When Doing More Isn’t the Answer

In this episode of The Dima Podcast, I’m joined by Dana for a conversation about something many high-achieving women quietly experience: the pressure to always hold everything together.

For years, many of us learned that being productive, organized, and successful was the way to feel safe. We became the responsible ones. The performers. The ones who get everything done.

But what happens when the constant doing stops working?

In this conversation, Dana shares a powerful perspective on over-functioning, perfectionism, and how these patterns can sometimes be rooted in early experiences where achievement became a way to create safety.

We talk about:
 • why slowing down can feel uncomfortable or even unsafe
 • the hidden cost of always being the one who performs
 • how burnout can become a turning point
 • and what it looks like to begin reconnecting with yourself beyond roles and expectations

If you’ve ever felt like you need to keep doing more to keep everything together, this conversation will resonate deeply.

🎧 Listen now and join the conversation.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Hi, and welcome back to the Dima podcast. Today's conversation is for anyone who feels like they're standing on the edge of something new, even if they can't fully name it yet. I'm joined by Dana, a coach I met when we were both in the same coaching program. From the moment I met Dana, there was something about her energy, the way she speaks, the way she sees things. I just knew I wanted to have a conversation with her here on the podcast. And this episode is a conversation about seasons of change, trust, and what happens when you allow yourself to follow what feels true. Even before all you have all the answers. Dana, hi, and thank you so much for being here today.

SPEAKER_01 0:45

Dima, I'm so excited. We're doing it.

SPEAKER_00 0:49

Thank you for having me. Of course, thank you for being here. And you know, I want to start from the beginning because when I first met you and we met only virtually, and like I said, we were in the same coaching program. And I remember once you came to a meeting, a group QA, I think it was, and you shared with the group that you quit your job because you wanted to focus on your business. And I remember in that moment, I'm like, wow, she's brave. So can you take us to that time in your life when you took a big decision like this one?

SPEAKER_01 1:25

Absolutely. It's so funny because I'm working with a breath worker right now and she's really helping me stay in my body because I like to go out in the space and create things with my mind and imagination. But as soon as you reminded me of that moment and that conversation, I got this like feeling in the pit of my stomach that was like, oh because that's exactly that is exactly how I felt when I when I went for it. And that was one of the most, I've done a lot of scary things in my life, but that was one of the most terrifying decisions that I actually followed through with. You know, sometimes you like decide to do it, but you don't actually follow through. You just trick your brain into believing that you decided, which means you did something. Well, I decided, and that's the power of having a coach. And I love that we're baby, we were baby coaches together because I had a coach who stood in leadership and belief for me when I had to make that decision. He didn't he didn't tell me to do it, he didn't encourage me to do it. He held belief and he asked that question. He said, Dana, what would you do if you knew you couldn't fail? And there was something inside of my spirit that was like, exactly, you're not gonna fail. Like, look at you, you're not gonna fail. What would you do? And I said, Oh my God, I would quit my job. And he said, Great, well, what's stopping you? And I gave him the reasons, the logic, and the six of the six runway and the same and my kids and my family. And he's like, No, really, what's stopping you? And I said, I'm just scared. I'm really scared. He said, What would you do if you weren't afraid? I said, I would quit that job today. And I did, Dima, I did. That is scheduled. I already had a call scheduled with my boss. And candidly, this isn't wasn't something I decided that day. I was in a job that was it was a great job for somebody else. It was a six-figure ed tech corporate job with again, my manager was amazing, my teammates were amazing, my actual team was amazing. It's just it when I went to work, I did not feel alive. I didn't feel challenged in my heart. I didn't feel called forward in my purpose. I didn't feel like I was on assignment. And listen, you're I've I've heard your podcast. We're talking to women in midlife and beyond. And there is something about the midlife switch that I said, I'm not doing, I'm not living like this anymore. I'm not living like this anymore. I'm not available for that. And I'm so proud of myself for investing in a coach who would hold that space for me to do what felt really terrifying. Because before I'd always been like, well, you know, I follow X and Y and Z, and we do the plan, and we're gonna climb the ladder and we're gonna build the thing, and it's gonna be very strategic. The only thing strategic about this was listening to my spirit. That was the strategy, and it felt like I jumped out of an airplane with no parachute.

SPEAKER_00 4:31

Wow, yeah. And can so how was it like like the next day when you woke up? Like, what how did you feel? How how what went through like thinking back to that day, the first day?

