Dad Bod, Big Heart, Spectrum Smart with Brad and Nathan

This episode of "The Polaris Connection" podcast focuses on the role of fathers in parenting, particularly in families with autistic children. The hosts discuss the common perception that mothers are more involved in the care of autistic children and emphasize the importance of fathers being actively engaged. They explore topics such as the difference between responding and reacting, the significance of understanding rather than trying to "fix" children, and the unique roles fathers play in providing emotional support and play.

The episode highlights the importance of acceptance and understanding in parenting, encouraging fathers to connect with their children through play and intentional involvement. The hosts share personal anecdotes and humor, including dad jokes, to illustrate their points and make the conversation engaging. They also discuss studies that show the positive impact of involved fathers on children's empathy and social relationships.

Overall, the episode aims to motivate fathers to be more intentional and engaged in their parenting roles, emphasizing the value of connection, play, and understanding in fostering healthy family dynamics.

Share this episode with a father who works hard on being there for his kids.

Follow us on Instagram at PolarisAcademySocial and reach us at Info@PolarisAcademy.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Hello everyone and welcome to the Players Connection, your podcast that connects parents of autistic kids with industry expert and proven results. I am your host, Brad Bluez, and I'm here with my larger-than-life Dadzilla, co-host Nathan Palmer.

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Brad, but if there is one title I will own and wear proudly for the rest of my life, it is that of being a dad. I don't know about dadzilla. I like daddy but I'll take dad any day of the week, twice on Sunday.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

The great thing about my co-host Nathan Palmer is that you're proof that you just that you don't need a plan, just confidence. That's all you need.

SPEAKER_01 0:39

Love it.

SPEAKER_00 0:40

You know, hey Nathan, let me ask you, what do you call a bear with no teeth?

SPEAKER_01 0:45

Hang on. Are we jumping into dad jokes?

SPEAKER_00 0:47

We're going to dad jokes.

SPEAKER_01 0:49

I don't know, Brad. What do you call a bear with no teeth?

SPEAKER_00 0:52

A gummy bear.

SPEAKER_01 0:56

And on that note, boom. Well, listen, today I think you're going through all the dad stuff because our topic today is dads.

SPEAKER_00 1:05

It is, yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:06

It's something that I've been wanting to talk about for a while. Um, you know, it's funny. When we started this whole uh journey into the world of caring for autistic students and just neurodivergence, I can't tell you, Brad, how many people I've met and done tours with. And one of the most common things I hear is, well, it's my wife that does all that stuff. Or, well, you know, ask my wife because she kind of does that. And on these tours, we meet families looking for services. I'd say 80 plus percent of the time, it's the wife that shows up, not the husband or the mom. And so, you know, and listen, this is not this is not an attack on dads. I wanted this to be an opportunity for dads to know how to show up and support in ways that maybe they hadn't considered.

SPEAKER_00 1:47

Correct. And it's probably maybe the wife that's saying, hey, honey, you want to listen to this episode. I always say, you know, there's that common joke. Remember on uh oh um uh my my big fat Greek wedding says how the husband's ahead of the family, but the wife is the neck, you know, and so sometimes we just like, you know, wives kind of steer their husbands a little bit of like, hey, you probably want to listen to that. And that's kind of like our direction today is that, you know, working with Polaris Academy, you know, it is interesting that, like you said, we want the wives, we always tend to look at the wives, but there's a big part there with that the dad needs to play, and that's our topic today.

SPEAKER_01 2:29

Yeah, and listen, if you're a single uh parent household, you know, that's okay. The stuff we're gonna talk about today really still applies. It it we're gonna get into relationships, we're gonna get into parenting styles, play styles, and even some some data, some clinical data to back up different approaches to parenting. So listen, if you're a single, single parent household, listen still, um there are uncles out there, there are grandparents, there are And we talk about the village. We do, we do talk about a village. And so everything we talk about today, don't take this as a, oh no, I don't have that in my home. Think of these as ways to gap fill or maybe even change some of your approaches in play and how you relate with your kids that might just influence that that dynamic. So correct.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

And we want this to sp like spur like how how can I gap fill this within my own family, within my own village, with the resources that I have around me that can best support our autistic kiddos.

