Mike Sigel - Part 3 (The Art, Science & Fire of a Champion)

In this third installment of our multi-part conversation with Hall of Famer Mike Sigel, we dive deeper into the mind of one of the most electrifying champions in cue sports history. With characteristic candor, humor, and razor-sharp recall, Sigel leads us through the gritty realities of the pool circuit—from the early ’70s through his era of dominance—while revealing why only a select few ever truly separated themselves from the pack.

Sigel unpacks how conditions, equipment, and formats have reshaped the modern game, explaining why today’s environment compresses the skill gap and makes sustained dominance nearly impossible. He contrasts that with the wide-open, high-pressure world he thrived in—long races, slow cloths, unpredictable breaks, and an atmosphere where the strongest mental game always won out.

The stories flow as freely as Sigel’s legendary stroke. He recalls tournaments where winning was the easy part and getting paid was the real challenge, the strategies behind numerical racking, the inside realities of gambling matches, and being “incognito” on the road with Larry Hubbard. He talks rivalries—Buddy Hall, Nick Varner, Earl Strickland—and the rare few who could push him to the edge. And he shares why he earned the nickname “Mr. Finals,” describing the mindset that allowed him to win 107 career titles and deliver under pressure time after time.

Sigel also offers a fascinating comparison between pool and golf, drawing parallels to icons like Trevino and Tiger Woods, and revealing how he managed his adrenaline, nerves, and focus during the biggest moments of his career.

This episode is pure cue-sport gold—raw, insightful, funny, and filled with the unmistakable voice of a legend who lived the game at its highest level. Whether you’re a student of pool history or simply love a great story well told, this chapter of Mike Sigel’s life is not to be missed.

Transcript

Mike Gonzalez 0:15

So let's go back to this early 70 uh era. Mark, you were you were in the thick of it. You were uh you know you were you were competing back then on the road back then. Talk a little bit more about some of the events and what life was like uh just playing the tournament circuit back in the early 70s.

Mike Sigel 0:32

Well, the early 70s, it wasn't that big. At pool, pool became really big like 78, 9 through the early 90s, I think was this the well, of course, today they have a lot of big tournaments, but you got to fly around the world. Unless you have a huge sponsor, I don't see how they can do it. You know what I mean? I mean, you got to go to China, you gotta go to Indonesia, you gotta go to Dubai. I mean, it's crazy. Phil, you know, I mean, if you have a sponsor, you gotta spend probably 100,000 a year, in my opinion, to play in all these different events.

Allison Fisher 1:09

And it's also also these days, it's very hard to dominate, isn't it? Because there's so so many good players around the world.

Mike Sigel 1:16

Yes, for sure.

Allison Fisher 1:18

So it's very expensive.

Mike Sigel 1:20

It's very expensive and it's very tough because the I think the rules and the conditions also have made it tighter, in my opinion.

Allison Fisher 1:29

Well, I think the alternating break is a big deal, isn't it, too?

Mike Sigel 1:32

Yeah, the alternating break, I'm against that. Yeah, I don't like the fast cloth. The rails on the tables are real springy, you know. So that, in my opinion, makes the makes the the, you know, you have different levels of players. So the great players, and then you got the other guys just under them, and then you got these other guys. So you have three or four different groups of players. In my day, the top, like you have me, you know, Nick, Earl, and Buddy all kind of in the same time in the 80s, those four guys won 90% of the tournaments, and Ray is played and bustamani, and all those guys, you know, Mizrak, all that. But today, the separation of like Tiger Woods to the other players, you don't see the separation anymore. You know, you got the rotate break, the matches are shorter. We used to play race to 13. Yeah, that's a pretty good test, race to 13. You know, the nine and the Moscone Cup, they play a race to five. Of course, they're playing snooker. The Moscone Cup is snooker, it's not pool. It's snooker, it's not pool. You know, it isn't the pockets that big. It's a snooker game. Safe, safe, safe. Get a shot, win a game. Rotate, break. I mean, to me, it's uh you know, it's not pool. Pool is not snooker. They keep match room, tries to keep. I see the younger players today that they go like this. Look when they chalk. And they the snooker thing, like Allison, you're formed. Everybody, when I went to the thing at the Mustang, they had the a mat, a thing at Orlando, Florida. Every young player, they all look like snooker players. That's not pool. Pool is a different game than snooker. Anyway, that's just my but you're right. That the the there's so many people that play, there's no more distinction, I think. You know, the the conditions, the faster cloth and the rails have opened the game up more where the break, everyone's making a ball on the break. Okay, in my day, rarely did you make a ball on a break. On a nap cloth, very difficult to make a ball on the break. You had to hit them 300 miles an hour. Today you can hit them, they make the one on the side every game. It's like a dead bull. Or the you know, they stop the corner ball, but yet the one on the side goes in nine out of ten times, right?

