The Difference Between Fitness And Sport (and some other value nuggets!)

What do I do? I'm not even sure where to start! 

This is the most common frustration I've heard from folks who are new to training in a gym of any kind- let alone a functional training facility. 

Many people search for inspiration on social media, others deep dive on YouTube, some may even go old school and read some books. 

In this episode, we give you some tools for how to think of fitness and how you can customize your exercise selection based on what your goals are, to remain injury free and thrive! 

Sport is where most people begin, but as you'll hear...Sport is NOT Fitness! Listen in as we discuss from that framework and share some other value nuggets along the way! 

Welcome to the RPP Podcast! 

Transcript

Tali 0:00

Well, fitness versus sport was a topic that came up during our coaches meeting, and I can't exactly remember why do you,

Cody 0:09

no. We were talking about the CrossFit level one and it probably had something to do with that.

Tali 0:14

Sure, sure. Well, it was something that definitely came up in my class today, which I thought was so timely that you decided to do this topic today. But you know, today we're doing the Clean and Jerk, which is a very. A powerful movement. And I'd say that the clean translates into lots of, uh, important domains of fitness. But I don't know if I necessarily feel that way about the jerk, especially the split jerk being so very specific. Mm-hmm. And one sided. Someone had asked earlier today if they should be switching off feet. And I said, you know, if this is your first day doing it, by all means go for it. Like, play around, see what sticks, what feels strong. Um, but I'll be honest with you, I've been doing, you know, right foot forward for more than 15 years.

Cody 1:05

Yeah.

Tali 1:06

And that's where it will stay.

Cody 1:07

I had a weightlifting coach just describe it to me as batting, like if you step up to bat, you're, it's rare that somebody is ambidextrous enough to, to hit a ball with a bat from both directions. Sure. So. It's not creating some wicked imbalance if you're just working one side on that one movement versus all the other things that you do. Like the snatch is pretty well balanced, right?

Tali 1:30

Sure. I mean, I already have, I already would disagree with you about that because you know, when we do unilateral movements in. Fitness. Mm-hmm. We work both sides. Or when, um, we're rehabbing an injury, we work both sides. Sport is one of those things where the objective or the goal or the outcome outweighs what might be best for your body, and that's kind of the distinction we're making today. Right?

Cody 1:59

Yeah. Yeah. But I guess another way of, of distinguishing those though is if you're doing clean and jerk in a CrossFit setting or. Some general fitness setting, uh, it's gonna be sprinkled in with lots and lots of other stuff. Oh, yeah. Whereas if you're a weightlifter, yes, you might, you might produce imbalances, but those imbalances are probably helping you in your sport as long as it's not creating an injury. So. The, the jerk, uh, as a weightlifter is different than a jerk for general fitness. 'cause in that case it's, you're probably doing like walking lunges and you're doing all this kind of like bilateral stuff in a similar position as the jerk, but way more balanced. You're working both sides and you're, you're keeping that balance because you have this broad. General fitness that you're sprinkling in lots of variety.

Tali 2:48

Sure.

Cody 2:48

Uh, but if you're doing weightlifting as a sport, that's, that's a big key difference.

Tali 2:53

Well, let's define those terms, or at least let's make a distinction between those things.

Cody 2:59

Well, I sport on a

Tali 3:00

broader sense,

Cody 3:01

right? Yeah. I think sport can be a little bit more difficult to define because it, it, the obvious like is, is if you're competing, if you're. If you have a competition of any kind that you're working toward in a specific domain, that's obviously sport. Mm-hmm. But. At the same time, people play pickup basketball locally. They're not training for an event. They have no goals per se. You know, some people just do this for fitness, but I would still classify that as a sport 'cause you're just doing very specific things and it's a closed, um, the thing about sport is that it's a closed environment. In other words, there are rules to the game.

Tali 3:43

Mm-hmm.

Cody 3:43

Whereas in fitness. There kind of isn't any rules right there, there aren't any rules because you're gonna, you're going to work on the area of fitness that you need to in order to bring up the deficits that you perceive. So,

Tali 3:57

and it's just much broader, right?

Cody 3:58

It's, yeah, it can be much more broad and. Or it can be specific and it just depends on what you're trying to achieve for your health, your body, whether that's composition or strength or whatever. Uh, and it's not, your body is not a subject of the sport. It's like the other way around the training is for your body rather than your body being used to achieve a sport. And

Tali 4:21

then, yeah. That's a really good way of putting it. Yeah. Right. And I feel like that also just shifts the motivation and it shifts the priority. Right. And I think that that's why. We see injury far more in sport than we see in fitness pursuit.

Cody 4:35

Absolutely.

Tali 4:36

Yeah.

Cody 4:37

Uh, that kind of brings me to this stupid argument I keep seeing on X, which is, uh, some very influential, uh, uh, you know, like influencer type trainers that are out there. Have gone on record as saying like that the deadlift after a certain age, you shouldn't be deadlifting what? And uh, it's just so absurd to me because they, they cite all these examples of exercises that might be safer and pretty much the examples that they use is just putting everybody on a machine. And I'm thinking, well. Uh, they're coming at this and they're, they're really mixing up their intentions with the lift because a lot of people who think that deadlifting is dangerous, it's because they either come from a power lifting background or strong man or something like that. Or that's what they've witnessed and that's what they've seen, or they just don't know how to do the lift properly. Like any of

Tali 5:40

those, or like in their mind they're thinking like, oh, deadlift means heavy. Like that doesn't have to be the case.

Cody 5:46

Yeah. But even if it is, you can have a progressive overload. Without competition and it's a very safe environment.

Tali 5:54

Sure. I was just saying in class today, like we were watching masters weightlifting for a reason. Mm-hmm. During our session we had a really small class and I said, you know, one of the best things that you can do for your own weightlifting is to watch others, and I just happened to choose masters weightlifting, which is like 35 and over. And beyond. Mm-hmm. And there's a reason that you're seeing a lot of older lifters, it's considered much more safe than other sports.

