Things That Kill Insurance Deals: The Mistakes Boards Can’t Afford to Make

Insurance coverage is getting harder, more expensive, and more complicated for community associations — and small mistakes by boards or managers can create major problems. In this session, insurance professionals Greg Gerelli and Dawn Becker-Durnin discuss the issues that can delay, damage, or even kill insurance deals, including incomplete applications, poor documentation, deferred maintenance, claims history, rental percentages, lender requirements, underwriting red flags, and changing insurance market conditions.

-------- YouTube: https://youtu.be/6ORxa-WnfO4

-------- OnDemand 1h CEU Video (available all day) - Insurance Deal Killers on Jun 2, 2026 at: https://attendee.gotowebinar.com/register/9125978851478394968

The discussion also explains why the right insurance agent matters, how boards can better prepare for renewals, what carriers are looking for, and why associations should not treat insurance as a simple checkbox. Viewers will learn practical steps boards can take now to improve their insurance position, avoid unnecessary surprises, and better protect their communities.

Gregg V. Gerelli • Gerelli Insurance Agency, Inc. • gregg@gerelli-insurance.com • www.gerelli-insurance.com

Dawn Becker-Durnin, CIRMS • Acrisure • dbecker-durnin@acrisure.com • www.acrisure.com

Raymond Dickey • AssociationHelpNow.com • ray@brainerdcommunications.com • www.AssociationHelpNow.com

This content does not constitute professional advice.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Have to let the video catch up to the audio, which is very annoying. Very annoying. And there is a trend if I don't do that that people think the whole thing's gonna be like that. And a lot of people watch the recordings now. Hi, Ray Dickie from South Carolina, Hudson Valley, CAI and Association help now. Thank you so much for being here at a pre-recorded session. Today, Greg and Dawn have promised me that they are gonna make insurance cool. That is the new logo now. Be part of the cool club and tune in for our insurance made cool segments. They guarantee it. We are and if and if they don't come through, you can email Greg or Dawn that you were you were not satisfied. It wasn't cool enough for you. If you are here for CEUs, you have to listen to the instructions. I'm not king of the world. I'm not king of the world. I don't make the rules. You have to use your question feature. Everyone has it. You should be watching on the GoToWebinar system, by the way, if you're here for CEUs. If you're not here for CEUs and you're watching on YouTube, don't worry about it. Find your question feature and just type in CEUs. That's all you need to do. I'm gonna ask you to do that a couple more times. So pay attention. And this is what I need to give the educational authorities, if that's the right terminology, uh proof that you were here. So all you need to do is use that question feature. And if you can't find the question feature, stop watching and send me an email and I'll tell you how to do it because I want you to be able to do it. Okay, with that being said, here is our panel. And I see Greg first. Greg.

SPEAKER_04 1:45

Good morning, everyone. I'm Greg Girelli with Jirelli Insurance Agency. We're located in Cold Spring, New York, and we have uh community association-specific insurance programs throughout the Hudson Valley and surrounding Tribe-State area.

SPEAKER_02 2:02

Oh, Dawn, you know what I did before we went live? I typed in who is the coolest insurance person. I just wanted to see what the internet would come up with, and guess who it was? Oh no, it was Deb Giorelli. No, it was that flow character on those commercials. So there are some insurance celebrities out there. So all right. Uh, Dawn, please introduce yourself.

SPEAKER_01 2:27

Hi, everyone. My name is Dawn Becker Dernan, and I'm a community insurance risk management specialist. I work with Acrashore, and I'm the practice leader for their community association division in the east. We provide insurance on a national platform for property casualty as well as benefits and workers' comp, all sorts of different things. I'm very happy to be here, and and this topic is so exciting, right?

SPEAKER_02 2:53

Well, I meant you suggested it. So of course, I I'm glad that you're very excited about it. So the topic is things that kill insurance deals.

SPEAKER_04 3:03

And that's where we're gonna that's where we're gonna start, right? Is we've got to work on some of these topics for insurance to make them cooler and more exciting. So I'm proposing for the next one when you have us insurance specialists on, we start with something like how insurance saved the association, or having the right insurance can save your association. We're not killing anything.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

I don't know, Greg. I gotta be honest with you, it just doesn't sound that cool. I I like your enthusiasm, I've never seen you so excited before. So I'm very I'm happy. Keep them coming, though. We'll try them anyway if it makes you happy. All right, so things that kill insurance deals. Now I have like 10 questions, so hopefully we can go through them. But by all means, you're gonna jump around anyway. They don't listen to me, audience, but I'm lucky to have them, so I put up with it. All right, so the number one question number one, it's not item number one. Insurance issue causing deals to fail. And has it changed recently? And Dawn is so excited, I have to go to Dawn first.

SPEAKER_01 4:10

Oh gosh, you know, I have a lot of number ones these days, but I'm I'm gonna give you my number one. I'm I think Greg might have a different one. Uh, to be very frank, capacity issues. We just don't have a lot of insurance markets that will provide insurance quotes for community associations. So if we can count the number of carriers on one hand, that really means the limits have been reached and carriers have seen some of the risks over and over and over again. So they want to make sure that you know, if we have capacity issues, that you come in as pristine as possible.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

All right, Greg, I I kind of don't understand. I'm sorry, Dawn. I'll let Greg explain it. Like, do you is does Dawn mean there's not enough insurance policies to be had? Greg?

SPEAKER_04 4:57

She means that there's not enough insurance companies out there writing these larger associations that we're used to trying to compete on and work on. So by capacity, it could be the insurance companies aren't willing to take on additional risk in that state or in that market. Um, in New York, we're seeing it considerably more on the umbrella side of things, where we basically have one market right now willing to quote an umbrella for an association in our area. And we call it there's just a lack of capacity at the moment in the marketplace.

SPEAKER_01 5:30

Yeah, and the capacity, as Greg pointed out, with carriers, but also with limits of insurance. And I think when you have someone who's used to having$50 million of umbrella coverage and being told now all we can get is five million, and by the way, it's six times the premium cost of what the$50 million limit was, it's a tough scenario.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

Why, Dawn, would there ever be the inability to get an insurance policy? Because in any other business or industry, they just raise prices. If something's limited, they just raise prices. Why in the insurance business can people just not get insurance?

SPEAKER_01 6:08

Oh gosh, what a long road we could go on with this. But in short, for admitted carriers, a lot of times it has to do with the rates that they're filing and their ability to write in specific areas depending upon crime score, wildfire score, and of course other factors that may come into play. But a lot of our admitted carriers are saying if we can't do it all, we would we do none.

