Episode 17 - The Expectations Stayed

Grief changes you. Your priorities shift. Your tolerance for things changes. The way you see the world is different.

But one of the hardest parts? Everyone else still expects the same version of you they had before the loss.

In this episode, we talk about the weight of those expectations — being expected to act the same, show up the same, and handle things the same… even when you’re not the same person anymore. We get real about how grief reshapes identity and why the pressure to be the “old you” can feel just as heavy as the grief itself.

The Therapist & The Wildcard is a mental health podcast hosted by The Wildcard, alongside The Therapist, where real conversations meet professional insight—and nothing is off-limits. Together, they dive into therapy, grief, healing, relationships, emotional chaos, and the moments that make you laugh, cry, or ask, “Is this normal?”

Some episodes go deep. Some go sideways. Most do both. The Wildcard brings the unfiltered conversation, lived experience, and humor people are

usually afraid to say out loud, while The Therapist grounds the conversation with clinical knowledge, compassion, and perspective—without killing the vibe.

This podcast isn’t about having it all figured out. It’s about talking through the mess, naming the hard stuff, and finding meaning (and humor) along the way. If you’ve ever laughed through pain, questioned your own reactions, or wanted therapy talk without the therapy voice—welcome. You’re in the right place.

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61581431292635 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thetherapistandthewildcard TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@thetherapistnthewildcard

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome to the Therapist in the Wildcard, the show about grief, mental health, and all the messy stuff in between. One of us helps people heal for a living, and the other probably needs more therapy. Together we keep it real, raw, and sometimes ridiculous. Welcome to the Therapist in the Wildcard. I'm Vit, a certified grief coach, psychology student, widow and wildcard. I had to think about that.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

You nailed that. I'm Jen, the clinical social worker that tames her chaos.

unknown 0:31

Sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Today's topic is around boundaries and expectations within relationships with grief. What the relationships were like before the loss and the expectations after the loss. Yeah. So you had people in your life. You've kind of talked about this, right? You and Chris stayed in the house. You didn't really go out and have a lot of friends.

SPEAKER_01 1:00

Every time you say that and I like rewatch the episode, I'm like, damn.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

But it's not wrong, right? Like you guys just kind of kept yourselves. And part of that was like the OCD stuff. Yeah. You know, which is fine, right? But then the small group of close tight people that you had in your life prior to Chris's passing expected you to be that same person.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

After his passing. Okay. So what what actually happened?

SPEAKER_01 1:30

In what regard, like where? Where are you going with this? With me or with them?

SPEAKER_00 1:36

From your standpoint. Because you stayed with your brother for a couple months. We've talked about that. Yeah. You went home, you traveled a little bit, you didn't really start getting into your routine until month three, month four. Yeah. And then you were never home. And you were out with people that you had just met.

SPEAKER_01 1:56

Mm-hmm. Well, my friend circle changed after he passed. Um, I still had some previous friends from before he passed, but a lot of those kind of fell off. And I now had a new circle, if you will. Yeah. Um, but that's where it gets a little confusing because the new circle didn't know me prior to him passing. So they only know one version of me. This is true. Because when I talk about the old version of me, they're like, You had your shit together. You were type A. They're like, can't imagine, and I'm like, yeah. Actually. So grief changes you, obviously. So I changed. Probably in every which way I could imagine. But then that's probably where it gets dicey with the friends prior to him passing, because they are expecting the version of Vit that I was before he died. And I'm not that version anymore, and not only am I not that version, my life is completely different. Um like school, grief coaching, the podcast. There's other stuff I'm not thinking of, but and I think their expectations have stayed the same, but I haven't stayed the same.

SPEAKER_00 3:42

I know like some people in your family without saying names here, but like, you know, they expected you to be old Vit, you know, yeah, and do the things that you always did and move on.

SPEAKER_01 3:57

And I think people say grief changes you, and everyone kind of understands that in a way, but you don't understand how it changes changes you until you're in it. Fair enough. Because I would never think grief would change me the way that it has. Yeah. Like, of course, you're like, I lost someone, I'm never gonna be the same. Right. But it's deep. It's it really fucks. You're a brand new person. It's crazy. I don't know who I am, and half the time I feel like I'm just floating through life, not knowing shit. Some days you do feel like that.