Mike Gonzalez 4:13

Yeah.

Mike Sigel 4:14

I I to me that's they should put not the one on the spot, not the nine on the spot, the the second row on the spot. Then break out in the middle of the table, therefore the corner ball doesn't go in, the one doesn't go in the side. There's the solution, but they would never do that.

Mike Gonzalez 4:32

They may try that at some point. They they won't.

Allison Fisher 4:35

Hopefully they'll listen to this podcast and change it all again.

Mike Gonzalez 4:38

There you go.

Allison Fisher 4:38

Well, the thing now is though, that with on the a on the nine-ball break now, the cue ball always could inevitably comes down the end of the table. So there's always like a safety or a push out after the break, isn't there? A lot of the times. Well, what do you mean running the rack rather than just break, land the cue ball, run the rack, there's less of that now. The percentage of the biggest.

Mike Sigel 4:58

Oh yeah, yeah. Because I used to here's the thing the person that wins the tournaments today is lucky, and here's why. When we commentated, all I said was watch where the two-ball is positioned in the rack. So the one on the side, let's assume goes every break, which almost it does. So if the two is racked low, now the cue ball is going like this back and forth in the racking area. It may get kicked up table, but 99% of the time it's in between the side pocket and the corner where the rack area is. If the two is racked low, the two is going to be usually down there. The guy either has an easy shot or an easy safety or an easy kick. If the two is racked high, the two goes up table, the cue ball's down here. God don't have a shot. We focused on that every match. And eight out of ten times, if the two was racked higher, the guy had a difficult situation. If the two was racked lower, they usually won the game. So you're gambling on where the two ball goes. When I used to break, I would hope I make a different ball and break out in the middle of the table, meaning, you know, this far right or left of the spot. You hope a ball goes in, the cue ball stays in the center of the table or up, and the one would drift towards one of the corner pockets. And hopefully you make a ball and get a shot. Today it's a different thing. It's a crapshoot, getting a shot at the two, right? Think about it. Yeah, it's like making the one in the side. If you like Earl, you break in the side rail, the one in the side. If you break from the side rail, normally the cue ball, if you're making the one on the side, a lot of times the cue ball will stay lower. It doesn't necessarily have to be out in the middle of the table. Sometimes it is, but now you're gambling again and getting a shot at the two, right? You have to get a shot at the two. So when you think about it, the guy that wins is gonna get more opportunities at the two ball, right or wrong? If they're both making the one every time, yeah, right?

Allison Fisher 7:06

And then that's up to the referee racking how they rack it.

Mike Sigel 7:09

Well, here's what I said. Everybody said this was too tough. Ready? They're playing a race to 10 on the Bigfoot. I'm watching it. 20, 20 games, right? Or no, on the four and a half by nine when they play, they do the cut break. So I said, okay, when the referee racks them, the first game, the two is in the upper left under the one. The second game, the two is low behind the row of nine. That's the second game. Third game, it goes low to the right, and the fourth game up. So every time you rack each guy in a race to ten, it's rotate break, each guy is gonna get their share of where the two is racked, right? Yeah okay. They said no, that's too tough for the referee. I don't see how that's too tough that the two is really. That's how they should do it.

Mike Gonzalez 8:08

Four spots to put it.

Mike Sigel 8:09

Four spots, yeah, and it's the same for each player.

Allison Fisher 8:12

That's a good idea, I think.

Mike Sigel 8:14

Uh, sure, it's a good idea.

Allison Fisher 8:16

Allison, tell them that that makes sure you there are some events where they just have the two at the back, but they've now it's a little more random, I think.

