Is This Better On a Rewatch? (Dawson’s Creek 2x15) PART 2

We’re back with part two of Season 2, Episode 15—and if part one was about finding your voice, this half is all about what happens after the truth is out.

In this episode, we dive deeper into Jack and Andie’s relationship with their dad, unpacking the emotional weight of everything that’s been said (and everything that hasn’t). We also break down Dawson and Joey, and how their dynamic continues to shift in ways that feel both familiar and completely different at the same time.

Plus, we get into Andie and Pacey’s growing connection, and why their dynamic feels like a refreshing contrast to everything else happening in Capeside. And of course, we talk about Jen and Grams, and the quiet, evolving strength of their relationship that continues to surprise us on a rewatch.

This half of the episode feels more reflective, more emotional, and maybe even more complicated—because once everything’s out in the open, there’s no going back.

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Season two of Dawson’s Creek continues to show that honesty doesn’t simplify things—it just makes everything a little more real. And this episode proves that once emotions are on the table, everything changes. 🎙️✨

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Welcome to Press Play again, two roommates and one remote, the rewatch podcast where we dive back into the shows and movies we couldn't stop talking about in college and probably still can't. We're your hosts, Anna and Megan. Two roommates with one remote, ready to laugh, debate, and maybe get a little too nostalgic as we revisit the classics and discover a few new favorites along the way. So grab your popcorn, press play, and hang out with us as we rewind it all, episode by episode, movie by movie. More friendship are there. It's like if y'all could all get out of your own ways and out of your own rear ends, y'all could be the best group of friends in the whole wide world. But yeah, absolutely. But then when they're dancing and the camera moves back to Jen and Ty at the table, Jen is watching them like she has been in the other episodes longingly and with a little bit of jealousy. Yes. And it it was just a brief moment. It didn't last because then Ty starts talking about the fruit fly part of it all. Well, I think that's part of what he was trying to draw her attention away from them. Because number one, hey, she's there with him. I do appreciate though that it's not even acknowledged with words in this scene. It's not like, so how long have you been in love with them? Or it's not acknowledged. It has been acknowledged in other scenes in other episodes. It's just we see it in the way, well, I'm sure it was on the page for her to play it that way, but we see just in her facial expression between the lines. Absolutely. And I appreciate when shows let us read between the lines instead of just saying it with so much dialogue all the time, they just let us be smart. Right. And it it wasn't clunky, like some things were so way made way too obvious for you as the viewer to pick up on. Yeah, no. Um, that was a very well done scene, in my opinion. You know what else I like about this teen show? Because they are teenagers who aren't doing these things every weekend. I appreciate that about Dawson's Creek is that like not every teenager is out partying every night of the week or weekend and drinking all the time. I'm about to make a contradicting or contradictory statement. In some aspects, it's almost like they still include a little thread of some innocence. Uh-huh. Despite talking about sex all the time. Yes, and some of the other things that ruin it or strip it. But there there are some inflictions or inflections of it that's that's like we'll sprinkle a little bit of innocence in there just to keep it a little bit realistic. And I agree, they talk about it so much. But again, the innocence of even that is they're talking about it, they're not doing it. Right. What were we talking about it all the time? Absolutely not. No. But I know people who were doing it all the time. Yeah. So the difference in a lot of these teen dramas is like they're way too mature. And yes, Dawson's Creek talks a little mature, but the way that they act is is very e sometimes even under age. Sometimes, yeah. In some way. You know what I mean? Like they're talking about it, which I don't we did not do. Well, they're just they're too focused on it. Yes, yes. It was but and I don't know. I I just wasn't. I don't know if other people were talking about it all the time, and I just wasn't a part of those conversations. I I have no idea. But man. Yeah, it is, it's a it's a the show is kind of like I don't want to call it a balance because that's not the right word either, but it's a weird yeah, something. Uh-huh. But yeah, I agree. Um, let me make sure I wasn't forgetting anything. I did get tickled when Joey makes the comment. I didn't write this down, but when she makes the comment, where do you learn to play like that? And Jen says, church. Church. Or probably church. They back up. Yes. Dawson left. Yes. But I mean, I think they're a little bit tips of your buzz. And you know, they're they're getting past themselves and just hanging out. Yes, yes. And I that's what I mean by if they could just get out of their own way. And just let themselves all be friends. At that point, though, they