The AMPcast with Aliza Marie Prokop

Episode 12-Parenting with Grace and Truth with Paige Clingenpeel (Part 1)

• Aliza Marie Prokop • Season 1 • Episode 12

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0:00 | 27:47

The goal isn’t perfect parenting—it’s healing and a lasting relationship. Aliza welcomes Paige Clingenpeel—therapist, minister, speaker, wife, and mom—for an honest conversation about the role of forgiveness in parent–adult child relationships and how to stay connected through mistakes and hard seasons. Together, they explore how to respond with grace instead of fear as parenting shifts over time. Paige shares practical, faith-centered tools for navigating today’s realities—without letting fear dictate your decisions. If you want to parent with wisdom, grace, and intention in every season, this episode is for you!

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Hashtags: #TheAMPcast #AlizaProkop #PaigeClingenpeel #Trauma #Parenting #MentalHealth #Therapy #Counseling #Podcast #Podcasting #PodcastCommunity #PFCAudioVideo

SPEAKER_00

Good evening. We begin tonight with an issue that continues to affect millions long after the original events have passed. Trauma. Mental health experts say trauma from earlier life experiences often resurfaces years later, influencing emotional responses, physical health, and relationships. While the incidents may be in the past, the body and brain can remain in a heightened state of survival.

SPEAKER_02

I wish I could just forget about what happened to me so long ago. But these memories haunt me.

SPEAKER_03

I know it's over, but it doesn't feel over. I need help, but I'm afraid to open up about my past.

SPEAKER_04

Dealing and healing from trauma. Here now is your host, Aliza Marie Prokop.

SPEAKER_08

Welcome to the Ampcast. I'm your host, Aliza Prokop. On this podcast, we have honest conversations about trauma, healing, faith, and the journey toward wholeness. My heart is to create a space where stories are heard, truth is spoken, and listeners are reminded that healing is possible. Today I'm joined by a very special guest, Paige Klinganpeel. Paige is a licensed therapist. You have a lot of things behind your name, I just have to say. Licensed therapist, a minister, a TEDx speaker, and a passionate advocate for helping the next generation thrive. Paige has dedicated her life to equipping parents with practical tools to navigate the complex world of adolescence. You can find out more about Paige when you go to pageClingandpeel.com. Paige, welcome to the show. I'm so excited to be here. Thanks for having me. Thank you for agreeing to do this. So wow, you you need like a few more things on that list there. I know. I sound so accomplished, right? You are accomplished. You are. So tell us about yourself and what you've done and what you're now doing.

SPEAKER_06

Yeah. So I am so fortunate to be married to my husband of 20 years, and we have four kiddos. Um, I have a 20-year-old, I have an 18-year-old, those are my daughters, I have a 16-year-old and a 13-year-old. Those are my sons. So we're living our best adolescent life in our house right now. Um, my fifth child is my fur baby. His name is Bauer. He is a burnadoodle. And what was so amazing, I know he's phenomenal. He's more famous than I am. He is a therapy dog. And so when I worked in the school system locally, he uh would come with me three days a week. And he still has an Instagram page, has over 700 followers. I mean, literally, that's how I should have just introduced myself as Bauer's mom because people still know me as Bauer's mom, which is amazing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08

So that's amazing because he he could meet my dog Ted. And I'm just saying Ted has Ted is a golden retriever.

SPEAKER_05

Oh, yep, yep. They would be besties. No doubt.

SPEAKER_08

If you want to look it up. Just Ted. Yeah, just Ted. We will be following, no doubt. Well, I'll follow you too. So so you're you're in Indiana. I am uh and what are you doing these days? So you're raising all of these kids, and where are you at? What are you doing?

SPEAKER_06

So, interestingly enough, about seven years ago, I was doing uh again working in the school system as a licensed therapist. It was like my favorite job. It was amazing. Um, really enjoyed it. But I felt uh I'm a I'm a Christian, and so I felt God calling me to go into ministry full time. And so I I went over and talked to the pastor who um I had done some professional counseling alongside his family for a little bit and just decided this was my thing. And so I've been there ever since. And I do some counseling, marriage and crisis intervention, things like that within the context of the church, which is really awesome because they and what's so neat as well is the kids that I had in the high school system, they now are attending this church, bringing their own kids, and they're still coming and seeing me. And so, and they don't even have to be believers of Jesus. Like they still come because I built that equity and that relationship in high school. And so um, I still get the opportunity to do that, which is really fun. So I'm combining all the things that I love of people, relationships, Jesus, my therapy dog Bower still comes to church with me two three days a week. So yeah, it's it's been awesome. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08

And that's great that you have the background of counseling plus past being a pastor, because now you're able to do the counseling with the pastoral context that is, you know, really good for a person. It's not gonna harm them. Sometimes you see one or the other being a little dicey, but you're doing it together and that's great.

