Do Women Still Need Men? Masculinity, Feminism & Modern Relationships

As women become more educated, financially independent, and successful, are men struggling to understand their place in modern relationships and society?

In this provocative episode of Ella Podcasts, we explore changing gender roles, the perceived crisis of masculinity, and whether men and women still need one another - or simply choose to be together for love, companionship, attraction, and shared values.

Joining me are Dr Jonathan Marshall, leading clinical psychologist and former professor; Simon J. Littlewood, Oxford graduate, journalist and BBC World Service commentator; and Samir Kothari, investment fund manager.

The conversation brings together strongly contrasting opinions on feminism, independence, family, dating, masculinity, and what healthy relationships may look like in the future.

Who Is This Video For?

This episode is for anyone interested in modern relationships, gender roles, masculinity, feminism, dating, marriage, and the changing expectations placed on men and women.

In This Episode

* Are men experiencing a crisis of masculinity?
* How women’s financial independence has changed relationships
* Whether men and women are naturally complementary
* The difference between needing a partner and choosing one
* Why some men feel unwanted, undervalued, or uncertain of their role
* The impact of modern feminism on dating and family life
* Why marriage and long-term relationships are becoming less appealing
* What future relationships may need to succeed

Key Takeaways

* Financial independence has changed the traditional reasons people enter relationships.
* Many men are searching for a clearer sense of purpose and identity.
* Independence does not remove the human desire for love, intimacy, and companionship.
* Relationships are most likely to succeed when built on respect, communication, attraction, and shared values.
* Men and women may no longer need each other in traditional ways—but they can still deeply enrich one another’s lives.

Conclusion

Modern relationships are no longer shaped solely by economic dependence or traditional expectations. Today, people have more choice—but that also means relationships must offer genuine emotional and physical connection, mutual respect, and a shared vision for life.

Keywords: masculinity crisis, do women need men, modern feminism, gender roles, dating today, men and relationships, women’s independence, marriage, male identity, modern relationships, companionship, Ella Podcasts

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:07

Hello, I'm Ella, and this is Ella Podcast. Are men being emasculated? In a world where women are educated, financially independent, and successful in their own right, do women still want or need men? Many men say they're struggling because society no longer values them as providers and protectors and the head of the household. Has the liberation of women made men feel unnecessary and unwanted and unsure of their role in masculinity? Here to discuss this contentious topic are Dr. Jonathan Marshall, a Stanford and Harvard University graduate, who is a leading clinical psychologist and a former professor. We also have Simon J. Littlewood, an Oxford University graduate and a journalist known for his commentary on the BBC World Service. And we have Sami Kathari, who's a fund manager for an Italian investment fund. He has a Master of Science from the University of Houston, Texas. So Jonathan, are we experiencing a crisis of masculinity, or are men simply struggling to adapt to the rise of women?

SPEAKER_03 1:11

Women have more and more, are graduating with bachelor degrees more and more. So in the United States, it's almost 50-50 now. Um there's been a change in power, there are a change in dynamics. And I think all of society is trying to work out what is this balance meaning. And as a result, I think there are men who are struggling. They don't know you know, a woman doesn't need a man very much now. If she can be protected by her environment, if she can can make the money that she wants, the only thing you know men really can supply then is sex. But do they even need a man for sex? And so if a man's unique selling point is that he provides and protects, and a woman tends and and uh nurtures and brings people together from an evolutionary perspective, then I'm not sure men's role is really being strengthened right now. And I can think that a lot of violence is occurring as men feel emasculated.

SPEAKER_00 2:06

And Simon, are men confused about what it means to be a man in this post-feminist era? And what does emasculation mean in today's world?

SPEAKER_01 2:15

Well, we're not it's not post-feminist. We have fourth wave feminism now, which is particularly unpleasant when it comes to the role of men. If men are confused, uh it's not surprising. But the fact of the matter is uh the uh ability of women to play a wider role in the economy is absolutely great. It's it's clearly the case that if 50% of the population can play an active role in the economy, whereas they couldn't before, that is a desirable thing, because the totality of skills that you can bring to bear is is doubled in essence. Um so I think you'd be nuts to argue against that. You know, where I where I take issue with this is the notion that just because it's possible for a woman to be financially independent and therefore not to depend on man for men for leadership, for money, for marriage, for whatever it happens, that that's a good thing. That's two completely different questions seriously. One is what is the nature of the man and what is the nature of the woman, and how do we what do we need to lead successful and happy lives, versus what opportunities we have in the modern world to be entirely about ourselves, entirely about making money, and to buy into what I think is complete myth, the notion that satisfying all your needs and wants is per your personal needs and wants is the should be the primary objective of every life. I think that's a huge mistake, and I think it's leading to huge isolation and misery in current societies. And I I can talk about it a bit more, but I won't. I'll just say one thing. You know, the reality is that we have evolved to be complementary. Men and women have different skills than we do, because for hundreds of thousands of years we had to do fundamentally different things, but we need to recognize those differences and we need to ensure that we take advantage of them because they are complementary and they make us happy. That's what I think.

