Retail Media Vibes
Retail Media Vibes is your marketing lens on the world of shopping, commerce, and culture. Each episode brings fresh conversations with industry insiders who break down the stories driving how brands reach shoppers and how shoppers connect with brands. From big retail moments to the latest shifts in digital media, it’s your front-row seat to the strategies shaping the future of commerce.
We keep it smart, energetic, and actionable, mixing sharp analysis with good vibes so you walk away informed and inspired. Whether you’re a retail pro, a marketer looking for an edge, or simply curious about where the industry is headed, this podcast is made for you.
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Retail Media Vibes
Ep. 6 - First Five Recap: Summerween, CTV, and Work Slop
Missed the first five episodes? We stitched the best insights into one high-energy tour through what’s actually moving shoppers and budgets right now. From Halloween arriving in July to AI that can buy for you, we dig into the hits, the misses, and the money-makers.
We kick off with Summerween, where retailers extend the season and capture early spend without feeling forced. Then we shift to agentic shopping—the idea that AI agents handle the repetitive, low-risk purchases and increasingly the shortlist for bigger ones. Trust, transparency, and clear opt-ins will drive adoption this holiday season, and we share the guardrails that make it work. The brand-versus-shopper debate gets a fresh look through the lens of first-party data at scale: why building brands inside retail ecosystems can accelerate conversion and loyalty when done right.
Connected TV steals the spotlight with surging retail media investment and the promise of closing the loop. We talk about when shoppable overlays beat the scroll and how to design incentives that overcome second-screen distraction. On measurement, we tackle the ROAS trap and lay out a practical stack: incrementality, retailer attribution, MMM, and KPI alignment by tactic. The gaming segment explores safe, authentic ways to show up—native integrations, limited digital items, and digital-physical twins that create real value without breaking immersion.
We round it out with store tech that actually helps—think app-first wayfinding and contextual offers over expensive cart hardware—and a reality check on “work slop,” or AI output that creates rework when nobody owns accuracy. For dessert, we break down hype marketing that lasts: smart collabs, limited drops, and timing that feeds long-term loyalty. Ready to retool your retail media playbook before the holidays? Listen, share with a teammate, and tell us your boldest prediction. If you’re enjoying the show, subscribe, leave a quick review, and pass this episode to someone who loves both strategy and sell-through.
What's up, party people? BV here, and welcome to a special edition for episode six of Retail Media Vibes, a doing business in Bettonville podcast. We are recording live at Podcast Video Studios here in Rogers, Arkansas. So this edition of Retail Media Vibes is going to be a little bit different. Um, I've had some amazing guests on the show for episodes one through five, and I thought it'd be great to bring back some of the great uh guests and their uh opinions, their thoughts, their their emotions, their vibes, everything that they brought to each of those episodes and bring them into a single show so you can kind of catch up on all the things that have been happening so far with retail media vibes. So, episode one, the first episode, the pilot episode, if you will, of Retail Media Vibes, I had on my good friend and retail media expert, Tom Bryden. And we had such a good time on the show, and we really uh vibed around agentic shopping and summer ween and you know brand marketing versus shopper marketing. So we really had a great conversation about that. And so now we're going to relive some of the best parts of episode one. First topic we have is summer ween. I know that I just what did I just say, right? Summer ween. So I mean, it's basically Halloween in the middle of the summer. So this has been like a a trend that was happening on social where people were you know starting to get in the Halloween, we'll call it the Halloween spirit, no pun intended. Okay, the Halloween spirit in the middle of July, you know, June, June and July, right? And so, you know, retailers are really leaning into it. Um, I was in Lowe's the other day, and they've got this, you know, you know, 30-foot zombie in there or something like that, you know, hanging out. And so this, and this is August, right? So, you know, like well before October. So it feels like the retailers are getting into it. Walmart's definitely getting into it. Um, Michael's, so they're getting the jack-o'-lanterns, the skeletons, candy, decor. They're just pulling it out way in front of uh way in front of October. And it's it's booming. Like Halloween sales last year were$11.6 billion, and nearly half of those shoppers now start buying before October. So that's that's a huge, you know, huge, huge amount of money uh well well before October when you think people start thinking about it. Right. So, you know, Summerween. So is this something just made up to be a marketing stunt now, or is this really becoming uh a retail strategy? So, you know, what do you think? Do you think retailers are pushing it shoppers into Summerween? Or do you think you know the shoppers in the social media culture is pushing retailers into jump in a little bit early? What are you what are your thoughts?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I mean, I do think there's a cultural component to it. Um there's also uh a US culture versus other countries component to it as well, I think. Like something I noticed having lived here for 10 years, is that you know the US goes big on holidays in general, which is just which is great. I think it's awesome that we celebrate these big seasonal temple things. Right. Um I personally feel it's a bit early. Uh it's you know, October where we live is full foliage and cooler mornings. And yeah, uh it's tough for me to uh it's tough for me to get in the Halloween spirit. But that being said, it works. Like, you know, if you can extend out a big buying period, um there is an opportunity to increase revenue, um, especially if you're a brand that naturally and organically plays in that space. So I can see the benefit of it from a brand and retailer standpoint. And if you know the the average consumer is embracing it and doesn't feel that it's kind of off topic or too early, then then why not?
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. I mean, it feels like it also fits a certain niche of people who are really into Halloween, right? And so starts to get them into the spirit. Also, yeah, to your point, if you start to extend the season, you know, incrementally, there's opportunity to, you know, grow, grow revenue, right? You know, make make more sales uh during that period of time. So, you know, if if you were advising a brand, which you do often, right, would you tell them to lean into Summerween uh or just kind of wait it out a little bit longer to see? Like, cause I think it's it's it's interesting to figure out how how certain brands could play, right? Other than the people who are creating just these products that you know are sold for Halloween for decor or candy or et cetera.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I mean, I'm a media guy, so I'm always gonna go with the data. Uh which is what's the data say? Yeah, it's not it's not a sexy answer, but I I think there is data that you could draw upon in terms of consumer trends and you know, social listening and things that you could do to inform that decision. It's probably too late now if you're a sleeve, but like if that if that does become a trend next year and that's something that you want to plan for, and your brands like the key thing here is the brands that need to be thinking about it, they need to make sense in that space. Right. One of the worst decisions brands can make, in my opinion, is forcing themselves into a movement or a conversation where they just don't play. Yeah, and then it feels false and it feels unauthentic. Yeah. Um, for retailers, absolutely. We I took my my little girl, she's six, to Walmart the other day, and they had the pumpkins out and you know, the decor pumpkins, and she thought it was the best thing ever and wanted me to buy one. So it works. There's a real life example of how it works. Yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_05:It's a so you bought that pumpkin, and you probably will buy more things the next time you go, right? Because every time you go with your kid, yeah, they're gonna hit you up for the for the next thing.