SPEAKER_06

And I'm glad you mentioned that too, because sometimes Christian counseling could have well, it depends on the clinician, right? Because when some people hear Christian counseling, they hear you're gonna get the Bible thrown at them. That is not my practicality at all. I I believe that the Bible is truth, and that's how we need to model our lives, and it gives us wisdom, it gives us encouragement, but I'm also going to address the neurochemistry. I'm also gonna address the the brain patterns of the cognitive uh dissonance that they're experiencing. I believe God made us holistically. And so we need to address all of those things. And so when they do come to me, I'm gonna give them all of that and I'm going to meet them where they're at. And so there's power in that for sure.

SPEAKER_08

And you have a background that can understand if they come to you, my forte is trauma. So sure. When I see that coming in, I'm sure you are able to deal with it probably a little better than maybe just a pastor. I don't know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06

No, I would agree. They're not trained in that. My undergrad was in ministry, and so they didn't always have the context of integrating the counseling, even though people come to the church first, usually when there's a crisis situation, as they should, because again, I believe God's the only hope for those things. But uh, having someone walk alongside you when you are in the worst season of your life that can actually uh validate and encourage and give you practical tools, it's it's life-changing for sure.

SPEAKER_08

Absolutely. So today I was thinking because parenting is your forte, right? That's your your main parenting and parenting teens and parenting younger kids. I was looking more at the empty nest. I kind of wanted to hit, well, that's okay. Yeah. And I'm coming in contact with a lot of people after their kids are grown that feel like they've messed up, that feel like, well, it's I've messed up that relationship. They're on the other side of raising kids, or you know, the kids are off to college or they're going to college and they feel like that sand in the hourglass is running out. What do I do? And I try to work with them, but I'm wondering what your perspective is because you know, it isn't over. It isn't too late. At least that's the perspective I have. What can you say to that?

SPEAKER_06

Yeah, oh, I 100% agree. I it is so it's a relationship. And I think relationships take work. What I have found to be the best uh statement that resolves a lot of that tension in relationship is just starting with forgiveness, seeking forgiveness, of just saying, like, I didn't do it well. I'm so sorry that if I had hurt you in these ways, I didn't know what I was doing as a parent. I did the best that I could do. Not again, rationalizing anything that you don't need to rationalize. Oh, no, no, no. Owning, owning the stuff and being responsible, but more of just saying, like, please just meet me where I'm at. And I'm just so sorry. And that, I mean, that resolves so much tension because the the adult children, they need to hear that validation that they weren't seen or their needs weren't met in certain ways when they're legitimate. And having a parent say that, I mean, that can reconcile so many things just in that first initial statement.

SPEAKER_08

And, you know, coming from the background of being a pastor, I always want to highlight I am not a pastor. I don't ever claim to be one. But it strikes me that one of the core issues that we see or don't see that dictates whether or not we have success, oftentimes in counseling or not success is that element of forgiveness, whether or not a person is able to forgive. And that forgiveness doesn't mean, you know, saying it was okay.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_08

It it's a decision.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08

So do you find that too? What do you think about that?

SPEAKER_06

Yeah, I mean, unforgiveness is a huge catalyst in uh creating tension and dissolving relationships. What people don't often realize is that forgiveness does not mean reconciliation. Not always. And so one of the things is I always encourage people to be mindful that if you do not flush that wound out, because that's what it is, it is a wound, it will be systemic, it will cause disease in your body, and it will manifest in certain ways. It will impact your mood, it will impact your body. Evidence now shows if you are stressed and tension in relationships cause a huge amount of stress. And that is rooted in the fact that we have to release that. And the way we talk about that as Christians is that we give justice to God. The way that we still are responsible, though, is we choose to relinquish that justice to God. That's that transition. But I think where it becomes tricky as well is like, what do you do after that relinquishing of the justice piece? Do I reconcile with this person? How do I engage in this relationship while still being wounded? Because honestly, that scar is still there. That trespass still happened. There is still consequences from whatever that individual did. But how do you move through that? And that's where it's like you're just kind of figuring it out as you go. But it has to start with forgiveness. And sometimes that's the hardest part.

