The Hidden Biology of Burnout: Why You're More Exhausted Than You Think

What if your burnout isn’t just mental… but something your body is experiencing at a cellular level?

In this episode, I sit down with functional diagnostic nutrition practitioner Dori Martin to explore a completely different lens on stress and burnout, one that goes beyond mindset and into what’s happening inside your body. We talk about minerals, nervous system dysregulation, and how chronic stress can quietly deplete your energy from the inside out.

If you’ve ever been told “your labs are normal” but you know something feels off… this conversation will feel incredibly validating.

We also get into:

• Why burnout can leave you feeling stuck, exhausted, and overwhelmed (even when nothing “big” is wrong)
• How your body shifts between stress and depletion states
• The connection between your nervous system, hormones, digestion, and energy
• Simple (but powerful) ways to support your body, like sunlight, hydration, and slowing down

This episode is a reminder that your body isn’t broken, it’s communicating with you.

And maybe burnout isn’t just something to push through… but an invitation to listen, reconnect, and heal in a different way.

To connect with Dori, you can follow her on instagram @midlifeenergy.dori and through her website ⁠www.dorimartin.com⁠

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Hello and welcome to Advantage, the podcast that helps you shift from stress to strategy. I'm your host, Katarina McCurdy, a registered clinical counselor and former frontline worker, here to help you understand the patterns that fuel stress, anxiety, and burnout. In each episode, we'll unpack what's beneath the stress and explore ways to meet it with awareness and intention. Let's get started. Well, Dori, I'm so excited to have this conversation today. I've been thinking about it all week, in all honesty. Um, the reason why I'm excited is because we are taking such a different angle and look at stress and burnout and how it affects the body. Um, if I'm getting this right, we're looking at stress and burnout from a more like cellular level.

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Yes, 100%. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Which is different than any conversation that I've had so far. Um and I, you know, you do, I'm gonna let you introduce yourself because you're gonna do a better job at that than me. Okay. Um, but I know that we're gonna touch on minerals and these are things that I don't think a lot of people think about. Right. Um, especially when it comes to stress and and really understanding, okay, what's going on in my body and what's shifting and what's needed. So before we start on all of that, I'm wondering if you can just lead us with a bit of an introduction into who you are, what you do, and maybe a little bit of what brought you to the job that you do. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

And thank you so much for your thoughts about this. And thank you so much also for giving me the opportunity to talk about this because when I reached out, I know it's something pretty different. So um I think it's amazing that you were curious and you looked into it, and here we are. So my name is Dory Martin. I'm a functional diagnostic nutrition practitioner, which means that, you know, I run many labs that are functional. It's about optimization versus like, you know, um seeing arranged so that we can medicate. That's more of a medical model. And it, you know, sometimes it works, and sometimes, you know, you've got to get off that outside of that box. And we I'm sure we're gonna talk about that a little bit more. But um, I am also a hair tissue ameneral analysis practitioner and a certified midlife hormone mastery coach. And um I started into this because um, well, it's gonna sound scary when I tell you the date, but I'm I'm gonna go through it quickly. But from 2006, I became a single mom, had a five-month-old and a toddler. And then quickly after that, I found out that my stepdad was not good doing well. And, you know, he was older, and so I knew that his condition would advance, so became a caregiver. Um, and I was actually helping my mom be a caregiver to her. So I would say I'm not a caregiver, but actually she her English is her second language, so I was helping her, and I was helping him. And I ended up burnt out and I didn't know it at the time, and I never really worked on recovery because I could keep going. And that kind of factors into the story, right? Um, and then I amazed met an amazing man, and uh, we were engaged and we found out that he had a terminal illness. So I began to, and about this time I became a functional diagnostic nutrition practitioner. I asked my mentor, could we use this to help him? And he said, no, go to a clinic. Um, well, my husband didn't believe in alternative, and so we did actually do the FDN, and he's still here 12 years later. However, when I looked at my labs, they were worse than his in a lot of ways. And um, what did I do? Well, I'm a caregiver and I'm a, you know, somebody who's always been able to overcome. And so I didn't respond to the labs the same way I would to a client. It was kind of the funniest thing. Um, but at the end of the day, you know, I did all the labs, I did all the protocols, did all the things, and it didn't stick. And I realized that I learned the last lab I learned was the hair tissue and mineral analysis. And it's a beautiful lab that gives you so much information about really what's going on, as you say, on a cellular level. And it can tell you what's going on emotionally and also physiologically, and also because minerals are the spark plugs to your body, and so they're foundational. And when you don't have it, you literally can't create energy. And your emotions actually drive your mineral status quite a bit. I mean, there are other physiologic structures, but it can also tell you what's going on emotionally, how like burnout, especially stress and depletion and lack of ability to generate that energy. And so when I apply just these, uh, the principles from this one lab, it simplifies everything, but it also is what gives you the ability to acknowledge what's going on without shame, without blame, and finally give you kind of a way forward. Wow. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 4:55

