Supporting Cancer Fighters and Their Loved Ones

Cancer doesn’t just affect the person with the diagnosis, it impacts families, friends, and caregivers in powerful ways. In this episode of the Living to Thrive with Cancer Podcast, Kathryn White, holistic cancer coach and author, and her special guest Kenny Perkins as he shares how he supports cancer fighters and the people who love them.

Whether you are walking your own cancer journey or standing beside someone who is, this episode offers practical tools and emotional insights to help you navigate the challenges and build resilience together.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• Communication strategies Kenny uses to support cancer patients receiving radiation therapy
• The power of community and holistic support in the cancer journey.

Why This Matters:

 Supporting cancer fighters and their loved ones means more than just “being there.” It’s about creating a space of compassion, hope, and strength. This episode is packed with inspiration and strategies to help both patients and caregivers feel empowered, supported, and less alone.

Find Kenny Perkins

https://www.alltalkoncology.com/podcast

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Connect with Kathryn

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Transcript

Episode 5.2
===

[00:00:00] Kathryn White: Welcome to episode 5.2 of the Living to Thrive with Cancer Podcast. Before we dive into this episode with a very special guest, I just want to remind you that if you're a new listener and , or if you're not a new listener, welcome to the podcast.

[00:00:15] It is great to have you here as a cancer thriver, I use my stories and experience with stage four colon cancer to guide you through your walk with cancer. As a holistic cancer coach, I wanna help you through creating a health. Building lifestyle, managing your stress, and helping you to navigate the day in and day out stuff that comes up when you have cancer.

[00:00:35] In today's episode, as I said, we have a very special guest here. I am talking with Kenny Perkins. Kenny is the founder and host of All Talk Oncology, a podcast that empowers cancer patients through insightful conversations. As an eyewitness to the daily struggles and a listener to the ongoing concerns of patients and their caregivers, he was inspired to do more, creating additional value for cancer fighters and their loved ones.

[00:01:03] He established a platform where firsthand knowledge about cancer could be discussed. As a coach, he takes an in-depth approach to listening with the intent of breaking down barriers. And limiting beliefs. It has been an absolute honor for him to help thousands of cancer fighters get past this disease.

[00:01:21] He believes that every cancer fighter and their loved ones should be supported. No one should feel alone on this journey because we really are all in this together. So welcome, Kenny. I'm very, very excited to have you here today. 

[00:01:37] Kenny Perkins: Uh, absolutely it is. It is my. It is my pleasure and a privilege to be on your platform.

[00:01:43] Thank you so much for allowing me to get on here and, and speak to your listeners. 

[00:01:48] Kathryn White: I just think it's amazing. Um, you know, as I was going through your background, the things that you bring to the table and bring to the conversation. So what I wanna share today and go through with you are things about your professional background in the medical world and this, um, what really struck me was that you have this belief in the power of connection, which I think is so critical, and then how you support people.

[00:02:10] So I think we're in for a really great conversation. 

[00:02:13] Kenny Perkins: Absolutely. Let's do it. 

[00:02:14] Kathryn White: Alright, let's get started. So I would love for you to tell the listeners a little bit more about your work in radiation therapy and how that took you towards coaching and supporting people. Is that Radiation comes up a lot in my conversations and I didn't have radiation, so I thought what a great opportunity to have someone who's familiar with it, talk to uh, the listeners about it.

[00:02:37] Kenny Perkins: For sure. Well, I am a board certified radiation therapist. Uh, I've been doing this for over two decades now. And, um, you know, I landed in this field by accident and I tell people, you know, I, I wanted to be an architect, you know, growing up. And that's kind of what I was pursuing. And then, um, there was like a change, right?

[00:02:57] I mean, there was a change in economy, a change in what am I gonna do next? And so I, I landed in radiation oncology by pushing a patient. Uh, to their treatments. And it was the first time ever, right? I, I mean, I was wheeling patients back and forth to radiology because I, I was a radiology assistant and so I was wheeling them back and forth.

[00:03:16] But then one day we took a patient to radiation therapy and radiation oncology and, uh, I just started talking to, you know, the therapist there, like, what is it you guys do? They start telling me about, you know, how they see these patients, you know, anywhere from four to eight weeks at a time. And you know, you Monday through Friday and I thought, man, that's kind of cool because it's completely different than x-ray.

