Measures Of Progress

Transcript

Cody 0:07

Okay, we're on.

Tali 0:08

We're on?

Cody 0:08

Mm-hmm.

Tali 0:09

I hope that we can get one of those on air lights. Yeah. That would be so cool, especially right now because the gym is technically open.

Cody 0:18

Yeah.

Tali 0:18

I mean, no one's gonna barge in here, but maybe they'll see us-

Cody 0:22

Yeah

Tali 0:22

if they're-

Cody 0:23

It's, um-

Tali 0:24

if they're, I don't know, getting water or going to the sauna or something.

Cody 0:28

I'm sure it's on Amazon.

Tali 0:29

Yeah. That'd be cool.

Cody 0:31

Yeah.

Tali 0:32

Yeah.

Cody 0:33

Then you'll be an on-air personality.

Tali 0:35

Yes. Mm. Officially. Well, we're here to re-record for the fourth time an episode about, um, the many measures of progress.

Cody 0:47

Yes.

Tali 0:48

I remember that in California that didn't go well. We knew it wouldn't go well because we were at my parents' house, and the acoustics were terrible and-

Cody 0:57

Yeah. We were in a-

Tali 0:58

the room was pretty sparse and-

Cody 1:00

We were in a cool little room, so I thought it'd be a great environment, but it was echoey because

Tali 1:03

it had- Oh, right, we filmed

Cody 1:04

too concrete... Yeah, 'cause it had concrete floors.

Tali 1:06

Concrete floors probably didn't help. Yeah. And then we recorded again before then twice?

Cody 1:13

I think once or twice we tried to do the same topic, and, uh, the files didn't work out. I have since gotten a new laptop.

Tali 1:20

Ooh.

Cody 1:20

So we will see how this goes.

Tali 1:22

Yeah.

Cody 1:23

Fourth time's a charm.

Tali 1:24

I don't know about you, but I'm already warm.

Cody 1:27

Yeah, that's all right. We've, we've practiced this- so it should be very efficient, right? Yes. Uh, it's been months though.

Tali 1:32

Yeah,

Cody 1:33

it has. What is it? It's June, and we tried the first attempt at this, uh, over Christmas break. So we're talking about the many ways to measure progress, basically.

Tali 1:43

Well, and the reason- Uh that we wanna be able to measure progress in lots of ways is that a lot of us commit to a gym or to a program with some primary goals, and maybe have specific measurements around those goals, whether it's fat loss or strength gain or, uh, you know, what have you, living well, and it- A lot of other important things happen when you're on that ride, and I think it's really easy to forget- Mm-hmm or to forget to notice- Mm-hmm what other cool things are falling into place. And so I just want this to be more of a well-rounded experience for everybody. And so regardless of what your primary goals are, I'm sure there's all sorts of other amazing things that have been happening for you, and I just want us to be able to talk about, uh, how to measure those, what are the important things to look at, and maybe share some stories about what we've heard so far.

Cody 2:38

Yeah.

Tali 2:38

Yeah.

Cody 2:39

I just, I don't know why this just came up for me, uh, but do you remember the movie Rudy?

Tali 2:45

Of course.

Cody 2:46

So-

Tali 2:46

Rudy.

Cody 2:46

Rudy. Rudy. There's the only point in the whole movie where he quits. Like, he just is like this guy who won't quit ever on anything, and even though he's turned down and down and down and down, and it's like the last quarter of the last season that he can be there, and, uh, he's feeling all sorry for himself. And the, the, uh, maintenance man that he's working for gives him this big lecture about quitting, and he's like, "What's this all for? It's been pointless." And he's just like, "Uh, hold up. You got to, like, hang with one of the top teams in the country for two years. You got a first-rate education. You got, you know, this and that and this." And, uh, he's like, "Stop feeling sorry for yourself, you know? So you didn't get to play, big deal. Like, you got all these other things." And it's kind of a whole point in that story because it's like he was just measuring the wrong thing. Yeah. Like, his one goal was to, to, to play, you know, at least one play to, like, go down in the history books of having been on the team. Um, but he was kind of taking for granted all the other benefits that came with the efforts that he had put in, you know? Yeah, the

Tali 3:57

whole way through.

Cody 3:58

Yeah. And so, uh, it kinda reminds me that we can do that in the gym or in life in general sometimes too with- Yeah you kinda, like, have one metric that you're going for, and that one metric is just not working out. It's easy to take for granted all the other benefits that you're getting just in the pursuit of that one thing, so.

Tali 4:16

Well, the mistake is that you hang your hopes on one outcome-

Cody 4:20

Yeah

Tali 4:21

or one measurement. So yeah. We'll have to watch that again. I don't remember it as well as I could.

Cody 4:28

Yeah, I've seen it many times.

Tali 4:30

It's so good. I think. I always thought that it would be fun to do sport movie screenings here, just, like, of all the inspirational sport movies.

Cody 4:39

Yeah.

Tali 4:40

And speaking of, you know, h- I, I don't remember if it's Southpaw.

Cody 4:44

Mm-hmm.

Tali 4:45

No, maybe it's a different movie. It's whichever one has Christian Bale that you've been wanting me to see about boxing.

Cody 4:52

I think it's called- And it's

Tali 4:52

about brothers

Cody 4:53

I th- Oh, okay. The

Tali 4:54

Fighter.

Cody 4:55

So yeah. I think you're mixing up two different movies, but yeah, The, The Fighter, I think is what that one's called.

Tali 5:00

Cause I think I saw Southpaw.

Cody 5:01

So yeah. Yeah. You, you didn't like it that much. But the, um- It

Tali 5:04

was a little cheesy

Cody 5:06

the, uh Fighter, if that's what it's called. I think that's what it's called, is- Mark Wahlberg? We... Yeah, Mark Wahlberg and-

Tali 5:15

Christian Bale

Cody 5:15

Christian Bale, thank you

Tali 5:16

And Amy Adams.

Cody 5:17

And that one we went to see in the theater as a gym.

Tali 5:23

Wait.

Cody 5:23

Way back when that came out. Yeah, I took my original gym in, like, Lake Oswego. We took up two aisles of the theater and went and saw that. It was pretty fun. Oh, man. I

Tali 5:33

wonder if we could do a screening, like, on the side of the house or something, and do it in our yard since there's, like, a really big area.

Cody 5:41

Yeah, the only problem

Tali 5:42

is- That'd be so sweet, like a drive-in

Cody 5:43

yeah, the only problem is it doesn't get dark until, like, 10:00 at night now. Well... Maybe September.

Tali 5:49

Yeah, maybe late summer, yeah.

Cody 5:50

Yeah.

Tali 5:51

Um, anyway, I feel up to watching it 'cause I just saw a clip of it, and it- Okay looked really good. The acting looked great.

Cody 5:56

Cool. Yeah. The one movie I've been trying to get you to see that are brothers is, uh, Warrior, and that's Tom Hardy-

Tali 6:03

That's not what we're talking about?

Cody 6:03

No. Warrior is Tom Hardy and, uh, another dude I forget the name of, and it's MMA, not boxing.

Tali 6:11

Oh, okay.

Cody 6:11

Yeah. But they're both good movies-

Tali 6:13

Okay

Cody 6:13

in different ways.

