Mile 20 Mindset Podcast Episode 016 - Featuring Selama Masekela

Introduction: In the latest episode of the Mile 20 Mindset podcast, host Allen Maldonado speaks with Selema Masekela, a multi-talented personality known for his work in sports broadcasting, acting, and social activism. They dive deep into Masekela's unique journey as a runner, exploring the transformative power of running and the importance of embracing all aspects of life.

Main Content:

The Beginning of a Running Journey  
Selema shares that his first running experience dates back to his childhood in Staten Island, New York, where his mother encouraged him to participate in a 3K race at Clovelakes Park. "I just remembered how much I enjoyed running at 12 years old," he recalls. With a family that valued outdoor activities, Masekela found himself gravitating towards running, rock climbing, and other outdoor sports, defying the stereotypes often associated with them. This foundational experience shaped his relationship with running, leading him to appreciate the connection with nature and physical challenge.

The Joy of Running  
Masekela describes running as a form of meditation, a way to connect with oneself and the environment. He notes, "There's a piece in being able to play with nature. I think there's a healing and a meditation that takes place in doing difficult things outside." This perspective resonates with many runners who find solace and clarity in the rhythm of their feet on the pavement, especially during long-distance races. Both he and Allen share how marathons create a unique communal energy, where strangers cheer for one another, fostering a sense of camaraderie and shared purpose.

The Marathon Experience  
Selema's first marathon was the New York City Marathon in 2009, which he decided to run to raise funds for his foundation, STOPE, aimed at mentoring black and brown kids in outdoor sports. He admits that his training was not extensive, with his longest run being only 18 miles. "I was feeling like, I got this," he reflects, unaware of the challenges that awaited him. Masekela’s experience illustrates a crucial lesson: the need for adequate preparation and the understanding that the marathon is as much a mental challenge as it is physical.

The Wall at Mile 20  
Every marathon runner knows about the infamous "wall" that often hits around mile 20. Masekela recalls his experience running the Queensboro Bridge, noting, "When you're on that bridge in a car, you don't think that it's a mountain... but when you're running, it's a different story." This moment of struggle can be a turning point in a race, testing the runner's resolve and pushing them to dig deeper. Selema acknowledges the importance of this experience, suggesting that it teaches resilience and the power of perseverance.

Conclusion:  
Selema Masekela's journey as a runner is a powerful reminder of the importance of embracing challenges and connecting with others through shared experiences. His story highlights the healing power of nature, the joy found in running, and the strength that comes from community support. For those considering running their first marathon, his experiences serve as both inspiration and a practical guide to the emotional and physical journey ahead. Remember, it's not just about crossing the finish line; it's about the journey and the lessons learned along the way.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:04

Hey, what's up? It is your boy, Alan Mal Donado, host of Mal20 Mindset. This is the running podcast for running enthusiasts, elite runners, and those that love supporting the runners in their life. I got an incredible guest, uh, a multi-talented personality, um, known for sports broadcasting for over 13 years, hosting X games, um, acting. Uh, I shared the screen with him uh on my show, Sneakerheads on Netflix. Y'all go ahead and check that out. Um, music, fashion, social activism, uh, Emmy nominated producer. Man, welcome to the show. Salima Master Killer. What's up, brother? How you doing, man?

SPEAKER_00 0:46

Ah, big Al. I am I am very, very well, brother. I am uh I'm well in the wild world. Man, talk about it. Let's keep it a buck.

SPEAKER_03 1:00

Man, talk about it, man. So let's get right into it as far as uh you you are you have done a lot of things. I've watched your surfing videos, your skiing videos, uh, just you being active is just beautiful as, you know, just to keep it a buck. I remember being very active and, you know, doing all of these, you know, so-called white sports as a kid and always being teased. Like, man, why you out there running? Why you out there rock climbing? And right, and like uh I love how you embrace all of those things and never, never had allowed any sort of boxing, you people boxing you in as far as what you were able to do active-wise. Um, I grew up a Boy Scout, so I just was doing this stuff as a kid, and I didn't even know the difference between the two, um, which led me to running. And I'm curious on how did you begin your running journey as you've you've know you've mastered all of these other activities?