SPEAKER_01 3:22

Well, now you're you kind of want me to tell some more jokes. I I had one lined up, but it got out of order and I need to line it back up again.

SPEAKER_00 3:28

So what you're out of order? Neurodivergence joke. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

My favorite is still the date, and listen, I have a few others you might walked into that.

SPEAKER_00 3:37

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 3:38

I I'm dry, they go quick, and if you miss it, just hit rewind. One of my favorites, though, and I think I shared it on another episode, but it bears repeating. My my son told it to me. It's my favorite neurodivergent joke ever. He says, Dad, I went to the doctor the other day, and and I don't know what an HD is, but my doctor says I've got 80 of them. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 4:00

And I love how your kid came up with that.

SPEAKER_01 4:03

It was great. All right, so so listen, some some pieces of advice. I'm gonna just start right at the top and then we'll kind of work our way through. Um, one thing that I wish I could have told my younger self when I first found out I had a child on the spectrum was don't try to fix your kid. Um you hear that a lot. And this is general even relationship advice. You know, like I don't care how many relationship books you read, they all in some way, shape, or form say your wife isn't a problem to fix. They want to be heard, they want to be understood and accepted, but don't try to fix them.

SPEAKER_00 4:34

You know, and I always run into that trap. I know that's more of a relationship thing, but my wife will come up with a situation. I always want to fix it right away.

SPEAKER_01 4:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

And you see your family, you want to fix it real quick.

SPEAKER_01 4:44

Yeah, and listen, it's nothing, it's how we're wired. And there have been lots of studies on this, and you even think about how we play when we're young. So, like, if if Brad, you've done a lot of sports. We we kind of we kind of call Brad Sport, you know, coach Brad. He's got a big football background. But think about it. When we were kids, right, and we'd play games. If there was a kid that was upset because maybe he wasn't getting as much time or a turn, we wouldn't go try to coddle him or understand his feelings. We'd go, oh, give Jimmy the ball next time. Let's just play and let's just keep playing. Right. Right. We we'd try to, if there's something that got in the way of the activity, we just want to fix it and get it out of the way so we can keep moving on with the activity. Correct. Contrast that with girls at play. When one of them gets upset, they don't try to solve the problem so they can continue with the activity. They want to understand, well, why are you upset? Tell me more. I want to hear more about that. And so it's just in dynamics of how we're raised. And so, as dads, listen, you're you're if you're out there and and your first inclination is my kid gets a diagnosis, how do I fix this problem? You're not alone. It's how we all kind of approach it. But I I can tell you from experience, there's nothing to fix. And the more you try to fix it and the more you try to treat it as a problem, the more your child becomes the problem, the more your relationship gets estranged, the more they feel like they're not good enough and not accepted, and the more you tend to not accept them. And so instead of thinking of them as a problem to fix, just think of them as someone to understand and make it your mission to understand all those unique things about your child.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

Well, and Nathan, I'm glad you brought this up. We talk to a lot of parents at Polaris, and just in general, and we and most fathers and most and and I'm again, this is more catered to the men, right? Once they realize that I don't need to fix my child and I just understand them and I just want to be with them, all of a sudden their mind shifts and they open up of now. I can actually become a you know, I can connect with my child to where before here I am trying to fix them, as that's my way to connect with them. To where if I just accept them and just be open to it, now I can find opportunities to connect with our kids.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

Yeah. And listen, it it's it's down to your style as parenting. When you're cut when your child cries, you want to go, what's wrong? How do I fix it? versus, hey, tell me more about why you're crying, what you're feeling. And it's it that, you know, we call this the Polaris Connection. Um, this advice is as true for any relationship with a spouse as it is for a child, but it is about connection. It is about understanding and plugging in versus just your role of how do I make this go away?