Well, I appreciate that. That's um it's really cool to hear how your personal story has really flowed into the work that you do. It clearly there's a lot of passion there and uh a lot of belief in your own process and what you've kind of gotten out of that. I would love for you to expand a little bit more on the whole biochemical piece, uh, just so that maybe listeners can understand um what it is that you're looking for in these labs and uh maybe some of the things that you see.

SPEAKER_00 5:27

Yeah, so I work a lot with women in burnout, and one of the things that you see is literally the burnout pattern and where you are in terms of stress. Um, so when I talk and start getting into mineral speak, I just want to make it clear. This is just get the gist of it, um, but it kind of gives you an idea of what is happening behind the scenes. Uh, we can see actually the um continuum of where you are in your stress response. Um, for example, uh sodium and potassium ratio is really key in actually creating that energy, the spark that creates the ability in yourself to basically respond to life. And so when you see that rising really high, you're in an acute state of stress. And then when you see it low, it's a state of depletion where you really can't respond anymore. And when you're in a state of burnout, I think you could relate to the um feeling of, you know, you want to do all these things and you used to, but for some reason you just you get overwhelmed. Little things turn into big things and it feels really hard to follow through. And um you want to do all the things you were able to do before, but for some reason it's just not, you just don't have it in you. And then there's also this uh sodium and magnesium, which is basically the ratios are related to adrenals. And again, you need sodium to be able to have that aldosterone and adrenal response to stress, but then magnesium is a calming mineral. And I think you would actually appreciate that. It's sort of like your nervous system being able to be in that fight-flight when you need to, but then the rest and digest magnesium when you need to. And so when you see it's low, you know that you know that you're depleted and you're not able to respond to that stress. Um, there's also uh, you know, hormone balance, uh, how quickly your metabolism is working, and heavy metal toxicities, which also cause a stress to your body. These are physiologic uh stressors that create a nervous system response. And so that's the reason why I love this lab, because it tells you what's going on from a mind and a body connection, the emotional and the biochemical in a very elegant way.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

Yeah, that's really interesting. It's making me think about uh, because I've had a lot of conversations with women in particular who feel or recognize that there's something that's not right in their body. And so then they pursue lab work and they go get their blood test done. And then there's this frustration because the end result is well, my labs don't show that there's anything wrong. And so I'm sure we create all these narratives in our mind about like, are we crazy? Like, what's going on? And what's interesting about the work that you do is that there's actual evidence. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 8:10

And that they're okay, no, there really is something going on. It's so affirming when women or my clients they see this lab because it's very affirming and it explains a lot of things that are going on that labs, conventional labs aren't catching. And so that's another really good point. First of all, with the medical model, they're looking at a um a population that's not healthy. And really the goal for the medical model is to see when you get out of range to the point where you get medicated. They don't look at the continuum where you're headed. Um, and so it's either you're you're fine or you're not fine, right? But you could be trending that way, but they're not going to really pick it up and do something about it. And so your labs are normal for a sick population and also because you don't really get to that point where you need medication. It doesn't mean that everything is fine. Whereas from a functional lab standpoint, we're looking at optimal uh health and we're looking at vitality. And so we're actually looking where you are on the continuum and respond before you get to that point where you need like symptoms are showing up sometimes or medication is needed. But the other thing is blood labs are basically they're homeostatic and they are the carrier of like the oxygen in the nutritions into the cell. And so what you're doing when you're looking at hair, tissue, and mineral analysis is you're looking at a cell, a tissue sample, and how your cells are responding to what you have in your body. And sometimes, you know, your body cannot absorb and respond in the cells, and that's going to inform how you end up feeling. So it doesn't matter if you have, you know, medication on board, if you have the best supplements and the best nutrition, if you're not able to really absorb it and receive it and use it in the cells, then you're not going to feel well. And that's where the symptoms start to show up.

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Yeah, I'm because so much of this is new for me too. Um, I wonder if it's possible to break down or even just come back to what exactly is happening on that cellular level. I know you shared at the beginning a little bit, but would you mind coming back to that and just breaking it down a little bit?

