Ep. 12 - How to Schedule Your Drumline Camp for Success

Your drumline camp schedule has a HUGE impact on your success throughout the fall! Time of year, time of day (this one might surprise you), staff considerations, location, and more! The Team shares insight on how to use the schedule and setup of your drumline camp as a force multiplier to help your students achieve. 

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Greetings and salutations, friends, and welcome back to the Team Eastlass podcast, episode 12. I think we made it. We made it to sixth grade percussion. Yeah. My name is Doug Bush, and today I'm joined by Patricia Eastlass and Zach Scheer. And this is the podcast for anyone looking to better themselves at percussion education. Drumline camp. This takes many shapes and many forms throughout the nation. In Texas, it's often a full five-day week of everydays. I did air quotes there that results in drumming all day. With many programs, this might be the only time of the year you can bring out a specialist or even a staff to help teach the drumline. Today's podcast is about the scheduling of this camp and how to get the most out of that schedule. We're not going to get into the specifics of teaching the camp. That'll be a future episode. Today we will focus more on the literal scheduling of your drumline camp. Mr. Shear, you want to kick us off?

SPEAKER_02 1:18

Yeah, absolutely. First, I'll um give a big thanks to Team East Los because I can remember big changes we made in the drumline camp at Capel because of things you guys brought to the table. And we would like to give a big thanks to Mr.

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Shear for being open and receptive to those changes. Because not everyone you work with is. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And genuinely, I would just throw this out there on that side note. Guys, it never hurts to try. You know what I mean? I I throughout the entirety of my career, there are so many times where, oh no, dude, traditional grip with a tilt. Let's try, let's just try match one year. No, dude, bases behind, bases behind. Okay. Let's put bases on the side one year. And I very genuinely, in my heart, if we had just tried it in those situations, and then at the end of the year, the dude would come back and been like, hey, you know, I see some values and benefits, but I like the bases behind. You know, you're the boss. Sounds good. And the fact that you even tried it gets me, but to not even try anyway, tangent here. Yeah, we're back into scheduling drum camps. Okay, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:20

So scheduling drum camps. Okay, we're gonna break this down into uh time of year, time of day, and then some specifics on what the actual schedule inside the camp looks like. So first let's talk about time of year. Um Mr. Bush, is there an ideal in your perfect scenario time of year that you would have a camp or camps? Um if you if you had the ability to do two, what would that look like? And what if you had the ability to only do one?

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Yeah, uh for me, perfect. Uh for me, ideally, in a perfect situation, if I can only do one, it is uh after the last week of school. So it's the first week when school gets out. So, you know, the students often have vacations or whatever, they have all this type of stuff, but usually that week uh is pretty good at keeping them uh locked down. Um ideally at Capel, we have this great situation. The line is already set by then.

SPEAKER_03 3:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

And so for the past kind of three or four weeks prior to that, I am doing after school sectionals once a week with each battery section. So like an hour with the bass, an hour with the quad, an hour with the snare. Um that is, by the way, if you listen to the drumline audition podcast, uh you know, so we had those help sessions. That's what's in place of those help sessions now is um I'm doing that. And my goal is to set the students up for, for example, uh, we're gonna have a quad specialist like Mr. Jonathan Anderson come in. Uh, I want the quads to know all the procedures, the routines, to be able to play in time with as good sound as possible, to be on a single drum so that when the quad specialist is there, he can spend as much time doing quad-specific stuff as humanly possible, right? Same thing with the bass, right? I'm trying to ensure that uh, you know, I attend to teach the snares over the summer. Um, and then over the school year, I take over the bass responsibilities and Mr. Mooney does the snares. It's very important to me that when Mr. Strauss comes in to teach the basses, I have set the bases up so that Mr. Straub can get the most out of that time with him. And so if we do all that and then we don't have camp and they disappear for the summer and then they come back later, often a lot of that's kind of wasted. Um, so that would be my ideal if we had one. If we had two, I would do that one. And then the second one would be at the end of summer, it'd be like the the week before band camp started, or depending on how your band camp schedule is, the first week of band camp, uh uh, so that we can kind of get back into things again.

SPEAKER_02 4:44

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. So just to be clear, you're saying that you're meeting with the students after the line is set, still during the school year, you're having some like after school rehearsals.

SPEAKER_01 4:53

Wednesday after school for six to seven is bases or something like that. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. Again, because because this camp is so precious and so valuable, and it's like the only time the entire year is like no band, no this, no whatever. Uh, and we might be spending a lot of money to bring in really high quality people. Right. I want everybody, uh mostly the students, obviously, to get the most out of this. Got it, got it.

SPEAKER_02 5:16

So we're talking like April, May, maybe you're doing that after school rehearsals, and then in a perfect world, a June camp, first week school gets out, yeah, and then maybe a late July camp the week before band camp starts, or maybe the that first week that band camp starts. Got it. Now, Miss E. Sloss, what if we're only able to have one camp? We can only have one. I can't do two. I'm sorry. Should I do that right after school is out in June, or should I do that in July? What do you think?