[00:03:39] You know, in radiology what we do, we, we, you know, did you, you fell outta the tree. Did you break your arm? Yes or no? Right? I mean, we look at the film and then we see you, we never see you again. You know? Right. But in radiation oncology and radiation therapy you see them every day. So you get to know them, you get to understand them about their families, what they like, dislike, you know, and so it's a relationship.

[00:04:02] Kathryn White: And 

[00:04:02] Kenny Perkins: to me that was, that was the, that was the appealing factor. And I was like, that was a no brainer for me. Um, a lot of people try to discourage me from that. Uh. Because they were saying that, you know, it's a depressing field. You know, you see people sick and things like that. And you know, at that time I was like, 19, right?

[00:04:23] So it was like, don't tell me what to do. You know what I mean? 

[00:04:27] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:04:27] Kenny Perkins: So, so you know, here I am. Here I am. And, uh, you get to know people. You get to know them, and that was, that was my favorite part. 

[00:04:38] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. Yeah. That's really beautiful because , sometimes we view oncology as being impersonal. Like you go in your number's called, you go in, you do your thing, you go out, you go home.

[00:04:50] And in my case, I did chemo every second week. So I had a, some rapport with my chemo nurses. I was in a very small space, so it was wonderful. There were only eight beds where I was doing it, but it sometimes for for people it feels like a big machine. So to have that perspective of being able to make connections with people and get to know them, I think is really beautiful.

[00:05:11] And. I think may even demystify some of the process to have a friendly face meeting them and asking about how their kids are doing or how their week is going and things like that. Does, is that kind of what it feels like for you? 

[00:05:26] Kenny Perkins: For me personally. Yes. You know, you know, and not to discredit anyone, you know, I mean, everyone is doing their job and I think, I think that's what happens.

[00:05:36] Like we get our, we, we put ourselves in a position of, in these careers and we do our job, and a lot of us do it well, right? I mean, you come in for chemo, the doctor sees you, you get the infusion and whatever you get. And then you come down from radiation oncology, right? You, we, we treat patients every 15 minutes, right?

[00:05:56] And, and radiation oncology. Um, so that's four patients an hour. So you get 15 minutes with each patient. So it's okay. You're, you know where you're here for, if it's breast, if it's prostate, if it's lung, if it's brain, you know, we get you in position, we get you taken care of. Hey, hey, and give you a treatment and bye-bye.

[00:06:16] Now that's if I'm just doing my job, right? Mm-hmm. I mean, I, I'm, I'm doing, I'm doing what I'm supposed to do, but for me, you know, it's about, man, you putting yourself in that other person's shoes. It's, it's, it's, you know, it's, that's what empathy is. It's like understanding what a person is going through by being in their shoes and the fear and understanding that, and seeing that anxiety when people are coming in mm-hmm.

[00:06:39] Coming in through those doors and it, it's, how do I, how do I ease that? Right. So that's me as a person, right? That's me as a, as a radiation therapist. It's just who I am. I'm doing my job, but it's just who I am, so I'm going to make sure you're okay. I'm gonna talk to your family who may be apprehensive and, and wondering what's going on and scared, and I'm gonna ease them and, or maybe I need to bring them in and let them see the machine and get a feel for that.

[00:07:07] And, you know, maybe I, you know, I need to talk to you and maybe you just need a hug that day along with your treatment. Like, it's, it's that, right? It's, it's, it's me feeling out. The individual. And think about it, I treat 30 to 40 patients a day. So that's how many people I'm seeing. Right? So everyone else, every individual is an individual.

[00:07:31] Yeah. And everyone has their own needs and everyone is going through their own thing and their own circumstance and Right. Life. Life is lifeing. So yeah. As a radiation therapist, you know, that's who. I am. And that was my approach. Uh, and that is my approach. And so, um, and then this thing, and then you just, right.

[00:07:54] You just, you allow space. Yes. You know, I allowed space for in those 15 minutes, but guess what? It's 15 minutes for five days a week. So you do the math. I'm giving you 15 minutes per day, and I'm learning more and more about 15 minutes, and I'm continuing a conversation that I had yesterday that was 15 minutes.

[00:08:13] Hey, so you didn't tell me about that, right? I mean, it's, it's that, that's, that's the joy, that's the connection. That's the thing that I love. That's what, that's why I'm here, right? 

[00:08:24] Kathryn White: That's so beautiful. It's like that is the art in the science. Mm-hmm. That's the human side of it. I love that so much. Your, your, um, patients, I guess, is that what we call 'em.

