EP.13: The Stress Tipping Point

Crisis coach and former federal leader Zazy Lopez joins coach Karol Figueroa to break down what happens when burnout, stress, and personal crises collide with professional demands.

Learn how constant cognitive switching drains your energy, how to identify the real root causes of stress, and how to know whether you need a mentor, coach, or therapist. Zazy also shares her personal experience navigating major life disruptions while still showing up at work and why mastering the power of the pause is critical to avoid burnout.

If you’re overwhelmed, stretched thin, or operating under constant pressure, this episode gives you the tools to regulate, reset, and keep moving forward.

Connect with today’s guest, Zazy Lopez

LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/zazy-ivonne-lopez/ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/zazylopez/ 

Read her book: Slaying the Bar Exam

Meet your host: Karol Figueroa

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karolfigueroa/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/karol.figueroa.tate/

Need support at work? HIK Trainings can help.

Website: https://www.hiktrainings.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/hiktrainings/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/hiktrainings

Transcript

Intro

SPEAKER_02 0:00

The more you cognitive switch, the less likely you are to be able to be present in the moment and to be able to deal with those stressful situations.

SPEAKER_03 0:08

The foundation is mindset. It's stoicism. It's your power skills.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

I'm not on social media because social media affects my mood, my interactions, and my perceptions of the world greatly.

SPEAKER_03 0:20

You can't control the outcome.

SPEAKER_02 0:26

Hello everyone and welcome to Coffee and Coaching. I am your host, Carol Figueroa, and I am excited for you to join the very first episode of our new season when laugh hits work. Which is all about when those unexpected things in life just come in and hit you when you less expect it, and it ends up impacting whether you want to or not your professional life. Today we are diving into a topic that everyone is experiencing right now: handling stressful situations at work or at home, as you're going to find out through this episode. We live in a world where burnout is at an all-time high, and many professionals are feeling the heavy weight of the cognitive switching, constantly jumping between roles as an employee, as a parent, as a caregiver, and more. I am thrilled to welcome Sassie Lopez, an incredible crisis coach in human that I absolutely adore. Sassy is the CEO of the Thousand Lawyer Project, where she coaches people through one of the most stressful experiences of their life, passing the bar exam. She brings a wealth of experience, not because of her incredible career in the federal government. She's also a Gallup certified coach that also partners with HIK trainings and working with her clients. So we absolutely allure Sas that she brings such a great perspective to this very issue. Today she's going to share her insights about how to navigate high stakes pressure and why your emotional explosions at work are rarely just about the project and how to master the power of the pause. Let's dive in. This is incredible. We have increased our amount of attendees session after session after session. And I have to say, Sassy, you have driven the highest amounts of attendees for this live session today. I know it's you and your beautiful picture, but I also know you know you have this inviting personality. People want to get closer. And I know it's that, but I also know that stressful situations is something everyone, everyone is experiencing today. So thank you for being here today. But I have to start by giving an introduction so our guests know who you are. Sassy is not just one of my favorite humans, but she is the CEO of the Thousand Lawyer Project, which specializes in helping underserved segments of the bar exam takers that have failed to actually pass that amazing, incredibly stressful exam. As we know, passing the bar is not an easy task. So I could not think about anybody better to talk about stressful situations than someone that coaches people through one of the hardest exams to pass in the United States. In addition from that, she's a lawyer and she has been a leader in the federal government for years, helping people with unfair rights and making sure that they are being heard. So when I think about someone that fights for people's rights that is in stressful situations, that coaches people through stressful situations and handles stressful situations the best way possible. I cannot think about anybody better than Sassy Lopez. So thank you, Sassy, my fellow coach. And I must add also now Strength Finder certified coach. So very excited to have you as a guest today.

SPEAKER_03 3:41

Thank you. Thank you. I'm almost there. I'm almost there. Just a few more coaching sessions to go and then I'm done. And you're done.

SPEAKER_02 3:47

And it's over, right? It's over. Yes. And we have an upcoming client uh session that we're going to be doing in a couple of weeks. So I'm very excited that we're going to be working with this client together. It's going to be super fun. Okay. So, as you all know, coffee and coaching is where I sit down and have coffee conversations with fellow coaches and we talk about real scenarios that might impact you. So think about this as your free coaching session where you get to hear whether you're driving or that you're listening to our podcast, audio podcast or YouTube. Just think about this as your free coaching session as we talk about stressful situations. So, Sassy, I want to talk a little bit about just how you feel, you know, as you deal with your clients, as you see people around you, as you're coaching people and helping all of these professionals trying to pass one of the most stressful times of their lives. Do you think we're in an all-time high for stressful situations today versus any other year or any other decade?