SPEAKER_02:One of those stores that pop up on Halloween Spirit Halloween. Yeah, spirit Halloween. Yeah, yeah. So with that's our house. That's that's basically well.
SPEAKER_05:So you're really leaning into Halloween as a family. Yeah, my wife loves Halloween. That's good. That's good. So we're gonna talk about agentic shopping, right? So AI agents, I mean, I think overall that's just a huge topic. There are all kinds of agents that are being used or uh being planned to be used in retail. And honestly, it's probably too big for just this one podcast, right? So we're not gonna go into all of them, but we're gonna talk about agentic shopping specifically. You know, that's the idea of AI finding and buying the stuff you want automatically with, you know, minimal, you know, intervention, right? Um, or practically zero intervention. And everybody's everybody is working on this, right? So you've got open AI, perplexity, Google, Walmart, Amazon, everybody's experimenting, everybody's trying to figure it out, right? And so, you know, I think shoppers are kind of curious about it, but I don't think adoption is is low. And I don't, honestly, I don't think the tech is quite, quite there yet. And honestly, the value proposition, like, when is it the right time to use a gentich shopping? When is it not? Like, are you gonna you're gonna use it for your everyday essentials like toilet paper, but maybe not for if you're gonna buy a couch, right? So it's like I think finding the right use cases for this and having the right tech and right tools um does seem to be, you know, kind of the balance that it you know, everybody's trying to figure out. And so, and then plus, you know, consumer behavior needs to change, right? And so there's got there's an evolution. It doesn't usually happen just overnight. So trying to figure all that out. So, you know, if shoppers right now are, I guess they're getting more used to using AI for discovery, like how do I find something? Hey, find me this, find me that, find me the other. What do you think really needs to happen for them to kind of take that next step and look at using AI or agents or some technology that buys things on their behalf?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I mean, Essentia's hugely into the AI space. So we have a lot of discussions around this and not just what's available now, but where will it go in the next six months, 12 months, you know, right? As you know, this is such a rapidly evolving space, right? What you know now is going to be outdated by the end of the year. So it I think if I look at if I if I take your adoption question first, like I, you know, I would look at something like if I made an equivalent or a comparison, that's what I like to do when I'm thinking about adoption, which is like if I look at the iPhone, the way that you used to unlock the iPhone was you had to put in a pin. And then it moved to fingerprint ID. Yep. And everyone there was outcry about that. There was, I don't want my fingerprint in a database and PII and short things. Yeah, very much. Yeah. Apple kind of said tough luck and kept going, and people adopted it. Then face ID came in, and people got even more upset about face ID because they felt like it was a an infringement on their personal space. Well, now 50% of the world unlocks their phone with their face, probably more so if you count all the out the now you can get through security in the airport with just with your face, right? So I know it's not that's not exactly what you're asking me, but if I think about if I link it to giving up control and doing something that maybe feels strange now, but won't in six months, a year's time, I could see this topic and agentic shopping going that way. I think exactly what you said though. I think people will start with the mundane, the repetitive, the low risk in terms of cost elements of it. But you know, you you don't you don't go to a travel agent now to book your flights. You go online and book them and you hand over thousands of dollars and you trust that when you do that, the airline or the hotel company is is legit. True. Um, and so, you know, I would be an early adopter of that, I think for sure.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I think this coming holiday season is gonna be a key time for this, right? So, you know, with everybody working on this and you know, the idea that you know consumer and shopper behavior may be adjusting, like I think there is gonna be an opportunity to really see what the appetite is with the general public, um, with with uh, you know, using AI for shopping in a lot of different ways, you know, potentially even uh even a gentic as well.
SPEAKER_02:I think one of the one of the patterns or trends that I've seen is the ongoing tension between what you would consider brand level marketing and media, and then shopper retail focused marketing and media. Yep. And for me, you know, if you if you're gonna ask me for a hot take on that, I think there's a world in which they both play together. But at the end of the day, like if I was to ask you, like, why does a company want to build a brand, what would your what would your answer be to that? Uh to sell products, right? To you know, to make money, right? To to to generate revenue.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And the two primary ways you can do that are a D2C solution or or a retail location. Yeah. Um so if your ultimate goal is to drive conversion and loyalty, because you believe in the brand, loyalty is a another topic we could spend probably hours talking about. But if that's your ultimate goal is to drive conversion, why are more brands not focusing their brand building activities around highly scalable retail ecosystems? Walmart has 95% household penetration, right? Amazon is a a beam off of e-commerce opportunities, and Walmart is very quickly catching up on that, along with the targets, the Krogers, et cetera, et cetera. So I was just interested in your take. You know, you've worked on some some huge brands. Like have you seen a shift in terms of companies now being more willing to try and build a brand leveraging the scale and first-party data and the associated attribution of retail? Or do you do you still see it as we have brand level activity and we have shopper and there's this gray area in the middle?
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so for episode two, I had on Brad Godwin. I like to call Brad Godwin Mr. Vibes himself. Uh Brad is uh a good friend and you know, he's a very chill and really loves to connect with the emotional side and the humanity side of the work and the things that he does. So, you know, it was great to have Brad on. And, you know, we had a chance to really talk about, you know, some of the growing pains that retail media is going through, you know, how to, you know, be courageous in the creative work that we do, and then really look at what the future uh potentially could be for retail media and and marketing. So, you know, with that, we're gonna go ahead and hear some of the highlights from Brad's episode. To be able to engage with my family in a meaningful way, too, which is just awesome. Yeah, it does definitely bring the family together. Um, and there's obviously that feeling of nostalgia is a very powerful feeling and the ability to bring your family together around some of these, you know, IP is is super, super cool. For for me when my kids were young, it was Star Wars. Like Star Wars is really what brought us together and Spider-Man, you know, and somebody so Marvel, and obviously, you know, they've it's all expanded from there. So yeah, really cool. Really cool. All right, let's move on now to let's talk about some topics, right? Let's I mean I think you and I could just chit-chat all day, but that's not what everybody wants to hear, right? They they want us to talk about some things that might be going on in the in the retail space, in the media space. So let's let's let's do a couple of quick hints right out the gate, right? So this just happened, you know, just this week, Taco Bell. All right, Taco Bell. Like, I know how much you love Taco Bell. Taco Bell is rethinking using AI in the drive-thru. And this was obviously uh related to some things that happened. I think some guy ordered like 18,000 waters from you know, it's like, okay, maybe you know, maybe AI wasn't the right solution there. I think sometimes we're throwing AI at the wrong things to solve. And I'm not saying whether or not Taco that's the right thing or not, but you know, but you know, what was your gut reaction when you heard that to me it was like duh, you know, not a surprise.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I I think I had two visceral reactions. One one is, what in the world are they thinking? And two is I know exactly what they're thinking. Taco Bell just wants to be talked about. Yeah. And they have been the leader in QSR for decades in doing things that were crazy.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Not necessarily for those things themselves to be the profitability driver of the business. But guess what? It's called burned media. Oh, yeah. And guess what? We're talking about it on podcast. Yes, yes. Because of that, right? And so I think so much of what they do, and I think the folks I I knew some folks that worked in brand there, they were looking for shock value. Um, and I think that it they've really re-imagined that brand over the last decade into a one that Gen Z resonates with. Yeah. And so whether things work or don't work from a functional quantitative did, oh my gosh, this doesn't make any sense. I think some of it, I don't want to say it's a PR stunt necessarily. Um, but I don't think they hate it. Right that it got picked up and knocked about and went by either.