Mike Sigel 8:23

Yeah, but that's too easy. Yeah, if they're playing the cut break, yeah, you got to assume the cue ball is gonna be in the racking area under the side pockets. If the two was always racked low, usually the two is gonna be down there. I'm the one that came up with the numerical. Yeah, we used to play, we used to play rack for your opponent. I won a ton of tournaments only because the way I rack them numerically. And I couldn't believe that me playing a guy like Buddy Hall, Nick understood that too. Nobody else did. They just throw them up there. And every time a guy would break, and the one would be up table, and the two would be in the rack area, and the three would be back up table, I'd be going, you know, thanks. And the guy would have to, you know, I'm playing a guy like Earl Buddy, the guy who up for the one, down for the two, up for the three. I went and they never caught on to that. I'm telling you, because you know, you gotta, you know, go through traffic and you know, makes the run-out way tougher than if you break in a one, two, three's up table.

Allison Fisher 9:34

Yeah, right.

Mike Sigel 9:35

Well, there you go. So when I that's another thing, when I did that, I couldn't believe that people were not numerically racking the balls. I mean, I did that for 10 years. The only guy that understood that was Nick Barn. He interesting. He, yeah, right. I wonder. Of course, then when a certain group of guys came over, I won't mention who, all of a sudden you had to play rack your own. Then you had a rack, so all of a sudden that nullified what I was doing, right? Think about it.

Mike Gonzalez 10:07

That was a huge advantage.

Mike Sigel 10:09

Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 10:10

So what would you rather do, rack your own or rack the other guys?

Mike Sigel 10:13

Rack for the other guy. Of course, if you got a square rack. Like me and Ms. Rack gave the best racks frozen perfect. We're the only uh Nick after that. I don't know. You know, I mean, I was playing, I was playing a group of guys that came over from another country. I won't say where, but I used to have a lot of sushi there, so let's just leave it at that. I broke, ready for this? I broke, and the balls were off the one this much. Nothing went past the side in the tournament. The other guy got up, my opponent. I went right over, grabbed the rack, re-racked them, and rebroke, and and made a big stink about it, and they allowed me to do that. Yeah, okay. So there you go.

Mike Gonzalez 11:07

Okay, enough about Iraq. Let's go back to Johnson City. Did you ever have a chance to get to Johnson City?

Mike Sigel 11:12

Yeah, the last year it was Raiding. I was there. Is there when I didn't play? Me and Larry went there. I gambled with a few guys, and I won a lot of money there, believe it or not. I was 17, 18. Larry would take when they introduced the guy, where he was from, all that. Larry took all the information. And when we went on the road, we went to their, you know, Larry'd go, you can give him the seven. This guy, you got to play even. This guy, you can gamble with, you know, because you're what we're we were incognito, just walking around getting all the information, watching them gamble. Oh, this guy plays 200 a game. You can beat him out of this, you know. And then we traveled around the country. But I was there the year it got raided. I left the day before they raided it.

Mark Wilson 12:00

Yeah.

Mike Gonzalez 12:01

Yeah, we talked about that with Billy, I know, about them getting raided, and it ended up being nothing, right? I mean, they all got out of that.

Mike Sigel 12:09

The Jansko's. I won a tournament in Miami, and we got paid in counterfeit money from the Jansko brothers.

Allison Fisher 12:18

Wow.

Mike Sigel 12:18

Yeah. Yeah, they had 50,000 in counterfeit money. That's how they paid us. So I got stiffed. I tried to, you know, all of a sudden there was counterfeit. Real nice, real nice guys, you know. Wise guys. Ready? I this is what I tell everybody. I go, some lady was interviewing me. She goes, Boy, you just won that tournament. Oh, she goes, Oh, that's you know, it's hard to win. I go, winning the tournament, that's easy. Collecting the money, that's the tough part. Because in my he got stiffed a handful of times, you know.

Mark Wilson 12:53

Yeah.

Mike Sigel 12:54

Like one time I was playing, you know, it's hard for me to beat Miserac a lot of times. It would, I was jealous. He was making a lot of money. I'm the best player, but he's reaping the rewards, right? So I finally beat him in a tournament, go from fifth to fourth. He comes up to me, he says, Uh-oh. I go, what? He goes, Well, he goes, I just got paid in fives and tens. So naturally, when you got knocked out of the tournament and the top four players, it was me, Larry Lescotti, Larry Hubbard, and one other guy all got stiffed. You know, because the the top four you'd go into the office, of course, naturally, the promoter, he got his end, don't worry.