SPEAKER_00 10:20

Absolutely. So so many things are happening, especially when you get into midlife. And, you know, by then you've got 40 to 50 years of, you know, living and um a lot of things that's happening under the behind it all is what you talk about all the time, which is why I really love this conversation, the opportunity to talk to you and your listeners, because what's been happening over a long period of time that's creating these symptoms is nervous system dysregulation, um, probably something traumatic that's been either chronic or some pivotal event that happened. And just the oversimplify, I know it's nuance. You're either in a state of rest and recovery, um, or you're in the state of fight, flight, freeze, or even fawn. And so one of the biggest things that actually burns through your minerals, because your mineral, your body is trying to keep you alive, your energy is going to be directed at what's the priority. And it's sort of like your minerals are the ingredients to have you be able to respond. And so when you're in the state of stress and you're not in a state of safety, then all of the systems, the biological systems that keep you healthy are not going to be prioritized for safety. And your body doesn't know the difference between these like thought, belief systems, uh habits. Maybe I'm not good enough, I'm not safe, a lack of self-care, no boundaries, perfectionism. Doesn't know the difference between that and danger. And so it's actually trying to keep you safe. And then you don't have access to hormone production. We don't need to reproduce, you know, when we're our safety is at stake, um, digestion slows down and halts because we're not gonna digest and absorb food because you know, we're trying to stay alive. And then basically you end up with a chronic state of being in that, you know, you've got to do something, you're not safe, and the rest recovery is not available. And you actually see that in this lab in the biochemistry, because we see an example of there's a optimal range of all of these minerals that it looks at and it's all depleted. So basically, it gives you a visual. I think there's so much blame and shame in midlife women when you start feeling like something's off and I can't really respond to life anymore. And this is giving you a really clear um reason. I mean, it I hear it's really affirming, and I think it's very um comforting to know when you see actually an explanation to why you're feeling the way you're feeling. And it all boils down to nervous system regulation, um, dealing with your traumas, having somebody guide you through it, and also looking at your body chemistry and your minerals and balancing that out. And actually, the other foundation is energy. If you don't have cellular energy, you you can't respond to life, whatever it is. Um, and so your body is in its intelligence, it's not broken because it's turning things off and slowing things down. Um, I know functional freeze, it's kind of a fancy term, but it means that you're still functioning, you're still doing the things, but your body's doing it kind of on autopilot and sort of in a more down-regulated state. And there's also an equivalent from a biochemical standpoint, cell danger response. And what that means is your mitochondria. Remember in, you know, biology classes, organelles that generate energy. Well, in addition to generating energy, it's also there to sense danger and safety. And when it sensed that state of danger for too long, it's actually trying to slow you down. It's like hibernation. Let's reserve resources. So all of these symptoms are actually your body's intelligence telling you, Hey, I need attention and please slow things down. I'm going to do it for you because apparently you're not going to do it. And then it wants you to rest and recover. And that's really what I really believe your work is about in terms of more of the nervous system and uh the work that I do is the biochemical aspect that triggers the nervous system. And so I think it's an elegant um way to close the gap between the mind and the body connection.

SPEAKER_01 14:27

What listeners can't hear is me nodding my head as Dory's talking. I am just like, yes, this is exactly I'm it's so validating what you're sharing because this is the same thing that we are also trying to, like when I say we, I mean practitioners or even just therapists, what we're trying to communicate and help people with is recognize that if you don't, your body will. Absolutely. And you're explaining that on a whole other cellular level. Um with that train of thought, I'm curious to know what are some of the possibilities or the risks if we don't slow down at all. What absolutely look like? Because some of us are really good at pushing it really hard.

SPEAKER_00 15:13

Absolutely.