SPEAKER_00 4:04

Um happy to talk about it more, but probably Has the pendulum swung too far in the pursuit of gender equality? Are women better off as equals? What do you think, Samir?

SPEAKER_02 4:14

Well, I would just like to say that behind every successful woman is a male mentor, right? I mean, uh honestly. Where did you get that one from? Nobody just made that shit up. Um I'll just tell you now. You know, the only reason Merkel became who wrecked the German economy. Yeah, this, this, this, this genius, right? Uh it's because Hellman Koe, right? Every, whether it's Sherry Sandberg or that that Nithin, that that Pepsi chick that that ran Pepsi into the ground. She's come up a couple of times. Yeah, she's she's a because she's a fucking idiot, right? I mean, uh, but you you look at behind you look behind every one of these women that were catapulted into you know CEO positions or you know, senior political roles, it's there's always uh either one or a group of men that have helped this woman uh ascend to that that to that leadership role. Uh and then that woman then ends up fucking it up, right? So uh, you know, so I I do do do women need men? Yeah. I mean, if you want to become, you know, the CEO of uh of Google, yeah, you're gonna need a man to prop you up, to, to mentor you, to move you to the next level, because it's not gonna be a woman, right? You look at every sales team or every every team which is predominantly women run by men, uh, usually it is an extremely uh productive environment. When you have predominantly women that are managed by a woman, it's like a Nazi death camp, right? So, you know, the the this idea that, well, we don't maybe at a very low level, uh, yeah, I don't need no man no more kind of thing, you know, whatever some Beyonce bullshit song. Yeah, maybe you're gonna get, you know, uh there's some truth to that, right? That they can buy their own handbags and shit like that. But when it comes to, you know, major sort of roles that women will play within society, within politics, within business, that's never gonna change, right?

SPEAKER_03 6:19

So I don't know that I agree with you. Like I can think of Joan of Arc. I don't know that she had a male backing her up.

SPEAKER_02 6:25

But she had an army of men. She had an army of men, which she led them. Yeah, sure. And then she was burned to the state. She was born to the man as well. Right. So, you know, my cardinal or some shit, right?

SPEAKER_03 6:36

I can see in a society where power has largely resided with men, that yes, it makes a big difference to be be helped along. But I think that's changing.

SPEAKER_02 6:46

Okay, of course, of course, I mean, compared to the 15th century, yeah, there is there is more equality relative to, you know, from a societal standpoint, from political and business standpoint, right? Yeah. No doubt there, right? Uh and there's no doubt that there are women that contribute in all three of those sectors, right? Yeah. And are useful in society and politics and in business, right? My point is that if you want to reach the pinnacle of what whichever sector they're working on or in society, you need this the support of men to reach that, right? You're not going to get the support of women, right? Because women are inherently horrible at promoting other women, right? It's in every case, it's men that are essentially mentoring and supporting and promoting these women, right? So I don't see how uh, yeah, at a very basic level, like, okay, you know, I can pay my bills, right? But I mean, for God's sakes, I mean, you can pay your bills, I mean, great. You can pay your electricity bill, I mean, you can pay rent. I mean, men have been doing that for, you know, generations, right? So women conflate that with, you know, I don't need no man kind of thing, right? Well, I mean, the millennials, right?

SPEAKER_00 8:05

These are not these millennials. I think, you know, a lot of women have been educated that, you know, you should be career girls, you know, put the babies on the back burner, don't focus just on getting married and having babies. And I think what's sad is, you know, for me it was all, you know, get on the contraceptive pill as soon as you can so you don't have babies. And of course, there comes a point in life where you want babies, and guess what? You've screwed up your body from being on a pill for the bigger.

SPEAKER_02 8:32

That's a totally different thing, though. No, no, no, it isn't. I mean, it's not a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

You've missed out on having a lot of people. Because you've left it too late because you're meant to have this career. Um, you've lost out on all the good men who the girls that still wanted to get married and have a baby by 28, they've taken them. So actually, what's left for those career girls? I mean, I do sometimes question this, you know, desire for quality of careers, because what does it mean? I just pay all the bills myself.

