The Heirarchy Of Fitness

What's more important, Nutrition or Exercise? How does sleep factor in and how do we improve it? What suppliments do we take? 

In this convo we explore the idea of Fitness heirarchies and the relalationships between these seamingly disperate aspects of our health. 

Show Note: 
Here are some links to the Mobility/Active Recovery resources discussed in this eppisode. 

Kelly Starrett - The Ready State

Beard The Best You Can Be - Kinstretch

Phase 6

Transcript

Cody 0:01

Hey, we're on

Tali 0:02

Awesome I

Cody 0:02

think.

Tali 0:05

It would be cool if we had a, quote-unquote, Jamie, like outside that window-

Cody 0:10

Yeah

Tali 0:10

or something.

Cody 0:11

Yeah. Yeah, our podcast studio's a little small to fit an engineer in here as well. Right. Especially if we had a couple guests.

Tali 0:18

I can't wait for that day. Pretty tight. Yeah. Pretty

Cody 0:20

tight.

Tali 0:21

That's gonna be so fun. I've been thinking a lot about, what that will be like to be able to sit with our members this way, because so many really valuable conversations happen in here already. And I have to say, as someone who has been interviewed on another podcast before, it's a little bit daunting 'cause you're a little worried about what you're gonna say sometimes. If you get too comfortable, you might share too much. That's a real risk. But I think a lot of what our members would have to share would be really valuable. I'm sure we get repetitive with our stories and anecdotes and things, and people have a good grasp on, like, what we're currently working on. And so to open that up to the community in a- Yeah bigger way would, is gonna be awesome.

Cody 1:07

Yeah. Can't wait.

Tali 1:08

Just know that we're waiting on equipment right now, right?

Cody 1:11

Yeah.

Tali 1:11

Yeah. Still- We want a mixer and two more microphones still

Cody 1:14

bootstrapping equipment. Yeah.

Tali 1:16

Yeah.

Cody 1:16

Three more microphones, 'cause your microphone is dying.

Tali 1:19

My microphone... Oh, not, like, currently, but just

Cody 1:22

in general. Not currently, just in general.

Tali 1:23

Okay.

Cody 1:24

I have to do a lot of post-editing just to make it work. So that's what we're dealing with. But that's how we do. I

Tali 1:31

know. Yeah. It's amazing. Sometimes it feels like we've come a really long way, and then there's, like, still more things- Yeah that we still wanna add. Like, when does it stop?

Cody 1:40

It never stops.

Tali 1:41

It never stops.

Cody 1:42

Businesses are like kids. They just need more, and they just need more and more.

Tali 1:47

Don't they need less and less?

Cody 1:48

You pay for their sport, and it's like, oh, and they need shoes and they need pads and they need- a waiver and they need this and that. Yeah.

Tali 1:55

I used to joke that my kids would wear burlap sacks- Yeah. until they were fully grown.

Cody 2:01

Till they stop growing out of their clothes. Yeah,

Tali 2:02

yeah.

Cody 2:03

Yeah.

Tali 2:04

I know that wouldn't really be the case. I'm sure there's a lot of excitement with, like, getting a new outfit, as I do for myself.

Cody 2:10

Yes.

Tali 2:11

Yeah, so probably not, but I always thought that that was g- the economical way of going about it.

Cody 2:16

Makes sense.

Tali 2:17

Okay, so we talked about today being a conversation about the hierarchy of fitness.

Cody 2:23

Yes.

Tali 2:23

And I wrote notes, and I- I, I

Cody 2:26

did not

Tali 2:26

that's okay. Yeah. You're so much better at riffing than I am.

Cody 2:29

You're gonna carry us, honey.

Tali 2:30

I will not carry us. My voice may carry, but I will not carry us. Um, and so when I wrote down hierarchy of fitness, I also wrote in parentheses, "Health?" And then I started to kind of build what I thought was a pyramid from the bottom up of, like, the important steps to kinda nail down before moving on to the next skill or implementation or whatever it is. Mm-hmm. And then I realized it's not a pyramid at all,

Cody 2:57

oh, it's interesting that you would say that, 'cause I was gonna have a hot take about this.

Tali 3:01

Okay, let's hear it.

Cody 3:01

Yeah. I don't... Everything sort of depends on everything else. And so- Mm-hmm it's more like this circular thing rather than a pyramid or anything that's foundational. So I'll just... if I were gonna build a pyramid, we talked about this the other day, is that, like, sleep would probably be at the foundation of that. If you're not getting quality sleep, everything else suffers. And we'll get a little deeper into that, but I guess my point is is though is you can't get good sleep if you're not moving enough either.

Tali 3:32

Yeah, I think they're all- So it's like, it's like you- in line with each other and it's like you have little levers.

Cody 3:37

Yeah.

Tali 3:37

And as soon as you ramp one up, the other ones fluctuate as a result. Mm-hmm. Yep. Like, they're all uh, dependent on each other. And so I wrote down four things.

Cody 3:45

Cool.

Tali 3:46

I wrote down, I wrote down four things so far. It's, like, not complete, but feel free to add.

Cody 3:50

Here we go, folks.

Tali 3:51

Okay. So sleep. Movement, like regular movement. Whole foods/adequate calories, and then I wrote supplements. This feels like, you know that episode of Busin- of The Office? It's called Business School, and Michael Scott says something like, "There are four different kinds of business. Railroads..." Uh, I can't even remember what the other ones were, but they were... It was obviously, like, not including all things. That's

Speaker 3 4:20

so funny.

Tali 4:21

And so this is what it felt like. It's like these were just kind of the things that felt glaring or things that we were talking about, and I'm sure there are more that will come up. But- Yeah. Supplements kind of feels like the wild card there. And the reason I wanted to have this conversation is that we actually got a question from a member about which supplements you and I take or what supplements we recommend to our members. And so it immediately triggered the question within me of, well, let's look at your sleep, your movement, and your food intake.

Speaker 3 4:55

Food,

Cody 4:55

yeah.

Tali 4:55

Right? Mm-hmm. Like those things should be looked at first before we talk about supplements. Yeah. So I guess that's why it's there.

Cody 5:01

Yeah.

Tali 5:01

Are we missing anything that we wanna throw into those-

Cody 5:05

I think the foundations that I've heard of in the past break things down a little bit more specifically than that. Movement is, I mean, that's a- It's

Tali 5:14

broad

Cody 5:14

the biggest bucket you could possibly think of, other than non-moving, um, but, uh, I know Greg Glassman in the early days- Yeah of CrossFit had f- cardiovascular fitness as the foundation. He, it was cardio first and then body weight gymna- what he called gymnastics, and then, weightlifting on top of that. So he had this kind of hierarchy of fitness in that you need this broad base of cardio support in order to do any of the other things.

Tali 5:41

Those were just mo- that was like a pyramid of movement types though, right?

Cody 5:45

Yeah.

Tali 5:45

Yeah.

Cody 5:46

That I-

Tali 5:46

Yeah, I feel like within these there are pyramids.

Cody 5:49

Yeah. So let's back up a little bit. So I think that you and I agree that sleep is critical. I think quality sleep, consistent sleep is really critical, so I'd like to talk about that a little bit just so I can get into that. I was gonna say we

Tali 6:02

should talk about that first because what's ironic about it is that you were just saying, I think this morning or maybe yesterday, I must say guys, the days are blurring right now. But you had said something about sleep often being the afterthought. Mm-hmm. So I don't wanna leave sleep as the afterthought to this episode. No. I think we should start with it.

Cody 6:22

Yeah, that's actually the thing to dial in. I know as I said before, the, one of the ways that I have cured insomnia, cured treated m- insomnia- Yeah,

Speaker 3 6:32

I was gonna

Cody 6:32

say is that I don't have insomnia usually on the days that I do a CrossFit style workout.

Speaker 3 6:38

Oh.

Cody 6:39

Like it, I feel like if, like I'm- I couldn't stay awake if I tried. There's something about it. And it's not a matter of being tired. Those of you who suffer from insomnia know you can sometimes be so tired it just feels like agony. You just wanna sleep so bad, but for some reason your brain won't shut off or whatever. So I've had, I've definitely had those nights, but I rarely will have those nights if I have done a CrossFit workout. So there's something besides just the psychology and just being tired. There-- It's not just being tired. There's something else going on there, and I think it's probably a lot deeper, probably above my pay grade as far as, like, the brain chemistry and the hormones and that kind of thing that happens from a high-intensity workout like that.

Tali 7:26

Well, and just to set the record real quick, just for anyone who's listening, I've probably shared this in class before in some way, but Cody's an incredibly troubled sleeper, and I am not, and we share a bed. And it's a really interesting dynamic, I think, that we have in our relationship. You know, I will have a troubled night of sleep maybe, like, once every six months or so, or sometimes I have to migrate to a quieter space for one reason or another. But in general, you, you tend to be a troubled sleeper. Can you tell us So in what ways?

Cody 8:06

Uh, yeah. So once upon a time in 1975, I was born. No, I... This could go on for a long time. There's- I've had problems sleeping my whole life. Yeah. And it's started, or my original thought around my poor sleep was insomnia, because I used to have insomnia pretty bad. And-

Tali 8:27

And

Cody 8:27

that's just like

Tali 8:28

staying up all

Cody 8:28

night there are a lot of types of insomnia, and my type was the getting to sleep type. Okay. I just couldn't shut down. And so I would lay there, and no matter how tired I was, like I said, sometimes to me, there's a difference between being tired and exhausted. I take that word seriously, and some people I think they're just like, "Oh, I'm depressed," when they're a little sad, or, "Oh, I'm exhausted," when they're a little tired. I'm talking about exhausted where you feel ill, like s- upset stomach, cold sores in their mouth, like-

Tali 8:59

You do get ill when you're-

Cody 9:00

Like-

Tali 9:00

just tired

Cody 9:01

too exhausted. Yeah. Like actual exhaustion. Like, and still unable to sleep, 'cause I'll lay down and my brain will just start thinking of inventions or business ideas or something stupid. Can I just say

Tali 9:11

about that, though, that- Uh sometimes you have the best ideas- when you've been up all night. That's right. And when we first met, you had kinda told me that you were a night owl. Yeah our schedules have never really allowed that for you. Yeah. And I have always wondered what it would be like if you could just stay up all night.

