FFOD322 : Dr. Disturbance Can Flat-Out Hunt

This week I’m sitting down with Dr. Marcus Lashley, better known to many of y’all as Dr. Disturbance. Most folks want to talk science, biology and research when they sit down with Marcus. That’s all good and well, but I wanted to talk TURKEY HUNTING.

And let me tell you something… this man knows his way around the woods. We swapped stories, talked hunting strategy and what years in the woods will teach you. Marcus is sharp as they come, but he’s also the real deal when it comes to chasing longbeards.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Welcome to Fistful of Dirt, the official podcast of Monte Oak Properties. Whether you own a small farm, lease land, or just love hanging in your backyard. We're all about the outdoor lifestyle and how to get the most from your time in God's great outdoors. Now here's your host, Ronnie Cud Strickland.

SPEAKER_03 0:24

Test one two semi-live from the original Camo Cake.

SPEAKER_04 0:28

Semi-Live.

SPEAKER_03 0:29

And uh I don't know where you live, but our turkey season's winding down a little bit.

SPEAKER_04 0:34

It's gone by so fast.

SPEAKER_03 0:36

It's like I leave one day and I come back wherever I've been and everything's green and it's hot and it's humid, and it looks like July.

SPEAKER_04 0:44

And we've been mowing.

SPEAKER_03 0:46

Well, that's a good thing.

SPEAKER_04 0:47

That's my favorite time of year.

SPEAKER_03 0:49

Yeah, you and your mother, they love to mow. I know you're a mowing because I'll be over there and your mother and you both will kind of cut across from one patch of grass to the other, and I hear the rocks go ring, and I was like, don't say nothing. Just sharpen the blades and arcs. Yeah. It's like, hey, if they cut in the grass, I'll sharpen the blades. I know your husband does the same thing. So life is good. I made a few posts from uh my second Florida trip, and uh your boy Cranky was the only one that got a turkey.

SPEAKER_04 1:23

I know. And Cranky's gonna get his turkey. I'm learning that.

SPEAKER_03 1:28

Well, Cranky knows how to play the game. He'll sit back and he'll take in all the information because I'll ask him on the way somewhere, Cranky, who you want to go with. Well, I don't know. And he'll sit there and hear, he'll go from this little group to that little group and he'll find out who's seeing them. Who's got the best MRI.

SPEAKER_04 1:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:49

And he really does that.

SPEAKER_04 1:51

I know.

SPEAKER_03 1:52

You know, he got to go with Jake Marcus down there who knows that place. And I I've been calling Jake the wizard because he's one he's one of them good guys that he can cut and run or he can sit. It don't matter to him. He's good at defining which he needs to do at the time. Jake was with me. I had the I had a 13-year-old kid, his grandfather bought an auction hunt when we were down there raising money for Dr. Marcus Slashly at Dr. Disturbance, y'all following. And uh we raised a little money for that, and he brought his grandson, and uh the first day he and I hunted together with his grandfather, who was a big man, like 6'6.

SPEAKER_02 2:35

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 2:36

Yeah, so hiding was an issue, but uh we didn't hear a turkey.

SPEAKER_05 2:40

Man.

SPEAKER_03 2:41

I'm talking about we hunted from in in a good place where I have been before.

SPEAKER_05 2:46

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 2:47

Crickets. Hunted till about 10 30, and uh he wanted and I asked him, I said, You want to keep going? And he told me that one of the people that lived in their neighborhood, their son, was playing in the Masters.

SPEAKER_04 3:00

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 3:01

He had just won the USM and he was teeing off at the Masters at like 10 30 or 11.

SPEAKER_05 3:06

That's incredible.

SPEAKER_03 3:08

That's wild.

SPEAKER_05 3:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:10

So we went and watched him tee off. We went back hunting that afternoon, didn't hear a turkey, didn't see a turkey. I think we saw a turkey that afternoon, but anyway, the next morning this Wendy and Jake and I took the grandpa and the 13-year-old and Dr. Marcus Lashley went along with us, which ended up being a big treat for me.

SPEAKER_04 3:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:31

And you you gotta think about this. Everybody's got an opinion. Everybody thinks this is the way, that's the way. But you start asking two of questions I'm talking about hunting questions, not not habitat or DNA and all that. Start asking hunting questions to a scientist who's been working with wild turkeys. He's actually hatched some turkeys that think he's their mom. They imprinted on him. I mean, this guy studies them deep. That's crazy. How much fun did I have asking him questions? Uh and I know we got tired of it, but it was he put he put things in perspective like I I have never thought about. We killed a turkey and it was windy and it took a while. Thank goodness he answered the two call. So I'm glad I got my little part of that hunt, and it was real windy. And uh anyway, and the turkey didn't gobble much, and we just basically waited him out. And uh the right before he stepped into view, he's he was in view for Dr. Marcus and Jake and the grandpa, they were way back behind us. They could see around where I was with the kid. And this thing triple gobbled behind a bush, and me and that little boy couldn't see him, but he did. That's at the I knew then he was way to the right and had to get the little boy moved, which it was it was any it was an amazing hunt. Anyway, I was talking to him about how hard it is for me not to say, Man, I was thinking the whole time he needs to gobble one more time. And I kept thinking, No, I'll just wait him out.

SPEAKER_05 5:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 5:09

And your thoughts are, man, he needs to gobble. And I was talking to Dr. Marcus about that, and he said, you know, because he's probably thinking the same thing, I need her to yelp one more time. And I was like, you know, I have never thought of that.

SPEAKER_04 5:23

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 5:24

And and that I started thinking about that and I said, That's deep. And it that's gonna help me hold off. Because number one, I love to hear him gobble, who don't?

SPEAKER_04 5:34

Right.