SPEAKER_08

It is because so many times I think they say, Well, you don't know what they did to me, or but you don't know what was said, or but you don't understand what happened. And a lot of times that may be true. We don't know. We can't necessarily walk in that person's shoes. But I do know that it's a hook of the enemy. And I do know that if you don't forgive, that's one of the biggest, you might as well open a garage door and invite them in because that's one of the biggest things that's going to get you in the long run. I feel I've seen. That's been my experience. So all right. So we we look at focusing on youth in their years while they're at home, while they're in grade school, and then teen years. Tell me what your main focus is. What can you say to parents who have the teens? We'll start with that, and the youth. Um, we've got phones now, we've got, you know, increased drug use, increased sexual activity, all of these things are happening. What would you say to a parent now? It's different than it was when I was a teen in the 80s.

SPEAKER_06

Yeah, I I would say first off, um, yeah, it just even recognizing it is different. I know, like my husband and I, we view this differently. My husband's just like, of course you would allow your kid to ride his bike around the block. Like, why are you not allowing your child to do this? And I'm just like, well, I live in a state of fear because I know too much, you know? So this is dictating my parenting. And so, but things are different. We don't need to allow fear to dictate us, but we also, um, it's that spectrum of we don't need to become complacent either and just allow our kids to have access to just about anything. I love the line from um, I believe it's called uh Grace-Based Parenting, where he talks about you can't teach your kids to swim on the living room floor. So we have to have this element of educating our children how to live in the world because the reality is that they're exposed to this whether or not we want them to be, whether it's on the school bus, whether, I mean, it's church and Sunday school. My goodness, I had a conversation with a mama the other day. This is a homeschool child that is part of a homeschool play, like recess time. And this child was being communicated by another homeschooled child about things that they should not be aware of at the age of 12. And I'm just like, this is everywhere, you know? Yes. So we as parents have to be engaged in conversations. So the number one thing I feel is just being engaged. Our desires disconnect because we're overwhelmed, we're overstimulated in our world. So having conversations with our kids, and it doesn't have to be dictarial, it doesn't have to be like confrontational. Instead, it's taking moment by moment. So it's in the carpool line, it's it's sitting down at dinner or it's making dinner together sometimes. It's just those brief little contact points throughout the day. So you're checking in on them, you're you're teaching them through what is modeled around them. It's not again telling them that like this is right and wrong, but this is more of a this song came on the radio. What do you think about that song? I think the lyrics are kind of weird. What do you think about why they sing that? That became a teaching moment. And because you took that moment of intentionality of bringing it up, your child now has a conversation with you about that. And it becomes a discipleship moment, which is beautiful. So I would just say be conscious of touch points, um, be mindful and intentional with conversations and just engage uh with your kids because as much as they act like they don't want to engage with you, they truly do. They need to. It is biological, it is psychological, it is sociological. I mean, they need it.

SPEAKER_08

They need us in their, I think, thrive on it and they're disappointed. I can remember when my kids were young, you know, if if I didn't do the usual things the way I did them, you know, maybe one day my mother was sick and I had to go to her house for something and something Apple Cart was all upset. They were, well, aren't we gonna read the book? Aren't we gonna have the baths? Aren't we? Not tonight, guys. You know, I can remember that being kind of a monkey wrench for them. It's they probably won't remember that I do when they were very little. So, so keeping the door of communication open without being an authoritarian person that you're talking about. It's a good summary. So, okay, now I can't go past this age bracket without remembering fondly my years as a helicopter parent because that's what I did so well. I should have a thing spinning on my head. I was so afraid they were gonna get hurt. And I think I did an injustice to them at the time. You know, I can remember when they fell, I was everything. It was really noticeable, born out of love, of course. And I'm kind of glad they were raised in in the late 90s and 2000s, because today I think I'd be worse with everything. So ode to the helicopter parent. What would you let's talk to them?

SPEAKER_06

Yeah, I I think it goes back to don't allow fear to dictate your parenting. Because what ends up happening is as much as you feel like you're actually taking care of and being protective of and supporting your child, you're actually handicapping them. Yes. Because I mean, it's like you're tying one arm behind their back. They're not learning capability, they're not struggling. And we know that in order to arrive at success, you have to make tons of mistakes. So instead, what we're doing when we're helicoptering and we're protecting is we're creating a whole generation of kiddos that don't know how to struggle, don't know how to fail, don't know how to even regulate emotions because they've never had to because mom or dad have taken care of it. So we have to be mindful that is not love. We do not love our kids well if we constantly fix the problem for them. Can we um behind the scenes get uh nervous and um want to do those things? Absolutely. But on the front end um from the exterior, we have to allow our kids to make bad choices, to fail, to make mistakes so that they ultimately grow and learn from it. So yeah, definitely take a step back and maybe your partner can help you with that. I don't know if maybe your partner's involved in that and maybe not, have your friend interject with you, but just allowing you to take that step back and trust the fact that your child is actually going to be more successful when we allow them to fail in the beginning. Exactly.