Cody 9:29

Yeah. I s- Can't be a coach and a night owl.

Tali 9:31

Well, you could. Maybe you go to bed right after- Be the night coach. I'm just saying maybe you go to bed- Yeah at noon after class.

Cody 9:37

Oh, yeah.

Tali 9:38

I mean, I'll never see you.

Cody 9:39

Yeah, that

Tali 9:40

would be the downside. Bye. But, um, you have a lot of really great ideas when you've been up all night. Thanks. So.

Cody 9:46

It's not fun.

Tali 9:47

I know. I'm sorry.

Cody 9:47

But I- Not

Tali 9:48

to minimize

Cody 9:49

like I said, I feel like I've kind of gotten over that- Mm-hmm because I know if I'm training regularly and I'm g- got a lot of other things dialed in, I have been able to mitigate that quite a bit.

Tali 9:59

Well,

Cody 9:59

and here's that

Tali 9:59

lever- It still happens- kind of thing we were talking about yeah.

Cody 10:02

It still happens once in a while, but I will give everybody my pro tips for getting a good night's sleep. Pulling out all the stops. There's all kinds of stuff out there to try.

Tali 10:11

I only have one.

Cody 10:12

And I would say- Experiment. I would say experiment with whatever because there i- I don't think there is a right answer for everybody. But for me the biggest lever on that is training regularly. So even if you don't wanna work out or if you're tired or your sleep has been crap, try to get a workout in anyway and- We

Tali 10:29

will be talking about that

Cody 10:31

yeah, and do what you can,

Tali 10:32

you know? Any particular time of day?

Cody 10:33

Earlier is better.

Tali 10:34

Cause we... I was gonna say morning- Yeah should be better. Yeah. Because?

Cody 10:37

Well, there's a hormonal shift in your brain a- about what happens with that cortisol spike earlier in the day actually helps you to produce the right hormones and, and the brain chemistry for going to sleep at night. So it's a part of your natural circadian rhythm to have activity early in the day. I don't necessarily have that luxury. Um, and my schedule just doesn't allow it right now 'cause of our coaching schedules. Mm-hmm. So even in the early afternoon is fine. If you're somebody who has to work out after work at 5:00 PM, I feel for you. It's better to do it then than not at all- Yeah but it will make going to sleep in the next couple hours a little trickier for you,

Tali 11:18

so. Well, and I can attest to somebody who doesn't work out in the evening. I coach into the evening. Mm-hmm. I'm not even exerting the same kind of effort, and I come in, like, buzzing-

Cody 11:28

Oh, yeah

Tali 11:29

for hours.

Cody 11:29

That psychological energy.

Tali 11:31

Yeah.

Cody 11:31

So that's the one, one lever. The second lever, though, which is probably just as important, and I think this one is more universal, like applies to almost everybody, which is eat... stop eating as early as possible. Intermittent fasting and that kind of thing is pretty popular these days, but I think a lot of people skip breakfast because that's easy. If you wake up and you can just kinda like, "I'm just not gonna eat until I really need to eat," and sometimes you can make it till 2:00 or 3:00 in the afternoon. And I used to intermittent fast that way as well. But taking in food within two to three hours of trying to go to sleep actually raises your heart rate, raises your body temperature, all- Hell

Tali 12:11

yeah, it does

Cody 12:12

all the things that you don't want for sleep. You want your core body temperature to drop a little bit, and you want your heart rate, your resting heart rate to be as low as possible. Those are the two metrics that actually determine whether you're, like, ready for sleep or not.

Tali 12:26

As someone who's not really a troubled sleeper on a regular basis at all that has been the biggest change that... I can't say that I have been doing it as of late. I've slipped a little bit. But I at one time was fitting in all of my meals before 3:30-

Speaker 3 12:44

Yeah

Tali 12:44

before my evening shift, uh, if you will, and that made a huge difference. Like, going to sleep with a full stomach, I would run hot.

Speaker 3 12:53

Oh, yeah.

Tali 12:54

And waking up hot and sweaty and disturbed is the worst. And so just eating earlier, you know, 3:30 could be considered extreme, but maybe I would have, like, a snack on me, but I'd try to, like, cut it off at 5:00 if you and I were gonna wind down for bed at 8:00, 8:30. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, made a huge difference.

Cody 13:13

Yeah. The earlier, the better. Um, so I do... I don't know if what I'm doing is called intermittent fasting. I don't know if you could categorize that, but I have a pretty fatty and protein-rich breakfast, and then I don't eat again until 4:00-ish in the afternoon, and that's my dinner, and that's it. I eat those two meals and that's it. So if I- If I really stick to that, then I tend to sleep better. Yeah.

Tali 13:41

I just wanna circle back to what you said about maybe it's not really considered intermittent fasting, and I would say that me eating dinner earlier, I wouldn't call it intermittent fasting either probably 'cause I don't stick to it during the weekends if my schedule is open. But this reminds me of a conversation that we had in class, in barbell club last night. One of our members dropped off a protein h- like a protein, packet of ramen. Mm-hmm. And someone had said like, "Man, they're making everything protein rich these days, like even things that don't need to be." And Devin had said something like "What about gluten-free pork?" You know, just like taking the marketing opportunity. I was telling them about like the oatmeal too that we had bought that was supposed to be like, quote-unquote, "protein rich." Yeah but it was the exact same as the original. It just was marketed differently. Oh, yeah. And priced higher.

Cody 14:34

Yeah.

Tali 14:35

But it was exactly the same.

Cody 14:36

Yep.

Tali 14:37

Yeah. Reminds me of

Cody 14:37

the- Just

Tali 14:37

kind of

Cody 14:38

like

Tali 14:38

a buzzword

Cody 14:38

of the protein Pop-Tarts I saw the other day. I'm like, man, that's just garbage.

Tali 14:43

I want them to be good, but I'm sure they're terrible.

Cody 14:46

I would just have a regular Pop-Tart. I mean, if you're gonna eat crap- you might as well just have crap that tastes good. Have like

Tali 14:50

crap all the way.

Cody 14:51

Yeah.

Tali 14:51

Okay.

Cody 14:52

Just go all in.

Tali 14:53

I am gonna say, at my most competitive, and also at my leanest, I was eating Pop-Tarts. It was my favorite pre-workout. I mean,

Cody 15:00

you were training like 20 hours a week.

Tali 15:02

I know. Yeah, I don't live that life no more. Yes. Sleep. Sleep, eating.

Cody 15:06

Well,

Tali 15:06

sleep- That was the last

Cody 15:07

thing

Tali 15:07

yeah.

Cody 15:07

Working out consistently, even when you don't feel like it, eating as early-- stop eating as early as possible in the evening. Those are the two biggest levers, I think, for sleep. Um, other than that, there's just a lot of stuff that's kind of intuitive or frequently mentioned online, which is like sleep in a cooler bedroom. Um-

Tali 15:24

No screens

Cody 15:25

no screens for 90 minutes or so be- before you go to sleep. Um-

Tali 15:30

That one you and I bounce back and forth between. Yeah.

Cody 15:33

Well, we struggle with that because of our schedule. You finish coaching at 7:30-ish- Yeah uh, on average. And I tend to work on administrative tasks right up until the time you're done coaching.

Tali 15:45

Right.

Cody 15:45

So you and I are finishing work at 7:30 PM.

Tali 15:48

Well, and if it's like a particularly long day of work, I'll seek you out in the middle of the day and I'm like, "Let's have fun tonight." Yeah. I say it in those words.

Cody 15:56

I know.

Tali 15:57

Cause I just wanna not work and hang out with you. And un- and unfortunately, that has meant like you and I are watching The Office with popcorn, which are two things that we just talked about not doing for sleep.

Cody 16:09

Yeah.

Tali 16:09

Yeah. But we... You and I kinda like fluctuate. It... every once in a while we'll just do kind of like a screen-free week.

Cody 16:14

We're not perfect.

Tali 16:15

No, we're not. Uh, that's actually something that I'll circle back around to probably at the end.

Cody 16:20

Anyway, there's magnesium threonate. I know magnesium is brought up quite a lot, and it's pronounced like three and eight, but it's not the n- number three. It's like, uh, a word, threonate. That there are a lot of kinds of magnesium, like I don't even know- Yeah how many. I... The last time I was looking through a list, there was like over 20 kinds of magnesium.

Tali 16:41

Do you know which kind is in a banana?

Cody 16:42

No. But, the point is that it does matter what kind for specific- Needs needs So if it's to help with constipation, it's one kind, and if it's for, like, workout recovery, it's another kind. But for sleep, there's a couple of different ones that help with sleep. I have found three and eight to be the one that actually did seem to make a difference when I was taking that regularly.

Tali 17:04

Do you remember at the beginning when I had said that even within these categories are probably pyramids within themselves? Mm-hmm. And, you know, some of the things that we're talking about now are, like, something that you would need to purchase, right? Like, but there are a lot of, like, free or hard-hitting means that you could improve your sleep that are, like, the basics. And one of them that I would say that you and I have really embraced since the new year is having a consistent bedtime.

Cody 17:35

Yeah.

Tali 17:36

Yeah.

Cody 17:37

Yeah. Uh, we have not been as good recently on that because of our weekends. Oh,

Tali 17:42

We've loosened it some. Mm-hmm.