Tali 6:14

Okay. I feel like the boxing movies have a lot of similar themes.

Cody 6:19

Yeah. Well, a lot of boxers- Like- have that similar background

Tali 6:23

all their wives die?

Cody 6:24

Uh, no.

Tali 6:28

No.

Cody 6:28

Yeah. More, more like rough, rough, you know- Rough upbringing rough upbringing and, uh, um, underdog story- Mm-hmm is pretty common in the sport.

Tali 6:38

Yeah. Uh, before we move on, what's your favorite boxing movie?

Cody 6:43

Cinderella Man I

Tali 6:44

was gonna say that too Is

Cody 6:45

pretty dang good

Tali 6:46

It's so good except for, like, the first five minutes

Cody 6:50

First five minutes?

Tali 6:51

Yeah, when he breaks his hand or whatever

Cody 6:53

I mean, most of that movie's kinda tragic

Tali 6:55

Well, it is. It's just that- But- I don't know, that sound just kind of makes me sick. You know how they, like, split to the X-ray or view or whatever?

Cody 7:05

Yeah.

Tali 7:06

Yeah. Ugh.

Cody 7:07

But you don't get more iconic than Rocky. I mean, you just can't.

Tali 7:10

Mm-hmm.

Cody 7:11

Ever. Yeah. Like, he set the, he set the whole genre in motion, I think, of the, like, inspirational sport movie-

Tali 7:21

Mm

Cody 7:21

underdog kinda thing.

Tali 7:22

That one's worth watching every year. We- when we shop for posters that we wanna put around the gym, I always wanna have a Rocky- pop poster 'cause it's so inspiring. Yeah. It makes you get off the couch.

Cody 7:33

Yeah.

Tali 7:35

Okay. Did you take any notes for this? 'Cause I did.

Cody 7:37

I did not, but- Okay I just have a lot to say about it.

Tali 7:39

So at one time we had, like, 10 different things that you could measure for your, um, progress. Mm. And as I started to write them out, a lot of them overlap. So let's maybe start with some of the more obvious ones first. Most people come to us looking for strength gains. Mm. Let's start there, gaining strength, or maybe we can broaden that to performance in the gym. Go.

Cody 8:06

Well, uh, you just broadened it up a lot. That- Sorry that's a huge thing. So strength specifically, you know, we use the TrainHeroic app for now. Um, I'm not married to it, but it's good to track. You know, I- there's a saying, I'm not sure where, what it comes from, but it's, uh, you improve what you measure. That, so if you're measuring, if you're actually tracking your sets and your weights, uh, over time, you can see the progress. A lot of times people who don't track It's very consistent. Some people, it's like, "Well, I don't wanna be bothered with tracking, you know, I'm here to feel good," and, and they just kinda like come in and do the work and leave. Those people very consistently do not see their own progress, and we as coaches might see them, friends see them- Mm family sees them, and, uh, you can see three or four months down the road. But I actually wrote an article about this m- years ago, and I used the analogy of, uh, your own aging and your face. Like, you look at yourself every day in the mirror, uh, or most of us do, you know, uh, cleaning yourself up. Shaving, doing your hair, makeup, whatever, and because you see yourself every day, you don't see what others might see if they are, like, an old friend that hasn't seen you for five years, and they see a difference in you. And the same thing happens in the gym. If you're here working out every day and every day, and you're, you're really consistent and you're showing up and you're doing the work, but you're not tracking anything, you don't see some of the progress that's happening because you're just seeing this gradual thing, and that you're, you're becoming adapted to it.

Tali 9:42

Well, and with that comes the risk of maybe not seeing the progress that you want, right?

Cody 9:47

And that's what I'm saying, is that I've had pe-

Tali 9:49

Both, both can happen,

Cody 9:50

right? Yeah. I very consistently see people get discouraged if they don't track. I think it's so critical to track, and some people are really resistant to it, and as a coach, I'm like, "Well, you know, I'm still gonna accept you in my class, you know, I want you to do what you can do and, and try to meet you where you're at." But it's very frustrating to me, the people who refuse to ever track, because I know they're gonna get discouraged one day, and they're just gonna not understand the progress that I have seen in them as their coach. Yeah. So it's really important to me to track. Um, and maybe I go a little too far the other way. I probably track way more than I need to, but- Um, but with strength particularly, that's just a nice, like, objective number. Like, you can do what you can do, and that's one thing that's really cool about weightlifting is, like, the weights don't lie. Mm. Like, the kilos are the same for everyone, and- Yeah it may be relative to your strength what you can and can't do, but you can compare yourself to the past you and see exactly where you stack up, you

Tali 10:48

know? Well, and sometimes those numbers are, like, just the nudge you need to push the needle.

Cody 10:52

Mm-hmm.

Tali 10:53

Right? There, like you were saying, there are some people who kinda come in who are, um, just kind of content with, like, getting in the movement, calling it a day. But it might be important to, like- Uh, circle back to, like, why you came here, and tracking sometimes seeing what you did last time or a year ago, and being able to outperform that today is huge.

Cody 11:16

Yeah.

Tali 11:17

I just wanna give a shout-out today. I had, uh, Jen in class. She was the only one who was here at 7:00 AM, which, um, is funny because our 7:00 AM is either, like, overly full or the opposite. Mm-hmm. Like, we'll have just a couple of people, so it flip-flops a lot. But I just wanna throw a shout-out to Jen, who made a 10-kilo increase to her challenging three sumo deadlift today, uh, within A month and a half's time.

Cody 11:47

Yeah.

Tali 11:47

That's insane.

Cody 11:48

Yeah, that's cool.

Tali 11:49

That's huge.

Cody 11:50

Yeah.

Tali 11:50

Yeah, that was so much fun.

Cody 11:52

Looked really good, too.

Tali 11:53

It did look really good. And, you know, we were only able to make the choice that we did today based off of that tracking that we did.

Cody 12:01

Yeah.

Tali 12:01

Right?

Cody 12:02

Uh, Debbie was complaining that she didn't get a trophy, 'cause TrainHero gives you a little trophy- It- when you hit a new personal record.

Tali 12:08

Uh-huh.

Cody 12:08

And, uh, sometimes it glitches, but we're

Tali 12:10

also- It just lags

Cody 12:12

we're also new in the strength cycles, so- Mm-hmm we're kind of backtracking on stuff that we've done in the past. Mm. For some people, doing tempo work, they're not gonna get as heavy as they used to. So she was complaining about not getting a trophy and, uh, and, uh, Bill was like, "You know, we're only here for the trophies."

Tali 12:28

Yeah, that trophy can be addictive.

Cody 12:30

It was, it was really funny.

Tali 12:30

Um, yeah. So in that, we recommend that you track, and also write notes. Write notes to yourself about how that felt.

Cody 12:39

Yeah.

Tali 12:40

Right? If that last set of three felt like garbage, write that in, right? Even within, even if you match that number or get close to it, like, did it finish feeling better next time, or I had more in the tank.

Cody 12:51

Yeah.

Tali 12:51

All of that is super helpful.

Cody 12:53

I always try to explain to people that when we're taking notes, we're trying, we're sending a message to future you.

Tali 12:58

Mm-hmm.