SPEAKER_01 4:45

Well, the first the day that I did it, and also to give context, um, I I am married and we have three small kids, and I am the breadwinner. And so I had talked with my husband about it, but you know, in conceptual, we conceptualized me making a move. And I don't think he thought I was serious when I said, No, no, no, I'm quitting my job today. I called him and I said, I'm I'm gonna quit my job today. And he was like, Okay, honey, you know, I have big ideas all the time. So when he came home and I said, I quit my job today, and I expected him to say, Oh, great, you know, like that's so exciting. You could tell he lost all the color in his face, and so I lost all the color in my face. And I went from being totally excited and over the moon and filled with limitless possibility to total terror in my body. Just what did I do? What did I do? But also this knowing demon, because I could have my I had a great boss and a great company, and they'd probably take me back if I called them right now, you know. Like I did good work with them and for them and loved them. And I knew that I could go back and say, just kidding. And in fact, I did go back and say, Listen, I know I said six weeks, but I need 12. And they were like, Okay, no problem. So bless them for that concession, or uh so that day was a lot, and I'll tell you the next six weeks, my whole nervous system shut down. I was in panic, I was in anxiety, I couldn't focus, I couldn't function, I could barely do the job that I was, you know, they were hired paying me to do. And but there was a part of me so deep within that was decided. I had decided that day. I decided and I took action. I used human design in my practice, and so I did not know human design, I did not know my human design. I wish I would have because I would have probably spared myself those six weeks of what the frick did I do. I don't know if we can use profanity here, but you know what I mean. And um really it was like, what the fuck did you just do? My husband said that. I said, I don't know what I just did, but there's no going back. And I mentioned human design for two, well, a few reasons. Maybe it'll come through, but I'm a projector, so I can see big picture, I can look at the whole scene of things and say, this isn't working, or that's not working, or this, you know, we can move things around. And then the other thing is I have spleenic authority, which means when I know something, I know it immediately. I know it immediately. I don't have to think on it, I don't have to sleep on it, I don't have to cry it out. Like I know what I know immediately. And I wish I would have known that because I would have felt more grounded and confident in that decision, knowing that it was the right way forward. And ultimately, it's been one of the best decisions that I ever made for myself. And now it's been almost two years since that happened. Unbelievable! A lot happens in two years. Right.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

Um, it is that when you were I'm not very familiar with the human design, but if I understood correctly, is that when we know who we are, we understand our decisions a lot better. And it gives us comfort into trusting, trusting the decision, what the decision we just took and why we took that decision. And I I think that's what you were talking about, is that if if you had trusted where you were coming from, you would probably have lived less anxiety during these six weeks.

SPEAKER_01 8:26

You you're you exact you're exactly right. Human design in a nutshell is your energetic blueprint, it's how you're built to move through the world the easiest, best way. And I listen, I'm just gonna put a plug. Every midlife woman needs to get her human design right immediately. Like, immediately go get your chart, take it to Chat GPT, begin to learn about your human design. Because when I had my very first human design, I'm gonna give my guide a shout out. Her name is Tracy Hill. Her human design business is called a huge a beautiful fix. So she is who I recommend. My whole life changed. My marriage changed, the way I parent changed, the way I lead my business changed. And the thing that changed the most is I don't waste any time overthinking. I don't waste any time wondering. I know my blueprint, I know my profile, and I use it with my clients too. So we don't waste time doing things that aren't a fit for us. And if there's a gift that every midlife woman needs that I would love to give is your human design. Because once you know yourself, then you know yourself, and you don't have to overthink or over-explain or wonder. You can say, I have this authority, so I need three days to make a decision. It's emotional. Or I'm a generator, which means I can put all of my energy behind this thing that makes a difference. So, and I won't go through all the profiles, but once I got clear on my blueprint, it was on. And yeah, I can't recommend enough.

SPEAKER_00 10:04

Oh, now I I'm definitely going to take that. For sure. Now I'm very curious. You got me very curious. Yeah, it's it's powerful. Yeah, so I want to know more about girls who recover. Uh this is how you started, and this is what your podcast uh was called. Can you tell us more why girls who recover?

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Yeah, so I call Girls Who Recover Act One, and who knows how many acts we have left. But I was called forward out of education. I 20 years in education. I was a principal, I was a coach, I was a teacher, I did curriculum, I did all the things education. But the thing that I always loved the most was coaching. So I loved coaching teachers, and then ultimately I had a consulting and business coaching leadership. So if you were a teacher and wanted to be an assistant principal, I would coach you there. If you were a principal and wanted to be a superintendent, I'm the I'm your coach. And so I was always drawn to coaching and specifically drawn to women. And the other thing that's I think pretty cool about me is on December the 18th of 2009, I got sober and it was a hot mess. It was not like I hear this, people are sober curious now, and they're doing like dry January, and I'm like, oh, good for you. Not my story. Mine was I had to get sober, my whole life was burned down. I had to get sober, or I wasn't gonna make it very much longer. And so, in the middle of being an active participant in the recovery movement, I got to practice things like mentoring women and supporting women. And so once I recovered, I was able to guide other women through the process and what a gift that it's been. So, my favorite women up until a point to coach were women in recovery, hence girls who recover. And the the inspiration from the podcast was I have a lot to say about women in recovery. I have a lot to say, as you've already found out, about manifestation and personal transformation, personal development, leadership, and specifically women. I've always been drawn to women. I've got three sisters, I'm sorry, two sisters, I'm one of three, and I've just a preference for the power of women, the gift that we have to offer, and the ways that we have limited or been limited by our own internal conversations or by the world at large. We have both. And so Girls Who Recover was born. That's I started coaching women in recovery. I started being invited to speak as a thought leader for women in recovery, and then the podcast was like, whoops, we gotta start a podcast. Like, of course we have to. And so for the movement that was Girls Who Recover, half of it was me sharing with the world the things that I had learned, and then half were really powerful stories of women who'd experienced setbacks of all kinds. So addiction, divorce, cancer, um, attempted suicide, like all domestic violence, every possible setback. And then the story was how did you create or how was it created on your behalf by spirit or support to create a comeback from that? So setback to comeback and the transformation that's required. And one example that I can think of, one of my favorite stories is a woman. I interviewed a woman, her name's Martha Gilreath, and she has this really powerful story of she was addicted to drugs, she had a son that was essentially taken from her, and she couldn't see him, and she was just the bottom of the bottom of the bottom. And her whole conversation was well, how now she's this world-renowned award-winning chef in the middle of New Orleans and completely different. And so these beautiful conversations around what's possible when we open ourselves to personal transformation. Story after story after story. Okay, I promise I'm gonna close with this. Um about nine or 10 months into that experience, I noticed that the clients that I was serving as a coach, the places I was being invited to speak, were different than the message of the podcast. So I'm no longer being invited, not that I'm not, I'm just not saying yes to opportunities to speak on recovery. And I'm speaking more to women who are up-leveling, who are creating their next level of success, typically in business or in finances, and personal confidence, in their work in the world, in creating movements and really making a difference in the world for themselves and for other women. And my clients were matching that, and I found that's what I really started to love. Speaking of, so I made this really difficult decision because I've been in recovery now for 16 years. It's the thing that I'm really good at, you know, um, the upper limit, the book, The Upper Limit. It's, you know, that area where you're really skilled at it and people, you know, you do great work, but it's not your zone of genius.