SPEAKER_05:So and I think, you know, different companies are gonna try AI in different ways, and sometimes it's gonna work out and sometimes it does. And and to be fair, Taco Bell is not the only quick uh QSR that uses AI in the drive-thru, right? So it's just there's rethinking it a little bit. Totally so. Um, another quick hit is so the uh UK retailer Tesco, they I just launched an avocado tester. Like I love avocado, I eat avocado a lot. But this this avocado tester is uh it's like a is a handheld scanner that will scan your avocado and tell you how ripe, ripe it is. Um, so that obviously that's a little bit closer to the retail that we know and love on a daily basis for sure. But like, you know, is that just technology for technology's sake? Do you see that really something that I think more more stores should adopt? Like, I I mean, what's what are your thoughts?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, uh I actually was having lunch with uh a merchant at Walmart yesterday, and we were talking about not just this specific topic of uh of the avocado, but like, what are pain points for shoppers that might not come out like just in data? Right. Right. And you have to kind of watch and start to talk. And you know, one of the things I think for me, I love making homemade guacamole. Yeah, there's nothing worse than getting avocados and cutting into them and being like, these are garbage. Yeah, can't use now. I got so stoked. My wife specifically got stoked for fresh table side guac at home to no, we're not having it, or if we try to have it, it tastes like garbage, right? And so I think that's really meeting a need. I don't think it's tech for tech sake. I think it's going, hey, there's a human problem of I can't see inside this thing.
SPEAKER_05:And I think, you know, like you have it in this world where retail media experts are not necessarily all going to be falling from the trees, you've got to figure out a way to do a ground up approach as well, almost an apprenticeship model and have a have a structured training type of development plan, like help people understand and all of the different aspects, right? That that in that go into today's retail media, retail marketer, omnichannel, shopper market, whatever you want to call it, because it has like 52 names. But I do think it's it's that development and that structure has to be there. Otherwise, you know, nobody has time to just, oh, well, come along with me to this meeting and you'll figure it out as we go. Right.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And it's interesting the word expert that gets thrown around a lot. Yeah, like you'll read a job description, it's like, oh, we need 15 years experience. Like if you go into any other field, psychology, I have a lot of friends that are like in counseling or therapist, law. Yeah. Experts is like decades. Right. Yeah. This hasn't even really been around for decades. No. This is a relatively new discipline. And so I do think that the the ongoing curiosity of individuals, like I think this is great to have the conversation for companies, but if you're a listener and you're going, hey, I'm sitting here in Northwest Arkansas and I'm a national account manager, I'm in sales, or I'm a merchant at Walmart, right or at Sam's Club, or you know, whatever, to be able to say there's a curiosity of ongoing learning. And I think what you're speaking to with those Walmart Connect certifications and the online training portal. I mean, that's best in class, right? Because you can come on and start with basic and get to, I would say relatively complex, and that's up to you. Yeah. They put that in the the hands of the user. And so if that's something you're sitting here going, oh, this is really interesting, then oh, yeah, maybe right. I think five years ago it was a nice to have. Yeah. But it wasn't a mandatory depending on your role. Yeah. But I think now in 2025 and as we go into 2026, everyone in the organization needs to have some knowledge, at least at a theoretical level, of how is this, how does it work, and what is the impact.
SPEAKER_05:And how is it different? Right. Totally. And I think I think that's the part that gets missed quite often is like, how is this different? We're just talking about banner ads, right? You know, and it's it's not there's more more to it than and again, as we mentioned this earlier, but as you know, retail media continues to expand and you know, more tactics start to get thrown in the bucket, like how do you make all of those work and orchestrate media that is actually going to to work for that specific retailer for your brand? Absolutely. So awesome. Yeah, I'm really interested in the space. And again, as I have conversations with more and more people and just you know, trying to hear more about like how things are continuing to grow and evolve in the space. And so, you know, we'll we'll see how it how it shakes out. Man, it's a crazy time for sure in retail media. All right, so we're gonna move on to our our next topic. And it's still talking about retail media, but we're actually talking about another another channel within the retail media space that all of a sudden has kind of blown up, I guess, this year. So last year, it was in-store retail media, was all the buzz. Everyone's talking about in-store retail media. And like, how do we, you know, how do you do it? And uh, retailers were investing in signage, uh, you know, TV screens and stores. Um, but now it feels like that's pivoted a little bit. And now the new darling is connected TV or CTB, right? And so retail media connected TV ad spend is gonna is plan on growing uh almost almost 50%, 45.5% this year. And it's growing three times faster than retail search, which is not necessarily a surprise because I feel like retail search is pretty saturated, right? Kind of hit hit that saturation point, but it's definitely growing. Um by 2027, one in five US connected TV ad dollars could flow through retail media networks. So again, it's continuing to uh more and more money is getting put into that. Walmart acquired Visio, right? So that was a big play for for them in 2024. Amazon obviously has Prime Video and they have ads in Prime Video, so they're playing a big part. And obviously, Walmart and Amazon are the big players in in retail media. Um but you know, you in those in those scenarios, now you're starting to see some of these ways in which you can exit the funnel, you know, into conversion, right? Or at least these attempts to do that, whether it be a a QR code or you take your remote and you can add something and send it to your phone with certain with certain networks. Like, I mean, I I do that out of curiosity as a as a marketer and really curious and interested. Like, do you feel do you feel that others are doing that as well? Do we is is this is this just kind of a ruse? I want to say ruse, but is this really just a way like, oh, this is a top of the funnel opportunity awareness, but guess what? You can also sell something at the same time so we get the inject out of the funnel at a s at a at a different part, right? So I I'm just curious on what your point of view is on really on on the part of how do you transact or how you convert with these when really if you ever looked at a commercial before, it was always about awareness, telling the story, trying to brand lift, et cetera. Now we're we're giving these exit strategies. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Well, first off, we got to give a moment to whoever the PR person is for QR codes. Because I mean they they came, then they went. Yes, they got ushered back in during COVID, yeah, and now they are back in full force, right? So don't call it a comeback. It's a comeback, come back of the year QR codes. Um, but I think, you know, as you were referencing, I just love to look at human behavior. I think human behavior is in watching my kids, watching my spouse, watching like observing myself and my own behavior. And then this is a confession, uh, real-world confession here of like most of the time when there is something on the TV, I am primarily looking at my phone first. Yep. Um, and so I think that could be really interesting as a 2.0 of connected TV of will they ever be able to tell that, hey, I'm watching this screen. I also have, I'm in this household and I'm on this device. Is there a way to marry those? Could be simultaneously, a little, maybe a little freaky for Sar, but like I think the capability can be there to achieve that. But I do think it's one of those now, it's not every commercial is shoppable, but I do think it's going to get to a place where everyone starts to do it. Right. Go, like, at what point is that content that compelling? Right. That you're gonna stop everything. That I'm gonna stop everything else I'm doing to scan that to now. I think if it's like, let's say there's a promotion. Yeah, absolutely promotion. Like I can save a dollar off. I think promotion, that could be a huge unlock. I think sweepstakes, like, hey, enter to win. Oh, I watch this. Oh, I can enter a window trip to Hawaii from you know, Sunmade. Yeah, the brand.
