said, how do we have this kind of talk and debate? There's no right or wrong. It's point it's points of view. I think that's what's what's fascinating to me about the United States of America is that we will argue and damn near kill each other and disagree over guns. But somehow we all agree that we should protect Israel. So how do we, Democrats and Republicans who hate each other so many agree on that one issue? I need to figure out how we can agree on guns then. I'm just joking.

SPEAKER_02 44:43

Well, welcome to LeBron's life.

SPEAKER_01 44:45

Welcome to he like we I haven't formed a solid opinion relative to that. So I'll let LeBron lead that lead.

SPEAKER_02 44:55

No, I won't let LeBron lead that in any way, shape, or motherfucking form.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

I have a question. Why do you think you mentioned it at the very beginning, Al, about your diving into this community and discovering that you you were in that community, kind of the way I am in our fraternal community? You know, there's not a lot that look like me in the in the Divine Nine. There's not a lot of men who look like you in the gun-owning world and the gun enthusiast world. So why, and I ask you, Al, on this, but I also and Sonia LeBron, like, why do you think the gun enthusiasm falls so hard on those racial lines? Why has it, why is it such a white thing to be a gun enthusiast?

SPEAKER_01 45:36

I gotta go. I think historically because black people were not allowed to own firearms, so we don't have a legacy of firearm ownership like like Caucasian people do in this country. But I will say that that's growing. That's why our demographic legal gun ownership is becoming a thing in the African Chamere, in the African-American community, in the Latino community, in the Asian community. I do see that as evolving.

SPEAKER_03 46:06

Yeah. Go ahead, Antonio. Please bring that energy. I saw crazy.

SPEAKER_02 46:10

I was gonna say, I was gonna say, like what he said. Yes, that was some good shit. And Alan's uh I think assessment about black people not being able to own guns is true. And I think there's a conversation to be had about the stereotypes of black and brown folk, either as lazy or violent. I think that there's a large cultural component that works in terms of how laws are written. And and LeBron has talked about uh racism being when you have government backing, right? And so we've talked about immigration laws being racist on their face. Al has contributed that uh you know, gun control laws are racist on their face. And so I think there's a piece of this where people of color have accepted, have swallowed, have internalized that those amendments are not written for them, that the Constitution is not written for them, that as people in the United States, we are not actually full citizens. And so all of those benefits, because every time we've uh reached out to take those benefits, literally have been violently wiped off the face of the earth. And so there's a piece of it where whether or not uh the laws were written, to your point, Al, right? The laws were also written about whether or not black folk could learn to read, and black folk still learn to read, there's a piece of it where laws being written about black folk owning guns or congregating, which is why we made you drive to step shows.

SPEAKER_00 47:55

There you go.

unknown 47:56

Right.

SPEAKER_00 47:57

Gathering the hoop to y'all.

SPEAKER_02 47:58

That that that that piece of it was if I do this, if I reach for that brass ring, if I accept if I take full citizenship, the devastation is going to be Tulsa, Oklahoma. The devastation is gonna be the two young men who've been lynched in the last two days. The devastation is not only gonna be my death, but it's going to be the death of my family. And so there's and that's why I'm applying to get my land when I go to your house with a pizza, but I'll be hands up. I just think that there's a piece of it where when we talk about why is the racial disparity, we can't do it without talking about those historical.

SPEAKER_03 48:48

That context. Yeah. I appreciate that. And I have one question for all of you. So for the future of the democracy of the United States, which amendment do you think is most important? The First Amendment or the Second Amendment?

SPEAKER_02 49:04

Are those my only two choices?

SPEAKER_03 49:07

Unless you have another one. I'm sure Antonio has another one. Well, there are there are 27 amendments, bro. I only know two. So if you have another one, you want to pick. I say that because we're talking about the second, and the first one's being attacked. And so I'm just curious.

SPEAKER_01 49:25

So it's it's funny you say that, LeBron. There's another comedian that has this joke. Yeah. And he's the on the daily show. I think it's Michael Costa. I think it's Michael Costa. Okay. All right, go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 49:33

Yeah, go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 49:34

So so Michael Costa is talking about this exact same thing. He's talking about the first thing, the first amendment and the second amendment.

SPEAKER_04 49:40

Right.

SPEAKER_01 49:41

He said, you know, the founders sat around and they said, we should have freedom of speech. And the very next thing out of their mouths was, but you better have a gun. They said, no, you should be able to say whatever you want to say, but you better have a gun. And I think that goes back to my earlier point, yeah, is that the second amendment is what gives teeth to the other amendments in my change.

SPEAKER_02 50:10

Maybe that's where we started. I'm not I'm not disagreeing with that. It is the second amendment. Right. You came right in. They put five, they put five things in the first, and then they was like, but you better have a gun. Right. And maybe that's maybe that's true, right? LeBron, you asked the question: Does the tree ever strangle its fruit?