had not even they didn't have anything to drink because are you sure? Because if you looked around the table. Well, I think that might have been a little later because in that in that exact scene, okay, he orders the four usuals. They say, What's a usual? And then when he says it's a stiff surprise, they Joey and Dawson both say, We'll take a coke. Okay. As the waiter walks away, that's when Ty gets called up to play the piano. Yeah. And then in the same he starts playing, and that's when they're like, How did he learn to play like that? And Jen says, church, and they're laughing. Now, I I could be, there could have been like a little bit of time lapse that was just very fluid and I didn't even notice it. And and when they're talking about, well, my boyfriend might be gay and this and that. There could have been at that point, but at first they just order coke. And then I think they ordered there's martini glasses around the table. So well he ordered four of them. I know. So who drank them? Could have been any of them, but but they weren't, I don't think that they were empty. Um, but you know, Dawson's like, we'll take three more usuals. So I thought they were joke, he was joking when he said that. Okay, I don't know. But I mean, when they when he walks Joey home and the conversation sounds slightly slurred and a little under the influence, you know, which sometimes helps you ask questions that you would not normally yeah. It just yeah. But anyway, I just I thought that this, yeah, it was I liked that. I love that scene. I wish there was more of that. There will be at some point. And honestly, I will go ahead and say this. I think that is why I really love the college season so much. Like people are so against them and they just can't stand them. And there's things in it, obviously, I still I love the high school more, high school seasons more, but I think they just have more of a friendship bond in the college seasons that I love. It's like it's not the same back and forth. She likes me, but I like her, but I'm still in love with you. It's not as much of that, and you can just enjoy it, and they enjoy each other, and that's what those seasons are for me. So I think that you'll see what I'm talking about when we get to those, I hope so and kind of we can think back on this and see if it is similar, but um yes, I think go ahead. I was gonna say, I you know, there's the conversation that takes place between between Joey and Dawson when they're dancing, and he basically tells her that you know Jack's missing out by not being there with her because of course we've not mentioned that Jack has to call and cancel their romantic evening they're supposed to have had that night because he's going to dinner with his dad and Andy. Yeah. And um So she does she decides to go with Dawson like he and Biden. Yes, but I mean, even then, so I mean, I I'd made a note that you know, Jack cancels on her, Joey calls Dawson, they go with Ty and Jen to this jazz bar, you know, so forth of this scene that we've been describing plays out. And then um, you know, she's again asking Dawson if he thinks that Jack is gay, and he admits that he's thought about it a time or two. Um, you know, but then we've got well, and he she's he says, she says, Well, I know him better than you. She starts to get defensive again. Right. Well, he asks her, Do you know him better than than you know me or whatever, however he phrases it. She says no. No, of course she would say that. Right. You can't no, she says not yet. Right. She says not yet. Yes. But then and she's that's when she brings up I can see it in your eyes. I can read it in your eyes. Yeah. Some something to that effect. And he asks her. This was, I think, the only cringy moment for Dawson for me was when he says, What are my eyes saying now? Oh, I missed that. I must have been making a note. Yeah. That's awkward. He's he's what are my eyes saying now? And she she says, and I missed some of this because I was writing some things down, but she ends it with, they're saying it's it's comfortable here as friends. Yeah. And then she lays her head on his shoulder and he he says something like, Yeah, or I'm glad you see that. I I forget what he said, but it was it was a sweet scene, but she again reiterates as friends. Yeah, she's hardcore friend zoning him. But but why? Because she's giving him mixed signals, not not in accepting and going to hang out with him. I don't mean that's mixed signal, but she is. It's but it's been going on. Yes, it has. I think that Joey is just can just as confused about her feelings towards Dawson and fearful of letting herself fully feel them for him, as much as Jack is confused about himself. Which I completely understand where she's coming from in that because when she broke up with him, it was because she was afraid she was losing who she was, right? Because all she had was him. I get that. So she is afraid to kind of jump back into that. I I think there's something though that's underlying that Joey can't get to or hasn't figured out yet that's that's truly the root of why she's not with him. Like there's at the end of the day, if she loved him that much and had no reservations whatsoever, she would be with him by now. I but there's a thing that she knows she's not supposed to be with him. I think that too, but that's that's what I'm trying to get at. I think there's a root of something