Patrick Willis & Fred Warner: Breaking the 49ers Tackle Record & Knowing When to Walk Away | EP 8

In this episode of Real Ones: The League, presented by Experian, you will see:

San Francisco 49ers Hall of Fame Linebacker Patrick Willis joins All-Pro Fred Warner for a legendary meeting of the minds. From the small-town roots in Tennessee to becoming the "Terminator" of the NFL, Patrick Willis opens up about the "Gladiator" mindset required to dominate the linebacker position. He reflects on the high-pressure pregame speeches of the Harbaugh era and the internal battle of knowing when to finally hang up the cleats at the age of 30. 

In this deep dive, Willis reveals the specific "Welcome to the NFL" moment during his first training camp where Mike Singletary pushed him to the brink . The two discuss the evolution of the game, the fear Willis instilled in opponents, and the legendary battles against "Beast Mode" Marshawn Lynch. Patrick also breaks down the terrifying hit from a Washington fullback in 2013 that left him questioning how much more his body could take. 

Finally, we address the 49ers franchise history books. Fred Warner reveals the heartbreak of being just five tackles away from breaking Patrick Willis’s all-time record before suffering a season-ending injury. 

Plus, Patrick shares his honest thoughts on the Mike Evans signing, Max Crosby’s rescinded trade to Baltimore, and why it took five years for him to finally get the Hall of Fame call. 

#RealOnes #FredWarner #49ers #HallOfFame #PatrickWillis

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00:00 — The "Lick" That Changed Everything: Patrick Willis’ Toughest Hit 01:23 — The Blueprint: Welcoming Patrick Willis 
03:50 — Gladiator Mentality: Turning Into a Different Beast on the Field 
07:13 — Harbaugh, Pregame Speeches, & Finding the Team’s Aura 
12:27 — Getting Cussed Out by Mike Singletary: Rookie Year Humility 
21:13 — Why I Retired at 30: Honesty, Injuries, & Protecting the Soul 
29:41 — Marshawn Lynch: The Toughest RBs to Tackle 
46:35 — Passing the Torch: Patrick Willis on Fred Warner’s Evolution 
53:35 — The Hall of Fame Wait: Why It Took 5 Years to Get the Call 
59:36 — Warner vs. Willis: The 49ers All-Time Tackle Record 
01:05:08 — Experian BFF Call: Willis Calls a Former Teammate 
01:12:14 — Mike Evans, Max Crosby, & The Future of the 49ers Defense

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Transcript

The Hit That Stuck

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Who who gave you that lick, man? We was playing against the Redskins. I don't know what I don't know what fullback it was. I wouldn't know yet. Yeah, but man, he caught a pass in the flat, Fred, and it was at the point to where when I was younger, anytime you get inside them them lines, I'm in my mind, I'm thinking, I'm finna I'm trying to delete you like off the line more than when you were never out here on the field. He stuck his foot at the last second and came back in on me. And man, when I tell you the first thing I felt hit was my back of my neck. And I just remember I got up and I felt this excruciating pain in my ribs or what in the back side of my ribs back here. I just remember I got up. I went back to the huddle. Both said, both said, Pat, what's wrong with you?

SPEAKER_00 0:41

I said, Yeah, he gave everything you needed.

SPEAKER_01 0:51

Welcome back to Real Ones The League, brought to you by Experian. I am your host, Fred Warner. We are back with a big one today. I'm joined by one of the all-time greatest linebackers in NFL history. He's been a mentor and a role model for my game ever since I came into the league. If you're rocking with the show, do me a favor, like, comment, subscribe on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. Let's get into it. Welcome back to Real Ones The League brought to you by Experian. I'm your host, Fred Warner. Today we're talking to the blueprint, everyone. Before I ever even took a snap for the San Francisco 49ers organization, this man set a standard that changed the game forever. Seven-time Pro Bowls in his first seven seasons, a level of speed and physicality that redefined the linebacker position. He's the original Terminator, the legendary number 52, my big brother, man, Patrick Willis. Welcome to the show, dog. I appreciate you coming on, man. It's an honor for me. Man, I appreciate you for having me, man. It's an honor to be on. Yes, sir. Hey, we'll just get straight into it. You know, I I told you over text before we even started doing this. I said, man, they sent me this little rundown. They got a trillion questions that I can sit here, I can run through. But man, I'm just, of course, I'm, even though we've we've developed this relationship for everybody that's that's watching, of course, you you are now a part of the organization. You're around the building. Uh, and just for me to say, man, to have you in my corner and have a relationship with somebody that obviously I admired through, you know, high school watching you and everything, it's it's still surreal, man. When I still I see you around a building, I'm asking you questions about certain things. And so I almost got to pinch myself sometimes. Man, I what you're talking to Patrick Willis, dog. Crazy. Um, so yeah, man, you of course I have questions myself, even though we've we've talked a lot. I still, you know, I'm always one wondering and trying to pick your brain about certain things. Um, one being just like and we'll we'll just get straight into it. Like when you were playing the game, there's a certain style that the the game requires, I think, for any position, right? But especially for the linebacker position. And I think that you you encaptured that so well with the way that you were kind of able to turn into a whole different being. Because like knowing you off the field, you're real chill, soft spoken, you know what I'm saying? You went to you went to Mississippi from where are you from originally? You from uh from Tennessee, uh Tennessee, Tennessee, Bruce and little small town. Man, small town, Tennessee, soft spoken, but then you get on that field and you're ready to tear somebody's head off. And so, like, take me through when you were in that locker room, and did you play a candlestick or yeah, you played a candlestick? Yeah, candlestick, right? When you were in that candlestick locker room, like what are you doing to prepare yourself, prepare your mind for what you're about to get into when you go to war on the field?

Building The Gladiator Switch

SPEAKER_04 3:50

Man, well, man, let me take you back a little bit. So I grew up, I was a I was born in 85, and being born in 85, I remembered, you know, the early 90s. There was a I remember seeing a lot of um gladiator movies um on TV a lot, you know, a lot of action movies, and I don't know what it was about seeing those gladiator movies or seeing those action movies or just seeing like, you know, seeing the guys uh go at it, but I just thought it was super cool at the way the gladiators competed. And I just remember saying to myself, like, man, one day, like I would love to do that. I think if I was back there in those times, like I could have done that. And so, you know, you fast forward now and you start playing football, and the football field kind of gives that same kind of gladiator feel to where you are out there and you are pretty much entertaining. And I know everybody knows that line from you know, gladiators, are you not entertained? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. And so um, so for me, it was, you know, on game day, it was really it was it was quiet before the storm, meaning that, you know, I was more of a let me be reserved, um, you know, let my actions speak louder than my words. And also, man, I just always felt like on game day, I don't know how those guys had all that extra rah-rah energy before they went on the field because I felt like, man, I tried that one time because I thought that's the way you were supposed to, you were supposed to do it. You know, I thought you were supposed to be all rah-rah and and how, you know, from the time you go into the locker room to the time you get on the field to for the whole game. And I remember by the time the game started, I mean, I was tired. I was like, Boy, come on. So yeah, so long story short, man, my mind, my mentality really was just that gladiated mindset was, you know, when it's time to go, it's time to go, when it's time to lock in, it's time to lock in. And I remember after we would run out, and after they would do the national anthem, I would look at the entrance where we come in, and I would imagine I would say only one team can leave this field victorious, and it will be us today. And if it's not us, I'm I'm gonna die here trying. And so, you know, yeah, it was it was here with us today, man.

Pregame Speeches Without Burning Out

SPEAKER_01 6:22

Yeah, dang, man. Yeah, that's I I love that you brought up the gladiator movie because I don't even think I saw that movie until I was in the NFL, and it it just resonates with me now because that's that's truly my feeling of being out there. And it is it is entertaining, it is a performance that you have to go out there and you gotta show to give the fans what they want, give the people what they want, right? It ain't about just going out there and making plays. Like, I want to make sure I'm making plays, I'm talking about it, I'm fired up, I'm I'm putting, I'm putting it all together, right? Because I feel like that's that's gonna feed the entire stadium, that's gonna feed our sideline, our team to ultimately do what we want to do, which is win the game, right? Uh you mentioned that you didn't like getting raw, like the raw raw fired up before in the in the pregame stuff. So does that mean that you didn't do like the the pregame speech? Because I've seen clips of you doing that, you know what I'm saying? Like Together we fall, or something we fall, together we ride. You know what I'm saying? Like so was you doing that or was it?

SPEAKER_04 7:20

You know, that that that kind of just took off. You know, that was more of a 2011 thing when you know the whole Harbaugh came in. Because prior to that, you know, I might, every now and then I might say something or whatnot, but other times you would have other guys that would get up and they would speak and they would say something. And so I thought this year, 2011 year, you know, we new coaches um we're coming off the lockout. And I thought, you know, maybe you know, me doing it that first game was more like a you know, Patrick, you know, he's one of our captains, and you know, we're gonna let him do it first, and then you know, Frank could go, and then Vernon, and then Justin. And before you know it, I realized like, man, this is game two. You know, I'm I'm doing it again. It's game three, I'm doing it again. I'm like, I would look around, be like, hey, nobody else wanna say anything. Nobody else.