[00:08:36] Your patients are just so fortunate to have that connection with you and that you take the time for that. So thank you on behalf of many of us who go through treatment. Thank you so much for being that person. Really that smile or that touch or that moment of let's take a look at what's gonna happen can make such a huge difference.

[00:08:57] Kenny Perkins: Thank you. 

[00:08:58] Kathryn White: So that, is that like part of those struggles that you talk about, that you saw with patients and caregivers, and what sort of is taking you in this, this second piece of your world of cancer? 

[00:09:09] Kenny Perkins: 1000%. That's exactly it, right? You see that, you know, you. You know, there's, there's two type of patients I say that come through, right?

[00:09:19] And it's, it's the patients that have a, a certain type of mindset. And you see the patients that are like, I'm gonna get through this. I'm, I'm gonna, you know, I have this, but you know, I'm here. Let's go, let's, let's get this some, whatever it takes. And then you have the patient that's, it's uncertain and is fearful and it's just, they're stuck.

[00:09:45] They can't move and it's, it's just a scary thing and they're showing up, but it's, it's hard every day and you don't know what's going on personally in their life, but just being, just being diagnosed is, is, is overwhelming. 

[00:09:59] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:09:59] Kenny Perkins: So those people, those, those individuals have have a tougher time. So how, how can I be the light in their darkness, right?

[00:10:10] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. 

[00:10:11] Kenny Perkins: And it's me just. Just being there, allowing space, asking questions. Sincere. Right, because people know when you're just not really interested. Yeah, yeah. Right. You, you're here for treatment. Okay, let's go. You know, they, they know when that they just, you're just doing your job and they know when that person is like taking an interest in them.

[00:10:34] And so you know that, that. What has helped me to make me wanna make this decision because those people that are feeling uncertain, it's about how do you bring them through, right? How do you let them know? And um, it's just through my experience and the things that I've saw and the things that I share and helping them.

[00:10:59] You know, this whole time I was doing cancer coaching, right. I mean, it, it didn't have a name to me. 

[00:11:05] Kathryn White: Mm. Right. Yeah. Didn't, yeah, didn't 

[00:11:06] Kenny Perkins: have a, didn't have a name at that, at that point. But I, I, man, I was coaching every single day. Right. But then cancer coaching came about and it was, I mean, I took this course and it was a, it was amazing and understanding and that just.

[00:11:23] Elevated my, my, my abilities of what I was already doing. Right. And I, I thank God, I thank God one for allowing me to be in this space. Mm-hmm. Um, someone told me, and I'm humbled really, someone told me, man, Kenny, you are the perfect person for this, for this, for this, for this space in this place. And I was like, man, what a compliment.

[00:11:48] And I never thought about it like that. But what I do know. What I do acknowledge is that I, I want to make sure that I support everyone that comes through the doors, right? And so, you know, um, when you start talking to patients day after day, imagine for 30, 40 patients for the last two decades, how many patients have I saw, 

[00:12:12] Kathryn White: right?

[00:12:12] Yeah. 

[00:12:13] Kenny Perkins: And so when you start talking to them and you start to understand what's going on, see you're going, they're going to the chemo. They're gonna say whatever the doctor, whatever the, whatever the plan is that they're their family and the physician have come up with it's chemo. Got it. It's surgery done, radiation.

[00:12:29] We're gonna get it. Got it. Okay. Everyone's doing their thing. 

[00:12:32] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:12:32] Kenny Perkins: But you know what, what about the time when you're laying there and you can't sleep, or you're driving and you're thinking, and you're wondering, Hey, are these treatments gonna work? 

[00:12:46] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. 

[00:12:47] Kenny Perkins: Am I gonna get through this? Is this cancer gonna come back?

[00:12:52] Mm-hmm. Am I gonna be able to see my kids or my, my, my husband or my wife, you know, graduate? Are we gonna be going on those another vacation when you, when those disquieting thoughts hit you? And no one's there, right? It's just you. 

[00:13:07] Kathryn White: Yeah, 

[00:13:08] Kenny Perkins: right. Yeah. It's me now it's me coming in to say, no. I know that feeling because I'm talking to you.

[00:13:15] I've been, I've been, I've allowed space to know what's in your head, right? And so now let's, let me help you through that, right? Because the doc, we're gonna do our thing medically. But let me help you and coach you through so you can get outta that. Right. So that's, that's been my journey. That's been my journey.