SPEAKER_00 5:41

Yeah, yeah, right after school is out is ideal because they're already used to being a routine of coming up to school. So they don't leave for summer and go on vacation for a week and then have to come back and work really hard. Um, also, it's so important that we establish a standard at the beginning of expectations of how to learn new exercises or new music, and that they can take that with them to the rest of the summer when they have plenty of time to practice on their own. So they're not potentially learning music the wrong way or uh too fast of tempos or um it also just uh invites potential sectionals or playing together that won't happen if you save your camp for the end of the summer.

SPEAKER_01 6:23

Yeah. Now there is one exception that I would like to talk about here, is um that is it's also a little dependent on who you would like to teach the camp and their availability. Yes, right. Where uh, you know, there's been situations our great friend Mr. Mike Limish, right, would like to have us at Argyle. When's the cop hell camp? Okay, our cop hell camp's here. If and he would say, if I do camp the next week, the week after Cop Hell, and I pay you really well, and I feed you plenty of barbecue, right? You know, uh uh and uh uh whatever, would you be willing? And then it's like, okay, yes, the answer is yes. And to him, it was more valuable to have staff he trusted and he knew would do a great job if that meant delaying camp a week than forcing the camp to be on a week where there wasn't a lot of staff available. Yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_02 7:11

Yeah. Speaking of staff, you guys mentioned some names. I want to put spotlights on these people because they're wonderful. Clayton Straup. You mentioned earlier, Mr. Mr. Straup, Clayton Straup, uh, who has an awesome YouTube channel where he plays nine different instruments and uh plays all sorts of music. There's dogs involved. It's anyway, yeah. Um also former roommate of mine, Clayton Straub. We go way back. Um, you also mentioned Eliana Yamuni, who is famous, um but in the percussion world, awesome snare drummer for Vanguard, um, but also a staff member now at Capell.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

Incredible teacher. I mean, that's a whole future episode, uh, maybe if we're ever lucky enough to interview her. But, you know, uh over the years, seeing so many people that are wonderful players. Just because you're a great player does not mean you're a good teacher. Yes. And uh she is definitely the exception to a rule in that, you know. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

So, okay, now um we've talked about time of year. Now let's talk about time of day. I think this was the biggest change for me at uh at Cobb Hill. Uh when I got there, the schedule was like three a day. It was like eight to twelve, one to five, six to nine, I think. And that last blog was outside tracking, it just like beating them down. Um, and then it ended up changing a lot after conversations with you all. Uh, Jimmy LeBrecq was also very influential on me talking to him about what he had done. Um, so um, in general, I think the the most influential thing on time of day and how your camp looks is your start time. So we can go a little earlier start, which is typically gonna look like 8 a.m. or 9 a.m., or we can go a later start, which is gonna look like maybe 10 or 11. And uh we used to start earlier. When you guys started talking to me about starting later, I was like, what are you talking about? Like things, I just had this mindset like things start at eight.

SPEAKER_03 9:04

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:05

They just I don't know. That's what school day starts at eight, summer band starts at eight, whatever. Like things start at eight, Mr. Bush. I guess you're not aware of that, but uh that's that's what it is. But you all kind of laid out for me your experiences of starting later and the benefits to that. And I was like, uh, that makes more sense. So um talk a little bit about what it looks like to start later and why that works well.

SPEAKER_00 9:30

Uh I would say number one reason people need sleep. I need sleep, and the kids especially need sleep.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

But then won't they just if I send them home at five, Missy Sloss, they'll go to bed by bed by 7 30. Oh, you're exactly right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Uh they're gonna stay up late regardless. And they're gonna sleep in as long as you'll allow them to sleep in. And so during the camp, uh, I need them to be on their game and awake and alert so we can get some stuff done. We don't have any time to waste.

SPEAKER_02 9:58

Especially as the week goes on. Especially as the week goes on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

Uh and if you add uh any marching to that, they're gonna be physically tired too. Like they need time to recover. And by starting later, they're more likely to get more sleep. Um, number two reason if you do have staff that you're hiring to come in, often they're not in the city, they don't live in the city where the school is. So they might be driving 30 minutes, they might be driving an hour, they might be driving further. But that allows them to kind of avoid some of the nasty traffic. Yep. So it cuts down their time that they're on the road and the time that they have to be up. Um what would you say?