SPEAKER_03 5:34

Number two, I can make him gobble pretty good with that too, because I don't know what it is. But it he said, Yeah, there he's probably doing the same thing, especially them old ones. And he said, if uh if he answers you real good, you know, sometimes you just gotta you just gotta wait them out. Make him look for you. And I was like, Well, I've done that, but that's gonna help me think, well, he's wanting me to yelp. I ain't gonna do it. So I uh we got through and had a great visit with him, and uh I made him commit over there. I said, I said, Marcus, you've got to come on the podcast. He said, Oh, I'd love to. And he said, Man, I've been watching you turkey hunt forever, which made me feel old because he's got great news here too. But what a what a cool thing. And I didn't interview him like most people do, talking about, you know, what science. Why is yeah, science. What does this? What does that, and all that? And I just ask him 99% hunting questions. And to me, it's fascinating.

SPEAKER_04 6:38

Yeah, me too. I enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_03 6:40

You were eavesdropping.

SPEAKER_04 6:41

I had to because, like you said, he's the best of both worlds. He's got the scientist background, but he's a thug and he knows how to turkey hunt. It's like, who else would you want to ask these questions?

SPEAKER_03 6:52

Yeah, well, that's a good one. So y'all gonna enjoy this. I'm gonna go ahead and spill some beans and tell you it's gonna be two parts.

SPEAKER_04 6:58

That's a good thing.

SPEAKER_03 6:59

Yeah, I offered to buy his lunch, I was gonna get him here midday, and by the end of that, I was going, well, you want to buy your supper? We kept him up here a long time. So to me, it's a treat. If you love turkey hunting, there's some common sense answers that you may not get from anybody else because he ain't got nothing to prove. He's he's already done that. So, from a scientific view, with uh no science in the conversation, let's go visit was doctor that's at Dr. Disturbance, Dr. Marcus Lashley. Long time no see.

SPEAKER_06 8:17

I know, it's been at least a week. Yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_03 8:19

You know, I made a bunch of posts about when we were in Florida, and it's not that I was pleasantly surprised that you were a, you know, just an A1 class turkey thug hunter. It's just I never thought about it. I've always thought about you as being a scientist and a biologist. And after spending a couple of days and hunting a half a day with you, I went, good grief. I won't talk to him about turkey hunting. And I I I told him, I said, you know, the fact that you're as good at hunting as you are and you have that knowledge, you need some kind of handicap. You should have to hunt an orange vest or something.

SPEAKER_06 8:55

Well, you know, if I hadn't have just eaten humble pie for the last two days, I'd have been a little more keen to agree with you, but they still whip me plenty.

SPEAKER_03 9:04

Yeah, and you know what? We all know what that tastes like. And uh there's nothing like it, and it was so much fun for me to be around you because I got to see that passion side, which it's it's obvious in the work you do and all that. But when I got back, I told Lauren, I said, I'm gonna ask him just hunting questions. So I appreciate you stopping in between spots. You just left North Mississippi, kind of headed down here. I tell people all the time, and they they don't believe me. I said, You could drop a pen right here where we're sitting and do uh do a string, do a 250-mile circle. That's the toughest turkeys on the planet. That's just as tough. They're tough, and I don't know why it is, but anyway, enough about that. I want to know, I'm gonna ask some questions like I want to know where you grew up, where you were born, all that kind of stuff. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 9:53

So where where'd you grow up? I grew up in Belmont, Alabama, which is Sumter County. And uh I know that a bunch of folks around here are real fond of that area. Yeah. Because uh a lot of folks involved in Mossy Oak are from there or or have places over there. So I I grew up down in the bend of the river in Belmont, it's between Livingston and Demopolis, Alabama, and uh, you know, I was fortunate because that little bend of the river has been known for turkeys for a long time, and you know, that I grew up right in the middle of it, so the thick of it.

SPEAKER_03 10:29

Did you grow up hunting and fishing houses?

SPEAKER_06 10:31

Oh yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 10:32

Your your household, mom, you it was a hunting and fishing house.

SPEAKER_06 10:37

That all the men in the family, both sides of the family, you know, it's uh a lot of a lot of hunters. And particularly turkey hunters, you know, every that was one thing that was I I think really attractive about turkeys to me, is it was one of the things that I sort of, you know, looking back on it, it kind of unified the the men in the family. You know, they there was so much uh excitement and camaraderie around their interest in that particular thing, and I didn't really see that, you know, from from other aspects of life. It just seemed to be something that sort of unified them. They were all obsessed with it, and it's something I needed to be a part of, you know.

SPEAKER_03 11:18

Well you're lucky because where where I grew up and I'm older than you, but there wasn't there wasn't any of that camaraderie because wasn't nobody saying anything. You hear them stories, but I'm telling you, I I knew two people in the town that Turkey had in. One of them was a head coach at the football team, and the other one was the barber at the rebel bar shop, and they weren't talking. And uh, I got interested by you know, just reading I read an article about Ben Rogers Lee going to Texas. That's what kind of got me started, but it wasn't uh the information didn't flow freely like it does now.

SPEAKER_06 11:53

Well they they were still uh misleading each other. Oh but all of them were real excited about it. You know, like they they love turkeys and you could see it just exuding out of their being. I didn't see my dad respond to stuff like that very often. That's that's about you know, it's one of the few things that I've just always seen them really excited about.

SPEAKER_03 12:14

Politely ovasive and conveniently absent-minded.

SPEAKER_06 12:19

Is that a good is that a good something like that?

SPEAKER_03 12:23

All right, well, at what point in your life did that wild turkey thing just stick to where you know you were gonna just move on in that world to be a scientist? At some point you had to have a revelation or something.

