Imposter Syndrome: Why High Achievers Still Feel Like Frauds

Ever felt like you’re about to be “found out” despite having the qualifications, experience, and evidence to prove you’re capable? You’re not alone. In this episode of Ella Podcasts, we explore the psychology behind imposter syndrome - that persistent feeling of self-doubt that can affect students, professionals, leaders, entrepreneurs, and even CEOs. Despite success on paper, many people continue to question whether they truly deserve their achievements.

We discuss why imposter syndrome is so common, how it differs from healthy self-reflection, and whether it stems from internal thought patterns, external biases, or a combination of both. We also examine the role of perfectionism, workplace culture, social media, and career transitions in fueling feelings of inadequacy.

Joining me are:

🔹 Dr Ronina Stevens – Clinical Psychologist specialising in anxiety, depression, trauma, and wellbeing
🔹 Sapna Makwana – Counsellor and Psychotherapist who shares her personal experience of imposter syndrome during a major career change
🔹 Eileen Coupin – Executive Leadership Coach and Keynote Speaker

Together, we unpack why so many talented people feel like frauds and how to stop self-doubt from holding you back.

In This Episode We Discuss:

* What imposter syndrome actually is — and what it isn’t
* Why high performers often experience it most
* The link between perfectionism and self-doubt
* How social media fuels comparison and insecurity
* Whether sexism, racism, and bias contribute to imposter syndrome
* Why career transitions can trigger feelings of being a fraud
* The difference between healthy humility and chronic self-doubt
* When imposter syndrome becomes harmful
* Practical strategies to build confidence and resilience

Key Takeaways

* Imposter syndrome is common and does not reflect actual competence.
* Thoughts and feelings are not always facts.
* High achievers, leaders, and CEOs often experience self-doubt.
* Comparison, perfectionism, and social media can intensify imposter syndrome.
* Growth often requires stepping forward before you feel fully ready.
* Confidence is built through action, not certainty.
* A small amount of self-doubt can encourage reflection and learning.

Tough times are hard to navigate. We share experiences, feelings and tools to cope and become resilient. Unpack what weighs us down - loss, grief, anxiety, panic, low self-esteem, disappointment, sadness and change. Feel less alone and take away ideas to lift that dark cloud and face the future. Sprinkled with humour.
Creator / Host: Ella Sherman & Clinical Psychologist: Dr Jonathan Marshall with Two Special Guests per episode.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:07

Hello, I'm Ella, and this is Ella Podcasts. Imposter syndrome is the fear of being exposed as not good enough, even when there's evidence that you are more than good enough. It exists in the workplace, schools, within families, and on social media. It even impacts high performers, which sounds totally irrational. Is imposter syndrome simply a case of self-doubt or being underestimated by others? Or is it something more systemic? Is it enough to tell people believe in themselves when the system may be stacked against them? Here to discuss this topic are Dr. Renina Stevens. She's a clinical psychologist who specialises in working with anxiety, depression, and trauma. We have Sapna Makwana, a counsellor and psychotherapist who will talk about her personal experiences of imposter syndrome when making a career transition. And Eileen Kupin, who's an executive leadership coach and keynote speaker. So the first question, Dr. Renina, is imposter syndrome a psychological condition or simply a way to describe reputational insecurity?

SPEAKER_02 1:11

Well, first of all, it's not a diagnosis. So it's not a diagnosis like, say, a mental illness or an anxiety disorder or depression. It's very, very common. You know, many people have this. It could sit alone or it could sit with some other things. It's a pattern of thinking. So it focuses, as you've already said, on sort of self-perception, fear of uh evaluation or exposure, really. And uh it can be made worse by past experiences, having had something traumatic or critical occurring that can make the fear of that kind of come again. So it's what we describe as a cognitive distortion. So your mind has thoughts that are distorted from reality about your performance or your abilities. And uh so you may believe that you're not good at something or you don't deserve something, or you get a promotion and you're you're thinking they picked the wrong person, they're gonna find out that I'm no good at this, are the kinds of distortions that the person may have. And I think there are probably workplaces that may sort of externally accentuate that fear as well. Very highly competitive, highly perfectionistic, you know, high exposure, not particularly teamish, perhaps, that may accentuate those fears. It is treatable, right, and uh it is common, so it's good to talk about it.