SPEAKER_00 7:20

Well, and and as fathers, again, again, we're talking about men for the moment, so we want to just do a quick discipline. We see something wrong, boom, we're gonna discipline that. Let's make it right. We're gonna make that right. We're gonna, you know, sit up in your chair and hey, we're gonna make this to where, and I know you're gonna get to this of responding versus reacting. Yeah. To where we, you know, as men, sometimes we react so fast. I know I do that as a coach or as a father. I see something wrong, boom, I want to react. I'm a Nick Saban, I'm gonna jump in there and hey, Bill Belichick, this, we're gonna, we're gonna fix this right away, and you're gonna run the right route. To where it's a little bit different with autistic kids.

SPEAKER_01 8:02

It's a lot of it different. And Brad, I I I did what everybody did when the diagnosis came through. I I went online and I started educating myself, or at least I thought I did. What what I was really doing was I was looking for an out. It's like, okay, what's the end game look like? How how do I what are all the resources? And I looked at the therapy and and the interventions as a way to unprogram autism, as a way to remove it from my life or to mitigate it the best way that I could. And man, it's like trying to shape water. You you can't. And so I will tell you that the the this burden went off when autism became an opportunity, like you said, to connect, to understand him better. Um, to look at my son not as somebody that had something wrong, but as a child that was just different and different in a way that I didn't understand yet because I kept trying to fix it. Like I kept trying to separate the autism from my son. Does that make sense? And when I finally combined it, no, my my son is autistic and he's on the spectrum. That that's that is him. It changed to okay, this is this is not something I need to fix. This is someone I need to accept, this is something I can embrace. And and it was in that that I discovered and it's I it's so weird to hear this now, all the blessings that come out of an neurodivergent child.

SPEAKER_00 9:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:27

Um and and you you listen, if you're the early stages, I say the word blessing, you're like, what are you talking about? This is work, and it is. It's it's a lot parenting in general is a lot of work. But there are blessings that came out of that relationship with my son that I would have never had with my other kids.

SPEAKER_00 9:41

Well, and that's kind of like the first step is acceptance. You just gotta accept and love your child for who they are. Yeah, you know, and that's you know, uh, and and it's hard sometimes, especially with men. We have this idea of what our children should be, like, especially with boys. You're like, okay, my boy is gonna be this, you know, whatever, fill in the gap. And that's what I want my son to be like, right? And it's and it's hard when you realize that, hey, your child's not gonna do that. You know, it's gonna be different now. And uh and you have to adapt to it. So step number one is really to accept and love your child for who it is. And I know that might sound you know simplistic or seems obvious, but we do fight that.

SPEAKER_01 10:24

We do, we do, and that goes to your point. You know, you you hinted on kind of the next area I wanted to go into, and that's responding versus reacting. Um, it is so easy. It is so easy as a parent, especially as a dad, to be reactive in special needs. So easy because nine times out of 10, you're not getting the expected response. You're not getting what you want or what you expected. And and think that about this for just a second, Brad. Like, what do you what do you do? Like, if if there's something you want and you don't get it, like you you don't get your way or you don't get what you want, how do you react?

SPEAKER_00 10:54

Like, what's your typical reaction as a 40-year-old man or as a 12-year-old?

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Let's do both, because I have a feeling there's a parallel.

SPEAKER_00 11:02

So if I don't get what I want, typically either I push back somehow, shut down. Okay, either fight for it or I'm gonna shut down flight.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

Okay, now was this 12 or 40?

SPEAKER_00 11:13

Um both.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

Okay, that's that that's what I thought, right? And so here's the thing. If you asked, what about your dad? When he didn't get what he wanted, what did he do?

SPEAKER_00 11:24

Oh man, he always got what he wanted.