Cody 6:21

Yeah. Yeah. Uh, so I think the, the perceived danger is just from a misapplication mm-hmm. Of the movement, whether it's bad form or just bad programming, you know, trying to

Tali 6:34

Oh, yeah. Like going too ham too fast.

Cody 6:36

Yeah. Either going too far, too fast, or there's this. Idea with Starting Strength and Mark Rippetoe that somehow you should be adding five pounds to the barbell every week. Oh, every week. Every week. And it's like, well, yeah, that's true as a novice, but you know, if you read the fine print or if you really listen to what he's saying, he's not assuming you're gonna be able to do that forever.

Tali 6:55

Or if you're not missing a day and you know, everything else is in alignment too. Yeah. You know, that's not like a general prescription. Yeah.

Cody 7:03

And, um, uh, you know, with my rat pack, this is, these are all people 60 to 90 and they're doing dead lifts every week. But we do a wave pattern cycle. So seven reps one week, five reps, the next three reps the next, and they're getting progressively heavier. And then we start that wave over again. So they go back up to sevens and they back off of the weight. And then fives, and then threes building in the weight again. And they do that cycle three times, and then they have two weeks off completely where they don't lift at all. I. And then when we start the next cycle, we start with three weeks of tempo work. So it's really light, really slow for three weeks. It's kind of agonizing. But then, then we go into another nine weeks of that wave pattern that I just described. And our injury rate with, uh, deadlifts is, uh, major injuries absolutely zero.

Tali 8:00

Mm-hmm.

Cody 8:01

And minor injuries that people have had full recoveries from, I think maybe three out of 40 clients in the last three years. That our age is 60 to 90. So this whole idea of deadlifts being dangerous after a certain age is absurd, first of all. And I think it's just conflating the sport versus the movement for fitness.

Tali 8:22

Sure.

Cody 8:23

Yeah. So I think it's really important distinction.

Tali 8:26

I forget too. Um, do you guys test one rep maxes in rep pack?

Cody 8:31

We don't, 'cause there's no point, there's no point to one rep max a deadlift unless you are a competitor. And that again, that's separating sport from fitness. Um, so the heaviest we ever get is a three rep max, and then if they accidentally hit a one or two rep max and they can't do all three

Tali 8:47

after sometimes,

Cody 8:48

then uh, it's probably still a lower risk than if they had psychologically tried to load the bar for a single. Yeah,

Tali 8:55

well, so that's something that I actually wrote down was, you know, taking the intensity or the pressure off. Um, I think that's kind of tough to cultivate in a CrossFit setting. And I think us being such a green gym in a place that's really been untouched by this kind of programming, we have a really unique edge in that particular way. I think about sometimes if our members were ever to go to other gyms, you know, you would see a very different crowd of people potentially just like uber competitive every time, making lots of noise, like ripping their t-shirts off. And uh, I wouldn't say all gyms are like that, but there's a competitive aspect, right? Like we all are here for. The same reasons, but one of those reasons is like the energy in the room. And that energy really does push people further than they would push themselves if, you know, training in a vacuum.

Cody 9:53

Mm-hmm.

Tali 9:54

And that can natural on a

Cody 9:55

consistent basis.

Tali 9:56

Yeah. And I think that that can really feed those of us who do like having a competitive outlet or would identify as competitive people. Um, I don't see anything wild happening in our gym in that regard, but it can. Be that way when it comes to like trying to achieve a certain skill or trying to lift the same thing that you're the person that you're paired with is doing. Um, and I think the reason this conversation is important to our gym is that we're a gym of fitness even for our athletes. Right. Our student athletes. Mm-hmm. Or even for myself, like. I think of the work that we do here as building and cultivating fitness.

Cody 10:42

Mm-hmm.

Tali 10:42

And so that is a much longer game.

Cody 10:47

Mm-hmm.

Tali 10:47

I think,

Cody 10:48

and part of the pro premise that we're working on here is that, uh, the kids who are in sports are already getting their sports specific. Training, uh, by participating in their sports. Mm-hmm. By going to practices, by showing up for games. So our job is to provide a broad base of fitness from which to build that sports specific, uh, ability. So that. They're more robust, less injury prone, uh, and of course it's gonna help strengthen power and all those things could carry over to benefit their sport. Mm-hmm. But it's also a protective mechanism by having this foundation of fitness.

Tali 11:24

Yeah.

Cody 11:25

Where, uh, we'll leave it up to their track coach, to, to coach the specific track things.

Tali 11:30

Exactly. Mm-hmm. Totally. And I guess I just mean to say with all of that. That I'd like, I'd like the pressure to be off of everybody. Like we're all starting at different vantage points and we're all moving at different rates, and we're all prioritizing different things. You know, some people really lean into our lifting days and some people really lean into our pull-ups skill days. You know, not, not everybody has the same, uh, desire to fill all the buckets the same because there are many,

Cody 12:01

can you get your mic a little closer to the screen?

Tali 12:03

Yeah, sure.

Cody 12:05

Just better get right up in there. Better. Yeah. I

Tali 12:07

think

Cody 12:07

you got the sour mark, the sour mic this time.

Tali 12:10

Oh, I do. Okay. Thanks. Um, but I just wanna take the pressure off. Like, we do not expect people to come in here and like train like their lives depend on it.

Cody 12:23

Mm-hmm.

Tali 12:23

You know, maybe that's not the greatest phrasing because their lives do depend on. Right. Um, but, uh, you know. We talked about this in a, a podcast episode about consistency and being like, if you're showing up for with 60% in the tank, like, great, give me that. You know, we get it and we'll adjust for that. And that's the same. I think that's an important distinction with sport and fitness, is that there's this push and this pressure to perform, perform, perform. Were like, I'm just fucking glad you're here.