SPEAKER_03 2:38

And it's it's something I actually don't relate to for a change. Um don't have that on my checklist. But uh a friend of mine, she says she's got imposter syndrome, and yet she is the most brilliant, eloquent, competent person I know. She's got a degree in medicine and a law degree, so she's got two big degrees from Oxford University, and she tells me she suffers from imposter syndrome. How can that be?

SPEAKER_02 3:04

I mean, I think the thing to remember is that suffering from it and competency don't go together. So you can be highly competent but be struggling with imposter syndrome. In fact, quite often leaders are, CEOs are, you know, this is kind of hidden, but it's there.

SPEAKER_00 3:22

I remember reading a quote just recently from Maya Angelou, and um, I'm not gonna get the quote verbatim correct, but it was essentially she has uh published like 11 books, um, you know, one Pulitzer Prizes and the rest of it. And um there was something in there about oh gosh, I'm still I'm gonna be found out, you know. So even somebody at that calibre and that experience can can can also experience these kinds of thoughts.

SPEAKER_03 3:50

So Satna, do you think imposter syndrome is an internal lack of confidence issue, or is it due to bias such as racism, sexism, and elitism?

SPEAKER_00 4:00

Um, I think that's a really interesting uh question and an important topic around imposter syndrome, um, and definitely something that I think the answer is probably a bit of both, and maybe other factors as well. Um, because I guess here's the thing: like if you walk into a room and there's no one else that looks like you, you know, or you've grown up in systems where either subtly or or maybe even not so subtly, you've been made to feel like you don't belong in that room. You know, maybe your your name has been mispronounced, or you're you've been mocked for your accent, or you know, all sorts of things, then I think that it would be unfair to say that it is just an internal, not not just because there's so much to it, but you know, it's it's not only an internal thought patterns and all of that. There are systemic structural things that are going on around you, and your nervous system is responding to that. You know, you're reacting to that environment around you. Um, so I think that's half the story, or or perhaps a part of the story. But as Dr. Ranin has mentioned already, the the other piece is I think these thought patterns that they become habits or or yeah, just styles of thinking that become more common to us. So perfectionism, perhaps not thinking about the good things about a situation, you know, discounting the positives and really focusing on the negatives. And I think one of the other big uh thinking patterns when I was when I was thinking about this is that which we sometimes refer to as um attribution bias, like thinking something happened just because it was lucky, you know, not because of your own experience or knowledge or or or you know, for lack of trying or merits, that's the word. So yeah, I think these kind of thinking patterns all kind of get tangled up and and you know, yeah. So there's there's definitely other factors at play.

SPEAKER_03 5:50

And you reached out to me saying on a personal level, you have experienced imposter syndrome.

SPEAKER_00 5:54

Absolutely. So what did it feel like? I think for me it's is interesting because I feel like I've experienced in experienced imposter syndrome in like two sections of my life, two parts of my life. So, you know, I had a 20-year career in finance, um, and at certain points, you know, I was doing pretty okay. You know, I was doing well, I was respected, I had a good position, um, I know knew who to go to. But even then I had moments where I felt, oh my gosh, like they're gonna find me out. You know, there's definitely better people than me that could do this role. Um, so yeah, echoing what what you've already mentioned, Dr. Anina, like that it doesn't only affect newbies. But I think more recently it has affected me as a newbie. Um, because recently I, you know, over the last few years, I have really shifted um away from finance and into counselling, into psychology and counselling. And I think there was there were many moments where I have felt and and still do in some ways, that, you know, who am I to hold this space for other people when I have my own stuff going on? And, you know, I, you know, do I have enough experience? Do I have enough credentials to do this? So yeah, it's definitely affected me. Um, I think one of the things that's helped me maybe in reframing this is I've kind of shifted from perhaps trying to get over these imposter thoughts and think, you know, I don't want to have them at all, to being able to accept that they're there. They're a part of a part of my thinking process, and perhaps they're there because this really matters. You know, I really want to do a good job. Um, and moving towards, yeah, accepting that they're there, but doing things anyway. So doing things that, you know, perhaps like this podcast, you know, am I really the right person? I I don't know, but I'm gonna do it anyway, despite there being some imposter syndrome and some discomfort. Yeah. So yeah, that's probably been my experience in two very different ways. But thanks for sharing that.