Cody 17:44

Yeah. So-

Tali 17:45

It's not off the rails, but we've loosened some to, like, work within a two-hour window.

Cody 17:51

So to explain this consistency should be within a 30-minute window. Oh and-

Tali 17:58

So we've strayed a little

Cody 17:59

bit that's what we were doing. We were waking up- We

Tali 18:01

were pretty militant about it for a while

Cody 18:03

we were even on vacation, and we were getting up at 5:00 AM on vacation, if you remember right.

Tali 18:07

Yeah, I do.

Cody 18:08

And-

Tali 18:09

It was awesome.

Cody 18:09

It really was and I will admit that I actually did feel better. Like- Oh, yeah energy-wise, it made a big difference. I'm reluctant to want to get up at 5:00 in the morning on the weekends or on vacation, but it actually does make you feel a lot better to be consistent. Um, the Caveat to that though is that you, you gotta make sure you're getting enough sleep. So if 5:00 AM is the struggle and it just keep getting worse and worse, you really need to prioritize getting to bed earlier, which is where you and I struggle 'cause of what I was just talking about. You get done at work at, at 7:30 or 8:00 PM, it's really hard to wind down fast enough and feel like relaxed enough to go to sleep-

Speaker 3 18:46

Yeah

Cody 18:46

by 9:00, and 9:00 to 5:00 is eight hours. So you- it's tight. It's a very, very, very tight schedule to try to get adequate sleep and get consistent sleep as well for us.

Speaker 3 18:57

Yeah.

Cody 18:58

That's just kind of our coach's schedule though. Like, not-- most people don't have these weird bookend days where we're coaching at 6:00 AM and then finishing at 7:30 PM.

Tali 19:08

Yeah, I was gonna say, that's not a typical work schedule. If you work a 9:00 to 5:00 or if you make your own hours, you could have a lot more success in the wind down and the wake up being more consistent. But it- Yeah made a huge difference.

Speaker 3 19:23

Yeah.

Tali 19:23

Not just being at the whim of like whatever my body felt like it needed because I was giving it enough to perform really consistently.

Speaker 3 19:33

Yeah.

Tali 19:33

We have had a lot of change over the last handful of months, so you know, you always have to recalibrate when there are big changes in life.

Cody 19:40

Yeah. Well, we're

Tali 19:40

burning the candles- Um, and we, we have a, we haven't even had a chance to look at like our calendar.

Cody 19:45

We're burning the candles at both ends, and so that's just a phase-

Tali 19:49

Yeah

Cody 19:49

that we're in right now. Yeah.

Tali 19:50

But we did find a lot of success in it, so I would highly recommend playing around with that.

Cody 19:55

Mm-hmm. Another thing you can try, which we've had success with, but it, again, it's, it's better if you have a little bit more flexible schedule, is to set a, a bedtime alarm instead of a wake-up alarm. You set an alarm to go to bed on time, and if you go to, you know, start your wind down on time, then eventually you can, you can just get up in the morning. It doesn't, you don't have to have an alarm waking you up in the morning.

Tali 20:18

I hate that alarm so much.

Cody 20:21

The go to bed alarm?

Tali 20:21

Yeah, like instantly angers me.

Cody 20:23

Well, that's 'cause you have a defiance. You don't wanna go, "I don't wanna go to bed."

Tali 20:29

Every day of my life.

Cody 20:30

Yeah.

Tali 20:32

I have to say that waking up is the hardest thing for me every day. It feels miserable most of the time. Like you were talking about having a hard time going to sleep, I have the opposite experience, and it was like, it has been like a joke in my family my whole life that like waking me up took- an incredible amount of effort, even when I was a child. And I haven't really grown out of it. That's why when I wake up easily, it's like, "Oh, this is gonna be the best day ever." Uh, it's not often, but yeah, even if I sleep a lot or I sleep super deeply- I remember my dreams every single night. I hardly wake up in the middle of the night to, like, go to the bathroom or anything, and I wake up super tired. I'd

Cody 21:19

be interested for you to have a WHOOP so that we could actually see what your sleep structure looks like.

Tali 21:24

Well, I have a WHOOP.

Cody 21:26

Yes, you just have never worn it.

Tali 21:27

Well-

Cody 21:27

But-

Tali 21:28

cause it's ugly.

Cody 21:29

Maybe just wear it at part-

Tali 21:32

Could I just wear it to sleep?

Cody 21:33

Part-time. I don't know.

Tali 21:34

Part-time.

Cody 21:35

Um, but REM sleep is when you dream, and deep sleep you don't dream. So you may be-

Tali 21:41

Fascinating. Okay. So I don't know shit about sleep you

Cody 21:42

may be lacking in deep sleep. Yeah. So I've learned a lot about sleep structure after wearing my WHOOP and it's a little pathetic sometimes how much, like, deep sleep I'll get. It's like, oh, you got 90 minutes of deep sleep out of eight hours that I was in there. What's

Tali 21:57

a good ratio?

Cody 21:58

I think three hours would be better. Three hours of deep sleep, and then a couple hours of REM. It's in cycles, so it's not all at once, but that for me I think would be an amazing night's sleep. So those things have helped me the most as far as getting to sleep and curing insomnia, but what I've found out recently through a sleep study is that I also have severe sleep apnea. And usually sleep apnea is correlated with being overweight. I mean, they're almost like consistently correlated. People who are overweight almost always have sleep apnea. However right now I'm sitting at about 11 to 12% body fat.

Tali 22:41

Nice.

Cody 22:42

I'm not overweight. But it's a genetic... It's like a structural issue. I have a- It's your

Tali 22:47

gorgeous nose I

Cody 22:48

have a structural issue in my sinuses that where they kind of collapse in on themselves. And so what I have found is with all of... You can have all the greatest sleep habits in the world, but I have not had many nights probably in my whole life that were actually a good night's sleep. So I am exhausted all the time.

Tali 23:09

And

Cody 23:09

I think it's- You could be a totally different person if you were- I think I will be. Yeah if you slept I think I will be. So I will be, uh- Yeah exploring the whole sleep apnea machine situation as a temporary measure. And the reason I'm saying temporary is that I've also discovered some new exercises finally. It took me a long time to find these, but actual exercises to increase the s- structural integrity, I guess if y- if you will, of your palate and your nasal passages through some certain, like tongue exercises. Exercises. Yeah.

Tali 23:37

Yeah. Um-

Cody 23:38

So I'm gonna be implementing those along with the sleep apnea machine. I'm hoping that if the sleep apnea... If the CPAP can actually improve sleep quality enough for me to get healthier and then do the tongue exercises to wean myself off the machine. This is my plan.

Tali 23:54

We have a member who recently got a CPAP, and they even named it. And they said that their life has changed dramatically. So I really hope that for you.

Cody 24:04

Yeah.

Tali 24:05

Yeah.

Cody 24:05

Me too. So sleep.

Tali 24:07

Yeah. I was gonna say that my only one sleep recommendation that I ever got was like from my mom, and she said not having kids. She said that she had great sleep before she had kids, and I don't have kids, so, perhaps I will sleep well for the rest of my life.

Cody 24:25

Perhaps.

Tali 24:25

Yeah

Cody 24:28

So other than that, so what's next on the hierarchy for you?

Tali 24:31

Well, so we talked about- Even though

Cody 24:32

I don't think it's a hierarchy

Tali 24:33

we talked about food in the last one, right? Yeah. We were just talking about not eating before we go to sleep, and so maybe food should be next.

Cody 24:42

So I have another hot take about this.

Tali 24:44

Hot take.

Cody 24:45

Yeah. There's this often repeated phrase, I think people feel smart when they say it of that fitness is 80% nutrition and 20% exercise. That's

Tali 24:57

it?

Cody 24:57

And I think that's, first of all, you can't say one is more important than the other. I think it's kind of a silly thing to say at all. But I also feel like I have seen in so many instances, y- you have to remember that there's some psychology involved in your fitness. Mm. And that people who work out, it find it much easier to eat clean food because you are psychologically prepared to want to fuel your body better. And so-

Tali 25:26

Well, it brings- in my

Cody 25:27

experience- a different

Tali 25:27

context to food, right? Yeah. Like, it brings an entirely different motivation- One

Cody 25:31

of our clients the other day-

Tali 25:31

which I think is really powerful

Cody 25:33

yeah, one of my clients the other day was just saying that he goes to Safeway after his workout, and he always makes way better choices.

Tali 25:39

I think I know who you're talking about because I saw somebody right after- Yeah their workout when I went to Safeway.

Cody 25:44

So he's like, "Yeah, I don't wanna buy junk food after I just worked out." And so it-

Tali 25:48

Yeah, 'cause you're kind of undoing what you just did for yourself super well. Yeah.

Cody 25:52

Yeah. And you've got those endorphins and everything. My big hack for that, like this is not a big... This is not my idea. Everybody kinda knows this, but take it seriously if you wanna stop buying junk food. Eat before you go grocery shopping.

Tali 26:06

Oh, yeah. That's a really good one.

Cody 26:08

Do not ever go to the grocery store hungry. It's such an easy way to have cravings, and sugar looks way better when you're hungry. So if you're trying to get the garbage out, never go grocery shopping hungry.

Tali 26:23

When it comes to food I had written that it's not necessarily just the quality, which I feel like that is a really easy conversation for us to have in terms of like eating whole foods and like cooking your own meals and like knowing what you're putting in your body and making sure that garbage is sparing, if at all. But I also wanna talk about quantity as well. That is, I would say, just as important as quality when it comes to fueling your body enough. And we're talking about how to support fitness, and when we're talking about food quantity, it's about what is gonna be enough to allow you to perform on all cylinders. You know, if you are walking into the gym feeling like garbage, it would be worth asking yourself, you know, in the readiness score, I wish it was in there in Train Heroic, was like, have, did I eat well today or did I eat enough today to like walk into this gym feeling like I'm in fighting shape? I was saying about, uh, earlier about how I ate Pop-Tarts before training, but, timing a meal before training was something that I was doing at the time. Or, you know, some quick calories to like fuel my workout. Um, I know a lot of our members come in fasted, especially if it's an early morning class- which I can understand to some degree, but I can also imagine that that could be somewhat of a deficiency, uh, if we're doing like a heavy lifting day potentially?