SPEAKER_02 15:11

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

And I found that my zone of genius also terrifying was uh up women who were up-leveling who were like, oh no, we're not going from good to great. We're great now, we're moving to phenomenal. We're about to blow the ceiling out of the building. And so I'm I decided, I heard the voice first. I'm spleenick, so I heard it immediately that I had to I had to close girls who recover. And it broke my heart because it was the thing that got me out of the corporate job. So I thought we were gonna be together forever. But that's the beautiful part about midlife. It's like, okay, we're pivoting, we're pivoting. And now that I have experience and I'm getting wiser in years, you know, yeah, I have less fucks to give. I'm like, yeah, I'm going for it. I am going for it. I will not be caged, restrained, or withheld. I'm gonna follow the voice of my intuition and I'm gonna do and make the changes that are necessary, even though they are terrifying and challenging and make no sense to anyone who's logical. Because Dima, girls who recover is in the top five percent of all podcasts all over the world. So to close girls who recover is like, what are you talking about? You're basically at the Olympics of podcasting. Yeah. And but my spirit says, okay, but we're not we're done with that. We're ready for something more, something better, something I don't even know what it is. I still am not able to articulate. I finally did choose a new podcast name to match, which I'm happy to share. It's coming out at the end of February.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

So oh, I'm very excited for this. And I want to talk about that transition between uh girls to recover and what you're talking who recover and and what you're currently working on. I I want to go back a little bit to the girls who recover and because it speaks to a specific population and it speaks to a a moment in your life um that you felt deeply connected to. Um and I know you've been open about your own recovery. How did that experience first going yourself going through that recovery and then uh coaching women going through the same process? How did this experience shape your sense of identity um for that period of time? And then I want to talk about the transition that you're currently going through. But how did that experience being with these women um side by side with them and hearing all these uh setbacks and devastating stories, how did this shape your identity?

SPEAKER_01 17:43

That is a beautiful question. And I want to speak into something that helped me make my decision before I talk about identity, but because there was a huge upleveling in identity, huge expansion. Part of the dissonance between my work in the world as a coach, a paid coach, and a paid speaker, and a well-paid, I'm just gonna add, I'm a well-paid coach and a well-paid speaker. There was a tension there for me because the in the recovery movement that I'm a part of, it's free. You go, there's some steps, you get a guide, there's literature, the whole ecosystem is free. And I feel very strongly about that. I feel the same way about public education, which is why my girls go to a public school. But I feel a deep connection to this is a free resource that anybody in the world can access. It is a global movement that is free. So within the rooms of recovery, I'm mentoring women, all of that's free. I'm taking them through the work because essentially we're sit we're helping people save themselves. And we have a particular model that we use is that if you follow the model, it works. It's undeniable. And I feel strongly about that stays free. And so when I say I coach women in recovery, I don't coach them around recovery. I'm not a recovery coach. But I will take someone, what I noticed, Dima, was I would be in rooms with women who had five, 10, 20 years of sobriety, but they still were limiting themselves. They still weren't being well paid. They still weren't showing up in the world with deep confidence and worthiness. They still weren't making the kind of money that they could make. You see how I get mad? I get riled up about women making money that they're supposed to be making. But they were limiting themselves, thinking, well, I should just be grateful because I have this good life that I got through recovery. And my invitation is to say, absolutely be grateful, and we don't stop there. And so to take the women who had years of sobriety and say, we're gonna turn up the dial, not on your sobriety because that's a foundation that you've built, but on the quality of your life and how alive you feel. And are you on purpose and are you fulfilling your assignment and are you doing what you're here to do? That is where I come in as a coach. So there was a little bit of dissonance there because recovery is free. I'm gonna say it again. Recovery is free. And I see people, I'm not gonna go here. I see people who believe otherwise, and that's fine. People get to believe whatever they want. But where I play, it's free because we want everybody to have access. Yeah. And also, can I just be totally candid with you? Of course. I do a lot of work in that community and I love it, and I don't really want to do it for work anymore. I don't want to talk about recovery anymore. Yeah. And I realized that I wasn't the right person to hold space for these really powerful stories. And oftentimes I would sign off from a setback to comeback story, and I would feel totally depleted and totally not myself. But when I would get in front of somebody like you, for instance, who's like, I'm growing, I'm expanding, I'm leading, I'm hosting a brunch, I'm giving a talk, I'm coaching. That's where I felt in my body, in my spirit, and in my mind, all of them were singing at the same time in harmony. This is the conversation that I want to be a part of. And it was undeniable. So here's the identity shift. But it happens again and again and again. First of all, I had to blast my former identity to pieces. The person who's like, I'm playing it safe, I know where my money's coming from, I know how to climb the ladder, I'm a recovering type A, so I know how to follow rules and get to the top about as fast as you can get there. I was a principal before I was 25. I left home at 17. You know, like I'm an overachiever. Recovering, recovering. Now I don't need that. I'm trying not to need that anymore. Now I don't even need it, and the podcast still goes to the top. So there's something to be said for that because I never felt like I had to work hard for that podcast. I don't feel like I have to work hard in my practice either, because it I know and I know that's a signal. So the identity was that part of me had to die, the part of the need to be perfect, the need to know the way. And this new version of me was born. And I mean, now that I'm in the midlife community, it's like, oh, this is happening for a lot of us. Oh, yes. And it required a lot of me. It required everything that I had to say, what is it that I would love? What am I here to do? And I'm connected to the spirit. I'm spiritual. I love, I love meditation and prayer. And I love feeling like I'm carried through the world because that doesn't require me to work really hard. It requires me to surrender really hard. And so it required me to it's terrifying. And it's that's the hardest thing about it is how deeply can I surrender today and go with flow. And that has been an upgrade for sure. And so to be shifting into thought leadership around what does it take to upgrade your identity? What will it take for you to start the podcast, to create the business, to leave the job so that you can do the thing, to leave the husband so that you can be the person to uplevel and evolve so that you're creating not again, it's we're not talking good to great, we're talking you're phenomenal, and you're here on assignment to do something incredible, both professional personally and professionally, and that's been my experience. So it's required a lot of identity up leveling.

