Episode 34 | Jen Reise on The Biggest Challenges Facing Minnesota Cannabis Businesses

As Minnesota’s cannabis industry moves closer to a fully operational adult-use market, operators are navigating a rapidly evolving landscape of legislation, licensing, compliance, and competition. 

In this episode of The Canna Connect Show, Stephen Eigenmann sits down with Jen Reise, Founder of North Star Cannabis Consulting, to discuss the challenges and opportunities facing cannabis businesses across Minnesota. 

The conversation covers: 

• Legislative updates and proposed cannabis policy changes
• Supply chain challenges for medical and adult-use operators
• The future of cannabis events and consumption lounges
• Capital access and barriers facing small businesses
• The North Star Accelerator program and supporting emerging operators
• How dispensaries can compete in a crowded marketplace
• Craft cannabis, customer experience, and local marketing
• Federal rescheduling and the future of cannabis regulation
• Hemp legislation and what it could mean for Minnesota businesses

Jen also shares her perspective on where Minnesota's cannabis market is headed as more licenses are awarded, more dispensaries open, and competition increases. 

One of the biggest themes throughout this episode is that success in cannabis won't simply come from having a license, it will come from building strong businesses, creating exceptional customer experiences, and adapting to a market that is changing faster than ever.

Sign-up for Jen's newsletter: https://northstarcannabis.beehiiv.com/

Chapter Markers
00:00 Intro & Cannabis Industry Disclaimer
01:13 Minnesota Legislative Session Update & Cannabis Priorities
02:02 Event Licenses: Adoption Challenges & Future Opportunities
03:05 Public Consumption, Event Licensing & Consumption Lounges
04:10 Medical vs Adult-Use Supply Chains Explained
05:08 Why Unifying the Supply Chain Matters for Small Operators
06:32 Vireo, GTI & the Challenges of Medical Market Reform
07:05 Federal Rescheduling, DEA Hearings & What Comes Next
08:14 Rescheduling vs Descheduling: The Future of Cannabis Policy
09:17 Hemp, Marijuana & Why Cannabis Needs One Definition
10:34 Launching a Minnesota THC Beverage Brand
11:30 Jen Reise's Journey from Attorney to Cannabis Consultant
12:45 Building North Star Cannabis Consulting & Industry Education
13:15 Inside the North Star Accelerator Program
15:05 Opening a Dispensary Is Just the Beginning
15:40 Will Minnesota Have Too Many Dispensaries?
23:00 Consumer Education & Supporting Local Cannabis Businesses
27:24 How Small Cannabis Operators Can Compete and Win
30:00 Social Equity, Capital Access & Industry Challenges
35:00 The Future of Hemp Beverages & the Federal Hemp Debate

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

The thoughts, views, and opinions expressed on the CannaConnect show belong solely to the individuals and do not reflect those of Canaconnect and its affiliates, sponsors, or partners. CannaConnect does not promote or facilitate any activity that violates state or federal regulations. Everything you hear here is strictly for educational and entertainment purposes. It is not legal advice. It is not financial guidance, and it's definitely not medical direction. Seriously, don't take our word for it. Even if someone on the mic sounds like they know what they're talking about, and they're probably crazy smart too. Regardless of how legit our guests may be, you should always do your own homework, consult with your attorney, and understand the risk you're taking before you do anything when it comes to cannabis. Our intention is to keep it real. If you've got a problem with anything we've said, take us to court.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Welcome back to the Canon Connect Show. I'm your host, Stephen Eigenman, and today we are sitting with Jen Riza, North Star Cannabis Consulting. Jen, thank you so much for coming on the show today. I'm excited to talk to you about licensing, the accelerator program, legislation, rescheduling, descheduling, and anything else that comes up on the show. Low potency have that of us?

SPEAKER_03 1:05

You got it.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

We'll be right back. We're getting close to the end of the session.

SPEAKER_03 1:13

Well, that's the thing. There's a week and a half left in the legislature, and so it's crunch time. Now, of course, that's when the legislature does their best work. Right. Maybe like we cannabis uh folks, we tend to be ADHD folks who work under pressure now.

SPEAKER_01 1:25

Um I mean they have a lot. There's a ton to work through in Minnesota this year.

SPEAKER_03 1:29

There is. And so I don't think that cannabis is the number one focus of the legislature as a whole in the way that it was, you know, three years ago, two years ago.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:37

Um my hope is that we'll get an omnibus bill passed that includes a couple of important fixes.

