Job Interviews: Don't F It Up

I've sat on both sides of the table - interviewee dozens of times, interviewer / board member several.  I'd like to help you succeed in your career, and this is a cog in the wheel.

You can expect to interview for multiple positions over the next few decades as a LEO:  Investigations, new agency, Task Force Officer position, and on and on and on.  

Today I'll get into how to prepare, how to execute, and how to bounce back and win next time if you fail.

-LEO

Note:  If you have an upcoming interview, feel free to reach out via IG / FB messages and let me know what unit it is and I'm glad to offer any guidance I have.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Good morning. It's Leo. Let's go ahead and get into interviewing. And I'm not talking about sitting in the box interrogating people or talking to witnesses. I'm talking about you getting interviewed for a job and how to be successful at that. That may well just be a transfer to a different unit. If you're on a police department, there may be 30 different units from dive team to SWAT to narcotics and everything in between. And most of those will have some kind of interview as part of the process for taking somebody on. So I've sat on both sides of the table for these. I've been interviewed for many jobs, and I've been on the board for people that, you know, we're hiring to a new unit or to a new agency. So I can I'll give you my perspective on what's worked for me as the interviewee and what I look for and what some of the conversations look like behind closed doors as the interviewer. Some things that I recommend bringing your resume. A lot of this just comes down to being a complete professional because you can always go down, but you can't go up even in a grimy, you know, if you're going to be an undercover narcotics officer, I'm still being a complete professional in that interview. I uh going back to one of my failures very early of not being a professional, I was told that I was going to this certain unit, that I'd already been picked, that it was informal. I had to do an informal interview with the captain of the precinct. The sergeant that ran the unit was like, hey, you're in. All you got to do is just go meet the captain. I didn't know him at all. Once you've met him, he's going to rubber stamp it. You're good. I had tons of prostitutes and crack in the area that I was working. I was working night shift. And so when I was told it was informal, I took that very much to heart. And, you know, I was brand new as well. And sat down with the captain. He said, you know, what are you going to bring to this unit? I used some very colorful language with some F-words. I talked about gaining humant from the prostitution in colorful language because I thought it was informal or from the prostitutes and from the crack dealers. And I basically talked to them like I was on the street. And I thought it was fine. I blame everybody but myself if you're interested. Never take accountability for your failures. Always blame others, right? So I was put on ice for another month. I got to go to the unit, but I left. Sergeant went back in. Sergeant came back out of the captain's office, said, What did you just do? Did you say the F-word? Did you say whores in in the interview? And I said, Well, yeah. Yeah, this is how I this is how I operate. What do you mean? I'm I'm trying to be forthcoming, you know? Sergeant was like, dude, you're on ice. Like you're going back to patrol for a month. You were going to be with us today. Now you're going back for a month because you talked crazy in the interview. So I say all that to say if they say it's informal, it's okay to treat it formal. Uh so some things that I've done that I believe have helped me get positions. I think interview getting interviewed is one of my strengths. If I'm kind of in the running with other people neck and neck, I try to put myself ahead in the interview. And it's an art because you don't want to be braggy. You don't want to come off cocky. You do need to be humble, but you also need to brag, right? Because if there's 10 or 30 or 50 people interviewing or 5,000, you want that job. So bringing a resume that's an appropriate length, I like one to two pages. If you can fit it all in one, that's great. If you need to do two, that's fine. In that resume, I'm putting my relevant training, I'm catering it to that position. So I'm putting relevant training, I'm putting awards, I'm gonna have sections. It's gonna be a professional-looking resume. Whether somebody builds it for me, which I have had done when I was trying to get a federal job, I found somebody that builds federal resumes. Or whether I just build it online using one of the templates, it shouldn't just be a cobbled together Microsoft Word document. Try to be a professional. You can create a cover sheet if you want. I didn't normally do that for inside the department interviews, though, in retrospect, it would not hurt to do a cover sheet explaining why you want that position and why you're qualified. And putting relevant stuff on there. You know, if you're going to narcotics and you got an award last year from the U.S. attorney's office for a drug case and, you know, the person was found guilty at trial, put that in there and bring a copy of that citation. There's nothing wrong with that. And you can even say, like, hey, I, you know, I brought this award because I felt like this was relevant. I feel like