Did Watching This as Adults Change Everything? (Dawson's Creek 2x21)

Season 2, Episode 21 gives us something rare in Capeside—actual happiness—while still managing to completely break our hearts.

In this episode, we talk about Joey finally having a moment of genuine joy, and how different (and honestly refreshing) it feels to see her lighter, freer, and not weighed down by everything around her. Of course, this is Dawson’s Creek, so that happiness exists right alongside some of the most emotional moments of the season.

We break down Pacey and Andie’s heart-wrenching goodbye, which might be one of the most painful and beautifully acted scenes so far. It’s raw, it’s real, and it says so much about where they are—even if they can’t fix it.

Meanwhile, Jack and Jen step fully into their friendship era, and we get to see the foundation of what becomes one of the most genuine, supportive dynamics on the show. And, in true fashion, Dawson finds himself stuck in the middle once again—trying to navigate everyone else’s emotions while still figuring out his own.

We talk about emotional contrast, growth, and why this episode feels like both a release and a setup for what’s coming next.

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Season two continues to balance joy and heartbreak in a way only Capeside can—and this episode is a perfect example of both happening at once. 🎙️✨

Transcript

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know that these have faces. No, they don't. Yeah, you gotta look. Okay. Oh my god, they do have faces down here. See the eyes on top of it? Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Never paid attention to that. I heard it somewhere on the radio a years ago and I was like, no way, they don't all have that. And then I went immediately and bought some. Yep. I love these. I've gotten on such a jag of eating these all the time that I have bought like the big size bags. I tried the berry kind not my favorite. I like them okay but I like the mix. But some gas stations only have the berry. Yeah. It's almost like they're too sweet or something. I get it. I like the more sour. You may not be aware of what I'm about to ask. Welcome to Press Play again, Two Roommates One Remote, the rewatch podcast where we dive back into the shows and movies we couldn't stop talking about in college and probably still can't we're your hosts, Anna and Megan, two roommates with one remote, ready to laugh, debate, and maybe get a little too nostalgic as we revisit the classics and discover a few new favorites along the way. So grab your popcorn press play and hang out with us as we rewind it all episode by episode movie by movie. Have you seen that well first of all you know that Jackson Joshua Jackson and Katie Holmes are doing a movie together. A three-part movie like they're she's like directing it they're starring in it together like yeah yeah um it's a it's a huge deal of so yeah there's no like release date they've they've been filming it's it's a pretty big deal in the Joshua Jackson Kitty Holmes fan club world you know so but recently like last week they went to this red carpet event for not even for that it's for somebody else they were going to support they did not arrive together they arrived at the same time though got out and then took photos on the red carpet together okay the world was in a tailspin I'm telling you it was like everywhere people I mean the way they were looking and smiling at each other is just like oh my god it takes you right back it is so good and so now people have been commenting obviously like I mean People magazine us weekly like they're doing stories on this it's huge nothing's confirmed with them dating or anything either it's just like a big deal and just like so nostalgic. So they people have been commenting like Pacey and Joey forever like little things like that about Dawson's Creek but then some people are com and they're doing those comments and then some people are commenting y'all should really just go be a couple again or stuff like that. Yeah Katie Holmes is liking all of the comments about Pacey and Joey forever y'all should be a couple and it is just everybody is freaking out like is she trolling everybody are they both not married no okay they are not he has recently divorced in the last couple of years okay before they reunited for the movie okay so we can just cross I remember I remember um finding out who he's married to and he has a he has a daughter with his ex-wife but I remember she's like a supermodel his ex-wife anyways I've told my aunt I was like I don't wish divorce on anybody but I was joking and they got divorced and I was like is it bad that I'm I'm excited about this no because it's nothing against his ex-wife I just oh my gosh they are I I'm showing you the picture hold on let me just show you oh wow yeah and like there's lots of them where they're looking at each other smiling laughing oh my gosh and they're about to go to the Austin Film Festival no not Austin Tribeca Film Festival to like promote their movie that's too funny look at this one that they just redid to she posted this one