Cody 12:53

Yeah.

Tali 12:54

Yeah.

12:55

You

Cody 12:55

know? Yeah. Yeah. And I, the objectives can really more readily change too, when you have a mindset that you're doing this for your health versus a competitive sport. Because if, for instance, I have a deadlift competition that I'm gonna be really obsessed with making sure I'm getting my deadlift numbers in regardless of how I feel.

Tali 13:15

Yeah.

Cody 13:15

Whereas right now, at the age of 50, with like a sleep. Uh, disorder, I guess you could call it. Like, I have issues. Uh, so recovery sucks a lot of times. And so my objective with deadlifts is to be able to do them every week. Mm-hmm. And so sometimes like I'm working at 50, 60% and just getting in the reps and the first twinge of like, oh, my pack feels a little, uh, you know, a little tight on one side. I'm done for the day.

Tali 13:42

Good call.

Cody 13:42

I'm just done. Good. Like, I'll just do it again next week, you know? And yes, uh, that's. It is like playing it safe, but it's also like playing it for the long haul, like the really far view versus I have a deadlift competition in nine weeks. I can't take a week off.

Tali 13:59

Well, that's a really tough one to, I mean, that's a tough conversation for me to have because I'm very motivated by competition and I know that that really turns out not only like the best in. Me as a person, I feel really fulfilled by it. Um, but it really does, it just like turns on a switch.

Cody 14:21

Mm-hmm.

Tali 14:21

Like I feel so much more committed to the work that I'm doing, just having.

Cody 14:26

An audience.

Tali 14:27

Yes.

Cody 14:27

Yeah. But you know what, uh, what I've seen though with you is that you are able to change your objectives. So, for instance, your objective with this upcoming competition is not to win.

Tali 14:39

Well,

Cody 14:39

there's

Tali 14:39

no way that I could,

Cody 14:40

well, even if. You, I mean, you can't really say that like right now where you're at, you feel like that's true, but you could probably push harder and you could probably like, try, try. I could cut down to the

Tali 14:50

next class and like do all that. Yeah.

Cody 14:52

But the thing is, is your objective is you want to go six for six, not injured. Mm-hmm. And have fun. Right? Like that's kind of the objective is to just show up and, and reintroduce yourself back into the sport. So even in a, even in a sport context, you can change your objective.

Tali 15:10

It's true. You did see that shark come out for a minute there when that, um, start list came out a couple weeks ago. Mm-hmm. And I was a little freaked out myself that like, you know, seeing the startlet and seeing everybody who I was competing next to and like seeing our numbers and what we submitted. Just like my mind immediately went to like, I wanna crush them. Like I'm gonna kill this. And like, I'm gonna fill that spot where there's room for another medal. And like all this was just like flooding to me. And then something kind of settled with all of that information and I was like, oh yeah, I actually have no. Shot with my current positioning and that was actually a really big relief.

Cody 15:53

Yeah.

Tali 15:53

Like to take that pressure off, like that cutthroat side of me, I do have a lot of respect for, um, but it's not right for me right now. Right? Like I'm just lucky to be lifting at all. You know, I'm a year out from injury, one of the worst injuries I've ever had, and I'm just lucky to be here.

Cody 16:16

Yeah. And a layoff before that. Three years y before that of just,

Tali 16:21

I know.

Cody 16:21

Yeah. So that's great. Uh, I wanted to, while we're on this subject, wanted to address the difference between the. Functional training focus that we have here versus, uh, bodybuilding and endurance. Those bodybuilding communities and endurance communities particularly. Um, I could name others, but those you're

Tali 16:46

talking about like running, cycling, swimming,

Cody 16:49

yeah, running, cycling, swimming as far as endurance and then bodybuilders. What has happened, and I think this may have happened perhaps in the. Fifties, sixties, you know, bodybuilding started to get pretty popular and Arnold Schwarzenegger was like a household name and he kind of put into everybody's head that bodybuilding is fitness and bodybuilders of that era. And I think still to this day, a lot of times they, you know, you equate bodybuilding style workouts with fitness. If you go to a 24 Hour Fitness, or an LA Fitness or a whatever, any of those big global, uh, chains. That's what you'll see most people doing. They're either on cardio machines for endless hours or they are doing a bodybuilding style training, uh, protocol.

Tali 17:39

That's very interesting to call out. I didn't really think of it in that way. Yeah. But like it is really usually two different flavors

Cody 17:47

mm-hmm.

Tali 17:47

That are. Very sport specific.

Cody 17:51

Yeah. And that's the a, a big mental shift that I wish we could convey to a large audience is that bodybuilding is not fitness training. It's not bad for you per se. And if you're not competing, you might think, well, didn't we just talk about compete, competition kind of being the definition of the sport. But in this case, I, I would draw the analogy to like your local. Basketball pickup game. Like if you're in a 24 hour fitness and all you're doing is like leg presses and leg extensions and leg curls and you do like a leg day and, and then you do a chest day and then you do a back day and the back

Tali 18:28

thighs and tries

Cody 18:29

back and bicep day, you know? Yeah. And tries and shoulders and you're splitting up your body parts. Is

Tali 18:35

it not BS and tries?

Cody 18:36

It can be, but no. Usually it's like back and biceps and then chest and tries. Oh, but you, I've

Tali 18:41

never been a proper bodybuilder.

Cody 18:43

It's sort of like mix and match these modes. And there's, again, there's nothing wrong with that training. I'm doing some of that twice a week right now just because I kinda wanna put on a little bit of muscle mass.

Tali 18:53

I do it between sets because it's really good for building strong joints too. Yeah,

Cody 18:58

yeah.

Tali 18:58

Lots of stability.