this relates to what you guys do every day over here. And I just wanted to show my experience in this world. Bringing reports, I'll stick with narcotics because it's so common for people to try to go to a narcotics unit. It's so competitive. You know, there's usually a hundred people putting in for those two slots or whatever. So bringing reports, you know, if you're going to the narcotics office, bring a report and you're on patrol, bring a report of you getting a proactive drug arrest or two. And that shows several things. That shows that you're proactive. It shows that you have a nose for drugs. It shows that you can write a report. You know, they're going to read it and hopefully you write a good report. And they're like, oh man, this guy articulated his exception to the Fourth Amendment and why he was able to search that car. He got consent. He was in hot pursuit. You know, it was incident to arrest, whatever it is, it shows your understanding or lack of understanding of the law. It shows that you interviewed the person and that they admitted to the drugs being theirs, that you understood post-arrest Miranda considerations. Whatever, bring, man, I would bring like three reports to an interview inside the department. When I went to the marshals, I'm bringing one of a foot chase where I caught a guy and he had a gun. I'm bringing one of a maybe a use of force incident because you're gonna have them at the Marshall Task Force. You know, things that they're gonna want to see, like they should know, hey, this dude has done this before and knows how to write about it. This is just Tuesday, you know. If he goes after a murder perp and gets in a fight with them, he's okay with that. Like I'm reading this report where he did it. I'm a big proponent of studying before going. If you want the job, again, if we act like professionals, we can expect to be treated as such and paid as such, which is what we want, right? So study a little bit. You can look online, you can read about it. If it's an age, a new agency, you know, if you're going to an interview at the, we'll say the Georgia Bureau of Investigation, comb their website, give it an hour, read what they do, read the different kinds of units they have, because there's a good chance one of the questions they'll ask you, which I'll get into here shortly, is what do you think we do over here? And it would be nice if you're going to GBI and they ask you that, for you to say, Oh, well, you know, you guys have six different divisions. You have human trafficking, you have the tri-state drug task force, you have violent crime division, you have officer-involved shooting. You know, if those get conflicted out, you have the use of force investigation unit, uh, which is where I would love to end up down the road. Something like that, just showing a working knowledge and an interest. It just shows that you're interested in being there and that you took the time. So you can get a lot of that online. You can get it from news articles and you can get it from the agency's website. Just go there. If it's inside the department, just talk to somebody. Do human, do some human intel collection. Talk to your buddy that used to be on patrol and went over there, you haven't seen him since, and give them a call. Hey, I'm coming to interview up there next week. Can you just tell me? Like, I'll buy you a coffee, I'll buy you a burger, can we sit down and you kind of just tell me what y'all do? I want to be informed. Like, not only do I want to sound informed in the interview, I want to be informed because if you guys are go out and do 20 bybus a shift at narcotics, maybe I don't want to go to that unit. Sounds kind of whack. Maybe I want to do one where we have longer-term investigations, where we're doing bye walks, some title threes, things like that. But get your knowledge up so that you can speak knowledgeably about what that unit is all about in the interview. Because there's a good chance they'll ask you. And if they don't, go ahead and try to fit it in. Don't shove it in, but there's a good chance there will be an opportunity. A lot of time at the end, they'll say, What questions do you have? And that's when you could fit it in. Hey, I understand, you know, there's a lot of buybus. I just want to know what drives this unit. Do y'all what is management like? Do y'all like big seizures of assets? Do you want us like seasoned cars? Do you like big drug seizures? Do you like money? Like if I'm working a case and I know there's money going to Atlanta and there's going to be drugs coming back, is there one of those that you prefer getting? Do you want the money or the drugs? Some of them will be like, yeah, get the money. A lot of them will go take the money off if you can, because it goes to the unit and gets you training. Do you want lots of cases or do you want bigger cases? You know, what would be my goals when I arrive? What would be expected of me? So I'm also a proponent of over-dressing for interviews. I've heard people debate quite a bit. God, I don't know what to wear to this interview. I don't think I've ever done a job interview, including inside the department, without wearing a full suit. I did my narcotics interview, which was my first real off-the-beaten path position on the PD. I was working at the time. And I went somewhere. I think I went to the narcotics unit because I already dealt with those guys, and I changed into a full suit. And I put my uniform in a duffel