SPEAKER_01 8:02

And then Eileen, what's your experience with imposter syndrome? I mean, it's it's so common in the workplace, right? So there's various different studies, but especially for women executives, it's placed at around 75% of women experience imposter syndrome in the workplace. Um, and then you you see it at different stages within a career, right? So early career, it's do I belong here? And then as you go up the ranks, it's you know, what if I'm found out? You know, can I can I sustain this level of expertise? And especially within global roles and global contexts, um, people might be very successful within one context, and then they're moved to a different region. Um, you know, they have to adapt to new cultural uh styles, new leadership styles, new communication styles, and then they might get imposter syndrome for the for the very first time. For me, my my own personal story of imposter syndrome is both within my leadership roles and as a coach. So the first time I had to coach a CEO, I was like, who am I to be here? Who am I to be coaching this CEO? Um, but it's really reframing it, right? Like you were saying, Sapna, it's it's about thinking of what is the value that I bring here, right? So it's not, am I a CEO, but what value can I bring here? You know, so it's the listening, the coaching, the advising, the different perspectives that I can bring. Um, and with imposter syndrome, it's not about ignoring it, right? It's there, we're going to have these thoughts, but it's really reframing them and taking a pause, right? Looking at the evidence. So what are the facts here? You know, do I have the qualifications, the, the, the credibility, right, to be doing this role, looking at them in black and white. Um, and then rather than stepping away from the imposter syndrome, it's stepping up. So it's like a moment of growth. So I see it as something positive.

SPEAKER_03 9:56

Yeah, it makes a lot of sense.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

And then with the CEOs that you've coached, have you come across CEOs with imposter syndrome? Absolutely. Absolutely. And actually, it can get worse the more senior you become because the environment that that these C-suites or or CEOs are in gets more and more complex. The pressure is higher, both externally and internally. Um, so yeah, it it can get a lot worse.

SPEAKER_02 10:20

It's lonelier as well, I think. So there's less kind of checking out with peers because you have to be seen to be. And so I think that loneliness can kind of breed the overthinking.

SPEAKER_03 10:32

Yeah, so the buck stops with you and you're under the spotlight for absolutely everything. Harder to be vulnerable. Right. Yeah, I guess they've got no one to go to apart from their coaches. Yeah, that's interesting. So a saying I always find very practical is fake it to you make it. And I had an Irish friend who was always that was her mantra, fake it to you make it. And I learnt a lot from her because she was gutsy and she'd just put herself out there. I mean, she was kind of to the point where she'd she'd nail jobs that she had no experience for just on the gift of the gap. But then she would do the job really well, and it was just this, you know, fake it till you make it. So do you think that's good advice?

SPEAKER_02 11:12

I do. I I think it can be quite on on by and large, I think it's good advice. And I do use that term myself as well, fake it till you make it. Because I think it sort of encourages you to take action despite being afraid, and that's what we need people to do. You've got to keep going and try things, even though you're feeling scared and you're feeling, you know, in you know, that you're maybe allowed quit in some way, you've got to kind of keep going. It it sort of builds confidence, really, that you don't have to wait for something to be certain because it's not going to come. The certainty is not going to come without trying things and without practicing. And it can, I a lot of people who have imposter syndrome get into this sort of paralysis, emotional sort of paralysis sort of state, and it can help overcome that paralysis a bit by faking it to make it, but obviously I'm saying that with a with a kind of a bit of a protection. Right. So you can't fake it to make it. So I'll give you an example. My husband will be pleased I send this. I can't fake as a psychologist fake it to make it and go into an IT department and pretend I can be a programmer and have skills because I've just got such knowledge gaps that I'm going to expose myself. So obviously, you can't do it, fake it to make it with something too big where you don't have the knowledge knowledge. We're asking people to fake it to make it where we when we know they do have the knowledge and they might need to grow a bit. I think you can't go around faking it to make it every minute of the day feeling inauthentic. So I think it you we've got to balance that idea of sort of performance versus growth and not overperforming.