SPEAKER_03 4:45

I can only compare Earth with my 47 years on this planet. Fair enough. But I would say that there's so much going on. And, you know, right now we have a war, right? That that wasn't on anyone's bingo card for this year. And so there's so much going on. There's so much um external stress. There's um the economy. 300,000 black women lost their jobs last year. Um you have the significant number of um reduction in force in the federal government. I have been a part of that. And so there is stress. And with the economy, managing your home, right? Um, I'm a single mom. And so as a single mom, I'm the CEO of my household. So I am here thinking about how do I make sure there's a roof over their head, food in their bellies, because I have twin boys who can eat. And how do I provide for them while, you know, finding time for me and not being stressed, right? And so, and I'm just one of many navigating the challenges of just life, life in the serious way, right? Like you went from a pandemic to this, yeah, right?

SPEAKER_02 5:53

So in the whoever came up with life be lifing, it should be given a Nobel Award, in my opinion. Like just give it to them. Life be lifing is like one of the best pieces that I think I could think of. I want to add to that because, as you know, I have said this probably in every episode of the podcast because it's just so real for

Burnout as a World Health Crisis & Lost Careers

SPEAKER_02 6:14

me that burnout is considered a world health crisis and about the World Health Organization, like out of anybody, right? Like someone that is tracking sicknesses across the world has said burnout is at an all-time high and we need to watch out for it. But I do agree that the stakes are higher. Um, I remember having conversations with my mother about this, and I'm like, hey, how do you handle three kids? Because I got two. And how do you do the driving around, the dropping off? I feel like I'm an Uber driver for my kids, plus I'm an entrepreneur, plus like all these different pieces, right? I also look at uh at my husband and like he has his own business and he has his own things that he has like all the amount of things that we handle is so much grander than we ever have, and stressful situations are inevitable. What I have seen and why this topic I believe is important for today's environment is that I have seen more careers being lost due to the lack of handling stressful situations. I have seen that one situation at work was not that grand, but it was the tipping point. It was a tipping point, and she had done lost it, or he had done lost it in the middle of this meeting. So when you encounter people that you can tell and see they're they are at their edge, what are some of the things that you kind of help them realize to help them understand what's happening and how to deal with that particular situation, whether it's the bar exam or just the life piece?

SPEAKER_03 7:39

I think that the most important thing is to take yourself out of the equation and really assess what's going

Reaching the Tipping Point & The Power of the "Pause"

SPEAKER_03 7:46

on. The tipping point was not that that that was just the last thing, right? But there have been a lot of things that were leading up to it that you might have swallowed, you might not have confronted. If you are a people pleaser or an avoider, whatever your saboteur is, you might have thought, I can avoid this situation and it'll be okay. I just need to get by to tomorrow. But by doing that, you're just allowing it all to fester into one moment, it just explodes. And so when that moment is, when you're in that moment and you're about to explode, take yourself out of the equation, go somewhere, go for a walk, and really reassess what's going on. What's making me feel this way? And then what do I have to do next? Like, really, I'm a I'm a type A planner. I have to-do lists for to-do lists. Um I like that. I like to map things out. For me, I clarity helps before any type of action. And so I need to think about what am I doing right now? What's going on right now, and what am I doing right now? And what do I need to do to address it? Right. And that I learned by not addressing it, right? Yes. Learned this from those moments when you go, you know, you do explode. You're like, dang, I should not have said that. So reflection, you know, we live and learn. So reflection helps us think about, okay, what's the better approach? Who do I need to talk to? If it's a toxic work environment, um, maybe I need to find a coach. Is there a supervisor I can talk to? Is this the opportunity for me to say, I need to step away and maybe find something that's better for me? Perhaps it's therapy, right? So really it's taking a step back and assessing what's um what's really at odds in this situation, and then thinking about what would help me to address it.