bag. I came that day knowing that I had an interview, totally prepared, and I put on a full suit. And I think they even brought it up in the interview, like, aren't you working? I was like, Yes, sir, I just changed for the interview. Like that says that you want to be there, that you give a shit. That's good, right? That'll hopefully put you above, that'll remember you over the next five, you know, guys that come in in patrol uniforms. They're gonna be like, oh, Leo wanted this shit. It's kind of like wearing flashy clothes at a at a sports tryout. Like, wear the bright the bright green cleats, you know? Be the guy that stands out a little bit. It's any competitive position. You got to do something a little extra to get ahead. And it should always be putting on a suit and brushing your hair and not having bad breath like you just ate some nachos or whatever. These are competitive positions always. So you are gonna have to find a way to flex a little bit. Uh as I said, it's an art to not come off braggy, but it's also your time if you know they ask you the obvious questions. Why should we pick you for this unit? You should be ready with that flex. That is a that is an opportunity for you to talk about yourself in a positive way. And so you're going to narcotics. Hey, I got, you know, I got 20 felony arrests last month and 10 misdemeanors. 90% of those are drugs. I'm familiar with the court process. I'm always in court on my days off. I come in for extra task forces when they're available to develop my knowledge and, you know, learn about this more. Whatever you're doing, that's your chance. Hey, I'm picking the brain of my senior guys. Why should you pick me? Because I'm motivated. I'm here to learn every single day. So it's a time to flex, but it's also a time to be humble and show them that you're not going to show up on day one and talk all about your patrol exploits because nobody really cares. Nobody cares about the dead bodies you picked up and blah, blah, blah. They care about what you bring to the unit. So I love fitting into the interview. Hey, what are you looking for out of me? Should you pick me? You know, they usually ask you what question you have. Should you pick me? What would be the best things for me to do in my first month and mostly my first year, once I'm out of the very basic infant stages of this job over my first year, what kind of training would it be good for me to go to so that I can be a better member of this team? I mean, what does that tell them? You want to be a better team member. You're going to listen to them about what you need to be doing to succeed, and you're motivated. It's doing a lot of things all at once with a very simple response. Um, and go ahead and prepare for the obvious questions. The last position I took when I switched jobs, I was laying in bed one night and the night before the interview, and it just hit me. I had my interview for a new agency the next day, and I went, they're gonna ask me why I'm leaving my old agency. And you may get that. You know, if you're a homicide detective and you're switching to full-time SWAT, they may say, Hey, why do you want to leave homicide? Because a lot of places they're gonna be thinking, is this guy running from something? He or she has changed units five times in the last six years. What are they running from? What are they doing wrong? Are they not doing their reports? Are they always about to be kicked out? What's going on? So be prepared for that. I literally laid in bed and thought about that because you don't want to be negative. You don't want to drag them, you don't want to go, the supervisor's an asshole, and none of those guys get along. And, you know, it's a low-functioning team because that makes everybody cringe a little bit and wonder, hmm, are they the problem or are you the problem? So I always try to frame that question. I I did try to frame that as an opportunity. Hey, here's what I think, you know, it's a lot of new things that I can learn. I'm interested in what you do. I think you have an important mission over here. This is a kind of work I've never done before. And I really look forward to learning how to do this, learning from the people over here. And I'm just ready to try something new. And that's not BS at all, but it's also not negative. I didn't drag anybody. A few other obvious questions. I mean, you can, I'm sure you can go on YouTube, which I've never done and look up best answers to these, but what's your biggest weakness? You know, and you always see people, I think Michael Scott on the office said, like, my biggest weakness is that I'm the greatest boss anyone's ever had. It's hard to fill these shoes every day, or something like that. You know, not maybe not quite that extreme. Don't be a joke, but you also don't want to be like, I'm late to work. Like most days I'm late to work as a childcare, right? There's an in-between. So, you know, whether you want to say, like, I'm a perfectionist, you know, I can put it aside. But uh what I've said a lot is, you know, I get a I feel frustrated, and it's really something I have to consciously control when other team members aren't doing what they said they were gonna do, which is totally true. I do get frustrated. And if we're on a team and you say you're gonna knock out three search warrants for my case, and then I get up the next day and it's like, okay, they're not done. And you've got excuses. I do get frustrated. I'm like, well, you could have