SPEAKER_00 4:37

Some days you are just floating through life, but so is the rest of the world, so don't worry about it.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

So, yeah, there's been I'd say tension with a thing. Pre-death friends. We're gonna go with pre-death friends because of those stations. Like, I didn't have a lot of things going on my life in my life when Chris was alive. It was just him and I. Right. So if I needed to be available, I was. And even before him, I was very much a people pleaser. I didn't say no to people, I didn't want to stir anything up. So if someone needed me, I usually just went. And I genuinely enjoy helping people. I do absolutely, but I didn't tell anybody no, even if it inconvenienced me or if I didn't want to do it at that time, I still did it. You just never set the boundary. Yeah, so it's my fault. Boundaries are very important. So, and now it's just different. Like I don't have the luxury of, first of all, just dropping everything and going, or being the luxury of being a people pleaser. Right. Nor do I want to be one. Right.

SPEAKER_00 5:59

So when did all this kind of start to come out or kind of cause tension in relationships? Like six months after, two months after, one year after?

SPEAKER_01 6:12

No, it was definitely it was soon-ish, right? I feel like we talked about summer therapy.

SPEAKER_00 6:20

Yeah, there was some some tension with what people expected of you. You know, in the beginning, people have stopped talking about him. That's what's bringing you down, right?

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Um Yeah, I think it was fairly probably like the first before the first two-month mark. Yeah. Maybe like around month one and a half to two. Because month one, everyone's still kind of there and they're like, oh, her husband just died. Right. But then their lives go completely on, and mine is still starting over, basically. I feel like I'm still starting over. Yeah. Like I don't know shit.

SPEAKER_00 6:57

Am I supposed to know shit? Well, I don't know. Okay, so things started to change. It caused tension in some relationships. How did you get past some of that? Like, how do you explain to someone who you were pre-death versus post-death? I don't know if I have.

SPEAKER_01 7:21

Have I? Do you like when Kara was on, some things didn't click for her until she was on and heard you explain things in a different sense. Right. So I don't know if I've like I feel like now I'm better able to explain it if someone is like upset or whatever. True.

SPEAKER_00 7:43

But yeah. It's a tough concept. Like you couldn't just go home at the end of the day and go to bed with your husband. You know, you guys would eat out, you would go to a hotel, you didn't have the luxury of doing those standard things anymore. You had to go home every night and create a new life by yourself, which in itself is challenging. And then I added a bunch of shit into my life.

SPEAKER_01 8:14

Yep. So I'm still trying to figure life out in a new normal. And then I'm like, hey, let's go to school.

SPEAKER_00 8:20

Right. Well, and also, too, like you anticipated your world wouldn't really change. It just Chris wasn't there. I'm gonna continue to do all the things that I did, I'm gonna be sad, I'm gonna do this. Like, yeah. So I think the expectations that you had for your own life within the first month or two is like just gonna be the same, just without him.

SPEAKER_01 8:42

Yeah, I didn't know. Exactly. It's all new to me. And yeah, you hear, oh, your life changes, but I didn't think it changed like this. Right. Like, what the hell? Surprise. Yes. So yeah, that yeah. Shit, I tomorrow is a month and not a month, a year and a half, and I'm still trying to figure stuff out. Right. I still don't I don't know if I I have somewhat of a norm. Yeah, like a routine for the most part. Yeah. But I'm still trying to find that balance. Yeah. Because I do have a lot more on my plates. So trying to find the balance between work and play per se is very hard. Right. Because I'm not gonna lie, when I first started school, I probably wasn't the greatest friend. I didn't know how to balance. You never had to do it before. I didn't know how to balance it all. Yeah. And everything with the school was new, learning the system, the program, the Yep.

SPEAKER_00 9:50

And you didn't have as much free time. You literally needed to set boundaries with people so that you could accomplish your schoolwork. And that took them getting used to your new schedule.

SPEAKER_01 10:00

And then that they stopped, people stopped inviting me places because I kept saying, no, I have to do school. No, I have to do this. To where I still don't get it. I'm just I'm like, just invite me. I'm like, just invite me, feel like I'm loved. Just invite her somewhere, please. Just invite me. I'm probably gonna say no. Just invite me.

SPEAKER_00 10:21

Just invite her.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

Um, to where like now Vanna understands, like, and I'm like, no, listen, I'm really trying to balance it all. Right. Um, I'm like, so just invite me. Yes, there's going to be times that I can't. Yeah. But if I can make time, like, I will. And here's my thing. I'm not very much I'm not a sporadic friend. Very rarely can you call me up and be like, hey, we're going out to eat in 20 minutes. Right. My weeks are usually planned. Yeah. So set school time, set work time, set grief. Yeah. Yeah. Grief group. I mean grief group. Clarification, grief group. I don't have a set time for grief. That's just what comes and goes when it happens. Yeah. But so that's, I think, different too because I used to be able to drop things and go. Right. You had more flexibility back then. Yeah. Like Tam, not that Tam knows a lot of widows, but she's like, you're the busiest widow I know. Like, what she goes, do you know? She has six kids and a husband. Oh, hi, you came to me. Hi. Oh, you picked Vid over me. Um, so yeah. Did you turn the heat on?

unknown 11:43

I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 11:45

Why are you licking me? Why are you why are you licking me? Reel. What's the matter, Oscar? Do you appreciate what Vin is talking about? Do you understand her? Do you understand grief?