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Well, first of all, man, I appreciate that. You know, like you you said something really key about the box. And my life motto is there is no box. And I'm really lucky that I was raised by parents who really understood like the infinite ability for us and how we get to show up in our blackness.

SPEAKER_03 2:31

Right.

SPEAKER_00 2:32

I mean, my father was a political exile from South Africa, my mother was from Haiti, like you know, they they they came here trying to take full advantage, and they were not gonna be told that the there's no. They they raised me that way. So my like it's funny because my first my my the first race I ever ran was I grew up in Staten Island in the Shaolin in New York. And my mother took me to run a um a 3K around this park called Clove Clove Lakes Park. I have a picture of it. Uh and I just remembered how much I enjoyed at 12 years old um running. And my stepfather was a runner, so I would I would run with him. And then, you know, my my family moved around a lot. So when we moved to New England for a couple of years, which was a completely like there were like two black kids in my whole school. I ended up like being cool with the cross-country kids. And I was like, oh wait, you get to go like run and jump around in the forest, like and run run trails. Like it felt like, you know, you're like it it felt adventurous. So I would just I wasn't on the team, but I would just go and run with them.

SPEAKER_01 3:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:47

Um, and that kind of began my relationship on and off with running, because when I moved to Southern California uh when I was 16, my parents moved to Carlsbad and San Diego. I discovered surfing, um, been skating a little bit and then snowboarding six months later, and those those really like took over my life. Yeah. But I think I think being like growing up in New York, but with parents who are like, you are going to be outside.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:14

We are going to explore and and and go to parks and things like that. It just made me curious. And for me, there's there is a peace in in being able to play with nature. Like I think there's a healing and a and a peace, and there's a meditation that takes place in doing difficult shit outside, like in the outdoors. Um, and as I've gotten older for some reason, um, running has now come back full circle where I'm like, yeah, I I need to sit in this like really difficult, slightly joyful meditation.

SPEAKER_03 4:53

Slightly. Yeah, no, no, I I I I completely agree. It is it is functional meditation for me. Um, and when it comes to a marathon, it's that's the that's the one time I could think for four hours straight without any interruption. Like that is that is why I love running marathons so much, is that I get to get in this deep meditation and be surrounded by loving energy. And this is what I truly love about marathon races is that you could look in the crowd and look at a complete stranger, and they could be honestly rooting and cheering you on, and you can and you can believe that. And it's yeah, it's a rare space.

SPEAKER_00 5:41

Believe, you know, in my life, I I just ran New York and I had interactions with people where I didn't say a word, but they cracked open my soul, like they were looking through and see seeing you. And you it that's a thing that no one really tells you about when you start training for, and then you get to run a marathon. It is the collective energy of those who are you're running with, who are all doing it for different reasons, yes, right? From every age and race and like varying levels of ability, right? Someone comes running by you with no arms on blades, yes, and you're like, uh yes, okay I I gotta at least finish.

SPEAKER_03 6:21

He's gonna beat me. Yeah, yeah, I gotta at least finish.

SPEAKER_00 6:24

I don't have a choice here, right? Or you know, they beat they beat cancer, or or they they lost a loved one or a child or a parent, like people are sharing their stories, and then you're in this portal of the people who are watching who have gathered to cheer you on, and they this is gonna sound woo-woo, but whatever, they form an energetic conveyor belt.

SPEAKER_03 6:49

Yes, they do.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

That's they do that propels you forward. People are like, I could never do that. I I told a friend of mine, I'm like, yeah, but you're not doing it only solely on your own power. You train under your own power, but then when you go and do the thing, you're part of this, like the depths of what you you would envision human interaction could be like all the time. You you might explode actually if you just got to experience that much joy all the time in suffering with other people.