Cody 18:59

Yeah. Some of that slower, more intentional, strict movement is, is can be a good offset for a lot of the. Bures and shit that we find ourselves doing explosive

Tali 19:08

sort of stuff. Yeah.

Cody 19:09

So, uh, I'm not knocking it, but I do think that I, I wish people could really get into their heads that that is a very sports specific way of training.

Tali 19:18

So we're now defining what fitness is not.

Cody 19:20

Yeah. And, and we see, I see this online again with like, these gym bros on x just arguing with each other about the best exercise or you shouldn't do this exercise. And it's like, well that's very. Contextual to what you're trying to achieve. And a lot of bodybuilders assume everyone is just trying to put on muscle and it's like, well. Not everybody is not, you know, some people really want to just have a bigger engine and be able to do more in their lives and like hike and run and ski and do things and feel better doing it and doing bicep curls doesn't really accomplish any of that for anybody. Anybody. No. It's

Tali 19:54

probably a hindrance, right?

Cody 19:56

It could. It could

Tali 19:56

be. You probably won't be able to put your arms down.

Cody 19:59

Yeah. Or

Tali 19:59

put your shirt on.

Cody 20:00

Yeah. So anyway, that's, that's a huge distinction for me in. In sports versus fitness is that most people have a very mistaken idea of the type of training it takes to help yourself be more fit. Now, I will say, just to, so I don't get beat up here too much on this point, is that. Someone in the gym doing bodybuilding style workouts is far fitter and probably way better off than someone who's not going to the gym at all. So I'm not trying to knock bodybuilding, it is just that it should be recognized as a sport, not as a fitness mode, if you will.

Tali 20:38

I'm looking up gra uh, Greg Glassman's definition of fitness.

Cody 20:43

Fitness in a hundred words?

Tali 20:44

Uh, no. I mean, I could

Cody 20:47

do that because the definition of fitness is pretty broad. There's like three different versions. One's on a power scale and that kind of thing.

Tali 20:54

Well, okay, so you mentioned bodybuilding, which mm-hmm. I know why it's a pop, you know, it's each, it's approachable, right.

Cody 21:02

Yeah,

Tali 21:02

it's very approachable

Cody 21:03

and that's why I called out the endurance crowd too. 'cause a lot of people equate like running with fitness. Oh, I run, I run. Okay. So that's great. I mean, I'm glad that you run. I'm glad that you probably run better than I can and more, you know, this is that I can,

Tali 21:18

that's an absolute given for both of us.

Cody 21:19

But, uh, but the point is, is that's a very narrow, very narrow, narrow aspect of your overall health and fitness. And a lot of, I mean, there are a lot of distance runners who end up with. All kinds of maladies later in life from beating themselves to hell. In that one domain.

Tali 21:37

In one domain.

Cody 21:37

Yeah. I, instead of having a broad fitness where they're doing, you know, calisthenics speed work, uh, weightlifting. Yeah.

Tali 21:47

Balancing out that effort. Right. It's a very deep groove, and it's something that you and I talk about a lot with. Our members, when we talk about running specifically, if you think, you know, we think about running in distance, but I want you to think about running in reps. How many steps, how many strides are you taking?

Cody 22:09

Mm-hmm.

Tali 22:10

In a mile in 400 meters.

Cody 22:13

Yeah.

Tali 22:14

Whatever. Like that's hundreds of thousands of reps.

Cody 22:18

Yeah.

Tali 22:19

If you're not, that is quite tough. Quite tough on the body.

Cody 22:22

Yeah. If you're not conditioned for it, I try to use the analogy of like, you know, I wouldn't, if you, if I asked you to come in here and bench press a thousand reps, even with an empty bar, you'd think I was absolutely nuts. But you'll go out and run 400 meter repeats three or four times. You've gotten a thousand reps in of running and Yeah. The, it's not, it's not apples and apples, but you see the point.

Tali 22:44

No, well, I think, I think running is, you know, it's one of those. Human capabilities, right? Mm-hmm. That we think of like,

Cody 22:53

we're all born by the time we're three. We can do it,

Tali 22:55

able to do it. And it's one of those things that we would like to see ourselves being able to do for a long time. So I think that's an easy domain for people to really push through or like really identify with wanting to be able to achieve. But you know, running for fitness would need to be. Periodized dosed, just like anything else, we train here. Mm-hmm. And so I really do believe that the kind of work that we're doing here in our gym allows people to make better decisions for other pursuits that they have. Like I hope that everybody that we work with who runs on a regular basis, like does a little warmup.

Cody 23:35

Mm.

Tali 23:36

How many people just like put on their shoes and go,

Cody 23:38

yeah.

Tali 23:38

But we do a warmup every single day in here. Like, just trying to get in some good habits. Right? Like, check in with your joints, check in with this and that. Yeah. You know, make sure everything's feeling okay before you take off.

Cody 23:52

Yeah. I mean, I even have my classes like knock out a few practice sit-ups before we start the clock, because it, it sounds funny, but it's like, you know, even if. Y they always feel good. You start the clock and you're on some time thing where you're trying to get 20 of them in a round and all of a sudden you do six of them and you get a cramp in your abs and it's like, yeah, well today wasn't the day, but you didn't test it. The waters first. So

Tali 24:16

I always say we're taste testing.

Cody 24:17

Yeah. I feel like, um, I feel like we should all do that, even with stuff that seems really accessible.

Tali 24:22

Yeah. Most stuff. I just wanted to bring up the CrossFit pyramid and you know, we refer to CrossFit because this is what we've been coaching for such a long time. You and I and know we're not an official CrossFit affiliate and there are many reasons why we aren't, but there are a lot of values and. Themes that we do subscribe to, and I think about the CrossFit pyramid, right? It's like the nutrition pyramid, which you know, really needs some revising. I'm gonna assume that it has by 2025 at this point, that like whole grains aren't still like the most important. Base layer

Cody 25:02

on the food pyramid.