oh this is the one they should be a couple she heard of that one yeah yeah yeah oh my gosh he looks so good he does okay okay okay moving on because I can't take it anymore I can't makes my stomach do flips for what it's worth like before you and I watched what episodes I have seen um I had seen the movie Dare to Dream that has her in it with Josh Lucas Lucas who I adore Josh Lucas in anything that he is even the Home Depot commercial I don't care yeah anything with Josh Lucas um and I just remember when we first started watching it and it it clicked that that's who had starred in that movie I was like oh wow and I've been back to watch it again good movie it is a good movie the synopsis for episode 21 concerned for Andy's well-being Jack phones her or phones their father who arrives back in Capeside where he announces that he intends to take both Andy and Ms. McPhee to Providence for treatment in a mental hospital. Both Jack and Pacey are stunned at the news which leads Pacey and Andy to decide whether their mental wellness is more important than being together. Jack also must decide if he wants to go with Andy and their mother or stay alone in Capeside. Meanwhile Dawson is preparing for his film class final exam by videotaping all individuals involved as well as helping Joey's father Mike Potter extend the ice house for Bessie after being shunned by everyone Jen wonders where she'll live after her parents tell her by phone that she is not welcome to come back to New York I don't know why that says Jen's been shunned I know I don't know why that doesn't that so many synopsis are synopsis whatever synopsis synopsis probably I don't know just making up words over here um a lot of them they're not yeah they're not accurate or yeah yeah I agree this episode aired on May 19th 1999 it has a popularity rating of 22 out of 128 and an IMDB used rating of 35 out of 128 what was the first number then 22 I will say that I think I like it better than the previous one overall because the storylines still seem to tie together more because even with what Dawson's doing it's like the whole change like it it it flows better than the two complete opposite end storylines of the I was not distracted by where the storylines were leading in this one but but this one I mean I knew we were gonna have going into this episode I knew we were having to deal with what transpired with Andy in the last episode. I honestly did forget the sequence of all the events though in Dawson and Joey's dad and all that. So I didn't know exactly what to what I was expecting going into it coming out of it though I could have if I would have sat there and thought too long about it I would have started crying. That goodbye between Pacey and Andy gets me every time could have been a tear drop brutal oh my gosh anyways so I'm I'm it left me pretty heavy oh it was very it was better than the last episode though but it was still a heavy episode how do you feel um I don't know that I like one or the other better than the other I just kind of I feel like I'm in the same I'm just in a neutral we've hit a plateau in season two this is what I remember about we only have one left yeah and I'm ready I'm ready to get to season three to rem to start seeing what we did get through that I saw how many you didn't get far. No I don't remember how far I got but I do remember it wasn't far into the season. I mean I'm thinking six or seven I don't know that I made it that far but we'll see. Okay. Well the first couple episodes we just gotta make it through too because they I have a vivid memory of what I think comes in the first episode of Yeah. Well we're gonna season two is gonna end with the school year finally ending. Yeah so they're gonna enter into summer break but season three that's where it starts for me even though season two was better than I remember but anyways agreed so Dawson has this film this project for his film class final and he turns it into he decides that he's gonna make it into a like a documentary style thing tracks obviously um about changes throughout the year and so he's trying to think of all the different people in his world that have had major changes throughout the year and he's gonna interview them they all say no correct except for Joey's dad and I mean that one is actually a very good one to interview it is and I don't see Dawson has changed so much since season one though. So I say that because I had a moment in this episode where I went wow I have a lot of these through these episodes in season two of like wow Dawson really is a different person. But this episode in particular when Joey freaks out because it's like it's hitting her all at once that he's interviewing her dad about his past and judging up all this the the pain from the past and she confronts him and says why are you making him do this why and she goes off like turn the camera on yourself all these things and he is genuinely shocked that she's upset by this and he doesn't push it at like well this is what needs to be done because it's for the movie it's for this it's to capture this like he's been prone to do in the past he truly is