SPEAKER_06 12:37

Well, it was a you know, I I kind of look back on my my life growing up, and you know, I taught I've talked to my mom about this a few times, and she's like, it there's always something different about you, you know, like that I I kind of equate it for people to understand. There's a lot of folks that drive a car and they don't care how it works. Right? You just get in a car and you expect it to turn on and go. And then there's some folks that want to know how the engine works. And that that's kind of what it was like for me when I at a very young age, in fact, I can remember distinctly the first time I heard one gobble, I was with my dad. And uh, you know, it sort of turned on a light bulb and I was just obsessed with hunting and fishing from a very early age. I can remember going bass fishing, my mom would just leave me at the pond, you know, out on the the golf course there in Livingston. And uh, you know, I was just always obsessed with hunting and fishing, and I also took it a step further than everybody else. I wanted to know how everything was working. I was she she would tell stories, you know, uh about me bringing home a boot full of stuff that I had caught in the pond, and I was trying to figure out, you know, what's the best thing to fish with by seeing what was available to the fish and which one do they like. And you know, I'm bringing crawfish and and snakes and you know, all the all kinds of stuff home. And uh, you know, it's just always been a part of me. It's uh people kind of ask me that question like it was a choice, and I don't really view it that way. It was just the way I am. I can't help it, you know.

SPEAKER_03 14:16

I learned that pretty quick in two days down in Florida. I brought you a tube call as a memento more than anything. Because people, especially one I use with that snap on ring, not many people they fool with it and put it up, and boy, I'm in ten minutes, you had some good sounds like he's gonna kill a turkey with that tube call before we leave Florida. But I made you yep on the wing bone, and I'll tell that story at some point. But uh I you just wouldn't put it down in the further, you know, in in an hour you were cutting on that thing, and then you were working on a basic Yelp, which is way harder to do.

SPEAKER_06 14:52

Yeah, it's hard to be consistent. I have learned that over the last several days.

SPEAKER_03 14:57

But uh I'd say obsessive was uh and it's probably just about turkeys, about everything else. But that's a that's a good quality for a biologist scientist kind of person to have.

SPEAKER_06 15:09

Do you remember your first turkey hunt when you were Yeah, I remember going with my dad, and uh I I don't know how old I was, but I think I was probably five or six years old. And my dad said has said this to me before. My my brother was a little um you know, when he he was growing up, he he wasn't as keen on it, and you know he uh you know didn't want to necessarily sit there all day and and do something like that. But for me I would sit there motionless for hours. You know, just like it just I was just fascinated with it and it was just kind of my nature, and you know, we were a little different. And uh he was really great at at sports and and really keen to do that where I was wanting to be in the woods. And uh I can remember going with my dad and I was kind of sitting between his knees, at least this is the way I recollect it. And uh a turkey came in and was strutting and gobbling and everything, and the and the turkey moved on, it didn't shoot it. And I can just remember that experience, you know, and just I can remember him kind of talking over my shoulder, saying, You can't even blink. Don't don't breathe right now. You can't breathe. Don't do nothing. Yes, you you can't move. And I'd and you know, I hunted with him several times and I'd my my granddaddy as well, and I can just remember him talking about how you you can't I don't care if a mosquito lands on your eyeball, you can't blink. They're gonna see you. Yeah. You know just like this mythical thing. It it is mythical. I know. And I hear y'all talk about you can't trust them. Well that that's what was being ingrained in me. But just seeing the spectacle of the whole thing and hearing them gobble and getting to interact with them and hearing my dad or my granddaddy trying to talk back and forth with them and seeing how excited they got every time one responded, you know, just that whole thing just sucked me in. I couldn't help it.

SPEAKER_03 17:12

Well, we're glad it didn't print it on. I had a I had a person one time ask me at some kind of seminar or something, or his wife. There was a bunch of people there, and they were I was taking questions. She said, How can you love them so much and still shoot them? And I wished I'd have known you then, I would have said, You need to call Dr. Marcus last and ask him that question, because I didn't know if I was going to answer it right, because I don't know if I've seen anybody that I I've seen people that love hunting them and love them, but not not to your level. And that's that's pretty fascinating because you know we need science and we need data and all that, and that's what you base your I guess your hunting skills on. So I I'm gonna get into that. Um one more growing up, did you have any like turkey hunting mentors? Did you read somebody or did you follow somebody when you were younger before you got into college and all that?

SPEAKER_06 18:07

Yeah, that um that's a good question. I I mean I really had that in my family. You know, my daddy was spent a lot of time with me. He got me calls, my granddaddy gave me an old lynchbox call, you know, and and uh my cousin owns hounds tooth game calls, you know, he was excellent with it, and I remember him trying to, you know, teach me how to do different things. My uncle is an avid turkey hunter and has always been, you know, so th I had people around me that were revered for being good turkey hunters. And you know, that that really was uh important because you know they they were so good at it and they all had their their strategies and I got to participate in that at a really young age. It was a bit ri really important, you know, helping me to develop those skills.

SPEAKER_03 19:03

You didn't have a choice. No. You were just you were see, I'm I'm learning and and I love that. I'm gonna ask you this question before we get into the hunting tactics. And everybody wants everybody wants the magic call or the magic move or whatever it is. But uh do you think that uh the love of being able to hunt turkeys drives you even harder in your research to make sure we have 'em?

SPEAKER_06 19:32

Well, that's that's what I was gonna say earlier when you were you kind of got on that topic. It is I mean, I I was a hunter a long time before I was a scientist, and it set me on this path to be, you know, uh really dedicated to research and conservation and outreach, and I'm trying to extend as much knowledge to as many people as possible because I feel really passionate about trying to protect the resource for generations to come. You know, I want my kids and my grandkids to have the opportunity that I had. You know, I I grew up in a place where they were plentiful and I had a lot of opportunity and I I just feel really strongly that that's my calling to try to help provide that for future generations. So it absolutely there's no question my passion for hunting led me down the path to dedicate you know, my career to it, my life to it, to try to help you know, make sure that it continues on.