Mike Gonzalez 13:34

Sure, oh yeah.

Mike Sigel 13:35

You know, well, you'd hear the story. Well, we thought the gate would be better. We thought this, we thought that. But meanwhile, we got stiffed in probably three or four tournaments. That's not familiar, Mark. Then I won, then I got stiffed in. Yeah.

Mark Wilson 13:50

Yeah, I would normally lose early and get my money.

Mike Sigel 13:54

Yeah, there you go. That's the move. You knew what to do, Matt. I used I used to room with Dave Boneman, right? For a couple of years, we roomed together. So he would get his plane ticket to leave Friday. I go, What are you doing? He goes, Well, I'm probably not going to make it to the end, but if I do, I'll change my ticket. So he'd come Monday and he'd leave Friday because he was a great golfer. He played with Nicholas and Palmer on the tour. Yeah, he used to hit it big.

Mike Gonzalez 14:22

So, Mark, uh, not only did you get paid, you got paid with real money then, huh?

Mark Wilson 14:26

Well, I was just kidding. But nevertheless, Mike won so many tournaments that all those eventualities were gonna happen. He won, well, if you came to a pro tournament, 80% of the time it was Hall and Siegel or Siegel and Hall. And then once in a while, Varner, Rympy, Siegel, or Warner, Rympy, Earl, finally. But those guys would slip in there. Miserac could win one. But it was it'd be foolish to bet against Hall and Siegel. That was the finals of 80%. And there were some great, great matches.

Mike Sigel 15:00

He beat me in the finals more than my record in the finals was phenomenal, but most of my losses came from him. I he's the only guy after the match was over, I'd go shake his hand, nice shooting. You know, that he's the only guy I ever did that. With all the other guys, something happened, you know, they got lucky or whatever it is. You know, a pool is, right? Yeah, you know, you can look back at losing a match. He's the only guy I went up. Hey, nice shooting.

Mike Gonzalez 15:28

Well, let's talk about your career at a fairly high level. So, total significant professional wins. 107, is that a right number?

Mike Sigel 15:36

107. The billiard, the pool and billiard magazine. That was Sherry Stouch, I think. And what's the guy's name?

Allison Fisher 15:45

Harold Simmonson.

Mike Sigel 15:47

Yeah, well, they examined my resume very closely. Anyway, it was on the front cover of that magazine. I won that tournament at Hopkins. It was in the SPN event. I played Harriman in the finals. I won that, then I won the very next tournament. I beat Tony Allen. At that time, it was very difficult to beat Tony Allen. That was that time when he was playing unbelievable. That was like 92 or 3 or 4.

Mike Gonzalez 16:16

Yeah. I mean, was it the Super Billiards Expo Players Championship?

Mike Sigel 16:20

Super Billiard Expo. That was a big event. Yeah, I won. That was my 100th tournament. And then I won the very next one, 101, two in a row.

Mike Gonzalez 16:28

The Bay State Nine ball shootout?

Mike Sigel 16:31

I won on the seniors tournament, the last one Miserac had. Oh, that was an easy tournament. Yeah, I let's see. I beat Danny Medina, Parika, Varner, Buddy Hall in the finals.

Mike Gonzalez 16:44

Just a few Hall of Famers, huh?

Mike Sigel 16:46

Buddy and I played in the finals. It was like going back in time. I mean, we both pumped each other up or whatever it is. I played unbelievable in that tournament. I, you know, I'd been retired. That was, let's see, 2003, when I turned 50. I played in it. It was in Florida. You know, I was doing really good. Then, you know, I practiced a little bit. And I said, you know, I was a little, it was on Brunswick, so I was a little weak the first match or two. But after that, I started the I it pumped me up. I don't know why. But anyway, I really played good. And I won two or three or four other tournaments. I went to Europe. I won two tournaments. I won a tournament for when our honeymoon was in Paris and they had a tournament there. They would invite somebody from the United States. They had Miserac there, a few other guys. I went and I made the comment then that the one day the Europeans and whatever would beat the Americans. Because at that time the Americans still dominated, you know. But today, the Americans, just like in golf, they're they're they're not the top guys. I mean, I have my own reasons why that is, but the reality is they're not, you know.