unknown 15:14

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 15:15

So um I know that book that you you know this book, I'm sure, Gabor Mate's book, when the body says no. So that's when people come to see me because now they have a diagnosis because the body now is not whispering to you, hey, I need some support, slow down. I don't feel safe, and I want to feel safe so that I can start healing and recovering. And so they come to me because there's a diagnosis. And so for me, it's um having this test run, it's my invitation to be able to introduce more of the emotional aspects of what's going on. So there's not, I would actually venture to say that I don't think that chronic illness is able to really take hold without that nervous system dysregulation and lack of safety. And so when you keep pushing through, uh literally, as I was saying, your body literally shuts everything down and you end up with a diagnosis. And so, for example, you know, and if it's not able to generate energy and you're not able to digest, you end up with gut issues, right? Anxiety and all those things. We know nervous gut, right? Butterflies in your stomach, we know that nervous system dysregulation, even just like the thoughts you have about not being enough, perfectionism, not being worthy, all those things make you feel unsafe. It's it's telling you over and over again that you've got to do, you've got to like perform to be able to earn your place in existence. And that's, you know, it's not gonna create a sense of common safety. And it's not something a lot of people are even aware of because it's a way of being. And so when they come to me, by the time they come to me, they're looking at the biochemical because their body is telling them, hey, something's wrong. And of course, you know, doing things to support your gut, doing things to support your hormones are a part of regulation. But the upstream of that is what started that shutdown of the ability to adapt in the first place. And that would start with something traumatic happened or the way that your habits are created throughout the day based on, you know, conditioning, and then learning how to soothe yourself and calm yourself and giving yourself permission to be present and be aware. I I love what you say a lot, just awareness and um, you know, not not being in a state of uh shaming or blaming or, you know, um making yourself the bad guy or wrong, but just really being present with yourself like you would with a child or with somebody you love and you know what's going on with me. And and I I love that you have a very much body-based approach because your body is sort of your subconscious mind, and that's where it's talking to you because it's it's just how it works. And so calming the body and reminding your body that your presence and you're listening is a huge, it's huge medicine. It's more potent, I think, than a lot of different things you could do with those protocols and supplementation. It they all work together. I don't want to, you know, oversimplify, but just to give you like more of the weight of where the work lies.

SPEAKER_01 18:18

Yeah. So for those that have continued to believe that this is all in my head, it's not. No, it is not. Um, it it also reminds me of even just the vagus nerve and how that connects into all of this, right? You know, the vagus nerve, we know it connects the brain to the gut and then to every major organ in the body. And so there's a lot of physiological um evidence that our emotions are communicating with the rest of our body. And when we're in these long prolonged states of chronic stress, uh it's bound to have some sort of impact on our body and um and inflammation and all those pieces. So I can you tell us a little bit more about your role in when you meet with people? Like what? So after somebody's taken some tests and you're able to kind of read back uh what you're seeing, what what does your role look like in in those conversations?

SPEAKER_00 19:21

Yeah, absolutely. So now I actually start with one test. I realize that actually it it causes stress when you look at all these labs because they all come back with information. Now you have to do something with all that information. And now all of the results require some kind of supplementation or protocol. And but then um I thought this is actually causing more stress. And literally, if you have no cellular energy to do something with the supplements and to follow through with the protocol because you are burnt out, it actually your healing journey now turns into more stress and shame. And so I actually a lot of what I do is simplify and foundation. And that's why, you know, I do talk to them about these things, such as like mineral balancing. They're the spark blocks to your body, anything your body needs to do. Minerals are behind the scenes, what makes it happen. And if you don't have energy, then it's, you know, emotionally and psychologically, we blame ourselves and think that something's wrong. And really, it's your biology, it's not you. Even mood swings, like those horrible mood swings, irritability, anger, there are minerals that are involved, like lithium, right? It's a calming mineral. And then you've got maybe it also looks at heavy metal toxicity like um mercury, remember Mad Hatter syndrome, but it causes irritation and anxiety and all kinds of things because it gets into the brain. And so when people come to me, I actually just one run this one lab first. And if it makes sense to do anything else, we do, but we get our foundations dialed in. And so people often come to me because they are having, you know, symptoms physically. And um, when I run this lab, then I'm able to show them the mind and body connection. And that's where I really think it's great to partner. And that's why I'm really glad to be here and talk to you because, you know, a lot of us are not, this isn't my lane. I'm not, you know, licensed and I'm not practicing practitioner of psychology. Um, so it's a really elegant way to really introduce that element of it because a lot of people don't realize that, you know, hormonal imbalances and brain fog and you know, severe fatigue and you know, gut issues, um, and even a diagnosis, any serious chronic diagnosis is remember, my husband had that terminal diagnosis, and a lot of it was triggered by heat, combat veteran. And a lot of things happen in his lifetime, a lot of trauma and just belief systems and perfectionism and you know, uh warrior mentality and other things. But just having them understand that there is an element that's more emotional. And when I run the lab, I show them what's happening biochemically and what's happening emotionally so that I can. kind of bridge the gap between the two and I see that as a core part of my role. And it's um, you know, you can work on your nervous system and you can make a lot of progress with your healing of your biology. And you can also, but then if you just work on your biology and don't work on nervous system regulation, then it's hard to actually have that stick. And so I think that there's more weight, but it's not either or it's both. And so I see my place as Jill helping with hormone balance and a lot of the foundational energy inputs and nervous system regulation is biochemical. We're powered by sunshine. How many hours do you think many of us don't like we're we're inside and we're not getting it's like having a plant and not giving it any sunshine and can't thrive. And that's a nervous system SOS, right? It also um resets when we do what in our physiology. And so for example, when you have morning sunlight even just five minutes, it tells you when to create energy, when to hormone balance help with hormones and you know when to digest and when to re-recover and heal. And so if you don't have that in line, the body doesn't know when to do what and it causes a state of stress and dysregulation. Not breathing properly a lot of us are in stress and we're breathing only in the upper part of our lungs and not the whole thing. And we need that to move nutrients. 70% of our detox comes from how I breathe we breathe. And so and that signal safety if you can breathe entirely in your lungs versus just in portion of it. So that also helps to regulate nervous system physiologically and then hydration you know one percent of dehydration causes anxiety and brain fog. It can actually make make a big impact even your mood and a lot of us are walking around dehydrated. And by the way what does it what does that carry electrolytes or minerals to be able to populate in your body and so uh my role is to look look at the physiological aspects uh that cause nervous system dysregulation and also those symptoms that we're seeing and also to introduce the nervous system in psychological emotional aspects and um and share ways to be able to access that and get support.