Cody 12:59

Cause in a month or three weeks or whenever it is the next time you're gonna repeat that lift, you are not gonna remember this day. So you want those notes to not just be a tracking system, but also, like, an advisor. So I talk to myself, like I'll put in there, like, "You could do more next time." Yeah. Or, "You need to back off 'cause that was, uh, horrific," or something like that.

Tali 13:21

This conversation comes up a lot in Barbell Club because our, our lifting style is a little bit more, uh, technique-based or, uh, nuanced. And so, you know, the very first time you hit a certain-

Cody 13:34

Oh, you're more nuanced than the rest of us.

Tali 13:37

I'm just saying there's a lot more quality to pick apart, and so maybe the first time you hit a new number, you got there by the skin of your teeth, you know? Mm-hmm. You got lucky that all the stars aligned or whatever, you know, it's not always super pretty. And so it's a huge win when you're able to return to that weight and, like- Mm nail it. Yeah. And you weren't afraid of it, or, you know, you held onto your technique.

Cody 14:03

Oh, yeah.

Tali 14:03

Sometimes- A lot of times when people miss a lift that had excellent technique, I'm, like, praising them that, like, you committed all the way through.

Cody 14:11

Mm-hmm.

Tali 14:11

You know, having everything come together on the day is major.

Cody 14:15

Yeah.

Tali 14:15

You know? That's always tough about watching weightlifting sometimes, is that it's a good lift or a bad or a no lift, you know, there's no gray area. And sometimes the things that happen up there are dodgy- Yeah as hell.

Cody 14:27

Yeah.

Tali 14:27

But it counts.

Cody 14:28

Yeah, it

Tali 14:28

counts And I get that. I get the importance of that. But there is a benefit in measuring the quality of that lift too, right? It's not just your strength being applied, it's your experience. Yeah,

Cody 14:37

and you

Tali 14:38

can look at- And all those nuances

Cody 14:39

you can look at that, um, as a type of PR. So if- Yeah y- this kinda is starting to branch into the, the conversation that we're actually trying to have here, uh, that we're taking forever to get to. But the, uh-

Tali 14:50

Are we sidetracked?

Cody 14:51

The idea is, um, one measurement of a PR is you lifted more weight than you did before.

Tali 14:57

Yeah.

Cody 14:57

But another way to think of that is if you lifted the same weight you did before but it felt better, you know? Um, I look at that as a new personal record. Like-

Tali 15:05

And felt better means it felt lighter, it felt easier. Yeah. It didn't feel intimidating. Like- Right there are a lot of ways to approach a lift, and I mean, that's what we see, I would say, the most of, especially when these lifts are showing up again like this. Been there, done that. Like, you know what to expect, and that level of experience is huge. I hope no one discounts how important it is that you just have a level of familiarity with so many things at this point, so that if you walked into another gym, they said that we're gonna do sumo deadlifts, you have a frame of reference to build off of now.

Cody 15:39

Yeah.

Tali 15:40

Multiple times over.

Cody 15:41

Or it's just like a, a deadlift PR that is the same weight three times in a row, but the third time was, like, great form.

Tali 15:50

Mm-hmm.

Cody 15:50

And the first two were kind of dodgy. And it's like, I'm so excited about that third time hitting it because it's not the number that really is the victory, it's just, like, how, how well you managed the same weight.

Tali 16:03

So- Totally

Cody 16:03

yeah, so that's kind of another metric, I guess, we could look at is, uh, your form, positioning, how well you feel, the subjective feeling of what it was like to be able to hit that same number.

Tali 16:14

Well, maybe we should talk about what happens when that doesn't happen, right? Like, there are plenty of days where we're after the trophy and it does not come. This is where we wanna lean into the other areas-

Cody 16:26

Yeah

Tali 16:27

of, I mean, we could continue with performance, but the other areas of progress.

Cody 16:33

Mm-hmm.

Tali 16:33

Right?

Cody 16:34

Well, I think we, before we get totally off of performance, there's also other types of performance. So in- Yeah uh, peak fit or in, uh, shall we say GPP, general physical preparedness, there's like, uh- There's so many different metrics to look at. So we time workouts for, uh, basically work capacity in a very technical term, like work as in an engineering kind of physics m- m- way of using the term work. Uh, but that carries over to your cardiovascular capacity, your muscular stamina. And w- so you might not hit a new lifting record that week, but you, maybe you hit a new PR on a timed workout, or maybe you held an isometric hold lo- a plank longer than you did before, or your mobility has improved because you couldn't touch your toes and now you've got a knuckle of finger past, you know, your toes. And so there's so many different aspects of, quote-unquote, "performance"- Yeah that we can look at in a GPP program, which is part of the reason why I love training that way is because it's, uh, the main reason is 'cause it carries over to all the other aspects of your life, of course.

Tali 17:48

Yeah. Fit in all the areas.

Cody 17:49

And it, narrow training gets narrow results. So if you're only doing strength training, that's, you know, it does have spillover into a lot of benefit. But, um, you still gotta get the cardio in, and you still gotta do those other things that you may not enjoy as much. But the other side of that is not only does it benefit your life, but it also gives you just a lot of different data-

Tali 18:10

Yeah

Cody 18:11

to, to go after and not feel discouraged if one area is lagging sometimes for a long time. Especially the longer you train, the harder it gets to continue to make improvements. And so, uh, you have like a Donnie Shanklin story about that, don't you? About, uh- Donnie

Tali 18:29

Shankle?

Cody 18:30

Shankle, sorry. Who, who, uh, like he hit like a very tiny PR, but it took like two years or something like that to like add-

Tali 18:39

Oh, I think it took like six years.

Cody 18:41

Yeah. Y- yeah. So I was saying you had the story 'cause you, you told me about it. Well- But it was like

Tali 18:45

years weightlifting's also unique too because it's like- Yeah let's say you hit a new personal record in training, like how long will it be until you do that on the platform and then it counts- towards an official total. You know? Like there are lots of layers where that has to all happen multiple times, you know? I can think about the first time I ever hit 90 for my clean and jerk, and like how much longer it took after to do that in competition. Mm. And then be able to do that in competition on a national level stage. You know, there were like-

Cody 19:20

Funny, 'cause a lot

Tali 19:20

of- layers to the same goal right there

Cody 19:23

It's like there's two different types of personalities in weightlifting. There's people who PR on the stage.

Tali 19:27

Mm-hmm. And then some of us who don't.

Cody 19:30

And then there's people who come in and they dominate, but you got gas in the tank.

Tali 19:35

Well, I don't think it's a gas in the tank thing, I think it's an environmental thing. Like, I feel my best hanging in the gym with my friends, with the music, with the fun.

Cody 19:47

Mm.

Tali 19:47

Weightlifting meets are, like, way too serious for me. You know, I used to get a lot of criticism that I wasn't taking it seriously, and I understand the reasoning for it all, and like, but people can be kinda hostile sometimes in that situation. It's just not fun for me. So, um, that was something that I just kind of decided that, you know, I'm a local meet kinda girl. That's my thing. It's way more fun than the bigger stage-

Cody 20:15

Yeah for sure,

Tali 20:16

and then even more so training. Yeah. Anyway, um, so I just wanted to say one more thing about performance, 'cause you were saying how in our gym there's just so many areas to look at improvement just within our training-

Cody 20:32

Mm-hmm

Tali 20:32

uh, style, and this is why we have benchmark workouts. Mm-hmm. Um, my hope is that when we go into our next phase of, um- What's it called? Our next phase of programming that we get to maybe build some of our own benchmarks.