Tali 25:03

Yeah.

Cody 25:04

Well, it's, believe it or not gotten worse.

Tali 25:06

What? I gotta look this up now.

Cody 25:08

One of the most recent government issued dietary guidelines that I've seen actually placed Lucky Charms as a more healthy option over red meat.

Tali 25:17

Shut the F up. Hold on, let me

Cody 25:18

just look at

Tali 25:19

this. Um,

Cody 25:20

yeah, it's absurd and politically driven.

Tali 25:23

Mm. I see a whole food pyramid. I don't think that that's maybe. What everybody's seeing

Cody 25:29

that's not government issued.

Tali 25:31

No. How do you even find that?

Cody 25:34

It's fine. I don't really, I I, I'm not going to trust it anyway. There's just too many greased palms involved.

Tali 25:42

Well, the USDA one is the one that I grew up looking at, and it's insane. But anyway, bringing it to the CrossFit pyramid, nutrition is at the bottom.

Cody 25:53

Mm-hmm.

Tali 25:53

Um, you know, making sure that we are.

Cody 25:55

Meaning the foundation.

Tali 25:56

Yes, the foundation. Mm-hmm. And making sure that we're like eating healthily for any of the proceeding or following pursuits. And then metabolic conditioning is the next, which you are all doing with us. And then gymnastics being the next rung up, you know, being able to perform body weight movements. I don't think we talked about this on the podcast. Maybe we talked about it in our coaches meeting most recently. That. Uh, CrossFit defines gymnastics as all body weight movements, not the sport. Uh, and then weightlifting, being able to safely and strongly move external loads is the next rung up. And then sport being the most specific on top, which like you had mentioned, is, uh, competitive arenas. Uh, also with a mastery of skills. So like very particular. Needs, outcomes, demands.

Cody 26:55

Yeah. The said principle is real specific adaptation to imposed demands, said SAID.

Tali 27:02

Oh.

Cody 27:03

Uh. So that, that is a real phenomenon, but you can kind of bypass it in the type of training that we're doing by just doing lots and lots of variety. Uh, so you are adapting to the specific things, but you're doing so many different things that you're bringing up a, a wide base of fitness all at the same time.

Tali 27:19

Well, and we talked about in this same meeting how CrossFit itself has become a sport.

Cody 27:24

Yes.

Tali 27:24

Not a great spectator sport, I must say, though.

Cody 27:27

Um, it depends on, it depends.

Tali 27:30

It very much depends.

Cody 27:31

Yeah.

Tali 27:32

What are you,

Cody 27:33

whatcha trying to show me? Not, not the safest sport perhaps, um, I don't know about statistically, but maybe at some point you can read that

Tali 27:42

Fitness in a hundred Words by Greg Glassman. Let's see. Eat meat and vegetables, nuts and seeds, some fruit, little starch, and no sugar. No was in bold letters. Keep intakes to levels that will support exercise, but not body fat. Practice and train major lifts, deadlift, clean, squat presses, clean and jerk, and snatch. Similarly, master the basics of gymnastics, pull-ups, dips, rope, climbs. Can't wait to hang our ropes by the way. Uh, those came up in class today too. Uh, pushups sit-ups, presses and presses. Two handstands, pirouettes flips. I don't remember. Pirouettes being in there. Pirouettes flips, splits and holds bike run, swim row, et cetera, hard and fast, five or six days per week. Mix these elements in, in as many combinations and patterns as creativity will allow. Routine is the enemy. Keep workouts short and intense, regularly learn and play new sports.

Cody 28:43

Yeah. So there was more than a hundred words there because you interjected a few times. It's true. But yeah, that's kind of, I

Tali 28:49

see why he had to choose, et cetera.

Cody 28:51

This,

Tali 28:52

uh, gotta make it concise,

Cody 28:54

kind of summarizes the CrossFit paradigm. Uh, yeah. Which we. One of the reasons we're not affiliated is that we've also branched out from that a little bit. So in my, well, in one of your programs and in, in one of my programs, we do a lot of periodization. Uh, and it's because again, that specific adaptation to impose demands, uh, and in my case with the Rat Pack, I periodize because, uh, I want people to become. Practiced and familiar enough with just a few barbell lifts that they can continue to progress on those with mastery and with CrossFit, there's just so much variety. Sometimes it can take a long time to master certain skills because they only come around once every three months or something like that. Mm-hmm. And uh, it's fun because it's always different, but. If your goal for, for the rat pack, bone density is a huge thing for me. You know, uh, you can put on muscle with thousands of different exercises, but bone density is very specific. You have to lift heavy weight, like you have to really put demands on your body and there's only a few movements that are actually safe enough to do that regularly.

Tali 30:10

Yeah.

Cody 30:10

Squats. Presses

Tali 30:12

that are accessible.

Cody 30:13

Right? Dead. Dead lifts. Yeah. Yeah. And those are accessible. Some form of those are accessible for just about anybody. Uh, and so having it periodized, in other words, we're doing it every week in the wave pattern that I described. Allows lots and lots of practice by month three by month four or five, you've got enough reps in that you're just really dialed in. You know, the form is great and you're able to, uh, gradually and patiently increase that load and demand on your body without it having to reintroduce some new variable of movement. Uh, and so periodization, I believe, for certain goals or, or populations is very important. CrossFit would say otherwise. Like if I were at a seminar, if I was at a CrossFit seminar saying what I'm saying, I would get all kinds of pushback and, and argumentation. So we have departed from CrossFit in certain, solely in certain domains. Yeah. Uh, because, uh, we see needs that CrossFit doesn't meet basically.