[00:13:37] Oh, 

[00:13:38] Kathryn White: I love that. I'm gonna say that probably a lot. I love that so much like that. I have so many thoughts that you are coaching people as they're going through the process in real time, and that you recognize as someone living in the medical world that I call them the sneaky thoughts that the patient has.

[00:14:00] All that list that you just read off of, of all the sneaky thoughts that come in. That can really be crippling and can prevent someone from moving forward and asking for help or getting the support that they need, or even being willing to have a conversation with you when they walk into the radiation suite.

[00:14:17] Like there's just so many more layers to it. That I think is why people like you and I exist is so that we can support outside of the beautiful medical work that you're doing, that the people that, that need just that extra little bit or want a little bit more. So can you talk about your All Talk Oncology podcast and the other work that you're doing?

[00:14:40] 'cause your, your medical side is like, just brilliant, but I wanna know more about the other piece of Kenny. 

[00:14:47] Kenny Perkins: Yeah. Well, you know, all Talk Oncology came about, um, in the pandemic, right? Mm-hmm. Um, my first episode was April, 2020. You know, so it's interesting because prior to the launch of the podcast, I had this idea and I had shared it with a physician before and I was like, you know, what'd be kind of cool?

[00:15:11] Wouldn't it be kind of cool if, you know, there's like this show where people could come and talk about cancer and you know, you can kind of go through this thing and help them and you know, it has this, this discussion. It's a open, right. It'd be like kind of cool. And she was like, oh, so you'd be like the Oprah of cancer.

[00:15:28] And I was like, right. It was kind of like this whole thing, but really, really, I was like, yeah, kind of. You know, and that's basically, that has been my theme through, it's like, I, I want to be the Oprah of cancer. 

[00:15:46] Kathryn White: I love that. Right? 

[00:15:47] Kenny Perkins: I, I want to be that. I want to create the resources and the people the way they can go, the different podcasts that that's out there, the different treatment options that are out there, the different physicians that are different, new, new technology, whatever that may be like, that's who I am.

[00:16:03] Right. And. I and I, I was like, and so that's how all Talk Oncology was born, right? Through that, through that idea. And I didn't know, I didn't know. If that was gonna be successful or not, or you know, 'cause it was just an idea. Mm-hmm. But as I put it out there and, and start, started going through the process, we had some amazing people on the show.

[00:16:27] You know, we had Alex Trebek, we had his wife on the show, Jean Trebek, and it was what it was like. To be a caregiver, you know, for Alex. Mm-hmm. And, um, we had Samantha Harris from Dancing on the Stars on the show and what, and e Entertainment. Right. And how she went through her process. And we had Ananda Lewis.

[00:16:47] And so as this momentum began, I was like, okay. And what I'm doing is exactly it. It has, it has function. People see value. And so that's, that's where all talking oncology came, came about. And then of course, the coaching. And, and I, I, I think a lot of times what people may not understand or, or may overlook is that sometimes it's coaching through these interviews.

[00:17:19] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. 

[00:17:20] Kenny Perkins: Right? Because, you know, for me. I'm there with that individual and getting their insight on what they went through. And then I'm able to kind of coach a little bit and direct a little bit because as I, as I allow the space, and it's, it's a, it's refreshing to some of the listeners, right? Because they can, they can empathize with what the person's going through, but they also get the tools.

[00:17:46] That. So that came about. That's how our talk oncology came about. And then I was like, man, I need to, I need to write a book, right? And so it was like the five stages of winning with a cancer diagnosis. You can find it on Amazon, right? And it's like, how do you win? How do you win with a cancer diagnosis?

[00:18:03] And we talk about that in the book, right? And to go through some of those stages. And then I was like, man, we need to create a program. You know, when people get diagnosed, it could be overwhelming. How, how do we reach the people? So I created a program for them, um, so that they can walk them through. It's called, uh, you know, I have Cancer, am I going to Die?

[00:18:25] Kathryn White: Oh, wow. 'cause 

[00:18:26] Kenny Perkins: that, right? Yeah. 'cause that's the whole thing. It's like, oh my God, it's the C word. Right? It's like cancer and nothing positive. 

[00:18:36] Kathryn White: In our 

[00:18:36] Kenny Perkins: minds come out of that. 

[00:18:38] Kathryn White: Yeah. So 

[00:18:39] Kenny Perkins: that's what I named, that's what I named the, that's what I named the course. And that's gonna be my next book. Really 

[00:18:46] Kathryn White: amazing.