shocked that she's upset by this and he's just he looks at her and says I'm sorry I right I didn't know and that is a that is growth for Dawson. Oh it's major growth so I give it to him for that I and I have not lived through what Joey has lived through so I don't know how I would feel in that it probably would be pretty painful to hear your dad saying that but at the same time and everybody would be different I think I was gonna say at the same time or like on the flip side of that is some people may look at it as like listening to it with a little bit of pride of like how far he has come. Right and I think that too it depends on like what the subject matter might be that's being discussed too there was a moment where she um was saying to Dawson we just moved past all of this we just got past all this and I remember thinking clearly you're not past it. Yeah if it's this like triggering for you you haven't been past it. You just put it in the past but you haven't actually dealt with it. Correct as most of these people do that they don't deal with things they need to go to therapy. Yeah. Truly Andy's the only one who's actually doing something to move forward and that's just because it's pretty extreme and she has no choice. Correct bless her heart. Oh my gosh. But Dawson is gonna help with some construction work because they're building a lounge for the ice house for live music so weird. It it is like three episodes ago y'all were starting a catering business out of the ice house yeah and you know they've been talking about how you know finances are better and that sort of thing and we kind of get a sneak peek as to part of what might be attributing to that. Yeah we s Dawson goes back in because I think he left something and he was going back in to get it or something and he sees Joey's dad is still trafficking pills this time. It wasn't just trafficking marijuana. No it was other drugs. Drug deal going on so Dawson sees that and he runs into Joey outside and he just she asks what's wrong and he says nothing. Yeah he didn't tell her I mean what I probably would do the exact same thing though honestly especially like in the very beginning like I don't know what I just saw so it's like no nothing I'm good nothing nothing's wrong I I really think I would be that same way I would I would not feel comfortable telling her probably in that exact moment either yeah yeah I mean I did make a note of how happy they are in this episode um what made you so ugh during that scene where she's like I'm proud of you but I'm so proud to be here. How did you forget it's that fake sweat on his face yes okay okay he has never worked a hard manual labor no hard manual labor day in his life enough to have that much sweat on his face but I thought it was really cute when he is nailing something and he walks away and Joey looks at it and it falls off. Yeah and her dad says something and she was that won't work. Yeah she says don't tell him I know I thought that was sweet though of her because it's like she knows she's not with him for his handy skills well this is gonna sound ugly but it crossed my mind that Dawson would be probably 10 to not if not 20 times more attractive if he actually was like working in construction or doing something like that than the way that he is yeah because that's your type more I mean me too like more hands-on yes but hard work I I'm not even saying that just a little more of a handyman or capable of it not saying that's gonna be his job but just can get stuff done I liked yeah that was I I agree completely gross that's all that I think he wasn't cute but I like how Dawson acted in this episode where he was trying to interview all the different people in his life and they were all saying no but it still did not feel the same as the Dawson from season one if that makes sense. Right so to me there is a level of underscoring his maturity here um it's not out of a selfish ambition where season one would have been Almighty Dawson the wannabe director needing the exact shot angle precision perfection out of everybody and everything for whatever he's producing this is Dawson literally putting himself second or just others first and being genuinely interested in their story and what's going on. So that is really um emphasized when he is trying to interview Pacey and he sees that Pacey has a lot going on because this has Dawson Joey and Jen we are to assume they have no idea what's actually going on fully with Andy that obviously they know something they don't know what just happened in the previous episode is what we can assume. But when he sees that Pacey is starting to spiral and he's starting to kind of go down this he's not just giving me information for my interview anymore he's actually like reflecting on what's happening in his life he turns the camera off and he's he asks his friend what's going on he's not making everything about him or even indirectly about him. Yes and then to flip that Joey says to him turn the camera on yourself. Yeah and he admits that he's scared yes that he's afraid that he won't be enough I thought that was a big a big thing too that he's afraid