SPEAKER_02 23:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:33

Um, was there a part of you that you were attached to that was very hard to let go of?

SPEAKER_01 23:41

Yes. And luckily, I had some sobriety gave me some practice in that. So when I got sober, I had to let go of being a school leader because I couldn't, I was not being functional as a school leader. And that was my identity. My identity was I'm an overachiever, I'm a high performer, I get there, I get to the top fast, and I am a school leader. It was my dream. I created the dream. You hear me say I, right? It was a lot of work because I was doing it. I, I, I, I, me, me, me, me. It was very selfish. It was hard. It was very hard. But I that was who I thought I was. That's what I thought success was. And so when I left that cur that part that of my career, I thought I was dead. Like I felt like I was dead inside. And a very kind mentor said, Maybe there's more to you than the job that you have. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:34

And that yeah, I I um I can so relate to that part of your story. And for for me, it was um, what are we today? February 9th. So it was February 4th, 2023, uh, three years ago, uh, when I was a very hard time at work, and um at a time where I thought I was at the top of my career, an executive job, and um long story short, and I talk about it in my podcast too, is the doctor said you have all the symptoms of a professional burnout. Um, and for and then at the beginning, she said, let's give you two weeks uh off work so that you can take a break, take care of yourself. I ended up being uh six months off work off work, and the this period of my life changed my life. And one of the reasons why this podcast exists is because that professional burnout needed to happen for me to grow out of my identity. But to go back to who I thought I was is the next morning when I woke up and I was on leave because I have professional burnout, it was for my first for the first time in my professional life where I'm home not because I'm on vacation, or I'm home not because I'm sick and I have a cold, or because I'm in maternity leave because I just had a baby. I was home because in back then, because I failed in in my job, and then I did not know who I was. Like I woke up that morning and my whole identity was uh attached to that job, and I remember that morning very clearly. I started reorganizing all the cupboards in my kitchen because I I I did not know how how to exist without the title and without um the job. And to go back to what you're saying is that I had to let go of the Dima, the performer, uh the Dima, the people pleaser, the Dima seeking external validation, that um the Dima who sees her worth and and how people at work see her and not how she sees herself. Um, and that's hard. And to your point, it takes a lot of surrendering. Um, and I remember at the beginning of my leave, I wanted to plan, like what's next? And I was going through like this in my head planning what's next, what's next, and and then at one point I was uh speaking to one of my uncles, and and he said, You know what your only job is now, it's to just spend time with people who lift you up. That's the assignment, and it was like so. I needed the permission to just let go for let just let go, and really when you surrender, uh the the answers start coming to you, right? If you allow yourself to just be who you are without pretending, things become a lot clearer to you. I love that for you, Dima. Thank you, thank you. And it was um obviously, I don't want to go through that again, and I don't want uh anybody to go through this, but I think it's it was needed for me. It was that that growth opportunity uh that needed to happen. Uh, so just to go back to your story, uh you were saying that it was so hard for you to let go of the overachiever. Um do you remember what helped you through that? Uh I knew that for me, in hindsight, I like I had to actually go to the core of who I am and what are my values and and where do I feel more most aligned in my day-to-day life? Um what helped you to just find Dana underneath the overachiever and the uh performer and the go-getter?