SPEAKER_03 20:34

Well, we're very appreciative. Like I say, we need the science. And I and when I was kind of baiting you to get you on the podcast, uh I thought about the uh the Mississippi State football coach we just lost. And I took him on a turkey hunt, and everybody they called me and said, Hey, we need a some some some moss yoke for the coach and all that. I said, Good. And then he's like, We want you to take him. I said, Okay, no problem. And he pulled up, everybody was kind of scared, they didn't know how he was gonna act. And I walked up and introduced myself. I said, Now look, I don't follow football too much, so I ain't gonna ask you no football questions. And he put his hands again and said, Thank you, Lord. And we had the best time. So I said, look, we ain't gonna talk about science questions, and that's what everybody wants to know. But uh I'm I'm just gonna concentrate on hunting and on a selfish reason. I'm I'm asking these for myself. I took a few questions from the internet, you know, Instagram and all that, but I I formed all these myself. Okay, and uh first one is uh a common mistake you see, not just beginning turkey hunters, but regular turkey, a common mistake they may make while they're turkey hunting. And I know you go with a lot of people, you guide a ton of people.

SPEAKER_06 21:50

Especially new hunters. New hunters. Uh I would I mean I d I think the the most well, there's a couple of mistakes. The one that I see most often is a lack of patience.

SPEAKER_03 22:04

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 22:05

People get up and move, you know, they get excited, you hear one gobbling, and and you've been fooling with one and they get up and move too quick. And a lot of times, you know, that that gobbler's being stubborn stubborn and and he's gonna end up in your lap. And it's hard to it's hard to sit there, especially for somebody else that you know that's gobbling. So I think patience is a a virtue in the turkey woods, and uh you know, I I rarely see it exercised to the extent. And you know, that's not just sitting there, but also being ready. So it was kind of funny.

SPEAKER_03 22:42

There's a difference.

SPEAKER_06 22:44

Yeah, there's a big difference. And uh I have been the guy that wasn't ready several times in the past, and I've just kicked myself because you know how it is, it starts getting a little uncomfortable, you're sitting up against a tree, and next thing you know, you got your legs crossed in the shotgun laying there in your lap, and then the turkey's in your face, and you're you're stuck. And uh, you know, I I think having that patience is uh you know, really important thing that that will kill a lot of turkeys if folks will let it.

SPEAKER_03 23:18

It's uh it's a hard thing to do. Yeah. When we hunted together, you and I I made a post about this. I said he left, he had his mossy oak top and pants on, a hat and a head net and gloves, and a wing bone. Yeah. And that's it. No vest, no cushion, no turkey chair, no none. Is is that sitting still? Is that is that part of your DNA? Like do you just is that just built? I couldn't sit still that long, just leaned up on my behind against a tree.

SPEAKER_06 23:45

Well, uh, you know, occasionally I'll think about it while I'm out there, but I I think some of it is just natural that I just you know, I'm just built like that. You know, that's sort of a difference between me and my brother that we we both know, you know, we just have different uh different way of of uh doing things and being. So I think some of that's natural, but I'll I'll kind of reflect on it sometimes and and I'll be sitting there and think, I don't know if I've moved and and I'll be thinking like, how long has it been since I moved? Like it's been a while. You know, so I I do think uh some of that, but also I think this is another thing that people need to do more often. I reflect on what I'm doing all the time like that. Where I'll be sitting there and and then start evaluating myself. And I think that you get a lot from that, right? You start to realize you're making mistakes and you can try to improve, you know, uh whatever aspect of life you want to pick, right? I think uh there's a lot that comes from that, and I've I've tried to be really um you know, dialed in on making sure that I'm continuously evaluating myself and trying to improve, and and that goes in the turkey woods. Um I was gonna tell a little story and I won't go all into it, but the first turkey that I had got on this year in Florida, I was with a a landowner and and a land manager, and and they had, you know, they invited me over to come hunt, and it was over in the panhandle, and they've got a beautiful place. And they just wanted, you know, wanted me to have a hunting opportunity with them, and and I was really glad to to have it. And we got set up on a turkey, and it took these turkeys forever to get to us, but we were in the right place, and we had to be patient. And I was sitting there kicking myself because I had forgotten my shooting stick. Or I thought I had. It turns out I've lost it. I cannot I've misplaced it. Uh so I I was sitting there and the way that we were set up and where the turkeys were gonna come, you know, we we've set up on this pinch point, we know the turkeys are going to eventually come through it, and we've just got to wait them out, and there's a there's a group of gobblers, it turned out it was three of them with a bunch of hens. We've got a we he filmed all of it, so I'm gonna put it on my Dr. Disturbance YouTube channel, it's about to come out, uh so people can watch it if they want to see it. But I was sitting there and the way that we were set up, the I needed the gun to be a little bit higher than my knee was, which is where that shooting stick would have come in. And then it was gonna take, you know, it ended up taking them thirty, thirty-five minutes, maybe forty. I mean it was a long time where I needed my shotgun to be slightly higher than my knee, but I was sitting there thinking, you you did this to yourself. So you're gonna sit here and and struggle through this, but you're not going to be here not ready. You that's not what's gonna happen here. These turkeys are gonna come in here and we're gonna get one of them. And uh you're so I had to, you know how it is, you're sitting there uncomfortable, and we didn't have a tree where we were set up, and thank goodness I had a frame in my my uh vest that I was leaning up against, but I needed my gun to be slightly up from my knee, and I sat there holding that shotgun for almost an hour, you know, several inches up from my knee, and I was resting on my knee, but I wasn't getting to rest it on my knee like would have been most comfortable. But I sat there and I mean I was struggling, you know, just sitting there struggling and struggling and struggling, and finally the turkeys came in strutting, and and it was really awesome seeing them. They we had a slow pinch point, they came through like a bulldozer, all three, elbow to elbow wide, strutting and hens. They had a bunch of hens in front of them, they kind of pushed them through. One hand got nervous and she turned around, and she was like, Oh, I can't even go back through here because they're sitting there like a bunch of linebackers, you know. And uh they pushed them on through, and it was you know, but that was one of those things, like almost stubborn. It's like, no, you you're you're not gonna sit here and not be ready, and you forgot the stick, so this is on you. You know, I'm sitting there going through that in my head, but I'm not gonna let him come in here and not be ready.