SPEAKER_08

And I learned that along the way. And and I have a lot of clients that come in, and I can think of a few in particular that are afraid to to be apart from their child. I mean, it's to that extent. And I feel for them because that's that's hard, you know. Um, and then that is born from trauma. So that's where my kind of let's talk about the trauma to help not just fix the surface, we get to the root, and then maybe that kind of gets fixed in the meantime. I don't know, something for thought there. Yeah, yeah. So moving on into college years and saying, okay, you have some kiddos in college or going? I do.

SPEAKER_06

I have one in college, and then I have one that is going to the same college. Um, they're sisters, and so yeah, they're gonna be together, which will be awesome.

SPEAKER_08

Are they gonna room together too?

SPEAKER_06

Can they they're not because that would be a problem. That would be that would not be okay.

SPEAKER_08

It's not. My mother decided it was a good idea to have my brother and I rent an efficiency apartment when we went to Kent State University. Okay, how'd that work out? Um, I mean, it was okay, but now that I look back, that was that was asking a lot of him and asking a lot of me too, because we had one car and one little kitchen and one little bathroom, and it was like a hotel room. It was interesting. We did it, yeah. But yeah, you survived. You we survived. So the college years, the mistakes. We see mistakes, we know they're gonna make them, right?

SPEAKER_06

Yes, ma'am. It it's so funny that you're talking about this because not only an hour ago, I got a call from my daughter who is in college, who was talking about my other daughter who was there this past weekend. So it's I'm I'm already getting a glimpse of what this is gonna look like. I mean, the fact that they borrow quote unquote each other's clothes, like they borrow each other's friends, you know, like all of this tension. And it's it's interesting because as a parent who now is not there to help uh navigate some of these conflicts or even choices, you know, I mean, it's they have the ability to make choices that they know might be even counter to the way that I've raised them. But what I started on the front end is especially towards the end of high school, was having open conversations where there would still be consequences for things that need to be consequences, but yet the level of honesty would get uh more grace. And so my daughter is able to tell me all the choices you know they're potentially making in college. But my role now as the parent of an adult child is choosing my battles, in essence, of reminding her that maybe that wasn't smart being out at, you know, one o'clock in the morning in the middle of a campus where you know people are definitely not making good choices, just being safety-oriented instead of just listening to how she decided that wasn't necessarily a good choice and how she ultimately came to the conclusion of no, we need to probably call an Uber and head home. Yes, good work. So if I would have gone to the the front of that and be like, well, what were you doing at one o'clock in the morning, Alan? Why would you what is wrong? Exactly. Right? Like that totally could have shot her down and made her feel like I don't respect her choices. Instead, I let her speak that out until we got to the end. And then she was like, Oh, well, she made a good choice anyway. She Ubered back. Again, Uber, uh, you know, praise God that she was with like five of her friends, kind of thing. But it is, you know, we just get to that point was uh recognize what your role is as a as a parent of an adult child. It's it's different.

SPEAKER_08

And restrain yourself, I guess, when you want to say something. And I'm thinking of something, I would say, like, are you kidding me? What are you thinking? Like uh to your child. I'm not referencing your child, I'm thinking about my. I was like, what are you doing? Like, what are you doing?

SPEAKER_06

Well, I know the best part, the interesting part is that she FaceTimes me. And so I am I'm really good at um sometimes having the tone of acceptance, you know, and listening. But my face, uh, even as a counselor, like when I'm in counselor mode, I must get into my zone and I do the Botox face. Like you see nothing. Oh, really? Whereas with my I it's a it's a gift. Oh, I need that. I can't do that. The rest, yeah, the rest of my interactions with people is like you can obviously see what I am thinking. So now I'm on FaceTime trying not to show the uh judgment of her of her choices. But I'm like, this is okay. This is okay. Just look at my face, make sure my eyebrows don't go up, make sure I'm smiling, you know, all the things. But technology has added a wrench to this whole thing.