SPEAKER_02 9:00

That's a corporate rat race issue. That's not necessarily I don't need a man thing, right? I think it's unfair to to conflate both of them, right? So you're talking about the sort of the sort of propaganda around a career, and then our our topic is, well, you don't need a man type of thing, right? So I think even those women in the corporate world still want a family eventually, and still want children, and still want a kind of a traditional nuclear family, right? What we're talking about is this notion that women can do all of this without the support and you know, uh propping up of anyone that is the male gender, right? Which is we just don't need men in getting to our goals relative to, you know, from a societal standpoint, from political standpoint, from a business standpoint, I think that's a totally different thing, right? And and that does exist, right? We we we we see this, and this is propagated primarily in the it's a it's a political academic thing, right? So we just talked about this where in the 1960s, you had all of these nutjob academics in Stanford and Yale and Harvard and wherever. Well, you in Stanford and sorry about that. Uh, Stanford and Harvard. So two out of the four. But you know, uh talking about uh this very topic that you know women can run the world, right? So and then you look at the certain type of woman that is in a political government sort of standpoint, like Ursula Vendor, whatever her name is, right? She's basically fucked up everything that she's talking about. I mean, she must she looks like she was a bit of a looker. She reminds me of Goebbels' wife. I think there's a Magda Goebbels. She's the Magda Goebbels of her time.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Okay, let's get a little bit back in.

SPEAKER_02 10:53

I'm getting I'm getting back to the topic here, which is you've got you know prime ministers that brought in women to run Ministry of Defense. Because if women are defense ministers, right, the idea was there'll be no war. But what they did was they'd fucked up every every defense department. You know, the the the emasculation of the German military was done by Ursula. Single-handedly. Single-handedly, this this woman uh is a is a one-woman wrecking ball, right? And you know, but she's quite cute. Yeah, she can be a younger day, she would have been a big thing.

SPEAKER_00 11:31

I want to move this back to just talking more generally. So, Jonathan, how are changing gender dynamics impacting workplace and romantic relationships?

SPEAKER_02 11:41

Um, that's a good one. How do you imagine this question?

SPEAKER_03 11:49

I'm thinking that as men are getting angry, because it's like, you know, people.

SPEAKER_00 11:53

We're feeling some of that.

SPEAKER_03 11:59

Think of like, I think, for example, uh, you know, terrorist groups, how you know, that's often men, largely men, are doing the acts of violence in terrorist groups. And I think part of that is because of a sense of emasculation with society.

SPEAKER_02 12:14

Stern said then, if they if they started putting strip clubs in the Middle East, there would be no terrorist group. They just arrested in the American movies, or just sort of loving relationships where I feel valued. But they have loving relationships in Pakistan, but it's usually with a young boy. So maybe if they if we switch those out, maybe it might help. I don't know too much about that.

SPEAKER_03 12:36

But yeah, I think that people, I think, yes, the manosphere, the whole phenomena of these angry man groups what the hell is a manosphere?

SPEAKER_01 12:42

I mean, is it one of the No, no, he's doing hang on. Just listen, okay? Because one of the things that one of the things about modern debate on politics or gender is there are these false aggregations. People talk about the the the world of homosexuality or um the assumption that because you share a particular a gender or a sexual proclivity, that you all think the same thing. I mean, there is no manosphere. Men are men are all different, right? Um, I think some men are feeling isolated. I want to come back to the question of women, because the reality is that whilst it's true, and you you started to hint at this, there are more women professors at universities than ever before, there are more women law partners. In fact, a small majority of firms in in North America now have more women law partners than men than men. Um, this is all very good.

SPEAKER_02 13:26

Then kids are not getting a good education at the university.