SPEAKER_01 11:27

It seems like it.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

It seems like it, you know. Um, you know, uh I don't know, like what does he? I would just say, I think he would just either probably the same thing. He'd probably argue for it, or he'd probably just turn away and say, all right, you guys are stupid, I'm out.

SPEAKER_01 11:40

So right. So there's there's there's this thing we talk about, and and it's it's overused sometimes, but it's the fight or flight response, right? When we don't get what we want, typically we get triggered. Um now, as men, we don't like to talk about emotions a lot a whole lot. I can tell you I was emotionally constipated for most of my adult life as a man. I use that term kind of loosely, but I and this this is funny. I'd never really processed the idea that emotions are body sensations. They call them feelings because they're things you actually feel in your body. I always took a more intellectual approach to feelings, like anger is a state of mind, and sadness is it-prised me that you would do that. Well, listen, I live in my head a lot, and so I I still like remember like reading these descriptions of where you feel anger versus where you feel sadness. I'm like, wait, what? I'd never paid attention to that before. And if you haven't before, look into it. Emotions are feelings because they feel, they literally feel certain ways. And when you reflect on what you don't get, what you want, pay attention to your patterns because you're teaching those. And nine times out of ten, what you do is a reaction, right? It's it's a pre-programmed thing that your subconscious and your nervous system has already learned how to do. I don't get what I want, and so I shut down, or I defend, or I fight back, or I get passive aggressive, or I try to manipulate. I mean, there's a myriad of things out there. And then now look at your kids and pay attention to what do they do when they don't get what they want, and how do you react to them?

SPEAKER_00 13:13

That's a that's an awesome point. And then, you know, we always talk about that behavior is communication. So if you think about the behavior that maybe I'm penetrating, like what am I giving out? You know, and then how does that trigger them? And then what behavior are they doing, and what did I do to trigger that, if any, yep, and then how do I adapt to that?

SPEAKER_01 13:35

So the difference between a response and reaction is one is is intentional and the other's programmed. Right? So you're you're right, our communication to our body goes two ways. Our brain tells our body what to do, but just as frequently our body and our nervous system tells our brain what to do. And that's hard to digest for a second, but if you think about it, when you get reactive, when you get mad, you're not you're not thinking strategically. Your limbic brain's taking over, you're in fight or flight, you just react, right? So there's there's two ways of communicating.

SPEAKER_00 14:05

So then let me ask you this, Nathan. Uh growing up with an aut, you know, having an autistic son for the last what 12 years, how do you control yourself so you're not always reacting to what you're like almost causing the problem?

SPEAKER_01 14:18

Best way I've found, and I'm not perfect at it by any stretch, but best way I found is to just ask the question, why are they doing this?

SPEAKER_00 14:27

And to not ask that question internally to myself.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

No, I well, okay. I I could ask them, but Brad, when you're when you're triggered, you're not gonna consciously be able to give me a cohesive answer. Well, dad, I'm doing this because my I'm in a heightened, elevated state of my nervous system and my habit tick over. I mean, it's they're not gonna be able to do that. But my job, my job as a parent is to understand. And if I can't in my head give a logical reason why what they're doing is making sense, then I don't fully understand. And then let me say that one more time. If I can't make sense of their behavior, where in my head I can go, oh, it's completely reasonable why they're doing what they're doing right now, I get it, then I don't yet understand. And our frustration as dads comes in, why are you doing this? Why why can't you just do that? Why I don't get it. But and so out of that space of we don't understand, we get reactive. Why? Because we have a different expectation or a different belief system that they should have, right? That we're trying to impose and force on them. And so what do they do? The same thing we're modeling. No, you don't understand. And they try to impose it back on us, and now we're in a clash of wills. And so, how do we try to win that? Well, we're dad, and so we take this authoritative stance. So, what do they do? They fight back. We're just modeling reactive behavior. And if we're gonna change the pattern, even in a neurodivergent child, especially in a neurodivergent child, we have to understand where they're at. And that that's where it can take some work. See, neurodiversity is an opportunity to really take a lot of unique paths of understanding. Because in their world, the fluorescent lights might be the equivalent of a thunderstorm.