Allison Fisher 18:07

So what are your reasons?

Mike Sigel 18:09

I don't want to get into it.

Allison Fisher 18:11

Okay.

Mike Sigel 18:12

But any, you know, look at golf. I see, they made a mistake. I told Kevin too when he did the IPT. In golf, they protected the PGA tour. They had one or two guys come over to protect the tour just in case there's other guys that could compete on a similar day. Let Semi Balesteros over. They didn't open them. I told Kevin, I go, Kevin, why are you doing this? He's bringing all these people in from all over the place, you know, steal the money. They came here for a couple of years. You know, now that that didn't have to happen, but it did. Okay, so you know, you had too many guys coming over. They should have brought, they should have had Reyes, they should have had Bustamani and Parika, they should have picked one snooker guy, they should have picked one guy from here. You follow what I'm saying, instead of just let anyone come over. Yeah, the PGA tour didn't do it, right? Because they were protecting the tour, right? They had first they had who else came from? They had Sebi Bolesteros for a couple of years, then they brought enough. Now the Europeans dominate golf. There's hardly anybody from the United States, right?

Mike Gonzalez 19:20

Yeah, there was a lot of resentment, a lot of resentment because you know, back in, let's say, in the 60s and 70s, these uh these guys were all just trying to scratch out a living. I mean, you got the Nicholas's and the Watsons and the the higher level, but but tier two and below, they were just trying to put food on the table. So they saw the Europeans, the Asians coming over the South Africans as a threat to their livelihood.

Mike Sigel 19:40

That's really same thing, same thing in pool. He I argued with Kevin, he made a big mistake doing that, in my opinion, you know.

Mike Gonzalez 19:50

Yeah, yeah.

Mike Sigel 19:51

So, but anyway, even when Reyes came, you know, Reyes competed. He was here in '81. He never won anything in the 80s. Very few tournaments, very few that I recall. I mean, I was playing in every tournament, you know. Like I said, Buddy, Earl, Nick, and me dominated tournaments. It's hard to remember who won tournaments in those in in the 80s, like late 70s to early 90s, 91-ish. It was, it was, I don't remember Ray's winning. He won a U.S. Open. Well, that was after I retired. He won by even Miserek, believe it or not, Miserek did not win a lot of nine ball tournaments. I re won one in St. Louis. I think he won a U.S. Open. I think, I'm not even sure. Mark, did he win? I don't think he did.

Mark Wilson 20:44

I don't think Miserac won the U.S. Open nine ball. He won four U.S. Open straight pools. Yeah. He did win in St. Louis and he won a couple, but he was never passionate about nine ball. He always felt it was lucky on the break, and his heart wasn't in it, even though he had the capacity to play at a high level.

Mike Sigel 21:00

Well, his game was not because a nine ball, you have to see straight pool's a different game. In nine ball, you have to come a lot of times with the winning shot. And Mizrak was not really good in that performance of the pressured shot to win or lose the game. And in nine ball, those come up all the time. That's been straight pool. Once he gets, you know, he gets out of the gank like Renfey, myself, and Mizrak got out of the gank, especially in Straight Pool, better than anybody you ever saw. You know, in other words, it's like it's like playing 10 ahead, where you're numb after two hours goes by and you have no nerves, and then playing noon, a key match, and you're both nervous. Okay. Totally different uh uh atmosphere, you know. But Mizrack and Straight Pool, yeah, he he was a tremendous straight pool player.

Mark Wilson 21:58

What would you estimate your your personal? Personal record against Meserc career wise would be I was ahead.

Mike Sigel 22:04

I was ahead in. There's only one or two guys. Archer is a match ahead of me. Uh but everybody else, I think I have a winning record over. Pretty sure of that.

Mark Wilson 22:16

Yeah, you and Buddy had to be pretty close.

Mike Sigel 22:18

Yeah, we were close. Yeah.

Mark Wilson 22:19

Yeah. But after that, I can't remember anyone that would have a winning record.