SPEAKER_01 10:34

Yeah, and then I would I I would I would say to me, that's the number three. Uh I mean, for us personally, it's probably the number two, you know, but uh they're the start uh later start time also gives a chance for some of the weaker students in the program to get there a little early, to get there half an hour out earlier, an hour early, and hook up with section leaders or even yourself, right? This is something that Jimmy used to do is he even though they're starting at 10, he's probably there at five. Mr. LeBrec was there early, you know, like hand shaving the Marimba bar or something, right? You know, um, but uh, you know, it when it goes to the drumline audition, we alluded to section leaders, and that'll be a future episode. Uh this is not just something to put on your resume for Princeton, right? If if you have earned this responsibility of being a section leader at the Coppel Percussion Program, like you are going to earn this. And so if there is a kid, you know, if third base is not cutting it, dude, you need to get here early with that, like you and them. And uh, I had very profound moments in my drum core time where very strong section leaders would drum with me one-on-one. And there is something that is developed in the student to student uh, you know, drumming that is separate than the student to staff, right? And this build is one of the ways to literally build into that because kind of like what you said earlier, that freshman on third base, if they get to go home at five, they're going home at five. Their parents are picking up five, and they're right, and it's you know, parents are picking them up. That's the thing, right? Even if they want to stay. Guess what? Their parents had to drop them off at eight. Right. They have to hang out for an hour or two. Yeah, or they're already here anyway, right? Because their parents have to go to work. Yep. And if the section leader is, you know, uh the if you selected the right individual, they will drive up early to be with that person and hang out with them in drum.

SPEAKER_02 12:29

Yeah, so often I uh when when someone will ask me to come out and work with their group or work, you know, kind of consult with them like as a teacher or whatever, I hear percussion directors and band directors say this phrase all the time. And it's just something I think we're to the point that it just comes out of our mouth and it doesn't actually mean anything to anyone, the student either. They'll say, like, yeah, that's something, you know, put that on the list wherever you really need to work on that. Or for drumline camp. Yeah, yeah. For drumline camp, they'll go, Yeah, you need to, you really need to hit that before tomorrow.

SPEAKER_00 13:00

And everybody nods, everybody goes, it's not gonna get done.

SPEAKER_02 13:02

Everybody nods, you're like, okay, and then you just move on. And I I have actually stopped and been like, wait a minute, so stop. When?

SPEAKER_00 13:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:10

When? You're you're you're here until dark 30 tonight. And and then you start early in the morning. So, like, actually, yeah, Mr. Band Director, when do you think they are going to work on it? They're not. And then you're gonna show up tomorrow, it's gonna be the same situation. Um, so having a later start time, yes, it it just solves so many problems. I was actually really surprised um by how influential that was. Uh what about the lunch break? What about the lunch break? Uh, we need maybe 15 minutes to grab a snack or something and then get right back at it because we've got to use all of the time for full group rehearsal, right? No.

SPEAKER_00 13:53

No. No. We need some time.

SPEAKER_02 13:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:56

Everybody needs some time.

SPEAKER_02 13:57

Okay. So how, like, literally, Miss E. Sloss, I have had lunch breaks everywhere. I actually had a summer band where the the head director scheduled, I don't even know what it was called, like snack time or something. And we like didn't leave. Yes. It was like weird. We like didn't leave, and it was like 30 minutes long, maybe. And then and I've had then I've had drumline cams that were all the way up to two hours. So, what have your experiences been? What do you think? Again, all of this falls under the heading of what gets the best result for the week. Yes. What do you think works the best?

SPEAKER_00 14:31

I feel that two hours is ideal, hour and a half if you can't do two hours. The longer lunch break allows for time away from the instrument, for the kids to have a mental break, um, potentially time for kids to hang out with each other, go to lunch together, hang out with like that's a the bonding is very important for these sections, especially because it's potentially at the very beginning of the season, you'll have new kids in the section that need to get to know some of the kids that have been there. It's very useful for that. And then you also have time uh for the staff, if there is a staff, to talk about what happened in the previous block and plan ahead if we need to make adjustments to the schedule or we want to figure out what tempos things are gonna be at, like there's actually time to discuss that and eat. And then again, kind of like having a later start time, if you have some time within that break for kids to come back and look at music and play together, then there's more likely that you're gonna make more progress when you guys are together.

SPEAKER_02 15:27

Absolutely. And and just just like we just said, you know, if you've got vibe three over here who really just needs to work on those four bars, yeah, just but it's kind of holding the rest of the group up or whatever. Like, if you only have an hour for lunch, vibe three is running to Chick-fil-A, he's coming right back. There's no time. Yeah, but if you can actually go, like, no, listen, this is the reason we scheduled this this way. It's for you, Vibe Three. It's for these four bars. Yeah, so really you have time at lunch. This needs to be worked out.