[00:18:47] And we're gonna link all of that in the show notes so that people can find you when, when, uh, when they're done listening to this episode. 'cause I think there's just so much value in having a book because you get to really put those bigger thoughts that you have on paper. Yes, and having all of the podcast guests, I was going through your podcast and looking at your guests and, and I truly, I was like so happy when I saw Alex Trebek there.

[00:19:11] I was like, oh, a fellow Canadian. He was wearing his order of Canada medal. Um, and I saw you had Dr. Liz O'Riorden on also from the uk and um, she's actually going to be my next guest on the podcast. She's just an amazing woman. Like you've had some really inspirational, amazing guests and I think. And correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that that those people and their stories really level the playing field when it comes to cancer.

[00:19:38] Like it's not just, you know, normal people walking around doing their just normal everyday jobs. It's people that have bigger profiles, bigger lives, but it doesn't make them any different. We're all just human at the end of it. 

[00:19:52] Kenny Perkins: That's what I say, you know? Kathryn, it's, it's a great point you brought up, right?

[00:19:57] Because cancer doesn't discriminate, right? Black, white, rich, poor, it doesn't matter. Like it's, it's out there and it doesn't, it doesn't discriminate on who it gets. 

[00:20:09] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. 

[00:20:09] Kenny Perkins: And so, you know, I do that on purpose to let people know it doesn't matter who you are, this is affecting all of us. And so how do we do this?

[00:20:18] How do we do this together? How can I get, how can I give them gems that you can utilize on your journey? And the the beautiful part is, I mean, we're a global, we're a global podcast. Mm-hmm. Mean you look at some of our guests and where we've been, we've been in South Africa, we've been to Greece, we've been to India.

[00:20:36] Right. The UK and Canada. Like Australia, like cancer doesn't discriminate. It's all over the world. Yes. Right. And so we wanna make sure we capture that. We wanna make sure that we see, let people know that you know, this is not just you. You know, sometimes it feels that way. You may feel like you're on this little island on your, on your own.

[00:20:59] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:20:59] Kenny Perkins: But I, I want you to see that this is, there's people all over the world's being affected, and if we can take gems from different continents that are gonna benefit you, the man, let's do it. Let's make sure that you walk away with something and so that we can get you through this, this dark period of your time and your life.

[00:21:19] So you can get out and thrive, right? 

[00:21:22] Kathryn White: Yes. 

[00:21:22] Kenny Perkins: And so that's what we're doing. 

[00:21:24] Kathryn White: Yeah. It's creating a community even if people can't be in the same space physically or, um, online even. And, and some people, oh, don't want to, I know people who are just, they wanna be on their own and do it, but to be able to have the gift of sitting in your own space or in your car, or in a park or on a walk or whatever and hear.

[00:21:44] Your podcast and the people that you're bringing in, reminding us that this really is a human experience. And I love what you said, like it doesn't matter who you are, what your background is, where you're from. This is a disease that transcends many, many people's lives. And so the support needs to be there in the way that people are, are ready to receive it.

[00:22:07] Whether that's a book or a podcast or a program. It's just really important work to to connect. 

[00:22:14] Kenny Perkins: 100%. 

[00:22:15] Kathryn White: Yeah. So, so, so good. Um, so you said you're writing another book that's exciting. 

[00:22:22] Kenny Perkins: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:22:23] Kathryn White: When's, what's the plan for that? 

[00:22:25] Kenny Perkins: You know, I, I, I'm taking that program and, and then just making it into a book really.

[00:22:31] And know, I, I think. I think that's the, that's the the thought that a lot of people have when you get the diagnosis right. And so I wanna make sure I capture that. I wanna make sure that we, we talk about how to have the right mindset, how to have the, a right approach as we go through these things. And, you know, a cancer diagnosis doesn't always mean a death sentence.

[00:22:56] Right. That is, that is a misconception. 

[00:22:58] Kathryn White: Yes. Right. 

[00:22:59] Kenny Perkins: And, uh, a lot of times that's, that's what we think because we don't know. And so when we educate and help them to appreciate that, that's, that's not the case, then we can, we can empower that individual. The second part is that sometimes in this, in this field.

[00:23:18] Recurrence happens. And so man, right, you, you've got all of this strength to get through this the first time, and you're like, oh, okay, we got through. It was a breakthrough. And then, man, a recurrence happens. And it's like, okay, does this, how do you get the strength again? 