SPEAKER_01 12:01

He's like, yeah, do you know how many of her therapy sessions I was in? He goes, I get it. I'm here for you.

SPEAKER_00 12:07

What do you need? Do you guys have treats for him? You're gonna interrupt the episode. For the T-word? We need to interrupt anything.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Hey Vin.

SPEAKER_01 12:18

Yeah, Steve.

SPEAKER_02 12:20

Why did the coffee file a police report?

SPEAKER_01 12:25

I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 12:26

It got mugged.

SPEAKER_00 12:29

These are so bad. Why are we laughing? That's a good one. All right, and thanks to Steve, we're back. Talking about boundaries, friendships, relationships, post-grief, pre-grief. And we were just talking about how in like month three to four you were going out all the time. Right? You had met some new people in your life that weren't there when Chris was there, and you were just living it up. Living it up. If somebody called and said, Hey, let's go hang, you'd be like, Okay, let's go. Yeah. Part of that was avoidance.

SPEAKER_01 13:02

I didn't I didn't want to be home.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

And you didn't want to be home alone. Yeah. But you also didn't like having people over, so that was a hot thing. Yeah, it wasn't a game. Yeah. Okay. So then you were constantly going out. How did people who were in your life prior to Chris passing feel about you starting to go out all the time, never be home, hanging with new people that weren't in your life? It was an issue.

SPEAKER_01 13:33

It was an issue to say the least. And it was new for them. So I'm sure they probably, I don't even know what they thought. Right. And in going out with new people, other people, you know, naturally you have a little bit less time. Right. I don't even know how to word it.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

For other stuff. Exactly. Right? Like after Chris passed, there may have been people in your life, and I don't know this, but there may have been people who expected to spend more time with you or the same amount of time with you. But there are times when you didn't want to go to specific events or birth dates or stuff like that, right? So you actually tended to avoid some of those things that people still anticipated you to be at.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

Right. And I will say, so like some things are hard to go to in general because your husband is gone. Right. And then I also, with the whole cancer thing, and I can't have kids, like some events around children are hard to go to. Right. And I do my best to be like, suck it up, bitch. Like this is your life. There's nothing you can do about it. But the reality is sometimes it's just hard. And sometimes I am just in a bad mental space that day.

SPEAKER_00 15:02

Um so and that also leads to, if I may, here, um, you know, you can say, Yes, I will be able to be there. And then the day of, you're having a really hard day. And you're like, I don't think I can do this. Right? Because there was a lot of those.

SPEAKER_01 15:25

And yeah, there was. And there still are sometimes. There probably not as much, but there were a lot of, yeah, that sounds great. I'm free, let's do it. And then the day of, I'm just and even it's not even just the day of. Sometimes it's 20 minutes before, or right, on the way. The day before.

SPEAKER_00 15:47

Like, well, and it's the anxiety that's creeping up, the fear, the grief, the sadness that Chris isn't going with you. You know, Chris and I would have been doing this together, kind of thing. Okay. So there were times where you just didn't make it. And people were what? Angry? Mad, angry, disappointed.

SPEAKER_01 16:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:10

I let them down. Confused as to why you just couldn't go. Yeah. Thought they were you you were using Chris and Grief as an excuse. Oh, yeah. That happened a lot. You just don't want to come. No, I did. Right. And you had the full intention of going until you didn't.

SPEAKER_01 16:31

Sometimes I was like ready to go in the car, or you know, ready to go and like, you know, sitting on the couch and trying to hype myself up, and it just was like not working. No. And some events were still hard. I remember Chris's sister. Was it Monique? She had her baby shower. Okay. And I think that was like one of the first showers I went to were like family events after he passed. Yeah. And I was fine the whole car ride there. And I like parked my car and I start just, I'm a mess. Yeah. I'm bawling and I'm just a mess. And I'm like, how do I even go in? Right. But you know, thankfully at that point, I think I had like text Kanisha. I'm like, listen, I'm this is rough. But yes, like those events are hard. And that was like that was family. I drove an hour and a half. Right. I was in the parking home. Did you end up going in? I did. I waited for Kanesha to get there. Um and I mean, still, it was hard. Like, right. You know, because I know men don't typically go to showers, but as the brother, I feel like he would have been there. Like, so it's just and then it was like on the flip side, it was like, would we have even went at all? It was a very confusing day. Good point. Because I was sitting there thinking, like, he should be here, and then thinking, probably wouldn't have come. If he was here, would we have even came? Yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_00 18:07

So very a lot of mixed emotions, mixed thoughts. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:12

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 18:13

Okay. So, and were they supportive of like, did they understand? Like, I'm sure you went in like eyes all messed up as family. Like, they get it. They're great. They well, they were grieving too.