SPEAKER_01 15:56

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. All the best staffs I've ever been on, for sure. Like when the lunch begins, it's everybody is talking about every and it is a natural thing as a a good educator. You're excited to talk about this. Is what the baseline is, what snares did, you know, what did the front ensemble do? Oh, this person was struggling with this, you know, and and you're you're you're wanting feedback from the other high-quality uh educators you're working with, like, oh, you know, how would you handle this problem? How have you seen it handle them before? How do you, you know, it's all great stuff. Like, this isn't a time to talk about your cat or your next vacation, right? You know, or this is a time to like uh focus on making the student's life as good as possible and making as much out of this. And you know, a really strong example of this was a couple years ago when we did our neon dystopia show. I remember clearly at the Monday lunch, Mr. Stroud being like, bro, the baseline is unreal. Like, even for cop Hell Sanders, like they're just chewing through everything, and I'm throwing, you know, these impossible math equations, and there it's just it's it's crazy. And I said, you know, there's been this nine-lit buggada crescendo day, crescendo thing. I've always wanted to kind of do, but I've just never thought a high school baseline could do it. Yeah, I just never really thought a high school could do it at the quality I would be okay with. And he was like, Well, write it up tonight and let me start teaching it and let's see what happens. And literally every lunch, the rest of the week, when we came home, or came home, came back to the band hall, the baseline was always there and they were working on the base break. Yep. And they could do it, they could do it at the first contest, you know what I mean, all the way through the video shoot. Um, and that's another one of those it weren't that opportunity, that moment wouldn't have kind of really happened if we hadn't had a built-in relaxed lunch and then they hadn't had the extra time on their own to kind of put in the work and earn the thing, you know.

SPEAKER_02 17:48

Absolutely, absolutely. Longer lunch break wins. Yes, yeah. Um, okay, let's talk about. Um we've we've established uh when the camps should happen. We've established that we want to start a little later, we have a longer lunch break. Now, what do these rehearsal blocks actually look like? Are we in full ensemble all the time? If we have the opportunity to how much time should we spend in subs? What does that look like again uh for like what you're doing at Kapel or what your ideal kind of situation is for you guys?

SPEAKER_01 18:20

Yeah, it's it's it's you know different for different groups and depending on priorities and this and that. But uh, as Islas mentioned in an earlier uh episode, it is important for us to help try to foster a very positive relationship between the battery and the front ensemble and not an adversarial thing. And that's that's not going to necessarily happen organically because they rehearse so separate and they do separate things. So you're looking for opportunities to bring them together and do things together. Also, as we've talked many times, um, you know, your actions are what are important, not as much as your words, right? So we begin every day exactly the same during drumline camp. And that is the entire group, front ensemble, JV, varsity battery. We are all together in one room, and Mr. Bush is leading them on a stretch. And the stretch is designed. Uh, a lot of this I got from Art Avula. Throw, you know, uh shout out to Art Avula, Eastwood High School, El Paso, Texas. But um, it is uh about 10 to 15 minutes of uh, you know, Mr. Osmore has some stuff in here too, you know, things for your wrists, things for your fingers, things for your arm, things for your neck, whatever. This is whole procedure that we run them through. And I uh we're showing them that, hey, because we're dedicating this time, like your physical health and well-being is important to us. Taking care of your hands is gonna put you in better shape to play throughout the rest of the day. Uh, their hands are also not ready for the camp. Yeah, they're going from regular school to like hitting a vibrophone all day, right? Seven hours a day. Right. You don't see the football team or the soccer team or the whoever you like get together and not stretch or whatever before they start, you know. Um, and so we're trying to show, and I'm also for the highest students in the program, like our Joyce Tows that just may stay or whatever. Then in the future, when they're at region or they're solo or they're whatever, they have these little things that they can do. Or I'm in a situation where we're in the end zone and there's a delay coming on the field because of a speaker malfunction from the previous group or whatever, where I can look at the entire group, or a rehearsal with a clinician. Uh, we do this often. I do this with a front ensemble. You know, we have a band clinician, they're being rehearsed, it's freezing, the clarinets, blah, blah, blah. I look at the front ensemble and I just put my hands together and do the JoJo Mirror clap, and the whole front ensemble just puts their hands together and starts doing it, right?

SPEAKER_00 20:32

Yeah, I remember that.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

Yeah, so so establishing that, that's how every day begins, right? Then we uh we go into subs after that.

SPEAKER_00 20:40

Yeah, and the schedule will change throughout the week. Uh at the beginning of the week, we typically have a full day of subs. Again, to utilize potential staff that's there. If you, as a director, are paying good money to bring these people in, hopefully these people that you trust and you respect their uh input, then you want to give some time for them to actually do what they do.

SPEAKER_02 21:01

You know who else has some input is the dog Masashi. Yeah. I don't know if you just I don't know if you just heard that or not. But our listeners may value uh that input as well.

SPEAKER_00 21:10

Yeah, if she wants to let everyone to know it's past dinner time. Um so yeah, the first day uh will be full subs uh the entire day to really settle in and give time needed to whatever each individual section needs. Now, if you don't have access to uh that much staff, obviously that would potentially change, but um that's how we do it. The second day is usually split up into subs for the full front ensemble um for the full day, but I believe the battery usually will get together for a portion of the day to start drumming together. Um and you know, in front ensemble land, sometimes learning music is a little bit more involved, right? There's more parts, there's more players, the level of uh experience and skill sometimes is a little bit deeper. So uh when I'm running a front ensemble, I want to make sure that whatever music we are digesting, we're doing it right at the beginning, um, so that I don't miss any of those details. And they don't miss any of those details.