SPEAKER_03 12:56

And it's and it's so you know, it comes up in all our lives. So whether you change school and you're having to, you know, adapt to that, or you've got a new job or a promotion. I mean, there's there's a lot of elements of having to kind of pretend until you really are that real thing.

SPEAKER_02 13:12

When I moved to Singapore, I um it took me a while to get some friends and to, you know, I was a bit slow on the uptake, making friends and things like that. And I watched this lady who'd moved around a lot. She arrived and in two weeks she established what I had in six weeks. She just went out there and I'm sure she was anxious and she was doing fake it till you make it. Yeah. But she kind of was just doing that process.

SPEAKER_03 13:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:35

And it was working for her.

SPEAKER_03 13:37

Yep, that makes sense. So, how does social media increased imposter syndrome as we're always comparing ourselves to illusions of non-stop success and perfection?

SPEAKER_00 13:48

A hundred percent. I think social, yeah. I mean, social media has just, you know, has given imposter syndrome a whole new dimension and probably a kind of cruel dimension. Um, you know, I think before we were, we were always comparing ourselves, or you know, a lot of people do, but your pool is so much smaller. You you're looking at colleagues or friends, people who are physically around you. And now you you scroll on your phone and within five minutes you've seen a hundred people post their achievements and accomplishments, their highlight reel. And I think one of the, you know, going back to like one of the thinking patterns I think that really affects imposter syndrome is something called like comparison trap, or essentially when we're comparing like what we're feeling inside to what somebody is projecting or presenting on the outside. So you look at highlight reel or somebody that's you know doing this amazing presentation and looks completely articulate and confident and and you know, really doing really well with it, and then you're comparing how you might feel inside if you were to do that. Like I could never do that. So I think that that cycle of looking at social media and following people that and I guess the other part of it is you don't know what it took for them to do that. And a lot of it's an illusion, it really isn't real.

SPEAKER_03 15:07

Whether you're looking at people physically and it all looks so perfect, and their families all look so, you know, magazine style, everyone in Ralph Lorraine, picture perfect. You're not seeing the reality, but we inevitably start comparing their perfect lives against ours, and as you said, all the awards and recognition. What do you think on this subject, Eileen?

SPEAKER_01 15:31

Yeah, I I I think with with this, it's it's kind of with imposter syndrome, it's identifying what is your your type, first of all, of imposter, you know. Um so I think being the the sort of comparison one is a is a really big one with with social media. And I think everything is just highlighted and and exacerbated. And with social media for people in the workplace, it's LinkedIn, right? Where every tiny little you know, certification or every tiny little thing is sort of uh magnified and and um and I love it when people put a certification at just like really minor big fanfare and they're getting hundreds of likes.

SPEAKER_03 16:10

Like, seriously, too many quicksell, you know. But you're right, it's amplified. A different subject for you, Eileen. When should someone resign? Uh, because they really feel like they are an imposter in their role and they can't keep pushing ahead.

SPEAKER_01 16:26

So I don't think someone should resign based on imposter syndrome alone, right? So it's again taking a step back and pausing and whether that's you know, just checking in with yourself or checking in with a trusted friend, advisor, a coach, whoever that might be, but just looking at the facts, looking at the evidence. And is it something that is internal, right? So is it self-doubt, is it self-confidence, or is it within the external um environment, right? So those are two different things. Um, I have a lot of clients who are very burnt out, right? So there can be a link between the two. And I had a client who was uh physically and mentally exhausted, right? And who was displaying all these signs of imposter syndrome and who was saying, yeah, I have a lot of impostor syndrome and and thinking of quitting their job. And it's like, well, first of all, are you sleeping? No, I'm, you know, answering emails at three in the morning, doing these reports and so on. Are you eating properly? Are you exercising? So all of the basics. Let's first get that stabilized and then see how you feel, right? And can we work on the internal first? And then the external might be a new environment, a new promotion. You know, can we set boundaries? Can we work on that work-life balance? So I wouldn't say imposter syndrome is a a reason to resign in itself, but it is it is a signal, right? So it is a signal to kind of take a moment, pause, and and assess is it internal, is it external? And and what can I control? What can I change here? Dr. Ranina, what can people control in these situations?