Cody 20:51

Yeah.

Tali 20:52

You know, we've been doing CrossFit benchmarks for so long, and, um, one thing is that I wanna be able to honor the members of our gym as inspiration, um, 'cause we feel like we've gotten to know so many of you so well. Um, and the reason that we come back to these benchmarks is that they've been longstanding. You and I have done them for a long time. A lot of other people out in the world have done them. So it just kind of connects us to a broader context of fitness, which I think is cool to be a part of. You know, it'll-- If someone asks you what your Fran time is, like, to have something to contribute's kind of cool, right? You're speaking the same language.

Cody 21:30

Yep.

Tali 21:31

Yeah.

Cody 21:31

What's your bench, bro?

Tali 21:33

Oh my gosh. How-- I get asked that all the time when it comes to- weightlifting. Like, when I would say that I'm a competitive weightlifter, that would always be the first question, and it'd be like, "Ha. That's actually not part of it at all."

Cody 21:44

Yeah.

Tali 21:44

Yeah.

Cody 21:45

Well, the s- the name is confusing. In everybody else's defense, if you're not into weightlifting as a sport, you don't understand that weightlifting, capital W, all one word, weightlifting, is a sport. But weight lifting as two separate words- Weight dash lifting yeah, is just lifting weights. And so, yeah, it's, uh... You can't blame the general public for not- No picking up on that. And powerlifting is-

Tali 22:11

Well-

Cody 22:12

H- powerlifting should be called weightlifting, and weightlifting should be called powerlifting.

Tali 22:17

That's actually a really good point.

Cody 22:19

Yes.

Tali 22:20

Yeah, I agree. Um, maybe it would be strength lifting. The reason I never say Olympic lifting is because then the follow-up question would be-

Cody 22:28

Did you go to the Olympics?

Tali 22:29

Yes. Yeah. And so then- you're like, "No, I definitely have not." So, um, yeah. That's why that whole conversation is a little bit funny. Uh, anything else you wanna say about performance?

Cody 22:42

Well, just as a segue to other forms of metrics is that sometimes, um Any metric can be a little bit deceiving because if, uh, if performance is lagging, that doesn't mean that your efforts are all squandered. And so that's why we have things like the InBody scan.

Tali 22:59

Yes.

Cody 23:00

So-

Tali 23:00

Well, let's go do that next.

Cody 23:01

Yeah.

Tali 23:01

Yeah. So, um, the InBody scanner, the reason that we have it is, um, it measures our body composition, and we love hearing that everybody is feeling better, doing better in their lives outside of the gym, and are capable of more things. Um, but for a lot of us, some real physiological changes is what we're after. Um, you know, strength was something that we just talked about, and, uh, muscle mass is a part of that same conversation. They're not synonymous, but we're able to measure changes in muscle mass, for the better or for the worse. And so body composition is another area that we can track, um, to see progress.

Cody 23:46

Yeah.

Tali 23:46

And let me tell y'all, just, like, without going too deep in the weeds right away, I just wanna say, like, your body being a living, breathing thing with so many, um, tasks and demands and circumstances that change every single day, it fluctuates. There's a lot of fluctuation. So I'm just gonna, like, let that be the preface to whatever we talk about next.

Cody 24:07

Yeah. Nothing is linear and perfectly organized, and there's- Or in a

Tali 24:12

vacuum

Cody 24:13

and there's very little permanence with anything. And so whether we're talking about a PR on a deadlift, like we just were, just because you PR'd last month doesn't mean you have that in the tank today. Uh, that was just that particular day. You can be in the region, you know, of that, but, uh, it's the same with body composition. Sometimes it's like, man, you have a stellar scan and your next one seems to backslide, but it's like, you know, sometimes there's just, like, these, these fluctuations that we can't really see unless you were scanning every morning for a year, then you would s- like see this really, really solid lines and patterns. But, uh, it's very difficult if you only have one or two data points to understand actually what's happening, unless it's a big dramatic change.

Tali 24:58

Um, I leave one of my old InBody scans in here just for reference, and it was a year that I did every single month.

Cody 25:05

Mm-hmm.

Tali 25:05

And it's really interesting to look at it because it looks like the data points are bouncing around all over the place, which they do, but the cool thing about looking at a year at a time is that you can see trends, right? Upward trend, consistent trending or downward trending. Um, and so it might feel like month to month like nothing's really happening or that the margins are tiny. Then you take a step back at the year and it's like, oh dang, like I went down 5% body fat or something, you know?

Cody 25:40

Yeah.

Tali 25:40

It's cool. It's cool, and I also bring it out when we do have those difficult scans to be like, "Hey, this is not representative of everything we're talking about today. Um, and we have to consider how far apart the data points are too. So that's something to really be aware of if you are thinking about scanning. I find myself encouraging people to do it more regularly if it is something that's important to you. You gotta get more information for it to really make good sense to us.

Cody 26:12

Yeah. If you're trying to avoid sarcopenia, which is muscle loss, age-related m- m- muscle loss, uh, or if you're trying to get to a leaner body composition, I think those scans really should be done monthly, at, at the very m- least quarterly.

Tali 26:29

Yeah.

Cody 26:30

Uh, and consistently, and just know that, like, one or two scans isn't gonna teach you much. You really have to have three, four, or five of them to really understand what's happening. Uh, 'cause yeah, same for me. I, you know, I'm trying to get leaner without losing muscle, so I don't really even care what the weight says, which is kinda something I think we should mention, that the whole point of the InBody is to get you off of the scale and stop obsessing over your weight, because weight is such a, a poor metric. We know this whole- It's too

Tali 27:03

vague a term.

Cody 27:04

Yeah. This whole conversation is just about, like, measures of progress, but as metrics are concerned, weight is a very terrible-

Tali 27:12

It's not

Cody 27:13

very useful metric- Yeah uh, for an individual. And BMI is basically a height- height to weight ratio. And so it's- And

Tali 27:20

one of those things you can't change.

Cody 27:21

Yeah, you can't change your height. Uh-

Tali 27:23

And then we just deemed the other one not that useful.

Cody 27:25

Uh, yeah. And so what happens is, what I try to explain to people is, like, if you're, if you're an insurance company and you're, uh, you know, health insurance or something, it makes sense if you have a million people and look at average BMI, then that data can be pretty strong. You know? Like, if you have a high BMI, you're more at risk for these diseases. But as an individual, it's almost completely useless because if you- Or as an

Tali 27:50

athlete.

Cody 27:51

That's what I'm saying. As an, any... No, any individual. Because if you are gaining muscle, you often gain weight, and height to weight ratio means your BMI is going up. Mm-hmm. Gaining muscle Unless you are really abusing steroids, that's about the only exception where gaining muscle could ever be detrimental in any way. There is no world where gaining muscle is a bad thing. No downside. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, even if it's increasing your BMI, that's not putting you at health risks. And so that's why I usually just tell people to cross that off, like we shouldn't even have it on there.