SPEAKER_02 22:08

So you're valuing quality over quantity when learning music at the beginning.

SPEAKER_00 22:13

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 22:14

So we're gonna be on our own for another full day. Um and then the third day on Wednesday is usually when we have some time where we get together with the full ensemble, battery and front ensemble together. Um that allows also for some tempos to come up, which we can get into in another episode.

SPEAKER_03 22:30

But yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:32

Um, you know, so the amount of time we are spending uh as individual subsections, whether it's just the baseline or the quad line or front ensemble only, gets a little shorter and shorter each day throughout the week.

unknown 22:43

Right.

SPEAKER_01 22:43

Yeah, one of the things that you used to do, Mr. Shearer, that uh we really enjoyed, and a lot of great guys we've worked worked with over the years have done something similar to this, uh, if not this, is like a kind of like a parent performance or a preview thing at the very end of camp, right? What was your thoughts behind that?

SPEAKER_02 22:59

Yeah, I think it's really important. There are things um there are things that can do something different than what you can do as an educator with more rehearsal time at that point, right? So it's like Friday, we've been going really hard all week. There are probably some things that we've kind of hit a wall on, and that might just be like, hey, we just need more time or we just need more chops or whatever. Um but putting those students in a performance situation at the end of the week is hugely beneficial. And it's it's it not only does it make them better in that moment to go like, okay, wherever we are on this, as long as it's appropriate, you want to give them something that you know they're not gonna be successful at. But like wherever we are on this, even if I've still got a little doubt about letter B or whatever, like we gotta play it, you know, in that moment that levels the group up and adds a level of maturity, but also during the week, being able to point to that.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:55

And even on Monday, go like, hey, this is coming up. You know, yeah. Um, I know that this started to happen when I was there. And and from what you guys have said, it it sounds like it's even gone to a next level now that like former students a lot of times will come back and see the group, which is just that's so neat. You know, that's so neat. A lot of times they might do just be getting home from college at that point, or maybe they've been home from a couple weeks or whatever, but they get to come see the group. It's a chance for them. And I know actually, um, I would kind of like maybe touch base with those former students in advance, or if I see them come in the door and go like, hey, I really want you to flip out when the bases, you know, do this thing, or whatever. Like, even if, or like, you know, hey, you know, when the vibes do this thing, even if it's not perfect, make sure you clap, or whatever, you know, like just because I want the new, the new group to feel special. Like, you know, um another thing I was just thinking when you were talking about being in subs earlier in the week, like, well, what if I'm a group that doesn't have nine staff members? I I would argue it might even be more valuable. Let's say you're by yourself. And actually, my first year teaching at Rockwell Heath High School, I think I had like maybe one other guy helping me, or there was a week where I was by myself, something like that. I would argue it might be better to go, like, hey, I'm gonna spend if I've got a day or two and it's only me, I'm gonna do maybe uh two hours with the basses and then two hours with the singers and quads, and then two hours with marimbas and two hours of vibes or something like that. Absolutely. That might be better than just having, well, I gotta get them all up here. No, no, no, no, no, no. That isolated time is so valuable.

SPEAKER_00 25:34

And the bandhole is open. You can give them assignments, you can give them things to practice. Yeah, absolutely. They come up on their own, they can run little subsectionals on their own.

SPEAKER_03 25:41

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 25:41

Yep. And again, even though you might be there with two hours, their call time is at least an hour before that. And the section leader is warming them up or doing this or that, or you know, again, if you're a section leader, we're relying on you to help out here. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 25:54

You know, oh, go ahead, Mr. Bush.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

I was just gonna say, uh, Ms. Sheer, maybe maybe not jump ahead too much or this up. But another thing that you did that I used to love is, you know, uh two things. And this might be getting a little bit too off schedule, but then on schedule, is you know, on day one, it's like uh you would have great drum lines and drum lines you want the students to emulate and hear like playing on the speakers, not that you know, so they're not coming in on their phones, they're not coming as soon as they walk in, it's like the tone is set. And along with that kind of kind of professionalism, and this is a place of business mentality, you know, on the board, you would already have the dates for next year's campus. Yes, to ensure, like, hey, you are writing them down right now. And I know that's something that Randy's adopted over the years too, and and uh because this week is so important, we need to know about it during the audition process, and it's not fair to the student if they don't know about it. Like, hey, these have been here for a year, yes, right? And if you have to go to Aspen or Malaysia or whatever, that's fine, but then you're not gonna spot in Varsity or you can't be on the baseline or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 26:53

So, first I'll give credit where credit is due. That's I learned that from Mike Limish at Argyll. Um, and second, I'll say um, just to kind of be bluntly honest here, we're we're all it I'm pointing the finger at myself, we've all done this, but a lot of times I will hear friends, other educators, I dare say, complain, you know, like, oh well man, I don't know. We, you know, my students, I I can never get the full baseline there in June. Or like, oh, we had this thing and I blah, blah, blah. And I'm just gonna say, I'm maybe not every time, but a lot of times, I'm sorry, that's your fault. That's on you, man. Yeah, to reflect communication. Number one, kids, do you communicate with the kids? Yeah, maybe kind of communicating with the kids is kind of worthless.