SPEAKER_02 9:29

I I love that. I I said this recently to a teen that is uh dealing with an extreme amount of burnout, and the leader uh is at an all-time high stress level. And one of the things that they wanted to do is like the problem is X. They wanted to focus on the problem is this. And I'm like, the problem is this meeting, the problem is this project, the problem is the the pro that, you know, and

The 30-Day Rule for Identifying Your True Triggers

SPEAKER_02 9:52

I'm like, before we get there, I do not allow myself, a team, or anything to make a conclusion about what the problem is for at least 30 days. So if I believe that I have an issue, let's say um with HRK trainings, for example, if I'm like, I have an issue with HRK trainees and I believe is the CRN system. I don't allow myself to deduct that it's a CRM system until it's been 30 days. Because I need to allow myself those 30 days to analyze it, especially if I'm gonna make a life-changing decision, if I'm gonna make a work-changing decision, right? Or that impact people's lives, because our brains are as rational as they are emotional. And emotions are what makes us creative beings. And I absolutely love that. But if you allow your, if you have the same thought day one at day 30, and you have done your homework and you do diligence, you're like, you will, you will realize, and and most of the time, I'll say 80 to 90 percent of the time, what I thought was a day one is not a day 30. And for I'll I'll give you an example for me at least. I'm a very high, I I feel like I have all the emotions in the world. I feel them all. I feel like the wheel of emotions is just like a wheel that happens in my life all the time, right? Which is what makes me a good writer. But also it allowed it, I have had to learn how to react, especially if I have a trigger, right? So if there's a trigger, so I know we're all in high stressful situations right now. So if you join this show because you're in the high stressful situation and you feel like you're alone, let me tell you, you're not. We are all around the world dealing with high levels of stress, from government to situations at home to work and all of that. So the question is what Sassy just mentioned, I think is crucial. What is it? What is this thing that is like driving the water out of the out of the cup, right? What is the thing that is filling it up before you get to that next level? And then once you analyze that, hey, it's because of what's happening in the world is really affecting me, then you take measurements. So for example, for me, social media affects me greatly. Like I have friends that love to send, I am here because I work here, but friends that send me stuff all the time. It's like, did you see it? I'm like, no. Did you see this? I'm like, no. So unless you send it to my text messages, I'm not on social media because social media affects my mood, my interactions, and my perceptions of the world greatly. So I have voluntarily decided that, hey, you know what? This is not for me. So, like, for when

Navigating the Uncertainty & Shame of High-Stakes Exams

SPEAKER_02 12:25

when you're dealing, and I want to go back to your clients, right? And who you work with, with the with the, especially with the bar exam. Let's think about that particular scenario. Because we have a lot of guests and listeners that are waiting for that moment. They're waiting for this meeting, they're waiting for this project, and this day is so crucial for me. What are some of the biggest reasons people are overly stressed and almost gets them to fail the bar exam that you have noticed with your clients?

SPEAKER_03 12:52

I think uncertainty. You can't control the outcome, right? That's that's something you have to just let go. You can put in all the work and still not pass. You can't control the outcome. You can only control your emotions. You can only control how you show up in the moment. And there's a lot writing on the bar exam. You've just completed three years of law school. If this is the first time you're taking the bar exam, this is the exam that you need to pass in order to continue on to your license. Yes. Presumably, you went to law school to practice law. And so it's there's a lot of weight to it. There's also shame if you fail. People internalize that failure, like there's something wrong with them. Wow. And there obviously is nothing wrong with you as a person. It's just the system. Maybe the way you were studying needs to, you need to make some changes in the way you were studying, or you need to reassess what resources you have or what skills you need to develop, right? But it's usually this thing where you're like, I can't control that outcome. I don't know what's gonna happen. And so that that unease, the uncertainty of it all is what really drives distress. And then it is a lot of information. I mean, like the bar exam is taking your entire first year and saying, remember that what you learned three years ago? Now you're gonna have to do that in, you know, 200 questions. Right. And then um answer six essays in three hours, 30 minutes each. Oh, and by the way, you got 90 minutes to answer this um, you know, memo or brief or letter, whatever we tell you we want out of this library of information we give you. So it's a lot, and it's two days. So there's a lot going on and it and it's heavy. And for folks who are who might be balancing or the way I call it harmonizing life with studying. So they might be a caregiver, they might have children or caring for family members or pet. They all require caregiving, right? Um, or they are working and studying. There's a lot of balancing acts, right? There's a lot of things you have to do throughout the day in order to make sure that you're studying, but you're also, you know, taking care of the things you need to take care of, including yourself.