SPEAKER_02 18:02

Well, I think um what you were saying about take a look, I think that people have to work out what's making it come, what's triggering it, and then they have to work out what's keeping it going. So certain things maintain it. So I'll give you an example of what I mean. So if somebody has experiences thoughts that let's say their boss is coming to visit, they're coming to the office and they didn't know they were coming, they might have a thought, oh, it's because I've done something wrong. Oh, I'm gonna be sacked, they're gonna expose me, they're gonna find out that I'm not a great manager, whatever that might be. So what they do is then go through their emails for hours and hours looking for evidence of this sacking that's coming or some mistake that they may have made. And then they might go over the books again, working harder, working hours and hours, burning themselves out. And of course, the boss comes, the visit comes, and there is no sacking or no exposure. The person needs to keep a bit of a diary of that, noting what the thoughts are and then noting did it happen, did it not happen, and then start to reduce the behaviours that they're doing that are a bit like checking, you know, kind of double checking, which are exhausting and lead to burnout. So that's not a fake it to make it, that's kind of like a maintaining factor. So we we kind of really need to reduce that. And we need to notice when we're feeling like a fraud, name it, work out. Is it fear? Is it comparison? Is it because we're doing something new? Because if it is, even if we're older, you know, what do we need to kind of alleviate that new feeling? You know, do we need to let people know it's new to us?

SPEAKER_03 19:40

Um do we always, you know, maybe having training or mentorship, coaching, whatever you need to make that step into feeling comfortable that could be useful. Yeah, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 19:53

Sometimes it is about, yeah, like you said, checking yourself and seeing what do I need in this moment to help me to feel more confident and and to yeah, to feel more kind of uh established in doing this.

SPEAKER_03 20:05

So do you still feel like you have imposter syndrome or do you manage it now?

SPEAKER_00 20:10

I think I manage it in terms of I think like I was saying before, I I've just reframed it slightly in that I don't I I think in some ways, I think you also mentioned this, Eileen, I don't think of it as a bad thing anymore. I think it's there because I care about what I do, I care about my clients, and you know, in some ways in this field particularly, you don't I don't think I would ever want to get to a place where I feel like I know it all. And you know, I think that anybody that's seeing a counselor, a therapist wants that level of kind of checking in and to make sure that we are doing everything we can do. So yeah, I don't see it as a bad thing. I think it's more, I just am more aware of it if it's going to stop me doing anything. So really just seeing is there something that's coming up for me that's that's not allowing me to do the things I want to do. That's good advice.

SPEAKER_03 21:02

And do you think it's healthy for everyone to have a little bit of imposter syndrome? Yeah. Just to keep you on your toes. Yeah, I do.

SPEAKER_02 21:09

A little bit. I think most people do, because otherwise you're you're not going to be reflective and you you could lack a bit of self-awareness if you if you're not kind of sometimes quite curious and questioning. But perhaps you could look a bit complacent or overconfident. I don't know. So a little bit, but it is about the balance really, and it not being chronic self-doubt, which which then you know gets people to the point where they're burnt out and feeling like they want to quit. There's a difference.

SPEAKER_03 21:37

And what does chronic look like for imposter syndrome?

SPEAKER_02 21:41

I think anxiety is usually quite high. Um, I think avoidance can sometimes be high as well, but you know, avoiding certain meetings, avoiding doing the tasks that they're dreading that they feel they're not going to manage. I think what you've already said, Samna, is dismissing their achievements, just absolutely saying, Oh, well, I was lucky that time, I got promoted or what it is, just and just constantly being on edge that you are going to be exposed. I think that that is where it looks a bit more chronic.