SPEAKER_01 8:06

Right, right, right. Yeah, you gotta spread the wheel. That's what I'm learning, man. You gotta kind of spread the world. Because if you go in and doing it every week, yeah, the message gets it gets stale. It gets stale, bro. You know what I'm saying? You gotta you gotta kind of let everybody else get their little two-piece in. But like you just said, though, when you were talking, is that uh most people don't want to do that because it does expend a lot of energy, and then you gotta be intentional about before even getting out there of like, man, what am I gonna say? What am I gonna say to the team? I gotta make sure I say something good to make sure everybody fired up, ready to go. So it's a lot of pressure. You put a lot of stress on yourself before the game starts.

SPEAKER_04 8:42

Brother, let me tell you that's I literally would be there, would be times when I would be on the way to the game, whether it's a home game or away game. I would even the night before, I would try to write down, I would say, you know what, let me write this down. This this is gonna sound the best. This is gonna be, you know, it'd be exactly what I need to say, and I would not lie to you, man. I would get to the game, and everything that I would write. Gone. I would, yeah, I mean, I would have so many different pieces of paper from the night before that I would throw it all away, and then I would get to the game, and I would have exactly what I think I'm gonna say, and then man, I would look at it before I get ready to go out for um before the pregame and get out there, and everything goes black. That's exactly right. And the only thing, and the only thing that really where it would come from is it, you know, that energy that you feel before the game. I mean, that energy that you feel in pregame when you're out there on the field and everybody, it looks like everybody just going through the motions, but for me, I'm actually Intentionally, I'm actually taking in all the energy. I'm feeling like what the guys feel like. I'm seeing like how certain guys that you know how they're you know how the or is you know how they usually communicate. You're seeing how like how the how's the communication today and most definitely. And you and usually what would happen is right before like, you know, after we do that last little, you know, field goal, that little special team thing, right before we go ready to bring it up, I remember I would look around and I was my heart, my chest beating. I'm like, all right, man, this is what I was gonna say. But then really it would be when I would look at the guys when I when you walk into that huddle or when you walk into the middle, when they calling it up, and you start looking at the guys in the eyes, and you start feeling that energy, and next thing you know, it just man, something just kind of comes, it comes, I say over you, but it comes, it comes out of you, and you like, man, this is this everything that I'm feeling is I'm I'm I'm gonna convey it. You know, it's like I'm I'm I'm gonna put it out there on the on the on the guys. Like it's just uh it's just the aura field and it's just time to go. But yeah, I remember being so nervous at the time trying to think about what I was gonna say to the man, just let it come.

SPEAKER_01 10:44

It'd be stressful. Stressful. It's funny because I I was uh I saw I saw a mic up video the other day of myself, and it was when I was in my second season, and it was the very first time that I had ever did the huddle, and everybody was so locked into what I was saying, because it was the first time of me saying anything. And so it's just it just should it just showed me how it could, you know, if if a guy doesn't who doesn't do it that often gets in there and says something that it's a and as long as it's a guy that the team obviously respects, like because of your performance on the field, the way that you go about your business, you know what I'm saying? So it I'm I'm eager to see who we can kind of pull in that huddle this year to try and get get the guys riled up because it is part of the game. You gotta you gotta do it, right? To to kind of rally the troops, but you know your boy will have a message every now and again make sure you get the boys right.

SPEAKER_04 11:33

Do you think it's um it's one of those things is that's like you say it's earned through by how you carry yourself, like you know, it's yeah, by how you you execute, like be it like where you earned it in practice and you frame and you get ready to get that first start, or you've been starting and you've been balling out and you know you get you get that call up there and whatnot, but I'm like you, it has to be that kind of like feel and not just you know, I don't know, yeah, I'm with you. Yeah, no, for sure.

Rookie Humbling And Confidence Growth

SPEAKER_01 12:01

It's gotta come from a guy who the team respects and because that's ultimately what it is. You're getting the team ready to go, you're getting the team my the team's mind right to then go out and perform. So, and usually, you know, uh some guys are are more have a natural uh knack for getting in in front of everybody and speaking and trying to motivate, right? And some guys it may not come as natural. So, you know, it's just one of those things. So we'll we'll figure that out when the time comes. But uh reversing back to when you when you first entered the league, you were a defensive rookie of the year, you know, you're uh the 11th overall pick in the draft, you have all these expectations, and you have all you have you have the ultimate uh performance to start your to start your career, right? Of being the defensive rookie of the year. And you know, my question is one, is there a moment during your rookie season where it was like you're welcome to the welcome to the NFL moment, right? Where somebody may have knocked you on your butt like a fullback of somebody. I know you you probably got some juicy, you know, some type of juicy story there. And then two how confident were you in your rookie season as the as I mean, I've I've heard the stories about how you know you didn't know if your linebacker coach and the and the staff wanted you there, and it was it was a rough, you know, probably first start when you entered the rookie mini camp, but then ultimately you went on to have a great year. Like, how was that? How was your confidence level throughout that first season?

SPEAKER_04 13:22

My welcome to the league moment was actually was my first practice. It was actually my it wasn't the rookie mini camp. Um, it was training camp. First training camp practice. I remember yeah, training camp, first practice, and I just remember, you know, having Coach Singletary as my linebacker coach and what individual practice felt like. I mean, it just felt brutal, man. Like we was in like we was in boot camp, and then you know, I felt like I couldn't get anything right, you know, with him, and then you go over to team drill, and I never forget they ran like a toss TG and RP Larry Allen pools, and I tried to use the same technique that I used in in college on those big guys, and I tried to do the same thing to him, and weak. And and I'll let you know I feel like I was in the matrix, and all I could hear was my linebacker coach like just you know going off on me, and everything in my head was just like, man, I've been getting cussed out all practice long. I've been nothing's been going right. I mean, man, they're gonna think I'm a bust. You know, I'm starting getting it all in my head. I'm like, I did that's the last thing, you know, you want to be is that. And so yeah, I just remember, you know, going in and having a night meeting, and the night meeting was, man, it was one of the longest, one of the longest meetings uh ever, but it was it was the it was something that really changed my trajectory um going forward because you know I remember that night understanding just how serious this position was, how serious this opportunity to be in the NFL was, and how man, I had to take I had to make it count because one, I didn't want to be a buzz, two, I wasn't trying to go back home yet. Nah, no way.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

So that ain't even an option.

SPEAKER_04 15:15

So yeah, so that first that first first practice was very, very humbling, and then um I would say, you know, after after that, you know, I just remember coming back the next day and just, you know, man, just giving everything I have and and telling myself I was like, God, I just um just man, just bless me to have the energy that it takes to get up each day and go out and and give it my best. And when it's all said and done, you know, I can look back and and be one of the best type of players game. And the reason why I say one of the best, not the best, but one of the best, was because I realize this psychologically, Fred, that if you're not careful, man, you'll get caught in the the wash of trying to be better than other people's statistics or what other people say that you don't have that other people had, and this and that. And at the end of the day, man, it's all about just being the very best player that you could have been, that you could be. And maybe some other people do things better, and that's cool, but it's like, man, at the end of the day, when you look at yourself in the mirror, do you ask yourself, did I maximize who Fred was? Did I maximize who Patrick was? And that's how that's that was my mentality and going about it. You know, I said, when it's all said and done, I don't want to look back over my career and feel as if like I let myself down or feel as if like I was not good enough because I didn't have statistical records, like, I mean statistical stats like like others. You know, I wanted to be able to look myself in the mirror and say each day I gave it all that I had until the last the last battle, you know. Um and so yeah, that's how I pretty much like approached it. And so I would say it wasn't, man, it was probably going into my second second season, maybe even third season, man, before I really, before the game really began to slow down. It was I remember going, I remember going in my second season. So they say as a as a as a rookie, you gotta play what your whole season plus three games into the next season before they before you officially not a rookie no more. Not a rookie anymore. And I remember, man, going into that second season and asking myself, man, how did I get through that first season? Like, what the heck was going on out here, man? Like everything was moving so fast to where you began to realize like how much, well, for me, how much I didn't know or understand yet of the game, and how much like much harder and farther I had to to work and to get better. And so, yeah, man, it was from day one from that first um training camp practice um to having that um that go the way that it did to really just you know fighting the whole season because my rookie year, we didn't it wasn't, we didn't, we didn't, I think we went 500 or it was below 500. So we would just man, we was at I was out there on that field a whole whole life. Yeah. Um so yeah, so really it was just about keeping keeping locked in, man, and know that like I'm I'm here and I ain't trying to go home.