SPEAKER_02 15:11

And that means let's talk about that self because I'm excited about uh, because this is gonna be great. So we can talk about what you're planning next for for your career. Because I I always feel like your skill set is needed far more than love, my bar exam takers, but the world needs it. The world needs your crisis coaching expertise. Like this is one of the best things. So let's talk about the self. So, what has, you know, I know

Coaching the Whole Person, Not Just the Event

SPEAKER_02 15:39

that you work with a lot of people and like you focus more on the self or in the day of the event itself, right? Because I love the uncertainty piece. Because like for you to have gone through through school and grad school, you have to be an apersonality person, period. So uncertainty is not something that people like you and me do very well. I'm actually, I've actually had to go to therapy to deal with uncertainty. I'm like, what do you mean I can't control this airplane that is flying in the air? I I should be able to tell the pilot what to do, right? So that is something continuously work on. So from your experience, do you spend more time on the event or on the person itself when you're doing your coaching? Person. And what person and what they're going through.

SPEAKER_03 16:24

Yes, because everything, so let if we just take bar um students studying for the bar exam, everything you're going through is bar exam related. It might not be a question, but if you are, if you're having um a challenge with childcare, that's going to impact your ability to study. So you're gonna need to walk through and coach through. I'm gonna have to guide you through figuring out your next steps. Sometimes that decision fatigue, you don't have time for thinking about five different other things. Sometimes you just need to be like, I'm just gonna pull out a hot pocket and eat that. Right. Like, because it's just, it's uh you're you're deciding, right? And so when big challenges come up for my clients, it's like, okay, let's talk about that because that's ultimately going to impact how you show up when you study. For us um at the Thousand Lawyer Project, we, you know, we look at it like a um, we call it like a bar exam stratification. We look at it like a like a mountain. And at the bottom, at the foundation is mindset. It's stoicism, it's your power skills. Like you're not gonna be able to study if you don't know how to manage time. You're not going to be successful in studying if you're trying to control an outcome or you're not resilient or adaptable because sometimes you have a system in place and it's not working. So you have to change it. And that's okay. But if you're not able to do that, it's going to really impact how you study. Yes. We focus on you, getting you the skills and tools and things you need to identify triggers. What's going to throw me off, right? And then you can go to active learning, deliberate practice, all the other exam strategies. And I I did this with my kids. So my kids were sitting for the Catholic school exam. And I'm like, well, if I'm doing this for people taking the bar exam, I can help my kids. And so I made it a point. My so my boys are neurodivergent. They have ADHD and they're um on the spectrum. And so I was like, all right, I want you to sit down, take this diagnostic. And then I would ask them, so how did you feel? You got 10 wrong in a row. Were you focused? And they were like, no, I got distracted. I was looking at something else. I was like, okay, right. But I was helping them to assess, like, so now you now you know you get distracted. What are you gonna do to, you know, get back on focus, right? And focus on what you're doing. Like, well, maybe I could do this. And so it's so it's they they wouldn't have known it but for the exercise of sitting down, taking the diagnostic, and really looking at it, not just for what's on the page, but how I was showing up. And so with our with our clients, we're like, when you take your diagnostic, how did you show up? When were you hungry? Did you have to get, you know, get up and walk? Were you tired? Were you sleepy? At what point was that? These are all questions that are completely unrelated, 100% related to the example.

SPEAKER_02 19:13

Well, well, and I think that that that's a lesson for stressful situations at work. They don't just happen at work, they've been happening before you get to work. So I I have what when I'm constantly when I'm coaching people, I have to I ask a lot of questions. And I have I have some the most, I have everything figure out. Clients get really annoyed sometime at the beginning. And I think uh David, uh, my friend from All Cat out Um, he will he will agree with this, but I'm a instigator coaching style. Um so I I I will poke, but I'm poking because like the people that the most sure, because you know, I'm one of those people, like I know what I'm doing, and I need my coach to be like, no, you don't. Welma, if you're listening, you know what I'm talking about. It's like, no, you don't, right? Like you think you know based on the experience that you've lived and based on the recordings that you have in your head. But I have to poke a little bit because it's not just work, it's never just work. So if I have anything to share today with your expertise here, because everything you're telling me, it just feels very, very connected to me. I'm not studying, but I feel like every every big thing I have, like you can deassociate your stressor from a big event. So if your stressor is mostly at home, what are your stressors? What are your triggers, which I think is the most important thing you just mentioned, and and the document fast. I will be honest. As a mother, I cannot have my toddler around when I work. Like my daughter, she's been trained. She's 12, she knows, hey, mommy's on a call, mommy's this. She actually goes to sleep when she hears my voice, like knocked out. She hears me on a phone call and she's like, like, she it's conditioning, right? She's been hearing me talk on the post of watch. But my my son is like, no, attention, me, I'm talking to you. You're I'm you know, your mommy, right? Because I was more at home with him. So like I my people please her gets activated. I want to please you. I want to please my work. I want to please the like I and and that division is stressful. And I want to talk about cognitive switching