SPEAKER_03 22:10

And if people can't afford therapy, you know what measures can they take to kind of improve their feelings of imposter syndrome.

SPEAKER_00 22:19

I think Dr. Anina, you've already mentioned a couple in terms of you know maybe keeping a log of where where's it showing up, you know, what are the triggers? Where have I felt that feeling that you know I either I can't do this or I'm going to be found out. Just like really start noticing where that's coming up. And then if there are things that you can do about it to help you feel a bit more confident, really trying to have a look at those things. And I think a big one that I I think has helps a lot of people as well is is again, I think you've mentioned it Eileen, but reframing reframing the thought from you know I'm not good enough to do this or I can't do this to I'm learning and growing. I'm learning to do this better. You know, there's still an element of of of a journey and of growth and you're recognizing maybe you're not in the place where you you want to be um but you're also acknowledging that you are working towards that. I think that reframe is subtle but I think that reframe can kind of really help people.

SPEAKER_01 23:20

Yeah I like to use the word yet so I don't know how to do this yet. I'm not excellent at this yet right so it's really a work in progress it's it's really all about growth and I think there's a lot of literature out there as well where you can look at the different types and that really helped me and that really helps my clients as well is understanding looking a little bit at the past like why are we like this you know so for me there's the perfectionist element there's the expert I have to be an expert at something before I can you know do something about it. So it's really understanding and being self-aware and then when these thoughts come up it's just having them in mind keeping them in check and just saying I might not be an expert at this yet but it's okay. I'm trying I'm practicing and from this discomfort comes growth. So it can be a beautiful thing.

SPEAKER_02 24:11

Yeah. I think if people can't afford talking to friends who are perhaps not in their industry sharing a bit more because there's something about being a shame and kind of keeping quiet that makes it compounds it a bit. So I think if people can share it they will get more evidence that they are competent from those other people but they also may hear that other people have moments of this too so it's not apparently 75% of people in their lifetime feel like an imposter.

SPEAKER_03 24:41

So I'm so glad not to be on that list. I'm gonna have a go at Harry and minority it's shameless in that sense but you know it's a lot 75% of people at some point have felt that way. So for our final quick round um what do you want our audience to remember when they feel imposto syndrome this week?

SPEAKER_00 24:59

This week um I would say um I think I mean I think I've talked about it already but really rather than trying to completely eliminate these thoughts embrace them a little bit listen to what it's trying to tell you. You know this is important to you perhaps you are on a bit of a journey and you're not yet there but you're working towards it. So yeah rather than thinking of these as you know something really bad that needs to be eliminated just kind of getting a bit more comfortable with it and saying yep I've got it but I'm gonna do this anyway. I'm gonna move forward anyway. Great. Yeah that's what I would say.

SPEAKER_01 25:37

So for me it's it's a sort of process so when those thoughts come up it's taking that pause checking in being self-aware looking at the evidence right is it actually that I'm not capable of doing this or is it just my internal self-confidence self-doubts and then taking action right trying something get out of there and and just get out of your comfort zone and just try it out and then just seeing it as a as a moment of growth.

SPEAKER_03 26:03

Great advice and Dr.

SPEAKER_02 26:05

Anina I think it's remembering that thoughts and feelings aren't facts really being clear that we can feel something very very strongly but it doesn't make it factually correct and that people with imposter syndrome have no problems with their competency.

SPEAKER_03 26:21

And just with my HR hat on I would say to people you know your colleagues family or whoever it is they want you to succeed so it's worth remembering you know people aren't wanting to watch you fail they actually want to watch you do well. So you know I think knowing that can help. All right well thank you for joining us today on Ella Podcast. Imposter syndrome isn't something to cure the real challenge isn't silencing the little voice in your head but learning when to listen and when to ignore it. In truth confidence doesn't always mean you're right and doubt doesn't always mean you're wrong. Next time you feel like an imposter question what is this feeling trying to tell me and is it telling me the truth? If you want to suggest a topic for our next episode please join our Facebook group at Ella Podcasts and message us. Please subscribe rate and share this podcast sending you a big genuine hug