just said I'm not gonna do them and I would have done them myself, right? Or you could have said you were gonna do a half-assed job because you had other stuff on your mind, and I would have just done a good job, done my best. It's my case, dude. Don't fumble it. So that does frustrate me if you can't tell. So it's okay to express that. Like, I get frustrated if they don't do their job. So that's something I have to manage. Like I know I can't be snapping at people at work all day. Uh, so I really have to learn the people around me and learn what they're gonna do and who I can delegate what to during cases so that it gets done to my standard. So that's kind of a it's kind of a backwards answer of like, I have a standard, but yes, it is a weakness that I get frustrated with people, but also kind of not really. So, you know, you don't want to drag yourself on that one, obviously. And then they may ask your biggest strength or what what's the biggest thing you could bring to that unit. And you should have an answer for that. I think mine at narcotics was I'm gonna do all the undercover work you can give me. I am ready to do it every day. But whatever your thing is, just have a good answer to that. And depending on the kind of unit, they may ask the training you've been to, your involvement in that kind of work. You know, if you're applying to an investigative unit, you're on patrol, they may ask you, hey, you're competing against people that have already been investigators. What have you done that would make you competitive with a detective? And you need to have an answer for that. Hey, when I arrest shoplifters, I mirandize and interview them. Whatever you may do. I've written search warrants on social media from scratch, not knowing what I was doing and learned it. I have a motivation I'm gonna bring to learn that they're not gonna bring because they think they already know things. And I am ready to learn as a piece of putty in your hand, sir. I'm putty in your hand. Maybe not go quite that weird, but the point is there is something to be said for, you know, if you've ever taught somebody to shoot a gun, it's nice to teach somebody sometimes that's never shot because they don't argue and they're putty in your hand. And you can make them the shooter that you want them to be, as opposed to these old habits creeping in. I remember a drill instructor in boot camp saying that. Like, hey, my really good hunters, you're probably good shots, but you guys that have shot some, we're just gonna be fighting bad habits on you recruit pukes or whatever they said. So just figure out how you're gonna frame yourself. If you're totally inexperienced, I wouldn't try to create experience in your resume, in your interview. I would just be pretty honest and let them know that you're ready to gain experience and training and listen to your senior people. So, and and one of the biggest things, and I've touched on it already, but to briefly hit it again, be humble. Very much come in with, I have a lot to learn. I don't care if you've been on 20 years and spent 15 in homicide and you're going to narcotics, you don't know that fucking job. So you might think you do. You might have, you know, had narcotics pop your shooters before, and you've come over and done interviews and you've heard a little smidget about that case, or you've heard them testify in court. So you think you know what they do, but you don't. So I would, I love people that come in and they're like, yeah, you know, I have all this experience, but this isn't my world, and I really look forward to learning it. My understanding is you guys are, I wouldn't say it like this because again, I've learned not to cuss in interviews, but you guys are a shit hot unit. I want to be part of that. I like being part of high-functioning teams and helping it to get even higher and see how good we can get together. So I look forward to learning what you guys do. You guys are legendary around here. I want to be part of that. You know, hype them up a little bit, boost there you go. So I hope this helps some of you in a job interview, whether it's a new job, and this can go outside law enforcement or whether it's inside the agency, which is a lot of what we do as cops. If you've interviewed multiple times for positions and you haven't gotten it, it might be you. And you may want to ask that unit for feedback. Like, hey, I'm not trying to sue you to get on this unit. I'm not doing a freedom of information to say I was screwed over. I just want to know if there's something I could have done better in the process. They may well tell you. They may get creeped out and think that you're going to sue them and, you know, say that they discriminated against you. But they may also go, yeah, and tell you what you did. And if you interview again, they may go, huh, this guy was wanting to learn. He embodied what he said, where, you know, he didn't get it, and he told us in the interview he wanted to learn. And then he freaking came back to us and said, Hey, I didn't get this. I respect that. Can you tell me how to do better next time because I'm still interested? I mean, that is a humble grown up decision right there. So let me know if this helps you or if you have an upcoming interview, reach out on the Facebook or the IG or even the TikTok, which I check every now and then. And let me know if you have an upcoming interview or if you use some of these techniques to create success. Have a great day.