The Exhausting Reality of "Cognitive Switching

SPEAKER_02 21:14

because as we work through emotional intelligence with leaders, cognitive switching has come up a lot in a lot of different research points as to one of the reasons why people are burned out the most. We have the cognitive switch so much, and social media tech talk has completely messed our attention spam, right? So we are used to our attention being retained by such a short period of time that we start moving to things here and here and here. And something that you say about the bar exam or any other effort that requires a lot of focus will require an extra level of effort from us because we're so used to constantly cutting to switch. And when you have to cut it to switch roles, okay, now I'm a mom, now I'm a CEO, now I am a wife. Now I am a friend. Now I am a daughter. You're like constantly switching roles. And then you're cooking, you're cleaning, you're doing a power presentation. This is the life of many people to be able to keep up with everything going on today. So I think that your point is so, so, so clear. Uh, and this cognitive switching thing feels very real, especially for the stressful situations. The more you cognitive switch, the less likely you are to be able to be present in the moment and to be able to deal with those stressful situations, is what I believe.

SPEAKER_03 22:30

That was me during COVID. I mean, I had I was working my my regular hours. I had my two, they were eight at the time. Um, and they were in class. I had to make sure I was a I wore the social worker hat when I noticed one son was under the table. I'm like, what are you doing there? He's like, I don't want to be on screen. And so I'm like, here's your headphones. You still gotta listen. Right. Like some navigating that, or um being in work, and then the uh then, you know, they're crying because they got in a fight. So I am negotiating a peace treaty while in a meeting, um, or doing so. We we instituted, we would do on-site investigations and we instituted virtual ones. And right before I started an interview, my son throws up. And so my boss asked, my boss was like, You seem overwhelmed. I'm like, I want these kids back at school. Like, I can't work with them around. I love them. I love them, but then like, and then how can you be mad when they're like, excuse me, mommy? And you're like so polite for a cookie. I'm like, are you bleeding? Bleeding, you do not interrupt my reading.

SPEAKER_02 23:43

I am working on thank yous and pleases right now. I'm like, thank you and please, thank you and please. Like it's like, oh my God, it's real. But I do remember COVID. And I remember we I was grateful to have spent it with my sister and my mom. And at the time we only had my sister had her daughter and I had my daughter. And I remember us co-parenting. Like, honestly, we were stuck for six months, which I'm so grateful because I think it would have probably led to a lot of stress. And I do remember me just sitting my daughter, like directly from the bed, putting her in the chair, putting a hat on, because she's like, you know, her hair is not done. And like, here's your juice, here's your thing, turning the laptop on, play, and like next to her, my laptop, you know. And I'm like, this is this is not the way. This is not the way.

SPEAKER_03 24:30

No, so not the way. But that goes to the point of the c you know, the cognitive switching. Yeah. What hat am I wearing right now? What do you, who do I need to show up right now in this moment, in this immediate moment. I have so many hats. Now, with once my children were diagnosed with ADHD, I was like, oh, okay, so my mom hat changed to my coach hat. And so I have to ask myself, in this immediate moment, who shows up? Is it mom or is it a coach to really work you through it? And you know, it just happened recently when my son couldn't find his, he didn't have his shoes, and I had to walk him through the whole dichotomy of control, yet again, like when, especially with uniforms and pieces missing, you lost, you had them, when you had them in your hands, you had control. When you left without them, you no longer have control. And you can't just snap your fingers and hear they show up. So what about it?

SPEAKER_02 25:22

He's never gonna leave somebody in his hand without being in his hand ever again.

SPEAKER_03 25:27

So we walked through it, like what can you do now? Like really get him, getting him to problem solve. But that wasn't the problem. So I was like, okay, so I will let your school know that you're gonna wear your sneakers. And then there was a pause. And this this requires staying, especially for leaders, when you're trying to understand what's what's really at the core of your of your team members' um challenge or whatever is happening to them. It wasn't about the shoes and the school. It was what would his friends think from me. Like getting down to that was really important, and then helping him realize that's not as important as going to school with your sneakers and like and and then then I put my mom hat on. Yeah. Right?

SPEAKER_02 26:07

And you have that empathy and that yes, yes. You have to. It's a it's you know, yeah. I do have a question though. What happened if

If Work is the Stressor: Mentor vs. Coach vs. Therapist

SPEAKER_02 26:16

your stressor is work, the office, the place, the people around you, and not home?