SPEAKER_05:The incentive has to overcome the friction totally, right? And so if the if the in the formula, right, if the incentive is strong enough, then you will get people to to do it, right? And I mean that you you see that in in any situation. You have a you have a display in store that's talking about a sweepstake. It's if if it's easy for someone to sign up, then they will go. If the if the value of the prize is a million, you put a you put a NCAP or you put a display in a in a in a store that says you can win a million dollars, I guarantee you're gonna get a lot of entries, right? I mean, it's that's just because that's you know, the the that equation, that value equation for time versus effort leans towards I'll put in the effort. Yeah, I I think, you know, I do think like connected TV, like anything to your point, it it depends on what you're trying to achieve and what you're you're what you're trying to do. You're trying to get eyeballs, you're trying to get attention, your audience is on that specific, you know, programming. Um, you know, you you may be an underdeveloped brand or new product and you're trying to bring it to market and you get a due education. Like there, I think there is a definitely, definitely a lot of a lot of opportunity. And I do think there is more to thinking about how do you, what does conversion really look like, right? And I think also the measurement side of things aren't really well developed as well. And um at that stage, I I mean, I'm sure you know a lot of reach really smart retailers are are figuring that out. So I'm not I'm not saying that it won't ever, ever get there. But um, I think that also when you look at how much it's gonna cost to do this and what the measurement and value you get out of it, if you're not looking at things holistically, it may not look like the best decision every single time for sure. Yeah. All right. So for episode three, I had on my good friend Cassie Murray. Uh Cassie, I've known for a long time. She, you know, she's worked with a lot of brands and she's always had a great sense around, you know, measurement and you know, what really matters when trying to determine if a campaign is successful, if retail media is successful. So we really focused a lot of the conversation around marketplaces and measurement. And so it was really great to have her authentic voice in that conversation to really bring to light some of the challenges and possibly opportunities that we have in retail media around measurement as well. So let's roll it with Cassie.
SPEAKER_00:Create a more competitive space. I mean, we know shoppers are already doing it on their phones, like when they're in stores, it's not uncommon for somebody to price check larger items. But if it's something you need shipped to maybe, I don't know, toilet paper or something like not that an instant need or like that you're just looking at and like maybe, oh, maybe Amazon has it cheaper. And depending on you know their systems, because you know they're such a closed loop system with all of their media, could they know that you're about to purchase and you know, suggest that you price check while you're out sharping? Like, will it get to that point? I don't know. I'm well I like it.
SPEAKER_05:And so they're using that data as you're using that live search to inform their systems in order to, you know, for whatever reason, right? And you know, make a better product selection, hit you with ads, you know, whatever they they they might do that for.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, I think we'll see. I like you said in the advertising and maybe even potentially in social, you know, they integrate and listen. So like, you know, people are buying those media or those audiences, be like, oh, somebody that has been scanning a lot of this aesthetic type item, and so they know that they could target those people. I always tell people when people, you know, they go on the government rants about, oh, the government's tracking me. I'm like, it is not. I mean, they are maybe, but it's me. It's people like me, it's marketers. Yeah, exactly. We are tracking you guys on a scary, scary level sometimes. Aaron Powell, I feel a little bad about that. I do sometimes. Just a little, just sometimes.
SPEAKER_05:All right. All right, let's move on to our next quick hit. So Walmart is, you know, Walmart talks has talked a lot about retailtainment over the years, right? And that was one of the areas that you said you've enjoyed quite a bit. Uh so Walmart is taking the idea from a TikTok FYP or for you page and bringing it to life through a road tour, right? So they're gonna have semi-trucks that are traveling around to different events in different locations, not just Walmart parking lots, but other locations. And so there a lot of these are centered around Gen Z interests. There's K pop, retro gaming, there's a rodeo truck, there's a nature truck, and there's even one for like workout, post, post workout, and self, self care. So it's it's it's really trying to bring, you know. know what people interact with on screens and trying to bring it into real life. So you've got this this this transition of social media to the physical environment. And so, you know, do these do you feel like like retailtainment and things like this and what Walmart is doing with FYP, do you feel like it really makes a difference? Is it, you know, is it really bring shoppers to retail? Does it really build brands? Like what are your thoughts around, you know, an activity like this?
SPEAKER_00:And I think that's important also is like when especially when we kind of hit on measurement later on in this section, like it's brand building, but they are hard to generate a profitable return because of the expense that goes into creating the assets, the the fuel, the travel time, the just the people, all the different certifications and insurances that you have to do. Like so brand building, but you need to look at it from what it is and not necessarily from just a straight ROAS perspective. There is going to be a more long tail opportunity on those than an immediate, we just saw a 7% lift at store XYZ, you know, because we had the truck there. Like that's hopefully that is not the expectation and they will appreciate it for what it is.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Yeah. Cool. All right. So the last quick hit we have McDonald's, right? Not not typically a retail media, but yes for bear with me for a second. Um and I'm trying to I'm not gonna rant I promise. But McDonald's just recently brought back extra value meals. I think I remember when McDonald's started extra value meals. I think at that time extra value meals were maybe like$299. Right. Extra value meals are eight dollars, Cassie, eight dollars like that, you know, I know the meals themselves are like$12 ish,$12 to$13, I think now in in a lot of ways. But$8, I mean that's that's quite quite high.
SPEAKER_00:I feel like it's a much bigger like those those two numbers are way closer together than they used to be too right. Like because the value mill was two, three dollars and back then a full meal was like you know probably around 10 still maybe eight to ten, but that's a significant savings gap. And now we're going eight to you know H12, we're shortening that you know space and so it's not really a value.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Do you think like other other QSR uh restaurants are also going to you know amplify their value menu so to speak and you know is is you know their questions of whether or not what's happening with the economy and you know economic headwinds as I like to say economic headwinds. But like the when when the financial time financial and economic times get a little bit tough brands start to talk more about value, right? So they can kind of maintain a price point that's reasonable but you're getting more for your money. So you know value is obviously a key term. Do you think this will start a trend of price wars of value meals across the QSR landscape?