SPEAKER_01 28:54

I want to make it relevant to what's happening right now because I'm it's we're going through another up-leveling experience in releasing, releasing Girls Who Recover, which again, like Girls Who Recover, was none of this stuff was ever mine to begin with. It was just a gift given to me by life, by the universe, by God. And I got the gift and thought, oh God, I better hold on to this, or I'm never gonna ever get another gift again. It's like um a little kid who's like, I'm never gonna let go of this toy, even though if they would just release it, they would receive plenty of more, plenty, plenty other gifts. There's a neat little cartoon about that. But my deep belief, it's helpful to stay in with clients, and it's helpful to stay on stages and in podcasts because I teach the thing that I'm here to learn. We teach what we're here to learn, you know?

SPEAKER_02 29:48

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 29:49

And what helped me and what is helping me now is I heard you say this when, and I relate so hard. Every cell in my body related. When you were at home and you're like, okay, so we're gonna get our shit together at home. We're gonna organize this, and we're you probably had a list of things, the other things you were gonna do to get your space in order and your life in order, and that this and the that. And what I've found is that that for me, when I practice that in my life, I relate to that. It's over functioning and it's a trauma response. And the trauma response is basically this internal sense of it's not safe to be still, it's not safe to be without labels, it's not safe to not be the performer. That doesn't feel safe to me because as a kid, that's how I created safety for myself. We had a lot going on in our house. I'll just say that. And the way that I was able to create safety for myself was to do well in school and be the president of this and do all my homework and get it all done and do it right, you know, the year the perfectionism as a trauma response, because I didn't feel safe to slow down. If we slowed down at our house, the environment was, what are you doing? You're being lazy. Like, here's your list of all the things that you have to do. And it never felt safe to slow down. And so what I did as a gift for myself, and it was painful, Dima. It was not, I mean, it was self-care, but it was the most painful form of self-care, was I gave myself a window not to figure it out and not to come up with a plan and go for it, to really just feel in shock. And my coach, our coach, said, Yeah, right now that your only job is to take care of your nervous system because your nervous system has gone ballistic. She thinks you're trying to kill her. And in truth, we kind of are. So personal transformation requires a somatic experience where we go to the core of who we are and we go in our body. And we, by many ways and means, there are plenty of strategies, we slow down, we go in the body and we create safety at the pace of safety, not at the pace of how fast can we get this degree, how fast can we get this promotion, how fast can we make this six figures? It's not fast. And that was the painful part about it, is it's like winter, which I don't really relate to because I live in New Orleans. We don't really do winter, you know what I mean? But everyone else does. And I spent time growing until I was 20, I guess eight, I knew what winter was. So I get it. It doesn't make it more comfortable, but it is required. So I'll I want to end this part with this. I knew that I was closing Girls Who Recover in October, and I, you know, did all my interviews and the solos and I had it. So I really didn't do anything much with the podcast November, December. It kind of ran on autopilot. Then January, when I was said I was gonna start the new one, and I couldn't, I couldn't do it, Dima. It was like every I tried every resource that I had, but when I got still, what I heard was be still. It's not time. It's not time. You're in your own up leveling, and when it's time, we'll let you know. By we, it's like the spirit, my own intuition, my body. And so I've set the podcast release date back and back and back. And I don't feel any shame around that, which is new, because normally it's like, nope, you said you were gonna do it. You better do it, you better do it no matter what. But that is abandoning what's real for me. And that's what the whole podcast is about. In order to create success, you have to know what is true for you, which is why I'm obsessed with human design and somatic work. So I can feel that we're close to the edge of that, but I've given myself to answer your question space, time, and safety around slowing down.

SPEAKER_00 34:09

And that is the hardest part is how do you train your nervous system to slow down, to to to sti to believe that it is it it is safe. It is safe to slow down. And the word that's coming up and that you've used already is to surrender into that in-between space. It's between the January when you said this is the time where the new podcast is is going to be released, to now uh end of February, you said is the new release date. And to allow yourself to say it's okay to be in that in bit in-between space. What would you say for women who do feel like they are on the verge of a breakthrough? Um, because uh this is what happened to you after girls who recover, you were on a verge of breakthrough, and then you needed to tell your nervous system to break down, to like slow down, slow the pace before the next thing comes to you, the new gifts come to you. What do you think women often misunderstand about that in-between moment?