SPEAKER_03 50:34

Maybe it doesn't. There you go. You can't have a United States without guns. So you can't get rid of it. Otherwise, it would not be the United States. You wouldn't be called white or American without gun and killing people. So you can't be an American or white without having a gun because who would you be? Without the gun, you don't have a culture.

SPEAKER_00 50:54

Alan, you your origin story with guns, like you said, was in the 90s. You bought that. What was what was the first gun that you got?

SPEAKER_01 51:00

A little Chrome Davis Industries 380.

SPEAKER_00 51:03

That you still have. It was terrible. So it started as you said, I'm I'm gonna protect myself. And then it became, you know, especially you kept that for years, and then 2020 happened in the story, and now it's mostly about this passion that you have for the whole the whole enterprise. Are you 70, 80 percent enthusiast? Just love the like a car enthusiast. I just love the look, the this model, and that, and then maybe 20, 30 percent protection. Are you half and half? Like what where are you at emotionally with why it's so important to have a gun? Is it mostly about self-protection?

SPEAKER_01 51:36

I'd say, I'd say fundamentally is it is about being able to protect myself, protect my family, and protect my friends. I would say beyond that, similarly, a car is primarily a means of transportation to get you from point A to point B. But you know, we like our cars to look a certain way. So there's a little style points that go along with that, right? And so, yes, so fundamentally is about self-protection and self-preservation, and then secondarily, it has evolved into a passion and an appreciation for guns and the pieces of art that they are capable of being at the highest level.

SPEAKER_03 52:25

Yeah, so Al, I'm I'm gonna let you guys have one question out before I forget. In your to a community, I know you can't speak for everyone, I'm just saying, just in general, they believe they all feel like this the United States is so dangerous that you have to have a gun because at any given moment they could their lives could be in danger. Is that the general, or is that is that an oversimplification?

SPEAKER_01 52:49

Because that's sort of I think that's relatively I I think that most people in the two-way space, and keep in mind, you know, the two-way space is not a model, just like black. Exactly right, yeah. But I would say, generally speaking, people like the bloods and the cryps and the proud boys on opposite ends of they're the exceptions to the rule. I think we always say the squeaky wheel gets the Greece, right? So they have the loudest voices, so those are you who you hear about the most. But I would say the vast majority of people in the two-way space believe and and hope that they will live and die, never having to brandish and fire wrong in a self-defense situation. The goal is that they never have to do that. The reality of it is though that these things do happen, they do transpire, and better to get the goal of everyone should be to get home to their family and and to protect their family. And so I think that's why they carry firearms, and uh and that's why they own them for the most part.

SPEAKER_03 54:01

Okay, because I wonder, because you you when you shared the data of the how many people were killed on the 40,000, most of them are suicide 18,000. I'm like, ain't hardly nobody getting shot. So what's the need for all the guns if ain't nobody hardly getting shot or killed? So then I'm wondering where does what is the impetus, where does that message come from? Is the algorithm what's causing people to have that sentiment? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 54:21

What I would say, LeBron, is keep in mind, all I'm giving you is the homicide number. We do live in a relatively violent country. And so I think that while the gun deaths are far over exaggerated and overstated, I do think there are real violence statistics and rape statistics and things of that nature that guns would be a uh a deterrent for.

unknown 54:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 54:48

Or a mitigating factor in. I mean, to be f to be fair, like your numbers were about gun deaths, but not crimes committed with guns. Right. Which is a whole thing.

SPEAKER_01 55:00

Nor am I giving you the statistics. Yeah, no, 100%. Nor am I giving you the statistics for crimes that were thwarted because somebody had a gun too. Those numbers are far larger than gun deaths. Right. And so if there weren't good guys with guns, there'd be far more gun deaths every year. So just I know I know one good guy with a gun.

SPEAKER_02 55:24

I'm looking at this podcast.

SPEAKER_03 55:26

The only one I know is I'm looking at him always great. This is the only one I know.

SPEAKER_00 55:30

Right. Well, I do, you know, Alan, back to even the the beginning of all this, is like I want people who the those who do feel that certain something about, you know, whether it's Antonio saying that he had a he shot a Glock and then they feel a certain way. Or anyone that I'm in contact with. I mean, that that is a very common feeling about guns in general. I know you know I live on the west side of Los Angeles. It's it's it doesn't feel gun friendly in general. And there is this visceral reaction to it a lot because of the how we've been conditioned through the algorithms, through politicians, everything else. I think you can understand, we all can understand why a teacher, why a mother, why a father is afraid with their kids. I mean, school shootings are a sad American phenomenon that we all the undergirding that is creating them, the mental health issues, the access to health care, the access to you know community service that could be needed. I mean, all of these things are such a not a mystery, but a confounding complex frustration that we haven't solved. And I I just I would love to see more conversations like this where we can hear why it's so important to you, why are guns so important to you, and we can be sane about it and we can be brotherly about it, and we can be civil. The closest I ever came to getting a gun, because one time when I was married, my my ex we lived in West Adams for a minute. And you know, it was the nicer part of West Adams around the corner from where, speaking of guns, where Marvin Gaye's dad shot him. Three little kids, and my wife, the kid's mom, were like, I need a gun. I'm like, No, I know your temperament. I'm gonna get home late one night.