SPEAKER_00:I sure hope so. Like I mean because even I know Sonic has started with like a you know like a little two to three dollar subset menu in the app and Taco Bell has theirs and I've started noticing um because I get the Sonic push notification that they've been pushing a lot more, it feels like lately than they have historically. But yeah, all of us are going to be facing the same problem that QSR is it's it's going to become a share of dollar conversation. Right. And so you have to establish the value, you know, the QSR is there for of convenience and convenience is key right now. So they'll probably do fine. But yeah, I would I hope they do. I want to see some like good social media wars with like Burger King talking you know smack to Wendy's talking smack up McDonald's about their value meal and it's not actually a value.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Yeah for sure for sure.
SPEAKER_00:It's always good entertainment.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. Yeah we'll see we'll see how that goes and get your Big Mac meal for$8 and your sausage McMuffin with egg meal for five.
SPEAKER_00:I'm just I'm gonna do a happy meal I guess and get this I get a toy with it or something better about it.
SPEAKER_05:That could be a whole other topic for another day those those promotions and incentives all right so all right so that was the quick hits. So now let's get into our bigger mediator I guess topics and I mean we just talked about hamburgers so I guess that's a a good condition right um all right so top our first topic we're gonna talk about measurement and retail and what really matters. And I we could probably do a whole podcast just on this because I think it's such a hot topic in retail right and so whenever the conversation in retail comes up there's it it's there's just this groan around measurement right it's like well you know that we can measure this we can't measure that the numbers that I see don't reflect my sales um you know every retailer has their own measurement criteria KPIs aren't aren't the same numbers don't line up you know brands you know brands that are controlling more of the retail media budgets you know they want to see results that you know before they release funds, right? And so it's really becoming a a bit more challenging really you know in the conversations that that we're having you know it's clear that incrementality is one that is a a a clear North Star that everybody really wants to see is, you know, did my marketing or did my media actually drive incremental sales, not just capture people who would block already? But you know it's it's hard it's hard to measure, right? Because you know, last point attribution last click you know that that there's yeah all of these things actually are coming coming together. So you know from your perspective and you're definitely well more way more versed on on measurement and your experiences than I am but like what is your perspective on the value of measurement where where measurement is headed you know and also considering online versus in store because you know we you mentioned omnichannel earlier these are omnichannel shoppers they're shopping online they're shopping in store it's all about convenience how do we measure to make sure that our media or marketing activities are actually driving the bottom line.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah and I mean to your point there is 80% of grocery shopping or 70 to 80% still happens in store. So that is a huge component of this especially with your Walmarts, your Costco's your SAMS, your Krogers, all of those because they they are brick and mortars first and foremost and you know but they need to be able to engage that person in a digital experience. Even if the shopper isn't necessarily a digital shopper in that ecosystem, you're still trying to impact that in-store shopping behavior and can I just can we get rid of ROAS? ROAS is the best metric. I don't know how many conversations I've had over the years and and ROAS used to be I mean we didn't have much more like we would look at ROAS goals you know it was better than click through rate and impressions but it still doesn't tell it just tracks the number of sales that happened during the period that your media ran. And um in that space like it's just it's incomplete and even on the incremental side of it um understanding that incremental value can be very difficult. I will say I don't think there's a one end all be all solution. I have been fortunate to be able to partner with I have partnered with a lot of different data, you know, the IRIs, the ANSAs, the Nielsen's the you know um most recently I'd onboarded a newer company called Peak and they were using AI modeling to kind of flatten out all of those other things that happen in a market, you know, weather trends and things like that. But also to look at it from a cross-retailer perspective because that is the other big issue with this is Walmart's reporting is not going to be the same as Kroger's reporting. And even the impact of something like search, you know, you're not Kroger could be driving more incrementality in your search but have a lower ROAS just because they don't have the space to grow like Walmart does. And so kind of levelizing that playing field, even for me in that space um I was with fresh and frozen items at Dollar General they only get a truck once a week. So if you run through the product and they also very limited shelf space for that product. So you might get four items on a shelf at a time but if you're running promotions and things like that, well once you run through that inventory like there's not as much opportunity for incrementality. And I mean and then communicating that with sales and with your leadership, you know, because that's always coming back to that if your KPI was new to brand shoppers. Okay, great. We may not see as much incremental lift as we would have on a traditional program because we were solely focused on new to brand shoppers. So that new to brand percent is really what's going to matter to us more than the total IROS.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah yeah and I think we get confused sometimes on the difference between a campaign objective and a media objective. Yes. The media objective should support the campaign objective but they aren't one in the same 99% of the time.
SPEAKER_00:Trevor Burrus Well and usually there's multiple tactics. Oh yeah yeah I mean so you yeah to hold them all to that same and then as long as it's funneling up and just reminding yourself that what the goal was.
SPEAKER_05:Aaron Ross Powell Well and being on the agency side so as I've been and you've been on the brand side so you you you understand where I'm coming from on this one but there's a lot of pressure when when an agency is looking at the numbers and to your point about why did the click-through rate change, even though that may not be necessarily the focus of the campaign, right? But it but it in the in the meeting right in the in the report that we have to send over to a brand and say hey something changed and everybody wants to optimize everything right because we're in this performance media mindset across the entire ecosystem right and so it it it adds that pressure right well why did the click through rate go down 0.01% well I don't know what can we do to change that? Why do we need to change yeah why do we need to change it and I think so I think you know there is there is you know the pressure on the agency side obviously there's pressure on the brand side too because the shopper marketer that's looking at the report has to report up to somebody else and there's somebody who's asking them a question, right? And so just from just my perspective, I think sometimes we get too focused in on the numbers the detailed numbers right like when you're running a a campaign yes there are KPIs and KPIs are there for obviously very specific reasons. But what I've seen generally in in my career has been like when you do a can when you do a campaign with the right communication strategy, right? With the it's the right idea, the right communication the right media channels working together, you're gonna see good results, right? Right. Whether or not and and I know I understand why right I understand everybody wants to justify why things are spent the way they were and make sure that you can repeat it again the next time because everybody wants to get to a formulaic result or formulaic process. Oh if I do this this and this every time I'm gonna get X percent of of improvement and and in in sales. All right for episode four I was very fortunate to have on the CEO of Hashcoup, Joel Pontz, who is a a long friend and one of the most curious people I've ever met in my life. That guy just loves to learn and is always you know feeding more information into that amazing brain of his. And it was great to have him on to talk about gaming and advertising because I think his perspective there really brought to light some of the opportunities and and challenges there. And then you know on the technical side you know Joel really had a has a great thought around how AI can impact marketing and marketers and what the role AI can really play. So with that let's go ahead