SPEAKER_01 24:16

I don't think I will ever look at deep breathing and hydration the same ever again. That just brings it to a whole new level. That's so interesting. It's it is sometimes I'll be honest it it's a hard sell to tell people it's not sexy.

SPEAKER_00 24:33

It really isn't and it goes back to what we were saying before you hit hit play if you know the why because you know these are the foundations of what your physical body needs to thrive. Even just taking a pause like you said when you have that go go go mentality going from one thing to another that's not how we were designed. We're designed to pause um you know and when you're in that physical state of move and onto the next thing onto the next thing it that also sends uh signals say a lack of safety. And the the drive behind it is that I need to do things to be able to make sure everything's okay. And in a a hint that maybe you're in that state of burnout and that's your mentality is go sit outside for half an hour and do nothing. And you'll be so you know agitated, irritated, a little bit like you know you feel a little bit anxiety because it feels unsafe to just be still but that's really something that is signaling to your body physiologically everything's okay. Hey, it's time to recover and be fine. And for a lot of women who are in burnout who are high achievers or people that you work with as soon as they get that little bit of energy back, boom, they're back out there again, right? But that energy is signaling to you oh now I have the reserves to start recovering instead of like okay now I can do more right but we're not giving it that because it's more comfortable and safe and it it's what we're used to to go and use that energy as soon as we have it and boom we're back into that state of burnout.

SPEAKER_01 26:03

Again we're not able to recover rest and digest recover and heal yeah okay so recognizing that you know in the winter we live in a rain city right what do they call it Vancouver um it's hard to access that sun unless you have uh the ability to fly somewhere and you know go somewhere warm for a period of time what you know what would you recommend prioritizing throughout the winter when it is colder it is darker yeah what would you recommend um as a reset?

SPEAKER_00 26:41

Yeah so sometimes even if you don't see the sun and it's raining and it's cloudy you're still able to get some of it. So that's it is this is another hard sell, right? But be your end of one experience and be curious and see what happens. But even um just opening a window or looking outside or just getting some kind of sun exposure can still be helpful. And still it's really tough, yes, because you you get your sunshine circadian rhythm you get your vitamin D, which is it helps with mood, health and nervous system all of those things those things are really important. That's why seasonal affective disorder happens. And so I don't like to rely on technology but the thing that comes to mind is there's 10,000 luxe light that you can use and just sit in front of it. And for the people that are shift workers that's what I recommend because it's it gives you that light to be able to signal hey it's daytime and this is when I need the energy. And uh so that's another option and they're not very expensive and you don't have to spend a ton a ton of time around them. A Spurdy S P-E-R-T-I is a good brand but I think if it's Lux L U X light and 10,000 then it's able to give you you know something like that without having access to sunshine.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

Okay. I didn't realize that um despite the lack of sun just exposure uh to the outdoors maybe that's even just the fresh air absolutely and being in nature and just um we're designed to be outside and and we're not doing that.

SPEAKER_00 28:16

So it's like a it's like okay if you have a pet and you never let it see outside you're thinking that's abuse, right? But then for people it's it's the same that's that's our state of nature that's where we we belong. Well the other thing that helps with signaling circadian rhythm is light. And so at nighttime dim the lights or avoid the blue lights because the blue lights only show up during the daytime. And so that's something else you can do to counterbalance that and so you know when the sun goes down in the wintertime when there's you know then just keep keep the light the ambient light sort of like more auburn which is more like sunset which is signaling to your body and your eyes that it's time to wind down. So that part is really important as well. When you have the blue light flashing ahead then over your overhead then it's signaling hey it's time to wake up hey and then it's hard to wind down and rest and that confuses your nervous system. So even with that piece of it the the evening hours um and if you can see the sunset and the ambulant light there it really helps as well because it is telling your your body through your eyes you've got receptor in your eyes that is able to reset your your body's rhythms and say hey this is the time to do whatever it wants to do during that time. Rest and recover in nighttime when you're sleeping that's when growth hormone starts to happen and that's when you start detoxifying to give it that is really powerful.