SPEAKER_02 57:02

You go shoot my ass.

SPEAKER_00 57:03

You're gonna shoot my ass. So no. But years later, I was talking to a colleague at work, and we live in northern California, and he was a gun enthusiast. He's a lot like you, Alan. I mean, just a sane dude. He's a hunter, he's a fisherman. I mean, he was responsible. And he told me this story. He said, You know, I know someone he got a gun, or no, yeah, he got a gun after you heard this story. A gentleman took his wife to go camping. And when they set up camp way out in the woods, truck rolls up with two dudes and says, We're gonna take your wife. And dude was a little small, and he just lifted up his his shirt and showed the gun that he had concealed. He said, No, you're not. The gentleman got back in the truck and they left. And as an outdoor enthusiast, someone who, you know, would hike by myself, and you hear mountain lions sometimes, where it's like, you know, I'm like, that that's the great equalizer you talked about. That's sane gun ownership. That's there's a reason for that. And that's the closest that I got. But my entire point is there's room to have these conversations between intelligent people, you know, and and that's why I agree. I agree. That's why we're here. And Alan, it was I was so excited. Like when I learned this was what you're enthusiastic about, I saw it from afar. And then when we had this conversation, like, we gotta have Alan on, man. It's it's uh what my hope is to to again foster more talk like this. It's like just get out of the algorithm, man, get out of the extreme, but let's talk about what we really feel. Like, I'm troubled that we haven't solved this thing in America. It still feels like this the school shooting aspect of this is a very uniquely American problem that we gotta fucking do a better job with.

SPEAKER_01 58:34

I don't have any answers uh relative to that. I, you know, it's a like I said, I don't I don't know how to address the mental health crisis that we have in our country. I wish I did. I don't know how to address the wealth gap in this country or the lack of access to quality education, um, which we know can be the great equalizer. Um I should say quality and affordable education.

SPEAKER_03 59:07

Yeah, different things.

SPEAKER_01 59:09

Right. And so I I I don't I don't have the answers. It my frustration, and hopefully, I didn't come off like the angry gun owner.

SPEAKER_02 59:18

No, not at all. Um, came off like the enthusiastic down the hill.

SPEAKER_01 59:24

Well that's that that's what I wanted to be because I I look, I and I and I think Antonio, you and I had a text exchange, and it wasn't anything to do with guns, but we were kind of talking about politics. Oh, yes, I said, you know, I'm for individual thought. I'm not here to dictate to anybody what they should believe, what they should think. Everybody has a right to their own opinion, and I embrace that. The only time that it bothers me is when your opinion starts to infringe on my personal freedoms. Um and so, other than that, I live and let live. And then let's let's let's have dialogue.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:08

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:08

WB Du Bois talked about the duality of being black and being in America, right? And so I always I have always had this sense of duality throughout my life because I've always gone to you know, I got bused from South Central Los Angeles to a school out in the valley in high school. I went to UCLA, which has obviously had a very small percentage of African Americans. Predominantly white institutions. Right. I was I've been in corporate America for the last 30 years in a field where it is predominantly not filled with people that look like me or think like me necessarily. So I have this duality always. And what's been interesting though, as I become an adult, is I I've also kind of evolved into a political duality where my friend group and my family are very liberal in nature. And because I work in finance, my friend group or my work family, if you will, have always been very conservative in nature. So all day at work, I hear about all the evils that Democrats do. And then when I come home, I get to hear all the evils that Republicans do. And I think what it has allowed me to do, though, is get out of my echo chamber. Right? Get out of whatever my natural echo chamber is. And what I find myself doing sometimes infuriating people along the way is when I'm with my conservative folk, I try to be the liberal voice of reason. And when I'm with my liberal friends, I try to be the conservative voice of reason. My goal is only to give them a perspective that maybe they haven't thought of. And that's it.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:10

That's why you don't get invited to Thanksgiving dinner. But I appreciate you.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:15

Well, you know, we don't celebrate Thanksgiving dinner or episode five. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:22

You can even you can even drop the episode number. I'm impressed. I'm impressed.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:27

So I don't remember any episodes.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:30