Mike Sigel 22:25

Archer came on the scene. It was tough to beat him, you know, and then Earl was tough to beat Earl. Of course, I beat Earl 11 to 1 in Europe. I won a big tournament. Mucey brought his whole staff of guys. You know, it was David Howard, it was Renpe, it was Earl, I think somebody else. They had a corporation, you know, and I wind up playing Earl at the end. I didn't play him in the finals. I beat him 11 to 1. I mean, they had the Brunswick tables, five-inch pockets, Simonis. I mean, it it and I like I just he didn't shoot the whole match. Like I kept making balls on the break. I'd hook them or run it. He just sat there. And I remind him about that. I go, who beats you the worst you ever lost? You know, I think my worst was like 11, 3 or 4. Somebody beat me. Usually, you know, uh yeah, I if I lost, it was a lot of times eight and above, eight, nine, or ten, usually. You know, but I got beat 11 to 3. I think actually Archer, and I just watched the match. It came up on YouTube. It was me and Archer played in Reno. I won that four times that tournament. That was hard to win.

Mark Wilson 23:45

One of the things that made Mike special was that he's got this relaxed, outgoing demeanor, and he would have a match and it'd be a pressure match. But he held up good because he would engage audience members and make it fun, and he would get down on the ball and stroke a bunch of times, and he'd get up and say, I really shouldn't even try this. I hate to play this shot. But then at the end, the ball went in the pocket, and it was a very dynamic, engaging thing to watch. This is what I always appreciated about my scheme is the capacity to kind of shed the nerves by engaging people, not keeping it all internal. And it was very compelling, not just for me, but for everybody. And so he was a fan favorite for that reason, that it was exciting. You're gonna see something special.

Mike Sigel 24:28

Well, that that's like Lee Trevino. My that's how I release my energy. People said I sharped my I've sharked my. I looked at a guy, I go, I don't have to shark you to beat you. Told him so me, like Lee Trevino, I would talk to the crowd. That's but I felt pressure, but I performed I after I did it so many times, I knew like, you know, when I got down on a bowl, my heart beat going. I felt nervous, of course. And if it didn't look right, I would get up and down many times, sometimes three, four, five times. But when it looked right, you know, and I, you know, I told myself, stay down and hit it with a good stroke. And I made it 99.9% of the time. Yeah, I mean, tough shots and tough situations. And after a while, I just knew that was gonna happen. So that was like the the confidence thing where other players and that's but in golf, I could be playing a dollar a hole, have a putt that long, miss it. You know what I mean? It's weird, but in pool, I performed. And you know, in nine ball, especially, you have to every game a lot well today with the way it is, it doesn't it doesn't seem like that comes up anymore. It's like they're open, boop, boop, boop. You know what I mean? It's in in my day, it seemed like you had to do a tough shot, draw it down table, or make a long something. That just doesn't show up anymore, you know.

Mike Gonzalez 26:02

So you talk about Trevino, one of my favorite stories. We had Tony Jacqueline on our golf podcast, and Tony was talking about the time he and Lee were teeing up in a major championship. I think it was the US or the um open championship, and they start out, and and Tony tells Lee says, Lee, I I really don't want to talk today. I just want to focus on my golf. And Lee says, Lee says, You don't have to talk, you just have to listen.

Mike Sigel 26:24

There you go. But that's like well, that's in my nature, but that that's how I would release the energy. You know, I'll tell you, here's a good story. Watch real quick. So I won the first three ESPN events they ever had. They loved me, okay? So the next event I finished like fifth, well, whatever it was. And so they said, Hey, we want you to commentate, right? So in those days, they would what film the match and then edit it. You'd go to Bristol, Wisconsin, and then you'd watch the match and you would commentate it after they, you know, cut it down to a show, right? So, but he goes, the guy goes like this, he goes, I want you to come into the truck outside. They had a truck with like five or six different monitors. And he goes, When they're shooting, you know, direct the camera, you know what? Because I could see he's gonna play this ball. I go here, camera two, he's gonna, you know, I I just tell him, camera two, camera four, and like that, right? So they're you know, the guys are in there, they're they're they're doing it, and someone's commentating the match, but they're off to the side, I guess for the maybe commentating, yeah, whatever that gets mixed in. But anyway, I'm doing the camera angles, right? So it was, I think, Warner and somebody else playing, right? So the guy's watching and they play a rack, right? And I'm telling they play another rack, right? And then the guy looks at me, he goes, he goes, Mike, he goes, when do they when do they start talking? I go, no, I go, these guys, I go, these guys, no, they don't talk when they shoot. He looks at me, he goes, Well, that's not good. That's true story.