he will that she will see she has grown and changed more than him that he wouldn't be enough for her he's his eyes are opening yes yes he is becoming more and more aware his social perception is growing in its own way yeah yes it's crowded for him yes very good for him yeah he's got a big dilemma though we gotta see what he's gonna do with this dilemma of his girlfriend's dad who has changed so much and she they make multiple notes about how happy Joey is right now too in this episode she says I'm happy sue me and he says I know I like this happy positive Joey it it is said multiple times to further emphasize how bad this is gonna be when it comes out what her dad is doing. Correct and how bad it's gonna affect her and Bessie and honestly everybody around them because they're all involved well Dawson I mean it it's Dawson is always in the middle of something even when he doesn't try to be yeah geez he is I mean my thing is though I wrestle with how far Joey's dad has or hasn't come as far as changes because clearly he's still in the business. So how valid is any of that you you can be making changes and you know steps in growth or ways of growing while still be doing some of the old bad things that you did previously that it's not mutually exclusive. But yeah I do remember this is ugly when it comes out the season banali is a pretty explosive I don't remember all the details I just remember it was rough so um anything else with them um oh the white pig events oh yeah yeah yeah because she has told him Joey has told him when she's saying how happy she is after he has said he's scared she's gonna see that he's not enough and she's outgrown him she comes to him later and says how happy she is how much she loves him she's proud of him believes in him and proud to be with him and all this about being happy and all she needs now is the white picket fence. Yes and so at the end yeah he has built overnight of course and painted yeah and painted a portion of a white picket fence and it was a sweet gesture it was very romantic just like a very heartfelt he listened to her and he did something that showed her he was listening and he wants to make her happy in every way possible I thought it was really sweet and showed true growth from Dawson. I agree and yeah I was this good episode for him I mean and her she's so back and forth I sometimes I just can't whiplash can't like he's doing something nice and helpful and try interviewing her dad because he admires the change he sees and she flips out I understand the flip out though to some degree I'm not saying she's completely wrong and crazy but I feel like we should not use the word crazy these days with the show. I know yeah okay oof I don't know if I'm fully ready to talk about Pacey and Andy honestly well we could go into Jack and his dad you know and Jack and Jen because they were the warm hug that I've needed for a long time. Agreed. I have been waiting on this really yes they brought me comfort yes I totally agree I know that Jack is going through his own set of issues with his dad but him him recognizing that Jen was you know even leaving or like chasing her down. Yes and going and telling her, you know like You can't go, or you don't need to go. Just just come in. She's so distraught about feeling like she has no place in Capeside, like we talked about in there. I appreciate him offering to let her stay at their house. Cause I knew when Grams kicks her out, I remembered that she goes to their house at some point. Yes, same. But I've for whatever reason my brain just skipped right over her staying at Dawson's. Same. Same. I did too. But I'm glad we didn't just jump straight to Jack and Andy's because it would have we would have been sitting here going, how did we get here? They've barely spoken to each other. Well, that would have really interfered with the storylines that we've had. Yeah. So but when they're talking at the River Walk, he's um he's out there contemplating everything because his dad has shown back up and Andy's about to go, and she walks up to strike up a conversation with him because they are all in the same print group. We just don't see it very often with them. And he starts confiding in her a little bit, but then she does too. And he asks her at some point, can you not go back to your parents? And so she does she says that she doesn't think that they would want her, whatever. And so then that leads her to later on in the episode call her mom. Correct. And I and her mom, we can't hear that com that side of the conversation, obviously, but she is trying to tell her mom that she would like to come back and she's changed and all these things. And the fact that you even have to try to convince a parent that you want to come back home and that you've changed, it's sad. And I know there's certain situations, there are circumstances where a child is out of control, and I know she was out of control at some point, but to never make them feel like they can ever come back is sad. Doesn't she say when she gets on the phone with her mom that like it's been a while since they've talked? Yeah. I mean, this show leads you to