SPEAKER_01 13:29

The levels of mental health issues, you know, in women, particularly in the West, particularly in the United States of America or England and places like that, are at an all-time high. So, you know, this emancipation, because we're talking about emancipation, we're talking about letting women do the same things as men, which we all agree, I think, unless we're mad, is a good thing. It's not leading to happiness. Instead of skirting around, oh, making a living and being independent, what is it that makes a man and a woman happy? And the idea, and the answer is working together to do particular things in certain cases. And that happiness comes from, frankly, having a family in most cases. That's just a fundamental fact about human nature. And you know, I know some people are gay and some people like animals, but you know, at the end of the day, most people need that. So there are two things I fundamentally disagree with. First of all, it's a good thing that women are able to do more and have more choices. I'm the father of a daughter. I've always said to her, get a career, be able to earn a living, be able to be capable of having independence, because you shouldn't have to depend on a man. Okay, that's a really bad idea. I shouldn't have to depend on a person, be independent. But the second thing I've all said is the most rewarding thing that's ever happened in my life, by a million miles, has been to have children, okay? And that's just the reality. And many people will say this. I've gone to Oxford, I've been on the BBC, you know, degrees, money, all these kinds of things. None of that matters in the slightest when it comes to having a family. And I think many people understand that. The next thing that I disagree with is the fact that women actually lack a voice. It's simply not true that women lack a voice. They like too much of a voice. That's the problem. Just, you know, so so my forthcoming book, Sisters of Enhedwana. So the the first published author, human author in history whose name we know is a woman called Enheduana, um, who should be on everyone's lips but isn't. And she basically was a very senior person in the Empire of Akkad in uh Mesopotamia. And she was a very authoritative figure. She wrote poetry, she's a religious figure, she wrote about politics. She was extremely intelligent and she was extremely well known all over the Middle East for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years. So it's not clear to me how you can say so. So the premise of modern feminism, which is that women never had a voice, is wrong. Because the first, it can't be true at the same time that women never had a voice, and that the first known author in human history is a is a wonderful, clever woman. Those two things can't exist at the same time. Um, and you know, my my view is that, and I've I've argued this in 26 chapters, is that men and women have evolved in different ways. And if you look at women through literature, starting in ancient literature, women have a very clear voice and a very clear role. The where the ways that men and women differ is very simple. Men exist in a set in a state of drama. It's men who do the fighting, who do the uh setting up states, and also it's men who die. One of the things about ancient literature is mostly the men are dead at the end of it, and mostly the women are alive. Why is that?

SPEAKER_00 16:36

It's very clever.

SPEAKER_01 16:37

Because women well, because women have a very they have a high level of emotional intelligence, and they represent continuity in uh in the human world in in a very fundamental way. And if you look at figures like, and I'll shut up in a minute, if you look at figures like Penelope, the the wife of Odysseus, Ulysses, Andromache, and even Helen of Troy, Helen of Troy probably the best known woman in literature. What's the thing about what's the thing about the Iliad? At the end of the Iliad, Helen of Troy is still alive. She goes back to the ball.

SPEAKER_02 17:07

Yeah, she's a she's like she's like Ursula, she's a wrecking ball. Everybody else is just back to Sparta.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

No, my point she represents she survives by being extremely adroit in her negotiations. She's highly intelligent. She can't control affairs, but she can manage people, particularly men. So I I don't I just do not accept the fact that women have not been present in history. I think they have. I think they've been present in a different register from men, and I think we listen in the wrong register. You know, we tend to say, well, men, you know, men are the richest uh industrialists, you know, it's men who do this, it's men of the film stars, they earn more money. They are, but that that's only one way of measuring success. There are other much more fundamental contributions that you can make to human life that don't involve any of those things, and mostly it's women that are responsible for them, and always have been. Um and in part, too, because this is a trilogy, I'll be I'll be taking this theme and and exploring it through through middle-aged and and modern literature, medieval and modern literature, because I think it's it's clear that women have a voice, need to be heard, but listened to in a different register. So I'm not sorry.

SPEAKER_02 18:11

Yeah, but you see, you see what again, from a political academic standpoint, and we go back, I go back to this again and started in the 60s, and now what you see is the evolution of that, which is you know, overweight chicks, crazy left-wing chicks on antidepressants trying to run agents over with their cars, right? And then are worried when they they get the shit beat out of them by the police because they've, you know, they don't understand boundaries, limits to violence, right? Now, why would they do these things? Because the media and particularly academia has told them that women are all, you know, you can act out however you want to feel. We as men don't do that because we've had within our childhood limitations. Like you, you just didn't, you know, if you were bullied or you know, if you push somebody to the limit, that guy, however, scrawny is gonna punch you back. So women don't understand, you know, they want the the sort of trappings of the men's world, as long as you know there's sex in the city and they get to wear uh suits and and and play pretend, uh pretend exec C-suite executives. There's no doubt that there's the they don't want the downside of this.

SPEAKER_01 19:22

The academy has been has been horribly feminized, and there's lots of quite good literature on this, and there are some very good female academics who've written about this. What's happened is as the numbers of influential academics female in academics has grown and grown and grown, there's been a preponderance of females, and the behaviors and the and the dogma that now inhabits academia in in the US is overwhelmingly driven by feminists and it's destroyed the universities. Um, and it's frankly to do with feminization. Um, because there should be a balance.

