From Jobsite to Strategy: The Role of an Operations Manager in Construction

Running a successful construction operation takes more than managing projects—it requires vision, strategy, and relentless focus on efficiency. In this episode of On the Surface, Seth Stevens and Jordan Janet talk with Brian Kelso, Delta’s Operations Manager for Construction, about what it takes to lead large-scale operations in today’s competitive market.

You’ll learn:
 ✅ How operations management differs from project management—and why it matters
 ✅ The KPIs that drive profitability, from trucking costs to tons-per-hour
 ✅ Why customer relationships and collaboration are key to growth
 ✅ How technology and process improvements shape the future of construction

If you want to understand the big-picture role of operations in heavy construction—or how to move from jobsite execution to strategic leadership—this episode is packed with actionable insights.

Thanks for listening!

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Transcript

*Transcript automatically generated by AI*

Seth Stevens (00:06)
Welcome back to On The Surface, where we're talking all things heavy construction, material supply, and general business. I'm your host, Seth Stevens, and this week Jordan and I welcome Brian Kelso, who is the operations manager for our construction operations at Delta. During our conversation, we learn about Brian's career, discuss profitability metrics for construction, and dive into what a typical week looks like in construction management. Let's go.

Brian Kelso (00:38)
I'm Brian Kelso, currently operations manager for construction within Delta. Been in the construction industry for 17, 18 years now.

Seth Stevens (00:50)
That's a long time.

Brian Kelso (00:52)
You were 10.

young. So my background, from a small town in Northeast Texas, Paris, Texas, oddly the second largest Paris in the world. We do have an Eiffel Tower with a cowboy hat, makes it legit. But when I was in high school, we had a new program coming into the local community college was a x-ray program. I had a good friend that was

Speaker 3 (00:54)
You

Brian Kelso (01:20)
first year he went into that and was successful and enjoyed it. And so at that age I was thinking you know what can I do minimum years of college for most return and it was leaning towards the medical field and so that's what I did. I graduated high school, started taking a lot of college credits to expedite that and ⁓

I applied for the X-ray school and actually my first year I was not accepted. I didn't have enough college credits. what that did was put me on a path to able to go to work because I only needed like two more classes. So I started working for a construction company out of high school. There was a guy that went to a church, my church, that owned a paving company. And that's really how I got my start.

Speaker 3 (02:07)
So. ⁓

Brian Kelso (02:09)
I started with laying asphalt and building parking lots and roads and really enjoyed it. My dad was a blue collar construction guy most of his life. And so it's really all I knew growing up watching watching dad work and how busy he was and the fulfillment he had in it. So I enjoyed that as well.

Speaker 3 (02:29)
Wow.

Brian Kelso (02:31)
worked for them for year and a half and then reapplied and then got into x-ray school. So did that for another two years, got my x-ray degree and certificate and started taking x-rays for about two years, two and a half years. Long story short, my wife and I got engaged and decided to relocate back to Paris. I had moved to Austin, Texas for a year.

Speaker 3 (02:52)
And ⁓

Brian Kelso (02:54)
went back to work as a project manager for the company I worked through through college and the end of high school. really how I got my start, I got into management at a young age. Lucky for that, you know, it was a small mom and pop company that kind of a jack of all trades had to do field work, office work. At that time we were kind of building our footprint, was needing more supervision, more project management, more clerical work. We had an office lady at the time, she

Speaker 3 (03:00)
⁓

Brian Kelso (03:24)
She went a different way. So I learned how to run QuickBooks and accounting and ⁓ as well as running a job. So we were working many hours, but at a young age, I was thankful for all that. I got a lot of experience, not only just managing people, then administrative side as well. eventually worked my way through the company.

Speaker 3 (03:44)
⁓

Brian Kelso (03:51)
became kind of an operations manager. Official title was vice president when I left Texas. Long story short, I had met Brad Marotti at a ⁓ impact leadership group through Napa and Kentucky and built a relationship with him. We were doing work in southwest Arkansas.

He asked me to join the Paving Association, so I did and became kind of in that friend group, networking. So shout out to the Paving Association. It's for someone young in their career. It's a really good spot to get to know a lot of people. And if I hadn't been a part of that, then I wouldn't have known who Delta was. So, gained that relationship.

My wife's family is in the ministry and they took a church in Hoxie, Arkansas. They were in Hope, Arkansas for 16 years. Most of my wife is originally from Southwest Arkansas. And ⁓ they moved to Jonesboro and started ministering in Hoxie. And I got a text randomly from Brad one day, he would you be interested in working for Delta? And we had just had our first son.