believe that they never communicate, truthfully. So how sad further than just what you're saying? How sad that her mom never even checks in on checks in. Which she doesn't really communicate with her own mother, Grams. I mean, correct, all of it. It's it's sad that, and that just really is where the the the feeling of not being wanted stems from for Jen. And so even though Graham's has made her feel welcome by kicking her out, which I know the reasons Grams had for that, but by kicking her out, it just further accentuates like how Jen is feeling. Now, why she felt like she n couldn't stay at the Leary's, I don't know. And she does attempt to go by Graham's house, but she doesn't actually knock on the door. She just kind of stands there for a second and says, bye, Graham's, and then off she goes. But I think she was just going there to say bye. Like because she was about to go get on the bus. Yeah, that is true. I don't think she was gonna try to come back. I don't think about that. Yes. Because when she first walked up, I thought that. I thought, oh, she's gonna don't remember this part. But then when she just says bye, I took that as she was going to say goodbye to her and just couldn't even do that. But um, when he does come to the bus stop, bus station, and he says, Did you think you were gonna get away without saying bye or whatever it was? And I I liked that because now I'm not I'm not saying anything bad about the other friends in the group because Casey and Andy are dealing with stuff and Dawson and Joey are too, they have their own lives, and they don't necessarily know because they haven't had this conversation that Jack has had with Jen. So they don't know that she's doing this, so I'm not saying anything bad about them. No, but it makes you wonder in a way too, and I hadn't thought about this till just now, so I'm sorry for interrupting. But like, did nobody know that she was leaving the Leary house? I don't think so. Was anybody even there to see her leave? Like, was Gail working and Dawson wasn't home, so she just got her stuff and left. You're like, Yeah, I don't I don't understand why she I still don't. That is one question that is burning. Like, why did she leave their house? That's why I turned and looked at you and was like, wait, I'm confused. I don't know. I really don't because I was going, wait, they didn't throw her out of the Larry house either, so no, I I don't know, I don't understand that. But when he walks up and he's like, So did your did you talk to your parents? I mean, he's not going there initially to get her to come back home. No, he's going to say goodbye to her, correct. And sad is that is where it just leaves me wondering, and I kept thinking it the whole time, I was like, Where's everybody else? But that's what I mean. Like, I'm not gonna harp on and be upset at them because they do have other things and she didn't tell them. They don't know. But she the the tone of her conversation with Dawson in in the hallway at school when she's talking about when she cut her hair and all that would lead me to think, something's off about this. So yeah, I don't know. I don't think we have a cohesive group yet in this show. We don't have very cohesive right now right now either. So, you know, we have moments of them all together being the big friend group, and then we have moments where we don't see them together for a while. So I just we just don't have a cohesiveness yet. It's not a full group, it's like parts of the group, but um when he when she says no, they don't I it's not the right time for me to come back into my mom's life right now. Correct. And her dad is still not over the last time she was there. Correct. That's heartbreaking. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Because her behavior while she when she before she moved to Capeside, her behavior at the age she was was already because she was neglected basically. Yeah. So it's not like they were doing everything right and p it is just so disgusting. I mean, she's not been a yeah, an example of perfection either. But no, I mean it's like you're saying, it doesn't sound like she was really in the best home life to begin with, so well, and she Jack says to her, he has the the comment of if my mom was mentally stable enough to know what was going on with me right now, she would still be happy and love me. Correct. Because that's what parents do, they love us for no reason at all. Correct. Unconditionally. And it it's like she just had not, she has not experienced that, and so she doesn't understand, but she knows that he's right. I mean, you can see it on her face, it's like that is how it's supposed to be. She just hasn't had that. Because even with Grams, for her, it feels like Grams will love her more if she will conform to Grams' religion. Well, she's gonna, it's almost like she feels she needs to earn Grams' love. We do see more of an unconditional love in Grams' actions as the show goes on, I think. Not that she doesn't love her already. She does, I know she does, but I do I would see the same thing Jen does with the whole Grams relationship right now. It's like, well, I'm