SPEAKER_02 6:32

That's pretty scary that you can't get insurance. And what happens to an association that can't get insurance? I'll go to Greg.

SPEAKER_04 6:41

Um, usually we can obtain insurance, but what Dawn was just talking about with the admitted carriers, um, an admitted carrier is someone's licensed to do business in your state, and they need to file their rates, policy forms, coverages, exclusions with that state. And what happens is the state may decide, no, we want to protect our customers. We're not gonna let you get that higher rate. And when they're not allowing you to get the higher rate the insurance company wants, the insurance company will come back and say, okay, we're not gonna write that line of business in that state. It could be limousine operators. In this case, it's$25,$50 million umbrella coverage for associations.

SPEAKER_02 7:22

Dawn, I just remembered something exciting. Tell me if I have it right. If you can't buy insurance in your state, you're allowed to buy insurance from out of state, and those insurance companies have some kind of like leeway, right? Do you know what I'm talking about? What's that called?

SPEAKER_01 7:37

So what Greg is speaking to is the non-admitted marketplace, as he referenced, but it's sometimes called excess and surplus marketplace. A common carrier that is an ENS for short, excess and surplus carriers, Lloyd's of London. Everyone's heard of the Lloyd Syndicate, but they truly are in London. They're not domiciled here in the United States. In fact, a lot of the insurance carriers that we work with are not domiciled here in the United States. And when that occurs and they do not have an office in that specific state, then they become non-admitted. If they're not admitted, two very important distinctions. One for property coverage, there is no application of the property and guarantee fund, which, in the event that the carrier becomes insolvent, there is no way for the state to go after them. And so this fund is very appropriate for an admitted carrier, but not an ENS carrier. Two, if they're not domiciled here in the United States, well, who's gonna go and come after them, right? There's certain rules in the state that we set up for them to even do business, but ultimately they can file whatever forms they want, put exclusionary wording wherever they want, and nothing is really uniform. And that's why we see these ups and downs during very tough market conditions like we had during the pandemic.

SPEAKER_02 8:57

So omitted comes with a certain amount of guarantees, for lack of a better word. Non-emitted, it's the wild west. Theoretically, you're not really guaranteed to have coverage.

SPEAKER_01 9:09

Theoretically, living in South Carolina, wild, wild west.

SPEAKER_02 9:13

Okay, terrifying. But insurance docs, lenders demand, but boards don't provide correctly. Is this an insurance killer deal, Greg? And what am I talking about? What does this slide mean behind me?

SPEAKER_04 9:28

It can slow the process down. I don't know about the killer of a deal, but lenders are going to demand certain documents or certain things to be included. And if the board doesn't get that information back and provide it correctly, it will slow down the process. Um, I'm not sure on the lenders' demand part of this. Obviously, we need a lot of documents in order to secure the master policies, and we work with the property managers and the board to obtain the financial statements, et cetera, that we need to work on that insurance.

SPEAKER_02 9:58

What do you think, Don? What does that slide say to you?

SPEAKER_01 10:01

I actually think it's a deal killer in some respects. And here's why. Uh, Fannie Mae, Frenny Mac, the federal lending requirements were just changed very recently. And before that, we had a cap of up to 5% for a total project's insured value for deductible. So, in a lot of cases, let's say a high rise where we have water damage claims, we couldn't have a deductible that exceeded 5%. And if you were using a per unit deductible times the number of units, well, you could see by the math, we could quickly blow through that 5% cap. Good news, the lending requirements just changed, so now we can have up to a$50,000 deductible per unit. Also, one of the big deal killers was the replacement valuation that they required for roofs. Roofs have always been a maintenance item. And as the roofs deteriorate, we always plan for replacements, or at least we should be planning for replacements. Unfortunately, some people use insurance as their replacement instead of a reserve fund. Carriers started to limit coverage and said, hmm, well, just like a car, we're going to depreciate the value. So lenders said, nope, that won't work. And so that was a deal killer. But the good news is that requirement has been peeled back, and now we can use actual cash value for roof servicing.

SPEAKER_02 11:25

Oh, I'm glad that was pulled back because I remember that coming up. Because that was that was pretty scary in itself, right there.

SPEAKER_01 11:32

It was a big deal. In fact, a lot of people could not get preferred loans or could not close on their loans at all. That's when we were hearing about communities that were being quote unquote blackballed.

SPEAKER_02 11:43

But it really was because people abused the system, right? It wasn't really people were taking advantage of it. And like you said, they just weren't putting money aside to replace the roof properly.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

Well, yes, for the roofing issue, absolutely. But the other aspect with deductibles, I think that was a little bit of an overreach from the government.

SPEAKER_02 12:02

Okay. And I have about 10 questions. That's about it. But I am adding a new segment to our new segment. It is, it's very short. It is, and Dawn and Greg have no idea. It is insured insurance trivia questions. Okay. I'm gonna go. Dawn and Greg have no idea. The question is, I'll start with Greg. What is the largest payout ever to one insured from one insured? No, you have to tell me the uh tell well, okay. Tell me whatever you can. Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun.

SPEAKER_04 12:41

Greg, do you have any answer? What is the largest amount? No idea from one insurer to another insured, it's gotta be no the payout from the insurance company.

SPEAKER_02 12:52

It's it's a missed type, it's a typo. Sorry, I always make it hard on you guys. No, the largest amount an insurance company paid to an insured person. Sorry.

SPEAKER_01 12:59

One of your claimants, Greg.

SPEAKER_04 13:02

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 13:03

Um 600 million. Okay, Don, can you guess who it was and the amount? I guess this is a hard one. I thought you guys just sit around talking about these things.

SPEAKER_01 13:18

Are you talking? No, oh, okay, the deep water spill. Yeah, I could imagine. But you know, hurricane. I'm surprised about that because Hurricane Ian caused over 60 billion dollars worth of damage. So that's one insured claim at 7.2 billion for one specific location. That's a pretty big amount.

SPEAKER_02 13:38

Well, I meant here's my disclaimer. I got it off like Chat GPT, so it's all I don't really, I don't I didn't have like any. I'm not really Jeopardy. I didn't have like any and I don't have a a team of researchers to confirm these things. So as far as Chat GPT, you could be right for all I know, but it was seven 7.2 billion for the Deepwater Horizon oil spill. That was the biggest payout from one insurance company to one party, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 14:03

One insurance carrier taking on that amount of risk. So I think the follow-up question is that insurance carrier still still here today in business?

SPEAKER_02 14:12

No, I don't know. I could ask ChatGBT and find out.