SPEAKER_01 18:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:25

You know? So it's different.

SPEAKER_01 18:27

But yeah, a lot of like friends and people who aren't family don't get it as much. Yeah. So it's a little hard. Well, you've never been through it. To be fair, there was some things that I couldn't or didn't go to prior to him passing because then the OCD was in the way. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 18:49

So that's where it gets messy. Yeah. Well, and I think at one point too, we talked about the guilt with the OCD when he was here, and that's a whole nother topic. But your friends and family didn't expect you to change in the ways that you did. Correct. And at the end of the day, they expected the same bit. They still do. They still do. So now I mean you've tried to set boundaries with them, you've tried to explain where you're coming from. Um I'm sure never did they think that you were gonna go to school.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

No.

SPEAKER_00 19:27

Right, right. And now they're like, why would you do that?

SPEAKER_01 19:31

Yeah. My brother actually thinks school is stupid, so there's that. That's a waste of time and money. Okay. Well, it's a good thing you got some scholarships there, huh? That part, which is kind of smart. But yeah, and I don't think people expected me to be doing the things I'm doing, and I don't know what they expect. I don't know what the fuck I expected, right? Or what I still expect. Yep. Because the last year and a half has just been insane. Like you've just been doing your thing one day at a time. Yeah, and then there's been so other like just family stuff. It's been a lot.

SPEAKER_00 20:16

It's been a lot. It's been a lot. So if you were to talk to somebody, how do I say this? I don't know. If you're gonna talk to somebody, um what advice would you give to someone who is the friend or family member of somebody who lost their spouse? What would you recommend they do to be supportive and not judgy, if you will?

SPEAKER_01 20:45

Just fucking be there with no expectations. Drop the expectations. The person, the griever is trying to figure life out. They don't know what the fuck is happening. Yeah, and sometimes we don't need people to say things or do things, we just need them to sit with us. Like, just sit with us. Yeah. And yeah, we're not gonna show up to things. We're having a hard fucking time. It may not look like it on social media, right? And you know, even through texting, oh, I'm having a really hard day. You don't see me fucking eyelashes stuck together from crying so hard. I'm a mess. I haven't showered in three days. Yeah, you don't see that side of me grieving.

SPEAKER_00 21:31

But you expect me to show up for you when I haven't even shown up for myself in the last three days. Okay, so on the flip side, has this come up in your like grief support group at all?

SPEAKER_01 21:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:45

Okay, and how do others feel about it, or what's been kind of tossed around on how to deal with this? I think it's just hard.

SPEAKER_01 21:54

Like, no, everyone has the expectations, and we're still trying to figure out how to be. A good friend per se while still grieving. Right. But people who aren't grieving or haven't experienced loss or close loss, right? They don't get it. So a lot of us grievers just feel alone. Even if there's people around. Because now when there's people around, we're trying to put on a mask because we don't want to be too depressing. We don't want to, and then we're being judged if we're too fucking happy. Right. Uh, like, yeah. I remember the first time I posted on social media after he passed, or like one of the first times I was terrified. I was like, these people are going to judge me. I think it was like a vacation that I took with his sisters. Okay. And yeah, life goes on. You're smiling, you're, you know, whatever. But what they also don't see on that vacation, there was a wedding at the resort. Yep. I bawled my eyes out. I recall. We were in the middle of a club party. Like having the time of our lives. I had to step out into the lobby because I just started bawling. Because Chris should have been here. Right. So it's but I'm not taking pictures and videos of me doing that and posting that on social media. Right. So, yeah, don't take social media for face value because you only get the good shit. I'm not gonna post, oh, I've been crying for three days and want to die. Well, and check in without judgment. And check in. Don't be afraid to check in. We know our our people have died. Yep. We know we're in the thick of it. Don't be afraid to say their name. Don't be afraid to check. Like, we know all of like by you not checking in, are you afraid to bring them up? Isn't doing anything. Yeah. Bring them up. I haven't met one griever who does not want to talk about their person. That's a good point. Bring them up. We know they're dead. We know they're dead. Valid.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

Bring them up. Okay, there's the advice of the wild card. Thanks for joining us.

SPEAKER_01 24:15

That's a wrap for the therapist and the wild card. One of us brings the therapy and the other brings the chaos. Together, we'll be back with more laughter, healing, and everything in between.