not I'm not enough for her to actually love me the because she wants to change me. I get that, but then when Jack tells her that well, and then he says, um, it's worse to be the one incapable of love, yeah, to be the one who is not loved. Jack had a lot of really good lines in this episode. Mm-hmm. I Jack is emerging. I know it's yeah, yeah. So he tells her to come back home with him because he's got a lot of room and he needs a roommate right now. And this is the start of a beautiful friendship, and it is uh there they they have the the montage at the end while Dawson's voiceover is happening for his film, and they're just sitting in bed eating, I think it was ice cream or something, watching a movie together, and that's where I thought, oh, this is comforting. That right there is like to know you have somebody when Jen I and I know she you know she has found a friend in Dawson, she's confided in Gail, she's but I think Jack is really the first person that she like fully feels like she can be herself and just like breathe and and just it's like comforting to know that she has somebody with her. Well, he's not trying to get in her pants, yes. I mean, think about it. This is this is one of her ver very first real true friends, not Abby who's instigating and stirring up pots and looking for trouble, not Dawson who wants to be a good friend, but really had feelings for her, so he really isn't capable of not still trying to aim at or want to cross a line in outside of the friend zone into you know a romantic relationship. Her and Joey have water under that bridge, and it it's here or there, you never know. And then we don't see very much interaction with just like Jen and Andy, yeah, let alone the little bit that we have on occasion between Jen and Pacey. So this is the very first real friend that Jen has had on the show, yeah. And I it's one of my favorite relationships. Uh, from here on out to the end, it's one of my favorites. But it when I saw them sitting there eating ice cream watching a movie, it felt very comforting. Like that's what felt like a hug. I agree. Um, Jack and his dad, we have a little bit of closure with them in this episode. It's still sad, it's still heartbreaking. Yeah. But it is what allows him to be able to share that insight with Jen because of what he's dealing with. Because his dad still can't fully love him the way that he needs to be loved. Well, he just can't even accept or fully even say out loud that Jack is gay or Oh yeah, he can't say the word. Well, no, he just you have these gay ideas. But it's his way of sugarcoating what's actually happening because he literally cannot bring himself to accept it or even say it out loud. Because he just wants Jack to change. Yes. He he wants him to change his mind. Yeah. To go back. Yes. Have you tried what he says to him? Have you tried? People do it all the time. And Jack says, Well, that I don't think that it's sincere or whatever he says. His his response to him was that, you know, basically the same way that Tim was not. Yeah. He he either what was it that he was born or he he just woke up and he's not the same way as I am. Yeah. And the dad says, um, oh, what does he say? Because Jack's response was it's something, and Jack's response was oh, it's about choice. And he says, I didn't choose it, I chose to be happy. Um, and it it just regardless of because I've thought about this a lot, like, and I'm not a parent, but like, if I had a child, and I know the ways that I would want to raise a child, but if if I had a child that came home one day and said to me that they were gay, well, what am I gonna do? Because do you I mean he the dad in this episode blames himself? He says that he blames himself for this, right? And Jack's like, no, it's not, it's not you, and main point of it would all be steal your child. I'm still gonna love him. Correct. And it just to me, we've said this before, agreeing with something or disagreeing and showing compassion, kindness, or love in the case of a child, completely different things. Correct. And they're not mutually exclusive. No, and this dad can't sorry, just can't seem to understand and wrap his head around this. And now, granted, the family's kind of all over the place, okay? So kind of going through it right now. They are he they kind of got some big things. Jack is literally the least of the concerns right now, okay? They got some bigger visions for Roberts here, you know. But Jack says that he's not going because the dad has come back into town because Jack calls him to help with Andy. And innocently enough, as a teenager would think, he thinks he's gonna help her here. He's gonna come here and help, and they're not gonna uproot us and move us. And but the dad's intention is to take Andy and the mother to get supervised help like they need constant, which means their mom has been at the house the whole time. Well, I yeah. For some reason, I still thought that maybe maybe there could have been a chance. But I immediately looked at you and was like, constant supervision. So where is the mother? Like she doesn't make a peep, she doesn't make an appearance, she