Mike Gonzalez 28:21

You know, I've I've I I've seen some of these matches, you know, with with with uh with you playing, and and I can't I can't hear anything about what you're saying, but I see your mouth moving a lot, and I'm thinking, well, that's that's that's very untypical. So that must have been your release.

Mike Sigel 28:36

Well, it's like I watched that match. I used to have the I came up with the flashy vest. You know, I was with Nick. We were like, you know, Nick and I were like partners in a lot of the matches, or the not partners, but we'd take a small piece of each other. Then if we wanted to playing at the end, we'd we'd redo it. I mean, the reality is I didn't care about that, but when you're playing for small money, you know, I'm a I you know that's why I played so good in the finals. My biggest pressure was getting my money back in the big. Once I reached where I was ahead in money, I flew that. There's no pressure. Where's the pressure then? I can only win money. You get in the finals, but when you we were playing like after all that grief and aggravation and pre-playing 10,000 first, 6,000 second. I'm playing with a guy that's a friend of mine, so we would hedge off $1,000, 9 7. You know, I said, even though I knew I was gonna win in my mind, I don't care who I was playing, I just I knew I was gonna win. I just knew it would be you know surprising if I did not win in the finals. However, why am I gonna gamble $4,000 on a race to nine? Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, so so that's why we did that.

Mike Gonzalez 29:57

But there's a reason you got your your Mr. Finals nickname. What's your record in finals?

Mike Sigel 30:04

My record in the finals, I lost. Let's see, I lost 13 times in the finals out of 120. 120 finals. That's yeah, 13 times I lost. So I won 107 in the finals. And Buddy, Buddy was was you know, when I got in the finals, it was my that was my best match usually. You know, I collapsed a few times, like when I played Reyes. I mean, I just, Jesus, I mean, he didn't even play good in that match, to be honest with you. He played horribly, he missed a bunch of both. I just played worse. I couldn't get started. Everything was all of a sudden things were happening. I couldn't get out. This, that, you know, the diamond. That was the other thing. I told Kevin, please don't do diamonds. The only reason he did it is because they could bring him in at one piece late. You know, so my game dropped that five or ten percent on a diamond, which which was the automatic on retiring, you know, because I started making mistakes, just like the other guys, you know. Pool, if you look at golf, they played what seven, uh 72, 284, is that right? Four rounds. What's that?

Mike Gonzalez 31:21

Yeah, depending on what par is, but yeah, uh okay, 70, 280.

Mike Sigel 31:25

Most tournaments are won or lost by one stroke. One stroke, one stroke, okay. One stroke. Pool's the same way. You make I'm playing a good player, they run out, you know, you're waiting for that one mistake. That's what's gonna win or lose the match. I started making that mistake continuously, so I and I couldn't get out on the rail, wrong angle.

Mike Gonzalez 31:50

In your prime, though, like Michael Jordan, you must have had another gear when it counted.

Mike Sigel 31:55

Yeah, yeah. I I I was very my adrenaline. People thought I was on drugs or all this. My adrenaline would, you know, like my break was way harder. My just outlook on it, my the positivity. I did not see how to not run out. All I saw was how to win. I didn't see how to lose. That never came into my my brain, never. So, you know, whatever. Same thing, you know. I didn't see Michael Jordan ever basketball, but what I've heard, and a lot of guys that are in that group, Tiger Woods, look at Tiger Woods. He he made shots in golf in situations that no one in the world could duplicate. I mean, he was in rough this high at the U.S. Open. Remember that shot when he hit the club? He had that much turf on his club, and he hit the ball like 180 yards, stuck at four feet from the pin. I mean, nobody in the world could have ever hit. And he continuously came up with shots. I told you I got to watch him close up. You know, he lived near me on his golf course, and it's amazing to watch him hit a golf ball. I mean, just yeah, you know.

Mike Gonzalez 33:14

Yeah.

Allison Fisher 33:14

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