SPEAKER_02 1:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:43

Uh OCM put forward some fixes that they want to see, including streamlining the event license, which I think would be a good um move forward. And then we could go deeper on the streamlining uh unification proposal for the medical and adult use supply chains if you want to. That's a that's a big piece that has been on the table this year. People have been having a lot of conversations about it. Sure. I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

I'd be curious to hear your perspective. I mean, I I I'm a little surprised at how few event licenses have been pulled so far in Minnesota. I know Strange of the Earth uh pulled an event license for their 418, 420 weekend party. And obviously there was Legacy Cup in September last year.

SPEAKER_03 2:23

And then the Growers Ball has one coming up in September.

SPEAKER_01 2:25

Coming June June 19th, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:28

So I'm excited for Kayla Fearing to take that event to the next level.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

Yeah, absolutely. She reached out recently. I think we're gonna do some promotion and and Luke wants to uh go to the event, so maybe we'll have some representation there. But uh Good, good but three in eight months is not much to write home about. So the event license is underutilized, maybe potentially from from maybe what the OCM thought adoption would be like. You know, license of bit licenses have been live by the time this episode fully airs, it'll they'll have been live for a year.

SPEAKER_03 2:58

That's true. It's true. No, I agree. We haven't seen a lot of event licenses. The good news here though is we've done a lot of smoke and weed.

SPEAKER_02 3:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:06

Right. And so when we think about what kind of event requires an event license, I try to guide folks as it's a big event.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:15

Any event where you're selling commerce licensed, but not just any event where you're smoking weed of eight people.

SPEAKER_01 3:21

No. Right? Right.

SPEAKER_03 3:22

And so uh I think the fact that we have public consumption in Minnesota is is an important thing that we need to be willing to stand up for.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:32

Uh one of my hosts to the legislature next year is the we'll take another run at getting a consumption lounge license so that we can smoke together indoors. Um, patients, visitors, and recreational users all deserve a safe and warm place to smoke.

SPEAKER_02 3:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:49

Um and we don't have any way to do that without getting a legislative exemption to the Clean Air Act.

SPEAKER_02 3:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:56

In Minnesota. Right. So we need our allies in the legislature, including Representative Jess Hansen, who is totally excited to try to figure out the consumption lounge piece. Okay. Um, to we need to we need to solve that.

SPEAKER_01 4:07

Maybe absolutely. That's great to look forward to. The bifurcation of the supply chain, medical cannabis versus adult use cannabis. Just in the last couple weeks, there was some large news from Washington that Schedule three was uh sorry, that rescheduling for medical marijuana was was moving forward. And uh great opportunity for Virio and great opportunity for Green Thumb Industries, but those are our only two uh 100% medical uh cannabis businesses here in Minnesota. There are some dispensaries now that are that, and I'm my my language is not as crisp as yours, but are able to sell medical cannabis through their shop. So they have a medical cannabis option and they have an adult use option. What would the potential addition to the omnibus bill do for this dual supply chain that we have? What are the benefits to passing this bill from your perspective?

SPEAKER_03 5:07

Yes, yes. So the reason that we that patient advocates and others sort of talking about unifying the supply chain is because we want to make it possible for small operators to participate in the medical market. Right. And it's been really prohibitively expensive because of the separate supply chain. You've got to grow the medical weeb separately, it's in its own metric, and then you know, sell it separately as medical product. And um, and that's that's prohibitively expensive um for most of the small players that that we're excited to support.

SPEAKER_01 5:38

All the things that come with setting up your own cultivation, having to have two, two of them.

SPEAKER_03 5:44

Mm-hmm. Yeah, separate rooms, even, right? Well yeah, not even separate plants, but separate rooms. Okay. I heard of one outdoor cultivator who was um instructed that they needed to build a fence between the adult use and the medical uh plants, which is just ridiculous. Okay, so so unifying the supply chain, the idea is it would make it easier for other folks who have a retail license generally to sell both adult use and medical. Um that has, from a legislative or a law perspective, big ramifications because of how our licenses are structured. You have to restructure the the med combo license, which is what our our two uh legacy uh operators have done under Vireo and and GTI.

SPEAKER_02 6:30

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 6:31

And so um so it's become this really quite complicated proposal that none of the players, including Virio and GTI, are very excited about. Sometimes that's evidence of a good compromise.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm not leaving until no one is happy.

SPEAKER_03 6:48

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

Um That's the OCR's new tagline, actually.

SPEAKER_03 6:54

Oh, that's a that's a funny tagline. Just kidding. Um, send that over to Eric Cowboy, see what he thinks of that.