[00:23:36] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:23:37] Kenny Perkins: Right. It's like, man, all the, all the strength and all the air you had just went out.

[00:23:42] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:23:44] Kenny Perkins: And, um, so we wanna tackle that. 

[00:23:47] Kathryn White: Yeah. 

[00:23:47] Kenny Perkins: Because, because a recurrence doesn't necessarily mean a death sentence either. No. So, so I, like I said, been doing this for over two decades and I've seen some amazing people. Come in more than once and thrive. 

[00:24:06] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. 

[00:24:07] Kenny Perkins: And so we just wanna make sure that we give you tools that you can have the right mindset so that you can get through all of that.

[00:24:14] Kathryn White: Yeah. I think it really, really is. A lot of it is mindset. I think having a good team is important. Um, I think I am, I am 10 years out from my original diagnosis, and on the 22nd of this month will be two years since my last surgery. My lung surgery, that was my sixth, sixth surgery. I've been told five times that I have cancer.

[00:24:40] Because I've just had recurrences that just little, you know, little mets that have popped up in, in my lungs and in, in my abdomen that I've had to have dealt with. But the mindset around it and having tools really has made the difference and having a great support team and, and knowing who I could reach out to when, when I learned that asking for help is a superpower.

[00:25:02] That you don't have to do it alone, but, and, and truly. One of my missions is to bust that myth that you were talking about, that everybody dies. I had stage four colon cancer. I'm still here 10 years later. Not everybody dies. And I think the media, quite frankly does a disservice of portraying people with cancer in a very poor light and makes them, makes it out to be that everybody's story ends in a tragedy.

[00:25:28] But there's more and more people that are surviving. Because medicine is moving forward and there's new technology and there's people like you and myself and a whole bunch of other people that are, are cheering people on from the sides. I think that's really, really important. 

[00:25:45] Kenny Perkins: 100%. 

[00:25:48] Kathryn White: Look at us trying to help people.

[00:25:51] It's good because people often don't know how to ask for help or where to go to for help. So I think a podcast and a book are really accessible 'cause they don't have to talk to other people. They can just, you know, integrate the, the messages from your guests and, and your, uh, episodes, your solo episodes and my stuff into.

[00:26:11] Their learning circle and take from it what's important to them and, and let go of what isn't important. 

[00:26:17] Kenny Perkins: For sure. You know, you know, you know Kathryn, A lot of times people don't know how to be there. Like you said, they don't know what to say and that's okay. I want, I want to, I want to, I wanna tackle that right now.

[00:26:34] If you don't, if you know someone with cancer and. You don't know what to say or do you know? You don't want to say the wrong thing. You know that's understandable. But because you don't know the worst thing you can do, I want you to know this is back away from that individual. That's the worst thing you can do.

[00:26:56] Yeah. 'cause you don't know what to do. And I understand that. I want to tackle that because. You don't know what to do and say, so I'm just going to like, stay away. No, that's not what you need to do. This is, this is what you need to do. One, just be there. You don't need to say anything. You don't need to say anything.

[00:27:18] Kathryn White: Mm-hmm. 

[00:27:18] Kenny Perkins: Just being there, allowing that space. What can you do for them? Is there something I can do for you? That's a easy question. Is there something I can do for you being there, allowing the space. And let me tell you that individual will just love you because you know, they don't know. Sometimes their minds are going a hundred miles a minute and sometimes they don't even know.

[00:27:48] Yeah. But just being there, is there anything I can do? It means everything. So I just wanna give that tip to you. 

[00:27:59] Kathryn White: Yeah, it's true. It's the, the most awkward part I think of, of a relationship with cancer is the not knowing what to say, not knowing how to show up. Don't wanna say the wrong thing, you know, don't wanna make the other person uncomfortable.

[00:28:13] And, and also it's uncomfortable for the friend or the loved one because. It's just so uncertain. So thank you for addressing that. I think that's a really valuable lesson for, for everyone that's listening here. 'cause it's not always just people that have cancer that are here. It's the people that wanna support them and, and those people, the friends and the family, the caregivers, they need that support also.

[00:28:38] Kenny Perkins: Absolutely. 

[00:28:38] Kathryn White: Yeah. It is not, it is not a solo project cancer. It takes a, a team and a whole bunch of wraparound so. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And you shared some really amazing insights and I am looking forward to going back and re-listening to this episode because you've just said so many, there's so many nuggets in here we could probably talk for hours about.