Tali 28:26

I usually cross it off for them. I'm like- Yeah "I'm doing this."

Cody 28:28

But the reason, uh, it is on there, just to clarify, is like sometimes this InBody scanner is used in large studies. Uh, and so it does make sense if you're looking at 1,000 people and you're correlating, you know, heart disease with body weight, you can see those trends matching, um, for the general public in a large cohort. But as an individual, it's totally pointless. So, eh.

Tali 28:55

Well, something

Cody 28:55

that I just wanna- Your scales don't mean

Tali 28:57

much I just wanna plug in for the InBody scanner if anybody is interested in doing this. And, you know, this is actually a service that we, we want to offer the public. It's not just for our members. They can, they can purchase scans too and have a coaching session with one of us. Um, the great thing about the InBody scanner is that it puts it into context of your age, height, and sex. And so the recommended, the recommendations and the parameters that it's talking about are all within the context of what's best for your frame, time of life, et cetera. It's not these huge broad terms of you should do this. Uh, if anything, I feel like it helps people identify what their composition goals are a little bit more realistically and a little bit more tailored to what is achievable for them, like what's gonna be safe and effective for you.

Cody 29:50

Yeah.

Tali 29:51

Yeah. So along with composition being a measure of progress, I put how you fit in your clothes.

Cody 29:58

Oh, yeah.

Tali 29:59

Yeah. I- it's not the same thing exactly, but I know for me, um, when I stop fitting into my clothes, that is when I really look at my life, right? 'Cause my, uh, my love for clothing runs deep and, um, you know, I like to collect clothing. Uh, and if I can't wear it, it's upsetting. And so, um, you know, noticing that my pants zip up more easily or, you know, I don't need your help to zip myself up into a dress, or I can... You know, you and I wear our wedding clothes or try to wear our wedding clothes every year on our anniversary.

Cody 30:37

Yeah.

Tali 30:37

And there were a couple years where they didn't fit.

Cody 30:39

Yeah.

Tali 30:40

Do you wanna tell us a story about-

Cody 30:43

Uh, when I split my pants?

Tali 30:45

Yes.

Cody 30:47

At a fancy restaurant. But I had a long coat, so it was fine. Yeah. Well- um, yeah, I think it's a- W- we all have things like that. It may not be the clothes, but it may be like, um, the thigh gap or the, you know- Oh,

Tali 31:07

yeah or- Well, that's one for me too

Cody 31:08

or yeah, when you sit down, like, are you bulging over the jeans or whatever it is. Like everyone's kind of got their- Can you reach your

Tali 31:14

shoelaces? We've heard that one before.

Cody 31:16

Uh, d- y- yeah, one that I've heard a lot and have experienced myself is, uh, do you hold your breath while you tie your shoes?

Tali 31:23

Oh, that's what it was. Yeah. Okay. I knew it had something to do with tying shoes.

Cody 31:26

Oh, yeah. Uh, 'cause I've been there. I've been heavy enough that I kinda like had to sit down and do like this figure four position to prop my foot up on my other knee.

Tali 31:36

Why do you have to hold your breath?

Cody 31:37

And then kinda like holding my breath because bending to reach my shoelace, I couldn't breathe.

Tali 31:43

Oh.

Cody 31:44

Cause there's too much fat in the way.

Tali 31:45

Oh.

Cody 31:46

Yeah.

Tali 31:46

Okay.

Cody 31:47

Um, so that's a victory when the-- when you don't have to do that.

Tali 31:51

Mm-hmm.

Cody 31:52

Uh, these days I don't sit down to tie my shoes at all. I try to stand on one foot and put my shoe on every d- Nice every day.

Tali 31:59

Are these your slip-on shoes? No, I'm kidding.

Cody 32:00

No, all my shoes.

Tali 32:02

Um, you know, I was just thinking, you have a few articles of clothing that you've had forever.

Cody 32:07

Mm-hmm.

Tali 32:07

Like over 20 years. And at times I've questioned like, well, why in the world do you still have that? Especially if you d- weren't like wearing it all the time. But there's a testament that you were able to wear them again, even still, like after all this time.

Cody 32:22

Yeah. My, my V-neck red shirt that you're talking about?

Tali 32:25

Yeah. I actually really-- I mean, I love that shirt on you. I really do. Um, I know for myself that if I'm not fitting in my clothes, unless it's something very sentimental or something that was vintage or very special, um, then I won't hang onto it or I'll, like, pass it along to your girls or something. Um, because to me, just having all these clothes sitting in my closet that I can't wear is maddening. So of all the measures of progress, honestly, that one's the most potent to me.

Cody 32:57

Yeah.

Tali 32:57

And then- Because for me, the training, if I have to take what is important to me outside of training, it's like living life well and being able to wear what I wanna wear is part of living life well to me.

Cody 33:10

Yeah.

Tali 33:11

Yeah.

Cody 33:12

Joint pain is a big one for me.

Tali 33:14

Okay. Um, do we wanna talk about recovery then?

Cody 33:18

Uh, sure, yeah. I- that's a pretty powerful metric actually.

Tali 33:22

And also broad.

Cody 33:23

Uh, it is broad, and it is, there is some objective data about this. I mean, the, the fitter you are, the f- the, uh, your ability to recover is a strong indication to your overall fitness level. So we can talk about whether that's soreness or stiffness or whatever, but, um, in real terms, we can also do instant recovery type of measurements. Like, if you exert yourself to a, say, zone two cardio, and then you sit, how long does it take you to get back to your resting heart rate?

Tali 33:55

Mm-hmm.

Cody 33:56

Cause if it's 30 seconds, a minute, minute and a half, um, that's indicating a higher stroke volume, so your heart is working more efficiently. If it takes you several minutes to come down to your resting heart rate, then that means your body's having to work a lot harder to supply the nutrients to those tissues that you had just worked.

Tali 34:15

Mm-hmm.

Cody 34:15

So, um, yeah, this is not just subjective. There's some real objective data when it comes to recovery.

Tali 34:22

Totally. And that, that's something that we also play around with in our more periodized programs, like RAT Pack and Barbell Club. Mm-hmm. Like, how well are you able to keep up with these percentages that we're prescribing? And the recovery aspect of that is, you know, are you able to come back swinging-

Cody 34:39

Mm-hmm

Tali 34:39

to perform at that level again or higher the next time we see you?

Cody 34:44

Yeah.

Tali 34:44

Yeah. Recovery's huge, and it can be perceived in lots of different ways. Um, you know, less technical, to me, the way I think about what we're doing in the gym and why we train the way that we do is you, you learn your body. Not only do you learn how to move it in lots of different ways, but over lots of different kinds of time domains, zones, like you were talking about, all these different ways of training your body. And so I s- feel like we start to build this sensitivity around like, "Oh, I know what-" heavy but still good feels like. I know how to push without toppling over the edge. Like, learning how to really make use of the stimulus and be able to regulate your body and still perform well, um, to me that's all kind of part of that same conversation, is like, do I have the wisdom to come back and, like, hit it just as hard? And I think recovery's a big part of that equation.