that that just gives her some hesitation or just whatever it is that that that because when you're constantly and and we'll see when they do get back together, like when you're constantly looking for a reason why you can't be together or should not be together, there's a reason for that. Right. If you're looking for the problem all the time. If if you've got hesitation or some reservations, there's a root and a reason for that. And and don't sweep that under the rug. It's it's worth digging up. Yeah. The last bit is Pacey and Andy. They have not spoken in a week, and they are both holding their ground that they both deserve apologies from one another. What? Well, are we are we gonna come back to Jack telling Joey? Yeah. Okay, okay. So we when you said the last thing, sorry. Okay, go ahead. No, it's okay. Um, I wrote down that I understand his side and why he is upset, and I struggled a little bit with understanding hers fully. I'm not saying she did not have a right to how she was feeling. I just struggled with fully relating to it. And I get like this, I have just done this thing that I was standing up for what I thought was right. Thinking that he was defending her brother. My brother got suspended, and now I haven't even heard from her. So I've completely, which I know he had that con they had that conversation on the dock, and he he does let her have it just a little bit, but no communication. You would be in your head for an entire week of like, oh my gosh. And then especially at 15, it starts spiraling and being like, they don't even care, she's not even gonna call me. Fine, I'm so mad. And and so, but she is also having the same thing because he called her weak and insensitive, and blunt and honest there. I just don't I know why she was upset from the beginning, okay. But it's like a week has passed and she is still holding strong, and it's like you haven't even is this just a teenage thing that you that you are still just focusing on the words he called you, and you haven't stopped to think about this the full picture situation and what he did and what he's going through right now? Is that just an age thing? That a girl is focusing on my boyfriend called me weak, you know, or like where I don't fully get why she has the the leg to stand on of like you owe me an apology. I don't know other than maybe there's some aspect of this of like somehow he's said what he said, and maybe she thinks that the ball is in his court and that it's up to him to reach out. Um, like if he's so upset with me, well then I don't know, but I'm I'm with you. I I it I struggle to identify with her side enough to agree. Um I also think that because where they left that conversation on the dock was him saying, I needed you. I needed you to be there, even if you didn't agree with it, I needed you. Yeah, and so he leaves. And yes, he does say, I don't even really remember him calling her weak and insensitive. I do. Okay, I believe you. But so even him saying that, like he left the conversation telling her, I needed you in this moment, and he leaves. So if I had been the one, if I had been pacey in this and I left the conversation that way, I would be thinking the same thing that she would reach out to me. Right, not me have to reach out again because I told you how I felt. Right, but she had already stated how she felt about it too, and just by the way that she approached it, would have told me in his shoes, she ain't gonna apologize. And I just think that she also was still living in denial about her brother, though. Oh, a thousand Well, she still is when this is taking place. Yes, that's what I mean. That's what I mean. She was she that's why no apology could come from either one of them because Pacey was still holding on to what had happened with the teacher. She is still living in denial that anything is happening with her brother, and and what Pacey did escalated the whole thing and and all of this, and the whole apology conversation takes place after her eyes are finally open to what Jack is actually dealing with right now, right? And after Pacey has now had this entire moment with the teacher, right, and I mean you've got Pacey, who's almost in in this mindset of of like a martyr because he's been suspended and all this, and then you know she's in denial of her brother, and then you I mean, yes, by the time that they actually finally apologize to each other and make up it's just I don't know. Like I I don't want to say I'm not saying that it's a throwaway storyline, but and I don't want to say that it's not as important, but I just feel like she has taken it way more personally than was really her place to take it. Does that make any sense? Yeah, yeah. That might sound ugly, but no, but their apology conversation was really sweet. She was cute. I I just think that Pacey Joshua Jackson has really grown into himself, and he looks so cute in this season. I mean, this episode in particular, I was like, oh my gosh, I'm in love with him. I'm in love with him. Everything about him. And when he walks out of the school and he sees her, and I mean she looked pretty in multiple scenes of this episode. Yeah, like when they go to dinner with their dad, she looks so pretty. And her hair was done just right with her little berrette and everything else, you know, and then you've got it just her little clip when when her and Paisy are having their conversation at the