Di - Identity

In this episode, I’m joined by Di Black.

Di is a psychotherapist and someone who was also my therapist for a period of time. She brings depth, honesty, and a willingness to sit in uncomfortable spaces without needing to rush to answers.

We sit inside fear, identity, and vulnerability.

Not as concepts.
As lived experience.

We start with a question that hits hard.

Share your most guarded secret.
Your most embarrassing fear.
The thing you least want to say out loud.

We stay with what that brings up.

Di speaks about recurring dreams. Feeling lost. Losing identity. Not knowing who she is or where home is. The fear of losing memory, losing self, and what it means to exist without the structure we rely on.

We sit with that.

Not to analyse it.
Not to fix it.
Just to be in it.

We move into addiction.

Not just substances.
Addiction to thinking.
Addiction to being right.
Addiction to our own perspective.

We talk about how hard it is to step outside of that. How we live inside our own version of reality and mistake it for truth.

And how relationships force us to confront that.

To step into someone else’s experience.
To drop the certainty.
To admit we might not see the full picture.

We also touch on vulnerability in therapy.

The idea that therapists are not above the work.
That hiding behind the role can become another defence.
And that real connection comes from being human first.

We do not solve anything.

We sit inside the discomfort of not knowing.
Of not being as together as we think we should be.
Of recognising that the work never really ends.

The question Di leaves for the next guest is this.

If you could have your life over again, what would you change?

It’s You, Oh Fuck, It’s ME In Session with a Psychotherapist
Hosted by Chad Taylor

No tips.
No fixing.
Just real conversations.

Di Black is a Psychotherapist and can be found at

Website: https://www.facebook.com/zenconnect9/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/zenconnect9/?hl=en

Book- https://cxv22j-gy.myshopify.com/    Discount Code: PODCAST20

Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/chadtaylor.itsyou/?hl=en

Tiktok- https://www.tiktok.com/@chadtaylor.itsyou?lang=en

Email- chadtaylorpsychotherapy@gmail.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:15

I'm Chad Taylor, psychotherapist, author of It's You, Oh Fuck It's Me. No tips, no fixing, just real conversations. So today I've got a fellow psychotherapist and counsellor with me, Die Black. So Die, who the fuck are you? Tell us a bit about yourself.

SPEAKER_00 0:33

Hi, Chad. Uh well, I'm me. And I'm still it's an ongoing process getting to know who I am.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Tell us who me is. Who's me? How would you describe me without the name, without the Okay?

SPEAKER_00 0:50

A mother, a partner, a lover, a psychotherapist.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

What lights you up?

SPEAKER_00 0:57

What lights me up?

SPEAKER_01 1:00

What are you passionate about?

SPEAKER_00 1:02

Relationships, music, nature, probably all the whole natural world, the everything natural, vulnerability, diving deep into communication with people that I trust.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

And yeah, I got some amazing growth and some amazing conversations with Di, even though we had differing views on some big topics over the time we were together. We really had a strong connection and I felt like Yeah, she's she probably sells herself short when I ask who she is publicly. So while we're on that, Di, do you wanna do you want to talk a little bit about your practice?

SPEAKER_00 1:45

Just a bit of a Um, yeah, I'm slowing down a bit because I'm trying to enjoy what's left of my life and not be so stressed. I've been doing it for a bit. But it's I'm Xenitholistic Counseling and Psychotherapy.

SPEAKER_01 2:03

And where can people find that?

SPEAKER_00 2:07

Well, best place to is email me. I'm on Instagram and Facebook, but not really. So email zenconnect9 at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_01 2:18

And do you have an ideal client? I know that's a hard question. Do you have a is there a type of demographic or client that you love to work with? For anyone out there?

SPEAKER_00 2:30

I'm really interested in people who have an altered experience of life, so quite comfortable with people who've had either a psychosis or a severe depression or anxiety, existential crisis.

SPEAKER_01 2:50

I suppose I specialise in that really in in We're not far off a spiritual experience or a psychotic episode, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:56

Well, yeah, there's a mind.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

There's plenty of people in a psych ward that could probably deal with some help under a tree becoming enlightened. But for anyone out there, at the end of the show notes, I'll get Daya to send me her details and I'll link her email and her Instagram and how you can contact her. So I guess we're at this part where everybody cringes who's listened to my podcast that the last guest actually leaves something for the next guest. And the last guest was Tommy, and Tommy was from Middle America, and he has probably left the hardest, most challenging thing for the next guest that anybody could possibly do. And it was share your most embarrassing, shameful fear or thought, whatever you can possibly muster out of the depths of your soul, basically to share your most guarded secret. And before we go any further, this is all within reason. And just remember that's only me and you on here and the rest of the world.

SPEAKER_00 4:00

Thanks, Tommy.

SPEAKER_01 4:02

What happens when you do that? What happens when you hear that inside of you?

SPEAKER_00 4:07

Oh, well, uh, it makes me have to really dive deep in there to think about that one. And I'm actually quite an open person, so anybody I absolutely trust, like my partner, I don't think there's anything that I have that I hide, but I suppose more my fears that would be my most vulnerable if if you wanted to get my vulnerability.