Speaker 3 (04:47)
them.

Brian Kelso (05:01)
And my wife was wanting to get close to my in-laws. And so it just worked out. know, thankful for that. Thankful for the opportunity to come into Delta. I came in as a project sales manager. I think that was a new title that we didn't have. So I'm glad they opened a spot up for that.

Speaker 3 (05:14)
that.

Brian Kelso (05:21)
two years in that position and then moved into construction management where I've been the last four. And then through this reorganization, I've moved into operations management.

Speaker 3 (05:31)
So.

Seth Stevens (05:32)
⁓ emerging leaders was kind of the paving association, right? Like almost every construction association has some sort of emerging leaders category, which is like typically 40 or 45 and under or something like that and kind of have fun events and. ⁓

are able to connect and get like good leadership and management topics and stuff like that. That's why I remember meeting you the first time is kind of a scouting mission in Little Rock.

Brian Kelso (06:04)
Yeah, I'll never forget because Delta had a pretty good size crew there and they was all younger managers. Yeah. And the company I worked for was that old school. We had a lot of older managers, a lot of older supervisors and really impressed that Delta allowed for that, you know, and had that younger guys, that bench coming up and really top tier talent. So I enjoyed you guys being around it. And then I could, you know, seeing myself being a part of that.

Seth Stevens (06:32)
Yeah, yeah, it's fun. that's a, mean, you kind of shouted it out, but it's a good testament to the Paving Association and being involved and creating connections and all that kind of stuff. Yeah, yeah. Personal and business for sure. So the, what, I mean, the majority of your time you spend as construction manager. So what does that mean? Like if you explain that to people,

What's a construction manager?

Brian Kelso (07:03)
What

is a construction manager? You know, it's at that level management, you're thinking more of your accounting, finances, job cost, budgeting, for sure leadership, you know, within your teams, whatever that looks like, know, mimic that in a smaller organization or larger like us. But, you know, day to day operations, I was very in tune with our project managers, project engineers, superintendent.

Speaker 3 (07:30)
it.

Brian Kelso (07:32)
somewhat

to the foreman level, but it was more issues that developed throughout the day. know, if they had equipment breakdowns, you kind of just go through the chain of command of your leadership team. Casting a vision for the work season. You know, making sure all your equipment and assets are healthy, that you're, they're being utilized. And what does that look like, you know, on the profitability side of that side of the company.

Speaker 3 (07:35)
you know.

Brian Kelso (07:57)
Yeah, building relationships with your customer base and getting to know those guys and making sure that all needs are being met. You're looking at safety from a different level, seeing what your safety score is and seeing what the culture of the team, what does that look like? How do you grow and develop that?

Seth Stevens (08:14)
So you're kind of describing it as being responsible for the construction operations as a whole. So in your mind, how would you describe the difference between that role and a project manager?

Brian Kelso (08:21)
Yes, right.

Yeah, so a project manager, my opinion is more job-focused based. So like currently we've just come off the interstate projects. So take Patrick for example, that's his job. He owns that project. So day to day for him, his mindset is how do I progress this job to the best of my ability? How do I work with the customers the best I can and then truly be accountable for that job budget?

You know, that's a project manager. So the construction manager is the thousand foot view above that. know, multiple project managers, multiple projects. What is my master schedule for the season and how do I help the team? And that goes into manufacturing, trucking, everything. You know, how do we use this whole group to work together to accomplish a construction need? And that's what the construction manager is looking at.

Seth Stevens (09:27)
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I think helps clarify, you know, kind of the different positions. where does, you know, I know it's different now, but where does like estimating fall historically in that chain of command?

Brian Kelso (09:45)
So

it's through looking through Delta's lens over the last six years, Brad ultimately came up through estimating and had a smaller team at that time. like estimating went hand in hand. Guy that the job, managed the job.

and did a contract admin, did everything. And then now that's grown more into siloed departments for us. You know, now we have a full estimating team and staff and that's what they do. But it works hand in hand. mean, really, you're estimating is the forefront of your business. You're only good as the jobs that you're picking up and bidding. But they can't do their job if they don't know what your job cost is either. really, you work hand in hand with estimators. But now our jobs have grown so large that we're having to have on-site

supervision and then the amount of cost control on the back end is you know we have to have these project managers that know their job and the costs associated with it. So they work hand-in-hand but you know for us having a dedicated estimating team now we can turn out a whole lot more number of bids than what we have in years past because they're not bogged down with the day-to-day operations. Yeah. Is that answer question?