SPEAKER_03 28:22

Holy cow!

SPEAKER_06 28:23

And I guess you got the shot. Oh, yeah, got the shot and killed the turkey. It was a beautiful turkey. Uh, you know, really nice. In fact, it was uh the longest bearded turkey that I've ever killed.

SPEAKER_05 28:34

You earned it.

SPEAKER_06 28:35

Yep, it was right at 13 inches long beard. So, you know, really just beautiful experience, but I could have very easily gotten lazy and and not been ready. Let your gun down. Right. And, you know, uh I've just I've been burned too many times. I don't trust them.

SPEAKER_03 28:51

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SPEAKER_04 30:23

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SPEAKER_03 31:00

I try to explain to people all the time the difference in being, you know, hunters, the difference in quiet and turkey quiet. Right. And they think you're nuts. They really think you're crazy. And I got to watch you quite, you know, when we were hunting together, you were behind me, sadly, most of the time. But and I'd say my style's a little different than yours, but I'm pretty good at sitting still now, especially with that chair. But I was thinking the whole time, because we were hunting this young kid, and his grandpa had bought an auction hunt, we're raising money for your research down there. And uh we were in front of you, and I had him hidden good. Matter of fact, he was heading he was kind of too far to my left behind me. But when the turkey came up, I expected him to come straight across, and he didn't. He he he came down to the right, which was making it really tough. And I was sitting there thinking, you know, because this this was a long hunt. It took that turkey a long time. And he finally triple gobbled up there close, and I was thinking, I bet you Dr. Marcus Lashley's just thinking cuz is gonna yelp at some point and mess this thing up.

SPEAKER_06 32:08

I was not, I was thinking, I hope they got turned because I knew the kid was pointing the wrong way when he came in. But when he triple gobbled, he was 20 yards straight line of sight to me. And I just melted into the I was in a down tree, and I mean I just felt like I just went right on into the tree and just melted into it because I was thinking that I'm not gonna be the reason this kid doesn't get the kind of relaxing when you don't let it be me. Don't let it be me.

SPEAKER_03 32:38

Well, it was uh it was it was a cool move when he triple gobbled. I finally got that kid moved 180 degrees to the right. Man, he made a great shot too. It's what a special thing for me and Jake, our host, and Steve. Um to be able to hunt with you, Steve got to hunt with you by himself, and you called a turkey up for him on that wing bone, and we are gonna talk about that. I gotta stay focused on now. You gotta remember these answers are coming from somebody who has made turkeys in print on him. He's studied them his whole life, he knows about their eyes, the rods, the conts, and all that. So, what what does Dr. Marcus Lashley look for before he sits down? Because I I I'm learning how your mind works and his gears flying 80 miles an hour. What do you look for when you decide, okay, I can I think I can kill him from right here? What are you looking for?

SPEAKER_06 33:31

Yeah, uh there's a few things that I think stick out. I bet uh one, you gotta be able to hide. I think that's a mistake that folks make to just get on a tree that's wide enough. Yeah. And that, you know, not thinking about where can you hide, and sometimes it's not even a tree. You know, that this uh this morning I got on a turkey, and it you know, some of this kind of stuff is uh because of my line of work and uh I've done so much work with prescribed burning, for example, and uh, you know, showing how valuable that is for turkeys. I was in a a hardwood stand this morning that that they had burned, which I had promoted, you know, and they they burned it, and uh there was a tree that had fallen down and the stump had burned out. And I mean it was a big old giant oak, you know, the this big stump. And it was it created this little hole. So I just got in there. And the hen came right through there, she came five yards from me. I ended up I ended up uh getting a video of her and it was kind of funny because she went to dusting and it was it wasn't a dust bowl. I was thinking it's this is a dust cloud because she was throwing dust everywhere and uh I got to sit there and watch her do that, and I'm sitting in a burned out stump hole, you know, leaning up against this this piece of the oak that that remained, but you know, that that was the best place to hide. And she walked right in there, right like I wasn't even there, and she got up and she was actually under a pokeweed plant. It was so I mean it was just fun. But that you know, these are kind of things that I'm getting out of it that m some people may not be. I'm thinking about all of this stuff, and you know, just appreciating that hen coming in and she's dusting, she's got to do that for several reasons, really important to her biology, and she also needs to hide, so she's in there tucked under a pokeweed plant, which is also an exceptional while you know, I'm just going through all this stuff, just thinking about it, just giggling, watching her do that while I'm sitting in a burned-out stump hole. But, you know, that to me, there were cut there were two things that I picked the spot for. I I had been following these gobblers with a bunch of hens. They're not gonna do nothing except stay with those hens in the open. It was also windy. Our data shows really clearly when it's windy, they get in the open. Like we, you know, that's so the science and the hunting is intertwined. I'm going through this stuff in my head. And uh there was a this burn stand and a couple of ag fields and a pinch point, and I could hide really well. I was sort of in between where where they were and where I thought they wanted to be, and uh got in that stump hole. So I'm I picked a place that's a hiding spot, but also that's going to sort of narrow down their options to where I'm now I've gotten favor. And uh unfortunately they turned and did not play that game. They went on the other way, and only one hen broke off, and she came over there and gave me a show, and I enjoyed that. Yeah. Uh, but you know, I was that that was what I was doing, was trying to evaluate the situation, and you know, these field birds with a bunch of hens, there's not a whole lot you can do with that. So what I was trying to do is figure out how I can narrow down, you know, the their options so that it gives me an advantage. And I I think, you know, when folks are trying to pick a place, that is the way to do it. You you're trying to pick a place that you can hide so that you can beat them when they get close enough, and then try to narrow down the ways they can escape you.