SPEAKER_01 14:16

Well, great. One of the things that people think is that insurance carriers are super rich and they have a lot of money. But the aspect is think about during the pandemic when we had extremely low interest rates. Not only were your bank accounts not making much money, but so are the insurance investments of premiums. And so we have a long tail on claims that is occurring, increased medical cost, litigation. So by the time a claim is settled, it really does grow in the scale. And for some insurance carriers, their financial viability is very much impacted by claims like this.

SPEAKER_02 14:50

No one, no one feels sorry at all, Don. I don't even think anybody even believes it. I don't believe for insurance companies seem to be very good making money. Maybe they lost money this year, but they seem very good at making it back up again. Plus, look how un plus look at the insurance brokers. Look how unbelievably wealthy the Jarelis are. They're basically like they're like the Amazon owners of the Hudson Valley.

SPEAKER_04 15:14

That's a generic problem in the industry, though, Ray. And that's the reason why are having a hard time people understanding that no one wants to write an umbrella policy over a community association. It's because they're losing money at it badly. Um, the nuclear verdicts, the court systems, the judgments that are coming out, it's just not sustainable. So therefore, they're leaving the market. And people don't want to understand that and think that insurance companies are just crooks. Um, but they're not. They're just making smart business decisions.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

You know, honestly, I never thought insurance companies are crooks. I think it's the most important industry we have to a certain extent in so many different ways, whether it's business or personal. I always figure it's a bunch of people sitting there trying to figure out a bunch of odds of what's going to happen here, what's going to happen there, and they're trying to guess the future. And they're really good at it. That's true.

SPEAKER_01 16:06

And a lot of, as you mentioned, actuarial type uh services are put into the insurance underwriting, and that is exactly it. The potential, the probability, what's the cost factor, the unearned average, all of that. And Greg, I'm sure you did a lot of calculations while you were in college.

SPEAKER_04 16:26

Yes, we did, but it is the law of large numbers. This is pretty simple. And when they see in a state like New York and the court systems and the rates that New York State is allowing them to charge, and they're deciding that it just isn't sustainable.

SPEAKER_02 16:43

Dawn, not only did Greg go to college, his parents, who are also Jarelli Insurance, or Greg has and his wife taken over, but they sent Greg to nursery school, insurance nursery school. He only hung around with other little toddlers whose parents were also in the insurance business. So he started at a very young age. Okay. How often are deals delayed or denied due to an incomplete HOA insurance application? I'm gonna guess. Dawn.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

Oh, well, I could say that that could be sometimes 50% of the time at least. There are a lot of applications that need to be completed, and there are certain rules in certain states that agents cannot be completing those applications, the clients must. And oftentimes board members will scribble through them, uh, not answer them properly. And remember, we have a limited amount of carriers. Some of these carriers have seen your account in years past and may have prior applications. So if there's a disparity in the information, meaning that it's incomplete and inaccurate, well, that is gonna be a holdup too.

SPEAKER_02 17:53

Greg, isn't this where the right agent and someone in our industry makes a huge difference during this application process because they're gonna be able to help you with that? Is that correct?

SPEAKER_04 18:04

Definitely, definitely. We help with the communication process between the board and the insurance company and the property manager in obtaining that necessary information. We know what is critical to that app. And if it isn't on that application, you know it is just going to the bottom of a pile or it's not gonna move anywhere on that underwriter's desk, versus some pieces of information may not be quite as critical as others. So, yes, we help out a lot in those situations trying to obtain that information, but sometimes it's time consuming to obtain information, and the insurance companies are doing deeper underwriting into these accounts, especially if there's a claims issue or it's a coastal account or there's something different going on with it where they're asking some pretty in-depth questions or information that we've got to work to research to get the answers on.

SPEAKER_02 18:54

I it's not like a I don't think it needs to be a secret, but Dawn has some of my insurance policies, and I have found using someone like Dawn to be so important, and I can't tell you how much time someone like Dawn spent on my policy because I had a lot of questions and I was being doing these live streams, also I was pretty anal with the policy. But you know, Dawn, I hope you don't I hope that was okay if I said that. Um I could take it out if you need me to. But I just wanted to push upon the importance of how much time someone like you spends and how much your expertise helped me through that process. It's accurate, right?

SPEAKER_01 19:26

Greg and I are independent insurance agents and we are retail agents, so that when we are looking at programs, we have a variety of different carriers and programs. So Greg and I really have to memorize maybe 20 carriers different nuances, whether they provide this coverage or exclude it. And so we spend a lot of time reading documents so that we can explain it to our consumers, the clients. But one of the things, if I can throw out a pro tip right now, if you're listening here, I want you to make a spreadsheet or a Word document. And in order to keep applications as accurate as possible and also keep information for future generations, posterity, keep a list of all your improvements, the basics, a summary, an executive summary of your community would be wonderful. The number of units, how many rentals, all of that are the questions that we ask every single year, and every single carrier will ask the same. So you can keep that list and hand it out to your agents, you're gonna be really completing most of the work right there.

SPEAKER_02 20:30

Dawn, that's a great topic. Can I try to jot it down, but can you try to remember it? We should come back and help people and create that list that they need to know. I think people would be totally interested, totally interested in that. Um, Greg, what are lenders really looking for? I guess we're back to the banks, and where do the associations fall short? I think you were kind of saying there's a lot of emphasis with the banks here in my questions.

SPEAKER_04 20:57

But there's a lot of emphasis with the banks because I misread the earlier question. Um, but when you're saying what lenders are looking for, it's a lot of the same things insurance companies are looking at too. Dawn just hit on a bunch of them. I mean, number of rentals within the association, how profitable is the association running, how many people are delinquent, um, you know, not paying their common charges on time, and for how long? They're looking at the association. It is a business, and how well is that business run? And for Dawn and me, the better picture we can paint as an agent for you to these companies, that you're an extremely well-run business and you're on top of all these improvements because you sent us the spreadsheet Dawn was just talking about. And the better picture we can paint, the better result usually we're gonna have with that underwriter.

SPEAKER_02 21:44

Dawn, do insurance agents like yourself, or is this like kind of like a wise tail? Do you actually go to bat for clients? Do you have that? Is maybe you don't, if you don't want to talk about it, it's fine. But do you have enough ability that maybe you could call an underwriter and say, look, I know this client. Can you kind of go to bat for clients, or is that kind of not reality?