and hear what Joel had to say in that episode. We're gonna talk about gaming in advertising and commerce right and as we spoke about earlier you know everyone's time and people's time you know is fractionalized but there's a huge amount of time being spent on in gaming I think you know for a while there was the you know the the conversation that everybody's a gamer right and so it's just your your mom's a gamer your grandma's a gamer everybody's a gamer right and so and that's and that's true. I think gaming as a form of entertainment is you know definitely part of part of our culture and you know you see that quite a bit. There's also been a lot of conversation about gamification. How do you take certain experiences and turn them into a game um and you know when everybody when when people are spending time doing a certain thing marketers advertisers want to find out how can I you know how can I reach that audience? How can I reach them at the right time? And I think there's the conversation about like I I'd like to play in gaming but I'm afraid I think brands a lot of times are afraid to get into gaming. I think they they're afraid of the gaming community to be quite honest. Like I think they're afraid like if I put my ad in a game and it interferes somehow with their game I'm gonna get so much backlash on on social and in in digital formats that people are just going to you know I'm gonna be dealing with that for months, right? And or people will never never see my brand ever again, right? Because they'll shut me down or something. Right. So like from your perspective like I think I've got to believe that there are some ways that you want to approach it. I think there's been some ways that some brands have approached it and have done it well. Yep. I would love to hear from you like where where do you see the current state of the industry and kind of like where how did it kind of get to where it is today and where can brands play that are very it's where can brands play that really help uh help them reach those gamers?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah it's a fascinating topic um gaming as a category um has about as much time spent uh really across generations but certainly uh with Gen Z Millennials and Gen Alpha a little bit less so with uh Gen X but growing um time spent is comparable to social um and many advertisers I talk to say Joel this has been on our radar for years as a place people are spending time but we haven't done it for one of a few reasons. One is we don't know where to start. There's a whole lot of things out there we're not sure where to begin. Two we're not sure how to do this in a brand safe way or in a way to your point that is authentic both to us and for them. Yeah that's really important. The other one is also uh is this right for us? Meaning right for our audience there's a lot of defaulting to it's kids. Right. Or sometimes it's kids are doing it as a basement. And there's a lot more than that. So to your point uh gamer itself has an interesting moniker and stigma behind it. So what we find is whenever you ask a room full of people do you consider yourself a gamer it's like 20 to 30% of the room if that. But then you ask them oh do you play any mobile games Candy Crush, Words with Friends, Roy Girl way more hands go up for sure. Or even people that are playing Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing like that's cozy gaming. That's a category of games cozy gaming is a real thing. Really that's interesting. So part of it is understanding what's happening across the board. It is a form of uh entertainment a way that people sometimes disconnect um and it's understanding all of that and then giving them the right place to start. So we think of it as a this crawl walk run approach. And it also depends on again who is the audience. So if you are trying to reach uh Gen Alpha coming up but certainly Gen Z, a platform like Roblox and Fortnite makes a lot of sense. But then what is the outcome? What are you trying to do? Right. They're fantastic at driving brand awareness right now. They're developing certain capabilities that will enable commerce opportunities but I would say they're that is not their bread and butter to date. But for example Roblox now has uh immersive commerce capabilities that they've started to roll out it's in its infancy uh but you're starting to see really interesting opportunities where I went and bought something on Walmart discovered within the game yeah and I got something shipped to my house but I also got a digital twin as a gift with purchase.
SPEAKER_05:I I really like that and I I think you know Artifact with Nike did did the same thing correct like you bought the shoe and you got the NFT right and I don't think it was for every every pair sold but that was one of the it was really the reverse.
SPEAKER_04:You got the digital item and then they would ship you the arrow so they took it as pre-orders which was a good way to limit how many they had to produce sure and it also created limited quantities of these. So then there isn't an infinite number or an undefined number of these there's we can look at the sole inside and tell you exactly how many of these were made.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah yeah well that and that addresses a whole nother issue not necessarily where we were headed but I just it just came to me that whole idea of the digital item and the physical item being you know being purchased at at the same at the same time.
SPEAKER_04:And the digital item itself is fascinating. Like I think people are still trying to wrap their head around this but to give you some context uh Parsons did a Parsons School of Design did a study with Roblox where uh out of the Gen Z participants in the study uh 56% of them actually stated that their virtual closet was worth as much if not more to them than their real life closet. Yeah. And at first at surface level you're like that's insane. But then you think about it you're like well actually more people are probably seeing their virtual items on their avatar than might actually see them in real life in some cases. So it's a an element of bragging rights especially when it's a limited item when they had to have been there to have gotten that yeah so we see a lot of opportunities frankly across generations one thing people don't think about actually is baby boomers is one of the fastest growing segments in mobile gaming specifically you know first of all the technology that goes into the cart itself to be able to weigh your food and weigh you know weigh your produce and all that stuff and add it directly to your shopping experience and shopping cart is absolutely brilliant right um and so but on the other hand like trying to deploy that you know a a large number of caper carts I've got to imagine there is pretty pr a pretty expensive experience.
SPEAKER_05:So um you know I like like your point of view on you know do you think a cart like that does it really add to the experience you know or is everybody just good with their mobile phone and and the the wire shopping cart that they're already used to what are your thoughts I think it's fun uh I've never done it myself uh the idea of it sounds interesting and there's definitely moments that I could see that have actually being helpful.
SPEAKER_04:Like there's times that I want to know where certain item is in the store and have to go find somebody in the store to tell me and sometimes they're right and sometimes they're not. So uh the fact that it would be aware of what aisle I'm in and maybe I can even somehow tell it what my shopping list is like things like that I get excited about uh I think they're interesting. I think a lot of value will go to the retailer of course um you know I think early tests that they're showing are people are spending more uh there's more there's more loyalty uh like and I mean I went to you know fresh market yesterday and I saw they had an offer of like buy two chocolate bars and you get a better deal than one. That's not even with a caper card I bought two chocolate bars. Yeah well like what if I was in any given aisle and because it knows what I'm putting in the car it gives me relevant offers that I may not have been aware of I I could set see that being value to the shopper but also driving higher carded value. So it's going to be incredibly expensive to do. I don't know the economics behind it but sure maybe through monetizing the ad inventory what getting increased getting increased uh basket sizes and maybe even more like people on a loyalty program um maybe that actually equates to maybe it's a wash and that's enough for it to be a win.
SPEAKER_05:Right. Yeah I just wonder you know would you shop at a store specifically because it had a cart, a smart we'll call it a smart cart, smart cart, um like a caper cart would you shop there over shopping somewhere like you know a mass personally I wouldn't uh I wouldn't make a decision to go to a place because of that versus not. Yeah it's so frustrating to me when I go to different Home Depot or different lows that I'm used to going to so having something to help with the wayfinding and I know you look it up on the on your phone you can do it through the app you can it'll tell you what aisle things are.