SPEAKER_03 26:22

If your stressor is work, um, I would I would suggest that you find um a mentor or coach who can help you identify what about that work is stressing you out? Could it be that you were overlooked for a promotion or you're working with someone who is not giving um adequate guidance?

SPEAKER_04 26:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:42

Then how what what can you do to to obtain that guidance? Yes. Could you ask specific questions of your supervisor? Hey, you know, I'm working on this project. I have some questions for you. What tools and tips do you need in order to make it uh a more effective relationship? Right. Yes. But also, is this the right fit for you? 100%. Right. And so you might not have the ability to transition right now, but sometimes you need an exit strategy. And that's okay. Like it may be six months from now.

SPEAKER_02 27:14

We're gonna be okay. Yes. Yeah, yes.

SPEAKER_03 27:16

Six months from now I'm gonna leave, but that gives me the buffer to look for something else, right? And then see if I'm just here for six months, what skills do I need to make me marketable in the next position?

SPEAKER_02 27:29

Yeah, don't pick up and leave. Don't do that. Don't leave, don't leave a job without a strategy or another job. Like, you know, absolutely, especially if it's your livelihood, is on the line.

SPEAKER_03 27:39

So definitely get help. Like, don't don't sit there and and stress without it. Like, um, either it's a mentor, a coach, therapy where you can work through whatever that stressor is in the moment so that you can respond appropriately.

SPEAKER_01 27:55

Before we continue, a quick shout out to today's sponsor, HIK Trainings. If you're ever wanting to level up your leadership skills or bring real connection back to your remote team, check out HIK Trainings.com.

SPEAKER_00 28:08

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SPEAKER_01 29:00

And we're back. You're listening to Coffee and Coaching, where we blend real conversations with real growth. Let's jump in.

SPEAKER_02 29:07

I personally think this is my guidance for that because I'm like therapy is if if if you are this is triggering something other than just business, right? So if this, if you feel like this is when you're mad, it's like it's lasting you days, it's triggering some kind of childhood trauma memory, right? It's like we call it a uh talent trigger or a life trigger here at HRK training. So this is a life trigger for you. So a life trigger is happening. If this is lingering, lingering, and and I had this situation when I had this manager, he triggered my issues or authority from my childhood, right? Like it was like I felt like I have to constantly prove myself. Like I have to show you. I have to show you that I can. I have to show, and I like when when it was unfair feedback given, it will take me days. Like, oh my God, this is so unfair, you know, and it will it will linger in me. And to your point, if I would have got that piece of advice, get a mentor, I should have gotten a mentor earlier in that situation, right? Like I should have got and I have seen it so many times. And the difference between a mentor and a coach, I think is super important, right? A mentor is a person that has walked a path. A mentor is a person that has done what you've done, that's been in your position, has more experience in the company, has more, so knows the culture better, or has more experience in the role, and they can tell you, hey, Dan, I'm Gandalf, come follow me, right? But a coach is a person that is going to give you tools and skills to get out of the current situation that you're in. It does not mean that they know the path of that company or the culture of that company or the people that can tell you to network with. It just means that they're going to give you skills and tools that you need to get out of particular situations. So I say if your stressor is the job, you definitely need a mentor and a coach, in my opinion. But you know, if you can only do one or the other, got it. Because with your mentor, I think like you have to be more careful in your conversations. With a coach, you can be much more open about it. And with your coach, you can, you can, they don't work at the company. And we that you are protected by contract that we have to keep confidentiality of everything that you teach us. While a mentor, you know, you can share with them how do I walk through, but you probably can't be as open as you would like to be. That's my opinion, based on my experience. What do you think?

SPEAKER_03 31:25

No, I agree. I mean, and also mentors are busy, right? Super busy. They're that my my, you know, if you're my client, my hour is yours. In fact, I am, I'm one of those. My hour and a half might just be yours. I might just give you an extra 30 minutes. You can text me. I will, I will answer. You know, that's a different relationship. I am there for you. Whereas as a mentor, you're just one of many different things I'm handling and I care. And I've been a mentor. And so as a mentor, I do show up coach-like because that's just how I am. Your natural being. Yes. But it's also, you know, it's it's also a weight on me, right? As a mentor. And so I think sometimes when when you have a mentor, you feel that for them as well. And um, I know for me, I don't want to bother. So I tend to be like, I don't want like, oh, do you want to have coffee? Maybe my people, please. My avoider. Um, do you want to give you coffee? Like, let's let's meet up. Let's see. Do you have, do you have no? It's okay, no pressure. You know, right? So you recognize that this is something that they're doing because they want to be nice and they want to help. But um, if it's a coach, you're like, well, I'm paying you for this. It's like your coach. Right? Like, that's my time. And so I'm gonna show up for my time. It's not a nicety that you're doing if you want to get it.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