SPEAKER_01 22:05

I'm so glad you asked because that's really the only difference a lot of times that an agent such as Greg or myself can show our difference in how we service an account and also how we negotiate. So as we stated earlier, the rates are set by the state, and then the carriers have different deviations for credits, right? But ultimately, what it comes along to is the underwriter and the relationship they have with the agent from trust. If I'm giving you dog poo and I'm just covering it up, that when the underwriter opens up the package, it stinks. Well, then they're not going to want to do business with me. And so the real test is the relationship that the broker has with their carriers to negotiate deductibles, to negotiate any type of credits that may be available from that carrier. And to be quite frank, I'm sure Greg has spent more time like I have on getting carriers to renew coverage. And a lot of our carriers are looking to exit. So the aspect of asking them to stay on and to also explain why it's a great risk, what they're doing to make changes, claims that happen, giving them the background or the story.

SPEAKER_02 23:21

Greg, I'm thinking about explaining to people, and I don't know if it's true or false again. This would make a lot of sense to keep your agent too. Like, don't be so quick to change agents over a couple bucks. Is that true or is that a fallacy? But if you have an agent and they've been working with you for 10 years and maybe you're having kind of a problem, they can go to bat for you with your claim.

SPEAKER_04 23:41

Definitely, but it depends on your agent. I mean, in the community association industry, it's a very specialized industry. There are a few agents like Don and myself who really do this to a high level with a lot of accounts. And that relationship with that carrier does go a long way. And if you're the type of account and they can see it, there's limited markets in each state that are writing these accounts, and they see you switch agents three times in the past four years. An underwriter is going to look at that negatively. Certainly, we appreciate loyalty to the current agent. If you're the current agent and you're doing their job, it is a very difficult insurance world, but you should give your incumbent agents the chance to do what's right and to get things done. If they're not specializing in the community association industry, it's different. This isn't like personal home and auto insurance where you're with state farms, all state St. Geikos, and they put your information in, and either it fits the box or it doesn't fit the box. There is a lot of gray area and discussions, conversations, and negotiations that go on between the agent asking for information and we're in the middle of this and relaying it to the underwriter in what credits can be applied. Can this be renewed? You know, okay, yes, it fits the box to be non-renewed or canceled, but hey, they did XYZ and all these other items, so therefore it should be an exception. And Dawn and I are constantly fighting for those.

SPEAKER_01 25:05

Yeah, I'll give you an example real quick. I just talked to a client today, and we were being denied insurance coverage from our carriers due to the protection class of the community, which is essentially their fire rating, how close they're to the fire, how fast they can get there. It's the difference between saving a building or it being completely burned to the ground. Well, there was a miserable rating is going to change, and they're going to actually get a lower protection class, which is going to result in opening up carriers. But it won't happen until July. But it's a conversation. Right now, the agent has the wrong protection class. And so they're getting a benefit that they may not deserve or they may deserve, but it changes. And having that conversation and being able to tell to the carrier, well, okay, we're going to take that risk on. We weren't interested before, but now that we know the change is occurring, sure, let's open up the doors.

SPEAKER_02 25:59

Plus, I would also assume that if you have an agent that you've had a long time, look, your time is limited. It's true. You're going to spend more time and work harder. Maybe you don't want to admit it, for somebody that's been a client a long time compared to somebody that's just constantly changing agents. I would assume.

SPEAKER_01 26:15

I'm going to be very frank with you. Um, when we personally our team does not take on the frequent shoppers, they just don't align with our values. And at the end of the day, if you're looking to buy paper, well, you can buy paper from any agent. It's very hard to quantify my expertise and Greg's expertise and the cost of an insurance program that we did not underwrite and develop in that way.

SPEAKER_02 26:44

Greg, have you guys ever given away toasters? I'm just curious.

SPEAKER_04 26:48

No, we've never given away toasters. That would be illegal, right?

SPEAKER_02 26:52

Actually, that would be giving you're not allowed to give out a toaster.

SPEAKER_04 26:57

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 26:58

No, you're not, right?

unknown 27:00

No.

SPEAKER_02 27:00

No, seriously. In the insurance business, you can't give out.

SPEAKER_04 27:03

You can't give out there's got to be a disclaimer, but I can give one out.

SPEAKER_02 27:07

Oh, I didn't know that. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 27:09

You can give out gifts in certain states up to a certain monetary value. So for example, you know, New Jersey might be$25 maximum, North Carolina,$25 maximum. So we there is no rebating that's allowed, meaning that Greg or I cannot reduce the cost of the premium in order to entice a client to purchase their insurance. Nor uh that rebating is illegal and we would lose our insurance licensing. Also, we can't, you know, Greg can't take his Lambo and go pick up all his clients and allow them to drive it. That is illegal. No private jets, those that type of thing.

SPEAKER_02 27:47

Oh bully. Okay. Well, that's not fun.

unknown 27:51

No.

SPEAKER_02 27:52

All right. Oh, wait a minute. Looks like there's another insurance trivia question. And if I have time, I'm going to put music in the back. I probably won't have time. All right. What problem? Doo doo doo doo. What problem made early life insurance unreliable? I'm always going to go to Greg first, Dawn, because I always like you to have an edge because I've known you a longer time. Greg, what problem made earlier life insurance unreliable?

SPEAKER_04 28:23

I'm going to go with the data of the death tables and their information was all wrong. Okay, Dawn.

SPEAKER_01 28:33

You know, I'm going to go along that line, but perhaps people were living longer than expected.

SPEAKER_02 28:38

I think that's a winner, right? I think Greg was dead nuts on, right? No actionary pricing and pooled payouts? That's what you exact. That's what you said, right, Greg?

SPEAKER_04 28:47

Yes, pretty much dawn too, really. Yes. We they weren't planning how long people would live.

SPEAKER_02 28:53

Do you go to insurance trivia nights? Like with other insurance? No. Okay. He's probably he's probably not being honest, Dawn. We're just not invited. Okay. Here's the next question. Has underwriting standards tightened and are boards keeping up with them? I think it's Dawn's turn to start.

SPEAKER_01 29:13

Well, I would say yes. And underwriting standards as far as the housekeeping, the maintenance, the roof replacement. One of the questions that I think Greg and I are most challenged with is when was the building electrical and plumbing last updated? In a condo association where owners are responsible for their individual repairs and replacements, that can be one of the toughest scenarios to deal with. And our carers will say, unless the building has been fully gut renovated, we may not be interested. So, Greg, wouldn't you agree that seems to be one of the tightest underwriting standards is the improvements and updates?