Cody 35:49

Yeah. Uh, there's a, another way to think about recovery that I think a lot of people can relate to, which is, uh, this is kind of like a, an edge case or like a more extreme example, but if you have back issues, a lot of times what we do in the gym actually feels good in the moment. Mm-hmm. You don't find out until, like, that night or the next morning when you wake up, and all of a sudden it's like your back is jacked up.

Tali 36:12

Yeah.

Cody 36:12

So-

Tali 36:13

Debilitating

Cody 36:14

sometimes yeah. So that's kind of another example of, like, if we see you recovering easier, like maybe you're not lifting more, maybe you're not doing more, maybe you're not changing anything about your workout, but you've been consistent long enough that you wake up without pain the next morning, that's a massive improvement and a very, um, tangible metric,

Tali 36:34

I think. Absolutely. Yeah. But I think it's easily missed. Like, if we don't prompt that question, like- Mm-hmm I have a handful of members that, like, I know to check in with them the next couple of days. Yeah. Or I even ask them, like, "Text me if this shows up for you over the next couple of days." Yeah. Whether it's back pain, headaches, that kind of stuff- Mm-hmm that tends to set in a little bit later.

Cody 36:56

Yeah. When we're testing movements, it's like it, the first test is, like, any acute pain in the moment. Yeah. Obviously, we're just gonna avoid any joint pain or acute pain in the moment. Uh, but I always tell people, it's like this is a 72-hour experiment. Like, we need to see how you feel over the next couple days before you start pushing the limits on this movement, even if it feels great right now.

Tali 37:16

Yeah.

Cody 37:16

Yeah.

Tali 37:17

Yeah. Um, it's an important thing to be aware of, um, and it's something I just find ourselves kind of educating people about. And the, the hope is to, to see, you know, good progress would be that we bounce back sooner and sooner each time.

Cody 37:30

Yeah.

Tali 37:31

Yeah. Yeah. Do you have any anec- anecdotes about that?

Cody 37:36

Anecdotes?

Tali 37:37

Yeah Stories

Cody 37:39

Stories about- Uh recovery?

Tali 37:41

Bouncing back faster- Well- or better, or maybe not

Cody 37:45

I mean, I, I think sometimes it gets construed with, uh, like the population that I work with with Rat Pack, or we work with, uh, with Rat Pack is, like, um, I think it presents itself as just more energy in da- daily life. They don't, they don't think of it as a faster recovery to their workout.

Tali 38:03

Mm-hmm.

Cody 38:04

But what we see is after three, six months, maybe sometimes a year, uh, that people are, are able to do more activities, whether it's golfing or hiking or, or cross-country skiing, like all these kind of activities, and they, they see that return. And part of that is an increase in strength and stability and capability from the training, but it may be very subtly missed that you're working out and doing those activities- Mm-hmm which means you're recovering faster from your workouts to be able to have the energy to go do stuff like that, so. Well,

Tali 38:36

and even to bring it in on a tighter timescale, like that same class this morning, I'm just gonna brag about Jen all day, um, we really pushed the deadlift. We took our time with it to make sure that we had all the right circumstances to really knock it out of the park, and, like, she worked hard- Mm at the end there. Like, it was not an... You know, I think we found the edge at the end there. Um, I hope she'll let me post the video. Um- And I had told her, we had 10 minutes left in class, and I was like, "You know what? You fought for that, and we met our goal and more. If you wanna call it a day, we can call it a day." Like, we still had a MetCon with, like, biking and running and lots of sit-ups, and she's like, "No, I'm good. I'm gonna go for it." And she crushed it.

Cody 39:21

Nice.

Tali 39:22

To be able to push yourself that hard physically on the strength-

Cody 39:26

Mm

Tali 39:26

and then be able to go crush it in the MetCon, she never took a break.

Cody 39:31

Awesome.

Tali 39:31

Again, that just shows, like, she recovered from hard work to do more hard work.

Cody 39:37

Yeah.

Tali 39:37

And then she went for a hike after.

Cody 39:39

Wow.

Tali 39:39

Yeah.

Cody 39:40

Rock star.

Tali 39:41

So she, she's an engine gal is what I learned today.

Cody 39:44

That's awesome.

Tali 39:44

Yeah. Well, she's gonna be- Yeah, I know if you think about, like, weightlifting me, it's like I'd sleep in the car.

Cody 39:49

Oh, yeah.

Tali 39:50

You know? Like, I'd be dead.

Cody 39:51

Yeah.

Tali 39:52

Done.

Cody 39:52

That one time, it was just... It's one of my favorite stories 'cause we, uh, we're gonna get food out of town, and we had a two... No, th- it was Corvallis to Portland, so whatever that is, two and a half, three hours.

Tali 40:04

Something like that.

Cody 40:04

Um, and we went from the college to the gas station, and I was- This was

Tali 40:10

Eugene then.

Cody 40:10

In Eugene. That was at our college. Yeah. Yeah. And I, uh, was filling up the tank to go home, and I got back in the car and you were asleep. We, we didn't even make it out of town.

Tali 40:19

Took a lot out of me.

Cody 40:20

Yeah.

Tali 40:21

Yeah.

Cody 40:23

Yeah. But, um- Uh, just quick footnote, like we already have had a podcast about consistency. It's probably one of the first ones we did because it's so important, but-

Tali 40:35

We'll circle back around

Cody 40:36

to this- All of these

Tali 40:37

met- so many more

Cody 40:37

times, I'm sure All of these metrics that we're talking about, and the s- especially the specific, uh, stories that we're talking about with specific people that we've mentioned so far, it, they're just always, it's a testament to their consistency.

Tali 40:49

Yeah.

Cody 40:49

You know, Jen has been really consistent, and- Oh, yeah they have made the effort to be here. Oh, yeah.

Tali 40:53

It's not an accident by any means. Yeah. None of it will be an accident.

Cody 40:56

Yeah. And so it's not just like a training session. Like we're talking about a consistent practice here, and that's where all these metrics really... There's always a, a positive metric to pull from with all this variety of metrics when we see consistency.

Tali 41:11

Well, and I think a reason that we wanted to talk about this is that consistency is hard to keep up because, like you said, we're not always operating at 100% every day that we walk into the gym. Mm. And life has a lot of demands that we can make a million excuses not to walk through that door. And even when we do walk through that door, we think we could've done better, or I used to be stronger, or why is this so hard for me today?

Cody 41:37

Mm.

Tali 41:37

And these are just some things to look through as like, oh yeah, there is some movement there, or there is some positive correlation happening there. Because training can be discouraging, but let me just remind you, that's kind of the point in a way. Like we are all seeking to challenge ourselves, and challenging means you're gonna meet failure regularly. Yeah. Yeah. And that's why it's good for you, not just physically, but as a person too.

Cody 42:07

Yeah. Yeah. When you feel like you're stalling out, it's the my favorite metric is your consistency, your willingness to show up. Yeah. Like, um, if, if we ever, in fact we do, we reward people for attendance, uh- Yes every year. You know, top attendee, attendees in the gym get a new pair of kicks. And, uh, we do that because that's the metric that matters more than anything.

Tali 42:33

True.

Cody 42:34

Really.

Tali 42:35

Yeah.