SPEAKER_03 37:16

That's why you should have to hunt the horns best. You've got too much back knowledge when you get out there. Uh I was gonna ask you this later, but you brought it up. Friend of mine, Dwight Jones, who's to me the best auctioneer on the planet, he does tons of NWTF. You know sometimes when he saw my post about you coming, he said, Ask him this. And and and he was coming from a hunter standpoint, but he and he's got like everybody else, he's got cameras out and he turkey hunts a lot. He said, I've never seen a gobbler dusting in a dust bowl. It's always hence. D do they even use them? That's a good question. I never thought of it.

SPEAKER_06 37:54

Um I don't know if they use them as often, yeah, but they certainly will. And they start doing that really early. Uh and in fact, they start doing that at about five days old. And I know that because I have lived with them, you know, and and like you were saying, I've imprinted them on me and walked around with them. And uh yeah, they s they start doing it then, and uh, you know, we see them do it some in our our captive population where they're now jakes, you know, they're almost a year old now, and uh you know, we we see them do it, but certainly not to the same frequency, I would say, as a hen. But you know, one another thing about that is a you know, understanding the biology of the animal, you start to understand some tactics that come from that. So if you find a place where there's a whole bunch of dusting going on, it's often in, you know, it'll be in a field or something where there's some bare soil, but it's often in the shady, you know, maybe a overhanging oak or something's right there nearby, and they often are doing that late in the morning up into the middle of the day. So, you know, good place to key in on when you s when you've struck out that morning and you need to go host up somewhere when nobody's got one.

SPEAKER_03 39:15

I don't know that I've ever seen one. I had a guy, one of my buddies said he he killed a turkey in Alabama and he was at his son-in-law's place and he said he said that he had planted something there and he had he had started discing and he quit. He just had fresh dirt at the end of that food pot. He said, Every one of them turkeys was staying down there in that fresh disc dirt, and they said they'd come out there in dust and peck around and go back. He never did call one up, I don't think, but it's like, well, that makes sense. I I've never thought of that.

SPEAKER_06 39:44

So Well, and uh I was just thinking, I couldn't remember who it was, but I'm pretty sure that it was Tess Jolly sent me some uh video footage of a gobbler in a in a dust bowl.

SPEAKER_03 39:58

Yeah, yeah, that's it. I don't know that I've ever seen it. Not that I'm any kind of expert by any stretch. All right, I had a guy, we me and Cranky were talking about this. I hear this all the time, especially in Texas. They say, uh, man, if if he cuts you off while you calling, if and sometimes you won't hear him if you're actually calling and he gobbles, but he said, if he cuts you off, he's coming in. Is is there any is that another myth we about to bust?

SPEAKER_06 40:26

I'll I'll say this. My interpretation of that behavior is that he is excited.

SPEAKER_04 40:32

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 40:33

So he is excited about you know the the opportunity to be with a hen, and that does not necessarily mean he is not with him already. It doesn't necessarily mean he's gonna leave where he's strutting. So I I would say it is somewhat of a myth. That is he he's definitely not gonna run in because of that. Like that's not an indicator, but that is an indicator that he's interested. And sometimes he does that. But you know as well as I do, sometimes you'll have one that's gobbling well and you'll call at him and he'll quit gobbling.

SPEAKER_03 41:09

I thought that was just me.

SPEAKER_06 41:11

Sometimes that means he's coming.

SPEAKER_03 41:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 41:13

Um yeah, the it's uh and matter of fact, I can tell you another story.