And I'll say this with therapy, I'll say this. With therapy, we for me, what I had a client that was like, I'm stressed out, I need a coach. And I'm like, you don't need a coach, you need therapy. Because I like the she was physically suffering. I could see her brain had her feel pain. She was pained. And I'm like, this is therapy grounds, which you know, I am very clear. I I think there's there's for every season and every reason, you need a coach, you need a mentor, or you need a therapist. There's there's one for it. Sometimes people feel like the blinds are bur blurried. For me, they're not blurried at all. I think like, like, I know exactly you know it too, right? As a coach, we're like, no, I you also need therapy. I need you to look time with a therapist. And I make it part of your goals. Like, hey, part of the goals that we're gonna set out for you is you're getting a therapist, right?

SPEAKER_03 33:40

Well, because we ask that for people studying for the bar exam. Like, do you, you know, this is a stressful time. Consider maybe getting a therapist or counseling. Like, we throw it out there in the beginning. Like, you might need some other services in addition to just coaching or tutor or whatever it else you think you need. You might need someone who you have to talk to about some of the deep emotions that that studying for something like the bar exam can bring up.

SPEAKER_02 34:05

Oh, yeah. And and and I can only imagine it's real. I I get anxiety with exams too. So the godlock test that you just recently took. I took it on the last day. You could think you six months. I took it on the last day because and I knew everything in there. You you know how me and the strengths, I I know them to the memory because of my input, but it was it was something that that was there. Okay, so I could talk to you forever. What is the one takeaway you will want to leave the guests and the listeners with today on stressful situations?

SPEAKER_03 34:36

Um, the one takeaway

Micro-steps Out of the Valley

SPEAKER_03 34:38

is pause. Pause in that moment and think about what's going on. And as you're thinking about and mapping out what's really at issue here, what's what's what's bothering me, what's stressful here. Think about who do you need to be to overcome that moment? And how are you going to become her? Who love it? Because those questions are going, they're very similar but different. Like I need to be vulnerable, for example. How do I become vulnerable? It's not just sharing, let me just tell you everything about me. That's not vulnerability. No, but let me hold back some of the stuff that I really don't want to share.

SPEAKER_02 35:15

Oh, you know, I struggle with my vulnerability. Me and vulnerability have a complicated relationship.

SPEAKER_03 35:21

So in that situation, you might need to, how do I become vulnerable? Maybe I need to get a coach, or I need to go to therapy, or I need to work on, you know, work on some of these skills. So it's really a lot of it's introspective and reflective. But it's all being intentional about the next step. The way I look at it, Carol, it's like this it's like faith is really important to me. So it's like hilltops and valleys, right? And so you're at a hilltop, and then stress happens, and now you're in the valley, and how do you get out? You can't just push through. You have to, I I say get up for a second, walk a step because that shows action, and then stop. Right, stop. Walk to the coffee shop, get your coffee, get your out your notebook, and like think about what's going on in this moment, right? Yes, and then keep moving. Make those micro steps further and further until you get out of the valley. Um, but also make space for you. And I and I know that it's really hard, but one of the most stressful times in my life was going through a divorce and my mother um being in hospice at the same time, within the same three-month period, and transitioning my kids from one childcare to another, and then they were gonna start kindergarten all in the same summer. Wow. And still showing up to work. And I had to be honest that I was not gonna be able to do any of those things if I wasn't there for myself. And so I leaned into prayer, right? For me, that was what I needed, but I had to find and protect that space for me. And oftentimes we ignore the self to try to address the challenge. And when you do that, you do more harm than good. So taking even that 10 minutes in the morning for you, it really matters and it goes a long way.