Cody 27:57

It, it could be. I do think though that people are highly adaptable.

Tali 28:01

Yeah.

Cody 28:02

And individual, of course. I think if it's consistent, I don't think it matters as much. I think if you're the type of person who always trains fasted, that you will probably make just as much progress as somebody who feels like they have to fuel before their workout.

Tali 28:16

But it depends on- Well, hopefully the post-workout is with that in mind.

Cody 28:20

Yeah.

Tali 28:20

And so- Right? Like, don't be eating like just a banana and toast right after a workout if you went fasted.

Cody 28:25

Yeah. And yeah. But you do have to fuel it at some point.

Tali 28:27

Absolutely.

Cody 28:28

So it doesn't necessarily have to be pre, post, uh, during, whatever. The only time nutrition is really important during is... And even then, there's a lot of controversy about this. But for ultra runners or, people who are actually exerting for an hour or two at a time, that, that makes a big difference consistently-

Tali 28:47

Oh, yeah

Cody 28:48

like a runner. But,

Tali 28:49

um- Well, in weightlifting, uh, you know, in the back room I always had snacks- Mm-hmm 'cause you're competing over a two-hour period.

Speaker 3 28:56

Yeah.

Tali 28:57

And you're staying warm. Uh, even if you're only lifting on the stage for s- six minutes you're lifting at over 90% effort-

Speaker 3 29:06

Yeah

Tali 29:06

multiple times over, over a two period or two-hour period. Mm-hmm. And so you need to stay, uh, you have to keep yourself from crashing.

Cody 29:14

Yeah. Yeah. Another hot take. I'm just full of them today- though, is that, uh- No

Tali 29:20

notes, but just lots of hot takes

Cody 29:22

people who, uh, stop working out in a CrossFit workout to go get a drink I, I've done it, but just know that that is you just taking a, a rest period because you can't- Ooh get dehydrated fast enough and, or rehydrate fast enough for it to actually matter. If your workout is 20 minutes or less, it doesn't really matter. You have to hydrate before the workout to stay well-hydrated.

Tali 29:47

Okay.

Cody 29:48

Hydration is not something that can be fixed in 10 or 15 or 20 minutes. No. So that drink you're taking is actually you just taking a break.

Tali 29:56

Ouch. Okay. I don't really have a lot to say about that.

Cody 29:59

I'm not saying it's bad. I'm just saying it, what, what it really is. You're

Tali 30:02

just saying it's false.

Cody 30:03

No. Yeah. So I, uh, I also take breaks during, you know-

Tali 30:07

Yeah my workout. Breaks are fine. I encourage breaks all the time. One reason that I wanted to talk about quantity, and I've had this conversation with so many of our members, usually when we're having a sit-down on the InBody scan appointment we have the opportunity to find out what your basal metabolic rate, your ability to metabolize your calories, and there's a little bracket in there of, like, where your optimal range is. And it gives you an amount of calories that you would need to consume in order to maintain your current composition or your current stats, if you will if you were on complete bed rest. And unfortunately, a lot of people find themselves being like, "Oh, great. That's exactly what I'm eating." And I'm like- Yeah "No, no, no. You're doing a lot more than bed rest, right? You are training here at the gym. You are gardening. You are hiking. You are ranching. You are

Speaker 3 30:57

at-" Eating.

Tali 30:57

Yeah. You are... yes. That requires energy. And so making sure that we eat enough is not only what allows us to perf- perform well into the gym, but it's also, like, how do we recover from that time in the gym? People who I would say are, like, really inflamed or super injury-prone, I would be asking them about their nutrition as well. Not just in terms of what the quality was. Of course, that can make a huge difference. There are a lot of, like, anti-inflammatory diets- Yeah out there or ways of eating, but just simply getting enough calories. If you are lifting heavy or pushing yourself with an incredible amount of effort, that also comes with needing to nourish a body that is working that hard.

Cody 31:42

Yeah. I I'm gonna name-drop now. Kelly Starrett when I was down at the conference in California last year, I got to speak with him briefly, got to meet him and, um, I've... You and I have followed his work for many years. Like, he's- Since

Tali 31:56

the beginning.

Cody 31:57

Yes. And so- It was cool to be able to meet him. And in the c- short conversation that we had, he talked about the fact that when people come to him with frequent and chronic tendinopathies, um It's almost always associated with some sort of protein deficiency. And he's like, "A lot of, a lot of people who are vegetarian and vegans have tendon issues," and it's not politically correct to tell them that that's why. But he's like, "We- but we have to tell them- But that's why that's why." Yeah. Yeah. And so, he didn't pull any punches there, and it was kinda interesting to see 'cause it is a touchy, politicized topic, and it doesn't need to be. It

Tali 32:35

doesn't

Cody 32:35

need to be. We're just talking about- You have

Tali 32:36

to-

Cody 32:37

Yeah, physiology

Tali 32:37

realistically look at- Yeah what you're putting in your body having potential consequences.

Cody 32:42

Yeah.

Tali 32:42

Right?

Cody 32:43

Yeah.

Tali 32:43

Yeah, it doesn't have to be personal.

Cody 32:45

Yeah. It's not a personal attack. It's not an, uh, moral or ethical issue. I'm just saying that we see this high correlation of tendinopathy with a lack of protein. Either a, either not getting enough protein or not getting good quality protein. Also, just before I, we move on from this, I've been reading a lot lately about... uh, aging is a bitch, man. Aging just, it gets you in so many different ways. But-

Tali 33:09

Well, you're

Cody 33:09

swimming

Tali 33:09

upstream we

Cody 33:10

talk about getting at least a gram p- of quality protein per pound of body weight as sort of a, a baseline that we shoot for. And unfortunately, as you age, you also digest protein less efficiently.

Tali 33:26

That was something that Amy had said at the n- Nutrition summit, yeah the nutrition talk at the health fair. I think Karen had asked about it, and I didn't know about that. I thought that was fascinating and makes a lot of sense, doesn't it?

Cody 33:39

Yeah. And unfortunately, we see the opposite with our aging populations. They tend to eat less, and they need to be eating more protein- Yeah uh, a- and really fighting- To

Tali 33:48

offset that degeneration.

Cody 33:50

Yeah. Yeah.

Tali 33:51

Yeah.

Cody 33:52

So I'm right now, even though I'm only eating two meals a day, I will supplement with some whey to get that extra protein in. And on the days that I do get my my whey protein in, I'm hitting 220 grams of protein per day. But I'm keeping calories pretty low, so I've been getting leaner. But are real

Speaker 3 34:12

dense. So

Cody 34:13

over the last 18 months, I've gone from 18% body fat to 11.9% or something like that the last time- Nice I scanned. So, it can be done, and you don't have to starve yourself, which I think is the point you've been trying to get to here, is that you have to have enough calories. You can't just starve yourself to fitness.

Tali 34:31

Well- That's some old school- and the thing

Cody 34:32

about

Tali 34:32

saying- garbage starve yourself to fitness is I feel like there's something not quite a- accurate about that because I think we are under-fueling accidentally. I don't think people are intentionally doing that. I am just finding a trend that people are not eating enough for what they're doing, and there are ways to actually calculate what that is. I know that counting calories is not for everyone, but at least if you can give yourself an idea of what a day's worth of food- could look like for you to live well, to perform better, to sleep better, right? Like, all of these things have to do with each other. How many times do we hear members saying that it's hard for them to sleep because they ache? Right? Like, they've got inflammation, like whether it's a result from the workout or their lives or whatever it is. But food is part of healing that, right? Food is part of recovering and rebuilding, and so we have to think of that as just as important.

Cody 35:31

Literally what you're made of.

Tali 35:32

I know.

Cody 35:33

Like, you literally

Tali 35:33

are what you eat. I mean, the thing is that we've become so far removed from what food is meant for. And one thing that I'm really grateful to over the years is I, at one time, really built a good relationship with food that was purely about the fuel. I was so motivated to be the best athlete that I could be, and so that relationship really changed. My life's really different right now, so you know I'm not hungry for PRs and I'm not hungry for being the best weightlifter in the state or anything like that anymore. So you know, living well is kind of a new motivation to get used to. It sadly doesn't feel as potent. But I do know that when I'm eating enough, which is, collaboration that I do with a nutritionist, um, to eat enough calories a day, I feel great when I do it. You know, it's not perfect all the time. Consistency doesn't mean 100% every day. But there will be you know, timeframes where I'm, like, on it, like day after day, and I can kick ass in the gym and bounce right back and do it again the next day. And, you know, there might come a day where I can't do that because of what we were just talking about with aging. Like, there might just be such an uphill battle at some point where that's just not possible. But it's a good reminder now that when we dial in these things like sleep and food, that we could be feeling so much better. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It's just we can also adapt, like you said, to, you know, working out fasted. We can easily adapt to not feeling great and thinking- Mm-hmm that that's the norm or that's okay.