SPEAKER_03 41:19

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_06 41:20

I I took a young lady, she actually works in my lab. It was our first time hunting uh just a couple of days ago, it was three days ago while as we're recording this. And uh we were on the Gator Gobblers women's hunt. Uh so you know, uh an opportunity to get young women into hunting, and uh they they've been doing it for years, and I've been helping guide here for the last few. And uh so they paired me with somebody who works for me. Poor girl. Poor girl, she drew this short straw. So we got out and uh we got on this turkey, and first we we went to a place where we thought one was gonna be roosted, and he gobbled, and he was several hundred yards from us in a right on the property line, and I was you know, I just decided we we let's go somewhere else. So we finally went to another place and uh we heard a turkey gobbling while we were walking down the road. And again, we didn't have anywhere to hide, you know, at the where we heard him, and I was looking around and I kind of pointed out to her because I was trying to give her a you know an in some insight into what was going on in my head and why we were doing things the way we were doing. We were on this road and it was a stretch that you could see maybe 200 yards and the turkey when he gobbled, he's less than a hundred, you know, but he's he's on a road that put that cuts off and it's but he's between the food plot that's on the road and the main road that you know that they're using to drive on. And we're on the main road you can drive on. So you know, I I told her, I don't want to get right here, even though we've got a good tree to get on, because if by the time he he will be able to see down this road for a hundred yards past us before we can shoot him. He's gonna see us 20 or 30 yards, you know, he's gonna be able to see down the road too far. So we if we went up the road just a little ways, and there was a slight curve in it, and there was a bush kind of sticking out on the right side, and I was like, if we get right there at that bush, by the time he can see down this road, right when he can see down the road, he's gonna stop and stand there and look, and he's gonna be in your barrel. So, you know, kind of walking her through it, even though we don't have a tree to sit on. So what we did, I set her up, and we're kind of tucked over on the right side of the road, and I sat right behind her and put my knee up and let her lean on that. And then I'm also just kind of talking right over her shoulder, you know. So I told her, I was like, Okay, are you comfortable? You feel good, can you see right here? I told her there was one little sweet gum limb, you know, leaning out. And I was like, you can shoot directly through that if he's standing right here, that he's in range, you know, kind of walked her through all of these different things that are gonna happen. If he read the script, that is. And uh so we're sitting there and he he's gobbling really well. You know, everything comes over, he's gobbling at it, and I have not called yet, and then I finally was like, Okay, do you feel like you're ready? And she said, Yes. You know, this is probably a five minute span. I said, Okay, I'm gonna call at him and then we'll see what happens. So I call at him. He's been gobbling every few minutes, you know. I call at him, he gobbles and then he stops and then we go, five minutes, ten minutes. And then she's like, Is it is it gone? And I was like, you can you know, you can hear it in their voice sometimes when they answer you, it's like and I told her, I said, There's there's four things that could have happened right here. One, he's gone. That's bad. Two, he's just strutting right there and he hasn't moved and that's neutral. Three, he stopped gobbling because now he's coming. That's good. You know, and we need to be ready. And uh the fourth one is there was another bird gobbling down the you know, down the road, and it's like the other one is now they're in a competition and I don't know what's gonna happen here. You know, so that one's sort of a wild card. It could be really good or really bad, I don't know what's gonna happen, but you know, we're we're kinda walking through this and and talking about it. And I was like, But the main thing is you've gotta sit here patiently and be ready because he's gonna pop out and it's like I'm gonna see him before you but you know, you need to be ready and I'm gonna be able to once he gets when I can probably see him ten yards farther and she's gonna be able to because of my vantage and uh I was like, I'm gonna be able to tell you what's going on. And then I said, if I was a betting man, I'd bet he's coming. So he didn't gobble for like twenty five minutes maybe and then all of a sudden I said, I can see him and then you could see it just you know, she got so excited and and I and he got there and he was about three yards shy of where she could shoot. And he was standing there just straight up looking down the road and I was like, Man, we're just I missed it just that much, you know, and I told her, I was like, Listen, I I know that you're struggling right now, you're excited. She can't see him still. I was like, you're you're excited and and you're struggling, like you're in a hard position, you're trying to hold the gun, you're trying to stay on it. I I get it, I know, but you've got to fight everything in your being to move right now. You've got to be still. Because if you move it's over. And then he finally took that extra three steps and she shot him. We sat there, but you know in that case I I did I did a three-note yelp and he answered it. And then that was it. He never said another word.

SPEAKER_03 47:28

Took him a half an hour. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 47:30

And to to make up fifty yards. That's all that's how far he had to come for us to shoot him.

SPEAKER_03 47:35

You know you're throwing out all kind of things that's gonna be memes for turkey hunters now. Bad neutral good. I was like, I can see that. You need a t-shirt that says that to sell on. If he's gone, that's bad. Bad neutral. Your mind just works way different, and that that's fascinating. But boy, good for her having somebody like you.

SPEAKER_06 47:56

It's uh She was so tickled too. And she was like, I I understand. She'd been uh editing our stuff and you know, putting out all this content. She's one of the the communications specialists in my lab. And she's from South Africa. You know, she didn't she'd never been a part of that. And then she got in it and she I mean she's just gotten in love with this culture, you know, in the turkey world, and and she was like, I've got I d I just feel like I've got to do this. And I was like, Let's do it.

SPEAKER_03 48:25

Good for her. Now she gets it.

SPEAKER_06 48:26

Yeah, and then after it, she's like, I I I get it. Like I I just I understand.

SPEAKER_03 48:32

It's it's like it's a saber-toothed tiger. Uh gonna reap your throat out. It's just unbelievable. Yeah. And while I was sitting up there with that that little boy on our hunt, where you were gracious enough to go with us, I had my Tetris in and it's a frequency thing. I was hearing the turkeys fine, but I could hear every once in a while because the wind was blowing from y'all to me, I could hear you and Jake back there wishburning you weren't that far, but y'all were talking about making him look for you. Making him look for you. Talk about that, and I know it's about patience, but I feel like that's one of your main strategies when you're set up on one.

SPEAKER_06 49:07

Is that true? It is for sure. And I think that's you know, when we were talking about some of the key uh characteristics, and in fact, uh you know, I was just telling you that story. Uh the reason that we picked our spot, it was the most uncomfortable position we could have been in for her. And uh but but what it did for us is uh it got us to be uh in a position that where he got to where he could look, he was dead. And we were we were within three steps of of what that ac where that actually was. He almost stood in the spot that I'd planned him to stand and to look down that road. And you know, that's exactly what was going through my head, you know, is we want him to come in looking for us and he if he can see past us, we need to already be able to shoot him. So either you're gonna have to set up so that you've got something behind you so that he's gotta come around to see behind it. Uh you know, I don't want him to come in and be able to see that there's no hen within a few hundred yards. So, you know, when I'm thinking about making him look, I'm either thinking about getting him in a position where there's an obstruction where the hen could be behind it, or once he can see a long ways, he's already dead. Too late.