SPEAKER_03 27:35

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

You are communicating with the parents, that's who runs their lives. Okay. So I when on that pair performance on Friday that you're talking about, I would look at the parents in the eyes and say, right here, 365 days from now, there are the dates. It's not optional. Please, actually, could you get out your phones right now? Could you write it down? No, please, you, Miss Johnson, that means you. You know, like really, like make it a little uncomfortable if you have to, if you want every kid to be there.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

And there have to be consequences.

SPEAKER_02 28:06

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:07

Right. And it might not be like removing a kid from band. Sure. But uh maybe they don't get to be on the section they want to be on. Maybe they're not on the battery, maybe they're not playing one of the most important parts, or maybe they're an alternate, um, or maybe they're not involved in like the drumline show performances at the drumline concerts. There has to be some kind of consequence that says through your actions to the students and the parents that you know these these dates are important, you know, because we are respecting the time of everyone in the group. Uh, if you were not there, that's disrespectful.

SPEAKER_02 28:36

Absolutely. Yeah. Um one more thing I haven't heard you guys mention. You're talking about the schedule for the day, and we're starting with subs, we're getting together, we're working towards a performance. What about going outside? What about tracking? Don't we need to be out there glistening in the sun with our shirts off, Mr. Bush? Just, you know, getting a sunburn and tracking every single day outside all day.

SPEAKER_01 28:57

Yeah, again, I think it depends on you and your priorities. Okay. Right? You know, and and what you're kind of walking working for the group. We are very, very fortunate, Miss Shuttlesworth, during the full band, summer band, right? They have marching fundamentals and blocks, and she allows us on our own to go at our own pace, which I this might be this might be a hot take here, but I think any sane band director should do, right? You know, if you have a percussion specialist that you uh trust at all, which if you don't, you shouldn't have hired them, right? But if you do and you and you trust them, you need to give them this opportunity because they can move so much faster and learn so much quicker when they're by their own, right? And so for us specifically at Capel, uh, that works pretty well. But you know, if if you are more of a WGI focused group or or this or that, maybe you do need to be out there tracking, right? Again, I I think it's like a or if you don't have the summer band option or there's weather things or whatever, you know. I I think you you you do whatever you need for your group. Um but I don't think it I Think the uh drumline police are gonna come arrest you if you don't right, you know, you're not outside tracking.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

And also, I will say, I have been a part of some staffs teaching camps, or I've been involved with some groups where it's like, yeah, actually, I do see the need for you guys to get outside and do some tracking, that's great, but not right now. We don't know how to bring our sticks out. We don't we don't have these uh uh procedures locked down, it's just gonna be a mess when we get out there.

SPEAKER_01 30:25

Yeah, and and to kind of clarify and go back on that as well, if you have not took time before the camp to set all the carriers to the new line, yeah, you're gonna pay these guys and you're gonna hire the staff. That that's I've had that situation where it's like, oh, we're gonna track. It's like, oh, wait, this is a whole new line from last year. So now we're spending an hour and an hour, hour and a half. I'm sitting here getting paid doing nothing. Yeah. Just watching people set carriers.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

That's it, equipment.

SPEAKER_01 30:51

You know, uh, and then what was supposed to be base sub time, I've now lost because now we got to go outside and track, probably without a Met. Yeah. And guess what? It doesn't work out very well. Absolutely. Right. So if you are gonna track, that's fine. Um, but man, don't waste your staff's time. Like, make sure you've done whatever you need to do before so that we're ready to go and get some stuff done.

SPEAKER_02 31:09

Um, true story. My first day student teaching at Colliville Heritage High School with Jeff Osdomore. Ever heard of him? Yeah, legend. Um, I come out to the band field, they're out there, they're they're tracking, it's like drumline camp or something, and I'm like, I'm kind of scared. I'm like the young kid. I'm like, what's going on out here? I walk out there and they are those guys could track. Oh, they're like Mr. Osdemore had those kids tracking. Mr.

SPEAKER_01 31:32

Osmore, Mr. Gibson, Mr. Nemeyer. Yes, tracking dudes.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

Mr. Nemeyer is working with the group. Mr. Dan Niemier, wonderful teacher, great, um, great, very funny guy. I come out there, they're, I'm not exactly, they're tracking, they're playing five lit one note timing, which I didn't even know high schools could play. Yes. That I was like, I'm like, it's like one of those things you walk up, and as you're walking, you're like, what are they playing? What are they playing? And then I'm like, oh, wait, no, that is what they're playing. Okay. But um, yeah, that's an example of a school who had like a culture of tracking. Oh, yeah. And had that really going very well.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

And they marched their drumline competitive show, unlike Coppel. This still makes sense. Like if we were marching, we would be moving too.