SPEAKER_04:There's something interesting about like it's just here and it's on the screen I'm adding products to the cart. So I think it's helpful but I think it would help my experience I don't know if I would choose to go to the retailer for it. Right.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah yeah yeah yeah especially if I eventually realize every time I go I spend more than I want to well if we can tie that previous topic into this topic like you know if you're on you have that cart right and it knows where you are in store it could provide additional incentives I mean or it could detect your next to it and change the price on at the shelf right before you're about to put in your cart. Who knows? But I think it's like an in-store cookie.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah like it's following you around it knows what you're doing uh if nothing else it's a really uh expensive but probably compelling data research project.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah my my feeling about where the opportunity would be for Caper cart and Instacart specifically would be to you know build all of that technology into your app into your phone app right of course the sensor piece is going to be you know the scales and stuff that's not really gonna be possible unless I guess maybe if you have LIDAR maybe you can right from from the bears right maybe you can use LIDAR to figure out how much something weighs but for that but bring it into your device right and then really bring that because I think it's like more of an immersive shopping experience when you have that cape when you have the caper cart in order to you know tie that into your shopping journey within the within the store your list and your gamification and all that like why can't you just bring that into you know your your mobile device and bring that experience and let that be the way to to do the same thing and then you can scale that much much faster.
SPEAKER_04:It's funny because even as you say that I was like you know a cart that just has space for your phone to go in there and you're you upload the app and then your phone is oh yeah it's good yeah significantly reduced cost and you're opting in to do it at that point you're maybe not going to get the way but you get 80% of the benefit.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah yeah yeah we'll see how you know caper carts and other smart carts get adopted and what impact they have on on shopping so so for episode five we had claire on the show and it was great to have uh claire as kind of wrapping up those first five episodes and she brought her her unique wit and and perspective to the podcast where we tackled about hype culture we tackled AI and marketing aka work slop and we made a few bold holiday predictions together so it was really great to have Claire on the show and so let's hear from Claire. So work slop is a phrase that's being thrown around the workplace now for people who are using AI in AI generated content, you know, whether it's emails or or reports or documents and then they're throwing it over to whoever they have to send that document to and it's not accurate, right? There's there's mistakes or it's not the right you know right content. And then the person who receives it then has to go through this this process of trying to validate that information that has been put into to that document. And so it you know there's been studies and that have been have said that that you know work slop is costing a lot of time and all that time is you know accumulating to lots of lots of dollars.
SPEAKER_01:So you know my question to you is like have you seen personally have you seen workslop have you like actually contributed to your workslop for sure I have especially in you know whenever you're jumping into a new role and you're having hit that learning curve and I mean I'm transparently I'm in a whole new industry that I've never been in before. And so I was heavily relying on um AI and chat to help me better understand it. And now that I'm past that learning curve, I feel like I'm not integrating with it as much. But even the other day so we're redoing our website right now and we are tapping into chat quite a bit but we've got a tailored chat that should and does know our industry and our company through and through and so I feel like once if comp more and more companies do that for the brands that they're marketing for or themselves I feel like that will help. But even the other day we were working through the website and we were chatting through um some some copy options and I made the comment I was like man I feel I feel really bad for a lot of copywriters out there because I feel like that that is one of the roles that AI could potentially replace but to your point on WorkSlop and even what chat spit out for us for a one-liner I was like no this still needs a human element to review it.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah um yeah and I think you know I think first of all with AI, AI in the workplace the AO it's all new right and so there tends to be opportunity for mistakes people misusing it in in in different ways. Maybe AI wasn't the right you know tool to use for a specific request. So I think sometimes it may get overused and so that I think leads leads to it. Some people may just be lazy and don't want to or might maybe or we'll we'll do it the other way. Maybe they just don't have time they're very busy and don't have the time to really check the check the work um and before it gets sent out. I do think that this will you know correct itself over time but I think ultimately the person that is the person that is creating the content whatever it is if they're using AI they are responsible for the accuracy and completeness. Right. I also think about it a little bit like it's like having you know a more junior level employee that it works for you that's maybe new. Yeah. And so you know you try to also help them you know get the content correct but they are going to make mistakes right you train them and they and they've got it and they're gonna make mistakes. So I I do think this is a temporary a temporary thing. For sure and there's obviously as people get more skilled in using AI I would expect that work slot will decrease again but I think you know when it comes to hype marketing you know like I said there's a few different angles of hype that can be built right so it could be a limited edition product only available for a limited time there is you don't know what you're gonna get in the box. I don't know I don't know if that necessarily works well for CPG um unless it's like you know but you know there's that. And then there's the collaboration right and so we're there's some sort of partnership um you know um I think Oreo had I was yeah I was in a yeah at Supreme Supreme Oreos and those sold out instantly then Selena Gummet builds all that hype but you know to me in some cases hype marketing works sometimes it doesn't sometimes I roll my eyes sometimes I get really excited so like in your mind like what do you think really makes hype marketing work?
SPEAKER_01:Well I mean even bringing it back to that the other topic you've got to have a product that works and branding that works with it. So I mean at first I mean using the Oreo post Malone as an example at first I was like what? Why is it postalone making his own Oreo? But then I mean the marketing behind it and then actually trying the product which I love Oreos but that's my cryptonite yes and um I mean yeah I loved it. I mean and I think the campaign performed from what I hear it it did it did really well. Right. Um so I think yeah you've got to have the right product and the right marketing behind it or random behind it.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah and you also see the clouds even at the in the QSR or fast food space quite a bit that actually drive a lot of hype. So a few years back Travis Scott had the Travis Scott meal. Oh yeah and he was he was offering you know offering that through McDonald's and uh SpongeBob and Wendy's right yeah Spongebob and Wendy's um in the sneaker and and sneaker community and um I would say like there was one with a cactus plant flea market.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_05:And so all the high beasts around the in the sneaker community and and uh were all about buying up all these happy meals that had the toys in them. Have you ever have your have you ever bought like a happy meal or some sort of meal like just to get the toy?
SPEAKER_01:Oh yeah for my girls for sure. I think the squishmallow ones were were a hit for the girls for sure.
SPEAKER_05:And yeah they wanted all of those I think I've even had to go and ask hey can I just buy the squishmallow toy and they let me so do you think hype marketing will always work or do you think I mean obviously you have to have the right pairing but like do you think people just go ah not not another mystery box or another I I mean I think it's I I think it's also just trends and what people are jumping on with trends.
SPEAKER_01:I mean even using like the surprise like the the things that are boxed. I feel like it's more so in the toy space where you don't know what you're gonna get um candy could probably play into that and cereal does yeah yeah actually you know dum dums even do like they Back to the dum-dums, like the the purple question mark rap, bro. Oh, yeah, yeah. That's the original, right?
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:That's the original surprise. Um, but I mean, my kids love that, and now it's across almost every single toy. Like there's Barbie, there's those puppy dolls. I mean, there's there's everything. You don't know what toy you're gonna get, and it's gamification, you gotta try to get them all.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, it is. I guess there is a certain level of gamification, you know, as well. Um to it, because you know, you're you're you know, you I I think of it as like the Pokemon mentality, you gotta catch them all and kind of thing. Yep. So I I I think you know, to me, if you if you find a the right I also feel like like a the right cultural moment also is an opportunity. Um like Cranch, right? That was that was you know, catch up in Ranch and app became a thing. That was Taylor Swift, right? With Cranch?