SPEAKER_00 16:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:11

And or or like nails on a chalkboard or chewing on cotton swab balls or whatever sensory thing that you might make your cringe, right? And until we can get into a headspace where we can say, Oh, if I were in your shoes having this experience, I could see exactly why you're acting the way you are. We are not in a position to respond appropriately. Now, once we're in that space and we can understand, at that point, we can now intentionally parent and choose to be with them, understand them, and help to guide them back out of it.

SPEAKER_00 16:48

Yeah. Well, and and it seems like it's a lot of experimenting. Yeah. You just kind of have to be open to the way you feel, the way that you act, experiment, and there's a lot of adjusting, it sounds like.

SPEAKER_01 17:02

Yeah. And and the, you know, I wish I could go into Brad what the right answers are. And the truth is, I don't know. Because they're different for every kid in every situation. But the key is if you feel I'm gonna go into feelings here for a second again. So men out there, if you feel those body sensations, those feelings, if your chest gets tight, if your muscles tense, if your your posture changes, if your tone of voice adjusts, there's a good chance you are reacting and not responding. And so some keys to take from that is if you feel yourself in a reactive state, if you feel that your nervous system has become elevated, take a second to reset that first. Some simple things, and this is not new advice, but just taking some breaths. Uh-huh. Um or asking some questions before you jump to conclusions. Maybe taking a breather and coming back at it another time. Um maybe just switching the activity. If that if the thing that you're doing is causing frustration, switch gears or introduce a playful thing. Maybe even tell a dad joke. Humor is a great way to reset. And until you can feel that nervous system reset within you, until you can get yourself out of that limbic brain, don't respond.

SPEAKER_00 18:14

Which reminds me, what do you call a cow with no legs?

SPEAKER_01 18:18

Ground beef. Hey Brad, why don't autistic people like carrying cash?

SPEAKER_00 18:25

Um, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 18:27

They don't like change. Oh, but there is a new diagnosis out. Have you heard of it? CDO?

SPEAKER_00 18:35

No.

SPEAKER_01 18:35

It is like OCD, but the letters are in alphabetical order.

SPEAKER_00 18:40

Folks, we can do this all day.

SPEAKER_01 18:42

So probably shouldn't.

SPEAKER_00 18:43

Okay, so but we wanted also, if we can switch gears about provider roles within a father as a father. I know we talked about this before, and I think our audience would be really, you know, curious to hear the a, you know, being a provider as a father. Yeah. What that really means.

SPEAKER_01 18:59

And again, let's this in our changing dynamic, there's a lot of people that can be quote unquote the provider, but I wanted to kind of switch the role on what provider means because a lot of times in the you know traditional family setup, you have one parent as a provider, one is more of a nurturer. Um, and they're just roles we fall into. They're not imposed, they're not stereotypes, it's just kind of the reality of some provide and and and and nurture in different ways. Um, the question I kind of asked myself was, what am I providing? And a lot of times we just think of, well, I help pay the bills. And I go, okay, but what else? Am I providing security? A safe place for them, not just physically, but emotionally. Am I providing play? Am I providing a sense of belonging or stability? Am I providing intentional moments to be a dad? You know, these are these are questions that I just throw out there for all the dads listening or any providers listening. It gets really easy to get into a role of, well, I provide for these things so that my spouse or partner can do these other things. And I just would broaden that question, ask yourself, what do you provide? So like Brad, I'll ask you as a dad, what what do you provide?