SPEAKER_01 4:34

We can even talk about what it brings up in you. We don't actually have to answer the question. I'm mindful that this is the way I'm doing this podcast is super fucking challenging to everybody, right? So it's almost like a mini therapy session publicly for a worldwide audience. We can even just follow what it brings, the feeling that it brings up in you hearing that and how that almost how we do that to clients.

SPEAKER_00 4:57

And well, I'm actually quite excited by that client. If I was in a really close therapy session with you or something, I'd find that really exciting to explore. But um and I actually I suppose a fear, a fear may as well make it juicy and interesting. Um I have which is a bit of a recurring dream. Well, there's two actually. One is of a tidal wave, which I've had recurring since I was about 19. Um but the other one is which is more current, is that I'm totally lost somewhere, and I have no idea really who I am or how to get home or wherever home is. In fact, I don't even feel like I've got an identity, I'm just existing. But it's a nightmare, but it's not really a nightmare. It's sort of quite I don't I wake up though and it may it flaws me, so it's a deep thing. But on a conscious, not a subconscious, because dreams are uh subconscious, on a conscious level.

SPEAKER_01 6:14

I guess I'd quickly jump in and say there's obviously messages in that, and I'm not gonna sit here and do a therapy session with you. Like, have you unpacked? I'm sure you've unpacked that through journaling. And are you getting any message out of that fear? Is there anywhere in your life that sort of resonates with you or that you could see that plays out? That's your subconscious giving you a message?

SPEAKER_00 6:34

Which one, the tidal wave or the being lost?

SPEAKER_01 6:37

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:40

Being lost.

SPEAKER_01 6:41

Yeah, both, whatever, either, any, all.

SPEAKER_00 6:44

Well, I think the tidal wave is that started because of my fear and my existential crisis I had at 19. And I think I read Revelations or something at the time. I don't know, but I did think that that was I thought it was real at the time, but now I realize it's an overwhelm, it's a feeling of overwhelm.

SPEAKER_01 7:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:07

And the lost one is a similar thing, actually. They're both related to. I had the experience of actually losing my ego and becoming almost nothing when I was about 19 as well, and then having to rebuild myself. And there's also the current conscious fear now of aging and perhaps losing my worldly self as I transition as I get older and becoming demented or whatever that is, maybe. Who knows? Of not of not knowing, of losing memory and things, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:50

I think that's a valid fear, right? And I think that leads into a question about my book. We think that we are this person, and we think that it's so scary of who are we if we remove all these things, if we remove the physical body, if we remove this, is pretty turning pretty deep pretty quickly, but what was it out of my book? You gave me a pretty strong review, which I deeply respected with who you are. What was it? What from the book landed for you? I guess I'd I'd ask.

SPEAKER_00 8:20

Oh, that's pretty easy, really. I mean, I was laughing at lots of spots. It took me a while to get over the fucks and stuff in the beginning. I'm going, oh, chat, chat. But then I got the second chapter, it's like boom, here we go. And then I got right into it and I really enjoyed it. Possibly the fact that that we everyone has addictions, and the realization that I too do, which I've been processing lately, but that addictions, avoidance, the avoidance and the blame, that just hits home. You avoid it's an avoidance of self. Anything. And so I realized, okay, what are all the things that I do? I mean, I became aware that, yeah, of course, we are all we all have addictions. And that book made the book not just for people who think they've got like a specific addiction of usually alcohol or drugs, which but the biggest addiction we have is an addiction to our way of thinking, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:26

Like we all are so righteous generally and judgmental, and even if we don't want to be and struggle to admit it. Like I think all of us can be unconscious at home, at work, everywhere. Someone was driving slow this morning on the way into my office, and I was almost coming up beside them, trying to look in the window. Thankfully, I didn't say anything, but it's like, Who the fuck are you holding me up? And it's like, Chad, you have no idea who this person is. And the original name for the book was going to be called, I'm fucked, you're fucked, why being wrong is forplay. Because of the feeling we get when we admit a bit of fault, or we strip a bit of that mask off, or a bit of that, it's not so scary to admit fault. It's amazing what that does inside of our bodies with oxytocin, dopamine. There's a scientific thing that happens in us when we almost own up to stuff, but unfortunately, the egocentricity inside of us is almost so armored that it's almost impossible to do that. It's scary, right? Scary to admit that we're addicted to our way of thinking.

SPEAKER_00 10:37

Yeah, I I've been doing a lot of work on watching myself in that way and the way I react in relationship and trying to well to be aware of myself. So there's kind of like me in the situation, there's me watching now.

SPEAKER_01 10:55

Which is great. And I guess I'm more speaking that to a generalized population that at any given time, right? That if we had a lot of people here right now, not a lot of people are doing the amount of work that you are. So I guess from a generalized statement, we either love Donald Trump or we hate Donald Trump pretty passionately, or we vote for liberal or we vote for Labour. It's very rare these days that people don't have a pretty strong opinion on things that really we think we know about, but we know fuck all about, I think, personally.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:28

That's more what I was meaning there when we're addicted to our own way of thinking.