SPEAKER_01 18:21

Yeah, no, I mean it sounded like you had a great perspective even early on uh and you obviously you have great perspective now. I think things that you go through in your life, things that you go through throughout your career create even greater perspective, right? And the thing that that I caught on I caught there was wanting to lead the game as one of the best to ever do it, not just the best, right? And I mean that's real, right? I mean, every ha everybody has the the dream and the mindset of man, I want to be the best to ever do it, right? And when I think of the best to ever do it, you know, you gotta have the consistency over a long period of time. You gotta have the Super Bowl rings, you gotta have the Super Bowl MVPs, and Ray Lewis is the only cat who played our position that has really achieved that, right? To play as long as he did and achieve the things that he did. You know, and that's that's a tall that's a tall list to try to to try to catch a a cat like that, right? And uh, you know, it it just you don't like you but like you said, it's about how did I ma how did I maximize Fred Warner's career? Like how did I get the most out of what God given abilities God gave me, right? It ain't about me trying to chase another individual because God blessed him with certain abilities and certain situations that he was able to thrive through, right? And and and my my hat, my hat's off, and it's much respect to him for achieving the things that he did. Right. But you know, I think about the situation I'm in right now where I'm coming off of a, you know, uh my first big injury of my career and and have the the platform and the opportunity to to really do something special, you know, bouncing back from something like that and showing people like, oh damn, I didn't realize you could you could snap like that coming off of an injury like that. You know what I'm saying? Like I feel like that that in itself is so such a uh a career defining moment in your in you know to be able to do something like that, not just being the league defensive player of the year, not just winning Super Bowl, but you know, all these little things also that that make a lot of difference when it comes to your legacy that you leave as a player, and obviously you had a ton of those type of career-defining moments that altered the way the game was played because of the fear that you instilled in c in cats when you was coming across the middle and you the way you dumping them, you know what I'm saying, and picking the ball off in the air, returning it for touchdowns, all all the different type of things that our position requires. You did that at the highest level, right? You were a seven-time defensive player, or not defensive player, seven-time pro bowler. Was that seven times in a row?

SPEAKER_04 20:44

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

From your rookie season till year seven?

SPEAKER_04 20:48

Yes. Okay, yeah, I didn't I didn't make it my last year.

SPEAKER_01 20:51

Yeah, last year you didn't make it. So was that okay, so that's that's interesting. Was that something, you know, when you were when you were making that decision of hanging it up on that last season, you're like, man, I don't want to go out this way. Like, I didn't get I didn't get a pro ball after I I made it seven years straight. Was it something where you were like, I don't I don't want to leave like this, I want to I want to make sure I return and make a pro bowl and then I can hang it up. Was that something that went through your mind?

Knowing When To Walk Away

SPEAKER_04 21:13

Yeah, yeah. So Fred man, that's a great question. I and all those things went through my mind from a personal perspective or you know, when I was thinking about man, is it it wasn't so much about me thinking, is it time? It was more so of me understanding that it was that it was time. And what I mean by that is man, everybody's purpose is different in playing this game. And you know, for some, you know, it's to reach the the pinnacle of you know, the the the best to ever do it, you know, to claim that throne. And man, and for me It was part of it, but it was more so it was more so of of something that I had set out to do when I was young to take care, to have a better life for myself, for my family, and to someday to be able to just be able to like you know enjoy it in a way that like I felt like I was never able to do when I was a youngster. And I remember when my body and I remember telling myself my rookie year, I was like, God, how do I know when it's time to step away from the game? Because I didn't want to be selfish and play to the point where I saw some of my favorite players play and they were not the same players that they once were. And I understand we all get a little bit older, but when I saw some of these guys play, it was like, man, like you get knocked around, like you, you getting you getting punched. It's like like a it's like you, it's like you like a old, you're like an old person, like you know, playing. It's like you should be home. And so I just remember telling myself I didn't want to get to that point. With that being said, I remember having a a real honest conversation with myself as a as a as a rookie. I said, God, how do I know when it's time to step away from this game? I remember I asked three or four other guys, older guys, I asked them when they know, like, how do you know when it's time to retire? And they all gave me their answer, right? And I was like, shit, man, they didn't, they didn't tell me what I was, and they didn't give me the answer I was looking for. So I remember asking myself, why, why do I play the game? And I was like, man, I play the game to be one of the best ever played. I play this game um because I I love it. I have a passion for it. I play this game because man, it's always been it's always been fun. Like it's uh it was just ever since I've known it's just it was like my playground. And and I was like, well, I guess when I no longer can give it what I have, um, give these, give myself, give the fans, give my teammates, this organization everything I have, then it'd be time to step away from the game and let the next person, you know, take care of himself and his family in the way that I've been able to be blessed to do it. With that being said, man, we always say the NFL's, you know, quote unquote stand, some of it's, you know, I've heard it said not for long. Or there's no guarantees of how many years you're gonna play, and then you hope that you can be fortunate and play, you know, uh quadruple years and be able to be in a place where you can keep on dictating like your years, but then we know there's some who might get one year or two and that's it, or major things happen. So me, I always kind of felt like, man, I don't know how I I don't know. I kind of felt like my journey in the league was not to play for a long time, but it was to get in and be as effective as I as I could be, meaning that in life we don't know how many days we have or how many years we have. All we do know that we have is the day. And so we talk about maximizing each day that we have to live because we don't know what tomorrow may bring. And that's what you saw every time you saw me line up for those eight years because I didn't, I didn't know what, you know, I didn't know what the next year had to bring. Um, I didn't know if I had, you know, I was praying to that, Lord, maybe I can get 10 years. Like if I can get 10 years, I think I could have, I think I can get in enough work to, you know, solidify myself to be one of those, to be one of the best to play this game. But it came at eight, and I just remember, man, having that conversation to myself when I just each day it started getting a little bit tougher, and I would look in the mirror and brush my teeth, or when I would try to walk to the bathroom, or I would feel my hands start to catch and different things. I remember being a rookie and seeing these old heads come back and talk to us, and the hands were like this, and I remember saying, like, man, I don't, I'm like, man, I don't want to look like that. When I finished, yeah, I was starting to feel my body go that way because again, I had some I had a bunch of injuries. I'm like, you know, we knock on wood, Fred. Man, you've been blessed, and I pray to good Lord, like this is you come back from this thing, you're gonna be good, man, and roll out the rest of your career. But I was I had I had quite a I had quite a bit of injuries, man, where I was having surgeries in the off season to where people understand it takes a lot to get back to where you were, and then not just to get back to where you were, but you got to get better too, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:19

So most definitely that's a lot of energy.

SPEAKER_04 26:21

So I had like eight surgeries. So you think about each time, each one of those surgeries, you're trying to get back from the broken bones, from the joint sprains, from all those things, and that's taking a whole lot of, you know, I call like force, a whole lot of like, you know, like like power. So let me wrap it up by saying, I just remember saying, I don't know how long I have to play this game, but however long I do have to play it, I'm gonna give it everything I have. And so when that time came and I remember looking in the mirror, and I remember, man, the hardest thing sometimes to do is be honest with yourself. And I remember I I remember the conversations, hey, you remember it? Like that little the little little person was in your ear back here or inside of it, he's like, Hey, you remember that conversation we had your freshman year when you said like you would know when it's time to step away? Right. And so my feet went out and whatnot, and then the doctor told me, he said, Hey, by the way, I don't know um how long your your other one have, but he said eventually you're gonna have to come back in and get surgery on that one too. I'm like, before I'm done, and he was like, it just depends on how long you can hold up. And I always complain about my toes and stuff. I just didn't realize I knew it was bad, but I didn't realize like just how bad they were getting, but I just I could feel it, you know. And so yeah, so when that time came for it, that's it was one of those things where I was like, I kept this.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

I'm not trying to chase any more pro bowls. Like I done did that, it ain't it ain't about that no more. Yeah, I mean I'd put I done put it in, it's it's time.

SPEAKER_04 27:49

Bro, what I kept hearing from me to you, God honest truth, what I kept hearing was that Bob Marley, uh, what is it to gain? I I want to say it was something he had said, but it was what is it to gain the world below? So um, and I know it's a little a little much, but it felt like it felt like each time that I was kept going kept getting up and kept putting on those cliques and setting in that meeting and and the way I was feeling internally, it was like it's because you know it's time away. But I was like, no, God, not not yet. Like I wouldn't do it on my time. I no, no, that's why, like, you know, it's almost like it again, it's these are these are tough conversations. These are kind of probably like, what you talking about? You talking to yourself like that. I'm like, man, these are personal, introspective, personal conversations that you have to be able to go to these places in order to achieve certain things in life that it just how do you do it? That's how they can how I'm like I wish I could like just put it. If I just put it on you, it might be too much for you. It might explode if I just put everything there, like I wish I could let you know like how it what it takes. But um, but yeah, so I did think about those things, but the greater the greater understanding um weighed weighed more than me, you know, continuing to chase because I did. I has had a homie, he knows he said, man, why don't you just stick around, man, and go to training camp, buddy? And man, and you still get your money, man. What you doing, man?

SPEAKER_01 29:20

That training camp, the worst part. Yeah, I said, man, you gotta get through training camp to get to the good, the good part playing the games.

SPEAKER_04 29:26

I can't do it, man. I can't do it to myself, I can't do it to the organization. Like, let them go find whomever, you know, however they're gonna do it. But you know, they gotta they got a hell of a guy who's here right now in Navarro who's gonna take these guys like on to the wherever they are to go. So right.

What He Misses About Sundays

SPEAKER_01 29:42

Yeah. So what's the thing? What what what's the thing you miss the most from the game? Is it people talk about you know being a part of the locker room, the the bus rides, the plane rides? Is it watching the games on Sunday, wishing, man, I wish I could just suit it up one more time, man, and just feel that feeling of being the man in the arena, the gladiator, you know what I'm saying, and and getting the fans just you know, cheer for me and this, that, or the third. Like, was it the licks that you was able to put on cats? Like, what do you what do you miss the most?