SPEAKER_00 20:18

Well, and at first, when I I remember when, you know, when we got married, excuse me, like I think that it's you know, it's normal for a man to feel like, hey, I have to provide financially for their family. You know, when I got married, you know, I didn't have a lot of money, didn't have a have a lot of means, and then boom, my wife was pregnant within a few months after we got married. And I'm like, holy cow, how am I going to provide for this child? And right there my mind went financially, you know. Um and I think that's normal for men to feel that way is like, okay, I want to make sure that my family has the best, and money is always the first reason. So, but then the older I get, and when I f and and I wish I can go back, and I think we all like that. I wish I can go back to the younger Brad and say, you know what, the most important thing, you know, and and it's interesting, if you don't mind me if I can just kind of jump into this a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 21:22

Yeah, jump in.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

So I have six kids. My first child, I felt like, man, I gotta provide financially for. But when he was younger, all he wanted to do was play. Now, with our last kid, my youngest son, who is now seven, I finally realized that. It took me 15 years, 18 years to realize wow, they really I mean, yeah, money is important, don't get me wrong, that helps, but they don't really care. All they really want to do is play. That's all they want to do. And the funny thing is, the older I've been, the more I realize that that's what my teenager wants. That's really what my My young adult wants. He just wants to hang out. Like, and that's it.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

It's funny you bring up play. I'm going to circle back to that in a few minutes with some actual clinical data on specifically with dads and play. But before I do, I think this idea of dads being involved deserves some time in the spotlight because for whatever reason, sitcoms and comedies and TV shows, they portray the dad as this dumb dude that doesn't. And listen, parents out there, when you're watching these shows, please point out that that is not the model dad, right?

SPEAKER_00 22:30

I I hate, and I don't want to get on a tangent, but I really do hate how media portrays men as dumb people. Yeah. Like I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 22:39

Let me give you some clinical reasons why being an involved dad, Brad, the way you were talking about, is so critical. So there was this uh Stanford psychologist, Dr. Sears, did a research study decades ago on like 300 different families and took data on kids when they were five years old. And they took a lot of just a lot of data. It was it was like a family study. Twenty-six years later, the a separate group of doctors from Harvard do a follow-up study on these same kids. And what they were trying to do was they were trying to find a predictor of empathy. Like what from childhood helped determine whether a child or a young adult was going to be more empathetic, basically have higher emotional intelligence, being able to connect.

SPEAKER_00 23:19

So they're meant so they're measuring emotional intelligence.

SPEAKER_01 23:23

Capacity for empathy. So they took this, they found this data from Dr. Sears from like 26 years earlier and tracked these same families. Like, where are they at 26 late 26 years later? And what was the greatest predictor of empathy when they were young adults? Interesting. Guess what it was? I don't know. The best predictor of empathy was how involved the dad was when the child was five years old. It wasn't the involvement of the mom. Now there's other nurturing things and data from that, but the best predictor of empathy was the level of dad's involvement when the children were young. The more involved the dad, the more empathetic the kids and young adult.

SPEAKER_00 24:01

Okay. So then how did then not done? Oh.

SPEAKER_01 24:05

Then another group. Okay. When these same kids were reached their mid-40s. So same group of kids. We're tracking now the same family, 300 families across four different decades. They wanted to find out well, what was the best predictor of better social relationships in their mid and advanced life? So their marriage relationships, their community relationships, those that experienced increased warmth from their dads when they were five. That was the greatest predictor of successful relationships in their 40s.

SPEAKER_00 24:35

And I like how you say warmth. Yeah. That seems like trust and confidence.

SPEAKER_01 24:40

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 24:40

So like to all the dads out there, how do we instill more trust and confidence with our young kiddos?

SPEAKER_01 24:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:46

And and well, just male figures, right? For those that live in single family households, like what male figures can give them warmth and empathy at a young age.