Cody 37:17

Yeah. And sometimes there's an odd disconnect, too. It's kind of shocking sometimes with things like tendinopathy or back pain. I recently put together a back pain, uh, course basically on, on some things you can do to help solve your back pain. And the, one of the first things I said in the course introduction is like, food actually matters here. This is... You may be thinking of your back as a specific issue, but it could also be sort of a global systemic issue. Uh, whereas high inflammation can cause that pain, and it's so... It can be a real psychological disconnect because you feel this acute pain in one area of your body, and it can be shocking if you can reduce global inflammation, like throughout your body, how it really helps that one acute area that you're feeling it in. I've experienced this- Because your body

Tali 38:09

is able to repair itself- Yeah if it-

Cody 38:11

And this is-

Tali 38:12

has the means to do so

Cody 38:13

yeah, and this is true not with, only with food, but the sleep issue that we talked about. Yeah. I, as somebody who's had I'm going on almost two years now of the Achilles tendon issue, which I finally fixed, thank God. But it took me almost two years. But throughout that whole time, I, one reason it was, like, two steps forward, one step back is my sleep issues. And I know this because if we are out like on a weekend, uh, I get a nap in or something like that, a little bit of extra sleep, and I can walk pain-free And then I have a couple of rough nights and it's like inflamed and just really painful. But it was very specific. It was my heel. It wasn't my whole body, it was like my heel. But I know that there's a strong correlation to sleep quality and your ability to heal.

Tali 39:00

Yeah, it's a stressor.

Cody 39:01

Yeah.

Tali 39:01

Right?

Cody 39:01

So yeah, the sleep and the food really make a big difference for very specific issues that you might be experiencing. So rather than try to fix your Achilles or fix your back with like some magic exercise that's gonna help that one thing, take a look at these big things like your nutrition and your sleep first.

Tali 39:20

Yeah. I was gonna say- Yeah that if anybody is curious about figuring out how much food they could be taking in to perform better in the gym or adjust their composition, or if you are dealing with kind of like a systemic inflammation challenge, like come see us. Make an InBody scan appointment. I think it's the coolest thing that we do here at the gym, amazingly. And there's a really great app that InBody has that, you know, you figure out what your goals are, and based off of the information that you get from your scan, it's gonna tailor what not necessarily a meal plan, but it will give you a snapshot of like, okay, my goal is to build this much muscle. It's gonna take this many meals of X amount of calories or protein to do that.

Speaker 3 40:09

Mm-hmm.

Tali 40:09

And I think for a lot of people, it's like really eye-opening. It's kind of like, this is kind of a funny example, but like we did sumo deadlifts this week, and I was teaching people how to get lined up with where their positioning should be. Mm-hmm. And almost everybody was like, "Dang, that was way wider than I thought I had to be." And then people- Yeah had to really stretch into those positions. And f- I feel like nutrition's a toughie because you really do have to kind of stretch yourself, but it's just like training, right? Little bits at a time. Yeah. You build the habits, you build the consistency. Mm-hmm. You mess up, you come back. Like, it's all part of it.

Cody 40:47

Yeah.

Tali 40:47

Yeah.

Cody 40:47

Yeah. I'd like to talk about two different aspects to weighing and measuring food because people are really repulsed by the idea. A lot of people are very repul- like, "I'm not gonna do that." First off, I just gotta say, well, how important it is. How important is this to you? Yeah. Like, do you wanna fix yourself or not? Because having a- It's a

Tali 41:05

slight inconvenience

Cody 41:06

ha- having a food scale is... I don't know why people think it's such a big deal. It's really actually not. You put your plate on it, you put your meat in the plate, and then your scale tells you how much meat you just had. It's really not

Tali 41:19

that big a deal. Well, I think the, I think the stigma around having a food scale is, like, it might might mean that you're, like, signing up to have, like, neuroses around food, and you might not want anything around that. I don't think that's true at all. Mm-hmm. Like you said, like, there are people who need to be n- they need to help their body.

Cody 41:39

Yeah.

Tali 41:40

And this is a really sure avenue to do it.

Cody 41:42

Yeah. So that's my first thing is, like, how important is this to you? Like, you know, before you resist it. The second thing is if you get consistent with what you're eating, you only need to do that for, like, 10 days straight. If you just do that for a week plus a couple days. And the reason I say 10 days is that we tend to eat differently on the weekends than we do during the week. So you need to train yourself what consistency actually really looks like.

Tali 42:06

Yeah. What it looks like, what you should have in your fridge- Mm-hmm like what a meal looks like to you. Yeah.

Cody 42:11

Yeah. So sometimes weighing and measuring literally only has to be done for about 10 days, and then if you just kinda stick with the same program and you're just kinda eating repetitively, you don't have to weigh and measure the rest of your life. I would say- You can just dial it in once in a while

Tali 42:25

there, there's one exception, and that's peanut butter.

Cody 42:29

Well-

Tali 42:29

One tablespoon of peanut butter is insanely smaller than you think it is.

Cody 42:33

Yeah.

Tali 42:33

Yeah.

Cody 42:34

A, a serving size of most things is way less than you think. Especially M&M's. But the-

Tali 42:40

I would imagine that one's really high-

Cody 42:42

Yeah

Tali 42:42

actually.

Cody 42:42

The other tip that I have around that though is in conjunction with what I just said, which is just, I call it... I think the best diet in the world is one I call eat the same damn thing. You just- Yeah eat the same damn thing every day. Yeah. And that can be pretty unique, what it, what, what is working for you. What, what gives you some energy, what gives you enough protein without overdoing the calories or underdoing the calories within a certain window. But once you figure out what that is for you- I think we've been taught, and I think we still hear this from a lot of nutritionists, that you want a lot of variety in your diet. And the thing about that is, is that it does make sense as far as getting mi- micronutrients in. Mm. Eat a lot of different colors, you know, eat the color wheel, like all these kind of fun things to say. And I'm not disagreeing with that, but throughout our evolutionary history, we have not had access to mung fruit or... Like, you know, like if, unless you're in a tropical region- I think

Tali 43:38

it's monk fruit.

Cody 43:39

Yeah. I'm just saying. There's not a lot of basis for this, uh, historically. We've been a- we've had to eat seasonally. We didn't ship things from Mexico to Oregon.

Tali 43:52

I'm feeling personally called out.

Cody 43:54

I'm just... I'm not- I'm not calling out anybody's preference. This has nothing to do with preference. Eat whatever the fuck you want. I'm just saying- that I don't think it's necessary for health to try to eat the color wheel all the time. What if you eat the same- If, if... Just let me finish here. Sorry. Let me finish here. When I'm... Changing body composition is what I'm talking about primarily. Mm. If you're wanting to lose weight, get lean, whatever you wanna call it, find some, w- find three or four meals that work for you and don't eat anything else for like six months. You will be shocked at, A, how easy it is, and B, how effective it is. I eat the same breakfast seven days a week, and then our dinner is pretty similar, I would say five to six days a week. And I've b- and that has, that alone has been the thing that's taken me from about 15% to 11% body fat 'Cause I haven't changed anything else. That's all I've done. I just took out lunch because I was overeating, and then I've just tried to eat the same thing. There for a while I had, like, three or four different breakfast go-tos, and we were getting a lot of variety. Well,

Tali 45:00

the important things- thing about what the way that you're eating that I think is important to say again is that you're eating enough calories within those two meals. Yeah. The trouble that I see often, especially when I'm sitting down with members, is that they're starting to substitute things, but they're also starting to eat less of it.

Speaker 3 45:19

Yeah.

Tali 45:19

That's not helping the situation. It's definitely helping with making choices, but it still might not be supporting your composition goals, your performance goal, your s- your recovery needs.

Cody 45:31

Yeah.

Tali 45:32

And I'm gonna say needs 'cause those aren't goals. We all need recovery-

Cody 45:36

Yeah

Tali 45:36

from all the stresses that we have.

Cody 45:38

The other benefit of eating the same thing all the time is it's really easy to tweak. I- my last body scan, d- two scans ago, I realized I was losing muscle at a rate that I didn't wanna lose 'cause I was, I was losing weight, cool, and I was getting leaner, which is what I wanted, but I, according to my InBody scans, I was also losing muscle. Yeah. And that kinda freaked me out a little bit. So but all I had to do was take my breakfast and I just literally upped the amount of protein and-

Tali 46:06

Cody's currently taking in, like, 100 eggs a week.

Cody 46:09

Close. No. I eat six eggs every morning and f-

Tali 46:13

It's like a whole plate-

Cody 46:14

and four strips of bacon of sunny side

Tali 46:16

up eggs.

Cody 46:16

Yeah. And four strips of bacon and about a tablespoon of quality butter. And I know that's, like, super high fat and all that, but that is- Yeah, I went from four eggs to six, and then at dinner time I've gone from like six ounces of meat to up to 10 or 11 some nights. And but that's it. That's the only thing I changed. I didn't do any dramatic differences to what I was eating. And I- my point is, is that I continued to lose body fat, but I have maintained muscle. So I'm getting leaner and lighter, but it's maintaining the muscle. But hanging on to your

Tali 46:49

muscle, yeah.

Cody 46:50

So by eating the same thing every day, I'm not saying people have to eat what I'm eating. If you don't like eggs- Yeah, I couldn't or you're allergic or whatever, I don't... That's not my point. My point is, is if you're eating the same thing, it's very easy to make minor adjustments and actually see the results of those adjustments.

Tali 47:03

That's actually another point that I just wanna make that probably will be a good segue into our next topic. When I sit down with people for their initial InBody scan, you know, they're a new member with us, I say, "Try not to change anything else in your lifestyle. Let's just see what happens as a result to training with us."

Speaker 3 47:22

Yeah.

Tali 47:22

Right? Let's try to isolate this one thing. I do think that sometimes on our roads to fitness, we try to do a lot at once because we're feeling motivated to, like, hit all of these things. I do think when it comes to sustainable life changes, you wanna introduce things slowly so that, A, you see if it sticks, you like it, it works but it's sustainable, right? We don't wanna f- be completely consumed by this effort when we've got all this other stuff to manage. And so like you were saying with being able to make tiny tweaks, like, that's a really cool use of the InBody as well, is testing things out, right? Do everything the same and then, like, for the next two months, I'm gonna try adding a extra meal of protein. Let's see how that goes.