SPEAKER_04 29:50

Definitely getting accurate improvements and updates. You could have certain sections that are considerably more updated than others. You've got original unit owners that have been in there 30 years and not changed anything, where others have switched out their electric panels or maybe updated more to their unit. So it's very hard to answer on those. And the underwriting standards just to answer us directly, have definitely tightened. Insurance carriers and underwriters are really looking through their book, double-checking what fits their parameters and what risks they are taking based on age of roofs, updates, building values. And it's they're canceling and non-renewing more than they have in the past.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

And Greg, you mentioned something that I think we really need to highlight real quick the electrical, the panels. Our carriers are not accepting any longer aluminum wiring buildings and panels that are stab locked, Zinsco, Federal Pacific, a couple others. And the reason is because the fire hazard has been proven in an actuarial standpoint that it is not viable. There's just too many fires and too much damage, and people are dying when those fires occur.

SPEAKER_02 31:05

It's amazing, Dawn, that you know all about panels too. Your knowledge of all these things.

SPEAKER_01 31:11

Unfortunately, crop buildings at times just to find out things like that.

SPEAKER_02 31:16

Unfortunately, you guys only know about things that fail, but it's fine. Okay. Greg, insurance red flags that make lenders pause or kill deals. Are you going to expand on that? But what is a red flag that kills deals or kills an opportunity to even get insurance?

SPEAKER_04 31:36

I'm a broken record at the moment, but number of rentals and being behind on your common charges or poor financials, those will kill a deal very quickly. You see an association that's you know 60% rented, they want to see owner occupied. They don't want to see that. You see an association that's behind and not financially stable, they don't feel they can keep up with their maintenance. There's going to be deferred maintenance, there's going to be a lot of issues on the property. So those are my two biggest that jump off my head, red flags. Um, obviously, past claims history is going to be the next one, or maybe even jump those two. But if you have a history of frequent water damage claims or frequent slip and falls, um, one shock loss, sometimes we can talk through that. We have a brand new building now, nothing else has happened to the association. This was a reason for the fire. There was one big shock loss. That could sometimes be okay. Still gonna affect your rate, obviously, in markets a bit, but um if the frequency of claims is worse.

SPEAKER_02 32:38

So, Dawn, a shock loss is basically a once in a once in a most likely a once in a lifetime or once in a certain amount of time period claim, right? Something that's probably not gonna happen again.

SPEAKER_01 32:50

Yeah, our characters are looking at frequency versus severity, and the shock loss is a severe loss. You know, that once-in-a-lifetime tornado is an example. We never have had a tornado, they're very infrequent. You and if community had a devastating type catastrophic loss from a tornado. Well, maybe they're in New Jersey and we don't really see it. Now, if you were in Oklahoma, we might say, well, there's a higher potential there, right? So in New Jersey, though, that's a shock loss.

SPEAKER_02 33:21

Don, have you heard, and I'll go to Greg too. Have you ever heard I've heard this story more than once about an association, they're usually smaller, where one owner basically sues the association so much that it almost becomes impossible for them to get insurance. Can you talk? Can you give the audience a little bit of a short story on that? Because I don't think people realize that that could happen.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

Yeah, so Ray, we happen to be in South Carolina very maybe five, six years ago, doing a seminar and an article came out about a community. I want to say they had 40 homeowners in a single family community where a homeowner was repeatedly suing, and they had a captive insurance carrier, and their directors and officers insurance excluded almost everything. And so the individuals, when we don't have insurance coverage, guess who becomes the insurance carrier? The association does essentially, meaning that homeowners will be assessed. Well, after so many lawsuits and everybody has to cough up money, some people don't have that amount of money. So in that case, those repeated lawsuits and the lack of insurance made that association have to file for bankruptcy and they wound up dissolving the HOA, all due to that repeated litigation from one homeowner. And really the bigger picture was they didn't have defense funds or indemnification available through the insurance to supplement that financially. If they had, the HOA would still be in existence.

SPEAKER_02 34:47

I don't know if you heard about that. I know that story in particular, Greg, because like I said, it happened in South Carolina. And just so to kind of recap, because it's really quite a sad story, this person sued so much that the association lost their insurance. And this wasn't a wealthy kind of association by any means. And that was it. Over time, they just ran out of money.

SPEAKER_04 35:06

We've had that happen with several clients here, where we end up with one unit owner that's repetitively sued. We thankfully have given them the proper insurance. So the first few claims were covered on the timeframe coming in, but then you get into their now non-renewed for repetitive claims from the same unit owner. And again, working with an agent like me or gone and knowing the market, instead of going to excess lines and getting poor coverage, we were able to get a we happen to be travelers in one of the instances, a very good program and product where they had all their coverage. But if a suit came in from this named individual, it was excluded. So they knew they wouldn't have future coverage for that individual, but at least if something else normal happened, they were still carrying good DNO coverage.

SPEAKER_00 35:53

Like what are you saying? Something normal as far as claims.

SPEAKER_02 35:59

True. But Dawn, could they get insurance, another insurance policy for that one kind of crazy neighbor that was suing and just pay a lot of money for it, or not really?

SPEAKER_01 36:10

No, not typically. A lot of our insurance carriers, the bigger part for DNO is the defense costs in having to defend the association. We don't actually see a tremendous amount of payouts under the a DNO policy, but the carriers just have they have no patience. They really don't. And because there's so few of them, they really can be picky.

SPEAKER_02 36:34

It's scary. Okay. Um, this is the last one, and then I have a couple more uh educational talking points. Insurance trivia, insurance trivia. Okay, let's go with Dawn on this last one first. What I think this one's an easy one. I don't know, but what do I know? What risk was first insured at Lloyd's coffee house? What was the first risk?

SPEAKER_00 36:59

I really hope it's boats and ships, otherwise, I might have to hang up my insurance.

SPEAKER_04 37:06

Greg I I agree, maritime boats and ships, yes.

SPEAKER_02 37:12

Let's be honest. I gave you two hard ones, and I basically gave Dawn a softball, right? Yep. I knew it. Okay. I'm terrified of Dawn, Greg. I don't want to get on her bad side by any means.

SPEAKER_01 37:24

There's no way I spend my whole day just saying, how can I if I'm this aggressive, imagine how I am with my insurance carers and getting deals.

SPEAKER_02 37:32

We do very Dawn can always turn something into a sales opportunity. That's what I like. Okay. What's the most common mistake when responding to insurance requests? Greg.

SPEAKER_04 37:45

Not responding. Um, I'm not sure what where you go without one insurance request, but we send out a lot of requests for recommendations we get from the carrier that you need to put up this guardrail, you need to check your fire extinguisher, you need to do this and that. And we have to follow up with property managers and boards over and over again, and they're simple items, and they set a red flag on the file when you're not cooperating and sending this information back. And a lot of times it's fairly simple just to cooperate and get this kicked off the underwriter's desk and look like a good account and you're cooperating.