SPEAKER_01 29:40

Oh that's yeah really cool. I'm one I'm wondering if we can even shift um I'm curious how stress and burnout and what you see in lab work, how like how does that affect sleep for people or what do you typically see when it comes to sleep?

SPEAKER_00 29:59

Okay so when we go all the way back to energy like cellular you literally need energy to be able to get to sleep. And so when you don't have any cellular energy it's actually harder to get to sleep. When you're talking about minerals and um stress you know if that's running really high a lot of times when you're burnout something odd happens because it does have that up and down is kind of like wonky. So at nighttime you get a second win usually around 11 o'clock I and a lot of us I've experienced that or you know that I talk to um and all of a sudden you you feel like wow I can't get to sleep right because you get that second win at nighttime. And also something like magnesium is a calming sedative mineral and a lot of times I see for people in burnout on the lab, it's very low. So at nighttime with the low magnesium it's hard to wind down you get that muscle tension and feeling like just not able to let go and relax. And so something easy that you can do is maybe take an Epsom salt bath that has magnesium in it to be able to get it through your skin transdermally and also magnesium sprays and lotions things like that can be really helpful. But um yeah so it really does there are a lot of different things that show up in your minerals that not only help you you know gain energy but also appropriately wind down and get into that relaxation state.

SPEAKER_01 31:21

Yeah oh I know a lot of people that take magnesium as a supplement before bed because it like you said it relaxes our muscles and kind of helps our overall uh nervous system calm down. You said something interesting to me you started with saying we need energy to sleep. Right. Can you tell me more about that?

SPEAKER_00 31:40

Just to get yourself into that sleep state and also your body is doing a lot of things while it's sleeping it's actually doing a lot of detoxification especially of the brain and recovering and it is you know generating growth hormones. And so behind the scenes you're kind of knitting and healing and recovering your body. We feel like our body isn't doing anything while we're sleeping but we actually are and when that is not available to you then you can't detox and something interesting too that's happening in sleep is that all the stress and all of the you know things that happen the day anything traumatic or anything that really got you emotionally when you're sleeping it kind of calibrates it and it's almost like a therapy session in that it begins to kind of neutralize it and and concept like contextualize it and process it. Whereas if you don't sleep, it's doing all this work behind the scenes but when you don't sleep well then you wake up with the same stress. I I know that a lot of people had had the experience of after goodnight's sleep all of a sudden things feel different and look different. And it's not your imagination that's what's happening. So you're actually your body is doing a lot of things while you're sleeping whereas you know we we think that because we're not moving, we're not doing anything but we really are.

SPEAKER_01 32:52

Yeah that helps. No no absolutely and that's it like we sometimes we have really vivid dreams and not that I'm a dream expert uh but I do see and hear a lot of people talking about really intense dreams that they have and I do believe that the mind is also trying to process and make sense of what's been living in our subconscious mind. And sometimes those stress dreams don't always give us restful sleep. But yeah it it's a terrible feeling to go to bed stressed and then also wake up carrying that same stress if we're not getting good sleep. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:29

Yeah I totally agree. I mean it's it's such a big pillar of health and it's something that a lot of us are having struggles with or some people just feel like you know I've got all these things to do so I'm gonna power through and I'm just going to you know get this done and I'll rest you know when I'm exhausted right and and I when so when you're exhausted it it's it's harder to get to sleep the more you push.

SPEAKER_01 33:56

Yeah absolutely I'd love to help listeners recognize okay what what might be some of those early signs of stress or burnout maybe in conversations you've had or things that you've noticed because I'm sure a lot of people are wondering at what point in time do I go and see a practitioner like you for something like this? So when would be a good time for someone to come and check in if they're interested in doing more lab work or learning what is actually happening on a cellular level? Are there early signs that people should be mindful of and thinking, okay, now's a good time for me to go?