SPEAKER_01 35:33

That's such a beautiful question. It landed right in my core. So I can't speak for all women, but I will say, in my personal experience and with the women that I support through the same issue, it often feels like we're failing, like a deep sense of like, I'm not, if I'm not producing, I'm not worthy. And so who am I? And it feels like my worth is in question. If I'm not producing, I'm not worthy, and that goes all the way back to when I was a kid. In order to be worthy, this is the message. I don't know what the truth is. I'm sure everybody in my house has a different story, but my experience was the more I hustled and produced, the more loved I was. And so I think that the gift here, the gift here for me is this reckoning of, you know what? My worth is unshakable, and it's not dependent on podcasting, and it's not dependent on business, and it's not dependent on my marriage, and it's not dependent on anything. I am worthy because I am, because I was created by the creator, I'm a masterpiece, a piece of the master. I'm someone because I'm some of the one, and that's it. There's no other thing that I can do to be more or less worthy. I'm whole as is, and there's nothing can be done about it. And so the thing that we're missing is that we are whole and worthy no matter what. And there's not a word that we can win. You know, the Olympics are happening. There's no gold medal that's gonna make any Olympian more or less worthy than she already was. And there's some stories, some research, you won't be surprised to know that after someone wins a gold medal, after the Olympics conclude, there's a period where they've experiencing depression. Who am I? Why am I even here? What's my purpose? And I think that's the gift. And the thing we missed is in that, well, I'll use the word suffering in quotation marks because that's kind of what it feels like to me. There is an opportunity for us to remember who we are. What you said, what we value, use the word value. I had to come to what I value, to what was important to me, and to use this space that can be very uncomfortable and extremely painful to release constructs of past, labels that we carry even now. Part of that and the the guidance that I got, the mentorship was I'm releasing my label of coach, of corporate, of leader, of mom, of wife. Every label that I would have put on my resume is gone. Who am I now? We can't miss that. Because in that lies the answer to everything, and it allows me to walk through the world as a different person. I don't need people to review my content well, I don't need people to say all the positive things. I don't need that from people because I remembered who I was in that liminal space of letting go, of surrender, and truthfully, of some of it being stripped away because I wasn't always willing. So spirits like, well, I'm gonna take it anyway, and I'll be with you in the pain.

SPEAKER_00 39:13

Yeah. And do you do you feel that this self uh worthiness is this is this an ongoing practice? Oh, is this a goal that you reach once?

SPEAKER_01 39:30

Neither. It's neither of those things. I I was working with a client last week, and we were talking about what would you love to create in our six months together. And she said, I we're talking about identity work because that's what it all is. Business is identity, money is identity, marriage, like it's all identity. And she said, I want, I want to become, I want to be be more confident in becoming that woman. Let me say what she said again, because I hear it a lot. I want to be more confident in becoming that woman who has everything that she's ever wanted. And I always ask permission. I'm like, can I be in your face a little bit on that? And we were in person, so I was literally in her face. There's nothing that you need to become. The only thing that's required for self-worth is you remembering. It's a remembering, it's an awakening. We mostly have just been asleep at the wheel of our own life. Again, no shame. That's how we were raised. That's how we're enculturated and indoctrinated. If you live in the world right now, you're likely asleep at the wheel. Now, if you're listening to the Demon podcast, you're awake. Likely, if you're a woman in midlife, you're waking up. And it's not, there's no worthiness practice that I can give you. There's no affirmation that's required, it's stillness and remembering. And the way that I continue to remember is to be in conversations with people like you. To to instead of watching the news, I'm reading content that helps me remember. Instead of arguing with people, I'm in conversations with love languages with people who are also in their journey of remembering. And so part of the practice is releasing the sandbags that are pulling the hot air balloon down. And that's most of what transformation is. It's a letting go of all that stuff that we're ready to unlearn and release so that we can remember who and whose we are and what we came to do. And that doesn't come from mind, it's not going to come from our mind. Our mind is always going to tell us what we were trained to believe. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:50

And I love that that you you chose the word remembering. Um, I've never heard it like this. Uh the way I describe it is also in conversations with one of my clients, we're talking about purpose. And and I said, You're not going to find it outside of you. It's it's in you, it's in you, but you have to create that space, and we have to create silence. I feel like it whispers to us and it's always whispering, but we have to stop and be silent and still, and you talk about stillness a lot to be able to hear it because it's always within us. Um, it's it's how is that commitment to sit with the silence and stillness long enough to start hearing, and that, like you said, it creates a lot of discomfort. Uh, and we have to be also learn how to tolerate this discomfort to be able to to grow, and then I think that's what growth is all about is the when it gets really, really uncomfortable, how long can you stay there uh until you're on the other side? Um, and whoever like follows you, Dana, or read your newsletter, you use the word magic a lot. Uh, and I want to talk about magic a little bit. And what does that word mean to you? Like when you say magic, what comes up?

SPEAKER_01 43:27

That's such a good question. So let me just pick up my magic wand while I uh while I answer this. I just happen to have my wand. It's my favorite work tool. I use it for myself, I use it for my clients. And the thing that I say over and over and over again is that it in order to create magic, we have to remember that we are the magic. What does magic mean? Well, it's the unexplainable magic. Force that creates the impossible. That if we would to go back and meet the four-year-old, five-year-old version of you, Dima, she wouldn't bat an eye. She'd say, absolutely, we're going to Mars on a unicorn. We're going to wear dresses made out of bananas, and we're going to go, we're changing all the planets in the galaxy all this afternoon. And that is the magic is returning to our gift of imagination, our gift of intuition, our gifts that we've been given as spiritual beings having human experiences and using those gifts to create what we've come to do. Everybody has a purpose. Everybody has an assignment. Everybody has their own magic. You have your own queen midas touch. I'm like, everything you touch, if you're a manifesting generator, everything you touch probably turns to gold. But the magic is not something that's out there. It's not something that's even in this wand. I have to be touching the wand for the magic to come through, if that makes sense. Because the magic is within me. The gift is within me. The essence of creation is within me. I'm able to share some of that with you in a conversation or a supportive, you know, coaching structure or podcast or whatever, because your energy senses my energy. And we're all one. We're all one. So the magic is the other thing in coaching is like I'm not your basic mindset coach. Like, don't ever call me a mindset coach because the mind has no magic. And you can get in and like do the mindset work. But if you really want to create personal transformation, you will operate at the level of the spirit, also known as the subconscious, also known as your essence or your chi. And by going there first, your mind is helpful. You know, you want to love on her and take care of her. But she's an assistant to the spirit that creates the magic in your favor. So uh oftentimes I'll use the word manifestation. All that means is simply taking what you would love and creating that so it's your reality. And it's accessing your own gifts and your own spirit and your own answer to the question, what would I love? That if you want to turn on your own magic, I want you to get quiet, go within, and ask yourself, but what would I love? What would I love? Ask it again, what would I love? What would I love? And you feel your inner generators start to awaken and your lens of possibility expands. And it's so much easier to do that with someone who's believing with you. You can do it with yourself, of course. You can do it with ChatGPT, sure. But to be in the presence of someone who can look at you and be like, hey girl, remember who you are. Your soul hears that, and she's like, Okay, yes, I'm on assignment. That's what that coach did for me. Remember who you are. It's the one who would do what she would do if she knew she wouldn't fail.