end. Yeah. Just her little halfback clip. It was cute. Right. She looked pretty. But what I find so fun about their relationship is that there is this underlying like competitive nature between the two of them, not in a in a negative way, but it's like even with their apology, they're like, No, I'm apologizing to you. It's a stubborn form of competition. And it but it's sweet at the same time. And he's like, Will you just shut up and let me apologize to you? Well, I think that's also part of why neither one reached out to each other. It's not always sweet. Oh no. It it can work against you, but it's it's part of what fuels their relationship too. Yes. But she admits, I think I've molded you, I've tried to mold you into somebody that I wanted you to be, into somebody you're not and who I expected you to be. Um, and and but who he is is enough. And and she says that I don't uh because she says I need a partner. What does she say before? I don't need I don't need a knight in shining armor or a or a or a hero or something. But I need a partner. Yeah. And I thought it was a very mature conversation. It was. He says that he's sorry too. He says it first and and um he didn't want to add to the her problems, and then when she apologizes, he says, I'm always losing to you. Because he says, How is your apology better than mine? He cups her face and they kiss, and then he pulls away and says, I take that back. I'm the winner here. It was sweet, and kisses her forehead. Jack does when he when he is yelling at his dad and and he's telling him to ask the question again, and the dad's refusing basically because he doesn't want to hear the answer. And Jack is like, you know, you have known. You can't even look at me. You know. I thought it was a really important conversation, important scene between them because it it's it's he's pointing out the root of where their problem kind of starts between father and son. It's like you can't look at me. This is where your disappointment really comes from with me, is that Tim, like you said, Tim is the real son, and then there's me. I can't hide behind Tim anymore, as the dad says. And he knows, you know. Right. And you bringing up that he says that you can't even look at me. I feel like that underscores the dad's comment at dinner about people see you now. Because Tim's not there. So, in other words, if the dad had Tim to look at, he didn't have to look at Jack. You didn't have to pay attention. No. And in many cases, it may be that the dad is projecting the idea that you know, Tim's gone, you've got more eyes on you now. Just because now he has to, he's forced to look at Jack because Tim's gone. You know, this is a a much smaller scale because obviously I haven't had to deal with um coming out. Um but just the the the topic of disappointment and feeling like your parents are disappointed because that was always the worst thing for me. You can yell at me, you can ground me and whatever be mad at me. But if you say you're disappointed in me, oh my gosh. cuts it cuts so deep but I can remember sitting at the top of the stairs at home and like ha finally saying something else had happened it wasn't like I had we had had this fight it's like I was emotional that day or something and I flew out the handle and I finally said the words like I'm sorry that I I have done all of this and disappointed and spent all this money and I couldn't even do it and because I thought that I needed to live up to something I mean I had always had great grades and done so well in school and then all this different podcast and I I said the word I feel like I have disappointed everybody and I remember them going what yeah nobody nobody thinks that but I let I thought that and so it felt like this giant thing across my forehead and I felt like everybody else felt that way and I think Jack deals with that a little bit like he's fighting it and he knows deep down he knows this about himself and he's fighting it not hiding he's fighting it to try and make it not true. And he he feels like everybody can see it so he is overcompensating in ways with Joey. And so he's confronted with it again when his dad shows up and he knows he's such a disappointment to his dad and it just I just can't imagine if my parents had been like we we are so disappointed that you couldn't do this or you you are this way or I just can't imagine. And I was in my 20s so I can't I definitely can't imagine it at 16 and I did some stupid stuff at 16 I just it it makes me think about a scene from the Nobody Wants This show I know I've talked to you about it before but it's where Morgan goes to the bathroom and she's been crying and Bina is in there and it's where she I have seen that episode has been upset about what the guy told her about herself and Bina basically tells her that you know I don't think that you're upset or that it hurts because these people actually think that it's true. It's because you think it's true or like that you believe that about yourself. And that's ultimately the root of that problem. And that's the root of a lot of problems. It is and it's it's how do you get out of your own head enough to gain a new perspective and and see it in the right light and not you know self-condemnation. Which is why your mind is such a battlefield and why mental health is so important. Mental hygiene I feel like needs to be a term instead of just mental health because