SPEAKER_02 32:17

Yeah, it was in alignment with their goals. Yeah. Right? In alignment with their goals. Um, okay, so um I've got all this worked out, I've got my schedule, I know what it's gonna look like. But what about the actual staff that I'm going to hire? Okay, if if I can hire a staff, first of all, I will say this is a really good use of your money. If you're a percussion director and you're like, I have limited funds, what should I spend it on? One of the highest priorities um is getting some specialized staff for this week. So, how would I try to select those people? What kind of teachers am I looking for? Um, where might I find them? How has that worked in your experience uh for you guys? I know you've been kind of on both sides here. You've been hiring staff, you've also been hired several times. So, what does that look like for for you, Messi Slaws?

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Um, one option is potentially your lesson staff.

SPEAKER_02 33:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:11

You know, if they have experience with Drumline, um, which they probably do if you're in the Texas area, um, but not everywhere. But if they have experience with Drumline or Percussion Ensemble, that would be a good uh opportunity to involve them more in the program throughout the year. And if you have funds to pay them even better because they can uh have more reason to stick around next year. Um, but that's a really good I've been brought in a lot of the time when I've been kind of uh maybe third or fourth tier on the list in terms of lesson staff because I was new to the program, but I had some experience, so I was brought in. Um another uh good source would be just looking around at the programs that you think are doing well and talking to whoever's running them and getting uh feedback on oh who's who's who's taking your your front ensemble? Who's taking your baseline?

SPEAKER_02 34:01

So okay, are you telling me? Maybe this is a little bit of a hot take here, it's okay for me to go, wow, that group sounds really good. I might want to use their teachers.

SPEAKER_00 34:11

Of course it is. Yes, uh smart. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 34:15

And I think sometimes there's a hesitance to do that.

SPEAKER_01 34:17

I think a football coach wants the best, you know, defensive line coach they can get. Yep. Right? You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:24

Yeah. And this is the exact experience I had when I met you guys, right? You guys were out teaching all these groups that I was watching, and I was like, wait, who teaches? Who wrote that? Who teaches that baseline? Who are these people? And I looked around, I asked, I called, I got your number from somebody. And um, I think Mr. Bush, my first conversation was with you. And I called you and I was like, hi, I'm Zach Shear. You don't know me. Seems like you're pretty good at teaching bass drum, judging by what I'm seeing here. Tell me what you're doing. I already had someone teaching my basses who I was, I actually was happy with. He was doing some really great things, but I was looking for maybe another thing, and that's what led me to you all. So I would say select your staff carefully, select them early. Yeah. Try not to be stuck in a situation where you've got to get whoever you've got to get.

SPEAKER_03 35:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:12

That's that's a recipe for disaster. Absolutely. Um, what about the size of the staff? Like, do I have to have a person for each instrument? What if I'm looking at kind of going like, mm-hmm and size and whatever? Is it important just to get a great teacher, or does it have to be someone on that specific instrument?

SPEAKER_01 35:30

To go back to what you said earlier, personally, in terms of quality over quantity. Yes. Uh again, like I would pay more money to have higher quality, to have less people of higher quality uh than, you know. Um, and I don't know if we've all experienced, but I've experienced this before, where you might have a pretty qualified snare educator and a pretty qualified quad educator, but this guy marched group A and that guy marched group B. Oh, yeah. And group A beat more group B, but they weren't supposed to beat group B because you know, Marty Griffin or what, you know, Julie Dobi, and yeah, and uh and then the toxicity between these two 23-year-olds or whatever, uh, with little to no experience teaching, or right, you know, I got, oh man, this kid just aged out Boston or Vanguard, whoever he must be amazing. And then they get in front of the kids and treat them like they are Boston or Phantom or whatever, and it's like, no, man, this kid's 14, right? You need to use a met. You can't just click sticks, right? So I think that they're um if you are in a privileged situation of having a large staff of quality people, but that goes back to all the things you say. The people who get that are the people that are professional, that are on top of their communication, that are they're getting the people early, uh, and that are paying them well, which is something that you always did very well, Mr. Shear, and that Mr. Wynne and Ms. Therno before him always did great, and we're we're so thankful of.