Tali 31:09

Totally. And you know, that's very program specific. And Barbell Club is the same way Barbell Club has. Very few changes, if any, within 12 weeks. Mm-hmm. You know, the idea is skill mastery and applied strength. So those are things that we need to get really comfortable and really good at before we can get stronger in them. So there's a lot of repetition, a lot of wave patterns like you mentioned. And so, um, it really just depends on. The des the desire or the, or the goal. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Um, would I say that Barbell Club falls into that definition of fitness? Absolutely not. But Barbell Club is based on. Olympic weightlifting style training, which is a passion of mine. Mm-hmm. And I realize that it appeals to a very small population and it's not something that exists out here. So to me that was really important to offer. But I am well aware, and I'm sure they are all well aware that there are deficits in their fitness.

Cody 32:20

Mm-hmm.

Tali 32:21

As a result of training in this way.

Cody 32:23

Well,

Tali 32:23

but that's not necessarily what they came for. Right.

Cody 32:27

Well, it. It, it kind of depends. So you what your, your barbell club is a strength program essentially. Yeah. And there are people in that program. I know for sure. You know, one for instance, that, uh, it, it plays pretty competitive pickleball.

Tali 32:41

Mm-hmm.

Cody 32:42

And she's, uh, she's done, she's doing a lot of conditioning outside the gym. Yes. You know, she's really, she's

Tali 32:47

got good balance.

Cody 32:47

She's got a hard charger, and she's like, I, she's, she's a powerhouse. And so. When she comes in and it's strength focused, that's just balancing out the other things that she does.

Tali 32:58

Most staff, and I can actually think of somebody else in that program too, who spends a lot of time in the wilderness long, mm-hmm. Long, strong hikes for days. You know, my nightmare. She's killing it. But it is a good balance for something like that. Right? Yeah. That short, powerful work. Mm-hmm. Yeah. But I wouldn't say like weightlifting is a fitness regimen. Interestingly though, I would say I was like in the best shape of my life when I was the most competitive and like the deepest in that hole. Um, but I also know that there were a lot of other things that I probably couldn't do. You know, I probably didn't run for years.

Cody 33:40

Mm-hmm.

Tali 33:41

Doing, uh, competitive weightlifting.

Cody 33:43

Yeah. I think the style of training you have right now is. Is awesome because you're still following a weightlifting program. You've got a competition coming up. You know, you're getting back into the culture of weightlifting, but you're sprinkling in a couple of days of CrossFit workouts in per week.

Tali 33:59

Mm-hmm.

Cody 34:00

Maybe dialing back the intensity as needed based on the volume of your training and that kind of thing.

Tali 34:05

Yeah.

Cody 34:05

But I think overall that's gonna be so good for you to. To balance that out.

Tali 34:09

I'd say where I was a month ago would've been a little bit closer to how I would like to train, and it was kind of like pulling from multiple different disciplines, like, you know, doing our CrossFit programming two days a week and then weightlifting like three days a week and then doing accessory work. You know, like all that bodybuilding stuff that we were talking about, like that made my joints feel great and I felt really strong doing all those other things. Being able to give attention to all those like little, little areas of the body. Um, I'd say right now, just because the meat is coming up closer, the intensity is higher in weightlifting than even I would prefer. You know, right now it's like five or six days a week, which is, you know, that takes up all of my. Like as much attention that I wanna give

Cody 35:01

Yeah.

Tali 35:02

To that kind of training. So yeah, it's temporary, hopefully, and that's the plan anyway. But, uh, I have really come to enjoy a more well-rounded training regimen and I didn't think I would. Mm-hmm.

Cody 35:16

But

Tali 35:16

I feel like I am kind of throwing in what allows me to stay motivated and allows me to push myself especially. You know, having to train alone a lot.

Cody 35:26

Mm-hmm.

Tali 35:26

Kind of gotta put in something that keeps it, uh, moving in the right direction. Yeah.

Cody 35:32

Well, that constantly varied CrossFit style of training. Uh, it sure makes you feel capable. I mean, that's probably my favorite thing about it is that once you're in it for a while and you're consistent and you're really showing up and you're really doing the work and, um. Backing off when you need to, but still showing up and you know, that kind of thing. Uh, you get to a point where anything anybody throws at you, you're like, sure, I'll try that.

Tali 35:55

Yeah.

Cody 35:55

Like you feel like, oh, I've never water skied before. Eh, how hard could it be? You know, like, right.

Tali 36:00

Totally. That's how, I mean, Greg Glassman says fitness in a hundred words. I would give it one word. Capable. Yeah. Totally. I feel like that's the biggest gift of this kind of training is really feeling confident to try new things. Mm-hmm. You know, we've got so many members here who are into snow sports and they're like, come on out with me this weekend, like, would love to show you. And I'm like, I haven't. Skied since I was seven and I went exactly once. I do not have the confidence that I could just pick up something like this. But I think if I were training in CrossFit for, you know, another couple of years, I would feel up to the task. I would feel robust enough to be able to. You know, I don't know what to expect skiing. And that's

Cody 36:43

a couple years,

Tali 36:44

maybe that long. I don't think it take that long. Does that that long? Too long.

Cody 36:47

Yeah.

Tali 36:47

I mean, progress is slow.

Cody 36:49

Yeah. But you gotta give yourself some credit. You, you have a good base already.

Tali 36:53

That's nice of you to say. But I also like have had the, like c creepiest knees of my whole life Uhhuh, uh, this year. So I, I'm aware that I'm not invincible anymore. Like it's really obvious to me now. But, um. You know, that's exactly the idea of what our student athlete program is about. Like they do have these very specific demands, but I want them to also feel really capable in other domains too. To mitigate injury, like mitigating injury is really the most important thing about that program. And so, you know, the fitness level that we, oh, sorry. The fitness level. As we increase our fitness level, so does that. Span of things that we can do.

Cody 37:39

Yeah.

Tali 37:39

Yeah.