literally I I've heard somebody say before no stinking thinking about you know if if all you're doing is thinking negative thoughts and stuff like that it it's time to figure out how to set those things aside and and regroup and start over. I think that's why it's so important to talk to say things out loud because what my problem becomes is when I'm just thinking it over and over. Ruminating on it. Yes and then it just starts festering I internalize it and I hold on to it until it just comes and when you when you think it over and over it's almost like not almost it is you start thinking it's like it gets twisted in your head someone else has said that it wasn't just in your head this came from somewhere else. Right uh does for me. They say you your brain can't decipher between you saying a lie to yourself and you saying the truth. So if you think it's like your brain believes it. Even though if you know it's false it it's deeper than that. So you know telling yourself negative stuff is a dangerous thing. Really just kind of scratching the surface of like when we have the thoughts about ourselves and we just continue but then when you've got people who we're also dealing with they're hearing this from other people. Right and people are picking on him at school. Yes and I mean even Pacy like his hearing these things from his family and and so when you hear it from you start to think it has to be true. Yes yes is this true about me? Nobody could actually ever think anything else of me. And it just it's really you get labeled with things and you start to wear it and you start yeah and that is your identity and it's the longer you wear that label the deeper the risk harder it is yes to change that label to tear it off to replace it with something new. Dig it up and and honestly you can do that and it does not mean it's gone forever you have to it's a constant thing it's a constant battle and it's a constant thing to remind yourself not just fill yourself with positive thoughts but honestly we're not going to shy away from it it's important that's why it's important to remind yourself of what God says about you and how he created you. That's what I was about to say that's why it's important to know scripture and be rooted in that and what your identity is in him. To have a foundation of knowing that what the Lord says about me or about you in order to fight off those negative thoughts. Because when you have one negative thought you need to replace it with a truth or positive way like to combat it. Yes and again that comes back to your mind as a battlefield so definitely I want to hug these characters. I know and then not to skip over the final thing like you know Joey's set up this whole candlelit romantic evening and sh he comes early she's not done lighting all the candles. He's like oh you shouldn't have done that you you really didn't have to she is even trying so hard. It's like if she can do enough it won't be true because she's been questioning it. So it's not like she is in complete denial because she has been questioning it. It's like if I just do enough maybe I can change this or maybe it won't be true. Right. It's as if her performance will equate to whether he is or isn't and again she's finding or at least she's she's somehow bearing this this burden and feeling like it's affecting her identity as to whether or not he is gay or he isn't and at the end of the day that is not her shoe to wear. No but again I get it I get it yeah but I'm just saying yeah it's not and I do think that she does get over that right and it quickly it made it makes me feel like too she might be doing it even trying in some aspect in her own way to try to help him like in a in a public like or like an optics way or I feel like I keep saying that word a lot and I to like a relationship with him. Well just if if she can do this whole romantic evening with him or if they can have this romantic evening that that makes him look like for all these people that keep making ugly comments and everything that she can help make him appear less gay or like that she can help him. Yeah that's what that kiss was last episode. Right. Yeah definitely yes but you know he he comes early he tells her you didn't have to and then he says something and she's like okay just be honest I mean she knows she knows please God just get it over with basically and then he tells her that he told his dad he's gay this morning and Joey says you are like and he says well I don't he waffles he does he goes all over the place and then she's like just just tell me the truth she said yes she says tell me the truth but then he says well I don't and she says you're not and he says I mean maybe and she says part gay and he she says it seriously and he starts to laugh and she says don't laugh at me no and I like that I mean like that's true she's trying to understand this and he doesn't fully understand it so how's he gonna help someone else but then when she finally says are you and he just shakes his head yes he didn't say the word he just shakes his head yes and then he tells her that she's been such a good friend to him boom friend zone after being boyfriend girlfriend kind of whatever and that he doesn't want to lose her and it just gets really weird because I mean she's trying to be as gracious and compassionate as she can he's just trying to navigate a fully foreign territory yeah and then he tries