Cody 42:35

Showing up.

Tali 42:36

I didn't even write that down.

Cody 42:37

I know. I, I didn't really think about that before, 'cause we've had a whole podcast on consistency. Sure. But it's just like- It

Tali 42:42

deserves it

Cody 42:42

but you should give yourself the reward of knowing that I showed up. Like, even if the weight isn't improving, maybe your MetCon scores aren't improving, and you just feel like you're stalling out, you're showing up, and you should give yourself credit for like, "Hey, I got, you know, eight workouts in at the gym this week, and I went on s- three hikes, and I did this home..." You know, like add up all the s- the work you put in and give yourself kudos whether you got the result you wanted or not.

Tali 43:09

Yeah. You're keeping- Yeah that boulder moving.

Cody 43:11

Yeah.

Tali 43:11

Right? There's no more difficult place than to have to restart-

Cody 43:17

Yeah

Tali 43:17

from scratch.

Cody 43:18

And that consistency over the long term will move the other metrics that you're looking for.

Tali 43:22

Totally. It will all come together- Yeah for sure. Um, the last one that I wrote in here was energy and mood levels. Um, also kind of broad, but, um, being able to notice, like how do you feel when you leave the gym?

Cody 43:39

Mm.

Tali 43:39

How do you feel on the days that you don't go to the gym?

Cody 43:42

Mm-hmm.

Tali 43:42

I know that when you and I have too much downtime I kind of mentally spiral.

Cody 43:49

Mm-hmm.

Tali 43:50

Um, and as soon as I get to moving intentionally, even if it's for 10 minutes, um, I instantly feel like my whole life has changed. Yeah. I just feel more optimistic. Things don't bother me as much. Mm-hmm. All that thing that person said doesn't matter anymore. Yeah. Like, how, how has your mood been? How, how... I don't even know if this would fall into the same category, but, like, how prepared do you feel to, like, chal- challenge yourself- Yeah in other arenas?

Cody 44:20

Mm-hmm.

Tali 44:21

I really sincerely believe that, like, the gym changes you as a person. Mm-hmm. Not just how you look or how you can physically perform, but, like, what happens to you, um, in the neural pathways of the way that you interact with people or see the world or whatever it is-

Cody 44:37

Yeah

Tali 44:37

really changes-

Cody 44:39

Yeah

Tali 44:39

because of what I just said. Like, you're willingly challenging yourself every day.

Cody 44:43

And how you take on adversity, you know? Um, I think we have a culture, um, you know, we don't, we, we try not to s- ever slide into politics in, in our gym in any way, but we, I think we have a culture where, uh, there's sometimes so much emphasis on, um, disenfranchised or victim- victimized people, uh, that sometimes we get into, uh, a mindset of the world coming at us. You know, things are happening to us. Mm-hmm. And I think the gym is this defining line that I see with people who n- don't accept that. It's like, "No, I, I also happen to the world." Yes, things happen to people, things that they don't deserve, that, and life isn't always fair, but also I am also happening to the world. Like, I have some- Pushing back a- ability to, yeah, push back or to take on the challenge or to accept the thing that's bad that's coming at me and not, uh, break.

Tali 45:41

Yeah.

Cody 45:42

Yeah. I can either absorb it or bounce back or whatever it

Tali 45:45

takes. I got chills, honey, and it's so hot in here.

Cody 45:49

So, uh, yeah, I think that's probably the thing I love about the gym the most is it's this, um, philosophical foundation for almost everything that we, h- how we live our lives and how we relate to other people and-

Tali 46:01

Totally.

Cody 46:01

Yeah.

Tali 46:02

I would say that a big reason that I wanted to work with preteens and teenagers is that I always wish that I got started in this kind of work sooner.

Cody 46:11

Mm-hmm.

Tali 46:11

You know, I started when I was 19, and I still feel like that was too late, but if I was 13 and lifting weights and feeling like a badass then-

Cody 46:19

Yeah

Tali 46:19

to think about all the things that influenced me negatively at the time, I'd be like, "Who cares? I can out-lift you any day." Yeah. Or, like, not even you, but, like, I can do that thing. You know, you build, you build confidence and integrity with yourself in the gym.

Cody 46:36

Yeah. Yeah.

Tali 46:36

You know? There's, uh, there's not a lot of other arenas in adulthood where you get that.

Cody 46:43

Yeah. And I think there's value in that there's a self-imposed aspect of it.

Tali 46:48

Yeah.

Cody 46:49

Cause you're doing something hard and you're choosing to do something hard, and that's just a whole other level than just, like, being strong enough to take on things that are coming at you. It's like you've chose the hard path, and there's, there's also its own reward just in that, and that it just kind of bolsters you up for the things that you don't choose, you know, the things that do come at you that y- you didn't choose.

Tali 47:11

Yeah, you know, yesterday I had a lot of appreciation for, um skill acquisition. Um, I had performed that workout that Wednesday and Thursday, did the really short 10-minute, 10 rounds for time of the pull-ups and double unders.

Cody 47:29

Mm-hmm.

Tali 47:30

I chose to do ring rows, which were really effing hard. I'll tell you that. Yeah. That was the hardest part of the whole workout, um, to do 50 of those. But the double unders, like, getting every set of 10 unbroken, which is something that I think I would normally take for granted, but there was something that I was feeling just, like, really emotional about in the moment, being like, "Yeah, still got this." Mm-hmm. Or like, I took the time at one point in life to tackle this skill. Yeah. Like, I gave myself s- myself shin splints trying to learn-

Cody 48:02

Mm-hmm

Tali 48:02

double unders, 'cause I was so committed to learning everything when I was young and excited about it all. Um, and so there was just something really sweet about that moment being like, oh yeah, like, I thank myself all the time for having done this.

Cody 48:18

Yeah.

Tali 48:19

And still being at it.

Cody 48:21

That's awesome.

Tali 48:21

Even though it looks so different, right? Yeah. It looks so different- Oh, yeah than the first time around or when I was 20.

Cody 48:27

Or, or the second time around, yeah.

Tali 48:28

Totally.

Cody 48:30

Mm-hmm. Yeah. I- it's funny that you bring up double unders, 'cause I, I still remember getting double unders. Like, uh, there's a lot of different skills that we've picked up over the years of coaching and, and being involved in this, but I remember what it was like to not be able to do them and then do them. I was already a coach. Like, I kinda started backwards. I started teaching other people before I did anything myself, so.

Tali 48:54

Mm-hmm.

Cody 48:55

But I remember developing that skill. So guess another metric that we can look at is, like, skill acquisition. And, um-

Tali 49:02

Yeah. What

Cody 49:03

can

Tali 49:03

you do now that you could not do?

Cody 49:05

Yeah.

Tali 49:05

I think it's easy to glaze over that one too- Mm-hmm because we're kind of, like, swimming in that water, and there's also this expectation that we should know how to do everything already. Yeah. You know, I can't tell you how many times people tell me, like, "Oh, I can't join CrossFit because I don't know how to do anything yet." And I'm like, where do you think we all learned it?

Cody 49:23

Yeah.

Tali 49:23

Right? This is the classroom. This is the lab- Yeah where that all takes place. And so, um, yeah. There's something so cool about it. And I still have a lot of things to still learn.