SPEAKER_00 11:32

More that we're more addicted to our own personal experience, which we believe to be absolutely right, because that's the only experience we have is our own. So it takes a while to realize that others aren't us, that our experience is unique to our own, and our view is absolutely, you know, how could any how could I be wrong? Because this is the way I see it, but we don't realise that others have had a different experience, therefore their worldview could be totally different. And you have to answer that's the biggest one, I think. That's the biggest thing, the hardest thing to do is to pull yourself. It's like a virtual reality headset. We have our own, and that's all we've known, and it's it's all we can see. But to be able to put on the headset of somebody else is really hard, and that takes a lot of work, and that's what you have to do in relationship, basically, isn't it? You the and and love, I guess, the understanding through love, if you care for somebody deeply enough, you will be able to empty your own preconceived notion of what's happening and look at it from their perspective, stand in their shoes.

SPEAKER_01 12:55

Like yeah, and something I do in my therapy practice. Sometimes, if people don't believe me on this, I almost get them to become the other person in the argument. So person A then becomes person B, and vice versa. So they almost impersonate their partner and then start to have a disagreement about whatever it is while they've got to take on, and I say to them, it's almost like what they'd call at school mock trial, where you're either on this side or that side, and it really gives them an understanding. The laughter happens pretty quickly, and it's almost like, do you really perceive me like that? But it's a really good insight if they'll go with it to see what it's like to be that person, even if you don't agree with what they're saying. I've got to almost put that virtual reality headset on, or I've got to step into your shoes and I've got to argue the point as if I'm you for me to give myself an understanding of what it's like for you.

SPEAKER_00 13:46

I guess, yeah, the debating teams at school, that was that exercise, wasn't it? That was a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

It definitely was. And I suppose being a therapist, do you think sometimes we can hide behind that identity?

SPEAKER_00 14:02

Yeah, you can, but I think to be a good therapist and for the client to feel really comfortable and open and trust you to disclose enough, you have to show vulnerability to some extent. So I'm not I'm not afraid to do that. I'm not afraid to show my own vulnerability because from my experience when the person that is shows a little bit of their vulnerability, that's just permission for me to trust and be open. So I love vulnerability in people and I'm not afraid to show it in myself. But I guess I'm a little bit nervous. I guess that would be one of my fears too, actually, is that is um is that I'm not um as you know, maybe I'm not as together as people would expect perceived, and that I'm um I'm not a good thing. No, of course. That's the human condition. So I forgive myself. I've done a bit of work to forgive myself, but um yeah, there was sometimes I don't feel comfortable in the human body at all. I feel it like an alienation, like an alien. I get dissociated. I think that is part of my human experience, though I've experienced dissociation, so perhaps when I'm a little bit triggered, I can get dissociated. And I think that that does affect my relationship sometimes, and that would be where I'm a little bit I have to really watch myself because I've only just recently become aware of the fact that my relationships have been really impacted by that because I can't see myself how they are.

SPEAKER_01 15:59

No, and we can't. It's a bit like the goldfish, right? Walking up to the goldfish and asking it how the water is, it has no fucking idea what water is. It's living in its whole life, and if we could have the ability to have the awareness to be taken out of the goldfish bowl and look back on it and say, hey, look, that's what water is, and that's where you live, it would almost have this aha moment. But then, this is what I meant by we're all addicted to our own way of thinking, but then it would almost believe that it now knows what water is, not knowing that there's rain, there's ocean, there's pollution, there's creeks, there's rivers, there's moisture, there's mildew, there's all sorts of water. So I guess what you're saying there is it's I think it's really important for a therapist to keep doing what you're saying there and keep becoming accountable because unconsciousness can cost us a lot in relationships.

SPEAKER_00 16:50

Definitely, definitely.

SPEAKER_01 16:54

So these are nice and short and sharp. So we're almost at the end, and we're at the point where I ask what you'd like to leave for the next guest. So a statement, a sentence, a question, no teaching, just one line for the next guest. What would Die Black like to leave for the next guest?

SPEAKER_00 17:22

What if you could have your life over again, what would you change?

SPEAKER_01 17:28

Oh, I like that. If you could have your life over again, what would you change?

SPEAKER_00 17:34

I guess I have a fascination with parallel existences and parallel lives. So I think every every trauma part of your psyche splits off. And I sort of have this thing where you could imagine all these different lives coming out from each each turning point in your road. When you which road you take, and you take one, actually. I might ask AI that one day. I haven't been brave enough to download chat GBT, but that could be a good question. Give them some history of my life and then make them go through every single possibility.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

That's exciting.

SPEAKER_00 18:19

From every decision.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

Thanks, Di. That's where we'll leave it.

SPEAKER_00 18:25

Crazy. Okay, it's sad. I loved your book, by the way. It was really good. I've just ordered two to give away.