SPEAKER_02 19:53

It's just and the feminization of the millennials, the the boys, the millennial boys as well, right? So what's the solution, Samia?

SPEAKER_00 20:02

Well, I've got a question. Women no longer need men economically.

SPEAKER_02 20:05

She's cut me off because she knows what I'm gonna say.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

What unique value do men bring to the table? And that's the biggest.

SPEAKER_01 20:13

It's not unique, it's complementary.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

You know, what value do men bring to?

SPEAKER_01 20:16

I I won't accept your premise. Um it's not competitive. It's complementary. That's a different thing. I can do things that you can.

SPEAKER_00 20:23

But how do men compliment women now? How do men compliment women?

SPEAKER_02 20:27

Well, they are in the workplace, for example, is you know, helping them stay in the lane, right?

SPEAKER_00 20:32

But romantically, how do men compliment women anymore?

SPEAKER_02 20:35

By being by leading, essentially, right? I mean, you can you can still be that hot shot executive, female executive that you want to be, but still be in, you know, have your your significant other, which is your boyfriend or husband or whatever. As a leader. Yeah, but they do. They do. Nobody wants it like a pussy as a as a as a boyfriend, right? No woman wants that, right? Unless you're unless you're thinking it's funny.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

I think if women are honest, I think feminine I think the terribly sad thing about modern feminism is that women have been sold a complete pup. They've been told things will make them happy when they won't. You know, concentrating on your career, treating men like, you know, useless dogs, is just going to make you miserable. Uh that's the reality. And as a result, we've got an awful lot of miserable women. And of course, on antidepressants. And of course, miserable men as well. And you're right, Jonathan. You know, men don't know what space they should inhabit because they're being there's this thing called toxic masculinity, which is invented by feminist professors, of course. You know, and it's a it's what it is, it's pernicious. It's a way of describing masculinity, which is a healthy thing, as being somehow, somehow negative, right? The same way that they demonize the expression boys will be boys.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

But the reality is toxic feminism is what is the real. Toxic masculinity is a made up bullshit thing like Christian nationalism, right? Made up by, again, by Our friends on the left, right, essentially.

SPEAKER_00 22:02

So why is the concept of long-term relationships and marriage becoming less popular for young men? Instead, we're seeing a rise of flings and ghosting and and I recognize this as a I don't think it's just a lack of respect and those kind of old-fashioned traditional relationships are going out the window. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02 22:20

No, because women are are essentially very hard to handle. And you know, most of the women, look, I'm the only guy that's actually active s from a single perspective. And well, except you, Jonathan, sorry. I forgot about that. We forgot about that. We need to see that. You are more of an eligible battery than I am. Very active. Most women are nut jobs, right? I mean, you know, you've been in the generalization. I just had an argument in Italy with this woman that was claiming she's like, well, I've got opinions. I said, but bitch, this is just facts. You call the bitch. You know? Yeah. I said, what the fuck's wrong with you? I said, your opinions mean dog shit, right? You have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. I have zero tolerance for people like that, particularly when it comes to like things like politics and you know, they they they just they've been fed this bullshit that your opinions are reality, right? Or your reality is our facts. And they don't know how to millennial women, right? Even even women in their 50s, it's like, dude, like seriously, you're my generation and you're you know delusional in terms of the reality of the world.

SPEAKER_01 23:24

So also we need to reprogram women. I mean, that's what I'm hearing.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

So what do men wish women knew and understood about them that might help?

SPEAKER_02 23:32

What what understand about men? Yes. I mean, dude, if you can't and women men are such simple creatures. I mean, you have to be you have to be incredibly stupid not to understand men, right?

SPEAKER_01 23:41

Let me be very clear. Men love women and men want to help women, and they get enormous elements of their self-esteem from the feeling that they have helped women, either in a family setting or in a one-on-one relationship setting. That's incredibly important for male self-esteem. To be told that you're not wanted and you're useless uh is really not good because that's a fundamental part of the male self-esteem. It's a combination of pernicious uh ideology linked with uh pharmaceutical developments, because the the advent of the birth control pill in the early 1960s has had a huge influence on uh society in the West, because it was felt that by letting people have as much sex as they wanted, which for those of you who can remember the 1960s was basically the way it was. Okay?