SPEAKER_02 36:54

Yeah, and and that's the thing again in the education world. I think sometimes we don't talk about enough. But uh it's no secret, money talks. And that's just the way it is. So um, again, some people might hear that and that might bounce off even go, well, that you know, my school doesn't have as much. Okay, let's talk about what you can do with what you do have. And it is a truth that money talks. So even if you don't have a lot, how can you use what you do have and who can you get on your team there? Yeah, that's so important. I think also when we're talking about who to hire, you know, I would sum up what you just said, Mr. Bush, as to say um playing experience and being in a great group does not necessarily equal being a great teacher. That's important, that's important to realize. But another thing that I think uh if you're listening to this and you're the percussion director or band director in charge, even if you have a great staff, you will not get as much out of them as you need to if you're not setting clear and high expectations for them. So um, when that staff rolls in on the first day, maybe this is 30 minutes before, maybe it's right when it starts and the kids are doing something else, but you need to set clear expectations of what it looks like to show up on time and play the exercises that you're given. And if we're getting together for full for full ensemble or whatever, like, okay, we're gonna start full ensemble at one, does that mean we start moving at one? Yes. Does that mean downbeat is okay? Because I got news for you. On day one, the quads don't know how to move their stuff. Right. Okay, that's a project. And then the front ensemble is just waiting around and it's like just wasted time, right? So if there's someone in charge and there should be someone in charge, then you have got to set that expectation and make it clear to the staff member, and then again, hold them accountable for that, especially if you're paying them well. Right?

SPEAKER_01 38:40

Especially if you're paying them well, and especially if you're paying them on Friday.

SPEAKER_02 38:44

Oh wait a minute. Okay, you're saying that the campus Monday through Friday, and before you leave, you would actually be paid on Friday. Go home with money. Yes, sir. Yes. Have you actually experienced this, Mr. Bush? Or is this just a pipe dream?

SPEAKER_01 38:59

There are a few incredible programs like Coppel, like Argyll, yes, where I've experienced these things. Uh and those two groups I just mentioned, I guess are the two I've done the most drumline camps for. So I wonder if there's something that, you know, other groups that took months and months and months, you know. And it's the same thing with, you know, Misty Slots and I do a ton of arranging. So we work with so many schools, right? And it's the same kind of thing, you know. Uh schools that are really organized and on top of their stuff, we tend to get paid promptly, right? Schools that are not, we tend to wait a long time and have to kind of hound, hey, when are we gonna get the payment? And so when new schools come knocking, whether it's arranging gigs or teaching gigs, you know, right? Uh this definitely factors into it. It's not the only thing, but it does factor into it. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 39:46

And I well, and I would put that in the under the heading of money talks. It talks a little more when you get it sooner.

SPEAKER_03 39:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:52

Right? Like maybe I can't pay quite as much as the guy down the road, but I will pay you on Friday. And guy down the road, not say anything, but I've heard he might not pay you for three months. Yeah, you know. So um that's worth more if I have that check on Friday. Yeah. Um, now, um, I'm gonna say this. I'm gonna say, as the employee of the school district, uh, I believe one of the things that's really important is that if you are up there all day, every day, Monday through Friday, teaching this camp, running the, you know, the full ensemble stuff, you're hiring the staff, you're the first one there, you're the last one to leave. You are not a volunteer. You deserve to be paid for your time and your expertise. So I think it's far too um common in our field that we just think it's an obligation to work for free, to be gone, uh away from home, away from your family, whatever, for free. And uh that should not be the case. Uh, I don't think actually probably everyone expects that to be the case, but we just kind of think, oh, well, that's just what I should do. So um, if you actually have like extra days in your contract and those are those contract days that you're there for the camp, well, then okay, you're being compensated. That's great. But if not, uh, you need to be paid either through the district or through the boosters or through whatever arrangement needs to be worked out so that you are not a volunteer. That's not the way it should be, and it's not sustainable either. Yeah, absolutely. And so that might look different for different people. Obviously, you need to get ahead of that, have appropriate professional conversations with your head director, principal, whoever. Um, but do not be afraid to just say, hey, I I'm not a volunteer. I have time and I have expertise and that has value.

SPEAKER_01 41:41

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Um, you know, guys, I mean, that's so much the impetus of this entire podcast, right? Has been uh trying to impart advice, wisdom, knowledge, things that we've gained over the years that would have helped us when we were younger in our career and that will hopefully help younger people in their career now be able to stay in the career longer and and have a more positive impact, not just on their lives, but on shaping the future generation of wonderful musicians. Hey, thanks for hanging out with us today, friends. If you have any questions for the podcast, send them to teameslos at gmail.com. That's teames loss, t-e-a-m, i-s l-as at gmail.com. Shout out to all the great percussion companies that support teameslos. That's Maypex Majestic Percussion, Remo Drumheads, ProMark Sticks and Out, Sabian Symbols, Beetle Percussion, and Lot Ride Apparel. You know, a lot of drumline exercises and etudes can be found in the book Super Hands. Or maybe you're looking for an advanced snare ensemble for your students to play and you want to pick up El Chupacabra as performed by the PACIC champion Eastwood Snare Line. Shout out to Art Ovula again. Miss Eastloss, where can you pick up these beats?

SPEAKER_00 42:49

Teameslass.com, Lulu.com, Dallas Percussion, Steve Weiss music, or even your favorite local music store.

SPEAKER_01 42:57

Absolutely. And if you can teach a drumline how to play two accent triplet grid off the left while marching box drill at 220, then don't forget to like, subscribe. Please give us that five lit five-star review. Remember, friends, step one is time, step two is sound, and step three is subscribing to the TV slots podcast.