[00:28:57] And, um, I would be remiss to not ask you my favorite question of a guest, and that is, what does living to thrive mean to you? 

[00:29:07] Kenny Perkins: That is a beautiful question. You know, living to thrive, you know, you need to be intentional. It was one right, have a sense of purpose.

[00:29:19] You know, as a young man, I always thought, man, why am I here? I mean, what is this life all about? You see, that's not necessarily a cancer question, it's a life question. But what happens in what happens when you deal with cancer is you get catapulted in the front of the line of dealing with life. You didn't ask to be catapulted, but that's what happened.

[00:29:41] And so now you're dealing with it. And so what is gonna help you thrive? You need to be intentional about what you're doing. Mm-hmm. Do you know what you're doing? And if you don't, it's okay. Find out what you want to do, find out what your purpose is, and be intentional about it every single day and work towards that.

[00:30:02] I mean, as human beings, like sometimes we're stuck. Mm-hmm. We get stuck in life and it's okay. It's okay to be stuck, but don't stay there, find a solution. And so that's what I say for me, thriving is being able to be intentional and living with the purpose. And sometimes we, we don't do that all the time, even though we know our purpose and know the things that we're supposed to do.

[00:30:29] Kathryn White: Mm. 

[00:30:29] Kenny Perkins: But, but this is the reminder and sometimes we need that to get back up and move intentionally and towards our purpose. 

[00:30:38] Kathryn White: Beautiful. Living with intention. I love it. And purpose. Yes, very. I love that so much. 'cause it really. It really drives home the message that this is not something someone has to go through alone.

[00:30:52] That they can find their purpose in life. In this cancer narrative, this cancer story, there can still be purpose and the intentionality of every action we had. Um, just as a sidebar, we had mandatory family fun days when our boys were teenagers when I was sick because we set the intention of spending the time together as a family.

[00:31:16] Of doing things together that were gonna make memories that we could laugh and celebrate and, and so that, yeah, living to thrive, living with intention. What a beautiful message to share. Thank you for that. 

[00:31:28] Kenny Perkins: Thank you. 

[00:31:30] Kathryn White: Well, your message today transcends a lot of pieces of the cancer narrative, I'm telling you, but the, it's about been about like that power of support and the connections that you made with, with your patients, what you make with your patients and the the people that come to all Talk Oncology and your program.

[00:31:49] And how that supporting of people is just so, so important. And I know I shared at the beginning, like you were talking your talk about in your bio about not having to be alone on this journey, that people don't have to be alone. So thank you for being here today and for sharing this very small window of who you are and what you do.

[00:32:10] And I'm gonna share all of your information in the show notes where people can find your podcast. And you have a Facebook community also where people can go, I believe. 

[00:32:20] Kenny Perkins: Yes. Yes. You can just look me up, Kenny Perkins or All Talk Oncology and you'll, you'll find our links through there.

[00:32:27] Kathryn White: Beautiful. Beautiful. Well, I know, I know people will want to connect with you on that level. So, uh, thank you so, so much, Kenny for being here, for taking the time out of your day to spend a little time talking about yourself and what you do. And just before you go, I'm just gonna wrap things up here, just reminding people that if they found what they learned here today to be helpful, that they can go ahead and share this with other people.

[00:32:51] And that's what allows you and me to support more people who are living with cancer and help them to move from survivor to thriver. And you can, um, as Kenny said, go to Kenny Perkins. Just give him a look up or go to our show notes and find him and follow him where he is. And you can follow The Living to Thrive With Cancer Podcast on your favorite channel and on YouTube.

[00:33:13] And, um, Kenny, do you have a, do you have an email list that people can subscribe to also if they wanna stay connected with you? 

[00:33:22] Kenny Perkins: Yes. You can go to info at, All. Talk Oncology. Dot com, or you can go to kenny@yourcancerguy.com. 

[00:33:32] Kathryn White: Beautiful. It's always great to be on an email list for people who are sharing information education.

[00:33:37] So for the listeners, you go and find Kenny on his email list and you can get him in your email box and he can continue to share his wisdom with you. So again, a big thank you, Kenny, for being here today, for taking the time, for sharing your insights and how you are supporting people living with cancer.

[00:33:54] Thank you so, so much. 

[00:33:56] Kenny Perkins: My pleasure and thank you so much.