SPEAKER_03 7:20

Yes, yes. So speaking of that, like I would I would love to know your reason on on you deciding to finally do 26.2 as you know the fanfare is there, New York is special. Um but what was your reason? Like, what made you decide? Like, you know what, I I've been running, you know, I want to do this big thing.

SPEAKER_00 7:44

I ran it in 2009.

SPEAKER_03 7:47

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:48

Uh for the first time. And that was sort of like a drop of a hat. I hadn't been running, um, but I I founded a foundation called Stoked, a mentoring organization for black and brown kids to get into the outdoors, surfing, snowboarding, and skateboarding, and then use using that um as a building block for kids to be able to figure out what kind of choices they want to make overall in life.

SPEAKER_03 8:11

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 8:13

Exposing them to shit that scares them, right? Like building this relationship with with the ocean or the mountains, which again, like you said from the start, their taught is not for them.

SPEAKER_01 8:25

Yes.

unknown 8:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 8:27

And it's not just the the idea of like, you know, the supremacy barrier, but it's also the people around you who have been fortified in this idea that this is not for us. So if I see you taking chances, um, that scares me. So now I have to call you out and get you down here with me. Um, and so we started that in 2005, um, and I had the opportunity to raise some money and I ran the to run the race. I was decently fit, but I wasn't running at the time. It broke me.

SPEAKER_03 8:59

So before we get before we get to the to the to the race and where that sort of mal 20 moment, I would love to talk about the training. Like if you say you didn't you didn't do too much of training, but what did you do prior? Like, can you please give us that insight as you know, people watching this pod is maybe interested in running their first marathon. Tell tell your story in regards to what little training did you do for this this first marathon.

SPEAKER_00 9:26

Ran. I think my longest run was 18. I shouldn't say I didn't train, I just didn't train long enough. I only trained for three months.

SPEAKER_03 9:33

Got you, got you.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

And so my longest run was 18. And I was feeling like I got this.

SPEAKER_01 9:41

Right, right, right, right, right.

SPEAKER_00 9:42

I'm in sports. I'm I'm fit.

SPEAKER_01 9:45

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:47

And um so I I was running a few times a week, but I just I didn't really appreciate how much you needed to sustain the training and build up build your body to like to deal with what comes on the what comes on the back end. The front end of running a marathon is euphoric.

SPEAKER_03 10:14

It's glorious. It's glorious, it's good, it's glorious.

SPEAKER_00 10:17

You're just like mile 16. I'll never forget that first race. Mile 16, I was like, I'm Kenyan. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Look at me. I'm out here running eight eight thirties, which was not in the game plan. Right, right, right. We're gonna finish sub-4, and I'm maybe I'm not South African, maybe I'm Kenyan, maybe this is gonna be my life. And the guy who was pacing me was like, we have to slow down. My my friend Michael, I was like, no, I just I feel amazing.

SPEAKER_03 10:54

Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so so so when was so let's go ahead and get into it. What was the mile 20 moment? Like, what was that moment in every every race, every runner goes through this? I don't care if you go, you got one or one thousand marathons under your belt, you go through it every race. Where was the wall? What what what mile was it?

SPEAKER_00 11:14

Mile 19, the Queensborough.

SPEAKER_03 11:16

Oh, so three miles later.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

The the Queensborough Bridge. Now, when you're on that bridge in a car, you don't think that it's a mountain because you're in the car. Yep. Yep. You don't realize that it's like I don't know, I think it's like 34 degrees of of incline, something like that.

SPEAKER_03 11:44

It's a mountain.

SPEAKER_00 11:45

It's steep. It's a mountain. It is a man-made mountain suspended across water, but you never knew that because you were in a car. And you hadn't just run.