SPEAKER_04 30:10

Man, truthfully, it it wouldn't even so much about the hidden. I remember when I started getting to the point about, I remember like when I started getting to the point where I would hit right in that last year or two, and I would be like, God dang, like how much, how much, how much harder can I hit someone? You know, how much or how many different ways can I hit someone? Like, after a while, it's like you were starting to feel it yourself. Yeah, and it's just not as it I ain't gonna say it wasn't as fun. It was it was cool, but it just wasn't, it was like after you hit so many grand slams and home runs after a while, you just like, and then on top of that, I started feeling bad for the for the opponent because I can feel myself crushing their ribs, and I'm like, I'm like, man, why am I worried about like you know, damaging him? Like, you know, I'm like, he gotta go home, he gotta my mind started going into other places or whatnot, and that's when I knew I said, yeah, it's on the before before you keep going.

SPEAKER_01 30:59

I want to pause you for a second, because this is something that I've realized as as I'm deeper in the game now, is it's funny how your mindset kind of starts to shift a little bit as you get older because you start to make these connections and relationships with cats around the league, because you you done played everybody a bunch of times, you didn't seen cats at the Pro Bowl and around the Super Bowl festivities. So you kind of build these relationships, so it make it a little a little different when you're out there on the field of like if you really if you really smoking a cat, you know, are they gonna feel certain sort sort of type of way? It's just funny, like how that how that evolution is, versus when you don't know anybody and you're trying to make a name for yourself, you're trying to just get a lick on anybody that you can, not not caring about what anybody thinks of it. But never, I didn't mean to interrupt you. That's just is in my mind. It's crazy the evolution. So I didn't know if that's if that's something that you that you were thinking about.

SPEAKER_04 31:48

No, no, that that's real. And the reason why that's and that's funny you you say that because if you ask Marshawn, Marshawn was like, you know, there's certain guys on other teams that they want to talk to you during the game, they want to be your buddy during the game.

SPEAKER_01 31:59

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_04 31:59

And you're like, wait a minute, man, I don't want to I don't want to talk to you during the game, but I'm gonna go to the house.

SPEAKER_01 32:05

That's right. I don't want to talk about it. Yeah, they know what they're doing, they're trying to soften you up. They're trying to soften you up. Because nowadays it ain't about no, it ain't about the trash talk. Most guys ain't trash talking me. It's like they're trying to soften you up to try and be like, hey Fred, how you doing, man? Yeah, yeah. So you're trying to soften you. Yeah, nah, we're not going for that. We'll we'll chat up after the game.

SPEAKER_04 32:26

Yeah, no, I I honestly I don't know. I I don't know if it was just getting to man, age 30 or getting around that that age now to where it was like you're understanding the the the the virility of of the of the hit where when you're young and you just young boys now you can get out there and you just knock each other over where people like, oh man, like other people asking, like, man, you see what y'all doing to each other, but to you it just so fun and giggles, like most definitely. But then I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's because I my my body started getting a little older where I was like, you know, I'm not gonna take that that hit, which kind of reminds me of you asking me, bro.

SPEAKER_03 33:05

Which kind of reminds me of when you asked me about that welcome to the NFL moment.

SPEAKER_04 33:11

Oh yeah. This wasn't a welcome to the NFL moment. This was a yeah, I think, man.

SPEAKER_01 33:19

I think I'm there there was one, there's one that's coming to your mind right now.

SPEAKER_03 33:22

You starting to Yeah, I was like, yeah, I think this is one of those. This this is one of the ones where I was like, yeah, I think I might be getting close to the end. Like, I don't know if I can take any more hits. I don't know if I can take another one like this.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

Who was it? Who gave you that lick, man?

SPEAKER_04 33:37

It was uh, god dang, it was a fullback from um we was it was 2013 season. We was playing against the Redskins. I don't know what, I don't know what fullback it was. I wouldn't know either. Yeah, but man, he caught a pass in the flat, Fred, and it was at the point where when I was younger, anytime you inside them them lines, I'm in my mind, I'm thinking I'm finna, I'm trying to delete you like off the line, or not when you were never out here on the field. Yes. Run that that last year, last them last couple years, I started getting to the point where I started sizing up everything, where I started measuring up, like, man, do I really need to take that hit? Or I can just push them on out of bounds. Well, this particular player here, this fullback caught it, and man, he was like he was running towards the out of bounds. And so I'm like, you know what? I'm just gonna just kind of nudge him out of bounds. Sure. He stuck his foot at the last second and came back in on me. And man, when I tell you, the first thing I felt hit was my back of my neck. And I just remember I got up and I felt this excruciating pain in my ribs or what in the back side of my ribs back here. I just remember I got up, I went back to the huddle, both said, both said, Pat, what's wrong with you?

SPEAKER_00 34:49

I said, Yeah, he gave you everything you needed. Yeah, I'm gonna kill him like that.

SPEAKER_04 34:54

And so the whole the whole first half, man, I was looking for him the whole, literally, the whole first half. I don't even I try not I try to not ever get out of my game like this where I just started, I just lock in on somebody, but that was one of the ones where I was like, I'm gonna get you.

Experian Ad Break

The Toughest Backs To Tackle

SPEAKER_01 35:12

That's the worst. Yeah, bro. That's the worst. When somebody gets you and you that's the only thing you think about now, you want to just go, just whatever they're calling, whatever player you're calling, whatever your assignment is, you want to just go ahead and vacate your assignment just to go after somebody, knowing that it ain't that ain't what's best for the defense, that ain't what's best for the team. But man, my ego, my ego bruised. I gotta go, I gotta go settle it. I gotta go settle the score. Let's talk about the real MVP off the field. Experian, your big financial friend, the kind of BFF you want in your lineup. Let's be real. Your other BFFs might talk you into impulse buys or questionable fantasy league bets. Experian, they're here to keep you in check. Experian could help you save time and money with all the financial tools you need at your fingertips, right in the app. With the Experian app, you're always in the know. It lets you check your FICO score, matches you with personalized credit card offers based on your credit profile, and is always looking for ways to help you save. Bet your other BFFs can't do that, can they? I'm telling you, Experian should be your go-to app for taking control of your finances with this big financial friend. You're always in good hands. Get started by downloading the free Experian app today. Speaking of speaking of fullbacks and running backs, who who was the running back that gave you the most issues when you were playing? I'm sure not a lot of running backs gave you issues, but you play with in a in a in an era where you're talking about you talked about beast mode. Even in in your division, Steven Jackson with the with the Rams. Uh uh Was Sean Alexander playing when you played?

SPEAKER_04 36:48

I played against him one year in Seattle, but that was I think towards his last his.

SPEAKER_01 36:52

Okay, so he was he was he was toward toward the end there when he was playing. Um but uh let's see who else you got Rams. Cardinals didn't really have any, or did Cardinals have anybody that you that you remember? Not really.

SPEAKER_04 37:07

Yeah, not not not really like that. That was like Danian Tomlinson? Uh no, I didn't play. He was uh uh AFC um Yeah, so you didn't never you never played him in the whole TV. Yeah, no, I didn't play no. I always thought maybe we would play in uh preseason, but he never played in the last he never played those preseason games or not. And then as I got older, I stopped playing those um those last that last preseason game.

SPEAKER_01 37:31

But so is there is there a running back that comes to mind when you when you were playing?

SPEAKER_04 37:35

Yeah, you just said, I mean, you said two of them that I mean they jumped right off right away. And that's you know, Steven Jackson when I first got in. I remember seeing him when I was in college and whatnot, you know, seeing him from afar and be like, man, that's a big ass dude. Screw on. I'm like, that's a big, that's a big dude. And then all of a sudden I get drafted in San Fran, and he's you know the running back for the for the Rams, and I never forget he had he was already a big dude. He wasn't very shifty, but he had that he had a one-two, and then he had a stiff form. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's already he already had that, he had a long arm too. Big and yeah, and big, and so it was almost like one of those things where man, if you didn't get out, if you didn't, if you wasn't able to get there and either knock knock the stiff arm down or get to him before he got the stiff arm. Right, right. He's gonna be on the he was gonna be on the highlights and then. Yeah, and you have like then you have Marshawn and and Marshawn when we first got drafted, was crazy what he thought he was gonna come to San Fran. I thought I was gonna end up in Buffalo. So we laugh about this to this day, but we both trained out at API. And I remember training against most of these guys that I ended up playing against in the league. And I remember standing to myself, like, man, I gotta, I gotta get right because these guys were here are like the Avengers, and one day we're gonna meet. And they can only be one. You know, I'm like, they can only be one. There can only be one. I say that to say, so I seen I seen Marshawn those first few years over in Buffalo, you know, doing his thing, and I'm like, um, I'm like, yeah, you know, he just he doing him, but all of a sudden free agency comes. And I don't know about you, but you know, during this time, I never really paid a whole lot of attention, but I never, you know, I just try, I just focus in on what I need to focus in on, on our team, who we have. That was always my mind. So I wasn't really worried about like who we need to go find, who we need to go get. I let upstairs do that. But I did hear that I got how they got like got word. It's like yeah, Marshawn Lynch is a free agent, you know, and he thinks about coming to the AFC West. And I never forget my ears kind of perked up a little bit. I'm like, huh?

SPEAKER_03 39:31

I'm like, what? Not not him, dude. Yeah, I'm like, not him and Steven Jackson both. Like, you know, I'm like, no, man.