Speaker 3 48:13

Yeah.

Tali 48:14

Yeah. There's a lot of really cool ways to use the InBody and the InBody app. So I'd say if anybody feels really motivated by data or, it might be in need of more than I'm just feeling better, more capable, performing better. If there are some, like, real health risks that we might be addressing, the InBody's a really useful tool.

Cody 48:35

Yeah. What's the next thing on your list?

Tali 48:38

Uh, the next thing is movement. Okay. And just regular movement, and I thought that we could kind of batch this with another thing that our members ask us about a lot, which is what they could be doing between sessions. Because some people only come here two days a week. To me, I would not call that consistent movement all week long, right? That's only two out of seven days. We initially started with this kind of offering because moving to the county, we really quickly realized that people are involved in a lot here. And so we wanted our service to be kind of like the touch points each week that people could build momentum off of. Mm-hmm. And so often we hear, "Well, what could I be doing between my sessions?" If this is the only thing that you're doing right now.

Speaker 3 49:23

Yeah.

Tali 49:24

And so in terms of fitness, you know, we've already done an episode about scaling and, like, how to do things in here really well, but we wanna broaden that now and talk about what movement looks like on a consistent schedule-

Cody 49:40

Yeah

Tali 49:41

day to day.

Cody 49:42

Yeah. And I think, uh, it kinda depends on who you are and where you're at, but the what I tell people is that we wanna coach you during the most intense, high impact type of training that you do.

Tali 49:54

So- Also,

Cody 49:54

it's

Tali 49:55

done safely.

Cody 49:55

Yeah. So when you're doing the heavy weights or the high intensity stuff, you're working with your coach, because I don't need to watch you walk for an hour.

Tali 50:02

Mm.

Cody 50:03

Right?

Tali 50:03

Oh, no?

Cody 50:04

Yeah, we try to do that, like, uh, biggest bang for your buck kinda thing while you're in here. S- But that doesn't mean that should be all you're doing. So mobility, recovery work and recovery work meaning, like, walking. Uh, like getting your steps in, if you wanna call it that, is really critical for continuing to get circulation through the joints and those tissues that you've worked so hard on in here. Mm-hmm. Movement is magic. And active recovery is just as important as sleep. Maybe not as important as sleep, but it's pretty dang close to continue to move your body even with really low intensity.

Tali 50:41

Yeah. I think having a little bit of a broader mindset in terms of frequency is also gonna be helpful in some of the things that we've talked about, um, regarding the other categories, especially when it comes to things like inflammation and injury. You know, when we're... We've talked about this in our consistency episode, and probably with all of our members at one time, that to train the way that we train here in the gym sporadically is not safe. If you continuously move throughout the week or if you're gonna- You

Cody 51:10

mean if you come in sporadically it's not safe.

Tali 51:12

Yeah.

Cody 51:13

Yeah.

Tali 51:13

Yeah. If you just, like, come in a couple times a month and, like, are intending to send it, you know- Yeah full force, and, like, that is, if anything, that might set you back, right? Oh, yeah. 'Cause you are risking injury at that point.

Cody 51:24

Yeah.

Tali 51:24

But if you are coming in consistently two to three days a week, you know, that could be something that we're layering an open gym schedule or a, a po- session in, right? To either increase that or to be able to develop your skills or to get another day of lifting in. Like, that is exactly why we opened the gym on Saturday. You know, most of us are off of work, and we knew that some people would take advantage of a third day.

Cody 51:49

Yeah.

Tali 51:51

Or a fourth day. Sometimes people come in five days. It's amazing. Yeah. Yeah.

Cody 51:56

Yeah. So, walking, hiking, recreational activities like that are actually, they're not only great for- recovery, but it's just so many reasons. So it's increase of, of blood flow. Um, you're increasing your heart rate even if it's minor, like a zone one or zone two type of cardio. Output is still really great for long-term cardiovascular health. Is there's also the psychological aspect- Oh, yeah and the sleep aspect, which is gonna help feed into each other. Walking has so many benefits, especially, by the way, when you're walking, try to not look down at your feet while you're walking. You know, if you're, if you're hiking and you have to obviously watch where you step so you don't roll an ankle on some rock or something, but if you're, uh, walking around town or on a clean trail, you wanna look out to the horizon. Because there's, believe it or not, there's some studies done where ju- the pace of walking and the things that are going by you, like the scenery that goes by your eyes as you look straight ahead while you walk, actually helps to calm your nervous system. Mm. There's like some actual- Interesting aspects of, of psychology that will help to, balance your stress levels through walking. And so that's, it's kind of an interesting thing. It's not just endorphins from the activity. There's also some correlation with your visual cortex and how that's how your brain is interpreting that.

Tali 53:23

That's cool.

Cody 53:24

Uh, but that's not gonna work if you're staring at your feet the whole time. So-

Tali 53:26

Well, and I think it's also important to-

Cody 53:28

Or a phone

Tali 53:29

say that we have previously, I think in other episodes, talked about how walking is unlikely gonna be, um, the only modality that can get you to fitness. We're definitely talking about walking as like a recovery, supplemental, between workouts kind of thing.

Cody 53:47

Yeah, walking is not

Tali 53:47

a workout. Not a instead of. Yeah. Yeah.

Cody 53:49

The only person, uh, walking is for a workout for is if you're somebody who's been bedridden or in a wheelchair for a long time or something like that, then obviously there's layers to this. But for the average person, walking is a recovery tool, not a workout.

Tali 54:03

Yeah. If you're ever feeling- It's important. Yeah like especially sore or if you did a really heavy lifting day and you just anticipate like feeling stiff, take yourself for a walk. Take yourself for a walk and I w- I assure that you're gonna come into class the next time feeling much more ready to get moving.

Speaker 3 54:20

Much better,

Tali 54:21

yeah. Yeah. You know, getting on your horses. I know lots of y'all have horses. Swimming at the lake someday soon. Um, but yes, trying to get in some more of that zone one, zone two that you were talking about, I actually have no idea what it physically takes to ride a horse. I'm gonna assume it's more than that.

Cody 54:38

Not necessarily.

Tali 54:38

But yeah, you're it sounds like everyone's yard work is super physical. It's kind of interesting, like the first couple weeks of like gardening season, people were telling me like day after day of like how painful it was.

Cody 54:51

Oh, yeah.

Tali 54:51

And-

Cody 54:52

Every year there's-

Tali 54:53

I don't garden, so I just- Yeah I guess I wasn't aware of like how dangerous gardening can, gardening can be.

Cody 54:58

Yeah. I think we have two seasons here in Wallowa County. There's slip and fall season, and there's gardening injury season.

Tali 55:05

Slash snow shoveling.

Cody 55:07

Yeah.

Tali 55:07

I guess there's shoveling in both of those.

Cody 55:09

Yeah.

Tali 55:09

Yeah. Uh, anything else for consistent movement, which, we're talking about all the time, of course

Cody 55:17

Yeah. Um, I'm probably guilty about, of not doing enough mobility work or intentional mobility work. I don't think it always has to look like a stretching routine or a yoga practice though. I think if you are warming up and moving through optimal ranges of motion, that is a type of mobility that you're doing. So just don't cut your reps short while you're in here, and that's actually part of mobility. But desensitizing tissues with foam rollers and, and lacrosse balls and that kind of thing I find especially as I age or nurse back old injuries that have been nagging for a long time, that that kind of daily practice is actually really important.

Tali 56:00

Nice. Yeah. A lot of us have foam rollers. Y'all use them.

Cody 56:03

Yeah.

Tali 56:03

Use them. Kind of like you were saying to put an alarm on your phone- For sleep. Like, maybe putting an alarm on your phone for, like, a little rollout. I know a lot of our members who have to sit at a desk all day long, I often say, like, "Have a lacrosse ball in your desk."

Cody 56:17

Yeah. And there's a- I often get questions about leg cramps and things like that with sleep. Mm.

Tali 56:23

Mm-hmm.

Cody 56:23

And people's go-to is always potassium. And f- first of all, it could be a variety of different minerals.

Tali 56:30

That's what I was saying about bananas, not magnesium. Sorry.

Cody 56:32

Yeah. So- it could be magnesium, potassium, sodium. You know, there could be a lot of, You, you wanna experiment with a lot of different aspects of that. Staying very well hydrated, and I'm a big fan of LMNT, L-M-N-T. Uh-

Tali 56:46

I hope they sponsor us.

Cody 56:47

I have at least a packet a day with my big jug of water. So all that's important, and I think often talked about. But one thing you can do if you are frequently getting leg cramps is try a foam rolling session right before bed. Try to desensitize some of those tissues, 'cause some of that foam rolling, massage, lacrosse ball, whatever tools y- you have access to and, and know how to use some of that actually is helping to shut down the nerves from being overactive. That's part of what those do. Uh, it's also helping sliding tissues slide better and, and, like, loosen up the fascia around those muscles. That can all contribute to situations of cramping or stiffness or, or things that might keep you up at night. So if that's you, uh, give that a shot. It's not just- It's not always potassium. It's in- There could be a lot of different things that can cause that it's

Tali 57:40

interesting 'cause, like, we've been talking about these things in pertaining to fitness, but it seems almost like the even more obvious overarching theme has been recovery. Yeah. All of these seem to be really geared towards recovering well-

Cody 57:56

Yeah

Tali 57:56

so that we can do better in fitness. Yeah. Right? That's part- I don't- of that cycle.