doesn't have her in her room, or she's locked herself. We don't know. Oh my gosh. She could have. I mean, think Andy locked in her bathroom. Well, maybe she's just in there watching TV in her bed all day. Cause that's I like that. I don't get any ideas. I do that at work. Um no, so he's gonna take them back to Providence. Excuse me, all I eat my my trolley crawler. Um and Jack is adamant about this not happening, and at first Andy is very upset by this too. And she runs to school to tell Pacey that her dad is taking her to Providence and they're leaving tomorrow morning. Pacey is not having it. He is so upset. Bless his precious little soul. Mm-hmm. Because he does have this hero complex hero complex that he can handle this and he can help and he can make this better, and they can do it all in Capeside. She already has a therapist in Capeside, and and it's just this kind of naive way of thinking. It's like I mean, now granted, taking her to Providence to get help, the dad's still probably not gonna be very involved. So what's the difference? But Pace, when he goes to the house and confronts the dad about it, and he says her support system is here, yeah, and he's trying to be as respectful as possible. I'll give him that. And the dad is like, but I'm her father, right? He calls Pacey selfish for wanting her. Sorry, but and Pacey says, maybe, yeah, I am, but you know what? I do think that even with constant supervision, her sports system is in Cape Side. It is. You're taking her to Providence where she literally has you who's not even involved in her life, right? And there's there's something to be said for if you're kind of in a mental situation of any kind, um, be it even dementia or Alzheimer's or anything else for that matter, having some stability where that person is comfortable or feels like you know they're in a familiar place or with familiar people, that goes a long way. Yep. Because you can really exacerbate a situation if you put somebody like that in a new place with foreign people, like or just new people. Yeah, it it can make it worse if you're not careful. Yeah. Well, finally, after Jack even says to the dad, you know, you've you um the dad says, I've given her everything possible to and Jack says, No, you haven't, you haven't given her a choice. Finally, after all of this, the dad listens to that and he does give Andy a choice, but surprisingly, Andy is not quite sure she's gonna make the choice they all assume she will.

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I know.

SPEAKER_01 39:50

And it is even sad that whole conversation with her and Jack is really sad too because she says most days I feel fine, but then some days I don't, and and she's aware of that, and she knows that it's not good for her, and that it is getting worse if the longer it goes untaken care of. Well, that's what I kind of like going back to what I said in the last episode, where she's kind of caught somewhere in between this mental meltdown state and reality. She's she's somewhere in between the two and aware of it, at least at times. And and at this moment where she's where she's having the mature choice, where she's making this mature choice of I'm gonna go and get help, she doesn't want the burden to fall on Jack and Pacey. And if she stayed, it would. Because they would be the ones taking care of her. And I I don't know if my teenage brain would have had that awareness to make that decision. We've already said that so yeah. I mean, I probably would have been like, no, I don't want to go, I want to stay with my people. But her saying, I want to be healthy and I want to get better, let's just let's just block out that it may not be realistic. I loved it. I thought she was no, yeah, it's you know but there is something to be said for and it doesn't have to be just like a a mental meltdown situation, it can be any kind of a situation when you finally reach the end of your rope and you know you can't go any further, yeah, or you can't take it anymore, it's time to get help, or it's time to figure out how to fix it. Yeah. And I'm just proud of her for this is this whole storyline is why she was nominated for awards for the show. And and rightfully so. Because Pacey wants to have a great night. He said, Well, worry about tomorrow, tomorrow. And he wants to take her on a date, and they end up at the river walk where they have their first dance and kiss together. Uh so he says she says that she was weak in the knees and his heart was thumping out of his chest that night. Oh man. And they just start dancing together, and she Well, they have the fun little banter back and forth where he's like, How far we've come. He said, I hated you. And she says, I hated you more. And it was just really cute. And he says, That's really not possible for you to hate me more. And he gives her the credit of you, you changed me. You you made me better. And Daddy say something like my life started with you or something like that. Is that not during the goodbye? I didn't think it was, but I don't know. But when she starts crying because she's just she loves him and she's so happy, but she's so sad.