SPEAKER_03 11:58

Yeah, you got your radio turned up. You took, you took, yeah, took it for granted. Took it totally for granted.

SPEAKER_00 12:04

There's something incredibly ominous about that bridge in that you just you've just come off of like people chewing for you for miles, and you're just, and then it just goes whoosh.

SPEAKER_03 12:16

It gets quiet.

SPEAKER_00 12:18

So quiet. Like, where'd the energy go? And now everyone is in the deepest recesses of a pain cave together and going through their own death struggle as you're trying to get up of this this this thing. And it hits you as if you were climbing Everest. Yeah. And what happened to me in that first race is that about, I don't know, five minutes into it, my my quadriceps started to to to spasm and cramp. Uh then my hamstrings, then my calves, then my my lower back and glutes all at the same time. It all just shut down. Like, you know, when you when you see that you when you're in the car and um the red light comes on, yeah. And you're like, but I'm I'm I'm good. It's often all of us, and then you lose the car just stops.

SPEAKER_03 13:17

Like all the one light came on and then all the lights came on. That's when you know it's all bad.

SPEAKER_00 13:21

Yeah. Yeah. Unwrap. And I lost control of my body.

SPEAKER_03 13:27

What do you mean you lost control? Like, like you could not feel anything, or did you just have to literally stop?

SPEAKER_00 13:33

I had no command. Wow. Like I was just standing there, and all of my muscles were acting independent of each other, and they were they were crying out to me to stop. Negro, why are we doing this? And if it if it wasn't for the fact that I was raising money for children, if it wasn't for the kids, yeah, it was big fuck them kids' energy. Um I wouldn't have stopped. I would have stopped. And the next 6.2 miles, I think took me almost two hours. Like an hour and a half. Wow. Yeah, I I was tracking for 340. I finished in 540.

SPEAKER_03 14:20

Wow. What a what a difference three miles can do for you. No, so so my next question is this like what did it feel like when you finally cross the finish line?

SPEAKER_00 14:34

I dropped to my knees, and I I started crying before I got across the the finish line because my my then girlfriend was in the stands. Um, they had like these stands on the left. I had I was in that the VIP thing the first time I did it, which um yeah, they I got a bib for free, etc. It was it was amazing. And then my family was in the stands. She looked at me, I was about a hundred yards out from the finish line, and I could see the horror in her face at what I look at.

SPEAKER_02 15:13

She was like, she may have been like, oh my, oh just felt you.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

Just felt like, oh my, I can't even cheer for this man right now.

SPEAKER_00 15:25

So I was like, oh, I'm in bad shape. I'm in bad shape. But I got across the finish line and I um the amount of emotion that just flooded through me was it was a a a sense of of of humility and accomplishment that I'd never seen intersect before. Like I was wholly humbled, I was good, but I was and my body was in in all of the pain, but I had never felt such a sense of accomplishment. And it opened up a window that for me the the question that was like, hey, what are you what are you really actually capable of when you when when you really invest and and mine the possibility of yourself instead of just like mailing it in or relying on natural talent? Like it just I think it really set up what the what the what the last 15 years of my life has looked like across the board when it comes to how to to to challenge yourself to continue to show up better.

SPEAKER_03 16:39

And that was my next question as far as like how did it change your life after the race? Like, what have you seen it in you know, sort of enhance or enlighten you in s other areas?

SPEAKER_00 16:50

It immediately made me invest in in fitness as a lifestyle. Like I had hobbies, but I didn't know anything about taking care of my body. And so I immediately started like looking for ways to train. I found I found a gym in a community that was built based more in like in coaching and and development. And I've been training there for like 14 years. Um and now people are like, why are you working out so hard for? Like, what are you training for? I'm like my 70s.