SPEAKER_02 38:16

Dawn, why are people lazy? I know from my experience with you, I have kind of a complicated insurance thing. We spent a lot of time on it. I was very good in getting back to you. And I spent a lot of time on that policy, but you know why? Not to make your life easier, to make sure that I was protected 100%. You should. What is the disconnect with people not willing to put the time in and work with the agent to make sure that they're covered?

SPEAKER_01 38:40

Well, I've been asking my quick that question myself, but I think the bigger thing is a lot of our communities versus are professionally managed versus self-managed. When you have a professionally managed community where they have an independent third-party management company involved, a lot of our boards are making assumptions or they're parlaying that portion of the insurance program to the management company and saying, you handle it, you do, you deal with that. And some of them are really not taking the concerted effort to review their insurance. They just let it renew. Um, it really depends upon how engaged the board can be. And the reality is, and I think Greg is gonna back me up on this, boards need to be engaged, not the management company signing off, it's the board. And when we go back and claims and we look at who's responsible, it always goes back to the board. It's very rare that it's the manager, even though the manager may help promulgate the whole uh process.

SPEAKER_02 39:40

Greg, do you think it's here's what I think. I think people, a lot of people don't take insurance seriously and they just look at it as a checkbox. I think that they think I'm never gonna have a claim, I'm never gonna have to worry about this. This is another thing at the end of the day that I just have to say that I did it. Do you think that that's my theory, somewhat?

SPEAKER_04 40:00

I agree, and many people out there just aren't educated on it and think that there's a hundred other companies that would just do this. So if they're giving me a hard time, just put me with someone else, that this isn't a big deal. And they don't understand in the community association industry that it is a big deal.

SPEAKER_02 40:15

See, I'm not like that. I figure if there's a meteorite and it's gonna hit anywhere in the East Coast, it's gonna hit my car or hit my unit. That's the way I look at it.

SPEAKER_01 40:23

You know, also I would say the most common mistake also is not valuing the partnership you have with your insurance broker. I've said a couple of times transactionalizing it, but this is a partnership, and Greg and I advocate 100% for our clients. And so we put a lot of investment into making sure that they're insured properly and that our relationships with our carriers are as good as they can be to give them the best opportunity in the marketplace. But some of the carriers, uh some of the board members will say, just fire the agent, and there's no reason, you know, we don't know why. And Greg and I always want to improve our services. So it's important to have those conversations, even as difficult as they can be, about why you're leaving an insurance agency and what was the issue at hand.

SPEAKER_02 41:11

Yes, definitely. My logic in this industry, and I could be wrong, Greg gets nervous. He's like, oh my gosh, here we go. My logic in this is your insurance rep is more important than your attorney. Here's why. You can always change attorneys, you can always maybe go back and file appeal. When I mean always, theoretically, you can. You can always say this attorney did a bad job, or you can always have maybe another stab at it, right, with a different judge. Insurance, if you screwed up on your insurance application and you didn't check all the right boxes, I don't think you're gonna beat the insurance company. I don't think you get a redo.

SPEAKER_04 41:47

When the claim comes in, it's done. Yeah, once that claim is in, it's what was done in the past that's gonna respond to that. It's not anything you can do in the future that's gonna change it.

SPEAKER_02 41:58

So you agree with me, right, Greg? I mean, I mean I'm not belittling attorneys, but it's too late for the insurance company. You're you're done. You're you're not gonna beat the insurance company.

SPEAKER_04 42:07

Correct. There's no appeals, there's no real changing it. Once once that claim comes in, it's what that agent did, what that insurance company did. What product did you buy for what coverage at what cost with what deductible? So it doesn't change later, where your appeal scenario with the lawyers is a little different.

SPEAKER_02 42:25

Right, but Dawn, people are so quick to change insurance agents to save a couple bucks. They're not doing it with the attorneys. They may or they may not, but with the attorneys, they say, Well, we like this attorney, we like this about that. They should do the same thought process for their insurance rep.

SPEAKER_01 42:39

Yes, because there's a lot of times that there's hours that Greg and I put in having conversations with their management team, with other board members, with the insurance representatives that they're not seeing or realizing. It's just looking at the bottom line and up, not getting there. But you know, a lot of our tips actually contain or cut down the cost that our communities are going to incur if we were not involved. So when we get involved, we can give tips on how to reduce claims, what to do in the event of a fire, what to do in the event of someone becoming injured, how to follow up fire maintenance, also water maintenance, all sorts of good tips and information.

SPEAKER_02 43:19

I think Greg's distracted now. I noticed there's something else going on there. I've known him long enough and I've watched his face across from me for five years. Greg, are you currently being just be honest? Are you is someone waving to you?

SPEAKER_04 43:32

No, no one's waving to me, but my emails and other things are up in front of me too. So I do end up getting distracted and multitasking. Oh, see, I actually I got three screens in front of me.

SPEAKER_02 43:42

Yeah, I'm the same way, but I have to not I I close my email window because there's always the one that says emergency. And like no matter what happens, I I can't I get distracted. Okay. I thought maybe like someone was waving to you because I know every day you get like I know you get like a massage every day, and I know you have a lot. Of luxurious things that happen every day, and I didn't I didn't want to break into your time with that. Okay, or your own personal masseuse. The it's a the Jarelli Basseuse. Okay. What simple system ensures fast, correct document delivery? Dawn, I don't even know what this question is about. Do you?

SPEAKER_01 44:19

Uh no, but a lot of us insurance agents are using more technologies these days than we obviously have in the past. So one of the bigger things that the technologies have evolved with is paying your bills online and also retrieving your documents, such as your policy declaration pages andor other policy information like claims history online. So a lot of agencies have set up portals where you can access either directly through the agent or you can go directly through the carrier. That tends to be the quickest because people can access a website on their phone or in the middle of the night versus the nine to five that our typical insurance agencies operate in.

SPEAKER_02 45:00

Greg, here's a prediction. I believe AI will impact attorneys before it impacts insurance representatives.

SPEAKER_04 45:11

Interesting prediction. It's impacting both right now, I would say. So it is impacting and it's something coming for the future. But um, in insurance, it's got a lot of testing and uh work to go through to get there because it makes mistakes.

SPEAKER_02 45:27

There's a lot of subtleties in insurance. There is. Like you guys are talking about your selling policies, you're promoting clients. The law is the law. So on basic legal issues, I think AI is gonna pick up that portion and be able to help people. Insurance, unless it's just basic life insurance, you weigh this, you have this. I don't see it in our industry. I think it'll affect attorneys before it affects insurance reps.