Seth Stevens (10:58)
I so.

Like I think it's helpful to, you know, if there's any muddiness in people's minds about what those roles are. I was just gonna say like, so in a nutshell, basically, you're as a construction manager, at least from our viewpoint, is you're in charge of the thousand foot view of construction and like fully responsible for the execution side of the projects.

Okay.

For sure. And how do you, I mean, this is pretty fresh for your operations manager position, but how do you envision that looking, moving forward,

Brian Kelso (11:43)
Yeah, I think what it allows us to do is have a really good succession plan. Because that's a huge jump between say construction manager into like a regional manager or an area manager, whatever that looks like. And so now...

growing into this new spot for me, is how you organically grow the business or how do you go out and chase that extra work. What are the customer relationships that we have not had that we can focus on to grow? It allows you to look at more efficiencies, I would assume, and build greater strengths within the other departments of the company just outside of construction. I think that it's a good stepping stone into future leadership and growth.

Because when you're a construction manager in the day-to-day operations, it's a lot. I mean, it's a lot of phone calls, a lot of communication with your team, and you really stay in the weeds of the day-to-day construction efforts. So, like going into this operations manager allows you to see even another thousand foot above that operations team and look at what strategy and future looks like. That's what I'm excited for. know, I think...

In the markets that we work in, we've been heavily DOT focused, which is great. And it's been great for the company for many years. But now we're able to look into more of the commercial side, the general contracting side. That's what I'm geared to look at now.

Seth Stevens (13:12)
Yeah,

and we want to continue pushing, you know, paving advancements and ⁓ project execution advancements and automation. And there's a ton of technology out there and it's easy to get stuck in the daily grind of answering questions, solving problems, jumping from job to job, ⁓ working through equipment breakdowns just to get the stuff done that we have on the books, let alone think about.

the future and how we perform the project better, I agree. I'm sure construction manager and operations manager will have similarities and there's probably similar, like in office versus out of office time, which I guess in office and field time.

What do you, what would you say like your typical percent split is?

Brian Kelso (14:06)
So as a construction manager, I was heavy in office. As a construction manager, I say that. A lot of my field.

Seth Stevens (14:10)
as construction manager.

Speaker 3 (14:12)
Well...

Brian Kelso (14:19)
was doing it down a lot. I would love to be more in the field than what I had been in the past. Having good field management has helped with that, no doubt. I think our Foreman level within Delta is very educated, very experienced. lot of situational awareness there. They've taken just management within their control. So that made the superintendent's job a little easier, the project manager and all that.

You know, my travel from office was more with the associations with ⁓ the engineers, with the Department of Transportation. So that's where a lot of my, I guess you would say, out of office work would be. But heavily in the office, you know, looking at job budgets ⁓ forecast.

Speaker 3 (15:02)
them.

Seth Stevens (15:07)
Yeah. Just so historically as construction manager, you were actually heavy in office, but you're hoping that as operations manager, you can be out of the office more either one, visiting customers or associations and two, visiting the field to understand how we can.

Brian Kelso (15:32)
Yeah, maybe. somewhat. I still think that falls back on the construction manager and your PMs. But it should be a little more flexibility for me to get out at that spot. But I think customer relationships is going to be one of the biggest keys for me.

just seeing what the health is there and what's the future look ahead and the growth and then working more with our sales team. What is that customer-based target that we can approach? There's a lot of big government development right now in the US, especially in the areas that we work in that we could capitalize on. And just how do you grow those relationships? That way we can get a foot in the door.

Recently I've been to a meeting where they were talking about just material resources right now is what everybody's fighting for. A lot of contractors out there doing what we do, but not a lot of contractors who have the material side and that's where our strong suit is within our quarries and asphalt plants. So how do we market showcase that and then our paving capabilities with autonomous paving and...

survey side just being really technical and precise how do we how do we grow that and how do we merge that into the demand of growth within the US right now so I'm looking forward to that.

Seth Stevens (16:46)
Cool. Yeah,

that sounds like based on that we're set up pretty well.

Brian Kelso (16:51)
how

we're set up very well. We've got a really good construction team in Missouri and Arkansas. I think we're doing some things in Missouri better than what we're doing in what I call the South. And then vice versa, we're doing some things in Arkansas that collaborating as one team, this is a missed opportunity that we haven't been doing in for years.