SPEAKER_04 39:39

Then next thing he gets over here, and lo and behold, he turns into not turn. He just becomes that much more of whom he whom he was, beast mode. He had this low center of gravity where Steven Jackson is more tall. Marshawn had this like this wide, like bull-legged type of center of gravity where you just man, you gotta it take it take a few guys to get there and to get him down. If not, like he's gonna shrub, he's gonna shrug you off if you ain't you don't lock him up. And I remember I remember it was uh we was playing against them, and you know how it is in quarters, right? How they get everybody, they get everybody to drop back real deep, and then they take that running back and swing him out in the flat, and everybody way, way back. Yeah, that's a big boy tackle. You get to that flat. Man, here I am playing in the middle, right? I got a three-drop. And I try to get some depth back to help with that dig, you know, right back in the middle window back here. Yep, yep. They toss it over there to him, and they I say to myself, and I my eyes are on him, right? So as I'm getting back there, the whole time I'm seeing that too, and I'm like, man, he's gonna toss it. So I immediately start V-lining, but a lot of people don't realize to this day. I actually had broke my broke my uh fourth murder carpal earlier that game, and I was still playing, and so I could feel my body shutting off. Yep, I could feel my body shutting off like this. And I remember, Fred, when I tell you like this is a this is one of a few times, but I saw him, right? I came out, I mean, when I tell you, I I I locked in like a heat-seeking missile and I shot out and I like, man, I know I won't be able to wrap him up because my hand is broke. So I'm gonna hit him with everything I have, like, and just try to like shoulder, like just boom. Yeah, yeah. Man, I I as soon as he got the ball, he messed around. And I everything is about like milliseconds, like in this game, wasn't I? Like how you get the ball out to that first, and I said, Man, I gotta get him before he gets turned around. This with my head as I'm getting as I'm moving, I'm like, I gotta get there before he gets turned around. Man, he got that ball and turned around and saw me as as I was about right there, and all of a sudden he went to take a he went to take a little step. And when I say I hit him, boom, but when I hit him, I felt I felt him rock back. Boom. I and I even heard him go boom like this and rock back. Yeah, and then he came forward. I said, Oh shit. I said, Oh shit, man.

SPEAKER_01 41:59

This yeah, that boy different. He made out of something different. Nah, for real. Vibranium, something crazy.

SPEAKER_04 42:06

But much respect to them two guys, man. And there was some other there's been some other guys, but yeah, those two guys for sure, like hands down with something tough as well.

SPEAKER_01 42:12

I think of like an Adrian Peterson may have may have uh made the list. Him in his in his in his in his prime Viking days.

SPEAKER_04 42:20

Yeah, he oh he he ran a AP ran the ball, he ran it hard. It was just when he played against us, it was one of those things all week long. We really was focusing and dialed in on understanding what makes him elite in the sense of like, if you give him a little bit of room, I mean, he's gonna make plays, but for the most part, if you don't give him that much room to get his feet going or whatnot, and you can keep the edges and keep everything kind of condensed and make him have to, you know how they chop the feet and slow him down? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's what that's how we played him, and we played pretty and we would play pretty consistent against him. Now there'd be a couple times where he get out there on the edge and the one-on-one on somebody like oh shit. Hey, we're coming. Hey, just slow him down, we're coming. Exactly. Heck of a player, man.

SPEAKER_01 43:03

No, yeah, you played it, you played against some great running backs. And I'm shooting, I I feel like in my game today, there's a ton of running backs who Mr. Do-it-alls out there who I gotta chase after, and and they they definitely uh give me my you know, make me make my money every single Sunday.

SPEAKER_04 43:21

Man, hey, hey, you you would I I was didn't give you I wasn't able to give you uh flowers earlier, man, but um man, just seeing how you play the game, brother. Uh it's one thing I remember the first time I met you, you know, I I didn't for a while, you know, I didn't come around. I wasn't around, I didn't come around the team for a good while. I was I call it going through that that going through the transition, transitional phases of just, you know, trying to grow, you know, outside the game, whatnot. But I remember going to a sign in, you know, I don't know if you remember it, but it was a local sign in here in San Jose at the uh convention center over here. And somebody told me this, hey, Fred's in here and I was like, oh shit, man, I gotta go and say what say what up to him. You know, I seen him on TV, seeing him balling out and everything. I want to just say what up, you know, you know, say much respect. And bro, I'll never forget I meet you. And one, I couldn't believe how tall you was, man. I ain't gonna lie, like I was kind of like, I'm like, nah, I'm not cool. I thought I'd be like 6'5 or something, whatnot. But I tell that to say, bro, what was so awesome is by the time we left that conversation, I felt as if like we were eye to eye, and just the humility and just the the the vibe of of respect. And what I mean by that was like it wasn't like, oh, like I'm Patrick, I'm holy. No, it wasn't that. It was you can feel sometime when you can feel certain guys and certain energies or whatnot where you kind of feel as if like, man, that's a cool cat, or a kind of cat where you're like, yeah, he now I don't know if he would vibe as a teammate. But I remember I remember walking away and said to myself saying, like, man, this is a cool cat, man. I mean, I really hope, I mean, you always hope everyone do well, but when you meet someone and they're cool, you really want them to do well, and then fast forward years later, man, it's you've just you've dominated the game as one of the best linebackers in the game and um future Hall of Famer, and still cool to this day. So, and then I was sending out to say one of the things I I admired about your game the most was not only how you get that ball, how you punch that ball, which I'm learning last offseason I was able to get a few workouts in with you or whatnot from the boxing world, and I saw the way you were throwing them punches, and it made made all the sense in the world, but it's really the way that you floated, the way I say floated, the way that you played the pass game, the way that you like in sync with the pass game, the way your body like just moves. I remember saying to myself, I was like, man, this guy moves like really well. Whereas for me, I was kind of I want to say almost maybe like robotic, where I was really angle angle-nosed, where I'm like, it's an angle thick, you know what I'm saying? Like thick, you know, but then you know, but then I was like, It was working. It was working. Hey man, I saw how you were moved, Fred, and I was I I remember I live, I was saying, God damn it, this guy moves so well. But then I remember talking to you, and you and I remember you saying, Um, yeah, I played uh well, I remember I found out that you were a safety and had converted, and then after talking to you a little bit over the last few years or whatnot, and you explained to me how you played safety, and then coming down and how really like you had to learn how to play the position or whatnot, I was like, Shh, man, you've you've been one of the best to do it. So, man, keep it going and just with respect.

SPEAKER_01 46:35

I appreciate you, brother. That means obviously the world coming from a cat like yourself. You know, anytime I receive a compliment from people, it it does mean a lot. It doesn't matter who it is, but obviously when you you hear that from a Hall of Famer who played the position at the highest level, man, it truly does mean a lot. And it means even more, you know, the relationship and the bond that we've been able to build, right, in the last couple years, you being around the team, being able to to you know, have you as a friend and and just bounce different ideas because I know I don't know it all, right? I didn't have success, but I truly just have this desire to just be one of the best. And so I know if I want to do that, I gotta talk, I gotta, I gotta try and see what the best, one of the best did, right? And so, you know, you you play the position with a with a certain dominance and passion and just physicality, right? That I can I can always try to like grab from and see like, all right, man, how can I add that to my game? You know, the past game stuff, I'm I'm super blessed that I I entered the league when I did, because you know, had I entered, you know, in your era, I don't know. I probably would have it probably wouldn't have shook out the same because back then you had to really be blowing up the Marshawn Lynches and the fullbacks and the leads and then this, that, and the third. I'm not saying I couldn't have done it, but yeah, you know, I I probably I still I still could have got it done, but I I was like I said, I was blessed to be in a in a in a system in an era of football where now it was it was uh you know few and far between guys who could defend the passive, defend the middle like I could, right? And so that was just a strength of mind that I was able to grow. And then once I found out what my weaknesses were when it came to tackling and run game stuff, block protection, destruction, and I was able to make those strengths, boom, that's when things started to really, you know, bloom and I was able to come into my own, right? So I'm still searching, man. I'm still trying to find ways to be better, right? I I think there's there's things out there for me. You know, I look at the pass rush part of the game, you know, the ability to to win on backs and to win in the blitz game. I think that's something that, you know, might get tapped into this year.

SPEAKER_04 48:40

Yeah. Um, I think that comes with, I think the the more I looked at it, you know, I think about it too. Like, I feel like the more it's like repetitions, the more that you your numbers called on it, the more you begin to figure out, like, oh, this is what I this is my specialty or whatnot. If you're not called on it to do it as much, and it just every now and then kind of like, all right, let me let me, I'm still figuring and out, like live time, like what I really want to go with.

SPEAKER_01 49:05

But exactly, right. And I I played, I played three, four outside linebacker too, my first two years in college. Like, I was I was like a rush in. I was a rush in, bro. Like, there's clips of me been in the corner, like, you know, getting sacks, like, speed rush, doing all the things, right? So like I just been so but the thing is, Pat, is I've been out, I've been out that side of the game for so long where it's like I've been more focused on obviously the stackbacker coverage, run game, punching balls out. Like I that you know, I bet I've been making sure I've been sharpening my tool there. But then if I if I tap back into that bag, yeah, it's a wrap, bro. They they ain't got no choice. But yeah, I mean, you gotta be so good they can't ignore you.