SPEAKER_01 6:59

New LinkedIn connection for me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 7:01

Nice. Nice. Yeah. Um I don't I don't know if unification is going to pass this year. And I do think that the reset that the surprise rescheduling bifurcation maybe threw a little bit of a wrench in that. Because what we're seeing from the uh from the federal government is if you're just in medical, then boom, you're in schedule three. Um, whereas we adult youth do have a path forward on rescheduling, but it's more uncertain, it's gonna take more time. Uh, we can get into that more later if you want to.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

Yeah. Um June 29th, June 29th is the DEA hearings.

SPEAKER_03 7:38

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 7:39

ALJ is administrative.

SPEAKER_03 7:41

Administrative law judge.

SPEAKER_01 7:42

Administrative law judge.

SPEAKER_03 7:44

Yes, yes. So these these big administrative proceedings move forward through um through a hearing process, and then administrative law judge will make an order after that hearing process. It's slow, it's cumbersome, but at least it's moving. Right.

SPEAKER_01 8:03

Yeah. I mean, uh the opportunity to continue to reschedule cannabis all the way down to zero or five would be fantastic.

SPEAKER_03 8:14

Yeah. I want to see it unscheduled. Yes. Like alcohol. Yes. Alcohol is not scheduled, folks. Yes. Right. And it's it's regulated. We would check IDs, we test and label, um, but we we don't submit it to the to the Controlled Substances Act.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Right. The episode that came out today, if you're watching live with Elizabeth Sage, I touch on uh Tanner's Substack that he dropped a couple weeks ago. And I believe that's what he was getting at. And and then if you talk about or the panel that you hosted with John Helper talking about the the difficulties for a brewery to produce THC seltzers and beer, it gets really challenging no matter which door you open with what's available currently as potential outcomes with the hemp band.

SPEAKER_03 9:04

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

So I'm absolutely in favor of that as well. And uh then it would just come more down to okay, what dose are you looking for? And that would maybe depend on that would dictate where you're able to find the product. But that it's that we're just talking about cannabis. We're not talking about hemp and then THC and then marijuana, because they're Minnesota's guilty of this as well, as you know from the way HF 100 was passed, where there's cannabis, there's marijuana, there's hemp, and not picking on Minnesota, what the country needs is one word and as little uh scheduling on it as possible. Cannabis. Marijuana is a racist term, hemp is a four-letter word, and it's it's been manipulated. Um not as badly here as it is in Wisconsin, for example. But that's I I I take your same stance. I I would love for it to be on the same playing field as alcohol, and there's you know, maybe places that you can get really strong alcohol, and then there's maybe places at like your local brewery or coffee shop where you can get light alcohol.

SPEAKER_03 10:14

We're what we're the only state that still has three two beer, I think.

SPEAKER_01 10:19

And I remember a brand launched and they they had 3.2 milligrams. That was their selling point in their seltzer. Obviously that was gimmicky, but they it was a brewery mindset. Hey, this is similar to NA beer. And if we wanted to talk about hemp beverages, we could talk about hemp beverages the whole time.

SPEAKER_03 10:38

But let's talk about on that note.

SPEAKER_01 10:42

Um brewed locally at at Earl Giles uh distillery.

SPEAKER_03 10:46

Yes, I really enjoyed this. I appreciate the sample that you've got to go.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

Uh we we enjoy it too. Um this is our first product that's going out into distribution. And so we're gonna be able, you're gonna be able to find this product in Brainerd, you're gonna be able to find this product in Mankato, Rochester, Minneapolis, St. Paul. So many of my friends are they they see me come out with a product, they're like, where can I buy it? It's like modest, Earl Giles, back channel. Like you can only get it where it's made this time around. You're gonna see more adoption across the state with with stores. So wonderful.

SPEAKER_03 11:19

Congratulations.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

Thank you, thank you. And maybe even maybe even a follow-up to the Green Standard coming later this summer.

SPEAKER_03 11:25

Oh, all right. Yeah, I'm thinking of fun names. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:29

Um, let's talk about the role that you play in Minnesota Cannabis. I will never forget I met you at Modest Brewing, spring of 2023. For all I know, it could have been three years ago to this date. You know, we let's say it was. Let's say it was. So, so in the last three years, but probably more so in the last six months, like how have you enjoyed your role? What do you see your role and and where is your time spent?