SPEAKER_02 37:07

And that right there is the lesson, right? Start with the self. Start with the self before you start thinking about the situation because it starts with you and how how you react to it. I think uh if I was to leave anyone with anything today, it would be we're all going through it. It's a stressful world. This season for coffee and coaching is all focused on, and this is the name of the season, when life hits work, because it's impossible for it not to. And that's why I'm so glad you're our first guest in this series, Sassy, because it starts with stressful situations and then what happens to your body, how do we navigate through it? I want to say on what you share right now with us today and what you went through, you were above everything so brave for taking the first step forward. So thank you for being vulnerable and sharing that experience with us and with the audience because it's uh truly remarkable everything you have accomplished in spite of all the hardships that you went through. So thank you for that. I am so glad that we had this conversation, Sassy. I'm so glad you're our first guest of this season. And I know there will be many more. There'll be plenty more. And uh, I do want you to talk a little bit about what's coming for you on your on your coaching practice and what you're planning for your future, because it's super cool and I'm super excited. So, you want to talk a little bit about your crisis coaching and how you're you're planning on on uh showing up for your clients there.

SPEAKER_03 38:30

So, building off of my experience with with working with um students taking the bar exam, I'm working, I'm evolving as a coach. This whole, this past year, especially, you know, with the reduction in force and and and what's happening in the federal government, me included, I decided to take last year to build my coaching. So that meant getting working towards certification. I see have certification through the the community and around the community college course on life coaching, getting working on my Gallup strength certification, because you know how much I am a stan for kids of strengths. I love it. And so in building that, I started to see where where can I where can my coaching evolve? Where where do I want to have impact? Because the one important thing about me throughout my entire the entirety of my career has been impact work. When I was leaving my first job at DHS, DOJ to go to DHS, I said I want work-life balance and impact. And then last year I was like, well, I need work-life balance money as a CEO of my own household, right? Like income. But I also wanted impact. Like my belief and responsibility is on high. So those are two of my top five strengths. As such, I need to feel like I am of service, right, to others. And so for me, I want to work with high. I'm I'm really eager to work with women who are navigating these challenges because it's stress does not have to undo. We all go through it, but it's not just, it's like the significant stress, the debilitating stress, the the moments where you feel like you're being riptied and you you're looking for help and you want help. Able to help women navigate those challenges because they have it. We have it all. Like I had all the skills I needed. They were just, some of it was just untapped. Yeah. And you need someone to say, here it is. This is how this is how we're gonna unearth that skill that you have. Because we've all had to, especially women, you don't get to this point in your career without having to push through and really like developing skills you didn't even think you had. So it's it's um an empowering moment. So that's where my coaching is evolving. I'm really toiling away at what it looks like and what it feels. You heard me say it many times, like, well, I was thinking this. But you know, I'll leave you with this. I heard Taylor Swift has a song called I Can Do It With a Broken Heart, right? And in it, she's talking about how she goes out there and performs, but you know, she's breaking up inside and every day's her birthday. That's essentially what stress is. Like sometimes you just gotta go out there and perform while you're struggling on the inside. Yes. And so, what do you do what when you have to have that balance? Yeah. For me, I needed to keep the job because I was gonna be a single mom. So, right, like priorities. But if every day is your birthday, that means you need to find time for you. Yes. And so I believe in the holistic being. My number one is context, and it's not about Which is my number my number 34, which is why I call you to validate things.

SPEAKER_02 41:37

I'm like, and I'm gonna do this and this. And you're like, hold up, hold up, slow down. We need context. And I'm like, what? Context where I so I love that because is your number one by 34?

SPEAKER_03 41:46

Yes, yeah, yes. For me, but it's not about history. For me, it's the holistic you because yeah you did not show up today without everything that came with you.

SPEAKER_04 41:55

Yes, right?

SPEAKER_03 41:56

You went through a lot to be right here. So for me, it's like understanding the holistic you and then helping the holistic you build that woman you need to be to get through this challenge. So that's that's what I'm I'm working on.

SPEAKER_02 42:10

Wow, Sassy, this has been truly an insightful episode. Thank you so much for joining us in coffee and coaching, and thank you for being so vulnerable with your own story. For our listeners, I hope that you realize that while stressful situations are inevitable, how you respond to them is within your control. It's actually sometimes the only thing you can control. The next time you feel like you are at the breaking point, remember Sassy's crucial advice and pause. Take yourself out of the equation for a moment, step away and truly assess what is causing the stress before you react. Remember to look at your life holistically and actually figure out what is the thing causing the most stress in your life in that moment. But also be aware of the cognitive switching and constantly having to switch roles and see how your body reacts to not be able to keep up with all this different happening simultaneously. If you're interested in learning more about crisis management or navigating or working with Sazie Lopez, we'll have her information and the link to her book right here in the comment section. Thank you all for tuning in. We look forward to connecting with you on our next episode of Coffee and Coaching. Take care, everyone!