SPEAKER_04 45:51

It's very difficult in our industry. I'll give one example we had last month on a larger ice damage claim at a large association. The claim rep that was signed was newer, and he called us up because he put the 600-page offering plan into chat GPT and asked, what is the unit owner or the association responsible for? And thankfully the guy was smart enough when he got his answer back up. He picked up the phone and called us as the agent, and we helped educate him and point him in the right direction. But you're talking about somebody in a this was a smaller property claim, so you're not talking somebody with a huge salary or high up in the insurance world that was doing this. He was handling small claims and just threw the offering plan in Chat GPT and said, What's the answer? If it's spilled out the wrong answer, I mean that's that's where problems come in.

SPEAKER_01 46:39

But it's only wrong if you know it's wrong, right? So the bigger issue, and I think you pointed it out, is that people are using it. Um, luckily he caught it, but a lot of people are not. So you're gonna find that there's gonna be some fallacies in what is being automated.

SPEAKER_02 46:56

I only use it for drafts. That's it. Oh, and by the way, I don't mind sharing this with the audience. Dawn, we did a live stream and you taught me something. I do so many of these. All my chat GBT information is deleted. Not only is it deleted when I'm done with it, it's also set up. I've discovered Dawn thanks to the live stream we did. Information in Chat GBT is discoverable in lawsuits. And we had an uh intellectual, what do you what do you call it? Intellectual property attorney.

SPEAKER_01 47:24

Yes, she was an int, uh she spoke about intellectual property as well as uh copyright infringement. And she really spoke to the fact about intellectual property when you distribute it in an open AI sourcing platform, that information, obviously, as you pointed out, can be used in discovery for court cases, but it's also out there for anybody to see. So we have people who pop in legal documents, they pop in emails, private information that essentially could get out to anybody.

SPEAKER_02 47:58

So I don't ever put anything in there that's too private anyway, but I'm super paranoid. So basically, I also learned that there's a there's a there's a switch on Chat PT that you could turn that off theoretically, where it doesn't go into open AI. So, but because of that live stream, so just audience, just something to think about. Be careful what you're dumping into AI. I meant I was super paranoid anyway, but now I don't even worry about it. It's just completely deleted. Um I just there's no reason to keep it in there, you know? There's just no reason.

SPEAKER_01 48:29

Well, so AI changes a lot, but so does other information. So our underwriters use AI and also use technology like satellites when they're looking at a community. So they're gonna do an overview airily and they're gonna see that aerial view of the roofs. And if the roofs have shadows from a the part of the day that maybe the sun or there was clouds, well, the underwriter comes back and says, Greg, I'm not gonna write this risk because you told me that the roofs were replaced last year. But look at these dark patches on the roof. And as we get more automated, it's not a person making that decision. It is a robot who clicks the button, says the roof is not up to par and cancel the insurance.

SPEAKER_04 49:14

Yes, I see that all the time too. And it's it could be the morning dew on the roof and it makes it look like it's degrading and it's not. It was the timing of the photograph.

SPEAKER_02 49:23

One time, Don, I was going to a Hudson Valley event and I see this helicopter flying around and it says Girelli on the side. It's one of those big bubbles. And Greg is hanging out with binoculars, he's doing his own insurance work, flying the girl. It looked like the back copter, and Greg has like the goggles and the binoculars, and he's looking outside the helicopter and he's flying all over Hudson Valley.

SPEAKER_01 49:45

Well, then Greg's doing a great job because a broker should also be intimately familiar with the community that they're writing. So not only do Greg and I look through governing documents and tons of paper, inspection reports, sprinkler reports, all that good stuff, but we are probably looking at the maps geologically, geographically, and also realtor listings. We want to see inside those homes, are they being taken care of? And then most likely we're gonna do a walkthrough or drive-by.

SPEAKER_02 50:13

Greg, did you ever see the backcopter? Do you know what I'm talking about?

SPEAKER_04 50:16

I do know what you're talking about. You definitely go off the deep end sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 50:21

Don, do you know what it is?

SPEAKER_01 50:22

The backcopter? No, I know that in certain we call them a bird, but no.

SPEAKER_02 50:29

It's more for uh, I think a male Greg and I probably Greg's at the youngest point that would probably remember it. So it was a pretty cool, it was a very cool helicopter. And if Greg had a helicopter, I know it would be cool. He doesn't have one. I made that up.

SPEAKER_01 50:43

It's like a Tom Selic, you know, um magnum PI type of thing?

SPEAKER_02 50:47

No, absolutely not. No, the back opter was completely better, completely better. Okay, last one. Greg, two to three steps. You could do as many as you want. Should boards take immediately right now, today? What should they look for so they don't have an issue with having deals, whether it's with banks or other things, fail.

SPEAKER_04 51:15

Take care of your deferred maintenance, have your property in the best shape that it can be. Do all your preventive maintenance from cleaning your gutters, um, to straightening hallways to fixing sidewalks and fixing bumps, because basically maintaining your property is your best prevent for slip and falls to fire claims to any type of claims. So that's going to prevent things from hitting your loss runs to uh everything that's gonna help on that application when we're filling out and answering questions. So I think I hit a whole bunch of steps by just simply saying take care of all the maintenance items.

SPEAKER_01 51:54

Yeah, Greg, that's a big one because what we can insure, we need to maintain. And that's why reserve studies are extremely important for our communities to obtain. Us as insurance brokers, we do dive into them. And right now there are some affinity programs through CAI, for example, with certain insurance programs that do provide discounts on your director's and officers' liability if you work with brokers such as Greg and myself and you have reserve studies. So that's a really big help. My uh biggest takeaway for a board to prevent a deal failure is to communicate with the agent. I absolutely recommend that you meet with the insurance broker. And I'm not talking the day before the renewal or after, I'm talking about three months before, six months. You should be meeting with your agent at least twice, once to discuss and renew the insurance. But during the middle of the year, there's educational opportunities for your homeowners. Take advantage of that. Bringing the insurance agent into the mix, and that communication is so super important for a healthy relationship for your program and for the boards and the community members.

SPEAKER_02 52:59

So before we go to closing thoughts, there was one thing I wanted to mention, Don. Greg and I were on a live stream today with a live audience, and Mike, your team member, I think he kind of disagreed with Greg on something. Now, Mike knows his insurance, and Greg knows his insurance. He kind of he kind of did it the nicest way possible. Greg, did you like I don't want to say disagree? What would you say? But he kind of I because I I was more how you're opposing things.