Cody 49:35

Yeah.

Tali 49:35

Yeah.

Cody 49:36

Oh, yeah. No.

Tali 49:36

It never ends.

Cody 49:37

Never ends. It just gets to be a deeper hole.

Tali 49:39

Yeah.

Cody 49:39

Mm-hmm.

Tali 49:40

Anything that you are chasing after skill-wise?

Cody 49:45

Hmm. Well, I think- Not so much skill-wise at the moment. Uh, I am planning on getting back to handstand skills.

Tali 49:57

Okay, so re-

Cody 49:58

Um

Tali 49:59

acquiring a skill?

Cody 50:00

Yeah, reacquiring handstands. That

Tali 50:01

happens, everybody, just so you know. If you put things on the shelf too long, you have to relearn them.

Cody 50:06

Yeah, m- uh, m- there are many- many perishable skills. Yes. Not everything is like riding a bike. But, um-

Tali 50:13

Such a stupid saying.

Cody 50:15

Uh, muscle-ups is definitely something I've actually actively been working on. I think I'm getting pretty close. Okay. Bo- body weight has a lot to do with that.

Tali 50:23

Yeah,

Cody 50:23

it does. Uh, and, uh, muscle-ups and handstands, but I've been, uh, more focused on mobility drills right now, 'cause I want to be... I wanna have healthier joints, and have experienced a lot of pain in the last few years, and tendinopathies that I am sick and tired of dealing with. So, uh, yeah, working on mobility and, like, joint, joint health is kind of a big focus for me right now.

Tali 50:52

Yeah, it's an important one. Yeah. Um, I was talking to Coach Joel the other day. Um, you know, we were looking-- we were watching some other weightlifters on TV and, you know, some of their mobility abilities are just wild. I think we were watching Chinese lifters, which is, you know, really top tier there. And, um- It kinda dawned on him that he really wanted to put more effort into his mobility. Mm-hmm. And awesomely, like, even just doing the sport takes it so far already. Oh,

Cody 51:22

yeah.

Tali 51:23

But then of course, like, the added layer of attention- Mm is gonna go e- way further.

Cody 51:29

Yeah.

Tali 51:29

Um, a skill that I have been kind of flirting with, um, are bar muscle ups.

Cody 51:36

Cool. Yeah.

Tali 51:37

I have a huge hangup, though.

Cody 51:39

Hmm.

Tali 51:39

It's really high off the ground.

Cody 51:41

It is.

Tali 51:42

You- It's really scary.

Cody 51:43

The first time I ever did a ring muscle up, I- that's what I found, is I got to the top and I was like, "Yeah, cool." And then I looked down and I was like, "Oh, shit- I'm like way up here."

Tali 51:51

That's what I'm worried about, is the oh shit moment, and, like, just making sure that I don't, like, fall forward or something. Mm-hmm. I know that won't happen, but I, you know, when it comes to a new skill, there's, like, all these irrational fears that show up. But I've been watching lots and lots and lots of coaching videos around it, and just lots of different kinds of drills, and kind of sifting through what I think is gonna be the most useful.

Cody 52:14

Mm-hmm.

Tali 52:14

Um-

Cody 52:15

This is a perfect example of what we started this conversation with, which is- Is it? that it, like, if my goal, quote unquote, is to get back to doing a ring muscle up, in the pursuit of that, I have also, uh, strengthened m- my wrists- Mm because I was getting there for a while on any pressing movement, um, you know, l- like two years ago, I would always grab wrist wraps, always, because I'd get these little electric shocks in my wrists, and it's like, man, I don't wanna, I don't want more tendonitis, so I would wrap them, and then keep training. Well, as a result of pursuing the ring muscle up, I've been working on the false grip, and doing these, like, drills with the rings, and doing the ITYW with the six-way wrist thing that I, uh, came up with- Mm, mm-hmm

Tali 53:04

with the bands. I love that drill.

Cody 53:05

And I do that before every single workout. And now I have not had a wrist electric shock for at least six months.

Tali 53:12

Okay.

Cody 53:12

Like, at all.

Tali 53:13

So you're tracking pain,

Cody 53:14

right? So that... Yeah, so that's the, the point I'm trying to get at, is, like, the metric or the goal is the muscle up, but there's all these other metrics that I can also point to that's like, just the pursuit of that thing, even if I haven't achieved it yet- Mm the pursuit is bringing in all these other benefits that can't be taken for granted.

Tali 53:33

Yeah.

Cody 53:33

You know?

Tali 53:34

Most definitely.

Cody 53:35

Yeah.

Tali 53:35

Well, I think a good place to maybe end this conversation is for everybody to start thinking about what their current goals are. Maybe that's still in alignment with what you told us the first day that you sat down in this office, uh, with us was. And then what would be the maybe more obvious- measures of progress there, and then maybe think about maybe what the le- the less obvious ones might be.

Cody 53:58

Yeah.

Tali 53:59

What are some really cool byproducts that are coming from this effort? Yeah.

Cody 54:03

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I, I think we should be careful not to have, like, opposing goals. You know, if somebody's going to a weightlifting competition, uh, they probably shouldn't be training like a marathoner. You know, they wanna train like a weightlifter. So there's, like, specific specificity there. Um, but even within that, you can look at other metrics that can still complement your primary objective. So i- if you're in the weightlifting example, for instance, if you are leaner but retaining muscle, you could be in a lower weight class, which could put you at an advantage- Yeah to your weightlifting, uh, competition. You know, like, so there's, there's other ways of looking at these various metrics that are still in alignment with your primary, uh, goal.

Tali 54:45

Well, and if those metrics are working in the opposite direction than you are wanting, that might mean that we have to reassess what we're doing.

Cody 54:52

Yeah.

Tali 54:52

Right? Yeah. That does happen.

Cody 54:54

Yes.

Tali 54:54

Right? My sleep is getting worse. My stress is higher.

Cody 54:58

Yeah. There's a lot of value- My energy is bad. Yeah. Yeah. We've kind of been all this whole conversation- talking, talking about positive metrics.

Tali 55:04

Well, isn't that how coaching goes? Yeah. We're always trying to, like, steer towards the positive outcome- Yeah as opposed to pointing out the, the negative whatever- Yeah is going on. Yeah. Yeah.

Cody 55:15

But it is important to know that, uh- Such a coaching thing even a negative trend, e- a negative trend is still kind of a victory because you've learned something, hopefully.

Tali 55:22

Oh, yeah. It's useful, right? Yeah. It's useful data.

Cody 55:25

Yeah.

Tali 55:26

As is the InBody. I think that that's what makes it so interesting is that it's just, it is what it is. It's black and white. Yeah. You can't argue with it.

Cody 55:34

Yep.

Tali 55:34

Yeah. Yeah.

Cody 55:36

Cool. Well, I've enjoyed this conversation.

Tali 55:39

Yeah, I'm glad that- It's- like, fourth time's the charm. Yeah. We did it.

Cody 55:42

Let's see if I can get it uploaded before- Okay something happens. And once it's uploaded, we'll know we were victorious finally.

Tali 55:48

All right. Hurry. Let's not jinx it.

Cody 55:50

Fourth time's a charm. All right.