Speaker 3 (17:05)
So.

Brian Kelso (17:14)
So bringing everything under one umbrella. You know, we have a stronger team today than what we did, I feel like, you know, six months ago. Yeah. And we're going to continue to grow that and more, take on some big projects.

Seth Stevens (17:25)
For

sure, yeah, I agree. So what does, you'll probably have to use your construction management role to answer this, but what does like a typical day or week look like for that position?

Brian Kelso (17:40)
So week to week. So we have, the main thing there is really communication focal point within the company. A lot of people look for that position for your weekly schedule, your month look ahead.

Speaker 3 (17:41)
Yeah.

Brian Kelso (17:57)
what form is gonna be on what project. like, if you look at the manufacturing side, the asphalt platform, I need to know who they need to be communicating and working with day to day. And really that construction management piece is that point of the company, that touching point. And so like day to day, we have a two o'clock call. A lot of the times the CM runs that or the project managers, depends on who jumps on. But day to day,

know, Monday I came in, I oversaw a lot of the time cards and reporting just to see the accuracy on that, make sure that we're reporting and contributing enough hours to the shop to make sure the shop's profitable and that we're not under reporting any equipment hours there.

Speaker 3 (18:41)
⁓

Brian Kelso (18:42)
you know, just kind of overseeing time cards on Monday, because that's when we submit for payroll. ⁓ And then throughout the week is just staying on top of our daily plans, construction, making sure that, you know, all the tools that we have with Fleetwatcher and all these softwares that we use and heavy job to track our efficiencies, that there's no missed opportunity there that we're not capitalizing on. lot of times you're just you're trying to sniff out problems before that happen. And so whether that's making phone calls to your team,

to see how their daily day operations are. then if there's equipment breakdowns, problems with the customer. If we have a disagreement with ARDOT are we handling that properly through the communication chain? Does that require an onsite visit to sniff out some issues? So day-to-day operations sometimes fluctuate just depending on what your customer's band is. ⁓

Seth Stevens (19:32)
Yeah, I could see that. How often does ⁓ the plan that you lay out the week before come to fruition?

Brian Kelso (19:41)
It

changes every hour, unfortunately. It's kind of nature of the beast that we live in. We try to control it as much as we can. I think that's where we see success, but ⁓ it changes often, unfortunately.

Seth Stevens (19:51)
Okay.

Yeah,

kind of making a point, I guess, that some of, you know, a portion of your week is consumed with rescheduling the schedule. Yes. Right. Yeah. And adjusting to things that have happened, equipment breakdowns, know, project owner changes, all that kind of stuff. okay. How often are you looking at

like jobs, performance and costs. Okay.

Brian Kelso (20:27)
Typically weekly, yeah.

We've got a system in place for our month-end close with accounting. once a month, we bring the whole construction team together. We call it a jar meeting, but a job analyst review. And we close out our projects month to month. And then we adjust our, what we call EAC amount of completion. ⁓

Speaker 3 (20:51)
estimate. ⁓

Brian Kelso (20:54)
We do that once a month, but our PMs are looking at that job budget week to week. So we have some tools set out. I think it's a report that you send out. It's an auto report. But you're just tracking your labor hours per unit and make sure your trucking rates are coming in. A lot of our really tight-bid jobs, low percent projects with the DOT.

I always like to look at trucking. That's your highest expense per job. You know, make sure your labor and trucking is not getting out of whack. But we're looking at that day to day. We're looking trucking cost per ton. All the KPIs that we look at every day, tons per hour. I would say that's every day, hour to hour. How does that look like? Is the plant being maximized? If you've got a plant that's rated for 250 tons an hour, we're maxing that out. If not, why? Is it just the scope of work or is it a shortage of trucks?

you know, are we not doing a good job on the road communicating our plans or, you know, this attack truck notch brand. It could be a multiple things, but we dig into that often.

Seth Stevens (21:58)
Yeah, that's a very good point because people have asked before like, well, if you aren't reviewing all of your job costs regularly, then how do you know if a job is performing well or not? And truthfully, if you're looking at daily metrics, like just ⁓ bid tons per day versus actual tons per day and like labor hours and equipment hours and stuff like that, you know, every single day, whether

we're going to be on track on the job overall or not. Because if you aren't hitting, if we're missing, you know, half tracking our tons per day or whatever, we're going to be in pretty bad shape compared to what we bid. Whereas if we're beating it ⁓ every day, then we'd know that we're in really good shape. So it's as simple as that. like staying on top of those daily metrics and understanding how they affect the project as a whole. That's right. Right. okay.