Cody 37:41

So I, I guess to, to sum up the, the theme here, uh, the difference between fitness and sport, a lot of it has to do less with the type of training that you're talking about and more with the objectives that you're trying to achieve. Uh, 'cause like I said, bodybuilding in itself can be a, a part of your fitness. Uh, base. But if you're not planning on going on stage, then I would recommend branching out from that style of fitness to more functional styles, even if it's just something sprinkled in. Uh, some of the, like one of the fitness guys I've ever met did mostly bodybuilding because, and he actually did compete once as in a bodybuilding show and the dude was completely ripped. I think I've mentioned him before, 'cause I. He was like getting ready for a show. He is like three weeks out and he wanted to stop at freaking McDonald's, and I'm like, uh, what? He's like down in Big Macs and fries and still at 6% body fat.

Tali 38:38

Geez.

Cody 38:38

Just, ugh. Anyway, we don't all have those genes. But the point is, is

Tali 38:42

talk about one of the toughest sports though, right?

Cody 38:44

Oh yeah. Usually the discipline for bodybuilding to be competitive is insane. Just like you're weighing and measuring every. Ounce of food that you take in and

Tali 38:52

Yeah. That is life

Cody 38:53

and water and Oh, yeah. It's, it's intense. Like I, it's not that I don't have any respect for the sport. I super do. Like I really do respect. I super

Tali 39:03

do.

Cody 39:04

But, but it's, it is just, it's not fitness. Like if you're at that level, it's not fitness that this point.

Tali 39:11

No. It's just like calling it what it is. Right. What

Cody 39:13

were we

Tali 39:14

watching?

Cody 39:14

But anyway, I I just wanted to finish my point. 'cause the reason that this guy was so fit is he, I called him the Yes man. 'cause he would just like. If somebody's like, Hey, you wanna try trail bike riding? And he'd be like, sure. Let's, and he'd go buy a bike. Like he was just that kind of guy that he would just

Tali 39:29

because he was so capable.

Cody 39:30

Yes, yes. You know, and

Tali 39:32

so that he could make an investment like that.

Cody 39:33

He worked for me at Ballet Total Fitness, uh, and he was just total bodybuilding style, uh, trainer and, and, uh. Competitor. And then when I opened a CrossFit gym, I invited him to come out and try it and coach for me again and like get his level one and everything. And his, it was just always the same. He is like, sure, I'll give it a go. You know, he comes out and he just starts repping out, pull-ups and trying to learn how to kip. And I never met this guy, did

Tali 39:59

I,

Cody 40:00

Paul? No, but he's, uh. I think his, his broad fitness, even though he was a bodybuilder, is due to the fact that he was just willing to jump in and try things. You know, even though he was short, he'd still play basketball even though, you know, he, uh, had no experience. He'd, he'd just try snowboarding outta the blue. You know? He would just do these things all the time.

Tali 40:20

Go, Paul.

Cody 40:20

Yeah.

Tali 40:21

Well, and that's what we, to give all of you is like all of the tools so that your progress or that your fitness life can continue beyond these walls. We wanna just give you the area to train it so that you can further enjoy your lives.

Cody 40:38

Yeah.

Tali 40:39

Yeah.

Cody 40:40

So anyway, we wanted to rant about that a little bit. Hmm. Mainly to help those of you who have, uh, some sort of idea of what training should look like. Mm-hmm. Um, whether that's bodybuilding or running a lot or swimming, uh, at the pool twice a week or whatever. We're not knocking any of those things. It's just that those are very narrow band. Uh, activities if done in isolation. And that falls more into the category of sports training rather than fitness, unless you're mixing in some other domains. You know, if you're just, if you're just running and swimming, you're losing bone density. Mm-hmm. You're, you know, um, you're losing muscle as you age. It's just, it's just what happens. So. I like to encourage people to have some sort of breadth to their training. Not just depth, yes, but to have some, uh, to address, uh, any low points, even if you are involved in a sport, to try to do some counterintuitive training to keep your, your fitness, uh, as a broad base.

Tali 41:40

I have one last thing to say about that. One A, you're all in the right place if you're pursuing fitness, but B, that can also be. An attitude that you take coming into class. You and I have talked about this when it comes to modifications or scaling options for any given movement that we should encourage trying them all.

Cody 42:02

Mm-hmm.

Tali 42:03

Use them all. Mm-hmm. You know, like get good at lots of different things. Even in a, a scope as small as one exercise. Mm-hmm. Right. Like today. I don't know. I'm, I'm totally blanking. Give me something.

Cody 42:20

Toes to bar.

Tali 42:21

Toes to bar. Yes. So like one day do hanging knee raises and another day do hanging leg raises and the next time do v ups on the floor, or dragon flags, or toes to rack or whatever. Like all of those are valuable and I get a lot of questions. When people are feeling on the fence about any given modification, like, well, which one's better than the other?

Cody 42:42

Mm-hmm.

Tali 42:43

I'm like, well, this one might challenge you more in this way, but this one will challenge you more in this way. They're both totally valid.

Cody 42:49

Yeah.

Tali 42:49

And so that attitude. Of fitness and breadth and range that can be applied to every step.

Cody 42:58

Even a specific movement.

Tali 42:59

Absolutely. Or even a workout. I'm always like, cool, if you wanna go for the cardio bump, like do this, this, and this. If you wanna go for like a slower strength, we're gonna be working on the same clock. So like by all means. Mm-hmm. Choose your own adventure. Yep,

Cody 43:11

for sure.

Tali 43:11

And that can change over time depending on how you're feeling that day or what your goals are, whatever. Yeah. I really try to encourage like. Try to have a different experience. It doesn't have to be the same like grind every time. Mm-hmm. It can stay interesting and exploratory.

Cody 43:27

Yep. Yeah.

Tali 43:27

Yep.