SPEAKER_03 17:22

Don't talk about it. Listen, I gotta answer that question all the time. What war are you trading for against myself? I want to I just want to be healthy. I want to, I want to be able to run around and and jump and do all those things at at every point of my life. Every point of my life. I just want to be able to do that. That's the battle I'm up against.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

And that's what that's what the marathon did for me. And to answer your original question, like what made me go and do the it again 16 years later, I wanted to see what the return on investment was 16 years later of that marathon changing my lifestyle. How how do I show up to do this at 54?

SPEAKER_03 18:07

Wow. And and and and please, share, how was it? How was this last uh this last race?

SPEAKER_00 18:13

It was a joy.

SPEAKER_03 18:15

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 18:15

I trained so much better. I really researched nutrition, which nobody talks about the nutrition part. No.

SPEAKER_03 18:27

No, no, they just this carbo. That's about as much as you get using carlo, carblo.

SPEAKER_00 18:34

And and so I had a much more enjoyable experience. I didn't, I didn't bonk until maybe a third into Central Park this time.

SPEAKER_04 18:46

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

Um, which is like the city.

SPEAKER_03 18:49

Well, Central Park is, yeah, I'm about to say Central Park is where everybody, I don't care where you at. That's yeah, that's where it hits. That's where it hits.

SPEAKER_00 18:57

I didn't cramp on the bridge.

unknown 18:59

Good.

SPEAKER_00 18:59

I had no cramping. Good. I didn't cramp at all through, I didn't cramp at all through the race. Um I ran out of I ran out of like good gas, I think, in Central Park. But I was able, still able to move and finish in a way that I was incredibly proud of. And I I walked to Brooklyn the next day from Manad.

SPEAKER_03 19:18

Come on.

SPEAKER_00 19:19

And and that was like, whereas I couldn't walk for a week after the first time.

SPEAKER_03 19:24

Listen, I I try to tell people, it's anybody can run a marathon if you have a strong Y. Now how you feel afterwards is all predicated on your training. It is all if if if you can like I've I've had marathons I've completed and went partying the same night, and I've had some where I've I can't, again, walk for three days, four days. Um people walking backwards down to the subway. That that will that was that was me for sure.

SPEAKER_02 19:53

Yeah, didn't step off the curve.

SPEAKER_03 19:55

The bicycle taxis, yeah, they running it up that day. They could have charged me$3,000.

SPEAKER_00 20:02

So listen. Thank God I didn't take it. Listen, listen. So my phone died, right? I wasn't running with um with with music. I was um natural sound, which I'm grateful for.

SPEAKER_03 20:16

Wow, wow.

SPEAKER_00 20:18

Yeah, which was it was just super meditative. Yes. But I was on an old phone. I was on this 14, I was boycotting getting a new phone, and my my shit died. Yeah. And I lost my buddy. And I had forgot to bring credit cards. So now I'm sitting there, no phone, no people, no, my people are gone. And I'm like, what am I doing?

SPEAKER_03 20:42

And the walk from the finish line to the it to that walk from the finish line like like that, that's the real marathon. The walk from the marriage. That's a whole nother race.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

That's a whole nother race. It's like a zombie, it's like a zombie movie.

SPEAKER_03 20:54

Yes, yeah. Everybody got their refugee, little chrome blankets on. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:00

And this everybody just, it is, it is like walking like penguins. Yeah. Yeah. Last of Us. It's bad. It's a so finally you get out to the street and people's families are welcoming them, and you're like, Where are my people at? I had my people during the race, yeah, but no one could find me. And I see one of those uh those rickshaws. And I saw the guy's like, wait, wait, wait, bro, I got you, I got you, I got you. I was like, yo, you got a charger on there? He's like, Yeah, I got you, I got you, no problem. I'm gonna give you a discount. You're good with me. Plug in, get in my thing, get in the back. I'm like, oh. I was staying on the lower east side. Bro, this dude's small talking to me, telling me about where he came from and the race, etc. We get to the hotel. I'm at the LES.