SPEAKER_03 49:42

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, so I didn't learn something.

Offseason Work Ethic And Recovery

SPEAKER_01 49:46

Yeah, man. You know, you learn something new every day. But listen, it's uh it's the offseason right now. This is the time for guys to really grind and and set themselves up to be their best version of themselves when the season comes. I'm curious, what did your offseasons look like when you were playing? I mean, the fact that you were as dominant as you were for that a long for that long period of a time, was your mindset of like when you got that first Pro Bowl or maybe that first all pro and you you you got a taste of that success, you're like, okay, I found out the recipe, let me just do that over and over again, or was your mindset, okay, I did that. In order for me to do it again, I gotta do more. I gotta continue to find ways to be better. Like, what would what was your offseason mindset before going into the seasons?

SPEAKER_04 50:29

Man, it was really just truly understanding that my motto was always be better today than I was yesterday, be a percent better today than I was yesterday. And then on top of that, it was pretty much, man, every every year was I gotta get better. I gotta get better. I mean, I remember Coach Signature telling me after my rookie year, he said, now Pat, you know, you're gonna have to work now, you're gonna have to, you're gonna have to get better. Like they they're gonna be coming for you. And I was like, I don't know what that that means exactly, but man, I always I always just work, you know. But that's all I've ever known though. Like I would I remember I remember growing up, and shout out to my dad. I remember him telling me one time, because I think we was, you know, we you know, as oh you kids, you always want something. You want, want, want, want, want. Of course. You want all this wanting. He said, You know what I'm saying? Hey, he said, he said, hey, if you want something, you gotta have to work for it. Nobody's gonna give you nothing or whatnot. And so at a young age, I I just correlated, like, man, in order to get something, you gotta put in something. And I I began to realize, like, even also at a young age, that there's not many people that's willing to, you know, work that hard. I mean it and and maybe it's subjective, maybe because my circumstances are true, very true. You know, it required something else. But I just remember seeing it at a young age where I was like, whoa, wait a minute, I I think I have some. Like, they're willing to work a little bit, but they ain't willing to work like to the point where they're willing to, you know, exhaust or pretty much be laid out for it. And that's the way I've always went about like just life, and so I just carried it over into the game um as well, and then on top of that, it was just kind of what you said, man. Just stacking, you know, good on top of good. You don't want to go back to go back the other way. So yeah, in off-season, uh my mindset was what I did last year don't matter. It's all about what I'm gonna do this year, and that work starts now. And we know they don't start in August. The off-season really it starts now in March. Really, I probably I went ahead and gave myself, maybe because also to those teams I was on early on, we wasn't going to the playoffs. So, you know, we'd be done by January. And so I give myself all of January, and then as soon as the Super Bowl will be over with, I was right back into, you know, working out. So by February 16th or whatnot, I was back into working out. But when we started going to the playoffs, I won't lie, I kind of waited till March. My body was just saying, like, hey, you need to give it a little time to get back. No, most definitely. Yeah. Yeah, but all in all, like, man, it's just it's how you want to be remembered. And I don't know too many people that that's remembered that didn't put in the work, that didn't put in the grind. And so yeah.

Hall Of Fame Patience And Mindset

SPEAKER_01 53:36

So what about uh you you get you get this you get the call to go to the Hall of Fame? Right. It took what two, three years to to get the call from when you were first uh eligible to be inducted.

SPEAKER_04 53:50

Uh five?

SPEAKER_01 53:51

Five. It took five it took five years of you being eligible to finally get the the call.

SPEAKER_04 53:58

Yeah, so yeah, so we it takes five years for you to get eligible, uh, to be eligible for the Pro Football Hall of Fame, and then it took me five years to, you know, get in. I get in, I got in on my fifth.

SPEAKER_01 54:10

No way, I didn't realize that. That's a shame, man. You should you should have been first ballot. Uh you think that was because you only played eight years?

SPEAKER_04 54:18

Yeah, yeah, I I I feel so. But I'm I I totally I totally understand, meaning that I remember when I retired, and on my when I done my speech, I said, listen, if I don't make it into the Hall of Fame, the fact that I'm up here being able to give a I'm stepping away from the game from the NFL speech, man, God dang. You can't beat that, you know. But but I said, but for what it's worth, when you factor in, you know, the time that I had um and what I was able to do with it, I feel like it was enough body of work to where you look at some guys and they may have 13 years or whatnot, but you know, or 14 years or 15 years, but you know, some of those years are just years of just, I call it like just tagging on or just you know, just being around. And so I'd say, you know, maybe if they measure me off, you know, take me off for what I'd done with the time that I had, then that's what they have measured me off of. And then God say, God, if it's enough, then it will be. But if not, then I mean, I'm grateful to, you know, have been able to embark on a journey um as from a young kid with a vision um and achieve you know what I was able to um achieve. And so again, man, this world is very, as you as you can tell, I I psychologically I'm very cerebral in the sense of like I if you're not careful, man, you can make yourself go crazy in many different ways. And so there's ways in which I try to alleviate some of those things, and that's by psychologically not getting myself too impaired in things I can't control, but control the things that I that I can, and and just that's a good word, like grinding and whatnot. I say, man, I can't do nothing about being told, like, you know, you're not I'm not interested in you, or we don't want you, or you may not be good enough. Like, I can't do nothing about that, but what I can do something about is how like I show up. And it's what you said earlier. Be so good that they that they can't deny you, they can't, they can't get it. It makes it hard for them to get rid of you. And that's when I found like that really makes you a dangerous like person to where you like, man, listen, I may not be the best, but my work ethic and my grind is gonna make it so hard that you like, ah yeah. Maybe we're gonna take him, you know.

SPEAKER_01 56:32

Nah, facts. Facts, man. I mean, you know, of course, every year that they would they would start talking about it again when you were eligible, there had to be something in you where you're like, is this gonna be the year? I don't know. Like, uh, and then and then the the moment that you did you found out that you weren't gonna be in, it's like the during those four years that you didn't make it. I'm sure that was that had to be like, damn, like again, there's no way, man. I I know I know I'm a Hall of Famer.

SPEAKER_04 57:01

Yeah, yeah. Um, I mean, it's one of those things that you know you heard uh you get people that say, oh, you deserve this, and you know, but you don't always get what you deserve, you know, you get what you you earned. And I feel like I feel like I I earned it, but then at the same time, again, I I'm not I was not going to allow the opinions of others or me not getting into something take away from man being able to do something amazing. I was not psychologically going to do that, you know, to myself. And then on top of that, I had also saw, you know, I'm very I pay attention to those that come before. And I saw and I would see how, you know, when guys used to get those knocks on the door, um, when they used to, the way they used to do it, they would have everybody come to Hollywood, I mean, come to Vegas, or come over to wherever they at doing the the awards at the awards, and they would do the knock. And you might get the knock and you might not, but they would still fly you out and do all that stuff, and I would see guys, they I would see guys be hurt, like hurt, and they really go in like feelings, and I'm like, then I you know, then I then there are also then there were also two guys who I had always wondered, like, man, how is this guy not a not a Hall of Famer? You know, how this guy and so I told myself, I say, you know what, again, I don't really know what it's gonna require, what it's gonna like take. And so psychologically, like, it's not that I don't respect, you know, um the Hall of Fame and all that. I just psychologically don't want to get myself all messed up to where you know for sure feeling and it not and again, not that I didn't care, it was just how I it's how I play defense, you know.

SPEAKER_01 58:40

No, hey, yeah, you was defending your own feelings for sure. Yeah, you was defending your your sanity. That's what you were defending.

SPEAKER_04 58:45

Yeah, but deep down, but deep down is what you said though. It's when you have others though, you have those few people that's around you that's that's pretty genuine. I say pretty genuine, that's genuine, that's that was like, you know, they they tell you things sometimes, and you like, man, you just being cool, man. You just being kind. You really mean it's like, and they would say stuff like, no, not just because I know you, but like, I don't think you really understand like what you were able to do, seeing you play, you were that electrifying. And then, but to me, I you know, I I don't know. I just like man, I just did what I just did what I know.

Records Injuries And Perspective

SPEAKER_01 59:19

You can't you can't fake, you can't fake seven Pro Bowls, five first team all pros, defensive rookie of the year. You can't fake none of that. That's uh that's all written in the books, you know. Uh all-time leading tackler, like all that stuff, man. It all it all came out.

SPEAKER_04 59:32

Oh, hey, for for only only for what six.

SPEAKER_01 59:35

You only for one more game, only one more game.

SPEAKER_04 59:38

You right there, huh? What what what are you at? Where are you at?