SPEAKER_03 50:30

See, I I say that all the time. There's the art of setting up i is kind of getting lost. And that I I heard y'all back there whispering about that, and I was and I was making sure I didn't call. People tell me I call too much all the time. I don't really call too much. They they confused me popping the tube call, trying to make one gobble with I do that all the time. I don't. And you saw that, it's just a locator thing, but the way the way your mind works, that's the way you kill turkeys. Is uh but that make making them look for you. And I'm sure we're not like carton new science here. It's like a lot of good turkey hunters do that. A lot of people don't think about that. Yeah. You know, the road makes a bend, I'm gonna get where he can't see. That that's just basic to to turkey killers, but a lot of people don't think about that. They just say, Oh, there's a big tree, I'm gonna sit there.

SPEAKER_06 51:23

Right. It would have been the most comfortable place and and we may have killed him, but we probably wouldn't have.

SPEAKER_03 51:28

Probably wouldn't have. If he was if he was determined to if it took him 35 minutes to come 50 yards, you probably wouldn't have killed him like that.

SPEAKER_06 51:37

He came just far enough that he could see down the road where that hen was supposed to be.

SPEAKER_03 51:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 51:42

And it and it killed him.

SPEAKER_03 51:44

That turkey the kid killed with us the other day, he was as far as he was going. I don't know what he saw. He didn't see you. He didn't and I think I got the kid moved in time, but he had made his mark and we killed him at exactly the last moment.

SPEAKER_06 51:58

Yeah. Well, something else that that he and I talked about a good bit, and uh, you know, I hadn't thought about it this way, but you know, Jake was was saying this. And I definitely do this. You know, that once he started saying it, I started reflecting on it and was like, oh yeah, that you know, when how many times have you said, Man, we just need another gobble? Just so we know where he's at. Just one more. We need another gobble right now, real bad. And it's just eating you alive. You know? Like it I I say that almost every time I turkey hunt.

SPEAKER_05 52:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 52:35

And there's a lot to be said about this. He's on the other side of that and he's hearing this hen, and then all of a sudden this hen's gone silent that's supposed to be coming to him. And he doesn't know if she's coming or not, because she ain't saying nothing. And it's just eating him alive. And you gotta let it eat at him. He's he's gonna he eventually is gonna it's gonna uh tear him up and he's just gonna have to come take a look. And if you're in the right position, when he takes that look, you got him.

SPEAKER_03 53:06

That's uh what a great way to think of it. That that's what you kill them turkeys, it's got them big old hooks over and them old bad ones, too. That's just fascinating to me, especially coming from somebody that knows so much.

SPEAKER_02 53:20

Hey folks, it's Jeff Foxworthy. You know, when I was a kid, my dad bought back the farm that he had grown up on, and I absolutely love that place. I knew every square inch of it. It truly was my favorite place on earth. And when you're looking to find a favorite place for you and your family, Monteo Properties can help. Visit mounteoproperties.com to begin your search today.

SPEAKER_01 53:49

This is Kevin Van Dam, and you're listening to A Fistful of Dirt with Cud Strickland. He's not much of a fisherman, but he knows some people. Approved by anglers, hunters, food plotters, and moms everywhere. It's KVD approved.

SPEAKER_03 54:05

All right, I'm ready to keep going. Part two. Part one was awesome, and I get a little more I guess I get I I I'm gonna keep throwing hunting questions at him, but uh like I said, what a neat way to get some information. You know, what a wealth of knowledge and and uh this one thing to get him interviews, another thing I spent two or three days with him in turkey camp, seeing how he had all you know, he got there and he'd made up his mind he was gonna kill a turkey with that wing bone. And that's all he was fooling with until I gave him a tube call. And he said, No, I've never had one of these, not like that. Mine's the primos with the snap-on reed. I'm telling you, for the next hour, this was midday. I could hear him all over that yard out there, changing his lip and all that. And we and he called me back over, he said, Now one more time, and I want you to yel on it. He had already started cutting on it, he said, I want you to yelp on it. And he'd watch my lip get, you know, what are you saying? And and I'm telling you, at the end of the hour, he was sounding good. Those things are hard to run.

SPEAKER_04 55:09

They are.

SPEAKER_03 55:10

His mind is just like that. He's one of them people that's like, Don't tell me I can't do something. And uh pretty lucky that and it was certainly divine intervention, I think he ended up where he did. Yeah. Talking about his his dad and his uncles and all that took him and how long he got to sit there and all that. But very interesting stuff. And uh glad I got to share camp with him. We open up next week. Uh hopefully I'll be telling the story of Cranky.

SPEAKER_04 55:39

Nebraska.

SPEAKER_03 55:40

That's right, right. I don't know if I've made a post yet or not, but Cranky's going for that grand slam and uh holy cow.

SPEAKER_04 55:47

Halfway there.

SPEAKER_03 55:48

Halfway there. And uh no, he yeah, he he's and all he needs is a mirium.

SPEAKER_04 55:54

If he kills Oh, I thought y'all were trying to do it in one season. My bad.

SPEAKER_03 55:58

Look, if he gets his miriam and we kill an Eastern, he will do it in one season. But he's got plenty of turkeys under his belt, but you don't have to kill the Grand Slam in one year.

SPEAKER_04 56:06

Right.

SPEAKER_03 56:07

And uh somebody asked me the other day, was he gonna get the World Slam? I'm like, No, I don't really do that. I don't we don't really do that.

SPEAKER_04 56:15

It's not our thing.

SPEAKER_03 56:16

You see the isolated turkeys down in South America, uh they ain't in my group.

SPEAKER_04 56:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 56:21

They're not in my slam. But anyway, hopefully we got a mirror and we'll talk about that next week. So from uh y'all stand by next week's gonna be better. I'm telling you a lot more hardcore questions with uh real common sense truth bombs thrown at you. So from me and Laureen up in the Camo Cave from Bonsey Oak and Mossy Oak Properties, God bless you.

SPEAKER_04 56:43

We'll see you in seven days.

SPEAKER_00 56:50

Your favorite place.