SPEAKER_03 21:45

Yeah. Oh, hey, you know, that's my spot too.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

I go, man, thank you so much, man. You saved me. And he looks me dead ass and goes, That's gonna be$330.

SPEAKER_02 21:58

Yeah. Yeah. I go, what did you say?

SPEAKER_00 22:06

And now, like, I was in I'm like, I'm gonna go to jail.

SPEAKER_01 22:12

Now you got more adrenaline. Now you did adrenaline came back. Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

I was just in the peak, like, I was in all of the joy, euphoria, and now I'm like, oh, I'm gonna kill a man. He's like, and he said, I said, you need to stop talking. Just stop talking right now. But don't talk. Just just tap my phone and stop talking. Because if you keep talking, I'm gonna hurt you.

SPEAKER_01 22:36

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:38

And he's like, I'm sorry, brother. I'm like, you're not my brother.

SPEAKER_03 22:43

Not charging me 330. You're not my brother. You can't be no relationship. Tap the phone.

SPEAKER_02 22:48

And then, you know, here's me like rimping now like to the hotel.

SPEAKER_03 22:59

And I no, I can just imagine, like, you can just imagine the biker like that just looking at you, like, this man has incredible heart. Because he just ran a bear thide. And I know if I take him there, he's gonna find this energy. He's gonna find he's gonna find this engine that's choked me out. So I'm just gonna let him go. I'm gonna let him go.

SPEAKER_00 23:17

Yeah, he let me go. He didn't say anything. Yeah, but literally, whenever he tried to talk, I was like, stop talking.

SPEAKER_03 23:23

Yeah, no, they they they they get their money's worth that day. Because I'm telling you, everybody hop on because they're not in their right mind. They are not in their right mind.

SPEAKER_00 23:35

Not in the right mind at the end of my way, shape, or form.

SPEAKER_04 23:40

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:41

I took a shower. I went and got a beer and a burger by myself. That burger and beer was the best thing I ever ate. And people were like, you know, we're going to the after party. I'm like, no, I'm going to bed.

SPEAKER_03 23:53

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm I'm soaking and going to bed. My after party is right to sleep. Yeah, no. Yeah. No, no, no. Those, those days, listen, I've had times where we ran a marathon and we did, we took 10 shots after the marathon. After after the marathon, like maniacs. Um, I don't know where I ended up that night, but but but the next thing I still have my medal. I still have my medal, all that metal.

SPEAKER_00 24:21

I miss texts from people, and and people send me videos at like 3:30, 4 in the morning. Like in it. I'm like, how? How did I'm not at that level yet? I need to train, I need to train much harder. But um, I'm running New York again this year.

SPEAKER_03 24:37

Love, love, love. Yeah, I've ran it three times, man. And I will say New York, I've ran Berlin, I've ran Chicago. Um I'm aiming, I'm running Sydney in August, and I'm aiming for Toyota, uh, not Toyota, uh, Tokyo. Um, I love this for you, man.

SPEAKER_00 24:54

I did I did not realize that you that the that the knees out has become like an entire ass life for you.