SPEAKER_03 11:56

Yeah. So I you know that I'm trained as an attorney. I've been an attorney in Minnesota for 18 years. I graduated law school at Valedictorian, but I left the practice of law last January to go out on my own and start what I call North Star Cannabis Consulting. And I really think of myself as a consultant and a commentator in this industry. I'm super excited to be, I hope, a trusted source of information through my newsletter, which is SPRI. Uh, I have more than 1,300 subscribers that are excited to open that every two weeks for uh compliance updates, which everybody needs so hard to stay on top of this stuff, um, as well as analysis, what do all these pieces mean together, and then upcoming events so that everybody can uh can have a source of information. Uh, you also write an excellent newsletter. So I uh there's certainly room for other newsletters in this in this world.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

Oh, there's there's so much room.

SPEAKER_03 12:51

Yes, I have written that newsletter every two weeks for almost three years, I think.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:58

Um that's right. That's been a lot, a lot of newsletters, a lot of words. Um and so pleased to be a trusted source of information to folks.

SPEAKER_02 13:06

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 13:07

Then what I'm spending a lot of my time on right now, I do do some one-on-one consulting. But what really has my heart is the North Star Accelerator Program, which I launched um almost a year ago now.

SPEAKER_02 13:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 13:18

Uh, and is um at its core a membership program. So helping uh businesses who move through the licensing process and open compliant and successful businesses. Yeah. And so I'm proud to say that I now have six dispensaries and three cultivations that are all the way through to licensed and open and selling flour if they're dispensaries, um, and others who are still working through that process. As a group, we've accomplished a lot.

SPEAKER_02 13:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:48

Because one of, I think one of the fundamental insights that led me to start the accelerator program is how do small businesses win in this really complicated industry. We got to win together. And there are lots of groups of people that are working together around this industry. Um, like the Rise and Grind group on Tuesday, they've really helped each other a lot as well. Um and there are others, the Minnesota Canabus Networking Group on Facebook.

SPEAKER_02 14:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:13

So, so my accelerator was an attempt to come up with a light consulting model that gave people quality information and a place to ask their questions so that they can move quickly forward to be able to open in this really difficult industry.

SPEAKER_01 14:29

Right.

SPEAKER_03 14:30

And I'm really proud of what we have accomplished together.

SPEAKER_01 14:33

Yeah. You're in your second cohort.

SPEAKER_03 14:36

Um, I've brought people in as two cohorts, but they have what we functioned as one group because everybody's kind of on their own timelines. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:46

And so are there folks that are open that are still attending the North Sartre? Very much so. Wow. Yes, yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:53

Because I think our next phase is going to be now we're open. That's just the beginning. That's just the beginning of the puzzle. Getting through this complicated murkiness of getting to open. Now we need to succeed in light of a wave of big money coming into Minnesota.

SPEAKER_01 15:13

Okay, so and we thought about getting your license, which was a a chunk of of your your time, but like helping folks with their application. That was a big deal. And then phase two, getting open, but yet there's another door.

SPEAKER_03 15:31

Oh face. Oh, it's another yeah. So some of the next challenges that I see facing the industry um are what do we do when there are too many dispensaries in Minnesota? That's gonna happen really soon. It hasn't happened yet. We've got about 120 minute right now, but soon there are going to be too many dispensaries. And so as we see How soon?

SPEAKER_01 15:52

Soon's a four-letter word.

SPEAKER_03 15:55

I think by this fall, it's going to feel extremely different. By this fall, consumers are gonna have a lot of choices about where they buy. Um brand. They're not gonna be paying $72 an eighth like I did recently. It's a lot of money, especially if you're a home grower, you're like, oh my God, there is not very much in this little tiny package, you guys.

SPEAKER_02 16:17

Right.

SPEAKER_03 16:18

But you know, I want to see what's out on the market. Um also this fall, we're gonna have a lot of choice in cultivators finally being able to harvest and share. And so that's a phase that I'm really excited about. Right now, um my accelerator members and others, basically everybody who's open is selling sort of the same lineup of products if they can get them. Um, tribal flower, and there are a couple non-tribal operators that have come online.

SPEAKER_01 16:48

Probably more than a half dozen now, but but there's a couple standouts. We'll leave brands aside for throughout this conversation. But I really like that the accelerator program is serving folks across the phases that they're that they're in. Whether they were early, um first first couple members of your program and now open. But I think that point is well taken that there are still lots lots of twists and turns and and the the the program is changing and it will always change. Like Michigan, for example, with I mean, that's a tax thing, but man, I mean, just to add a tax, you know, six years into the program, I mean that that you didn't you didn't have that in your business plan.