SPEAKER_08

It has, because in my case, it would be my son would uh he he never wanted to FaceTime me from his apartment. Uh, this is my youngest. God bless him. And when he did, I would be like, What's that in the background? What is that other one? Like, you know, I'm this like hawk noticing everything. And I think he learned after a while to make the picture really close. You know, haven't you cleaned your room in a while? Yep. So so the the grief about empty nest kind of fuels your wanting to step in, I think sometimes. But I heard, and maybe you've heard this, I heard this last night. I was trying to go to sleep, and of course I had a a reel I was looking at, and I shouldn't have been because it made me cry. But it was this woman saying that you never know, she was reading this ode to her child and and she said you never know when the last time is going to be that you hug your toddler. That they morph into these different stages and you the saddest part about that whole process is you never get to say goodbye to the the first stage. And I'm like oh that's so sad but it's true in a way like they go from infant to walking and then walking to you know toddler school age and then middle school and and eventually our goal is for them not to need us as much but you never get to say goodbye to that stage that you just left.

SPEAKER_05

Right.

SPEAKER_08

What do you what do you think about that?

SPEAKER_05

Well first off yeah what a horrible reel.

SPEAKER_08

I was like I was crying I'm like this is ridiculous. And I'm texting my kids and they're thinking I'm sure they're thinking what is wrong with my mother your mother loves you. That's what it is. That's right. That's right. But that's what it was because those stages go so fast.

SPEAKER_06

It's true. I I remember the moment that my oldest was going to go to kindergarten and I just knew in that moment that that was the beginning of the end. Like it just I knew that it was going to be so fast after that. And that was also the time or around that time where I realized that she had a life outside of me up to the point you know she was home with me. I mean she went to preschool maybe like two hours a day and and I knew everything whereas there in school like I don't I don't have that same connection and and there was it grief is a great way to describe that and grief is complicated because you feel one way one moment and then the next you feel something else. And yeah with your children transitioning into the stage outside the home there is such a relinquishing of your heart it is it until you've been through it it is so hard to explain it is because up to that point they are in your house they are under your covering of safety it's it's almost like you have this false sense of control. Like I can keep them safe and protected. But outside in the world living in a different place making choices adult choices with adult consequences like it's just a totally different level. And I I I think for parents out there is like allow yourself to grieve that but then also celebrate the fact that you have raised kids that can navigate this world in a healthy way and and that's how I balance it you know it I wrestle with that of yeah you know I grieve that my babies are are gone. I mean I've gotten very close with my senior this year mostly because her sister's gone and her sister was her best friend. So I'm like yes okay I'll take second best that's fine you know I'll take whatever you'll give me the crumbs. Give me the crumbs you know and so for her to head out now I'm like oh man like I'm gonna miss my bestie and at the same time I'm like but you know what that's what we are designed to do as parents we we have them for a little bit and we we lead them on to live the best life that they've been called to live and you know and I have prayed from a young age that they they meet the right spouse that the spouse is because they spend more time and and years with their spouse than they would me being raised by me. And so I spent a lot of intentional time just praying God you send the right one. You send the one that loves them well that guides them well and um we got really strong ladies and so Lord that they were willing to to be in partnership with and they respect and you know all the things so um yeah it's just it's complicated but we wrestle with both celebrating and grieving.

SPEAKER_08

Celebrating and grieving it's the only job where you do yourself out of a job. Yeah yeah sort of in a way yeah sort of like counseling isn't it we hope to do ourselves out of a job absolutely yeah so Paige we have a lot more to discuss but we're already at the mark where we need to close this up so in the next show I'd like you to come back so we can dive in a little deeper um and focusing on that age of disrespect maybe if we could talk about that and its impact.

SPEAKER_05

Can you come back for the next one? I would love to thank you.

SPEAKER_08

Okay well that's all the time that we have right now if today's discussion encouraged you or you want to learn more we invite you to share this episode with someone who could benefit from it. And be sure to follow the show the Ampcast so you don't miss future conversations like this one. Thanks for listening and be sure to join us again next time as Paige joins us for part two of our conversation.

SPEAKER_04

Have a good week you've been listening to the Amp Cast with Elisa Marie ProCop. To find out more go to AmpCounseling.com. You can discover more information about all our services that we offer be sure to follow our social media platforms using the icons at the bottom of the page don't forget to check out our show notes for today's episode where we will have links and contact info for today's guests. Well that's all the time we have for this episode thanks for joining us and we will see you next time for another edition of the Ampcast with Elisa Marie Pro Cop Dealing and Healing from Trauma