SPEAKER_01 24:54

Yeah, because now then now there's a reverse study. Okay. So a whole separate group of psychologists, Drs. Uh Blanchard and Biller, they did another study on a thousand kids that found that those that had the hardest times with social relationships and even struggled with like grades, so intellectual performance and social performance were those where their fathers were cold, authoritarian, derogatory, and intrusive. So it's not just presence, it's the style. It's the style of being involved and being connected. So listen, as a dad, be involved. Be intentional about being involved. Um, we we're great planners, right? We like structure, but plan time with your kids. If you don't plan for it, you will fill the plans with something else. All right, so that's heavy. Let's go into something a little lighter. Brad, did you know that Santa Claus is neurodivergent?

SPEAKER_00 25:42

How can he be neurodivergent?

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Well, think about it. He wears white gloves, so he's got sensory issues. Uh things with him are always black and white. You're either naughty, you're nice. Okay. He can't help but check his list twice. And he does amazing things and nobody knows how he does it.

SPEAKER_00 25:59

Well, why do bees have sticky hair?

SPEAKER_01 26:02

Why do I have something to do with honey, but I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 26:06

Because they all use a honeycomb.

SPEAKER_01 26:10

Hey, I got another one. So an autistic person was asked, hey, if you're autistic, does that mean you take things literally? He answered, no, no, no, no. That that's a kleptomaniac. If you didn't cast that one, rewind, listen to it again. All right, switching gears. Unless you got another one.

SPEAKER_00 26:28

No, I I my well, there's one of my favorite ones. Why do the bananas go to the doctor?

SPEAKER_01 26:35

I don't know, Brad.

SPEAKER_00 26:36

It just wasn't peeling well.

SPEAKER_01 26:40

Okay, so on the lighter note, let's talk about play for a second. Yes. So if you've been a faithful follower of the players' connection, you know that we've really dove into the science of play.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

I I feel like that's been our biggest takeaway with the connection, of the players' connection, is the style of play with children.

SPEAKER_01 26:57

Yeah, in fact, you know, we've talked to so many different therapists, and they really kind of focus on that. The let the support people do their support stuff. Don't worry about wearing the hats of therapists and and all the things, just be there to connect with your kids and therapy fix, just play.

SPEAKER_00 27:12

And that's that's what they need.

SPEAKER_01 27:13

You know, yeah. So, funny thing though, dads and moms play with their kids differently. And there's data on the style of play from dads versus the style of play from moms.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

I'm excited to hear this.

SPEAKER_01 27:25

Now, again, if you're in a single-parent household, you can incorporate these other styles of play, but I kind of want to go through them. So the the typical explanation is mothers are more educational with their play, right? So they're gonna they they tend to want to teach with play, they're more nurturing with play. And I remember like my wife, she would like have them repeat a word or look at a picture, you know, this is a giraffe or this is an elephant. And the kid wouldn't respond, but she was like relentless, like she would make sure she was delivering these content instructions to the kids. And I I just wanted to like toss them or tickle them and you know, play games on the ground or make choo-choo sounds. And so that's not just me. That's so that's that's in general, dads tend to be more physical, moms tend to be more educational and nurturing. Um, and this is important because studies show that two-thirds of two and a half-year-old babies choose dads over mama's play partners.

SPEAKER_00 28:25

And they're and I always tease my wife about this. Like little babies when they're first born, I'm kind of like they kind of just want to hang out with the mom the whole time until they get to like like I don't know, eight months, like nine months, and then they become fun for a dad. And that's I'm like, let's go, because now they want to wrestle.

SPEAKER_01 28:45

And that's the thing. So play for dads is about fun, it's not for the moms, it's more about connection and purpose, it's more nurturing. And it's not that either one's bad, right?

SPEAKER_00 28:55

Because they still need they all have their roles, they do their purpose.

SPEAKER_01 28:59

But it's funny because reading on that, you know, a dad, a dad'll shift games repeatedly with a kid. Like they'll play something, but if the fun is kind of wearing out, we'll shift to a different one and then we'll go to another one. For a child, that can be dysregulating, but it actually intentionally teaches them self-regulation because they know that with the shift, they still wanted to play that other game, but now you're moving to a new game. And so it teaches them to transition from one to another. That's a good point. So the playstyle is actually really important. Um, it's also kind of helps them kind of guide them through more physical development and reaction. It activates different parts of their nervous system and it engages them in different ways. So creative play, I guess, is what I'm getting at.