Cody 58:01

Yeah. I don't agree with this statement anymore, but I, uh, there was a time when I used to say, just 'cause I was pushing back a little bit, ov- overcompensating, of-

Tali 58:09

Oh gosh,

Cody 58:09

what? of people saying like, um, "Overtraining, overtraining, overtraining." And I was, I would used to say People are not over-training, they're under-recovering

Speaker 3 58:19

Mm-hmm

Cody 58:20

And I don't think that's always true, but I do think often it's true. I think that you can probably get more training volume or higher intensity training if you are consistently taking care of your recovery in a very active way, and not just, like, going through life thoughtlessly and then coming into the gym and trying to kill yourself and thinking that that is how you're gonna get fit. I think that was kind of part of the CrossFit movement there for a while of, like, people just killing it in CrossFit. And then the rest of their life was just, like, as normal. Just, like, sitting at a desk, sitting and watching Netflix, and staying up late, or drinking beer, and all this kind of stuff. It should

Tali 58:59

be proportionate, right? Yeah. Like, that would be a really interesting way of thinking about your day of like, "This is how hard I went into my workout. I need to do that same amount of effort or intensity for the recovery of it."

Speaker 3 59:13

Yeah.

Tali 59:14

Right? If you came in and, like, we're just trying to, like, move through the day and we're not, like, pushing ourselves too hard, then yeah, you can probably back off on your recovery efforts. But if you're really stressing your body in here in the way that we can be- Mm-hmm intentionally, then that effort to balance it out has got to be matched.

Cody 59:33

Yeah. Get your sauna session in.

Tali 59:35

Yeah. Get your sauna session in. There are always lots of really great yoga courses that are popping up, and they tend to be on the restorative side. Phase Six is a really great resource. I've always really liked their mobility-

Cody 59:49

Yeah

Tali 59:49

stuff.

Cody 59:50

I'll link to their stuff- Okay and Kelly Starrett's in the description of this podcast.

Tali 59:54

Cool.

Cody 59:55

So there'll be a couple. So, um, those two particularly really good stu- And, uh, Beard the Best You Can Be, that guy, I forget his real name, but he's also a really

Tali 1:00:06

good- How can you with a name like that?

Cody 1:00:07

Uh, he's really good for coaching through some of the controlled articular rotation type stuff and joint health. He's, he's really, really good. So I will link to all three of those resources for y'all, 'cause that's all stuff you can do at home. They've got a lot of quality information, even on social media. So you don't even have to buy a course-

Tali 1:00:26

Yeah

Cody 1:00:26

um, at first. You can just access a lot of

Tali 1:00:29

good stuff. Take in all the free stuff first.

Cody 1:00:30

Yeah.

Tali 1:00:31

Okay. So the last one that kind of sparked the whole idea was supplement use. Maybe we should just start with the supplements that we use or have used.

Cody 1:00:40

You wanna do that here now?

Tali 1:00:41

Yeah.

Cody 1:00:42

I didn't prepare. I'd like to do a little more research before we hit that in a deep dive topic, so maybe a different podcast we can talk about supplements specifically. But we can go through what we take, but I just- Well, I

Tali 1:00:51

was gonna say, that was the question we were asked is, like, what do we personally do? Like, what feels worth taking? There's always kind of a debate of is this worth it?

Cody 1:01:01

I know. But I take a couple little multis that I would like to pick apart in more depth- Sure but I need to do a little research on those. But-

Tali 1:01:07

Well, share what you wanna share

Cody 1:01:08

in general because of my frequent tendinopathy issues, I do take in collagen protein as well as a little bit of vitamin C. That's supposed to be the magic combo. And ideally, that is a pre-workout situation. So I take my whey shake with collagen and a little bit of vitamin C midday. I don't really think it's a huge... Like, it's not gonna f- it's not gonna cure your tendonitis, let's just put it that way. But I think with consistent use, it can actually help with building those collagen structures. So that's one that I take. Also the magnesium threonate that I mentioned. I take a zinc every single night. Zinc is an interesting one 'cause there's a bit of a bell curve to it. If you take too much, it's less effective than if you take a little bit frequently. So I take just one I think it's, uh, 50 milligrams. Uh, no, 15 milligrams,

Tali 1:02:04

sorry. I was gonna say, I feel like they came in fives.

Cody 1:02:05

They're really small. Yeah, it's 15 milligrams, um, of chelated zinc. In the evening, and I take it before bed. There's a lot of benefits to zinc. It's kind of a strange thing. It, I started taking it because it helps my immune system. I tend to- I was gonna

Tali 1:02:19

say, when we feel something coming on or overly stressed from travel- Yeah we usually take a zinc.

Cody 1:02:23

Yeah. And the problem with it though is it's gotta be preemptive. So sometimes by the time you feel symptoms, it's too late.

Tali 1:02:29

Late.

Cody 1:02:29

And so that's why I just started taking it every night, and I tend to get sick less. Uh, however, there are some other really good benefits to it as far as like, testosterone and hor- and growth hormone. And then you and I are supplementing with something right now that has copper in it, and it, you can get copper poisoning basically. You can kind of build up copper in your system, and zinc helps to balance that and process the copper. So there's just tons of benefits to zinc. What else do I take? I take whey I mentioned. Mm-hmm. Whey is like the, the king of all proteins as far as quick and easy supple- Absorption supplement and absorption. Yeah. Uh, it's readily available. It's complete protein, an animal protein, and easy, and I... If you don't like the taste of it, drink it faster.

Tali 1:03:15

You're so cutthroat about it.

Cody 1:03:17

Um-

Tali 1:03:18

Oh, man

Cody 1:03:19

yeah. I'm, I'm trying to remember what else. Oh, so I, as, one of them that I'm gonna do some more research on, and I'll get back to y'all on this one, but it's a vision supplement. There are actually supplements that you can take to improve your vision, and I have noticed that it has made a difference. I'm 51, and I'm still resisting the urge to have to use readers. Um, I find if I'm not too fatigued, I can actually see, uh, see a difference in clarity of reading after I've taken that supplement. And what about you? Where are you-

Tali 1:03:52

What about me? Oh, gosh. When it comes to supplements, well, I know you know this, but maybe not everybody else does, is that I'm terrible at taking supplements. I'm a lady of chaos. I don't know. Um, I just don't-- I'm not great with routines of any kind, and supplements have always kind of like fallen into that category. I'd say whey protein, of all things, is probably the f- the one that I had had the most consistently, and in like every way that you could do it. There was a whole year that I had made whey protein waffle sandwiches. There was a whole year where I would put it in the Starbucks from next door to my gym, and I would mix it in with their oatmeal, and I would call it gym slop. And, uh, you know, then there were like the Progenex j- days where I would just like chug it, and I don't... And then I-- Yeah. The thing about whey protein is like, I think perhaps there is a lifetime quota that I met a really long time ago. You know, you were just talking about drinking it fast, and like there is nothing that sounds worse to me than drinking whey protein mixed with water in a shaker bottle. And it's also because there have been many shaker bottles in my life that were like left in a hot car- Yeah or in a gym bag, and it's- It's

Cody 1:05:10

as awful as that

Tali 1:05:10

mine. But I'm just saying it's like the most horrific experience ever. It's the worst smell on Earth.

Cody 1:05:17

Yeah.

Tali 1:05:17

But I- If

Cody 1:05:17

you have a plastic shaker bottle and you forgot to wash it out, just throw it away.

Tali 1:05:20

Yeah, get rid of it. Um-

Cody 1:05:22

It will never be okay.

Tali 1:05:22

It will never be okay. Yeah. I have a-- You know, I have thought about getting into whey again because I recently inherited a Vitamix from Wallowa County Classifieds, and I really wanna use it. But I did say earlier that when I find myself eating enough, right? That is an amount that has been determined by my activity level, my basal metabolic rate my composition goals, and my performance goals, all overseen by a nutritionist. Having nutrition support is- Just as important as having a coach for exercise, I would say, especially if that's a world that's either daunting or maybe you know, if there's any kind of like disordered experience with. And so, I l- find that I feel great when I eat enough of all the right things. You know, when I said that I felt personally victimized by your eating the color of the rainbow- I eat differently than you do. I try to change things up as much as I can because I'm focusing on keeping it interesting. Like, I eat CrossFit style, right? It's like constantly varied. Trying to meet all the goals. Um- High

Speaker 3 1:06:36

intensity.

Tali 1:06:37

Not high intensity. It's actually quite the opposite. It's like the easiest things that I could possibly make, but I try to keep it interesting so I don't get bored. And I'm somebody who kinda gets bored easily, so I always like to have something a little bit intriguing or new or whatever. And so, eating those calories as opposed to supplementing them with a drink, uh, I have found feels better for me over time. And you know, there are other things that I have taken in the past like collagen, vitamin D, and fish oil that I just don't see myself taking as often anymore. You know, supplements are another expense, too, and there have been many times where, like in budgeting my life, those were kind of the first things to get cut- so that I would, make the most of the food that I was eating. So I don't know if I'm kinda trapped in that and always kind of thinking like that's the first thing to get rid of, but that was the inspiration for this podcast, was like what supplements are we taking and like what might be better than a supplement when it comes to your movement, your food intake, and your sleep quality that might do the same for you that all the supplements you're seeking out are doing? And it's really to ask the question, am I mastering the basics- Yeah of living healthily or like on my fitness journey specifically? And so that's why we don't want sleep to be an afterthought. That's why food... Weighing your food is not something that should have a stigma around it. Like, this is what it takes to change your body for the better.

Cody 1:08:15

Yeah.

Tali 1:08:15

Whether it's the way it looks or how it feels or the experience you have in it.