What's been your favorite part of that position? mean, construction manager is kind of what we're referring to this whole thing, because it's freshest and where you spent the majority of your time with us.

Brian Kelso (23:12)
For me, somewhat of a visionary, so like casting a vision and then watching a team grab a hold of it and follow you. There's a lot of fulfillment in that, no doubt. And then just seeing some really cool projects be completed. It's sad, I texted a project manager last night, we just finished the 8 Mile Interstate project in Line 55. Been a historic, phenomenal job for Delta and it just substantially complete last week and he text me.

said that I really feel like we're gonna have a zero punch list. I mean, we finished this project with no items on punch list and I was just proud for him and that team. But sad. It was sad to see.

That is part of it, but there's fulfillment in doing a really good job. then working with your customer and they enjoy working with your team of people. it's funny, know, working years in the field and it's easy to find success there because you look behind you at the end of the day and you're like, this is what I accomplished. You know, you look back and it's a road that's been paved or whatever type of construction you're done. Whereas in an office, you know, you're sitting in four walls and

It's hard to find success sometimes. There's no level of accomplishment, but you have to live that out through your team and be the lifeblood on the back end. So there's a lot of fulfillment there, catching things and saying, hey guys, look at this. And then that happens or they catch it. a little bit of gray hair or wisdom. I don't know, time spent in the field.

Speaker 3 (24:44)
fight.

Seth Stevens (24:52)
But it's interesting that you bring that up because in ⁓ one of our last sessions, we were talking with Taylor Kirn about all this, or, you know, not construction in general, but as a like mindset type of thing and mentoring and ⁓ teaching people and that kind of stuff. you know, based on different roles and times in your life, like as you get older, we were talking about how there's like a chemical

reaction in your brain basically that shifts from such a like energetic doer executioner to having to embrace like mentoring and teaching people because all the wisdom that you've gained over your experience and your age and like you are better suited for training and teaching at that point and you actually like get more

Mental satisfaction out of that, but it's hard to embrace all that anyway It just made me think of it again talking about you know being in an office and you'd now have to like cheer on a team and Mentor people and help them through situations and that kind of stuff ⁓ What Types of you know, we've talked about a couple metrics that we look at every day and stuff, but what do you

Like if you picked two or three and just kind of like briefly describe them, what do you look at?

Brian Kelso (26:26)
seems like the last few years we've tracked our trucking cost per ton, probably more than anything. Because on every Monday we send out a loadout report. This was some low hanging fruit that we were able to tackle this last year. ⁓ So say you have a 7 a.m. loadout at Asphalt Plant, you know you have 10 trucks sitting there. What does that cost?

Speaker 3 (26:43)
We were.

Brian Kelso (26:50)
equipment, labor and trucking per minute. And so we dug into that, you know, whatever your cost is per minute. And then if we load it out at 710, well, that's a 10 minute delay that you have all that cost is sitting there. And so that was one KPI that was really easy. You know, we saw a huge increase and Darrell and you know, Darrell and I looked at this very a lot every day. But, you know, now we look at it once a week. And we did it really well.

we started managing that and made it important to us and then the team and then it's almost a competitive thing because every every Monday it comes out then all the plant forming all the road forming kind of compare themselves together and so it's it causes a healthy competitive environment there. But we're seeing a huge decrease in cost and you know and this you know making sure that we're loading out every day on time that way we're not wasting anybody's time whether it's the plant, the road and whatever.

Speaker 3 (27:35)
Hello.

Brian Kelso (27:47)
and then job to job our cycle time on our trucks, then relating that to back what our true trucking costs per ton is. Because not all the time do we hire the trucks at a per ton rate. A lot of times we pay them hourly. So we're only as successful as what the trucks are doing. So really, that's your highest cost every day. So the more you efficiently manage your trucking side, the better your job goes. So that's one aspect we do look at.

Speaker 3 (28:15)
them.

Brian Kelso (28:18)
labor per tons or man hour per tons. So that's another metric. And then really just job totals. know, like if we have a goal to lay 1500 tons, are we hitting that or not? So I guess original estimate versus actuals, know, that's often.

Seth Stevens (28:32)
versus actual stats.

Yeah.