SPEAKER_01 59:40

I will I you know what's hilarious, man, as I I was supposed to pass you up in that Tampa game. I got injured. I remember I went I went into that game. I went into that game. I will I needed six tackles to break your record. Yeah. And I remember putting it on my tape pregame of I wrote with Sharpie, I said all-time leading tackler, 49er history on my tape. I finished the game with one tackle and a broken leg. Man, hey, hey, you know, it wasn't, it wasn't meant to be. You know what I'm saying? It wasn't my time. And so uh it'll be uh it would my first game back is gonna be special for a lot of reasons, but then that would be uh another special reason for uh it being it being a big game too, because if I get five tackles, then I unfortunately, brother, I pass you up. Hey, hey, hey, I just got hey, I just got chills, man.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:30

Hey, I just got chills right now, just thinking about it. Because and and I I want to I want to preface this too and and say it while I'm on here with you. A lot of people don't understand records, all those things are meant to be be broken. And it's all about the next generation and the next generation and the next generation. And so for me to see what you are doing, to see you taking the linebacker position, and it's and I'm not even a lot, I'm not even I'm just one of many. There are guys who come before me, Mr. Wilcox, um, um Kenan Turner, Ken Norton. Um I mean man, the the list go on there. You got guys who you know I played with, you know, in to Kill Navarro, um you know, the duo that you guys have have have created or whatnot, like I I'm man, I'm I'm I'm elated to be in the conversations, but even more so just to to just to be acknowledged that I was able to you know leave a mark on the game. And so when I see a guy such as yourself who's you know finna break one of the records and got a chance to break other ones, man, I just smile and know that like, man, that was it was a it the journey was not the journey was neither less, but I'm I'm happy that it's somebody that you respect and someone that you like have love for that you see gonna take it and represent it that much more. And then perhaps at some point in time later on down the line when another great one comes through or whatnot, like you know, they'll be edging on yours, but then you'll be there to be smiling and knowing that like man, I left something for them to you know inspire to achieve or not. And for that, man, it's just I don't know. I just it makes me happy. I I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm happy, I smile, like I'm just you know, grateful, man. So go get it.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:26

Hey man, you big bro. You big bro, man. So hey, it it means it does mean a lot. And uh hopefully that that's the goal, man. That's the goal. I probably won't write it on the tape this time. That was bad luck. Ain't writing it on the tape. I'm gonna stick to my my my wife and my my kids initials on there. Nothing else on there.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:44

A lot of people don't realize that's that's actually too, man, where the whole humble but hungry thing comes in or whatnot, is because like so much shit is happening, so much stuff has happened in my life, man, to where you just never know. You just never know. And so I just I try to keep the keep it as simple as possible, but at the same time, like, man, when you when you rocking with God, man, I don't I'm I'm not trying, I don't want to make this all religious or just not about it. It's cool, brother.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:15

I'm hey, I'm right there with you.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:17

But it just something you it's it's just something about the way that you just you you you go about it. Not that that you cannot be touched it, but it's just like a uh an internal presence of of man, you I cannot be measured externally. Like this is coming from within, and it's even more than than what I even understand. So I'm gonna be I won't be humble, but yet like I won't be hungry to continue to like step on them toes, like you know, say get in there. I'm gonna stop get too.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:49

Boy, gonna start turning up. Where them pads at? Where the pads, where the helmet at? Get 5'2 back on the field, man. Now, did have they officially retired your number, or is it kind of just a known thing, like nah, y'all can't have 52, like that's off limits.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:02

No, no, you know what? No, it's it's um I don't know. Honestly, I'm not sure what's what's up with it. I think they've just been um they've been.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:12

It's more about respect like that. Yeah, they just don't pass that out to anybody anymore. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:17

So I I yeah, I don't know what what's um what's with it, but man, I'm just grateful that that they re that they honor it in the way that they that they do. And um yeah, man, I just just forced it.

The BFF FaceTime Call

SPEAKER_01 1:04:31

Hey man, it's dope. It's dope. It's something I just I I just realized. I'm like, yeah, I since the whole time I've been here, they ain't nobody wore that 52, not even for practice squad. You better not touch it. You know what I'm saying? But that's that's dope, man. This next segment, we call it the experience call your BFF segment. And uh we ask all our guests to uh to whip their phone out if you got it, and FaceTime whoever you feel like your BFF is that you that you played with or that you currently, you know, are or colleagues with uh in in somebody you think they'll pick the phone up and let them know that they're they're your BFF.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:08

Yeah, I I got I have one I'll try.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:10

Alright, let's see it.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:11

Who who we calling? This is uh Jamarka Sanford. So I played with uh Jamarca Sanford. So I played with him and uh at Ole Miss and he played in the league for a while, um Minnesota, but he's one of those guys that you know we go way back, Ole Miss days. Yeah, yeah, go back. But trying to think, man, somebody on the other.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:39

Them 49ers, you you you you not you you don't keep up with the 49ers anymore. You just like ah them boys, it was good, it was good while it lasts. You think Navarro would pick up if you if you face time? When was the last time you talked to Navarro?

SPEAKER_04 1:05:52

Um It was like uh probably like probably about a month a few weeks ago, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:56

Yeah. Let's let's see if old Navarro picked up. Phone up, man.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:00

Let's let's try. Let's try. Let's see.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:02

Let's FaceTime and be like, hey, brother, I miss you. You my best friend on off hand on the field.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:11

Oh god, yeah, exactly. He's not picking up. Should I try the other one?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:18

One more ring. Damn, yeah. Hey. The bond, the bond ain't his title. I know y'all had that special. Ah. Yeah. We can try your boy, though. Y'all catching y'all 40s, man. 40 and up. Yeah. Hey. Let's see. Let's see him. Let's see him on show him on the camera real quick.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:44

Yeah, Sam. What's up, man? Hey, what's up, baby?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:47

How we doing?

SPEAKER_03 1:06:49

I thought he might be up, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:51

Yeah, hey, man. We was trying to see if you pick up, dog. You know, Pat said he, you, you his best friend. So, you know, we wanna we wanted to, you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:59

I appreciate it, man.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:00

Appreciate it. Yeah, I was like, man, man. Hey, hey, hey, I ain't gonna lie, though. You might you my second ring, man. I was gonna I was gonna ring you first, but then I was like, no, let me try somebody here on the West Coast. And then they didn't pick up whatnot. So I was like, man, I'm gonna see Sempford. He's gonna be up, man. He should be sleeping, but I know you're probably gonna be up. So I got the early flying them, I want to say, you know. Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:20

You can turn, you can look at them. You can look at them.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:22

Oh hey, hey, man, yeah, y'all be safe going to Napa, man.

unknown 1:07:26

Oh yeah, for sure. How far is that from you?

SPEAKER_04 1:07:28

Uh it's probably uh about an hour and a half, two hours.

unknown 1:07:31

I'm gonna link up with you.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:32

All right, holler at me. All right. All right, safe travels. All right, see ya.

unknown 1:07:36

Come on.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:38

Hey, look at that, man.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:40

Partner.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:41

Partner pulled up, man. Hey, that's what's up, bro. Man, he said he's going to Napa. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:48

Him and his wife actually, the anniversary. Well, no, the adversary not till July. I think they just, man, I think they just taking a trip, coming out here to this, to this side. So that's the first time coming out.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:59

So you went to his wedding? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Nice, man. That's what's up. That's what's up. You you you on you next up, ain't you? You said you're getting married soon.

unknown 1:08:09

Nah.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:11

Nah, I'm not caring for you guys, man.

Linebackers Who Popped This Year

SPEAKER_01 1:08:14

Man, you a forever bachelor, dog. That's all right. Ain't nothing wrong with that. Okay, so a couple more questions, man, and I I get out your hair. So uh this year, you know, you had the opportunity to kind of watch the team. You had also had the opportunity to kind of watch around the league, linebacker play. So was there was there a couple or few linebackers that you saw around the league outside of our team that kind of popped off and you you noticed them, you know, playing at a high level?

SPEAKER_04 1:08:43

Yeah, yeah. Um Man, a couple that come to mind is the linebacker out of Cleveland, the rookie linebacker out of Cleveland is it just like. Okay, yep. Carson uh Swessinger, Swessinger. Yeah, Swissinger, yeah, yeah. Swessinger, something like that, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:01

Yeah, I remember rookie of the year.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:03

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:04

Fellow defensive rookie of the year.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:06

Yeah, yeah. I remember watching him in college a little bit, man. So to see him, you know, come into the league as rookie year and to really be all over the field like he was, it was pretty pretty cool to see. Um also was a fan of uh Jack Campbell, um Detroit Lion uh Detroit Lions linebacker. Um he played really well, I feel like this year. Um who uh I'm you know a um Roquan Smith um fan. Um who else? I feel like I'm linebacker out of uh linebacker out of uh um which is a linebacker out of uh uh Jaguars. Yeah, uh Devin Lloyd. Yeah, Lloyd, and then also linebacker out of uh Shelson, linebacker out of um Seattle as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:58

Oh yeah, Ernest Jones. Yeah, he's a bowler. Um both of them super productive. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:04

Yeah, so that I mean there was some I did, I mean uh there were some guys that were some yeah, some up-and-coming guys in this league that played really well, played really well, but Fred man, I'm not saying that just because I'm not saying that just because I'm on here with you right now, but I I didn't feel no Fred's, I didn't feel no Fred Warner's um auras out there, like just being straight up.