SPEAKER_04 53:26

We were on the same page. You were asking if there should be a policy for ice damming. And basically, I didn't think there should be a policy for ice damming. And Mike was more explaining there should be a policy about insurance, though, about deductibles, when you put in claims, what you should fix on your own, and how to make sure you're keeping your insurance, um, doing the best so that your insurance isn't seeing large rate increases or cancellations. So we were saying the same things, but different ways is how I saw it.

SPEAKER_02 53:52

But it was funny, Dawn, the the way he mentioned it, like the most respectful, polite way possible. But I said, if you were there, because you're you're his boss, would he have said it the same way? It was the most respectful, kindest way.

SPEAKER_01 54:07

I think we all learn when we have some disagreement. And I also think that workers such as Greg, myself, and Mike, the only way that we get better is having competition show us what they're doing wrong, meaning that we will learn from their mistakes and be able to improve their insurance program. But the information we have, if it's not good information and you don't develop a relationship with us, you're not going to get the best opportunities that you may uh be able to.

SPEAKER_02 54:34

Mike is so knowledgeable though. I meant he really is. I meant um it's it's absolutely fantastic for people that know Mike and stuff like that and everything.

SPEAKER_01 54:42

Yes, not only can he be um he can get things out of tall, you know, tall places, but he's certainly an insurance agent.

SPEAKER_02 54:50

Don we were talking, we were talking about that during the live stream, how it's okay to comment how tall he is and he doesn't mind and everything. And then you just said that. So okay.

SPEAKER_01 54:59

Yeah, he's six foot eight. So um, and his wife is six foot two, and he has a little boy who just turned three, and I think he's about seven foot eight right now.

SPEAKER_03 55:10

No, um close to it.

SPEAKER_01 55:13

When when she sent us a sonogram, the leg was about this. I mean, it was I've never seen a leg in a sonogram that was like a full-grown man's leg, but very tall. You know, he's he's a great insurance agent. You know, there are a lot of great insurance agents out there. And the point that I think you're making is having the time to talk with us and get to know us, a lot of the culture these days, especially since the pandemic, people are looking for online shopping. Well, with community association master policies, they're just we're not there yet. And I hope we never are because of the different nuances. But it's important to have a great agent. A great agent will help you in so many different ways, and ultimately that does result in a decrease in the bottom line costs.

SPEAKER_02 55:58

I think that was great too because I'm so impressed by Mike too, because I've been around long enough that he's he's you know, he was a new agent as far as I knew him. He knew all about insurance, but I've seen he just he's so much more knowledgeable and such a a great speaker now, and he's actually been doing speaking around the country.

SPEAKER_01 56:15

Yes, he was speaker of the year in New Jersey for the CAI chapter, along with Nicole Scarrow from First Citizens Bank. They did a co-presentation on crime and cyber liability. So anytime that our you know audience can get a chance to see anybody who's on your live stream in person, please go. A lot of the people who make those events possible want you to come. And you know, it's great Greg and I are here behind the computer, but live events, you can answer questions and you know, you get to know us in our personalities. Listen, I'm not everyone's cup of tea, but at the end of the day, I know insurance.

SPEAKER_02 56:50

Why did you? I don't even know why you said that.

SPEAKER_01 56:53

But anyway, I think you know, not everybody when you're looking for an agent, you know, personality and whether you work the same is going to be important. Talk about aligning with values. We should be aligned on the same pages.

SPEAKER_02 57:05

And if you see Mike, ask them to reach something tall, and you could tell them at Dawn and I said that's a you know, just say, Hey, can you get something? I I act like you need something for insurance so you get them all excited, but then really ask them to reach for something and then tell them at dawn. And I told you to do that to him.

SPEAKER_01 57:20

I just wonder how the weather was up there.

SPEAKER_02 57:22

All right, closing, closing thoughts, Greg.

SPEAKER_04 57:26

I think we just did that. Utilize your professionals, as Dawn just said. That is what we are here for. We have lots of experience, so utilize your professionals. This was an excellent seminar. Um, I think we hit a lot of good key points.

SPEAKER_02 57:41

And yes, sorry, Greg. Did you think I was gonna say, Dawn, I think you did make insurance cool today, you and Greg.

SPEAKER_01 57:48

I hope so. But I you know what I want to leave away is I really I mentioned that checklist earlier. I want to go back to that really quick. Guys, we do this every year, every single year. Why is it that we feel like we're always chasing information? Know when your roofs were replaced. That should be the number one thing you write down. Two, when was the last time you had a reserve study? If you have it, put that aside too. Keep a package of your insurance policies, your schedules, have an independent insurance appraisal. Those items, again, every year we talk about it, shouldn't be anything new, but that tends to be our hang up. So be prepared.

SPEAKER_02 58:26

How many items are on the checklist?

SPEAKER_01 58:30

I would say financials.

SPEAKER_02 58:32

Can you do it right now? That's what I'm saying. Can you do it in like a minute? All right, so let's do it. Let's let's clearly clearly go through the checklist one by one so people hear it. That way we don't have to come back for it.

SPEAKER_01 58:43

Yeah, so essentially our agency is performing what we call an agency check-in, right? Greg, you do the same thing before we're ready to renew several months in advance. Number one thing is we're gonna ask is for any changes in the community, any projects that you are going to be complete or have you just completed. Number two, financials. We need to see your current budget, a most recent balance statement. That can be your fund balance, operating and reserves. We would also like to see if you had an independent audit. Please provide us with a copy. If you've had any changes in the board members, send us an updated board member list. I can't tell you how many times people miss the boat, and then we get a lawsuit, and someone's like, Jack, he moved away 10 years ago. But if we had a list with his phone number and email address, that often it has stayed the same. The other items that I would say would probably be your uh schedule of insurance. Has anything changed with your building values? Things like that. And then Greg and I talked a lot about updates, the roofing, those projects which I mentioned earlier in the checklist. Greg, anything you want to add to that?

SPEAKER_04 59:50

Uh the one you mentioned earlier is reserve study. If you had one done, when was it done?

SPEAKER_02 59:57

Excellent. Thank you so much. If you didn't get all that, if you email me, I'll email, I'll forward your email to Dawn or Greg, and they can maybe help you out with that checklist. Um, thank you guys. Thanks for letting me joke around with you and stuff and everything. I appreciate it. Um, you guys really do know insurance, and I think you made insurance kind of cool, and we'll work on something for for next time. All right. Thank you, guys. Excellent. Thank you. Bye, everybody. Bye bye.