SPEAKER_00 34:37

Yeah. The optimal time is when well some of the signs um is one of this is energy like you feel like that's when your mitochondria and things are beginning to shift and it feels subtle and we always assign it to a thing like and also we also say well you know this is why I'm tired. But when I get through this then it'll be okay I'm going to take that vacation I'm gonna go get that massage so a big sign is that energy shift. The other piece is um feeling suddenly like um you're not able to rise up to the challenge or respond to things. So little things that used to not really be a big deal is suddenly a big deal because that traces back to energy like I don't have the capacity physically energetically to deal with this. And so you feel burdened when before it was no big deal. I'm just gonna do this. But you can tell intuitively that it's it's more than you can handle right now. And um you kind of brush it off like I was able to do it before. So I'm gonna do it again, right? Or I'm just gonna power through it. And so and it's a lot of identity isn't it this is who I am and this is what I do. So I'm gonna continue. And so we begin to slowly ignore because a lot of times it's not really subtle it's about a bunch of different things that keep cropping up and building um you know like what I was saying like feeling that anxiety when you're sitting down like wait I can't relax. You just can't relax or shut your mind off. That's another piece of it. And um then you also end up getting those physical symptoms um like your your gut maybe you've got gas and bloating because your body is in that state of must do and must function and must effort, must fix, must keep safe, must hold it together for everybody else. And so digestion starts slowing down and your enzymes you need minerals to be able to create like sodium sodium chloride chloride is what creates hydrochloric acid which is the digestive acid in your stomach that breaks down absorbs food. And so you actually aren't able to make that much and you you get that gas bloating and suddenly you have like maybe food sensitivities and puffiness and you end up with brain fog because the food particles and toxins are in general circulation. So just feeling tired and feeling more sensitive, getting sick and not being able to recover as quickly, getting sick more often kind of that low grade but you can't shake it. So there are a lot of clues um that are there and it's quiet, right? But then it all adds up but you're not putting it together because you're looking at the next project or the next thing or caregiving or you know every the people that you're caring for and helping even as a profession as a helper I mean you're thinking about it like okay what's how can I support this other person? And so it doesn't really occur to us to look and see what what's happening inside for us because we're holding it to everybody else and looking outside and everywhere else. And that's why I really love what you teach about awareness and being in touch with your body because a lot of us have lost that and haven't considered that anymore for too long and that's what culminates into a diagnosis and physical symptoms that have been there for a while and all of a sudden escalate.

SPEAKER_01 37:53

For those that might be in the thick of it with what you've just described um what is what is some hope that we can communicate or that you can offer to people that might feel really stuck?

SPEAKER_00 38:09

Yeah, for sure. Your body isn't broken and you're not imagining it and it's not because you're lazy and it's not because you know you've you've done something wrong. But now you have an awareness and I think awareness is what begins healing and um just listening to what your body's saying and giving your body and your mind what it needs is the key. But quick story is uh you know I've been watching my husband and he had that diagnosis and it was terminal like get your affairs in order there's nothing we can do. And yes we have done a lot of the things that I teach and they've made a huge difference. But the biggest lever was joy and safety and you know thinking about self-care and what makes you feel happy what lights you up and and seeing that in your your day it doesn't have to be something big you know it could be some treat like I don't know that tea that you love or whatever. But also getting back to what nurtures your soul, what lights you up has been such a game changer in shifting um his nervous system and also his outlook and then his physiology. And I would say that that's really powerful medicine. And um I would say things that you're teaching here, you're in the right place. I was just saying and I have to look at what it's called again you had just posted in your Instagram your five senses something simple like that. It's not the sexy stuff. It's not you know the fancy hormones that's there's a place for that. I think it's more advanced but it's like hydration and taking time and sitting in the sun and savoring and maybe slowing it down what you do, your actions like your speaking, your movement and everything because actually makes you more mindful in in your body and signals to your body that you're safe. There's no need to rush rush right you're you don't slow down when you're in state of rushing. But it's these not sexy but foundational things that give you your body and your mind what it needs. It's like basic human necessity that we're not getting but that we can easily put in and it's not to give you more to do it's just dosing it in throughout your day to remind yourself hey you're safe you know take and and the more you take care of yourself and do these things hydration and you know sitting and noticing your breath right you can do breath work but then just noticing it like any of the awareness will will help you be able to regulate another fun story is I I was doing something in the Heart Math Institute and uh they talk about coherence like getting into that rest and digest recover state and I they have a sensor it's called an M wave and I thought yeah I'm meditating of course I'm calm and it tells you if you're in that state of rest and digest it kept flashing red at me Katarina and what it taught me was I think I'm I'm then and relaxed but I'm not uh I've forgotten. And so this is actually something you do to retrain yourself and it's just dosing it in you know in those moments in between moments maybe when you wake up in the morning check in with your breath or do those five senses one of them even right like how am I feeling in my body or what do I see checking in and and being present and those things are what turns off that fight flight. It's what shifts you physiologically into the ability to heal and then you know you can do the other thing.