SPEAKER_00 43:01

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 43:04

Like, yes, I guess both of those things can be true at the same time. And she knows what's best for her, but she still doesn't want to let him go, and I wouldn't either. I get it. Oh my gosh. It's just I mean, the fact that she's even admitting to him out loud that she's not getting better. Yeah. And that she's leaving. Yeah. That's just that she wants to she wants to be better, she wants to get better and feel better. It's not even just getting better for someone else. She wants to feel better. Because I can't imagine like how she's feeling herself. It's she's sad because she's scared and she doesn't know. She doesn't, I mean, you you can't be a hundred percent guaranteed that even her her um medication or the help she's going. To get is going to change anything, right? Or that things are gonna get fully better, like it's not guaranteed, or how long it's gonna be, and so just admitting that she's scared of what's coming and what it's gonna be like and how we're gonna get through this. I know you've got me, but then that goodbye. I know when he comes running around that corner, because she says at the river walk no goodbyes. Correct. So she was anticipating he wasn't coming to her house, is the way I took that. Because when he comes running up, she says we said no goodbyes. And he says, This is not goodbye. No, and he just wanted to look at her and tell her thank you. I know it this this whole episode was like we said, overall very heavy. But I mean that was a borderline tear jerker, yes. He is thanking her for believing in him, changing him, inspiring him. I mean, I may be changing words up, but just giving her the credit of yes, he put the work in, he did it, but she is the one who made him believe he could. Right, he would not be the pacey he is right now if if it had not been for Andy. Yep. And he's saying that to her. And that, and she, oh my gosh, when she's crying and she just kissed me, and he does, and like when they're hugging, you can tell, like I just put myself, I imagined it was me, not because I want to be hugged by Joshua Jackson. I mean, that's part of it. But I can imagine anybody that you are in love with and you know you're having to say goodbye for an indefinite amount of time, whatever it is, and just like when you're saying having that hug goodbye, like just not wanting to let go because you don't know the next time that you're gonna have that. I put myself in her shoes and I just was like, oh my gosh, that's sad, and so he's being strong for her, but she's also trying to be strong, but oh my gosh, it is just it's immensely heavy. And Jack is over in the corner watching it because he's the one that told the dad, like these two pace he can help. I've never seen anybody more compatible than these two. And then he's watching the book goodbye. Oh my gosh, it's heartbreaking. Heartbreaking. And he says that he like he'll be there. Right, he's not going anywhere. And I guess she says, My knees are shaking. Yeah, and he says, It was so sad. I know, it was precious. But she gets in the car. Yes. Oh my gosh! And I I could feel just as uncomfortable as he was watching him be uncomfortable in that moment. Because even when he did put his hand up to wave, it was very odd. Yeah. Um Jack just walks over and stands behind. It really was so sad. It was so sad. And then we see they drive off, and then the last thing of Pacey is he's gone back to the river walk where their spot is, essentially. And he's just staring at the water. I know. Oops, sorry. It's okay. Do you need it? Okay, because I didn't want to bend down. No, oh man, this one. Well, I'll say that I'm giving this one a six because I did like it better than the last one. I didn't get as distracted by the camera work in this one as the last episode. And the storylines were better together. But I'm giving this one a five just because uh it that's the word plateau earlier really got it. Yeah, it really sums up where we're at right now. Yeah. I I went back and forth on my MVP, but I'm giving it to Jack. Oh, I was definitely going there. Yes. For going after Jim. Yes, the whole bus stop, bus station thing was really was really his finest moment. Mm-hmm. I mean, this is a different Jack than what we've seen with Joey. Agreed. Um, I mean he I appreciate him trying to advocate for Andy and And, I'm not going, I'm staying. Right. And and even for himself trying to stand up to his dad. Um, I mean in some ways Dawson could be a consideration just for the fact that he's not putting himself totally first. But no, Jack by far earned the MVP on this episode. I think so too. I agree. Specifically at the bus station. Okay, are you ready? Yes. Whole new set. What do we what do we have? Oh, it almost flipped to the next one. Therapy. Who needs to go to therapy the most? The obvious is not the one we should pick. I don't feel like we should just automatically give it to Andy. Well, she's technically already in therapy, and she's headed for intense constant supervision. Um, I'm going with Jen. She got some childhood trauma, unwanted feelings, parental damage. She's got things she needs to work through. Totally agree on that one. I mean, if I had to just say somebody else other than Jen, Jack might even benefit from a little Well, yeah. I mean, because he's also had to deal with his brother dying, his dad left, his mom has a mental illness, and now his sister. And he's just come out publicly. Yeah. Not of his own accord either. Right. So, yeah, I agree with that too. And now they have found solace in each other. Agreed. Okay, well, we only have one left. This season. I know. Season finale is next. I'm ready. I love season three. 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