SPEAKER_00 29:37

You know, and and as you're talking about, one game I always like to play with my little kids is I'd have their, they they would lay on their back and they would press their legs against me, and then I would lean against them, and then they would and then come on, push, push me off, push me off, and then they would push their legs against me. It was just something kind of fun that they would do, and obviously I would fall over and you know, just to kind of tease, and they would laugh, and it was just some way that I'm I'm I'm using their physical bodies or motor skills to kind of push and pull at a young age. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:07

I mean, it's it's it's not necessarily intentional. We are the accidental occupational therapists for our kids. Like we're we're doing those physical play engagements. Um, doctors John and Julie Gottman, they're more kind of relationship therapists, but they've cited literally hundreds of studies that have proven the way dads play, not just moms, the way dads play, that style is linked to huge positive outcomes for both sons and daughters, intellectually and socially. So that kind of play is important. And if the moms, if you think he's just being silly, let him do it. This style play is critical, it's important. And dads, huge call-out play with your kids. Yes, go home and play with your kids, interact with your kids.

SPEAKER_00 30:46

You know, one of the best play examples I love. Remember the show Liar Liar with Jim Carrey, and he had the claw. You remember that? And he would chase his kid with the claw, and it's like, oh no, here comes the claw, and they would run around. I guess I I read this later on. Jim Carrey got that idea because that's what his dad did to him. So he used that in the show, Liar Liar, because that's what Jim Carrey grew up with, his dad chasing him with the claw.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

That's awesome. Like it does so much good for the brain, for the body, it activates you know, your dopamine receptors, it gives you these positive memory styles, it creates connection and closeness, it fosters trust. Um, really, I think the end of the day, Brad, it's find fun in your family. Uh there parenting's hard. And anybody out there that's got kids, you know it's hard. It's not all fun and games. You know, I wish it could all always be that way. Um sometimes the fun requires intentionality. So play. Plan to play, be intentional about play. Don't react, respond and find fun, enjoy what you're doing. If you can do that, that is kind of the beginning of the pathway of connection. And in connecting with our kids, that's when we can finally hope to begin to understand them. And that journey, that one is full of treasures just waiting to be discovered.

SPEAKER_00 32:06

Well, and I know I I read somewhere that the best way to connect with anybody is through humor. Remember, we had we had a professional comedian that we brought on, yeah, and we talked about that. That in any any kind of like business setting or just financing, if there's a way that you can find humor, that's the best way to start that connection. So if there's any way that you can just find a way to create a little bit of just laughter in the home, laughter at play, you know, that's a great way to connect with any kind of person.

SPEAKER_01 32:41

Yeah. So listen, if this has been nothing more than just a small motivation to be engaged, great. If this has helped to be a call to action to some of the dads out there, great. You know, I I wanted to put this focus because I think sometimes dads are overlooked. Um, and I think sometimes we don't understand how we can really be impactful and make a difference. And I hope this has shined a light a little bit on how to approach your children, your family a little bit differently with intentionality, with purpose.

SPEAKER_00 33:10

Awesome. And final dad joke, Nathan.

SPEAKER_01 33:12

Uh I'm fresh out of dad jokes, Brad. But uh I'll throw it back to you. Do you have any final dad jokes for us?

SPEAKER_00 33:18

I always like that one is what do you what do you um what do you call cheese that it's not yours? Nacho cheese.

SPEAKER_01 33:27

We'll close it on that dad joke.

SPEAKER_00 33:29

Yes, thank you so much for making us part of your day. Please don't forget to subscribe so you never miss a conversation that inspires connection, fun, and play. You want to give a big shout out to our producer Jesse Palmer and our marketing director, Dallin Davis. Until next time, let's do some good.