SPEAKER_03 17:33

Yeah, well, and we're all wandering through this industry. What's gonna happen with rescheduling? Sure. What happens if and when hemp becomes illegal in November? Right. Um I don't know those answers. Yeah. I can't like write a book and give it to you. Yeah, but instead, I can work hard to stay on top of this, listen, respond to those needs, and meet with you every week. Yeah um I sort of think of this process as like we're all trying to cross a river, right? And so I'm building a raft. Okay, who wants to come with me? Let's build a raft, get a log, let's do this together. Some people are bringing a yacht, whatever. Some people are doing their own thing. Some people are like, I don't even have a log, I'm gonna swim. Okay, that's okay, right? But who who wants who wants to be on my raft? We're gonna figure this out together.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

I love that. That's it's a good analogy. It's a good analogy. Um, spectrum-wise, perspective on how prepared Minnesota's operator class is, you know, really right now. I think I think you've sort of touched on it there with swimming to yacht and the raft being the middle where you're you're finding, you know, your people. Like you're really providing a great service to to your cohortees to members, members, because it is really a membership program.

SPEAKER_03 18:57

I don't make people some kind of big promise, like some of the consultants pay me a great deal of money and I will get you here. Instead, I have people pay me a week. They pay me $100 a week to be part of the membership. Yeah. Um, I ask them for a four-week minimum, and then if it's not working, they can they can move on. They can find their own path across the road. That's okay. Right. Um, I also think what I have designed is trying to make it possible for folks who are doing mostly DIY. But full DIY is really, really hard because you have more questions like about what the OCM is going to accept in your final plans of record, for example. Um, and you can't just email OCM all the time. People complain, I see, on the Facebook groups, like, oh, OCM doesn't email me back. Right. That's not actually not their not their role or how their stat. I'm sorry. I'm sorry that they're not there for you, but that's not like um, and so instead I've created a place where people can come in, get their questions answered, and move on. Answered either by me or by my network.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

Right.

SPEAKER_03 19:57

Because part of what I'm doing is bringing people in and connecting them with my members who they need. Like Mark Waller, who's an incredible cannabis accountant, was on just yesterday.

SPEAKER_01 20:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:07

Talking about rescheduling and what do we as adult use operators, what should we know and what should we do now? What are we keeping our eye on?

SPEAKER_01 20:16

Um Mark's been following this for a number of years.

SPEAKER_03 20:20

Oh, yes, because he's been supporting folks outside of Minnesota. He's a Minnesotan, yeah, but he's been supporting folks outside Minnesota for years. Um, and so to get that kind of just quick 20-minute update from a qualified accountant, be able to ask them questions and also consider whether that's the person you would want to hire or you want someone else, that's super valuable. Yeah. We have done that again and again. We had a wholesale distributor come in, talk about their business model. Okay. Um we've had uh OCM come in and talk about the inspection process. And speaking of like OCM does want to support small operators, but they can't support them all on a one-to-one basis. Right. Instead, they want to know what sorts of questions small operators are having or what sorts of barriers. And so that's something that I can do as well is try to like collate those questions, come up with possible solutions that are within OCM's power, and then try to like pitch that to them in a way that that you know makes sense for them.

SPEAKER_02 21:24

Right.

SPEAKER_03 21:24

And the same for the legislature. Yeah. Together, we have enough power so that I can be on the Sotokan legislative committee talking about what should we ask the legislature for legislature for? What do small operators need? Uh onesies, twosies, none of us have time to go talk to the legislature.

SPEAKER_01 21:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 21:44

And so uh the accelerator operates as, you know, less than a co op, but more than a meeting. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:54

Yeah. And, you know, it's especially if you've gotten to the place where you're cat where you're you're open. And you're selling $52 eights or $64 eights, like you might have $100 a week to to stay abreast and to be able to have that touch point with Jen to ask questions and also be around other folks, right? Because I think so much of this is important. Like the supply and demand right now, there's not a there's not a traditional uh apex technologies platform where folks are buying and selling. There's it's phone calls and and Instagram and and network.

SPEAKER_03 22:32

And who you know.

SPEAKER_01 22:32

That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_03 22:33

Exactly. Right, right. And so I can bring minor work to bear in in helping folks find win-wins. I'm all I'm all about trying to find those win-wins.

SPEAKER_01 22:42

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 22:43

Proud to say the accelerator has helped us do that and do that in a way that people can open expeditiously and keep moving.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Good, good. Well, I'm I'm glad that you've found a great service that you can provide that's that's working.