Brian Kelso (28:41)
And then really more at the construction management level, I was looking at a monthly forecast. know, we've got an annual forecast of tons that we're wanting to achieve, but really we hone in month to month. That's really the heavy focus. You know, are we going to hit our monthly ⁓ financials? That's more than often I was looking at that overall number.

Seth Stevens (29:01)
Yeah, that

makes sense. That's good. Who is somebody for you that's made a difference in your career?

Brian Kelso (29:10)
Man, there's a lot. That's a tough one.

no doubt my dad, you know, starting out just watching his work ethic. think that's where I learned most of it. Because like dad growing up, you know, I had

played ball and all this, but at the end of the day, work came before a lot of that. So he didn't miss a lot of my ball games and I wasn't sad about it because I knew Dad had to go work and supply for us. so just constantly seeing that growing up gave me a huge desire to put work first, company first, that kind of thing. I still feel like.

That's a big part of who I am today. So I appreciate that. There's a guy named Kenneth Millsap. He was the owner of the paving company I worked for in Texas. And the number one thing I took away from him was he never took no for an answer. Like we were in tough situations, whether equipment breakdowns or logistics or whatever, he could always figure it out. And I a young man, you

I was like, wow, that's an awesome trait to have. And so I started trying to figure that out. How did he know that? How did he know how to make that call? And it's so like...

just asking questions, why did you do that? And he would share all that information with me. And not only that, he really invested in the leadership side at a young age. He allowed me opportunities to go to leadership meetings and really cultivate that ⁓ as a young man. He always had that mentality of if you can learn how to manage people that you'll get ahead in life. so I appreciate that.

Speaker 3 (30:36)
Thank

that.

⁓

Brian Kelso (30:50)
was guy named Brad Drake. was a corporate company called Amar that ended up buying us out. I worked for them for about four years before I went to Delta. And he was a visionary. I mean, he had some wild dreams. But it kept the company rolling.

afforded lot of opportunities of really neat projects. We did a lot of work with Coro engineer, some government contracts, we did a lot of stuff municipal, we chased big box retail, Walmart, Lowe's, Home Depot, Tartlet. So we traveled a lot with those customers. But I think he really boosted the ground as the owner of the company. He was really well versed in the PR side and building relationships.

which you all ultimately saw that funnel back to the company with work. So I learned a lot from him. And then being with Delta, working hand in hand with Brad and under his leadership there for a while. His people skills, Brad is really level, calm and collective. And ⁓ I tend not to be that way sometimes.

Speaker 3 (31:40)
Mm-hmm.

Yes, sir.

Brian Kelso (32:06)
People at home probably say I am more than I am at work. Just seeing that and then here recently been with Darryl and his technical skills and then Darryl's very just non biased. so like when I need a punch in the gut or a personal opinion, I may be upset about something. He always will ground you, bring you back.

Seth Stevens (32:27)
What did the numbers say?

Brian Kelso (32:28)
Let's

talk through this. what are the numbers say? Honestly, I've learned so much through him in last two years. So, thankful for that. Yeah, that's awesome.

Seth Stevens (32:38)
so what we've been doing for the episodes is like the person in the episode before leaves a question for the next person to answer. And then you'll get your chance to leave yours for the next person.

question and you don't know who these people are. So the question left for you is if you weren't in the business that you're in today, what business would you be in?

Brian Kelso (32:59)
Okay.

I like it,

but I don't know why.

Speaker 3 (33:13)
good question. ⁓

Brian Kelso (33:17)
I guess the selfish side of me. I'm a big duck hunter, love the outdoors. And so probably something in the outdoor industry, honestly, whether that's ⁓ land development for wildlife and conservation or something in marketing retail for the hunting industry. Back outdoors, go check it out.

Seth Stevens (33:36)
Back outdoors.

This is Brian's initials. We ⁓ walked through this idea once or twice maybe of an outdoor retail store. ⁓ Okay, well Jordan and I had bets on whether duck hunting would come up naturally or not and so it just did. Okay, so what question do you want to leave for the next person?

Brian Kelso (34:02)
So I would say, what are you intentionally doing to help groom yourself?

Seth Stevens (34:10)
That's awesome. Yeah. I love that question. Very self-personal development. Yes.

Brian Kelso (34:16)
personal

development. That would be the question. What are you doing to help your personal development?

Seth Stevens (34:20)
Yeah, Monty.

Seth Stevens (34:23)
Please rate our show and leave a review on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen.

and check out Delta on all social media platforms at Delta Companies and our website at deltaCOS.com. Thanks for listening and we'll see you next week.