SPEAKER_03 25:01

Yeah, yeah. It's it's it's um when was your first one? Man, 2018. I ran a rinky I remember it. And bro, bro, when I tell you it was like 12 people part of this marathon, it was like 12 people about this marathon. It was not, it had no fanfare. It was like a loop. Oh, it was it was it was terrible. And by the time I got to mile 22, my foot broke. Now, I didn't know I broke my foot. This is what that's what I'm saying. And I this is my first marathon, no training. I did no training. It was one of those things I promised that I was gonna do it at this particular year, 2018, and it was December, and I didn't do it. And I'm like, I'm a big person or I don't never lie to myself. So I'm very careful on what I promised myself, but I never lied to myself. So I had to do this thing, and it was the last marathon in any, I just randomly found it. I woke up one day, my boy looked at me crazy, was like, yeah, I'm like, yo, take me to Long Beach, I'm running a marathon. He's like, what are you talking about? Like, I'm like, like, what are you talking about? We didn't trade, we that, we that, we never talked about this. Like, what I say, no, I just need to ride. I'm like, all right, I go there, Mal 22, my feet, my feet is killing me. And at that particular time, I was like, you know what? I'm just gonna leave the country. I'm just gonna leave the country. I'm gonna I'm gonna call an Uber. I'm gonna get home, book a flight, book a flight. And the people that are waiting for me at the finish line won't even notice until I'm I'm overseas. Because I couldn't live up. I couldn't live up to the idea that I couldn't finish this thing. Because it was that much pain. I'm talking again, regular life is happening around me. People are walking their kids like dogs, like the beach is full with patrons, and I'm just in the background dying. And man, no, I finished it and it changed my, it changed my life just because it was the first thing that I ever experienced in this human experience that broke me mentally. I I didn't I didn't went through so many things in life, challenges. I grew up in a very, very, very rough neighborhood. So um my life being on the line was just a daily, you know, obstacle of Mario Brothers. So I it wasn't YOLO was, you know, my teenage, you know, my teenage experience. So running a marathon and anything. It wasn't a luxury. Yeah, it wasn't. It was it was survival, and I loved, I love that level of survival, as crazy as it may sound, and which is why I guess I'm in love with running these marathons now. Um it brings a challenge to yourself that nothing I've ever done has, you know, been able to provide outside of those crazy times in the neighborhood where it's like, oh, okay, uh I I may not make it home back today, but boy, we're gonna have a good time while I'm out. Um that was sort of the the mindset. And I went in ahead and decided after that marathon that I would run four marathons in five months. Um and trained in Spain, in the desert, in Madrid. It was it was 90 degrees, it was 100 degrees some days. Like it was I was a maniac um just because I felt like I needed to be in order to beat the boogeyman that that kicked my ass uh a year earlier.

SPEAKER_00 28:33

So it's a it's a hum it's a it's a different kind of humility.

SPEAKER_03 28:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:38

It breaks breaks you down to the to the core ingredients of yourselves, like down to the mitochondria.

SPEAKER_03 28:44

And what I what I what I've learned is that it's safe, it's safe to say that you can't blame anyone else if you don't achieve your goal. And I think that is the humility of it all. Where it's like usually you could try to find an excuse or somebody to point the finger at, but when it comes to running and when it comes to marathon, you could only look at yourself and if you prepared or if you didn't. And that will determine how great of a day, race day you will have. And you can't blame no one else. And even that might not be a guarantee on no, no, no, could because every race, whether it's physical, mental, or spiritual, there's going to be an obstacle that you're gonna have to cross. Like it's some races I felt great, and then I gotta, I'm dealing with trauma from my eighth from from eight from eight the bully in eighth grade pops up, and it's like, wait a minute.

SPEAKER_00 29:37

What are you what are you doing here?

SPEAKER_03 29:39

Over this. Like, like, yeah, no.

SPEAKER_00 29:42

That's that that's so real, but you you I think you just hit it like it is a one-stop shop of of of self-care, in that yes, you're in de you're engaging in this really difficult physical endeavor, but the mental, emotional, and spiritual sort of the mix of the fuel and what comes up is it gives me chills actually, like to to just to think about like it just it it really solidifies for me that it's all yes it is. It's all connected, and there's no better way to lean into that than to m to move, but to move with intent and conviction and and find out what's really going on beyond what just looking in the mirror.

SPEAKER_03 30:33

Yeah, it's it's for me, it's the the only time you have these sort of internal conversations without distraction. And whether you whether your your phone, family, survival, a lot of times you don't you don't have the ability to even talk to yourself. And when you're running, you although you may be running from a destination, you can't run from yourself. And you're running actually towards yourself while you're running. And that is in large part while running has kind of taken over my life in a in a positive way, as far as the healing and the the mental health, the stability. Like I run two marathons a year, beginning and end to sort of always check where I'm at and what I'm not doing, what I'm ignoring. Um, and of course, all of my daily runs are sort of my daily checkup, but that marathon, that four hours is sort of a cleanse. Um, you know, I have a uh brother that is uh very heavy and doing like ayahuasca's, and I I feel that marathons is the closest thing to experiencing that sort of that that self-mort of clarification.