SPEAKER_03 22:56

Thank you. Yeah, so I think I think the next phase is helping the consumer understand that they have a choice in the dispensaries that they go to.

SPEAKER_02 23:05

Sure.

SPEAKER_03 23:05

Most of the dispensaries that are open now are small operators, not all of them, right? But many of them. I looked at the Star Tribune list again last night. Um, and of course, we've got the tribal folks and we've got the two medical operators now into adult use, but most of the rest are one location folks who have been trying to figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 23:28

Most of them are one-offs.

SPEAKER_03 23:29

That's not going to be true very much longer. We have not seen very many of the big retail or the big mesos um open in Minnesota yet. They are, they are just about to come in and flood the market. We've also got big cultivation facilities that are coming online that are built with big money that's about to come in. And so we need to be ready for the next phase, which is to win the heart of the customer for our small business.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:57

And it make them excited to come back and try the craft cannabis that we are going to be able to sell them soon.

SPEAKER_02 24:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 24:05

We are going to have much more quality, small batch, interesting craft cannabis to sell them as soon as the fall, maybe sooner. Uh, and I hope that uh we can educate the consumer such that they're excited to go on that ride.

SPEAKER_01 24:22

I think the best way or the easiest way to to win the hearts of the consumer is if you're growing in Lacrescent, to be selling in Lacrescent as an example. Hyperlocal in your marketing strategy and in your partner supply chain strategy so that it's less of a story that you have to convince someone. I get all my gas at the same gas station because it's six blocks from my house and if I need gas, I'm probably six blocks from my house. So um I'm I use that as an example to say like it's it's easier to convince someone to buy something when it's local. So we if we're talking about microbusinesses or 5,000 square feet canopies are smaller, it's a lot of weed to some, but to other states it's it's a very small canopy size. So what so depending on how you're looking to develop your brand, are you looking to be in all four corners of the state with your pre-roll brand? Or does your supply that you have available work within a corner of the market or a s a segment of the market? And keeping the flour as close to where it's grown will allow for brand adoption to be stronger because the folks that live in Plymouth go to loose line brewing. And I think we have to keep in mind the the the way that craft breweries gained uh adoption and fanfare, it was because that brewery was in your backyard and and that brewery meant something to you or you you appreciated the service they provide. The coffee that I primarily buy is is located fairly close to my house. The shops that I buy hot coffee at, not that I buy beans from or right, I go to the I get my beans at the grocery store. But I I think that is just common wisdom when it comes to marketing, because you're not going to have the same competitive advantages when it comes to the larger licenses that are that you're referring to that are coming. And I will say though, if we're looking at the spectrum of large MSOs to microcultivators, uh the largest MSOs, GTI aside, are not paying attention to the Minnesota market. So there is a considerable amount in the middle from the 34 to the 68%, right, within the sign curve, you know, generally speaking. So I I I hear you, but everything is relative. And Minnesota designed in some ways to keep the cure the cure leaves and the true leaves out of the market so that they so that the smaller micro businesses weren't squashed from the onset.

SPEAKER_03 27:19

I'd agree with that. I think another way to think about your gas station example is people talk people talk about how do you how do you win a customer? You can win on location, you can win on price, not right now, you can win on quality, or you can win on experience. Right? So I think as we think about how the the smallest businesses are going to win once there is a lot of supply in the market and once there are a lot of dispensaries in the market, um I think it's going to be on customer experience and or quality. Some will have a great locations.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

Um brand story.

SPEAKER_03 28:00

Brand story, exactly. And so as I think about what the next phase of this is for my members and for others similarly situated, those are some of the things on my radar.

SPEAKER_01 28:10

Absolutely. Absolutely. No, I I totally, totally respect that. It's just the I like I'm paying attention to media companies, cannabis media companies larger than mine to understand the the national footprint. So I if it's not Timberwolf's content, I'm I'm tuned into the Dales report and and they they get folks from Cure Leaf, True Leaf, Fund Cana, the MS, the MSO supporting uh the MSO, which I have, I've never shopped at an MSO, but I'm we I'm aware of I'm aware that in Florida, for example, I'm aware in these markets outside of Minnesota that they absolutely dominate.

SPEAKER_03 28:57

That's right. Well, I've done a lot of traveling and shopping at dispensaries in other states. So I there are I think as a consumer, it's easier to shop at an MSO because you know what you're gonna get, right? You went into MedMen in California, say five years ago. That's true. It's a beautiful big store.

SPEAKER_01 29:14

Um I have shopped there. That's true.

SPEAKER_03 29:17

Do you remember what happened to Med Men? Oh, they do you remember the story of Med Men?