to reach across the table to hold her hand and she like gives him a finger but she doesn't even like hold his hand back. It's just sitting there holding her but yeah it's so awkward. And then she goes okay girl just just he don't got cooties okay you you can hold his hand back right just just hold his hand back like be be the good friend he just told you you've been please she just can't see past how it makes her feel and look right now though which I do think is pretty yeah but I I'm not gonna let you just awkwardly yeah well okay now what I will say for this girl is I am a pretty awkward person. So it's like this bomb has just been dropped even though there's been a little bit of pretense and it's been coming and I know it's been coming now he's sitting right across from me though and bam it's finally out there and my hand is just sitting there and he reaches across I can see myself being like I don't know what you want me to do. Yes but honestly I probably would have been the one that's like like I'm I also have that awkward social awkwardness sometimes okay see you doing that too but thank you I don't know it just it was it was awkward because the camera really focused on it it's supposed to be I realized okay we're supposed to feel as uncomfortable as we are yeah I get it but it just but you know what before okay this is backing up just a tad when he finds her at school after he has told his dad finds her at school and she yes is putting on this whole facade of like rescue rain check? Yeah tonight yeah they kiss okay yeah that's gross but I wrote an odd case for before he gets to her you can see the camera shows him walking he looks completely different he almost some relief yes and he's happy yes yes this is the Jack that we love as the show goes on yes I mean you you can tell that once he's gotten some of the weight off his shoulders of telling his dad coming out to his dad you can you can see it and it's like but that to me though there's this weird moment after he kisses her and it's not like she kissed him he kissed her he didn't have to truthfully let's let's just throw that out there pick it it didn't seem like it was even necessarily just like a a habit it just I don't know I in a way in the way it was written personally it felt a little forced but whatever their whole relationship has felt forced it has but it it's not like the girl needed any reassurance from you to kiss her before she goes off you've just she already thinks you're gay she's questioned it but she she's questioned a lot she knows I know but the thing is she's already like okay our rain check we're it our e our romantic evening is back on like that that's all that she wanted or needed out of that but he smiles after kissing her for this this moment and then his face falls that was confusing to me because it's like okay wait you're smiling so big after just kissing her who you don't actually find you may find her on some level attractive because you wouldn't be where you are right now if you hadn't at all personality wise like friendship. I mean you can find friends attractive like that friendship is anyways right too deep but yes go ahead but no it just it just that that to me was almost like okay wait why are you is it was there almost a moment of like regret that he just kissed her because it's technically almost like leading her on or is it like oh god I regret doing that because I really didn't like it or like like there's there's so many questions that ran through my mind in that moment. Yeah I don't know but ultimately we know that it ends yeah with Joey running back to Dawson and crying he's just chilling yeah he's just chilling he he doesn't even know what's the whole world he is he doesn't even know what's happened with his friends no but she comes through that window he knows what's wrong yes he does and he already knows you know like Katie Holmes has this habit when she cries on this show she starts crying her face screnches up and she immediately does this with her hand on her the side of her head she does it every time that's not a criticism I just have noticed it it's like what she does and it's anyways you do you want to spin a wheel sure it's your turn I know it is my turn okay man there was a lot in this episode there was oh my gosh okay it's rapid fire which character would thrive in today's world where we are right now in Dawson's Creek like season two which one would thrive I think we already know you think that Pacey would thrive. Oh Pacey's thriving no matter what okay that's a given he's not who I was gonna say though I was either gonna say Andy or Jack oh my gosh okay I mean I think that Andy is a hustler I think she is a go-getter and she would be thriving in this this world in some ways Jen might she might but it wouldn't be what we would think like what the popular of it now it would be more like almost like her and Peyton sawyer from Winter Hill are kind of in the same category it would just be like I hadn't even thought about the man type thing like going against the grain. Yep okay who would dominate aim away messages oh my gosh away shoot and for anybody too young to know what aim away messages are shame on you instant messenger it's aol instant messenger I did which I had I did MSN yeah I did MSN Messenger too and I had Yahoo messenger yeah but I was mainly on my AOL account but you had to be on the computer yeah you did it oh