SPEAKER_01:No, I don't think so. Was it?
SPEAKER_05:I think she did something with Cranch and then it took off and they maybe all right. We might edit that one out.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Um, but anyway, um, so I I I do think that you know, I I do think it has the timing has to be good. Yeah. The partnership has to be right. You have to know your audience. Right. Right. You know, because the other thing too is if you put something in a box or you collab with somebody and that user or or that customer is a big fan and they go and they buy it, are they gonna come back and buy your product when it's not a collab anymore? Right. And it's not, you know, it's just a it's just the regular, regular product.
SPEAKER_01:So are you well by then there might be another trend that that yeah? So you're so that that brand switch over switch over.
SPEAKER_05:I know I I do I do think like I do think as long as there is an opportunity to build excitement, right? And so and that's what marketing is, right? You're trying to build demand, right? You're trying to build a desire for a certain brand or product, right? As long as as long as that can work and it's done in the right way, the right product, right collab, I think hype marketing will continue to work. It'll continue to catch me for sure.
SPEAKER_01:For sure.
SPEAKER_05:But you know, and so I think I think I think hype marketing is really gonna stick.
SPEAKER_01:Stick around. Well, and I mean, yes, we've talked about collabs, but I feel like we only briefly touched on like the limited edition side of things. Yeah. And looping it back to do I like Taylor Swift's new album? Dude, she has crushed it when it comes to hype marketing. Oh, yeah. All of her limited edition albums. I was looking at an infographic the other day that shows Taylor Swift's album sales by album. And I think it was the Midnight's album where it there was an uptick and then another uptick for the 1989 Taylor Swift Taylor's Taylor's version. But the reason that the Midnight's album had such a high point of sales was I think that was her first one where she had multiple vinyl editions. So you could collect all of them. And then with this, the Life of Showgirl, I don't even know how many she had, but I mean, I I think at least eight. I'm not don't quote me on that. But and they were all limited edition. You could only buy them for 24 hours. So they she released it on her website for 24 hours, and so then the graphic shot up for Life of a Showgirl because there were so many unique versions of her album. Um, I mean, and yeah, it got a little annoying with the marketing of it, but also she knows what she's doing, and people are still coming back for more.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, she's a machine for sure. Yep, so cool. This holiday season, this is you know my prediction, prediction number one here is I do believe that agentic shopping will actually go mainstream, well, more mainstream than I think we expect. I actually think that more people or more shoppers will buy through AI through live streams. Which I know live streams have had a had a surge and then they've kind of quieted down. Now they've kind of normalized, like it is still obviously a way that uh brands and products can engage with shoppers. I I still, you know, I still think there has to be the right product fit. You know, I don't think every product is great for a live stream, um, but I do think that there, you know, there are definitely opportunities. So um, but that all being said, even though there is this normalization of the live stream shopping, there's obviously all this excitement about agentic shopping and using AI to shop. And now we have these very powerful tools that can do a lot of this research and they make us allow us to find gifts, right? We don't have to sit through a live stream and wait for the gifts to show up, you know, or to show up to buy them. We can just find them directly on on AI with through AI, Chat GPT, et cetera. Um, so that's my prediction. My prediction is that we're really gonna hit it, hit a hit its stride. I think it's gonna drive a lot of adoption and more people will buy via agents and AI than they will through live streams. What do you thought?
SPEAKER_01:I totally agree. I even the other day, this was at holiday shopping, but the other day we're renovating our house or a portion of our house right now, and I needed to order some windows and doors. And I was trying to do just research on my own via Google, just shopping online. And I was like, you know what? I'm gonna go, I'm just gonna go in store to Home Depot or I think Home Depot. I don't know which one. I went to Home Depot or Lowe's and I was like, I'm gonna go back to the back of the back of the store, talk to a person, they can help me plan out the whole thing. I hate to say this, it was not helpful at all. He just asked me to pull up my item skew, and I was like, that's that's not what I want. So I left. Along with using chat, I also used Home Depot's AI chat feature on their website. It was amazing. Yeah, it f I finally found what I was looking for. I was looking for matching windows and doors and a single door and a double door, and I used it or I found it all via the Home Depot AI chat. So yes, I had a little bit of help from Chat GBT, but so I mean, yeah, I think it'll if I'm using it for home renovations, people are definitely gonna be using it for do you use ChatGBT to talk to the Home Depot app?
SPEAKER_05:They could work it out.
SPEAKER_01:No, and actually, I mean, truly, Home Depot's was a lot more helpful than ChatGPT.
SPEAKER_05:Well, it should do, all right. It has that it has all of the data, right? So it should be able to be more uh more helpful. So cool. All right, uh, what's your bold prediction? Give me one.
SPEAKER_01:So I feel like this one has honestly been trending upwards over the last few years, but it's definitely trending in my household. Um, we are leaning more towards experiences and subscriptions over physical, I say toys just because I've got little kids in the house right now. Yeah. Um, but over physical items. I mean, even the other day I almost asked Chad for some new loafers, and I was like, no, I need to do need to get something that's more of an experience or more of a subscription. Yeah. Um, and so last year for Christmas, I asked Chad for some pottery lessons over time. So it was a subscription and an experience. Um and yeah, I think that's definitely at least my household is going.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I think I think that's it's I think that's really interesting. I I do think, you know, kids like to get their, you know, the the PlayStation Network, you know, subscription, you know, as a you know, usually as a gift card and a lot of that stuff. But I think also like I subscribe to Calm.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_05:You know, I subscribe to Blinkist, some of these things that I personally pay for. It would be great if somebody, yes, to be gifted, you know, something like that.
SPEAKER_01:Or those storybooks, what are those uh the brand, the storybooks where you I I gifted it to my dad actually. Um, but you it's an email and the gift recipient gets an email. You can choose how often to get it, but I think I set it up for once a week or once every other week. And they get a question, the recipient fills out the question, and then um and then at the end of the subscription, it's all put into a book. So it's basically your family members' story put into a book and it's bound in everything. So there's a little bit of a physical element to it.
SPEAKER_05:So it's to to put a finer point on your prediction, are you saying that more subscriptions and you know, let's say digital, you know, just and experiences, subscriptions and experiences are going to increase significantly this holiday season. All right. Well, that's a wrap on this episode of Retail Media Vibes, this special recap edition of episodes one through five. I want to say a special thank you to my guests, Tom Bryden, Brad Godwin, Cassie Murray, Joel Ponce, and Claire Reed. So thanks for listening along and stay with us on our journey for retail media vibes. And I hope to see you very soon in another episode. If you have any feedback for the show, please send that to retailmedia vibes at gmail.com. And as always, I promise to do better next time. Be the out.