SPEAKER_01 29:21

Yes, they lit money on fire.

SPEAKER_03 29:23

That's right. They they took all this venture capital money and went bankrupt. Uh, they owed so much money to their suppliers, to everybody else in the California market. The venture capital lost everything. Um, and that brings us to something that we haven't talked about yet, which is, and now nobody with money is excited to invest in cannabis because they think it will be a losing proposition. And that is a huge problem for our small operators in Minnesota and our medium operators in Minnesota, is that there's just no capital out there. Right. So that's one of the things that we were talking to legislators about this morning was um we we did a good job in Minnesota's social equity program and getting folks to the position where they are can set up licenses, but now that they actually need to acquire buildings and do a build out and build a successful business, that requires some capital in there. And a lot of people are stuck at that point. It's a it's a very hard moment.

SPEAKER_01 30:27

With the ticking, with a ticking time.

SPEAKER_03 30:29

That's exactly right.

SPEAKER_01 30:30

Or like with an expiration date.

SPEAKER_03 30:32

With an expiration date.

SPEAKER_01 30:33

On their on their piece of paper.

SPEAKER_03 30:34

Exactly. Exactly. So that's another thing that we're that I'm watching closely as well.

SPEAKER_01 30:39

Um Are you involved in the Flourish Investment Forum next week?

SPEAKER_03 30:44

You know, I have not been. Okay. Yeah. I'm excited to see what Angelique and Calandra do. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:49

Um I'm not either.

SPEAKER_03 30:51

It's a very important uh issue, and I know quite a few people that are speaking.

SPEAKER_01 30:55

Right.

SPEAKER_03 30:55

Um it's unfortunate that it is sh uh what what do we call that? Cheek to cheek, I guess, from a scheduling perspective with Nikan.

SPEAKER_01 31:04

It is. Um because interesting timing, I'm not quite sure, but uh there's always something going on in this market.

SPEAKER_03 31:09

I think maybe just I don't know. Yeah, but uh yeah, it's Nikan is going to be a huge event. Um Yeah, let's talk about it. Yeah. So that's next Thursday and Friday, of course, uh, May 14th to 15th. I'm on stage for in three different panels. Okay. Three different people asked me to be part of their panel. Yeah, that sounds fun. Let's see if Nikan accepts them. Nekan accepted all three of them and then scheduled them all back to back. So I'm speaking on three back-to-back panels on Friday. Um, but I'm excited to do that. I'll be talking about advising small entrepreneurs, um, about uh raising capital and um setting up getting set up for success, and also about Hemp THC.

SPEAKER_01 31:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 31:51

So yeah, yeah. So I'm excited to have those conversations with folks.

SPEAKER_01 31:54

And I'm anticipating like the the NBC uh metal tracker. It's like you and Don Raleigh for the most panel appearances uh at Nikan.

SPEAKER_03 32:03

I was thinking about bringing like different sweaters or blazers, like switching panel.

SPEAKER_01 32:07

Yeah, are they recorded?

SPEAKER_03 32:09

You know, I don't know the answer to that.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

Yeah, I'm possibly I I don't based on Nikan's usage of YouTube, I don't believe they are. Okay. You know, I think YouTube's an underrated platform for cannabis media. I think we're addicted to Instagram, we forget about Facebook, we're legal on LinkedIn, and then I go to tag some of our partners in YouTube videos and they have 11 followers on YouTube. Mm-hmm. It's like, what do you it's like it's Google, it's Google search. You know, if you do it, if if this interview rolls out and we put chapters, folks are gonna be able to literally Google each topic that we talked about, and that segment will pop up on the first page of Google. It is it is an underutilized platform in cannabis. And which is why we're we're um we're live on LinkedIn and live on Facebook. Appreciate our our watchers today. And we're holding this until June, and it'll drop in June on YouTube.

SPEAKER_03 33:05

But okay. Well, we'll see how well some of my predictions play out then. Uh I was pleased I had an interview with Racquet uh last week.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

Wow. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 33:13

And she said I would just went back and read my notes from our interview a year ago.

SPEAKER_01 33:17

That was a great piece.

SPEAKER_03 33:18

And your predictions were the best ones. And I was like, that is about the nicest thing anybody said to me for a while. Right. Because I work very hard to watch this market, to learn from other markets. You know, I've been to MJ BizCon four times, trying trying to learn from the national folks about what's gone poorly in other places, how things have played out, um, and then figure out how to guide folks in Minnesota through this really complicated story. So anyway, so I'm excited to see that racket piece.