SPEAKER_00 31:43

Um as as as as a brother who also has um done a couple of ayahuasca journeys, I can I can confirm that yeah, that it is running is the closest thing to death.

SPEAKER_03 31:57

Wow. Wow. Okay, so one last one last question before we go on to our speed round. What would be your biggest tip to a person looking to run their first marathon?

SPEAKER_00 32:08

Get outside and run down the block and run back. And then the next day run around the block. And then the day after that, a few more blocks, and so on and so on. I think 26.2 is just like right, it's just so it's giant. But what it's made my my motto is a little bit more and a little bit better today. And if you if you take that approach, you know, as cliche as it is, you know, one step to take a thousand, um, you will find out that you are infinite in in what you're capable of.

SPEAKER_03 32:48

Man, beautifully said, brother. Beautifully said. Um all right, so we're gonna go to our last little segment, which is the knee that the knees out speed questions. Um you answer yes with knees out, and you answer no with knees in. Um all right, so do you did you ever think about quitting while training but still showed up for yourself?

SPEAKER_02 33:09

Knees all the way out, eyes out. Knees out. All right. Um, is the marathon more mental or physical? Mental.

SPEAKER_03 33:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:33

Yeah, yeah, I agree. I agree. It's far more mental.

SPEAKER_03 33:36

All right, so yeah, I I I I see you already said that you're gonna run the New York coming up. Um my next challenge, and this is what's this is I I even often ask myself this, and every time I ask someone, it's it's sort of the the urge to do it is growing. Would you ever run an ultra marriage? Yes. Okay, hey, listen, when you were you ready to do it, I'm I'm I'm down. If you do it, I'm I'm down. Whatever, I'm I'm I'm that's it. That's it. That's I want I want to do it. I want to do it.

SPEAKER_00 34:06

I want an ultra bad. Okay. Really, really, really bad. So let's let's do it. Whatever, whatever.

SPEAKER_03 34:13

Oh, true. I'm I'm down. I'm down, I'm down to do it, bro. I'm down to it.

SPEAKER_00 34:16

There's there's that Catalina one. I think it's a 50k.

SPEAKER_03 34:19

Yeah, I know. Somebody was telling me about Catalina's beautiful.

SPEAKER_00 34:22

That's that's the one I've been eyeing. Um, a couple in the Midwest, but let's build on it. I knew you were gonna say it.

SPEAKER_03 34:27

No, no, he's gonna ask people. I'm down, I'm down for Catalina. I'm dead I'm down, I'm down, I'm with it, I'm with it, I'm with it. All right, so last one. Do you think running changes a person beyond the mouths?

SPEAKER_02 34:39

Absolutely. Absolutely, knees out.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

I I I I believe that um it opens you up to all the angles of yourself that are impossible to see in the mirror. Like your running puts you in a in a in a in a prism almost, you know, where everywhere you look, you have an opportunity to find to see yourself at angles uh that are unimaginable, and you can take that into the rest of your your your life and existence. It's why people run until they can't.

SPEAKER_03 35:15

Yeah, man. No, listen, I it's uh I I got a guest coming. She's ran 163 marathons, bro. She's ran 21 ultras. Yeah. She's amazing. She's amazing. She's amazing, man. So listen, listen, that that listen, everybody, please follow and subscribe. This this concludes another incredible episode of Mal20 Mindset, man. Uh, peace and love, everybody.

SPEAKER_00 35:43

This is dope, man. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_03 35:46

Thank you, man. Thank you.