my gosh so I had so many away messages but I just okay this is so against the rapid fire we are not being rapid but I love the nostalgia of it because I can remember like talking to a crush on there butterflies and and seeing when they were on when they would sign on and the sound that it made and then when they got off and it's like oh no but then they came back because it's like oh which storyline screens 90s drama um I think where we are right now it's the the fear of coming out for Jack. Yeah I agree just because of the time and then favorite 90s snack my gosh I was seven I don't know that's hard I think just as a kid I'll say this as a kid we we were real big on like fruit roll fruit by the foot like the long oh yeah so we had those in our lunch boxes and that would have been elementary school so that would probably be we had to have those we we were we were sour kids like we liked sour stuff. We were at the mercy of what my mom would or wouldn't buy it didn't matter what we liked. Well I've already told you my story about going to the grocery store they weren't gonna buy it I was just gonna eat it there so yeah already told that one yeah no did you have a favorite nineties cartoon probably um the nineties I'm trying to think about the time we were standing at Margot's like while my mom was working so we watched a lot of like we w we watched a lot of blues clues rug rats and cat dog those would have been like my sister loved blues clues yeah that I was that would have been more like Jamie yeah be being younger but it was on at the like so we were I'm I mean I remember like me and Josh would sit there and watch it even though we were older and then like so then it became this thing of like where'd Steve go? Steve went off to college who's this Joker Joe he's terrible like it was just oh you don't know the lore of blues clues anyways keep going well yeah I was gonna say it I love Tom and Jerry and like some of those cartoons um and I'm sure that I'm gonna forget something but you can laugh and I don't know if this falls in the 90s or 2000s. Yeah see it but it was all the same I used to love Sailor Moon I've never heard of that um it was like a a Japanese it has like a Japanese uh origin but I'm sure if I showed you a picture of her that you'd know who I'm talking about. You know what my favorite show it's not a cartoon I've never heard of that did you ever watch I promise okay did you ever watch Gulla Gullah Island that sounds familiar oh my gosh with the big giant yellow and red frog okay wait maybe not and it was this family it sounds familiar but I don't they were the gulla people and like they talk they were like tanky tanky for thank you oh my gosh it came on Nickelodeon you didn't touch Nickelodeon but it was a it was more wholesome it was it was a wholesome show it wasn't no right but it was not a cartoon right I loved Gulla Gullah Island yeah that's not the right tune I don't know what it was gonna I gotta find it hold on I know you got my phone I know that blues clues was wasn't that Nickelodeon yeah like yeah Nick Jr or something yeah Kelsey like I said Kelsey got to watch that but um Rugrats was like a bad word in our house we loved Rugrats and some others but Rugrats I gotta find this this is a lot I feel like I'm probably forgetting something okay oh yeah no I've never seen that together what was your MVP moment today I think I'm gonna have to give it to Grams. There there were lots of big moments in this episode but I think it's got to go to Graham's because that was a really deep conversation or just just a a deep topic that really mattered a lot. Yeah my runner up would probably have to be Andy comforting Jack and kicking her dad out that's good too siblings sticking together I'm sorry I said mine yeah I said mine earlier in the episode it was Dawson and his what his response is to Joey when she asks am I sexual? Yeah which is such an awkward question but the I know I understand what she means by because it's stemming from Jack and his struggles. But so that would be mine. Okay I'm ready to hear your rating all right so I'm giving this one a seven okay which Which I think might be the first time I've given something. It's mainly because of my two favorite scenes in the episode. You know, the three of them together at the table and you know, cutting up with each other and the scene with Graham's. One scene can make or break the episode. And I always give extra points when the whole cast is together doing something, so I completely understand. I really went back and forth between an eight and a nine on this one, but I am gonna give it an eight. But it is still at the top of all the eights I've ever given. So this is a good one. I think this one was my favorite so far. That's pretty that's a high honor coming from me. We've talked about this was a very packed episode, but it wasn't like a it may have been some deep topics, but it wasn't like a heavy, heavy episode. There were emotional moments, yes. But I feel like it had a good balance of you know jovial, funny, and like real problems. Yeah, you know. Season two is so good. I can't believe I'm saying that. I know that. And that's a wrap on today's episode. If you loved hanging out with us, make sure you like and subscribe on YouTube where you can watch this full video and follow us on Spotify so you never miss a rewatch. 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