SPEAKER_00 47:07

And I love that because that was my next question, but I think you answered. I wanted to ask you what you would say to the woman who is listening now and who feels the nudge for more, but who doesn't feel yet ready to act? And I think you would tell her, remember who you are and what do you love now?

SPEAKER_01 47:27

Yeah, yes, and can I add a couple of things? Ready is a weapon of the patriarchy used against women. Okay. There's no man out there who's like, well, I'm waiting until I'm ready to start my thing. Like, stop it. So waiting to be ready, just know we're being it's it's weaponized against women specifically. And that's a delusion. So we can stop being ready. It's a lie. The truth is you're never gonna be ready, but you might be willing to do something, you know, like there's a difference. And ready also is a something that we sabotage ourselves with because it's like, oh, I'm gonna do it, which gives your brain the dopamine when I'm ready. So it gives your nervous system a safety, like, oh yeah, we're gonna do it when we're ready, so we're still safe. And the nervous system doesn't like to be dysregulated, it doesn't like to be disrupted, but but change is gonna require it. And what I would say is, I used to say, girl, just go for it, but I realize that that's not a good plan. And I I also yes, start with the question, what you would love. But you know what my advice is right now? Let's cut all the corners, collapse time. Are you ready for it? Go get help. Yeah, get yourself a guide, get a coach, get a teacher, get a get a something. Because the work that we do one-on-one with people collapses time. And women who are in front of me do things in six weeks, six months that it would take 10 years or never to do without support. So the first thing I say is get support, yeah, and then do the other stuff. And if you can't invest in support right now, that's okay. Put it on your vision board. Let it be the answer to what would I love? I would love to be able to invest in support. And then you look around for the resources that you have right now, and we do what we can where we are with what we have right now, and I think we've got more support than we give ourselves credit for, at least that was my experience.

SPEAKER_00 49:24

Yeah, and and you're right, and women specifically, they have a very hard time asking for help and asking for support, but also um we're trained to do it on our own, to to uh it's it's like a badge of honor to be able to exhaust ourselves trying to uh accomplish something, and I feel we underestimate the the power of doing it together with somebody else, and just having someone cheering you uh on, and you don't you you feel less alone, you feel supported, um, and someone who can be on the sideline and holding a mirror for you, I think that's so valuable um to let go of this idea of I can do it on my own and be open uh to help and everything, and and at home, at work, and our business, chasing our dreams. We feel that it's not our success if we don't get help when when no, we we are stronger with somebody by our side for sure. And we're the first one offering help to others, but we have a very hard time accepting it and asking for it for sure.

SPEAKER_01 50:50

Yeah, a client I met with just before you, I heard her assignment this week is every day, she's only allowed to say yes when someone offers to help her. She's not allowed to say no. So if she does, if someone says that moms do this a lot, we'll have a mom who's juggling three kids, trying to wipe nose, wipe a butt, pull a wagon, and uh we'll walk up and say, Oh, can I help you? She's like, Oh no, I'm good. I'm like, ma'am, you're about to have a nervous breakdown. Can I help you? No, no, I'm good. That is a weapon of the patriarchy. It's Western civilization saying the right way is the masculine energy, do it yourself, or you're not successful. That's weaponized against women. So as we awaken, we we actually have time and space to seek our inner wisdom. We're like, I'm pretty sure this is a bunch of bullshittery. And then the I want to tell you a story. I got so choked up about it. I have to tell you. Um, but I'm and I feel passionately because I am that woman. I'm her still sometimes. Yes. Uh after I had my second baby, I was pretty close to having a breakdown. Because if you have two babies, you know. If you have one, if you're awake right now, you know. And so part of my um self-care and coping, candidly, is exercise and running specifically. I love running. I love it. And so I decided I was gonna train for a marathon. And I trained and I trained and I trained all by myself. I'm like, I can do this. I'm getting up at 3 a.m. to go run because then I've got two babies and husband, like and kid and work to do. So the whole time I trained by myself, which I was like, yes, I'm doing so great. Well, I also have a really powerful network of people and friends here. And so they're asking me about it, and they're like, when's it gonna be? And what day is it? And what's the race? And um, you know, in the meantime, I'm like on my own training. Well, the day of the race, oh, I get so emotional about this. So the day of the race, I'm ready, I've trained, I know I'm good. Um, and the first, you know, six miles are great. And then along the route, there's a friend of mine, and she's holding a sign. She's like, Go, Dana! And I just thought, oh my god, how did you even know? Well, as it turns out, they had gotten together and said, You're gonna be here and you're gonna be there, and you're gonna be at 16, and you're gonna be at 22, and you're gonna bring Advil. And um it meant so much to me. And on mile 16, I I felt like I couldn't go anymore. And I was exhausted because I put all the energy in the first 13. And I thought, um, I can't, I'm not gonna be able to finish this rate. It's like I can't do it, I don't think I can do it. You know, if you have run marathon, you know about mile 16. Apparently, it's common. And then as soon as I thought, like, I'm gonna have to drop out, there was another person holding a sign that had my name on it. And I was just like, well, I can't quit now. There's this person with a sign. And then the next mile, there was a person with a sign, and in between the miles, I was like, I still feel like I'm gonna quit. But there were people at every mile until the end.