SPEAKER_01 33:45

You have a new you have a new racket piece coming out soon, if you spoke to them potentially.

SPEAKER_03 33:49

Yes, I believe so. We had a very long conversation. I'm super interested to see what she pulls out of that.

SPEAKER_01 33:56

When it drops, we'll include that in the show notes as well as a link to your website where people can get in touch. And it's hello at North Starcannabis Consulting.com. That's my email. Yep. That's your email. Yep.

SPEAKER_03 34:05

Northstarcannabisconsulting.com is my website. That'll get folks information about the accelerator as well as to sign up for the newsletter. The newsletter. Because when I think about like people finding this in June on Google, like who knows what will have happened between now and then, as far as federal changes, rescheduling, the hemp ban, whatever. That's probably why I write a newsletter that comes out every other week at 420. Yep. Because this industry is always evolving, always pushing forward much more rapidly than any other industry that I have been involved in. Absolutely. Um, and I enjoy that, but it means we all have to stay on top of our game.

SPEAKER_01 34:42

Yeah. I I I don't think too much will change with Schedule Three. I think, I think a lot already has changed as it relates to medical marijuana. The hemp is, as we look, as we know, we're protected in Minnesota. We have our own definition of of low-dose hemp in Minnesota, but that is still problematic for breweries that produce beverages and sell it uh over state lines or distributed across state lines. It sounds unlikely that they're gonna uh that the legislation would put a uh delay in in effect, like to s to to kick the can down the road. Um do you have any predictions on where where you think we'll be in the next six months with low-dose hemp beverages or hemp as it's known?

SPEAKER_03 35:34

Yeah, yeah. You know, I I've been talking to a lot of people, some of whom are lobbying Washington, and others of whom, you know, helped write the the original 2018 farm bill and so forth. Um personally, I'm really excited about the Klobuchar Rand bill that was introduced, a week and a half ago now, something like that, um, that would uh put into the federal legislation that hemp is banned unless it's regulated within each state.

SPEAKER_02 36:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 36:04

And a state that has regulated those states can do interstate commerce with one another, which is super important, right? We know we know, as you said, that hemp will still be illegal within Minnesota after the ban goes into effect if nothing else happens. But that's not really enough to keep the industry that folks have built here alive. Right. Um and so a more formal uh states can opt in kind of federal position would not be as good as what we have now, but would uh would go a long way to preserving what we have now.

SPEAKER_01 36:44

I think both Amy Klobuchar and uh Rand Paul uh are well versed in in this category of of cannabis.

SPEAKER_03 36:56

And I'm glad to see Clobichar showing leadership on this. Um Minnesota is the national leader in hemp THC. I'm so proud of what we have done both that our entrepreneurs have done from a manufacturing perspective, creating safe products that consumers love and shipping them around the United States. Yeah. And I'm proud of what we've done from a legislative perspective, that we've come up with a medium level of regulation for hemp that includes, you know, testing, labeling, uh uh, age gating, without it being the totally crushing over-the-top regulation that is imposed on the adult use industry because we're federally legal under Schedule One. Yeah. We, as we said earlier, right, I would love to see, you know, this is thinking big picture, a one-plant solution from a regulatory standpoint where we regulate everything to a medium amount.

SPEAKER_01 37:48

Yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_03 37:50

Uh, get rid of the 280e taxes, allow us access to regular banking and capital access and get rid of this crazy over-the-top metric. Um cannabis doesn't need to be regulated like plutonium. And it's time to it's time to end that chapter and move forward together. Uh, I'm preaching the choir. I know. I know that you're on board there.

SPEAKER_01 38:19

Well, we're not the it's not just you and I that watch this.

SPEAKER_02 38:23

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 38:24

That's the good thing. These cameras are on. Um, last bit, um, if they're watching this live, check Jen out at Nekan. If you're watching this on YouTube, I'm sure you'll be at Canacon as well in some form. And uh if you're if you're an operator and you're still have questions, the North Star Accelerator program is a great option. And I highly encourage you to get in touch with Jen.

SPEAKER_03 38:48

Thank you. I appreciate it. Yes, I believe we can help folks um avoid mistakes. We don't all have to make the same mistakes and ultimately save money by being able to choose the right providers the first time and to move expeditiously to Open.

SPEAKER_01 39:03

Yeah, absolutely. Thank you for coming on the show.

SPEAKER_03 39:05

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 39:06

Absolutely. That's Jen Risa on the Can of Connect Show. We'll see you next time.