Cody 43:28

Even people who don't have the grip strength to hang from a bar yet, I can still think of at least. Four or more variations on a pull-up that you can do all

Tali 43:38

right

Cody 43:38

with, with your feet still on the floor.

Tali 43:39

Four variations of a pull-up without hanging from the bar.

Cody 43:42

Okay, well number one ring. Ring rose.

Tali 43:44

Ring rose,

Cody 43:44

yes. And then we call the them body rows when you're doing the same movement but with a barbell, uh, like in the rack. Um, and then I call 'em three and then I call 'em foot assisted pull-ups, where you kind of have a bar in the rack about chest height, but instead of rowing your body back. Like a straight line. If you, in, if you picture like an inverted pushup for instance, you're kind of, that's a body row. Oh my gosh.

Tali 44:05

What?

Cody 44:06

Well, you're in the same position as a pushup, except you're hanging from the bar with your feet on the floor and you come back onto your heels and your body is a nice straight plank.

Tali 44:14

Yeah, an inverted row.

Cody 44:15

Yes. Okay. And you pull yourself, your chest to the bar. Right?

Tali 44:18

Is that not what you said for number two?

Cody 44:19

It is. Oh, okay. But I'm trying to describe it for our audience who does not know. Sorry. Listening. And so, uh, if you're in this. Same position. You're, you're kind of hanging from that bar instead of rocking yourself back in a straight plank from that bar. Instead, drop your butt to the floor with your arms over your head. And you're mimicking hanging from a bar, but your feet are still on the floor. So then you can pull yourself up. I call it foot assisted. Pull up

Tali 44:45

what would be a number four,

Cody 44:47

and then a number four could be that same thing on the rings. 'cause your arm, uhhuh your hands are in a different position. So that's four variations. And then I probably wouldn't put somebody in a bandit or assisted pull up unless they could hang from the bar.

Tali 45:00

Agreed.

Cody 45:01

However, uh, the, the minimum. Requirement that I enforce is that if you can hang from a bar and do shoulder shrugs and then release that shrug, we call it a scap pull, scapula being your shoulder blades. So if you can imagine hanging straight down under a bar and then you can shrug and then anti shrug for 10 reps, then I think you're safe enough. You have the grip strength and the shoulder stability to be able to try a banded assisted pull up.

Tali 45:27

I have a number five. Okay. That doesn't require hanging from the bar.

Cody 45:30

Mm-hmm.

Tali 45:30

If you hang up a band. And grab a dowel and thread it through. Yes. Like a lap pull down.

Cody 45:36

Like a lap pull down. Nice. Yeah. Yeah.

Tali 45:38

Takes up a lot of space, but it's a good one.

Cody 45:40

Yeah.

Tali 45:40

Yeah.

Cody 45:41

That's great.

Tali 45:42

Mm-hmm.

Cody 45:42

And then of course there's like rows and dumbbell rows and all kinds of things as you can do to get that basic upper body pulling. So yeah,

Tali 45:49

feel free to quiz us like, yeah, just know that our entire jobs have been making decisions like these, like pivoting and coming up with the next best choice. Mm-hmm. It's fricking infinite.

Cody 45:59

But to circle back around to what you're saying is like if you can't do pull-ups, then don't do ring rows every single time.

Tali 46:05

Yeah.

Cody 46:06

As your only modification, try some of those other varieties that we just mentioned.

Tali 46:10

Darn it. This is gonna come up in another podcast that I want to do, which was about scaling.

Cody 46:14

Yeah. We're gonna do

Tali 46:15

specifically

Cody 46:15

a, uh, podcast about scaling, so we will revisit

Tali 46:18

this. Yeah. How to make those choices. You know, not, we always wanna be asked those questions of course, but like, I want people to build the tools of like. What do I wanna scale to without having to consult the coach? Like what is the next best choice?

Cody 46:33

Yeah.

Tali 46:34

Um, and we'll talk about how to formulate that.

Cody 46:36

Yeah.

Tali 46:37

Yeah. Fun

Cody 46:38

on the next episode of the Ruby Peak Performance Podcast.

Tali 46:42

In a World.

Cody 46:43

In a World. Alright.

Tali 46:46

All right. Well, this was a fun one. I'm glad we, I'm glad we did this because I, it's, um, it comes up all the time.

Cody 46:53

Yes. So I think it, it, it can help paint a valuable picture on, uh, how people might approach their training, whether they're in our gym or not, uh, to, to imagine a broad base as being, uh, fitness and maybe not letting the goals push you to the point of injury, but being more conservative. Um, ebb and flow because. It is because that's how

Tali 47:18

life be.

Cody 47:19

It's not a uh, it's not a winner take all situation. You know, your fitness is a forever thing. It's kind of like. In sport, there's like a, when the bell rings you're done. You know, like there's a, a start and an end to the game and there's a winner and a loser, and there are rules that if you dis

Tali 47:37

absolute

Cody 47:38

disobey the rules. Yeah. It is this like closed loop thing, whereas your fitness is something you're trying to do until the day you dies forever. Like the whole, the game is to keep doing it. Mm-hmm. That's the win is to keep doing it. So come in with that mindset and uh, it changes your approach on how you train.

Tali 47:54

Well, that was a very whimsical ending. That was a great way to cap it.

Cody 48:00

Alright, so we'll sign off for now.

Tali 48:02

Okay.

Cody 48:02

Alright. See you all next week or the next time we record whenever that is. Huh?

Tali 48:07

Check the lost and found.

Cody 48:08

Oh yeah. Yeah. When you come into the gym, check the lost and found. It's growing.

Tali 48:13

It's taking over my life.

Cody 48:15

It's growing like a mushroom. It's just like you come in every day, it's like, wow. It's bigger than it was. Alright, well we'll sign off for now and we'll catch you the next time.