Five hundred and fifty five episodes. You're doing it all yourself in that room where you're sitting. That's the thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:38

That's why he looked at me and he was like, Oh, you're using iMovie? Oh, you're so cute. That's adorable. That's so cute.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:44

That's cute.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:45

Al, you made me think of this, and it's it's a quote that's um incorrectly attributed to James Baldwin because James Baldwin was such a prolific writer and such a deep thinker. Um, but it's actually Robert Jones Jr. who on Twitter, we can disagree and still love each other unless your disagreement is rooted in my oppression and denial of my humanity and right to exist. Right? And so I I needed to come with that and say, like, none of this conversation is rooted in anybody's oppression or denial of right to exist, right? And it's interesting to me that you know I had feelings as I drove out to the to the gun club, right? To the private space that you invited us to. What they're gonna be. What happened in I'm not sure where I am. Was it what Alan said?

SPEAKER_00 1:03:46

Particular type of vehicle that was prominent.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:49

I mean, it was a row of Ford 150s like Brump. Right?

SPEAKER_00 1:03:54

We've talked about symbols, symbols. And yes.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:58

I I understood that for for that time it was a place I needed to be. I want to say uh thank you to to joining us for this conversation because it's obviously something that we um haven't participated in. Uh I want to say in a meaningful way, the echoes of that like holding a gun was different than talking about gun control. Yes. And so I want to say thank you for for joining us. Um I do hope that we have more opportunities. I appreciate you. That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:33

And I want to say one last thing, Al, because you just blew my mind and I had an epiphany moment. You are the first non-white person who I've ever heard say, infringe on my freedoms. So that's a phrase I've only heard white people say because to me, white people in America are the only ones who are free. So you're the first person I've heard who wasn't white who use the term as though you are free, and somebody's infringing on your freedom. So I need to figure out how I can feel that way and how to use that language. Because that's where, like Antonio said, we feel like we want to own guns, but we haven't been allowed to either legally or traditionally, historically. And so I appreciate you opening that door and being in that space to sort of allow us to have access to that space, just like Tiger Woods opened a door for us to start playing golf because we thought brothers don't play golf. He opened that. So you're sort of, you know, not to put too much pressure on you, Al, but the Tiger Woods of the gun world.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:42

The Tiger Woods of the Gun World. No doubt.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:45

2 ANLA, baby.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:48

I was like, well, maybe that's who I am. Um look, look, brother, maybe the ecstasy.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:57

Right now, in this regional, it's gonna be 2A. 2A and USA in a minute.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:02

I'm just throwing them out there. Alan, I wish there were more men like you, and I appreciate how thoughtful you are. I genuinely mean it. I mean, from the time that I met you and you scared the hell out of me as a big brother, trying to make sure that I was to see our last episode that I was a real one. But also opening up the door, you all have always been uh an individual thinker. You talk about wanting, you know, not wanting to or not feeling represented by either party or either extreme and being that voice of reason. I just feel like who you are right now is an extension of who I knew 30 plus years ago. I think we're 35 years deep now when we pledged. Yeah. But I I really appreciate you. I appreciate you coming and and like just saying what you really think and giving us a chance to interrupt and interject and banter. It means a lot, man. Uh, I wish there were more like you.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:55

Well, thanks so much. I mean, it goes without saying that I love each and every one of you guys. You're my family, and uh I am so proud of what all of you have accomplished. Not just the education, the accolades, and the career accomplishments, but the men and the fathers that you've all grown up to be. I think you are a bright, shining example of what we're capable of. So thank you for having me on the show. I love what you guys are doing.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:31

All right, thank you so much. All right, y'all. Yes. Thank you for joining us. Still got questions? Other things you want to say? Well, hit us up at three for the founders.com. On Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, or TikTok, or send us a text through Buzz Sprout. Remember to like and subscribe wherever you get your podcast and share the pod with someone you think can benefit from it or add to the conversation. Till the next time, Left on Founders. We out.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:06

Thank you for listening to the Three for the Founders podcast. The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed are the speakers' own and do not represent the views, thoughts, and opinions of any professional or academic institution. The material and information presented here is for general information purposes only. Listen at your own risk of becoming woke.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:33

That was beautiful, beloved.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:35

That was oh man. Beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:38

I watched the new uh the new uh Spike Lee joint with Denzel and Jeffrey Wright on uh Apple TV. It was terrible. Um yeah man, Dizil is old.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:51

He is man, he's old.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:53

He he's trying to play not old. But uh Jeffrey Wright plays uh uh a dude who was in in prison and found a la and he's wearing the the hat or whatever. He calls everybody beloved, and I I just I love that. I was like you know, I hear you beloved. I hear you beloved what I'm gonna say is that's not really cool. I like that yeah, it's really cool. It was good.