Free Agency Moves And Mike Evans

SPEAKER_01 1:10:27

Like I like I it didn't it didn't feel the same uh not being able to you know have you like lead that bunch or when you look not see your see your name there because you you already know like what it is but I mean but that's that's respect to those other guys too but that's more respect to you as well like in where you stand amongst those guys but yeah man those guys are really that that was some really solid play um at the linebacker position this year yeah no I I agree I obviously had the chance to really see a lot of guys play from afar not playing this year uh for the majority of the year and so I was able to kind of see you know who was who was making plays who was you know doing their thing every single week it's tough man to to really be dominant in this game at that position like to be dominant week in and week out to really separate yourself amongst the rest you know anybody could do it one year anybody could do it for one game or for a stretch throughout the season but to do it week in and week out you know I think that's ultimately what I try to do every single year I play and you know I think obviously people recognize that and uh you know of course seeing other guys have success that does push me to obviously want to continue to to to be at my best but ultimately I'm I'm I'm I'm trying to be you know a whole play at a whole different type of standard than what anybody else has for themselves right and I know if I have that within my own self it doesn't matter what anybody does at the end of the day like you're not gonna touch what I'm doing if I if I got my if I got a different standard than what you than what you have for yourself right so you know that's that's just my mindset when it comes to to that kind of when to those kind of things like when I measure up with with some of the other casts around the league but that all that's be all that said obviously a lot of great linebacker play this year. We're in free agency now right you see all these different headlines go across the ticker most recently and I you know I don't know when this episode is going to come out but what we just saw Max Crosby's trade get rescinded uh and he's no longer going to Baltimore which is crazy I don't know what that's what implications could that's gonna have take for the Raiders and for other teams around the league who possibly want to have him on their team they say he failed his physical I you know I don't want to get into any of that but it's just crazy to see like I I don't think I've ever seen that happen before um you know and then Mike Evans gets signed us uh that was a huge pickup what you think about the Mike Evans signed yeah yeah man I I liked it you know it was one of those things obviously you know um outside looking in you know when I first heard about it like a few weeks ago I was like in a mind of like man but would he is he gonna want the ball is he gonna demand it but then at the end of the day when I realized like what what the Niners have at the offensive ham meaning like you know Shanahan leading the bunch or whatnot and then you have guys like Purdy and and um uh Kittle and Priscilla and all those guys and and that the running back with McCaffrey I'm like man he can really come in and and you gonna you got to respect him I mean you got to respect him as a as a football player and whatnot because of what he's done in this game and how good he is so that's gonna open up you know other guys and so I I I like the um I like the acquisition I like them um picking him up because I think he's really going to help the offense um he's gonna open it up for for obvious reasons whether it's you know just big play big body huge in the red zone just add another um add another body there so yeah I like it yeah no I love it I think I think he fits right in I I specifically remember meeting him like officially for the first time at the Pro Bowl a couple years back he was there and uh you know he's chopping it up with me and got and other guys there who are the 49ers and he just seemed like our kind of guy you know I'm saying like he seemed like he fee he fit in like cool dude obviously he's been an elite receiver in our league for for years and years and I know he still got juice left in the tank and you know this is like a like a new challenge for him right like as a as a player you played somewhere for the last 12 seasons and this is your first time leaving you know kind of your your your comfort bubble right love like everything that you ever known over there in Tampa Bay and now you leaving to go to a new team I I think if if I were in that position it would light a fire in my stomach like to to really want to prove to that new group and to everybody else like nah I still got it like y'all gonna have to see me. You know what I'm saying? Like I feel like I think I I don't know I haven't asked him I I did I did reach out and and welcome them to the team but I think ultimately having a new challenge is something that may have seemed enticing to him.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:14

Yeah I I I feel like it I mean it's everything you just said and then you factor in you guys having the veteran leadership that you guys have on the on that team whether it's on the offensive side um defensive side or offensive side especially offensive side if I feel like he would it would make him want to buy in that much more you know with those veteran guys because they understand how important today is or whatnot. So yeah I mean I look for him to do some big things.

Seeing Football From The Stands

SPEAKER_01 1:15:43

No most definitely I can't wait he hey you he know he know what the goal is and he's a Super Bowl champion too now. Hey I do I do gotta ask I do have to ask you this one I know I know as you asked me a question but I was just curious no I was actually about to ask you because I want I wanted you to ask me you could be the you could be the host now you ask me a question uh personal or football whatever you want you see the game any different than you've ever seen in like not being in the driver's seat as you have always like been did you see it from did you gain anything from this from this most definitely side opposed to the case most definitely most definitely so here's what I'll say to your question I sat in so I my wife and my family and and close friends we all they all sit in the box right up there at the home games every game to watch me and you know I I've never for the last couple years we've had it I've never even seen what it looked like right because you obviously I why would I I'm always out there playing on the field so I I have no idea even what it was like to be up there when they're enjoying the game and so I get hurt and obviously now for all our home games I'm up there with my family and where I'm watching the game from the box and uh you know I'm looking down and I I get to sit there I watch the uh the pregame intros of the players coming out the tunnel you know national anthem and watching the game of course and I specifically remember it may have been one of the primetime games where we were playing the Falcons or we're playing the the Panthers and I'm watching just how much the the stadium feeds off the players and their energy when they make a play and they get up and you know a guy celebrates after the flat after the after the the play and uh does his thing you know I'm saying like everybody kind of got their own signature a little celebration they make a play like I could feel up there as a fan I'm like damn like I I'm turnt I'm more turned up because you just you turnt up on the field. You know what I'm saying and I I never really felt that I not that I didn't feel it but like I didn't realize how big of an impact that has as a as a player the the the uh the power you have over the entire stadium in the way that you play not just what you do but how you're doing it. You know what I'm saying? And so like I've always played it in a in a way where like I don't want to just do things just to do them good. Like I want to do I want to make plays and let everybody know about it and have this infectious energy over the entire stadium. Like I've already I've already kind of played that way but then actually seeing it from the fans perspective now last year it makes me now realize I'm like man I gotta really turn up when I get back because I understand now having been there I'm like I just I see how how big an impact it really does have because you could you could just you could feel the difference of a cat he make a big tackle and he just gets up and walks back to the huddle versus the guy who make a big tackle and like it flex and he you know he trying to just impose his will and it's like oh yeah like I'm with you you know I'm saying like I'm with you up there in the stand that that's that's just how the fans want to feel like they're with you on the out there on the field right so uh that's that's one of the things that I vividly do remember from this past season being a being a spectator um but yeah man I mean it's it's it's crazy just to to be on the sideline and not not giving it up every week you also get to see kind of what what goes into playing a full like 17 to 20 week season and I remember being like being you know behind the scenes thinking like damn how did I do this for seven years straight and never got hurt. I'm like bro the the how violent the game is what it requires of you week in and week out the the the hours you got to put in man when you're in it it's you're just kind of just in like a you know you're just you're just in that mode so you're things kind of fly by and you you you snap your fingers the season's over but when you have a chance to sit back you're like damn like y'all boys grinding man it it's a long season. Yeah you know you gotta just stay in it you gotta stay locked in and uh it requires a lot of you mentally physically uh spiritually you know so it's a long season and uh that's why the offseason is so important to really build build up the armor to to to stay in the full season.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:57

Yeah yeah man you're talking about talking about the fans I I think we maybe I'm a little biased because you know I've only played for one NFL team and then obviously college team and then high school team but man it was nothing like playing in front of those faithful and you know I know you know you never got a chance to play inside of candlestick but when I when you talk about making a play and feeling like the the crowd be right there with you man that's how a candlestick felt candlestick gave that oval gladiator arena to where like it wasn't it wasn't so much an entertainment um later in this year it was more like you either had to be in the football or you was not going to like like being there or whatnot. I like LeBah LeBot's really nice and yeah if you don't like football it's one thing like you can still enjoy yourself but candlestick had that gladiator glore and man it was nothing like just feeling it like because and my biggest thing too is um I once heard uh TikTok say it um one time he said you never know who's watching for the first time most definitely make sure you give them a show and you're absolutely right man as some of the people I've met over the years it's like man I remember watching you the for my first time and and I got hooked after that and I was like hell yeah but that's what I'm talking about man.

Final Thoughts And Sign-Off

SPEAKER_01 1:21:17

Facts that's so real that's so real because imagine you have a down game that's the first time somebody somebody done puts you on about oh hat Willis or Fred Warner and they just out there they lollygagging it's like damn this is who y'all this is what y'all was talking about you know no you never want that on your name so there's always something to play for man it's it's the this game is unbelievable the things that it it can bring you bring to your life and the person that you get to be out there on that field is unlike anything else so that's why I want to play as long as I can man I'm sorry I know you only you only got eight years out of it but it was a damn good eight years I still got work to do.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:54

Yeah maximize it man maximize it get get all you can get all you can get man you'll know when it's time to step away man and and again only you only you will know know that so I pray that you get a chance to you know go out on your shield the way that you you choose to go out so most definitely well hey brother that's all I got for you I appreciate you coming on man it was a pleasure I know I'm gonna see you around the the building but uh you know it's much love and much respect always all right most most definitely man I'll catch you around I'm gonna be in the heavy uh during April for sure you know they're gonna have all the visits and different things or whatnot going on so be around trying I'm gonna not I'm gonna get a workout with you like I said I don't know if I'm gonna get on that field but yeah yeah we know we yeah we get the mints on you know yeah yeah do the deal so all right brother I appreciate you man thank you all right guys that's a wrap massive thanks to Patrick Willis for joining the show if you guys enjoyed the episode check out the other conversations I've had with some of the NFL's best on Gold Farm Sports channel don't forget to follow Gold Farm Sports channel on all social media platforms for top moments from the show