Cody 1:08:19

Yeah. So I would say that it kinda goes both ways again, that it's not a necessarily a strict hierarchy. Yeah. I do think that people need to get their basics of just eating When I say clean food, I mean, like, food you could recognize in the wild. You don't see a macaroni- Bush tree, tree. Yeah, you're not gonna go pluck it. Just whole, real foods consistent sleep, and training consistently. Those three are the big things. Once you have that dialed in though, sometimes a supplement can help with your sleep quality, for instance. Someti- like creatine can help your performance in the gym. So there's these... I wouldn't say that it's like get everything dialed in first and then supplement, because sometimes supplements do help you dial in those other big pictures. So it does go both ways. I just have found that there is no supplement that's a big magic fix. Like-

Tali 1:09:11

See, that's been the

Cody 1:09:12

other challenge for me they're, they're overly, overly sold, I think, as far as, like, the benefits. The benefits are real, but the benefits can be very minor, and they can be- Super

Tali 1:09:20

marginal,

Cody 1:09:21

right? And they can be very cumulative over years of... so it's not like you're gonna start taking creatine and wake up like, uh, an Adonis the next day, I do take creatine in with my shake every day. So, and I take more than five grams. Five grams is kinda like the go-to standard for muscle stamina. There, the studies show, like, you get an extra, whatever, like 1.75 reps or something like that when you're taking, uh, muscle to failure so there are legit studies that you can get more reps done in your workout when you're supplementing with creatine. It's one of the most studied longstanding supplements that there are. It's safe, it-- and it works. I take more than that because some of the more recent studies that they're doing on it has to do with aging and brain function. And interestingly enough compensation for sleep deprivation. So they have done cognitive s- studies where they'll keep their subjects up for like two days with no sleep, and then they have to take, do some cognitive tasks. And the people who supplemented with 20 grams of creatine performed as if they hadn't been sleep deprived. Now, that was kind of a one shot and done. I don't know about chronic sleep issues. But I f- I'm like I don't think it's gonna hurt anything. So I take like that 20 gram dose that has been studied. I don't know that that's great long term. I'm still doing some research, and I don't necessarily recommend everybody just go to that. Yeah. But creatine, generally speaking, is super safe and has... There's just so much evidence of it working in so many beneficial ways that I'm like, why not? And it's super cheap. Like, I buy it in a two-kilo bag that'll last me forever. And you don't have to go get the highest quality pro- creatine on the market because it's cheap and easy to make. So as long as it's a fairly trustworthy company, just get the cheap m- creatine monohydrate plain, no flavors, no crap in it. And then I do supplement with fish oil, and it's the opposite of what I just said. You h- you need to get the highest quality fish oils you can find because rancid fish oil in a pill is actually bad for you. And some of them aren't what they say they are, and the quality is so poor that you'd have to take a lot to get the amount of fatty acids that you're looking for. So I'm a big fan of Carlson's brand. They've been around forever. They're from the Netherlands, and they're just highly purified, excellent quality fish oil. But I will say that for a cost benefit, if you get to Costco, the Costco brand fish oil has also been studied through like Consumer Reports and that kind of thing to be very high quality. So fish oil and creatine are, round out what I take as far as everything I've mentioned, and those are two big heavy hitters. My problem with the fish oil isn't that I don't like taking it, it's that I forget because it's in the fridge and all the rest of my supplements are in the cabinet. So every once in a while I'll miss out on that.

Tali 1:12:21

Well, that experience that you have with fish oil is like me with every other supplement. Yeah. Like, I will just never think to do it.

Cody 1:12:27

So fish oil is a natural anti-inflammatory. Yeah. So when we were talking about injuries and stuff like that, it's a powerful recovery tool. And again, I take higher doses than what's on the label because it's not a more is better situation, but you do have to get a, what they call a therapeutic dose sometimes if you're working out very intensely or if you're trying to recovery, re- recover from injuries. So I take like a tablespoon a day, which is about four times what the label says. Um-

Tali 1:12:56

But it's good. It's not gross.

Cody 1:12:57

Yeah, it's not... It's, yeah, a nice lemony flavor. I mean, if you can imagine taking a tablespoon of olive oil that's kinda lemon flavored- Oh that's about what it's like. You can get it in pill version, but you'd be taking 12 pills, so it's just up to you. It's a natural blood thinner, so check with your physician if you are on medications that are blood thinners. You may want to not confound that. But I think that's why it's an anti-inflammatory, and I think that's why it helps with injuries, is that when you have a tendon, tendons and ligaments, they're white because there are hardly any capillaries in there. They're really low blood flow. It's one reason they're slow to heal. And so my theory, I don't know, I haven't really been told this by any authority, but as a blood thinner, to me it seems like it's helping blood get into those tissues- That

Tali 1:13:46

makes sense

Cody 1:13:47

that have, uh, less blood flow naturally. So-

Tali 1:13:49

Yeah, I think about that a lot with people who are maybe more sedentary throughout the day, too. A lot of physical challenges come with sitting for many, many hours.

Cody 1:13:58

Yeah. Yeah.

Tali 1:13:59

And so I think that could be really helpful if you find yourself working out really hard with us, but then needing to go to work where you're gonna sit for the next, four hours.

Cody 1:14:08

Yeah.

Tali 1:14:08

Yeah. Well, so the one thing that I wanted to kind of wrap all this up with is, um, you know, releasing the pressure of all of these efforts now- and then as well.

Cody 1:14:22

Mm-hmm.

Tali 1:14:23

It's really important for us to remind you guys that, like, we are people, too. Like, all the things that we make suggestions for you guys, we know that doing everything 100%, 100% of the time is not realistic. Are

Cody 1:14:35

you talking about pizza night?

Tali 1:14:37

What are you talking about?

Cody 1:14:38

It's pizza night.

Tali 1:14:39

Yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah. I was like, "Wait a second. What?" Yeah. We're gonna have pizza tonight. We're- we've been looking forward to it all week. You know, when we were talking about food, I have always had this idea with my food life and my training life, I think I got this from, um, Dr. D, Dave Rief. Um, the 80/20 rule. 80% effort in any of these domains is gonna move the needle. Doesn't have to be perfect- Mm-hmm but it's enough effort to be directionally correct without backsliding.

Speaker 3 1:15:12

Yeah.

Tali 1:15:12

And so- I'm sure everybody can understand or has experienced to some degree with anything like this, trying to be so regimented that you do everything perfect every time, and that fizzling out really quickly because the demand that you're putting on yourself to change your lifestyle is so great.

Speaker 3 1:15:32

Yeah.

Tali 1:15:33

So building up steadily, you know, maybe trying one or two things that we talked about today, and allowing it to build momentum. But then even once you get there, we don't measure everything we eat, but we measure a lot of what we eat, right? It's not everything, but I usually measure out my protein just to make sure that I'm not, like, low-balling it, right? That's easier for me to do.

Cody 1:15:54

That's the only thing I measure is my protein.

Tali 1:15:56

Yeah. But I think it is important to relieve the pressure here and there. Like tomorrow, no. Yeah, tomorrow is gonna be our day off, right? And the goal is to do no work, no,

Cody 1:16:08

We are gonna work out.

Tali 1:16:09

We are gonna work out. But no work- um, just to kind of unplug from responsibilities. I think that's really important. I think you have to let yourself off the hook. I even talk about that during our workout sometimes, where it's like, I said it today. We had three movements. Run... No. Maybe it was yesterday. Running pull-ups, and sit-ups, and I said, "Pick one or two." To really kick ass with today. And then like let one station be like something you look forward to.

Speaker 3 1:16:40

Mm.

Tali 1:16:40

Find some balance there so not everything sucks. You know, changing your life can feel like a lot of really hard work, and a lot of mental contorting, and a lot of effort, and a lot of frustration. You know, you have to be a bit of a scientist with yourself to see how these things are working for you. There are many more choices beyond what we just talked about today. And so-

Cody 1:17:04

Just kinda keep trying to reorient yourself to be directionally correct. Mm-hmm. And not perfect.

Tali 1:17:10

Yeah.

Cody 1:17:10

And just be okay with that.

Tali 1:17:11

We expect that of no one. Mm-hmm. You know? We want, we want what we do in the gym to be additive to our lives. For some of us, it's something we really need to live well. And so we want it to be enjoyable, too, right? We don't want this to be like you're gonna come in here and suffer the whole way through it. Like, there's a reason that we do it as a group. There's a reason we play fun music. Like, we're trying to make the hard work an enjoyable thing for you all. Uh, I hope we're doing that well, and I hope that you also get an understanding of like what our values are as coaches and what we want to see in the gym. You know, we want everybody to work hard, and we wanna see really amazing results, and we totally do. And we just want you to know that we know it's not as a result of perfection or, killing yourself to do it.

Cody 1:18:02

Yeah.

Tali 1:18:02

Never.

Cody 1:18:03

Yeah. Life is short. Have some fun with it.

Tali 1:18:06

Totally. But stay healthy. Stay well. Yeah. Stay capable.

Cody 1:18:09

So that you can have fun with it. Totally. And you're not miserable.

Tali 1:18:12

Yes.

Cody 1:18:12

Cause it's long-term misery if you're not healthy.

Tali 1:18:15

True that. Well, is there anything else that you wanna layer in here?

Cody 1:18:18

No, just if anybody has p- uh, podcast topics, please throw them our way. Things that we can deep dive on, do some research for you, or whatever it takes. Uh, or our viewpoint on something. Sometimes with just the two of us, we have to dig a little bit to figure out what these are gonna be about.

Speaker 3 1:18:34

Mm-hmm.

Cody 1:18:34

Until we get the technology put together to be able to have you all on as guests. Yeah. So we would love to have some longer talks with many of you. Um, you are interesting folks, and- and we care about you deeply, and we'd love to share some of your stories with other people. But, um- Yes,

Tali 1:18:51

there's so much to brag about. Yeah. You know those, uh, highlights we do on Instagram like don't even do it justice.

Cody 1:18:57

Not even close. Yeah. Yeah. But we need to upgrade some technology. So in the meantime, it'll probably be the Talia and Co- Cody show. So if you have topics you'd like us to cover, please let us know. All right.

Tali 1:19:08

All right.

Cody 1:19:09

It's been good. Love you. Thanks. Love you too. Thanks for being

Tali 1:19:13

here. Okay.

Cody 1:19:13

Bye.