SPEAKER_01 41:43

So if there's just one small step you can take it is that I would say the most common theme amongst all my conversations has been this idea of being present. Every so far a lot of people who have really been through burnout have learned and come out on the other side saying the most foundational or powerful tool is learning how to be present. And I do want to normalize how much of a threat that feels for the brain because we know neurologically that slowing down is not as stimulating for the brain. We don't get that same dopamine release and so I it's natural when it feels uncomfortable I think that's when people jump ship and they go, ah no I can't I can't do this. This is too much or it doesn't feel like it's working the maybe the way we think it should. And so I like to just reinforce that no no that's part of the course. If you're if you're not yeah if you're not used to it it's going to feel uncomfortable but it doesn't mean that it's wrong or that it's not working because clearly there's so um there's so much healing that can happen just in the basics of using our five senses and just trying to be in that present moment. So that's really great that you're able to reinforce that simple is powerful.

SPEAKER_00 43:08

Yes absolutely and I I feel like I hopeful hopefully that's hopeful and and it again goes back to what you're saying when you understand the why it helps you be able to try and follow through and see how it goes. And if sitting still is really difficult um your body likes steady rhythm and um slower pacing um together. So even just going out and walking in the sunshine that right left right left sensation of walking helps kind of soothe your nervous system. And if you're just scanning because you don't scan if you're being pursued or in danger it it also signals safety. So even starting with something like that can be really helpful. There's so many different tools right and I think that's part of what I like to do share so that the person is empowered With being able to choose and create their own healing journey.

SPEAKER_01 44:04

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So if if um if anybody's interested, you could also Google or research like Vegas nerve uh calming. Uh there's a lot of what you talked about in there too. But there are there are so many different tools that um there's some possibilities and not one shoe fits all sizes, right? Not everything is gonna work the same way, but um it's good to be reminded to come back to those basics. Yes, absolutely. So here's one question that I always like to ask. Um you know, if and this it's so hard to just pick one thing. But you know, if there's one thing that you wish most people could understand about burnout, what would that be?

SPEAKER_00 44:54

Oh, yeah, that is really difficult. Um, so knowing that there are a lot of different aspects to it, um, it's that it's a tap on the shoulder to pause and be aware and listen to what your body is saying to you. And there's even a book called The Joy of Burnout, but it's sort of like when you start um working through it, it's it could be actually a doorway into more peace, joy at presence and self-nurturance. And when you are taking care of yourself and you feel nourished and you feel your burnout lift, you can be a more powerful version of yourself and have more peace, joy, and energy in your life. And for those of us caregivers who want to care for other people, that we do it by example so that they can do it for themselves. Because I think a lot of times for me is I'm trying to fix everything for everybody, and it kind of diminishes their ability to, or my perception of their ability to rise up and take care of themselves. But I think it's such a powerful example. I had heard before through the Hat Heart Math Institute, a regulated nervous system regulates other people. And so without speaking and just being and showing up is uh a really powerful thing you can offer to those you care about.

SPEAKER_01 46:18

I like that. I like that's a bit of a new way again of looking at burnout, is that there's opportunity behind that, and that it is an opportunity to either reconnect with yourself because this is your body that is communicating something really valuable, um, or potentially connecting with yourself in a whole new way that you're not used to because it's worked for you to just push through, keep going, uh, do all the things, and now all of a sudden our bodies changed, right? They do for everybody, and everybody has a capacity. So what an invitation to slow down and go, okay, how can I connect with myself differently in the way that I have been? So I think that's really encouraging. Thank you, Dory, so much. You have so much knowledge and wisdom in this area, and I really value that and and the work that you're doing. Um, I would love to create an opportunity for people to ask questions, maybe in the show notes. And for sure, I'm gonna put in a link for how they can connect with you and maybe get some more information around this. And I don't know, we'll see. Maybe there's another opportunity for us to do another episode with some questions and then just kind of go from there. But thank you for your time.

SPEAKER_00 47:37

Absolutely. Yes, to all of that. It would be amazing. And it's been so much fun talking to you. And as I had mentioned to you when I met you, I just love the way that you present information, a very sensitive, trauma-informed, carrying it way. And the the tools that you share are really awesome. And I just saw your other your newest episode drop with a meditation. And so listeners are in the right place. Thank you. I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01 48:07

Thanks for listening. If you haven't already, please subscribe on Spotify and Apple so you don't miss future episodes. You can also connect with me on Instagram at advantage.podcast for updates and extra resources. To learn more about my counseling services, visit vantagecounseling.com. Until next time, take a step back, breathe, and give yourself the advantage.