SPEAKER_00 24:30

We weren't there, were we? Well, Jonathan, you were there. No, and you were not 60s babies.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Okay. Well, I was born in the 60s. Well, I I was you know, coming into being in the 60s.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

Just to jump in real quick. So so what what he said uh regarding, you know, the the toxic masculinity, and then and then he just mentioned that men get you know a a sense of self-worth helping women. Yes. Whereas women now are being taught to be a bitch to men and and be difficult, and that's somehow a badge of honor. I don't think they have to be a chance. I had a former girlfriend that said, I need a man that is gonna handle me. I'm not going, you know, that that's really the wrong way to look at things because no one's gonna handle you for, you know, you're really pretty, but after a while it gets really uh, you know, it grinds on the guy's balls, right? They have to handle you, right? I gotta handle everything, then I gotta fucking come home and handle you, you know, and because you think it's really fun to like, you know, fuck this guy's life up so that you can feel great about yourself. But they're taught this, literally, you know, from an academic standpoint from an early age, that they can do no wrong, right? Uh somehow. Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_03 25:39

I can safely say we all have different views. Yeah. Kind of it's good to hear other people's views and may or may not agree with women.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Women are the main victims of bad. You can use this in you know, some of the things I'm saying in your classes, too.

SPEAKER_02 25:53

Go back to the original discussion. Or you might use it as, you know, stay away from a guy like this.

SPEAKER_01 25:59

Men are victims of modern feminism. I mean, we haven't talked about incels, you know, involuntary celebrate men, men. They're they're they're the saddest people. They're they're men who maybe lack uh confidence, who basically declared themselves celibate. They don't want anything to do with women because they're scared of the entire dating world. And it's common among feminists to ridicule and mock them. I think it's incredibly sad, and I agree with Jordan Peterson that we should be compassionate about men struggling to make their way because of the perception that men are toxic, uh and the perception that women don't need them, all stupid ideas, um, you know, originating in the academy in most cases. Um, and I think women do need men and men need women, and we're complimentary. And I always said that to my daughter. And she's she's been in the same relationship for 12 years. Well, you they do need men, and they're being told.

SPEAKER_00 26:53

Well, I don't know if you do need men, but when you want men, that's a nice position to be in.

SPEAKER_01 26:58

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00 26:59

So for the final quick round, what kind of relationship dynamic will succeed in the future? Jonathan.

SPEAKER_03 27:06

I really don't know. Um I think hopefully ones where we we've learned to be more content in and in ourselves and less dependent on others, but I don't think that's happening right now. I think people are leaning towards machines. There's people are uh relating much more to their AIs than they are to people, uh or not not necessarily proportionately more, but I think it's growing. And uh and I think once robots can provide sexually uh what a partner, a human partner can do or do do better, then I think there's going to be a level of obsolescence that's quite terrifying. Oh my goodness me, what a horrible thing.

SPEAKER_02 27:44

Yeah, that that that woman that needs to be handled is then is now made obsolete, right? Essentially, because the robot is is is is better, right? Yeah, she's not serious, yeah. She's compliant and go going back to that this point. I think you're gonna see a swing, you know, uh to more traditional roles. I could actually uh whatever's next to next generation after the millennials. So the millennials are gonna get crushed, and whichever generation after, you'll see more traditional gender roles because you know, a hundred years from now, you can get a much better looking, fitter, more compliant robot girlfriend uh than you know, I you know, I don't need no man no more title. Serious.

SPEAKER_00 28:31

Have you seen the latest?

SPEAKER_02 28:32

Dude, and and so look, I I I totally agree. And and that will force women to be, and then of course, you're going to have uh AI and robotics take over a lot of the work, right? So you're not gonna have that pressure on women uh in the workforce because they you know, because we're gonna have some type of universal income, most likely, which is what all of the tech billionaires are saying that eventually that's gonna happen, or part of your income is gonna be taken care of by uh by this upswing relative to the hand that money to have to because you're gonna be able to do that. Musk is saying that you know the US economy will grow by five by five X or ten X.

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Well we're out of time, I'm afraid.

SPEAKER_02 29:18

Soil and green.

SPEAKER_00 29:19

We could have kept going with this subject for hours. Well, thank you for joining us today on Ella Podcasts. Do men and women still need each other? The romantic and me would like to think so. While economic dependence and social expectations have diminished with the empowerment of women, love, passion, and companionship still exist. Today, many women have choice. So relationships must be built on mental and physical connection, mutual respect, and shared values. If you want to suggest a topic for our next episode, please join our Facebook group at Ella Podcasts and Message Us. Please subscribe, rate, and share this podcast. Sending you a big hug.