unknown 54:13

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 54:13

And Dima, I wouldn't have run that race. I would never have finished, even though I trained by myself and I worked really hard and I was disciplined and devoted. If those people hadn't been there to carry me through, I wouldn't have finished. And you know, I'm not emotional about the race. Who cares about the race? I'm emotional because that is what my life looks like now. It's like I just had an epiphany, like, oh yeah, the reason why the podcast isn't out is also because I haven't engaged my mastermind to help me. I haven't said, can you please help me with this? Because I'm back in alpha male. I'm an honorary man right now, trying to do it myself. And so this is an ongoing remembering, and it happens in conversations like us sitting on the couch talking to each other about what matters.

SPEAKER_02 54:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:59

Thank you so much for sharing this and for reminding us that this is an ongoing practice. This is not something that we stop doing. Uh, it's something that we have to remind ourselves again and again and again that we're not alone, that there are people in our corner, there are people holding signs with our names uh on it uh every step of the way. We just have to accept accept. Just surrender and accept. I think that that's what that's what I struggle with is this whole surrendering part because at every event that I do and retreat that I run, uh there's something unexpected that happens. And when it happens, I feel like my whole body is like this, and I'm my mind is fighting it. It's constricted. Sorry, it's constricted.

SPEAKER_01 55:59

Just if you're listening, she's her ball, her hands are balled up in your face, like it feels constricted. Yes, a lot.

SPEAKER_00 56:06

And walking into the brunch uh last Sunday uh that I hosted for women, I had that, I remembered, and I sat in silence and I said, There are things unexpected, they're going to happen today. Don't lose sight of the whole picture and surrender to the fact that there will be unexpected things that will happen. And they were, of course they were, and I was I handled it a lot better than I used to, and it's it's just an example of how when we let go of control and let go of perfection, the same events don't have the same impact on us, and it's just that just allowing yourself just to let go. Um, and really this is where part of the magic happens too, is just letting go and surrendering to the moment, whatever it brings, whatever, whatever it brings. Um, I want you to talk to us about the new podcast. What can you tell us about it?

SPEAKER_01 57:18

Nothing. I can tell you nothing. I in our conversation, I have dropped enough details that you can safely assume that it's about women creating our next level, our next level of success, our next level of embodiment, our next level of remembering. And so, can I drop the name? It's not public yet, but I'm since we're friends, I'm just gonna tell you what it is. It's called her next level.

SPEAKER_00 57:51

Ah, right?

SPEAKER_01 57:53

We love it. And so we're gonna be talking about what does it take to create your next level as a woman? And I'm not talking about the promotion, although if you want to, we can talk about that. I'm talking about your next level of remembering who you are and what you're here to do. And so we'll be having conversations around women who've started movements, conversations with women who've up-leveled in marriage, in their fitness, who created next level identity shifts as they build businesses, as they welcome in more revenue. And we're not going to be talking about it as honorary men, working harder, grinding, climbing the ladder, and like, uh-uh, we're not, we're done with that. So we'll be centering our conversations on feminine energy. What does it mean to her surrender? Why is it so hard? But what happens when we do? And story after story after story of women who thought they had to work really hard, but realized and remembered they just had to come home to themselves and let go. And then it was done on their behalf by the spirit of the universe that's moving in our favor. Abraham Hicks calls it a stream of well-being that's always moving in our favor. And we think we have to work hard to earn it. No, so I'm very excited about that.

SPEAKER_00 59:15

I'm so excited and hearing you talk about this, and I felt like a deep exhale in my system. It was just such a a relief to be able to listen to these conversations that give us giving all of us permission to just be and just go back to who we are, and that's more than enough. And I'm so looking forward to listening to her next level. Before we uh end our conversation today, if this season of your life had a specific message to women, what would you want it to be?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:02

A specific message to women right now. It's all within you. It's all within. It's all within you. So there's no need to go outside, and we're not looking for anything external. And that goes for you probably don't need another certification, and your God isn't up there in the sky. And the the love that you're seeking isn't from another person, it's all within. Everything that you need is already within. That's why we're remembering we're not becoming.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:35

I love that. Thank you so much, Dana, again for being here. And if you're listening and this episode resonated with you, please like it, leave a review, and share it with a friend. And I'll see you in the next episode.